Guild Wars 2

Zenith.6403:

Ugh, I just read the article
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/world-vs-world-introducing-world-ranks-and-more/

World Ability Points can be spent on unique WvW abilities that improve your character in whatever roll you may find yourself in—anything from increasing the amount of supply you can hold to increasing defense from siege attacks to new siege weapon skills. You can train multiple times in the same ability, which increases the effectiveness of the ability, but also increases the cost. (emphasis mine)

Sure, as a player I’m really happy that I’m able to carry more supply. The obvious problem with this feature, as we start seeing players who can carry 20 supplies, is when huge zerg captures supply camp and it’s gone after 5 players have taken their fill.

Making good games is not just about what we players want. It’s about the ramifications to gameplay. What is the balance between increasing guard levels as camp upgrade to experienced players cutting through them like hot knife to butter? Clearly there exists a point where guard level upgrade is useful and when it’s useless, depending what the numbers are. If you never have to worry about taking on the entire camp full of guards as a lone player, something about the system is wrong. Very cheap and stupid solution is to give camp lord an arbitrary 5 minute invulnerability.

Who we? Your just talking for your self. As things stand most classes can solo a camp this just make it so you can specialize in going after camps. This makes it so you NEED to def a camp and not just simply flip and run i think that adds a nice level of play to the game more then just running in and running out.

People asked for progression that gave characters more of an identity.. stuff like this is for those people, just because some others (including me) like to play alts alot.. doesn’t mean they should cater everything to everyone.

I saw this idea of individual “progression” in WvW and cringed. Even worse that it’s character bound. What I liked about WvW was that any player could pick it up and reasonably expect to be on equal footing with almost anyone else, provided they weren’t seriously upscaled. Now we have to constantly play with every character to make them as useful as the next player when we want to join the fight. It becomes less about skill and more about spamming arrow carts and AoE to level up your glorious rank.

Jski.6180:

Who we? Your just talking for your self. As things stand most classes can solo a camp this just make it so you can specialize in going after camps. This makes it so you NEED to def a camp and not just simply flip and run i think that adds a nice level of play to the game more then just running in and running out.

- Capturing supply camps is already many times more rewarding than defending them and that’s the problem. For example you get no camp defense credit if you deter attackers but don’t kill them in camp area. Imagine if someone spends their money to increase guard level, but the camp soloer has it countered by +% damage against camp guards? It doesn’t take much effort to kill dolyaks either, but it takes great deal of effort to protect them against attackers. What this change is doing is to further incentivize that gameplay of taking turns to flip camps.

Sil.4560:

I saw this idea of individual “progression” in WvW and cringed. Even worse that it’s character bound. What I liked about WvW was that any player could pick it up and reasonably expect to be on equal footing with almost anyone else, provided they weren’t seriously upscaled. Now we have to constantly play with every character to make them as useful as the next player when we want to join the fight. It becomes less about skill and more about spamming arrow carts and AoE to level up your glorious rank.

Funny thing Arrow carts where effect by the condition dmg of the player using it so a high condition build would do more dmg with an arrow cart to living targets.

Any way why should WvW be fair? If i go in at a level 2 i cant take on a level 10 nor can i take on a level 80 that alone makes it unfair. On-top of numbers being different and the use of environment. Look at it this way in a war do you chair if the other side is calling what your doing as unfair?

@ Zenith.6403

There more going on then just person rewards its about wining it for your world if you take a camp down your just cutting supple for the 4 min timer (unless they use the trick to kill the guy faster). If you def it your cutting off supplies for a great deal longer.
WvW is more about the rewards of wining and betting some one then a monetarily reward. You fight for your world and bragging rights more then gold and krama.

The reason why people with alts are upset is that it will slow them down. Why should they be punished for looking out for the team? This game was centered around working as a team and with ANETs constant mis-management has turned even the last bastion of team-play in to a self-centered solo themepark. Am I really doing my guild any favors if my passive WvW skills are have kitten Oops, best to stick to one character so I can be the most effective.

Gelltor.3015:

Beorn Saxon.4762:

Gelltor.3015:

What are these perks supposed to be?
Titles are just superficial anyway,if someone sees your low level title and thinks “easy kill” theyll get a nice surprise :p

The question is, why would Anet make titles account based for pve and pvp but then character based for wvw? Yes it’s just vanity, but for those of us that play wvw exclusively I want my title to show that. I don’t want my 8 alts to all have the same noob title as the pve player that only plays in wvw 1/8th of the time I do.

Hmm,they aren’t making them like the PvP ones are they? Like the champion hunter one or those types?

It’s the exact opposite of PvP. PvP ranks are based off of glory, an account based ’currency. WvW ranks will be based off of wvwXP, character based.

I’m by no means an altaholic, but a very dedicated Tier 1 WvW player for multiple months now.
This means that i have different characters for different jobs, since every class, by any means, simply can’t do everything, even tho Anet likes to think so.

I have a Thief who is my main for the sole reason that he is fun to play.
Most of the time Thieves are bloody useless in WvW, and the only time i can really play him is offpeak hours to roam and scout when there is no Guild event going on, since otherwise i would hold my guild back for playing this profession (and feeding rallys in zerg clashes at best).

On the other hand is my Necromancer, a “Zerg Crusher” with a Well Support build.
While it’s still a cool character, for the most part a Necromander is not very interesting, and definately not challenging to play, but I’m really contributing to my group in a major way.

With this new system I’m conflicted between getting sweet titles and useful abilities on my roamer Main, who is rather useless for the most part in WvW, but who i like to keep up at maximum, or on my teamplaying alt, who would get even more usefull amd giving my guild an edge when needed.

Well.. thanks for that one ArenaNet.
I remember buying Guild Wars 2 for a different reason than being forced to play something specific to keep up with the hunt after the next number increasement.

I have 3 characters, level 80s, that I currently use in WvW. My Guardian, a thief and an ele. All have their own particular skills for particular jobs and I will alternate between characters depending on what type of mix the team requires at any particular time. The upcoming changes being character bound will force me to play only one of those characters, regardless of what is required at the time. That character will be forced to keep up to those that play only one character or be at a disadvantage when fighting those characters, similar in part to fighting someone geared with all ascended versus exotic or lower.

Take someone that plays only one toon, has it maxed to the hilt with ascended gear, plus the enhanced abilities this system brings in WvW and place him against someone that plays multiple toons. That second person is not going to be able to match the first as he has to spread upgrades across all his toons. So as many mentioned people will pick one character only for WvW as they have little choice.

Theftwind.8976:

I have 3 characters, level 80s, that I currently use in WvW. My Guardian, a thief and an ele. All have their own particular skills for particular jobs and I will alternate between characters depending on what type of mix the team requires at any particular time. The upcoming changes being character bound will force me to play only one of those characters, regardless of what is required at the time. That character will be forced to keep up to those that play only one character or be at a disadvantage when fighting those characters, similar in part to fighting someone geared with all ascended versus exotic or lower.

Take someone that plays only one toon, has it maxed to the hilt with ascended gear, plus the enhanced abilities this system brings in WvW and place him against someone that plays multiple toons. That second person is not going to be able to match the first as he has to spread upgrades across all his toons. So as many mentioned people will pick one character only for WvW as they have little choice.

Exactly and they don’t care. Time gates are more important to them than player satisfaction and proper design.

Does any one know if this patch will stop me from lvling my alts in WvW?

Because these ranks offer skills, they pretty much have to be character bound. I mean think about it.

Do you level your necro to get skills for your warrior? Do you level your guardian to get skills for your thief? Of course not.

Once skills were part of the package, it’s not unlike any other type of character progression.

Vayne.8563:

Because these ranks offer skills, they pretty much have to be character bound.

Or they could, you know, give each character the same number of points to spend at their whim.

Also, they’re not really skills, they’re passive bonuses.

Jiggy.8240:

Does any one know if this patch will stop me from lvling my alts in WvW?

Don’t worry they won’t stop you from leveling combat in WvW. Heck some people ONLY play WvW so if they did that they would have a lot of angry customers lol.

I like the idea of having Red Barons… people who are recognizable (and feared) because of how good they are at what they do, whether that is efficiently taking out camps or manning a ballista. When recognizing someone, it helps if the face (and body) doesn’t change.

I wouldn’t mind handing the cannon over to someone who I recognized as a cannon specialist, because it could mean the difference between me slowing the zerg down or him massacreing them on the spot. I would mind handing the cannon over to a level 3 character I had never seen before because he was the alt of the cannon master (who popped in for some power leveling.)

misterdevious.6482:

I would mind handing the cannon over to a level 3 character I had never seen before because he was the alt of the cannon master (who popped in for some power leveling.)

Who would be just as good on that cannon as his alt as he would be on his main.

Having the upgrades account-wide is a bad idea, and it’s very easy to see why. A person can get all the upgrades on one character and then come in with a lvl 10, on a class they have never played, that has the same upgrades – this is an unacceptable advantage.

I think the WXP and titles should be accout-wide while the upgrades should be character-bound. When you think about it, the titles and WXP are really just improvements on the already-existing Achievements – which are account-wide.

Having WXP account-wide would mean that when I have maxed out all the upgrades on one character, something which will, no doubt, take a considerable amount of time, I will still be earning points for my alt’s. I can also decide to save some of the points I have earned on one character to improve another – I won’t be wasting time playing my Necro while my Guardian needs 10 more points for the next upgrade.

Vayne.8563:

Because these ranks offer skills, they pretty much have to be character bound. I mean think about it.

Do you level your necro to get skills for your warrior? Do you level your guardian to get skills for your thief? Of course not.

Once skills were part of the package, it’s not unlike any other type of character progression.

You are completely right. Gold should also be character bound. How dare MY warrior be able to spend the money that MY elementalist made. That’s basically like fraud.

Geikamir.6329:

You are completely right. Gold should also be character bound. How dare MY warrior be able to spend the money that MY elementalist made. That’s basically like fraud.

A stupid comparison. Skills = / = gold

Well, Gold buys you crafting mats, crafting mats buy you gear and level ups, level ups buy you traits and skills.

So, gold = skills already

Lukhas.1962:

Geikamir.6329:

You are completely right. Gold should also be character bound. How dare MY warrior be able to spend the money that MY elementalist made. That’s basically like fraud.

A stupid comparison. Skills = / = gold

Just because they aren’t the same thing, takes no merit away from my point.

You realize the these buffs aren’t profession specific right?

First of all I wecome new WvW content…it will make me play WvW alot more…expect hours long wait to get into WvW after the patch…also even more lag in huge blob battles…

I also like new skills and because its skill based then it has to be individual character based doesn’t it? Otherwise why bother with 8 different character classes…just have one generic class…which would be boring as hell…

I have all 8 different classes and to be honest, I want each one to be individual and different so I get more variety when playing…

But, really until the patch and we all get to see what’s, what this entire thread is personal uninformed opinion…otherwise known as idle gossip…

Geikamir.6329:

Vayne.8563:

Because these ranks offer skills, they pretty much have to be character bound. I mean think about it.

Do you level your necro to get skills for your warrior? Do you level your guardian to get skills for your thief? Of course not.

Once skills were part of the package, it’s not unlike any other type of character progression.

You are completely right. Gold should also be character bound. How dare MY warrior be able to spend the money that MY elementalist made. That’s basically like fraud.

Skills are not gold. No matter how much money you have on your tenth level ele, he can’t wear 15th level gear. Bad analogy and misleading on your part.

But what if you had all your traits available to you as a level 5 guy. That would change the game significantly, which is more what we’re talking about.

Minor traits are passive. These are passive. Minor traits are character bound. You don’t get trait points for all your characters. These are WvW traits.

It would make no sense for a character to get a bonus on the traits you earned on another character.

People are simply greedy for power. They want more. It’s human nature. But that doesn’t make it right for the game.

Vayne.8563:

Geikamir.6329:

Vayne.8563:

Because these ranks offer skills, they pretty much have to be character bound. I mean think about it.

Do you level your necro to get skills for your warrior? Do you level your guardian to get skills for your thief? Of course not.

Once skills were part of the package, it’s not unlike any other type of character progression.

You are completely right. Gold should also be character bound. How dare MY warrior be able to spend the money that MY elementalist made. That’s basically like fraud.

Skills are not gold. No matter how much money you have on your tenth level ele, he can’t wear 15th level gear. Bad analogy and misleading on your part.

But what if you had all your traits available to you as a level 5 guy. That would change the game significantly, which is more what we’re talking about.

Minor traits are passive. These are passive. Minor traits are character bound. You don’t get trait points for all your characters. These are WvW traits.

It would make no sense for a character to get a bonus on the traits you earned on another character.

People are simply greedy for power. They want more. It’s human nature. But that doesn’t make it right for the game.

Professions skills =/= WvW passive buffs.

An elementalist will never have a clone shatter trait. And elementalist will have +5 supply.

These buffs are designed to work with any profession. Just like gold.

Also your last sentence literally makes no sense and makes it seems like you are trolling me. Are you trolling me? Cause it seems like you are trolling me. People want more power? What in the world are you talking about? No one asked for these buffs and mostly importantly no one is asking for them for free. What people are asking for is when you earn something that it shouldn’t be artificially held back from you just because you have an alt. I can use gold that I earned on one character on another. That is literally the exact same concept. Same as dungeon tokens.

I’m sorry, but all I’m hearing from the selfish character bound crowd is me me me me me. Seriously, whether I play just one character like the devs want or if its account bound you should face the same skill/rank level as the people who put the same time in. How does this affect you if I’m on my alt with my bonuses? It doesn’t, the only thing it messes with is your selfish egos. WvW is a reward for most people and now you are going to make it a chore just to keep up. That’s right though, you character bound advocates want less competition anyways.

WvW Rank/Skills should show peoples total dedication to WvW, how is my dedication really shown if I hold a novice title and skills because I’m spread out amongst other characters.

Geikamir.6329:

Vayne.8563:

Geikamir.6329:

Vayne.8563:

Because these ranks offer skills, they pretty much have to be character bound. I mean think about it.

Do you level your necro to get skills for your warrior? Do you level your guardian to get skills for your thief? Of course not.

Once skills were part of the package, it’s not unlike any other type of character progression.

You are completely right. Gold should also be character bound. How dare MY warrior be able to spend the money that MY elementalist made. That’s basically like fraud.

Skills are not gold. No matter how much money you have on your tenth level ele, he can’t wear 15th level gear. Bad analogy and misleading on your part.

But what if you had all your traits available to you as a level 5 guy. That would change the game significantly, which is more what we’re talking about.

Minor traits are passive. These are passive. Minor traits are character bound. You don’t get trait points for all your characters. These are WvW traits.

It would make no sense for a character to get a bonus on the traits you earned on another character.

People are simply greedy for power. They want more. It’s human nature. But that doesn’t make it right for the game.

Professions skills =/= WvW passive buffs.

An elementalist will never have a clone shatter trait. And elementalist will have +5 supply.

These buffs are designed to work with any profession. Just like gold.

Also your last sentence literally makes no sense and makes it seems like you are trolling me. Are you trolling me? Cause it seems like you are trolling me. People want more power? What in the world are you talking about? No one asked for these buffs and mostly importantly no one is asking for them for free. What people are asking for is when you earn something that it shouldn’t be artificially held back from you just because you have an alt. I can use gold that I earned on one character on another. That is literally the exact same concept. Same as dungeon tokens.

Sure it’s not like skills. But it’s EXACTLY like traits. Care to argue on that point then? Traits are character bound. These passive skills are like the passive minor traits you get which are also character bound.

Bad argument remains a bad argument.

Edit: People can disagree with you without trolling you. That you see my disagreement as trolling says a lot about how emotionally invested you are in your argument. I’m looking at this in a more detached manner.

Goloith.6349:

I’m sorry, but all I’m hearing from the selfish character bound crowd is me me me me me. Seriously, whether I play just one character like the devs want or if its account bound you should face the same skill/rank level as the people who put the same time in. How does this affect you if I’m on my alt with my bonuses? It doesn’t, the only thing it messes with is your selfish egos. WvW is a reward for most people and now you are going to make it a chore just to keep up. That’s right though, you character bound advocates want less competition anyways.

WvW Rank/Skills should show peoples total dedication to WvW, how is my dedication really shown if I hold a novice title and skills because I’m spread out amongst other characters.

Player 1 levels a character to level 80 in 80 hours.

Player 2 levels 2 characters to level 40 each in 80 hours.

Players 2 “why no me have both characters at max level like player 1. Me play just as long!!!!” /rage

Me: lol

Shonie.5297:

Goloith.6349:

I’m sorry, but all I’m hearing from the selfish character bound crowd is me me me me me. Seriously, whether I play just one character like the devs want or if its account bound you should face the same skill/rank level as the people who put the same time in. How does this affect you if I’m on my alt with my bonuses? It doesn’t, the only thing it messes with is your selfish egos. WvW is a reward for most people and now you are going to make it a chore just to keep up. That’s right though, you character bound advocates want less competition anyways.

WvW Rank/Skills should show peoples total dedication to WvW, how is my dedication really shown if I hold a novice title and skills because I’m spread out amongst other characters.

Player 1 levels a character to level 80 in 80 hours.

Player 2 levels 2 characters to level 40 each in 80 hours.

Players 2 “why no me have both characters at max level like player 1. Me play just as long!!!!” /rage

Me: lol

The difference is that we are talking about rank and title in WvW. People who play alternate characters do it to help the guild/server. As mentioned in the OP, WvW is about player skill and not just character skill. That’s why most people, majority of alts and selfless people believe this should be account bound.

account bound = player skill

I’m really discouraged that people honestly feel like it affects them if I have an account bound reward when it has no affect on them….

Goloith.6349:

Shonie.5297:

Goloith.6349:

I’m sorry, but all I’m hearing from the selfish character bound crowd is me me me me me. Seriously, whether I play just one character like the devs want or if its account bound you should face the same skill/rank level as the people who put the same time in. How does this affect you if I’m on my alt with my bonuses? It doesn’t, the only thing it messes with is your selfish egos. WvW is a reward for most people and now you are going to make it a chore just to keep up. That’s right though, you character bound advocates want less competition anyways.

WvW Rank/Skills should show peoples total dedication to WvW, how is my dedication really shown if I hold a novice title and skills because I’m spread out amongst other characters.

Player 1 levels a character to level 80 in 80 hours.

Player 2 levels 2 characters to level 40 each in 80 hours.

Players 2 “why no me have both characters at max level like player 1. Me play just as long!!!!” /rage

Me: lol

The difference is that we are talking about rank and title in WvW. People who play alternate characters do it to help the guild/server. As mentioned in the OP, WvW is about player skill and not just character skill. That’s why most people, majority of alts and selfless people believe this should be account bound.

account bound = player skill

Not sure how you get the equation account bound equal’s player skill. There are plenty of account bound achievements that take no skill at all.

And I don’t believe that everyone who plays alternate characters does it to help the guild/server. I play alternate characters, because I have fun playing alternate characters. A lot of people are altoholics and play them because it’s fun for them. There are, if you haven’t noticed, an awful lot of altoholics out there. They’re not all selfless.

I think this is a case of your projecting what you do (commendable as it is) on the masses, who just play to have fun.

@Vayne.

Yeah, but you could also be trolling me.

No they aren’t like traits for the exact same reason I already said. They are general use buffs that are not even remotely profession specific.

But that’s neither here-nor-there. They are calling the shots in this vitual world. They can make us all wear tiaras if they wanted to. And they are choosing character bound tine gates which is punishing players that like variety.

And to your argument with Goloith. What does it matter why players play wiyh alts? It doesn’t.

I don’t get how playing an alt helps the server any more than if you were just playing one character.
One warm body = one warm body.

Geikamir.6329:

@Vayne.

Yeah, but you could also be trolling me.

No they aren’t like traits for the exact same reason I already said. They are general use buffs that are not even remotely profession specific.

But that’s neither here-nor-there. They are calling the shots in this vitual world. They can make us all wear tiaras if they wanted to. And they are choosing character bound tine gates which is punishing players that like variety.

Except that I like variety and I personally don’t feel I’m being punished, So they are punishing certain players who like variety. Players like you.

I’m far more interested in having stuff to work toward while they make new content than I am having all my characters progress at once.

The job of an MMO is to give people stuff to do while they’re making enough content to eventually satisfy people. Every MMO does this. Some games have raid lockouts. Some games make you level alts. In this game, leveling alts is mad fast compared to most games. Hell, you can craft to level and have a max character in a couple of days.

So yeah, this is just something else to do. That’s all it is. It’s not personal. It’s something Anet has put there to keep people busy, because that’s pretty much their job.

And some people won’t like it. But believe me, without Anet giving people stuff to do to keep busy, people would get bored and leave. It’s happened before. That’s why they introduced ascended gear and fractals.

People complained, some people left, but more came back and stayed in game. Maybe Anet knows exactly what they’re doing. This is why I say I believe they’re doing what’s right for the game. Hope that explains it.

I generally don’t troll people., btw.

Shonie.5297:

Player 1 levels a character to level 80 in 80 hours.

Player 2 levels 2 characters to level 40 each in 80 hours.

More like:
Player 1 levels a character to level 80
Player 2 levels a character to level 80
Player 1 grinds ascended gear
Player 2 levels second character to level 80
Player 1 grinds WvW exp
Players 2 levels third character to level 80

Result:
None of player 2’s characters are as powerful as player 1’s only character. As Arenanet adds more and more ways to make a single character more powerful, the gap is just getting wider. This is not an opinion how things should be, but a simple factual result of the current policy.

You know what accomplishes that exact same goal but doesn’t punish players with alts? Making progression account bound. If the numbers are balanced right it doesn’t matter if you are playing 1 profession or all 8, it will still take X amount of hours to reach the end.

This system actually rewards rigidly sticking to a main. That’s it.

Geikamir.6329:

You know what accomplishes that exact same goal but doesn’t punish players with alts? Making progression account bound. If the numbers are balanced right it doesn’t matter if you are playing 1 profession or all 8, it will still take X amount of hours to reach the end.

This system actually rewards rigidly sticking to a main. That’s it.

This system rewards rigidly sticking to a main for people with a certain mindset. It doesn’t do that to me. I’ll get at least three or four professions in WvW that I want to play there and I’ll level them all.

Because I don’t believe that the effectiveness of a single individual in WvW is so important that it trumps me having fun.

Vayne.8563:

Geikamir.6329:

You know what accomplishes that exact same goal but doesn’t punish players with alts? Making progression account bound. If the numbers are balanced right it doesn’t matter if you are playing 1 profession or all 8, it will still take X amount of hours to reach the end.

This system actually rewards rigidly sticking to a main. That’s it.

This system rewards rigidly sticking to a main for people with a certain mindset. It doesn’t do that to me. I’ll get at least three or four professions in WvW that I want to play there and I’ll level them all.

Because I don’t believe that the effectiveness of a single individual in WvW is so important that it trumps me having fun.

Just because you don’t care about the reward doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. It also doesn’t mean that it’s a good design for the players.

So yes, it punishes players that like variety and don’t like being arbitrarily disadvantaged. How dare players want such a thing from a multiplayer video game. For shame.

Vayne.8563:

Goloith.6349:

Shonie.5297:

Goloith.6349:

I’m sorry, but all I’m hearing from the selfish character bound crowd is me me me me me. Seriously, whether I play just one character like the devs want or if its account bound you should face the same skill/rank level as the people who put the same time in. How does this affect you if I’m on my alt with my bonuses? It doesn’t, the only thing it messes with is your selfish egos. WvW is a reward for most people and now you are going to make it a chore just to keep up. That’s right though, you character bound advocates want less competition anyways.

WvW Rank/Skills should show peoples total dedication to WvW, how is my dedication really shown if I hold a novice title and skills because I’m spread out amongst other characters.

Player 1 levels a character to level 80 in 80 hours.

Player 2 levels 2 characters to level 40 each in 80 hours.

Players 2 “why no me have both characters at max level like player 1. Me play just as long!!!!” /rage

Me: lol

The difference is that we are talking about rank and title in WvW. People who play alternate characters do it to help the guild/server. As mentioned in the OP, WvW is about player skill and not just character skill. That’s why most people, majority of alts and selfless people believe this should be account bound.

account bound = player skill

Not sure how you get the equation account bound equal’s player skill. There are plenty of account bound achievements that take no skill at all.

And I don’t believe that everyone who plays alternate characters does it to help the guild/server. I play alternate characters, because I have fun playing alternate characters. A lot of people are altoholics and play them because it’s fun for them. There are, if you haven’t noticed, an awful lot of altoholics out there. They’re not all selfless.

I think this is a case of your projecting what you do (commendable as it is) on the masses, who just play to have fun.

In many of the upper tiers in WvW organization and the correct profession composition really matters. Here are some examples:
-Mesmers for veil/portal/timewarp. A skilled mesmer will already have a safety portal for Golems without being asked. If their doing that they aren’t getting badges and WXP. So they already suffer.
-Frontliners (Guardians/Warriors): They are not just warm bodies. If the group is really struggling through choked the can give that needed protection and CC. EMP and other guilds have done GvG and it can really explain why fights are one just based on class composition.
-Elementalists: Their ability to rain down on siege and for their party swords are incredibly effective against doors.
-Thieves are also effective (their AoE stealth with be more effective next patch) with cloaking Golems to the target.
-Rangers are ok, but their pets are great for taking people out on siege.
-Engineers are great for taking over supply camps because of their solo abilities

So people aren’t just warm bodies whether they are ikittenerg or not. An Engineer is a poor choice if running with a zerg. Flamethrower will get you killed, Grenades are useless if your taking a tower with a smart leader (cats/treb vs. rams). Boon Spike Engineer maybe.

I really encourage people to watch EMP and other guilds GvG. It will provide those that don’t understand group composition.

Goloith.6349:

Vayne.8563:

Goloith.6349:

Shonie.5297:

Goloith.6349:

I’m sorry, but all I’m hearing from the selfish character bound crowd is me me me me me. Seriously, whether I play just one character like the devs want or if its account bound you should face the same skill/rank level as the people who put the same time in. How does this affect you if I’m on my alt with my bonuses? It doesn’t, the only thing it messes with is your selfish egos. WvW is a reward for most people and now you are going to make it a chore just to keep up. That’s right though, you character bound advocates want less competition anyways.

WvW Rank/Skills should show peoples total dedication to WvW, how is my dedication really shown if I hold a novice title and skills because I’m spread out amongst other characters.

Player 1 levels a character to level 80 in 80 hours.

Player 2 levels 2 characters to level 40 each in 80 hours.

Players 2 “why no me have both characters at max level like player 1. Me play just as long!!!!” /rage

Me: lol

The difference is that we are talking about rank and title in WvW. People who play alternate characters do it to help the guild/server. As mentioned in the OP, WvW is about player skill and not just character skill. That’s why most people, majority of alts and selfless people believe this should be account bound.

account bound = player skill

Not sure how you get the equation account bound equal’s player skill. There are plenty of account bound achievements that take no skill at all.

And I don’t believe that everyone who plays alternate characters does it to help the guild/server. I play alternate characters, because I have fun playing alternate characters. A lot of people are altoholics and play them because it’s fun for them. There are, if you haven’t noticed, an awful lot of altoholics out there. They’re not all selfless.

I think this is a case of your projecting what you do (commendable as it is) on the masses, who just play to have fun.

In many of the upper tiers in WvW organization and the correct profession composition really matters. Here are some examples:
-Mesmers for veil/portal/timewarp. A skilled mesmer will already have a safety portal for Golems without being asked. If their doing that they aren’t getting badges and WXP. So they already suffer.
-Frontliners (Guardians/Warriors): They are not just warm bodies. If the group is really struggling through choked the can give that needed protection and CC. EMP and other guilds have done GvG and it can really explain why fights are one just based on class composition.
-Elementalists: Their ability to rain down on siege and for their party swords are incredibly effective against doors.
-Thieves are also effective (their AoE stealth with be more effective next patch) with cloaking Golems to the target.
-Rangers are ok, but their pets are great for taking people out on siege.
-Engineers are great for taking over supply camps because of their solo abilities

So people aren’t just warm bodies whether they are ikittenerg or not. An Engineer is a poor choice if running with a zerg. Flamethrower will get you killed, Grenades are useless if your taking a tower with a smart leader (cats/treb vs. rams). Boon Spike Engineer maybe.

I really encourage people to watch EMP and other guilds GvG. It will provide those that don’t understand group composition.

Bigger Zerg and better coverage wins.
Stop making it out like group composition is so important.
Every Zerg has plenty of every class

This could be either good or bad, depending on how long it takes to achieve the titles.

Long time: Bad, for obvious reasons. Players are discouraged from playing on alts or else they fall behind the curve.

Short time: Players get all the achievements on one character, and then feel like the XP is being wasted so start a new character, much like prestige systems in Call of Duty.

Shonie.5297:

Goloith.6349:

Vayne.8563:

Goloith.6349:

Shonie.5297:

Goloith.6349:

I’m sorry, but all I’m hearing from the selfish character bound crowd is me me me me me. Seriously, whether I play just one character like the devs want or if its account bound you should face the same skill/rank level as the people who put the same time in. How does this affect you if I’m on my alt with my bonuses? It doesn’t, the only thing it messes with is your selfish egos. WvW is a reward for most people and now you are going to make it a chore just to keep up. That’s right though, you character bound advocates want less competition anyways.

WvW Rank/Skills should show peoples total dedication to WvW, how is my dedication really shown if I hold a novice title and skills because I’m spread out amongst other characters.

Player 1 levels a character to level 80 in 80 hours.

Player 2 levels 2 characters to level 40 each in 80 hours.

Players 2 “why no me have both characters at max level like player 1. Me play just as long!!!!” /rage

Me: lol

The difference is that we are talking about rank and title in WvW. People who play alternate characters do it to help the guild/server. As mentioned in the OP, WvW is about player skill and not just character skill. That’s why most people, majority of alts and selfless people believe this should be account bound.

account bound = player skill

Not sure how you get the equation account bound equal’s player skill. There are plenty of account bound achievements that take no skill at all.

And I don’t believe that everyone who plays alternate characters does it to help the guild/server. I play alternate characters, because I have fun playing alternate characters. A lot of people are altoholics and play them because it’s fun for them. There are, if you haven’t noticed, an awful lot of altoholics out there. They’re not all selfless.

I think this is a case of your projecting what you do (commendable as it is) on the masses, who just play to have fun.

In many of the upper tiers in WvW organization and the correct profession composition really matters. Here are some examples:
-Mesmers for veil/portal/timewarp. A skilled mesmer will already have a safety portal for Golems without being asked. If their doing that they aren’t getting badges and WXP. So they already suffer.
-Frontliners (Guardians/Warriors): They are not just warm bodies. If the group is really struggling through choked the can give that needed protection and CC. EMP and other guilds have done GvG and it can really explain why fights are one just based on class composition.
-Elementalists: Their ability to rain down on siege and for their party swords are incredibly effective against doors.
-Thieves are also effective (their AoE stealth with be more effective next patch) with cloaking Golems to the target.
-Rangers are ok, but their pets are great for taking people out on siege.
-Engineers are great for taking over supply camps because of their solo abilities

So people aren’t just warm bodies whether they are ikittenerg or not. An Engineer is a poor choice if running with a zerg. Flamethrower will get you killed, Grenades are useless if your taking a tower with a smart leader (cats/treb vs. rams). Boon Spike Engineer maybe.

I really encourage people to watch EMP and other guilds GvG. It will provide those that don’t understand group composition.

Bigger Zerg and better coverage wins.
Stop making it out like group composition is so important.
Every Zerg has plenty of every class

Actually it does play a huge success. That’s why EMP and other great guilds wipe double their numbers. EMP and AEG (can’t remember, but they are from blackgate) were doing a GvG and even though they were killing each other managed to wipe a 50 man SoR zerg that crashed the GvG because the SoR was full of junk builds and not a top-notch line-up of professions. EMP excluded Engineers and Rangers completely and only had 1 thief because they just don’t do enough in a large groups.

You seem like a hack for SoR who either cheats or trolls.

Vayne.8563:

Because these ranks offer skills, they pretty much have to be character bound. I mean think about it.

Do you level your necro to get skills for your warrior? Do you level your guardian to get skills for your thief? Of course not.

Once skills were part of the package, it’s not unlike any other type of character progression.

Not really, the last game I played was Rift that has a level cap progression system where you gain small stat increments and skills, initially that was character bound, but guess what, it put people off from playing alts, so eventually, they changed it so the points were account bound.

And that is in a very traditional grindy game like Rift, that GW2 the “new, non-grindy MMORPG” is going to be more grindy than the likes of Rift, is just well…

You will also note, as soon as it would be an advantage to have things character bound, they decide to make them account bound, e.g – your daily.

Before this game was released, everyone thought it would be great for alts, the reality is in several ways it is worse for alts than many other MMORPGs.

Goloith.6349:

Shonie.5297:

Goloith.6349:

Vayne.8563:

Goloith.6349:

Shonie.5297:

Goloith.6349:

I’m sorry, but all I’m hearing from the selfish character bound crowd is me me me me me. Seriously, whether I play just one character like the devs want or if its account bound you should face the same skill/rank level as the people who put the same time in. How does this affect you if I’m on my alt with my bonuses? It doesn’t, the only thing it messes with is your selfish egos. WvW is a reward for most people and now you are going to make it a chore just to keep up. That’s right though, you character bound advocates want less competition anyways.

WvW Rank/Skills should show peoples total dedication to WvW, how is my dedication really shown if I hold a novice title and skills because I’m spread out amongst other characters.

Player 1 levels a character to level 80 in 80 hours.

Player 2 levels 2 characters to level 40 each in 80 hours.

Players 2 “why no me have both characters at max level like player 1. Me play just as long!!!!” /rage

Me: lol

The difference is that we are talking about rank and title in WvW. People who play alternate characters do it to help the guild/server. As mentioned in the OP, WvW is about player skill and not just character skill. That’s why most people, majority of alts and selfless people believe this should be account bound.

account bound = player skill

Not sure how you get the equation account bound equal’s player skill. There are plenty of account bound achievements that take no skill at all.

And I don’t believe that everyone who plays alternate characters does it to help the guild/server. I play alternate characters, because I have fun playing alternate characters. A lot of people are altoholics and play them because it’s fun for them. There are, if you haven’t noticed, an awful lot of altoholics out there. They’re not all selfless.

I think this is a case of your projecting what you do (commendable as it is) on the masses, who just play to have fun.

In many of the upper tiers in WvW organization and the correct profession composition really matters. Here are some examples:
-Mesmers for veil/portal/timewarp. A skilled mesmer will already have a safety portal for Golems without being asked. If their doing that they aren’t getting badges and WXP. So they already suffer.
-Frontliners (Guardians/Warriors): They are not just warm bodies. If the group is really struggling through choked the can give that needed protection and CC. EMP and other guilds have done GvG and it can really explain why fights are one just based on class composition.
-Elementalists: Their ability to rain down on siege and for their party swords are incredibly effective against doors.
-Thieves are also effective (their AoE stealth with be more effective next patch) with cloaking Golems to the target.
-Rangers are ok, but their pets are great for taking people out on siege.
-Engineers are great for taking over supply camps because of their solo abilities

So people aren’t just warm bodies whether they are ikittenerg or not. An Engineer is a poor choice if running with a zerg. Flamethrower will get you killed, Grenades are useless if your taking a tower with a smart leader (cats/treb vs. rams). Boon Spike Engineer maybe.

I really encourage people to watch EMP and other guilds GvG. It will provide those that don’t understand group composition.

Bigger Zerg and better coverage wins.
Stop making it out like group composition is so important.
Every Zerg has plenty of every class

Actually it does play a huge success. That’s why EMP and other great guilds wipe double their numbers. EMP and AEG (can’t remember, but they are from blackgate) were doing a GvG and even though they were killing each other managed to wipe a 50 man SoR zerg that crashed the GvG because the SoR was full of junk builds and not a top-notch line-up of professions. EMP excluded Engineers and Rangers completely and only had 1 thief because they just don’t do enough in a large groups.

You seem like a hack for SoR who either cheats or trolls.

`This one time a guild of 20 defeated a guild of 500 because they were soooo awesome…
``I bet their group composition was soooo perfect! Wow that`s so awesome… haha at those noobs on SoR… I bet they were all running on some silly class or something. I bet none of them were mesmers or anything! They had no chance against that super guild!
I bet one of those guys could take on an entire army of champion mobs!
Do they walk through siege like superhumans…
I bet that entire guild on BG was using alts to make their group composition perfect. Haha SoR they were probably on theirs mains or something… what a bunch of noobs.``

Ya that`s what you sound like.

@Shonie

Sure, zerg v zerg is currently how it goes. But that doesnt change the fact that this new update will discourage players from playing alts in WvW.

Anet hates zergs, they’ve said they are trying to change that which is one reason they are implementing specialized abilities. So if they want to push people into more specialized teams, then they should not introduce a mechanic that discourages ppl from rerolling as needed.

Also, why must anet have account wide titles in PvE, account wide ranks in PvP, but then go character based for WvW. People that play wvw, want to show off how much they play by having a high rank and not be penalized for rerolling. Rerolling is more fun.

You are picking one thing from PvE that is account-wide and applying it to your argument like somehow you`re making a point.

I can do the same…
``Why are Badges of Honor account-wide in WvW and Legendaries character-bound in PvE… because BoH`s are account-bound, so should legendaries``

See, now my post makes about as much sense as yours.

Shonie.5297:

You are picking one thing from PvE that is account-wide and applying it to your argument like somehow you`re making a point.

I can do the same…
``Why are Badges of Honor account-wide in WvW and Legendaries character-bound in PvE… because BoH`s are account-bound, so should legendaries``

See, now my post makes about as much sense as yours.

Yes and you know how many people want Legendaries to be account bound? Most logically minded people. RNG sucks.

Goloith.6349:

Shonie.5297:

You are picking one thing from PvE that is account-wide and applying it to your argument like somehow you`re making a point.

I can do the same…
``Why are Badges of Honor account-wide in WvW and Legendaries character-bound in PvE… because BoH`s are account-bound, so should legendaries``

See, now my post makes about as much sense as yours.

Yes and you know how many people want Legendaries to be account bound? Most logically minded people. RNG sucks.

I am gonna guess this isn`t your first MMO, and that you should be aware that RPG`s are based on character-progression, not account progression.
I`m at a loss why this new generation of gamers wants everything to be account-bound.
So you have to work a little harder to progress each character individually, big deal. That`s what RPG`s are.
I`m sorry you can`t start a new character and have EVERYTHING already on it. Is this some sort of new thing you`re experiencing or is this not what happens in every MMO and RPG ever made.

The new update won’t discourage me from playing my alts at all. Just more fun to be in WvW while i build up my characters.

Just the typical thread these days, when any MMO has an update, about how some section of the playerbase is getting a “screw job”, thats really become all too prevalant. Though it would normally be about 12 pages long by now i would think, so it can’t be all bad

Shonie.5297:

Goloith.6349:

Shonie.5297:

You are picking one thing from PvE that is account-wide and applying it to your argument like somehow you`re making a point.

I can do the same…
``Why are Badges of Honor account-wide in WvW and Legendaries character-bound in PvE… because BoH`s are account-bound, so should legendaries``

See, now my post makes about as much sense as yours.

Yes and you know how many people want Legendaries to be account bound? Most logically minded people. RNG sucks.

I am gonna guess this isn`t your first MMO, and that you should be aware that RPG`s are based on character-progression, not account progression.
I`m at a loss why this new generation of gamers wants everything to be account-bound.
So you have to work a little harder to progress each character individually, big deal. That`s what RPG`s are.
I`m sorry you can`t start a new character and have EVERYTHING already on it. Is this some sort of new thing you`re experiencing or is this not what happens in every MMO and RPG ever made.

People that play alts because its fun. We have already gone through so much character progression that they expect that when it comes to something that is around player skill, the player should be rewarded, not a character.

The question that I have to ask is How does making this account bound affect those that only wish to play one character? The answer is that it does not affect you one bit so why do you put up such opposition to people wanting to play at the same competitive level across all their characters? Why is there no valid reason that anyone posted on here as to why it affects them? The only thing that comes to mind is blatant selfishness.

Goloith.6349:

kash.9213:

Garreth MacLeod.4158:

Really poor decision by someone at Arenanet. However, I will continue to play on all my characters. They will just progress slower than the person that plays on the same character. I like variety in my game.

As much as I’d like to think myself of the same mood, I can see myself quickly shelving my alts since any time on them would feel like time away from my main character. I wouldn’t care much about titles and all of that, but any current or new currencies for any current or future stat progression would pretty much settle the matter.

Honestly I don’t care at all about WvW rank. I think most WvW players want is actual progression instead of all this fluff. Personally I think there should be ways to get Ascended gear with badges. Honestly many people in WvW stuck it out this long with hopes of this. Another path ANET should have taken is actually rewarding the top servers/winning servers with even better loot while in WvW. Yes it got much better, but compared to PvE its still lacking. One idea that I really would like is if guilds could earn guild tokens and the guild leader could assign them out in a max of two a week per person to the guildies working the hardest….probably would actually see people dedicated to defense because they knew their guild leader appreciates it. That progression would have been much better.

So many ideas.

The ascended gear for badges would be awesome.

Another buddy of mine thought of something too, if you could convert badges into dungeon tokens so you could get some of the dungeon gear by playing WvW a lot, ya know, playing the way I want to play. At the very least, have all or most stat allocations available for badges as opposed to only PVT gear being offered for badges the way it is now.

Goloith.6349:

Shonie.5297:

Goloith.6349:

Shonie.5297:

You are picking one thing from PvE that is account-wide and applying it to your argument like somehow you`re making a point.

I can do the same…
``Why are Badges of Honor account-wide in WvW and Legendaries character-bound in PvE… because BoH`s are account-bound, so should legendaries``

See, now my post makes about as much sense as yours.

Yes and you know how many people want Legendaries to be account bound? Most logically minded people. RNG sucks.

I am gonna guess this isn`t your first MMO, and that you should be aware that RPG`s are based on character-progression, not account progression.
I`m at a loss why this new generation of gamers wants everything to be account-bound.
So you have to work a little harder to progress each character individually, big deal. That`s what RPG`s are.
I`m sorry you can`t start a new character and have EVERYTHING already on it. Is this some sort of new thing you`re experiencing or is this not what happens in every MMO and RPG ever made.

People that play alts because its fun. We have already gone through so much character progression that they expect that when it comes to something that is around player skill, the player should be rewarded, not a character.

The question that I have to ask is How does making this account bound affect those that only wish to play one character? The answer is that it does not affect you one bit so why do you put up such opposition to people wanting to play at the same competitive level across all their characters? Why is there no valid reason that anyone posted on here as to why it affects them? The only thing that comes to mind is blatant selfishness.

Maybe it’s not blatant selfishness. Perhaps people don’t find it nearly as earth-shattering as you seem to.

I play alts, and guess what? This isn’t a big deal, its character progression.

giddy-up.