Guild Wars 2

I lost interest GW very quickly due to the lack of persistence, linear world and lobby nature of everything. It’s really hard to compare the two, except in name only.

Acewings.6872:

Well maybe if they didn’t make the game so frustratingly lame…

I wandered around in LA for 54 minutes trying to find the PoI that was in the sewers. They made this game one giant maze, and there needs to be some more simplicity for the casual players.

Oh yeah, in regards to your handholding comment…funny how I didn’t need my hand held in Guild Wars 1, way to admit that this isn’t a worthy sequel.

There’s a difference between making a game casual-accessible and dumbing it down so it’s easy to get 100% completion.

When I had trouble finding POI’s I just asked in Map.

Maybe they should make every area just flat? Kind of like Tatooine and Hoth in Swtor? Those were really popular right?

First of all, if you want to have a useful discussion, stop convoluting things. The bugged SP has nothing to do with your dislike of exploring. Yes, it sucks you cannot complete relevant maps yet, but that is another point.

You are not forced to do any exploring, the leveling to 80 is so easy, if you dislike exploring, do more events or crafting which gives considerable xp. In case you dislike those too, well, you really have to ask yourself if this is really the game to stick with.

Archer.6485:

Maybe they should make every area just flat? Kind of like Tatooine and Hoth in Swtor? Those were really popular right?

It doesn’t need to be completely flat…it just needs to be flat-er. There’s no reason to have like 20 mountains in one small area blocking the POI other than to annoy people like me who are trying to get to it. The maps just need to be easier to traverse, that’s all.

Algreg.3629:

First of all, if you want to have a useful discussion, stop convoluting things. The bugged SP has nothing to do with your dislike of exploring. Yes, it sucks you cannot complete relevant maps yet, but that is another point.

You are not forced to do any exploring, the leveling to 80 is so easy, if you dislike exploring, do more events or crafting which gives considerable xp. In case you dislike those too, well, you really have to ask yourself if this is really the game to stick with.

That’s not fair because events don’t give nearly enough exp and certainly don’t happen every 3 mins like you guys keep suggesting.

Acewings.6872:

It doesn’t need to be completely flat…it just needs to be flat-er. There’s no reason to have like 20 mountains in one small area blocking the POI other than to annoy people like me who are trying to get to it. The maps just need to be easier to traverse, that’s all.

But there can be obstacles to increase the challenge. Some people want their achievements to actually be an achievement.

Acewings.6872:

Rhanoa.3960:

This is a great example of players needing their hands held more!

Folks who can’t really think for themselves. Always needing help or guides, leaves very little room for improvising or imagination to say the least.

Well maybe if they didn’t make the game so frustratingly lame…

I wandered around in LA for 54 minutes trying to find the PoI that was in the sewers. They made this game one giant maze, and there needs to be some more simplicity for the casual players.

Oh yeah, in regards to your handholding comment…funny how I didn’t need my hand held in Guild Wars 1, way to admit that this isn’t a worthy sequel.

No need for the passive aggressive responses. Nothing forces you to do jumping puzzles or find points of interest. If you’re as casual as you say you are then you wouldn’t be bothered by missing out on them.

Sounds like you’re a perfectionist though instead of working for stuff you want your hand held at every turn. There’s guides out there for how to do vistas and such so why not look at them if you really feel the need? No need to cry and scream for the game’s exploration to be eroded away to appease people who can’t be bothered going off the beaten path.

Keep up the excellent work Arena Net and please don’t cave in to the vocal portions of the community who demand sweeping game changes to appease them.

Karizee.8076:

For the record, vistas are not cutscenes.
They are actual live ingame panoramic views.
Look what these creative peeps did with a vista

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gj5PwJX7EIk

Wow. That was incredible!

Why are you even trying to reach a poi if you don’t like exploring?

Archer.6485:

Why are you even trying to reach a poi if you don’t like exploring?

classic entitlement mentality, I do not want to do stuff, but I want the reward self-same stuff offers. If that is not possible, I want at least everyone who can do stuff not getting a reward.

Archer.6485:

Why are you even trying to reach a poi if you don’t like exploring?

To level up so I’m able to do my personal story quests…it’s not like I have another choice since I can’t quest grind, hate the crafting system due to item costs, and don’t like the way that pvp is set up.

Acewings.6872:

Archer.6485:

Why are you even trying to reach a poi if you don’t like exploring?

To level up so I’m able to do my personal story quests…it’s not like I have another choice since I can’t quest grind, hate the crafting system due to item costs, and don’t like the way that pvp is set up.

You know, I don’t stand in McDonalds ranting about why I don’t eat their food to their customers. I just don’t eat there. I wonder why you are playing GW2 when you hate all of it’s core functions.

so, you are basically saying you hate everything about the game, more or less. Why do you even care playing your character to 80 instead of looking for something you enjoy more?

Acewings.6872:

Archer.6485:

Why are you even trying to reach a poi if you don’t like exploring?

To level up so I’m able to do my personal story quests…it’s not like I have another choice since I can’t quest grind, hate the crafting system due to item costs, and don’t like the way that pvp is set up.

What level are you and how many of the maps in your level bracket have you completed (even ignoring the POI / vista exploration there is heart / dynamic event content)?

I’m level 34 and I’ve just finished the last 1-15 zone, I fail to see how you could be lacking the xp to get into a map with content which you have not yet done.

Jestunhi.7429:

Acewings.6872:

Archer.6485:

Why are you even trying to reach a poi if you don’t like exploring?

To level up so I’m able to do my personal story quests…it’s not like I have another choice since I can’t quest grind, hate the crafting system due to item costs, and don’t like the way that pvp is set up.

What level are you and how many of the maps in your level bracket have you completed (even ignoring the POI / vista exploration there is heart / dynamic event content)?

I’m level 34 and I’ve just finished the last 1-15 zone, I fail to see how you could be lacking the xp to get into a map with content which you have not yet done.

My warrior is 44 and I’ve already done almost all of the starting zones in every area of the map.

Oh jeez, in SWTOR we complained about the corridor and how there’s no real exploration (though datacron hunting was fun) other than a few area quests (like the Northeast group area quest on Hoth that’s a nice little credit farm after you’re done your dailies until you get board).

Here, people are complaining about being forced to explore. I like exploring, it makes it feel like I might stumble upon a secret or find rare stuff.

Acewings.6872:

I’m level 34 and I’ve just finished the last 1-15 zone, I fail to see how you could be lacking the xp to get into a map with content which you have not yet done.

And the mid level maps?

As far as I can see it;s impossible to complete the provided content and not have enough xp to progress. The problems come when you limit yourself to one one chain of maps, etc.

Jestunhi.7429:

Acewings.6872:

I’m level 34 and I’ve just finished the last 1-15 zone, I fail to see how you could be lacking the xp to get into a map with content which you have not yet done.

And the mid level maps?

As far as I can see it;s impossible to complete the provided content and not have enough xp to progress. The problems come when you limit yourself to one one chain of maps, etc.

Yes, that’s what I meant. I’ve done all the mid → lower level maps with the exception to the 1-15 asura starting zone (I believe). I need to get to 48 for my next personal story quest.

Well you have to consider the leveling balance of all the players. If exp gain was higher, then anyone who DOES like to craft, pvp and find as many events as possible would level at a rate that’s much too fast and that would ruin their experience. You’ll just have to accept that doing only one thing in the game to level means you’ll have to do a lot more of that.

Archer.6485:

Well you have to consider the leveling balance of all the players. If exp gain was higher, then anyone who DOES like to craft, pvp and find as many events as possible would level at a rate that’s much too fast and that would ruin their experience. You’ll just have to accept that doing only one thing in the game to level means you’ll have to do a lot more of that.

Cutting out content in any manner will limit the gains that you get.

Archer.6485:

Well you have to consider the leveling balance of all the players. If exp gain was higher, then anyone who DOES like to craft, pvp and find as many events as possible would level at a rate that’s much too fast and that would ruin their experience. You’ll just have to accept that doing only one thing in the game to level means you’ll have to do a lot more of that.

Those players can self pace though and make themselves go slower, I don’t have the option to make myself level faster. So in the end it isn’t as harmful as you think and doesn’t affect them really in any way.

Acewings.6872:

Those players can self pace though and make themselves go slower, I don’t have the option to make myself level faster. So in the end it isn’t as harmful as you think and doesn’t affect them really in any way.

Yes you do. Your client doesn;t have crafting, PvP, WvW or anything else which you choose to skip disabled.

It’s entirely your choice to skip it. And skipping it has consequences. You need to accept the consequences when you make a decision.

I have to agree with the OP here, although I think he could have worded his post better.
I really liked in GW1 how you could just do story mission after story mission without having to level up in between. I’m finding that what I need to do is ignore my personal story completely and get way above it’s level requirement so that I can do a bunch of them in a row. It’s a kinda breaks the flow for me when an important character is captured or in imminent danger but I need to go do some DEs before I can save them.
Don’t get me wrong, I love the DEs, I love exploring, I love jumping puzzles, I love so much about this game. I just liked how in GW1 I had the option to do the story first and THEN go back to all the areas/things I missed and learn about the world. I just expected that I would have that same option in GW2 since it’s whole downleveling system makes all the content relevant all the time. So it would work even better than it did in GW1.

It’s certainly something that I don’t think anyone can do anything about at this point and really I don’t think it’s something that would stop people from playing the game but I still think it’s something worth noting.

If you really don’t like exploring… (A fun part of the game IMHO)

Then just craft your way to 80.

I really don’t see the point of maxing level but, w/e.

Just clear hearts, then do crafting stuff..

Seriously, I’ve gotten the survivor title 2 months in a row just by crafting. (100k xp without leaving town)

Stormfox, I love the fact that you just suggested that we craft our way to 80 as if gold is super easy to make. Lol really, is that the best suggestion you can give?

Exploring is there if you want it. Finding hidden things is part of the fun. Not everyone likes this. That’s why it’s optional. Like so many other aspects of the game.
Yeah, the bugged stuff needs to get fixed, for sure.

But I couldn’t even call it exploring if all that was required was to simply walk from point A to point B. How boring is that?

1. You don’t have to explore unless you want to craft a legendary. (100% world exploration gives you two gifts of exploration items, which is needed to craft a legendary)

2. You CAN level without changing a map. When you are level 1 and you start on a level 1-17 or 1-15 map, mixing up instances and heart quests and dynamic events work pretty well to level up to the max of that particular map. I could do you, you can do it too.

Since there are lots of people and you are sharing quests-awesome feature of GW2-, you can do quests even 5 levels higher than your level so you won’t be having problems.

When you get past the first map, pick your next map carefully and follow the same path: instances + heart quests + dynamic events. crafting works for you too.

3. Repeatable quests belong in primitive MMOs. GW2 is trying to be different as much as possible.

4. Complaining won’t help. GW2 is a game that is very well advertised and suggesting for old systems is pointless.

Questing in GW2 is the best system I’ve ever experienced in an MMO. EQ, EQ2, SWG, WoW, AION, Rift, SWTOR are so inferior with their quest hub, run back and forth crap. This game feels organic in the way quest just pop up when you get to an area.

What I find funny is the comments about how tedious and boring it is to explore, yet the same people in this thread want to ‘grind’ to level 80 as fast as they can. Talk about boring… Well, there is always other MMOs out there for you guys. Have fun storming the castle.

Wow, it seems that everything I adore about this game is everything the OP hates.

I start up my game with an idea of what I want to achieve, as soon as I login that all goes astray. I can merely wander up a path and be involved with event after event. Two hours later I recall what I was off to do and once again become sidetracked by the possibilities.

For me this game personifies the fear/excitement Bilbo had: “It’s a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don’t keep your feet, there’s no knowing where you might be swept off to.”

I love it.

“What I’m reading here is “I want to limit my gameplay to a small percentage of the content & map, but I still expect to be given loads of xp as if I’d completed it all”.

You want to skip the majority of the content designed for each level? Fine, you’re free to do so. But it’s hardly surprising that you find yourself too low level to succeed in the higher level areas."

no, I don’t want to do vistas or PoI for the experience because it turns the areas between them into travel zones thus devaluing the world that has actually been well crafted, I like vistas and I like PoI, but there is a difference between incentivising them and making them required, I’m not asking to be fed EXP so that I can be a higher level, I’m asking that questing give enough exp that I can go to the next zone once I have exhausted all the quests in the area (or at least be no more than 1-2 levels below), questing should be in and of itself its own reward, but instead my reward for questing is being forced to do something else so that I can continue questing, and even then the questing isn’t that good. people tell me just to go to anther level appropriate zone? but that removes me from any sense of character/immersion and makes it feel like I’m grinding for levels, when I’m actively trying to avoid grinding for levels, again, the difference between grinding and questing is presentation, GW2 severely lacks it.

I’m not asking to be rewarded for questing, I’m asking not to be drastically inhibited for questing.

Gibbed.1572:

Questing in GW2 is the best system I’ve ever experienced in an MMO. EQ, EQ2, SWG, WoW, AION, Rift, SWTOR are so inferior with their quest hub, run back and forth crap. This game feels organic in the way quest just pop up when you get to an area.

What I find funny is the comments about how tedious and boring it is to explore, yet the same people in this thread want to ‘grind’ to level 80 as fast as they can. Talk about boring… Well, there is always other MMOs out there for you guys. Have fun storming the castle.

feels organic? what game are you playing, because it sure as kitten ain’t the one I’m playing. the way quests just “pop up” is one of the worst features, its one of the things I am talking about when I say lack of presentation, it’s the poorest attempt at concealing the grind I have ever seen (and concealing the grind is why quests exist in the first place).

also I couldn’t give a kitten about getting to level 80, I just want to quest in a way that makes sense and doesn’t ruin the world space.

@OP
You mentioned that we shouldn’t compare this game to WoW. Why should we compare it to GW1? And how is it not Guild Wars? It is placed in the same universe and that’s what makes Guild Wars. Sure, gameplay is part of Guild Wars too, but Guild Wars is a universe. Guild Wars 2 is set in this universe. So it’s more than legit to call it Guild Wars 2.
I never expected GW2 to be like GW1 in any way (and yeah, I played GW1, all chapters in fact). GW1 is a great game. So is GW2. It appears, you expected GW2 to be far more like GW1 than it is.
What I don’t get. You like to play story, but you want to quest grind to level? Why do you not just go to a new area, search for the scouts and run from heart to heart? I came barely across any obstacles across my way. AND, you don’t have to return to anywhere. You just go on as you run from heart to heart and do the ‘Quests’. Events give a fair amount of exp btw. And when you can spend quite some time to find a single PoI, why not invest the time to get to a heart in an area, appropriate for your level and grab the exp from there?
And don’t tell me, you have done everything yet. My Ranger is lvl 40 and I haven’t even set one foot into the lvl 35+ areas. The level 25-35 are isn’t even half completed. All I did was most of the 1-15 areas and two of the 15-25 areas. That alone got me to something close to 40 already. Neither did I have to invest much time, nor am I underleveled in any way for what is about to come.

Where I say you are right though is:
Yeah you DO have to do events, hearts, crafting in order to keep your level up with your personal story. And I honestly think, if you can not enjoy the exploring, GW2 just is not the best choice of a game (my oppinion so far). I enjoy exploring ALOT and am having a blast in this game.
Are you playing alone or with a friend? I am playing with a friend almost all the time, what makes it even more fun. That is pretty much the only thing, I could suggest.

About what was said above about quests in GW2:
They are the same thing as in every other MMO. But (again, in my oppinion) they are wrapped up MUCH better than in any other mmo. You want to know, WHY you have to do stuff? Go to the ‘heart-NPC’ and ask him about what is to do and why. And tadaaa… you have your ‘normal’ Quest. I like the new way, they went with GW2 in this regard. Doesn’t mean that everyone has to like it, by any means. Thats why there are so many games out there. Just pick the one, you like.

About taking things from WoW, because it ‘is’ succesfull:
Why does it still have million players (numbers are decreasing btw, they once had 10million+)? WoW was there at the right time. And most people stick to the game because of friends playing it and because they feel rather oblieged to keep playing, since they achieved so much already. I have some friends who play wow, and the reason why they still play it is either because of a still running subscription or because the others still play it. I, personally, don’t see any need to inherit anything from WoW. Making something different is perfectly fine and doesn’t have to suit everyone.

It really sucks when you notice that the game, you spent quite some money on, is not the game you expected it to be. But well, was stated before… that happens to everyone.

Zoridium JackL.7463:

“What I’m reading here is “I want to limit my gameplay to a small percentage of the content & map, but I still expect to be given loads of xp as if I’d completed it all”.

You want to skip the majority of the content designed for each level? Fine, you’re free to do so. But it’s hardly surprising that you find yourself too low level to succeed in the higher level areas."

no, I don’t want to do vistas or PoI for the experience because it turns the areas between them into travel zones thus devaluing the world that has actually been well crafted, I like vistas and I like PoI, but there is a difference between incentivising them and making them required, I’m not asking to be fed EXP so that I can be a higher level, I’m asking that questing give enough exp that I can go to the next zone once I have exhausted all the quests in the area (or at least be no more than 1-2 levels below), questing should be in and of itself its own reward, but instead my reward for questing is being forced to do something else so that I can continue questing, and even then the questing isn’t that good. people tell me just to go to anther level appropriate zone? but that removes me from any sense of character/immersion and makes it feel like I’m grinding for levels, when I’m actively trying to avoid grinding for levels, again, the difference between grinding and questing is presentation, GW2 severely lacks it.

I’m not asking to be rewarded for questing, I’m asking not to be drastically inhibited for questing.

Thank you, glad someone agrees with me. The people who want to questgrind to 80 shouldn’t be punished for wanting to do so. We’re forced to go out of our way to just be able to do our personal stories. Quests should give enough exp that we shouldn’t need to worry about being too underleveled to do our storylines. The leveling in this game was set up so horribly that all Anet is doing is ticking off their GW1 fans. This is not a sequel to the first Guild Wars in any way, we were expecting a Guild Wars game, and rightfully so.

Draennon.8576:

@OP
You mentioned that we shouldn’t compare this game to WoW. Why should we compare it to GW1? And how is it not Guild Wars? It is placed in the same universe and that’s what makes Guild Wars. Sure, gameplay is part of Guild Wars too, but Guild Wars is a universe. Guild Wars 2 is set in this universe. So it’s more than legit to call it Guild Wars 2.
I never expected GW2 to be like GW1 in any way (and yeah, I played GW1, all chapters in fact). GW1 is a great game. So is GW2. It appears, you expected GW2 to be far more like GW1 than it is.
What I don’t get. You like to play story, but you want to quest grind to level? Why do you not just go to a new area, search for the scouts and run from heart to heart? I came barely across any obstacles across my way. AND, you don’t have to return to anywhere. You just go on as you run from heart to heart and do the ‘Quests’. Events give a fair amount of exp btw. And when you can spend quite some time to find a single PoI, why not invest the time to get to a heart in an area, appropriate for your level and grab the exp from there?
And don’t tell me, you have done everything yet. My Ranger is lvl 40 and I haven’t even set one foot into the lvl 35+ areas. The level 25-35 are isn’t even half completed. All I did was most of the 1-15 areas and two of the 15-25 areas. That alone got me to something close to 40 already. Neither did I have to invest much time, nor am I underleveled in any way for what is about to come.

Where I say you are right though is:
Yeah you DO have to do events, hearts, crafting in order to keep your level up with your personal story. And I honestly think, if you can not enjoy the exploring, GW2 just is not the best choice of a game (my oppinion so far). I enjoy exploring ALOT and am having a blast in this game.
Are you playing alone or with a friend? I am playing with a friend almost all the time, what makes it even more fun. That is pretty much the only thing, I could suggest.

About what was said above about quests in GW2:
They are the same thing as in every other MMO. But (again, in my oppinion) they are wrapped up MUCH better than in any other mmo. You want to know, WHY you have to do stuff? Go to the ‘heart-NPC’ and ask him about what is to do and why. And tadaaa… you have your ‘normal’ Quest. I like the new way, they went with GW2 in this regard. Doesn’t mean that everyone has to like it, by any means. Thats why there are so many games out there. Just pick the one, you like.

About taking things from WoW, because it ‘is’ succesfull:
Why does it still have million players (numbers are decreasing btw, they once had 10million+)? WoW was there at the right time. And most people stick to the game because of friends playing it and because they feel rather oblieged to keep playing, since they achieved so much already. I have some friends who play wow, and the reason why they still play it is either because of a still running subscription or because the others still play it. I, personally, don’t see any need to inherit anything from WoW. Making something different is perfectly fine and doesn’t have to suit everyone.

It really sucks when you notice that the game, you spent quite some money on, is not the game you expected it to be. But well, was stated before… that happens to everyone.

They can call it whatever they want to. The questing isn’t like GW1. The story missions aren’t like GW1. The Skillbar customisation isn’t as good as GW1. The grouping isn’t as good as GW1. The combat isn’t like GW1. The setting isn’t like GW1. The classes aren’t like GW1. The art style isn’t like GW1. They have a town called “Lions Arch” in GW2, woopdy-doo. As I said earlier, I have a history book in my closet with a naked picture in it, that does not make it a Playboy magazine. Anet can call this game whatever they want, but it’s not a Guild Wars sequel in any way really.

I’m really up to the point where I’m starting to think those people are being paid to come here and complain about the game…. Really, the OP’s point is beyond any reasonable logic.

People are starting to get really bad at finding reasons to complain.

They can call it whatever they want to. The questing isn’t like GW1. The story missions aren’t like GW1. The Skillbar customisation isn’t as good as GW1. The grouping isn’t as good as GW1. The combat isn’t like GW1. The setting isn’t like GW1. The classes aren’t like GW1. The art style isn’t like GW1. They have a town called “Lions Arch” in GW2, woopdy-doo. As I said earlier, I have a history book in my closet with a naked picture in it, that does not make it a Playboy magazine. Anet can call this game whatever they want to, but it’s not a Guild Wars sequel in any way really.

You have spent the whole day trying to make your point. Many folks here have lent you a helping which I personally do not wish do.

It’s not complex, there is no difficulty of understanding the many ways to level. But instead you have chosen to ignore them.

GW2 is very much a sequel to GW1 but plays nothing like it. The Devs have expressed that they wanted to move in a whole different direction from what you and I have been familiar with. I don’t know if your just plan stupid or lack common sense to educate yourself on the product before buying it. It’s been talked about before OVER, OVER, AND OVER AGAIN. Heck, there was even BETA to experience this first hand, and tons of video…youtube!

If this is where it ends for you, where you completely stop playing,… thank you! You have done many of us a huge favor!

Zoridium JackL.7463:

“What I’m reading here is “I want to limit my gameplay to a small percentage of the content & map, but I still expect to be given loads of xp as if I’d completed it all”.

You want to skip the majority of the content designed for each level? Fine, you’re free to do so. But it’s hardly surprising that you find yourself too low level to succeed in the higher level areas."

no, I don’t want to do vistas or PoI for the experience because it turns the areas between them into travel zones thus devaluing the world that has actually been well crafted, I like vistas and I like PoI, but there is a difference between incentivising them and making them required, I’m not asking to be fed EXP so that I can be a higher level, I’m asking that questing give enough exp that I can go to the next zone once I have exhausted all the quests in the area (or at least be no more than 1-2 levels below), questing should be in and of itself its own reward, but instead my reward for questing is being forced to do something else so that I can continue questing, and even then the questing isn’t that good. people tell me just to go to anther level appropriate zone? but that removes me from any sense of character/immersion and makes it feel like I’m grinding for levels, when I’m actively trying to avoid grinding for levels, again, the difference between grinding and questing is presentation, GW2 severely lacks it.

I’m not asking to be rewarded for questing, I’m asking not to be drastically inhibited for questing.

Look at 1-15 zones as an example.

There are 5 I think.

If you do just one fifth of the content available for level 1-15 players (and that’s discounting exploration, gathering, crafting, WvW, and the various other things you can do to get xp – when those are taken into account it’s much less than a fifth of the content available to characters in that level range) it’s unsurprising that you aren’t completely ready for the next level bracket.

“Look at 1-15 zones as an example.

There are 5 I think.

If you do just one fifth of the content available for level 1-15 players (and that’s discounting exploration, gathering, crafting, WvW, and the various other things you can do to get xp – when those are taken into account it’s much less than a fifth of the content available to characters in that level range) it’s unsurprising that you aren’t completely ready for the next level bracket."

please do listen to what I say, i have addressed everything you just said and I’ll do it again.

I enjoy questing, in any MMO, and while I think the questing in GW2 is sub par I still enjoy it enough to want to do it (or at least enough that I want to try and enjoy it), I don’t want to be forced to PvP/explore(when I say explore I mean go to points marked on my map just to get exp, I actually do enjoy looking at the world while I quest)/craft/grind in any way in order to quest, so what option does that leave me, go to other level appropriate zones, that’s my only other option.

but this creates more problems than it solves, now not only does my characters progression in the world not make sense but I am actively removed from the game, I am unable to immerse myself or in any way feel like I am doing anything but grinding for exp for levels, I want to quest for the experience of questing (not the exp points for levels) and I want to continue questing, not to get to 80 but rather because I enjoy questing (and I have been told time and again that I should be doing things because I enjoy them and not for the “reward”, which is what I’m trying to do), but every time I finish questing in a zone I am forced to run alternative objectives that i do not enjoy just to grind out a few levels to correct my progression, it completely goes against the design philosophy of the game, and makes for an even poorer questing experience (and the questing is not that good to begin with).

I dunno, maybe I’ve just been spoiled by another recent MMO that had the best questing I’ve ever seen in an MMO, but the more I look at the way questing is designed in GW2 the more I see how badly it was done, which is a shame because I also see so much potential for questing in GW2 and it wouldn’t take anything more than some heavy tweaking.

OP obviously didn’t play TOR.

I’ve never seen a game with more corridors and dead ends than that one. The worst part is that after fighting your way down one of these paths, your reward is a bright red personal instance boundry hiding all kinds of interesting NPCs, making the worlds feel even more dead than they already were, mannequin-esque mobs and all.

Unless you’re just talking about Orr; I feel you on that one.

Zoridium JackL.7463:

please do listen to what I say, i have addressed everything you just said and I’ll do it again.

I enjoy questing, in any MMO, and while I think the questing in GW2 is sub par I still enjoy it enough to want to do it (or at least enough that I want to try and enjoy it), I don’t want to be forced to PvP/explore(when I say explore I mean go to points marked on my map just to get exp, I actually do enjoy looking at the world while I quest)/craft/grind in any way in order to quest, so what option does that leave me, go to other level appropriate zones, that’s my only other option.

Your only option for level appropriate content is in level appropriate zones. Yet you seem see the distribution of content into areas which have roughly the same level requirement as a bad thing?

but this creates more problems than it solves, now not only does my characters progression in the world not make sense but I am actively removed from the game, I am unable to immerse myself or in any way feel like I am doing anything but grinding for exp for levels, I want to quest for the experience of questing (not the exp points for levels) and I want to continue questing, not to get to 80 but rather because I enjoy questing (and I have been told time and again that I should be doing things because I enjoy them and not for the “reward”, which is what I’m trying to do), but every time I finish questing in a zone I am forced to run alternative objectives that i do not enjoy just to grind out a few levels to correct my progression, it completely goes against the design philosophy of the game, and makes for an even poorer questing experience (and the questing is not that good to begin with).

The only way it “doesn’t make sense” is from an immersion / storyline point of view. And I agree that the storylines across zones could be better inter-connected.

But it’s hardly unrealistic to fight easier enemies while training for harder ones. Practicing on a challenge which you can do to allow you to acheive greater challenges from the skills / experience learned is something that happens both in real life and in computer games all the time.

I dunno, maybe I’ve just been spoiled by another recent MMO that had the best questing I’ve ever seen in an MMO, but the more I look at the way questing is designed in GW2 the more I see how badly it was done, which is a shame because I also see so much potential for questing in GW2 and it wouldn’t take anything more than some heavy tweaking.

It’s not done badly, it’s done differently. It may well be done in a way which is less suited to your personal playstyle, but that doesn’t make it bad.

It’s less linear. There is more content that I could ever need to get enough xp to reach level 80 and the level downscaling means that it can be a challenge (depending on the quest, etc).

Zoridium JackL.7463:

please do listen to what I say, i have addressed everything you just said and I’ll do it again.

I enjoy questing, in any MMO, and while I think the questing in GW2 is sub par I still enjoy it enough to want to do it (or at least enough that I want to try and enjoy it), I don’t want to be forced to PvP/explore(when I say explore I mean go to points marked on my map just to get exp, I actually do enjoy looking at the world while I quest)/craft/grind in any way in order to quest, so what option does that leave me, go to other level appropriate zones, that’s my only other option.

Your only option for level appropriate content is in level appropriate zones. Yet you seem see the distribution of content into areas which have roughly the same level requirement as a bad thing?

but this creates more problems than it solves, now not only does my characters progression in the world not make sense but I am actively removed from the game, I am unable to immerse myself or in any way feel like I am doing anything but grinding for exp for levels, I want to quest for the experience of questing (not the exp points for levels) and I want to continue questing, not to get to 80 but rather because I enjoy questing (and I have been told time and again that I should be doing things because I enjoy them and not for the “reward”, which is what I’m trying to do), but every time I finish questing in a zone I am forced to run alternative objectives that i do not enjoy just to grind out a few levels to correct my progression, it completely goes against the design philosophy of the game, and makes for an even poorer questing experience (and the questing is not that good to begin with).

The only way it “doesn’t make sense” is from an immersion / storyline point of view. And I agree that the storylines across zones could be better inter-connected.

But it’s hardly unrealistic to fight easier enemies while training for harder ones. Practicing on a challenge which you can do to allow you to acheive greater challenges from the skills / experience learned is something that happens both in real life and in computer games all the time.

I dunno, maybe I’ve just been spoiled by another recent MMO that had the best questing I’ve ever seen in an MMO, but the more I look at the way questing is designed in GW2 the more I see how badly it was done, which is a shame because I also see so much potential for questing in GW2 and it wouldn’t take anything more than some heavy tweaking.

It’s not done badly, it’s done differently. It may well be done in a way which is less suited to your personal playstyle, but that doesn’t make it bad.

It’s less linear. There is more content that I could ever need to get enough xp to reach level 80 and the level downscaling means that it can be a challenge (depending on the quest, etc).

Double post due to forum issues:

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Edit & delete buttons not present due to poorly coded forums.

I cannot remove the double post nor edit the second post…

Complete all hearts, do all DEs, complete all pois and vistas and STILL not outlevel a zone? Really? And then the next zone starts off with monsters that are 6 levels above me.

Oh well, went on to farm them anyway, didn’t particularly care about a couple of glancing blows. But people who play mesmers, elementalists, warriors, necromancers, guardians, thieves or engineers may have problems.

Jestunhi.7429:

The only way it “doesn’t make sense” is from an immersion / storyline point of view. And I agree that the storylines across zones could be better inter-connected.

But it’s hardly unrealistic to fight easier enemies while training for harder ones. Practicing on a challenge which you can do to allow you to acheive greater challenges from the skills / experience learned is something that happens both in real life and in computer games all the time.

It’s not done badly, it’s done differently. It may well be done in a way which is less suited to your personal playstyle, but that doesn’t make it bad.

It’s less linear. There is more content that I could ever need to get enough xp to reach level 80 and the level downscaling means that it can be a challenge (depending on the quest, etc).

firstly, when I say immersion I’m not just talking about the character and how they fit in the world (although it does violate that as well), I’m also talking about suspending the idea that I’m just doing this to get exp to progress, I’m talking about GW2 completely failing to make it feel like I’m doing anything other than grinding, when I talk about immersion I mean in every aspect, and in every aspect I am let down. my character progression makes no sense for my character (he didn’t just look at the guys in the next zone and decide to go to the shiverpeaks to get a bit more buff). the idea that I’m questing as a character and not just grinding is completely ruined the second I am forced to sacrifice my questing experience in order to gain levels, something that I am forced to do after every zone.

and when I say badly I do mean badly, I know the difference between that and different. it’s like saying being shot is just different to not being shot, it’s true to a point. maybe the fact that I don’t enjoy crafting/forced exploration/PvP/grinding is part of the cause, but I find that even then the Questing is designed badly, even looking at it objectively the questing is bad. if by less linear you mean I can’t progress in a path that makes any sense what-so-ever and have to go places for no reason other than grinding levels than I wholly agree, but that’s not “less linear” so much as “there is nothing linear about it because there is absolutely no connection or linearity between them” which is bad because it returns us to the problem of stripping the player of any immersion on any level.

level down-scaling only applies if the content is a lower level, my problem is that I don’t level up fast enough via questing to allow me to continue questing in any good way, hell I couldn’t care less if I was several levels above the content in question, if I’m over-leveled for the next zone than that’s great because it means I don’t have to worry as much about the kitten progression interrupting my questing experience. I am also not complaining about the content, I think there is plenty enough content, my problem is that I can’t enjoy said content in any enjoyable way without the kitten progression actively making me stop enjoying it until I grind out some levels in one of a number of ways that I don’t find enjoyable in the slightest.

is it too much to ask that I be able to go to the next quest when I finish the one I’m on rather than be forced to craft/PvP/explore/grind or any other thing that doesn’t involve continuing with my otherwise good enough questing experience?

I have to say the argument that this is not a proper sequel to GW1 is fairly curious.

Compare FF7 to FFX. The systems are almost completely different, and of course with all Final Fantasy titles the characters and worlds tend to be unrelated.

Diablo III in many ways is a direct clone of Diablo I. And for all the things that made the first Diablo title exceptional, it is now a boring experience because of all of the games that have come since then.

There is no hard fast rule that says a game must use the same mechanics to be considered a sequel. In fact when game companies make the games too much alike they frequently get complaints because they didn’t introduce anything new with the sequel. Leave it the same, and you are in danger of only getting back the hard core fans of the original game who do not want to learn a different system. Make it too different, and you risk alienating those same people.

ArenaNet obviously chose the latter route. Knowing they would lose some of their biggest fans, they took the risk that they would gain a bigger following and make up the losses. It’s hard to be sure this early, but inital reaction from the reviewers and the number of sold games seems to say they have succeeded.

But what makes the OP’s complaints even harder to grasp is that devs were very clear in stating that GW2 was going to be a different experience. They were “changing things up” in an effort to entice people who didn’t care for the traditional MMO grinds. Not that they don’t have grinds, but they are different from what WoW, LoTRO and so many of the other WoW clones offer. They even wanted to break the GW1 mold to create something truly different.

To the extent that they succeeded, they did a very good job. However, GW2 is not immersive. I don’t think many MMO’s can be truly immersive by their nature. They have to do too much trying to be all things to all people. When I think about games that really stand out in this regard, it turns out they are all Single Player RPGs: Skyrim, Bioshock, Mass Effect, Fallout. For people looking for excellent and immersive story line, I highly recommend those games.

To the OP I can only offer that GW2 is not GW1, it couldn’t be. That’s why it is called Guild Wars 2, and not just another expansion pack.