Guild Wars 2

I just finished leveling a necro and it dawned on me. I grinded away to 80 It’s finally time to get get my gear, but I did everything. The maps entierly open. By 80 your build is pretty etched in stone.

Of course, I can’t get any temple armor because good luck getting one open durring a living story event. I would like to do get the temples for fun anyway. Let’s face it, Orr is a graveyard anyway. (no pun intended.)

Yes there’s living story, but that is dead in a week after release. Plus it further kills the other maps. Personal story? Once you don’t need the XP what is the point? Its usually an unrewarding pain.

i think for a lot of people WvW is endgame.

SHM.7628:

By 80 your build is pretty etched in stone.

Literally just yesterday I played four different builds on my mesmer trying to figure out which one I liked best. They were all very, very distinct in terms of skills and playstyle.

Maybe necro is different — haven’t played one yet — but I doubt it.

People get too hung up on concepts like ‘endgame’.

I always laugh when I read “endgame” in regards to an MMO. It’s especially funny in regards to GW2 with the whole Living Story and dynamic elements.

Its a living, breathing world in a virtual universe. IRL “endgame” is death. Do you want endgame in GW2? I sure don’t.

Is end-game supposed to be some sort of an enlightenment state to be looking forward to? Sort of like Diablo II where you got all the top rune words and hit 99, that’s boring because what else is there to do. You either start over with a different character or roam around killing stuff that yield no further better rewards. I’m glad there is continually new contents, new class of equipment to seek out.

Qaelyn.7612:

SHM.7628:

By 80 your build is pretty etched in stone.

Literally just yesterday I played four different builds on my mesmer trying to figure out which one I liked best. They were all very, very distinct in terms of skills and playstyle.

Maybe necro is different — haven’t played one yet — but I doubt it.

People get too hung up on concepts like ‘endgame’.

Its not that you can’t change. I know you can. I have leveled 7 toons to 80. What often happens is You are geared, weaponed and traited for a specific build.

It’s also been my exprience that certain builds far outshine others as for there usefulness. By level 80 you’ve probably already experimented and found what works best. I know I have. It doesn’t mean I never switch out skills though.

quaniesan.8497:

Is end-game supposed to be some sort of an enlightenment state to be looking forward to? Sort of like Diablo II where you got all the top rune words and hit 99, that’s boring because what else is there to do. You either start over with a different character or roam around killing stuff that yield no further better rewards. I’m glad there is continually new contents, new class of equipment to seek out.

i’ve always viewed it as two parts: leveling and end-game

Leveling is basically training. You learn about the world and your character progressively. As you level up you get access to more skills and i wider range of gameplay options. You also progressively open up dungeons (although, i think the trend in GW2 is to hit 80 then do dungeons) with the same idea of slowly learning them as you level up.

End-game is what happens after you’ve completed your “training.” At this point you should have a good idea of your character’s role, ability, and enough info about the game lore to understand the significance of in game events, stories, etc.

quaniesan.8497:

Is end-game supposed to be some sort of an enlightenment state to be looking forward to? Sort of like Diablo II where you got all the top rune words and hit 99, that’s boring because what else is there to do. You either start over with a different character or roam around killing stuff that yield no further better rewards. I’m glad there is continually new contents, new class of equipment to seek out.

Hey look, different strokes for different folks. I don’t personally like a gear grind. I can see you do and so do many others.

Don’t get me wrong, I think the living world stuff is great too. However, Look at the last 3 living story events. People rush through and get the achievement and then they are dead.

perhaps the missing element is progression? If there’s no loot and/or achievement no one plays. I’ve rarely gotten exotic loot. By and large the chests drog junk as do the mobs. Anyway, I don’t think its a question of right and wrong. I got the feeling of no end game when i hit 80.

In the bible Samson slaughters 1,000 Phillistines with the jawbone of an (animal that would probably be rendered in this forum as ‘kitten’ but really wasn’t). So here the equivalent would be buying an ML0 mace and wiping out an entire WvW zerg.

There’s your endgame. Get to work!

Scrambles.2604:

quaniesan.8497:

Is end-game supposed to be some sort of an enlightenment state to be looking forward to? Sort of like Diablo II where you got all the top rune words and hit 99, that’s boring because what else is there to do. You either start over with a different character or roam around killing stuff that yield no further better rewards. I’m glad there is continually new contents, new class of equipment to seek out.

i’ve always viewed it as two parts: leveling and end-game

Leveling is basically training. You learn about the world and your character progressively. As you level up you get access to more skills and i wider range of gameplay options. You also progressively open up dungeons (although, i think the trend in GW2 is to hit 80 then do dungeons) with the same idea of slowly learning them as you level up.

End-game is what happens after you’ve completed your “training.” At this point you should have a good idea of your character’s role, ability, and enough info about the game lore to understand the significance of in game events, stories, etc.

Thank you, I really think this was what i was feeling but was having a hard time putting it into words. Perfectly stated you hit the nail on the head. (you’re a genius)

I feel like hitting 80 should be the begining not the end. From a training perpective (like you said) I was probably at endgame around level 40 (tops) but had to grind out another 40 levels. why? i learned the mechanics. The whole thing was just very unfulfilling.

Endgame here is you hit 80, then go chase them shiny! Make your character perty, or monsterous or w/e you so desire <3

Get your gear done up by stat, but also skin them out, get more armor sets since build changes aren’t expensive at all, get a legendary, max them crafts and chase those titles!

The “endgame” here is something that can be forever expanded upon without having to render everyone else’s accomplishments invalid when the next year-long grind for the fancy Tier X+1 gear comes out.
That said, avoid WvW being your endgame… every time i seen people go from pve to WvW it was the final destination before they left to play something else

Inimicus.7162:

Endgame here is you hit 80, then go chase them shiny! Make your character perty, or monsterous or w/e you so desire <3

Get your gear done up by stat, but also skin them out, get more armor sets since build changes aren’t expensive at all, get a legendary, max them crafts and chase those titles!

The “endgame” here is something that can be forever expanded upon without having to render everyone else’s accomplishments invalid when the next year-long grind for the fancy Tier X+1 gear comes out.
That said, avoid WvW being your endgame… every time i seen people go from pve to WvW it was the final destination before they left to play something else

Most of what you described there is just busy work. gear chasing just isn’t my thing. Some longterm goals are good, but legendary is not gonna happen fora player like me. WvW is a bad substitution for endgame. Probably why they left soon after.

SHM.7628:

Most of what you described there is just busy work. gear chasing just isn’t my thing. Some longterm goals are good, but legendary is not gonna happen fora player like me. WvW is a bad substitution for endgame. Probably why they left soon after.

So what is it you want? I honestly don’t get it. I’ve been playing for only a few weeks, mind you, but I’ve already found enough stuff here to keep me busy for at least a year of solid play, and that’s before all the stuff they add in.

You do realize that there is no possible way for any company to keep powergamers happy with PvE unless they have a massive dev staff that few would be willing to pay for? If you’re ignoring WvW and PvP then sure, you’re going to get bored. That’s how it is in all games.

SHM.7628:

Scrambles.2604:

quaniesan.8497:

Is end-game supposed to be some sort of an enlightenment state to be looking forward to? Sort of like Diablo II where you got all the top rune words and hit 99, that’s boring because what else is there to do. You either start over with a different character or roam around killing stuff that yield no further better rewards. I’m glad there is continually new contents, new class of equipment to seek out.

i’ve always viewed it as two parts: leveling and end-game

Leveling is basically training. You learn about the world and your character progressively. As you level up you get access to more skills and i wider range of gameplay options. You also progressively open up dungeons (although, i think the trend in GW2 is to hit 80 then do dungeons) with the same idea of slowly learning them as you level up.

End-game is what happens after you’ve completed your “training.” At this point you should have a good idea of your character’s role, ability, and enough info about the game lore to understand the significance of in game events, stories, etc.

Thank you, I really think this was what i was feeling but was having a hard time putting it into words. Perfectly stated you hit the nail on the head. (you’re a genius)

I feel like hitting 80 should be the begining not the end. From a training perpective (like you said) I was probably at endgame around level 40 (tops) but had to grind out another 40 levels. why? i learned the mechanics. The whole thing was just very unfulfilling.

meh, to each his own, i suppose. I thought i knew my way around my ele at 80, but here i am still learning things. After 80, i view my progression skill wise, which is nice but not tangible like gear upgrades.

In WoW, end game progression was — PvP or raids and dungeons via stat upgrades. You need to complete this dungeon to get this gear in order to complete this dungeon, which will get you this gear, which you need to complete this raid, and so on. I haven’t played WoW in years so this might not be entirely accurate.

But in GW2 you have – PvP and Dungeons/events/open world what have you. But there is nothing that bars you entry from dungeons. Gear only mitigates the difficulty of dungeons, rather than determine what you have access to.

At this point with max stats (via exotics) you only progress in skill. In my experience, this has represented by my gradual transition from defensive gear to glass cannon gear. As i get better, i rely on my stats less for defense, as i get better and dodging and using utilities.

Personally, i have always been about PvP. I enjoy WvW when i can actually get in, and i spend time outside of WvW killing time, doing living story (i enjoy checking out the content as opposed to checking off achievements), or preparing myself for future WvW endeavors.

Inimicus.7162:

Endgame here is you hit 80, then go chase them shiny! Make your character perty, or monsterous or w/e you so desire <3

Get your gear done up by stat, but also skin them out, get more armor sets since build changes aren’t expensive at all, get a legendary, max them crafts and chase those titles!

Scrambles really did say it perfectly. You talked about crafting & getting a legendary. What is the point. The stuff before level 80 is all throw away stuff because you will outgrow it.

By level 80 you are through all of the content. So you never needed any of the gear to progress anyway. You could actually level in the lower level areas and not be very geared at all (if you so chose) I didn’t buy any gear over level 70 greens. You could feasibly just equip what you find.

Fractals are a great high level event. There a lot of end game in GW2 mainly because the full game is made to be end game.

Scrambles.2604:

i think for a lot of people WvW is endgame.

Sadly, I think this is rapidly becoming my only enjoyment in the game. I don’t want to tag along the zerg trains for every LS patch. I want to play in other zones…complete random DEs with a few random people. I can’t do that…there isnt anyone around to do it with.

So, I’ll try my hat in WvW. If that fails and/or LS doesn’t improve rapidly based on our feedback in the CDI, I don’t think I can play this game anymore.

Qaelyn.7612:

SHM.7628:

Most of what you described there is just busy work. gear chasing just isn’t my thing. Some longterm goals are good, but legendary is not gonna happen fora player like me. WvW is a bad substitution for endgame. Probably why they left soon after.

So what is it you want? I honestly don’t get it. I’ve been playing for only a few weeks, mind you, but I’ve already found enough stuff here to keep me busy for at least a year of solid play, and that’s before all the stuff they add in.

You do realize that there is no possible way for any company to keep powergamers happy with PvE unless they have a massive dev staff that few would be willing to pay for? If you’re ignoring WvW and PvP then sure, you’re going to get bored. That’s how it is in all games.

PvP and WvW are not my thing. I am not a power gamer btw. Some of these achievements are simply out of my grasp. They don’t interest me.

What do i want? I’d like to be fully geared and leveled before I hit 80 and all the content is done. What’s the point of finishing everything first? That is like getting all warmed up before a nap.

I think the problem is that at level 80 the character feels like it has no sense of purpose.

cesmode.4257:

Scrambles.2604:

i think for a lot of people WvW is endgame.

Sadly, I think this is rapidly becoming my only enjoyment in the game. I don’t want to tag along the zerg trains for every LS patch. I want to play in other zones…complete random DEs with a few random people. I can’t do that…there isnt anyone around to do it with.

So, I’ll try my hat in WvW. If that fails and/or LS doesn’t improve rapidly based on our feedback in the CDI, I don’t think I can play this game anymore.

so true. a lot of the contenet is abandoned. It’s even worse when there is a living story event going on.

Qaelyn.7612:

SHM.7628:

By 80 your build is pretty etched in stone.

Literally just yesterday I played four different builds on my mesmer trying to figure out which one I liked best. They were all very, very distinct in terms of skills and playstyle.

Maybe necro is different — haven’t played one yet — but I doubt it.

People get too hung up on concepts like ‘endgame’.

Try doing that with a Thief.

Doggie.3184:

Qaelyn.7612:

SHM.7628:

By 80 your build is pretty etched in stone.

Literally just yesterday I played four different builds on my mesmer trying to figure out which one I liked best. They were all very, very distinct in terms of skills and playstyle.

Maybe necro is different — haven’t played one yet — but I doubt it.

People get too hung up on concepts like ‘endgame’.

Try doing that with a Thief.

haha i’ve built different version of “all stealth” and “slightly less stealth”

Seriously though, i have different builds for different situations on my thief, but i don’t have a lot of different builds for the same situations, if that makes sense.

SHM.7628:

What do i want? I’d like to be fully geared and leveled before I hit 80 and all the content is done. What’s the point of finishing everything first? That is like getting all warmed up before a nap.

Huh? How can you be fully leveled when you haven’t hit the level cap? And how can you wear gear when you haven’t reached its level yet? This makes no sense to me.

There is no possible way you have done everything the game has to offer even in the open areas by the time you hit 80 on a first character. GW2 gives XP for everything, so it simply cannot be done. Furthermore, the game is designed to let you go back to lower-level areas. And then there are dungeons, living story, WvW, PvP, etc.

So you haven’t finished everything, not even close. You’ve just decided you don’t want to do a huge percentage of what the game offers, which suggests that it isn’t that there’s a problem with the game but just that you’re not a good match for it.

I guess recycled content is what passes for endgame in GW2….

Atherakhia.4086:

I guess recycled content is what passes for endgame in GW2….

And all other mmorpgs how often did you only run an end game event once in other mmorpgs? Just because its not level 80 or the cap level dose not make it any less of an endgame event.

WvW and Fractals is really the only end game that I see other than dungeons which, let’s face it get boring after a few times. Fractals is getting trashed with the new update. WvW is just Karma/Event farms.
Game is pretty much the same thing day in day out no matter what you’re doing. Focus on 80 really isn’t worth it as it only opens a few things up to you anyway :/.

If you look at the end game in GW1, you had Fissure of Woe/Underworld/Urgoz/Deep/DoA.. in Normal mode.. then Hard mode..

Then we had, vanquishes (kill all mobs in the area for a title)
We had skill capper titles, mission completion titles, kurzick/luxon titles (serious time sinks)
The titles themselves held some meaning, in gw2.. they really don’t.
Cartographer titles, HM / NM mission titles. There really was always something to do even if it was just hanging around in LA or Kamadan for random chats it was entertaining.

We built speed clears that just anyone could do with a little know how. Groups upon groups used to form every day, all day and just do stuff. FoWSc/UWSc/DoASc

Then we got dungeons, and we could do them in NM and in HM. Content Content Content. Okay we had 1 explanion and 2 other campaigns added but even just prophecies the first time through was a huge game. The grind for those Superior Runes, the grind for the greens when Sorrows Furnace was released. It was all there, and it was all enjoyable.
GW2.. just doesn’t have that.

The whole game is endgame. The only difference is you stop leveling.

One of the problems with ’end game’ here is the lack of desirable commodities.

Everything in the game rewards with you gold or items that will be turned into gold. Outside of Precursors and a few select sigil/runes, there’s really nothing of value that can be bought for gold.

I think the ’end game’ here wouldn’t be as dull if there were more items that could be acquired through play. Armor, Weapon, Back skins that can be purchased with karma currency as opposed to gold.

I see very little reason to hurry through leveling in GW2.

People always say there is no endgame.

…in every game.

Have you seen your achievements tab?

End game. Go get your achievements….done every mini dungeon? done ever goggles? done every jumping puzzle? done your slayer achieves? Dungeons can be done with LFG…I only PUG dungeons and have never waited more than 10 minutes for a group…even during living story. Fractals? Got your world explorer?

People who complain about no endgame haven’t actually looked. I have found more to do here than in WoW because I don’t need a group of 40 people to do GW2 “endgame”.

A lot of the GW2 community kind of reminds me of that one kid at Chuck E. Cheese’s.

See, when you go to Chuck E. Cheese’s, you eat pizza and you play games (or I guess you could spend your whole day in the urine-soaked ball pit). Some games give out tickets. Those tickets can be exchanged for little gifts. To complete the experience, it’s nice to at least go home with a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles pencil topper.

But there’s always that one kid who knows the trick. He knows that skee-ball pays out way more tickets than anything else, if you’re good at it. And he’s good at it. So that’s all he plays for 6 hours straight, with only a quick break for pizza. By the end, he’s probably sick of skee-ball. But the tickets! He’s going home with pencil toppers of all four Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles!

There’s a lot more to do in the game when you’re not chasing the tickets.

Clockwork Bard.3105:

But there’s always that one kid who knows the trick. He knows that skee-ball pays out way more tickets than anything else, if you’re good at it. And he’s good at it. So that’s all he plays for 6 hours straight, with only a quick break for pizza. By the end, he’s probably sick of skee-ball. But the tickets! He’s going home with pencil toppers of all four Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles!

Yep. Except he’s not just sick of skee-ball, he goes on the Internet to tell everyone who will listen that Chuck E. Cheese is ‘boring’ because there’s ‘nothing to do but the same thing over and over again’.

Clockwork Bard.3105:

A lot of the GW2 community kind of reminds me of that one kid at Chuck E. Cheese’s.

See, when you go to Chuck E. Cheese’s, you eat pizza and you play games (or I guess you could spend your whole day in the urine-soaked ball pit). Some games give out tickets. Those tickets can be exchanged for little gifts. To complete the experience, it’s nice to at least go home with a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles pencil topper.

But there’s always that one kid who knows the trick. He knows that skee-ball pays out way more tickets than anything else, if you’re good at it. And he’s good at it. So that’s all he plays for 6 hours straight, with only a quick break for pizza. By the end, he’s probably sick of skee-ball. But the tickets! He’s going home with pencil toppers of all four Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles!

There’s a lot more to do in the game when you’re not chasing the tickets.

Best MMO analogy ever. +1

Too bad Chuck E. Cheese’s only exists in some parts of the US.

If you think your build is etched in stone you’re definitely playing the game wrong. Even for PvE I have 4 sets of armor for my Guardian to optimize him for different situations.

The game does lack a PVE endgame in the traditional sense though.

It lacks whats kind of the ‘final boss’ of content. In most games you have raids, hardmode dungeons and the such . Challenging content which rich rewards which will test what you learnt so far in the game to the limit.

You have some of those here in GW2, like TA Aetherpath, but theres very few of them, and the rewards you get for doing them is just a joke. High level fractals? Worst income ever. TA? 1/100000000 chance at skins which are just reskinned versions of another skin. Arah? Why do it when AC gives you faster gold?

I don’t understand what you want SHM.

You say there’s no point doing your personal story or living story content because you’re not being rewarded with useful XP and gear. But then you also say you don’t want to keep grinding gear and you’d like to be at max level and fully geared before finishing everything.

You can’t have it both ways. Either you get to the max level and have max gear before you’ve finished everything and then don’t need the XP and drops you get from those activities, or you have to do everything in the game to get to max level and have the best gear and then you’re forever working towards that.

Qaelyn.7612:

SHM.7628:

What do i want? I’d like to be fully geared and leveled before I hit 80 and all the content is done. What’s the point of finishing everything first? That is like getting all warmed up before a nap.

Huh? How can you be fully leveled when you haven’t hit the level cap? And how can you wear gear when you haven’t reached its level yet? This makes no sense to me.

There is no possible way you have done everything the game has to offer even in the open areas by the time you hit 80 on a first character. GW2 gives XP for everything, so it simply cannot be done. Furthermore, the game is designed to let you go back to lower-level areas. And then there are dungeons, living story, WvW, PvP, etc.

So you haven’t finished everything, not even close. You’ve just decided you don’t want to do a huge percentage of what the game offers, which suggests that it isn’t that there’s a problem with the game but just that you’re not a good match for it.

I’ll dismiss you right there. You have no idea what I have done and not done in this game.

Danikat.8537:

I don’t understand what you want SHM.

You say there’s no point doing your personal story or living story content because you’re not being rewarded with useful XP and gear. But then you also say you don’t want to keep grinding gear and you’d like to be at max level and fully geared before finishing everything.

You can’t have it both ways. Either you get to the max level and have max gear before you’ve finished everything and then don’t need the XP and drops you get from those activities, or you have to do everything in the game to get to max level and have the best gear and then you’re forever working towards that.

A bit off topic, but with personal story I’ve completed it. I find it amazingly boring on the higher levels. I like it a lot before trahearne shows up. So not only is it not fun, but it isn’t rewarding on the higher levels either. The loot is lackluster and i no longer need the XP.

Loot at the end doesn’t necessarilly have to be gear, just something useful or even a nice skin, gold reward, etc.

Endgame on this game is the gem store. Every 2 weeks you get a new endgame. How is that not fun?

SHM.7628:

I’ll dismiss you right there. You have no idea what I have done and not done in this game.

I think you’re dismissing me (and others) because you simply don’t like what we have to say.

What I know of what you’ve done and not done is based on what you’ve said in this discussion, almost none of which has made a lick of sense.

The claim that you’ve “done everything” in getting to 80 is false because that simply is impossible given the game’s XP rates.

The claim that your build is “etched in stone” by the time you get to 80 is also factually false. Build changing in this game is easy-peasy, and pretty much nothing is “etched in stone” as you level except for your race and class.

You don’t want to do WvW or PvP, thus immediately removing huge parts of the game.

When asked what you actually do want, you give answers like wanting to be ‘geared and leveled by the time you hit 80’.

The problem isn’t with the game, the problem is you need to find one that better suits your interests. Developers not only cannot make happy people who play a game they don’t like, they shouldn’t try to make such people happy, as it will only ruin things for those who actually like the game.

There is no End Game….

Dante.1508:

There is no End Game….

Spoon boy.8932: Do not try and play the end game. That’s impossible. Instead… only try to realize the truth.

Neo.0001: What truth?

Spoon boy.8932: There is no end game.

Neo.0001: There is no end game?

Spoon boy.8932: Then you’ll see, that it is not the end game that plays, it is only yourself.

Clockwork Bard.3105:

A lot of the GW2 community kind of reminds me of that one kid at Chuck E. Cheese’s.

See, when you go to Chuck E. Cheese’s, you eat pizza and you play games (or I guess you could spend your whole day in the urine-soaked ball pit). Some games give out tickets. Those tickets can be exchanged for little gifts. To complete the experience, it’s nice to at least go home with a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles pencil topper.

But there’s always that one kid who knows the trick. He knows that skee-ball pays out way more tickets than anything else, if you’re good at it. And he’s good at it. So that’s all he plays for 6 hours straight, with only a quick break for pizza. By the end, he’s probably sick of skee-ball. But the tickets! He’s going home with pencil toppers of all four Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles!

There’s a lot more to do in the game when you’re not chasing the tickets.

This right here is dead on. I’ve been playing since beta, and I know I’m in the ball park of 2500 hours played. 2 k of which is on my main. And I still love the hell out of this game.

It retains my interest through living story, WvW, and sPvP, all of which I do depending on my mood. I have all that time in and STILL not even close to significant rank in PvP, nor a dungeon master title. I hate plugging and my guild is both small and often busy irl.

The key is I never do anything that doesn’t really interest me. It creates this positive feedback loop where every time I Iog in I’m entertained or challenged in some way. Which keeps me logging in.

Yet somehow while playing this game in ways the “uber” players would consider stupid and inefficient, I’ve managed to enjoy the hell out of this game to date, AND still have plenty left to do.

Qaelyn.7612:

SHM.7628:

What do i want? I’d like to be fully geared and leveled before I hit 80 and all the content is done. What’s the point of finishing everything first? That is like getting all warmed up before a nap.

Huh? How can you be fully leveled when you haven’t hit the level cap? And how can you wear gear when you haven’t reached its level yet? This makes no sense to me.

Your questions: How can you be fully leveled when you haven’t hit the level cap?

I’ve pretty much unlocked all PVE maps from stater areas to cursed shore by the time I ding 80. I did it equipped with level 70 greens and weapons. I hit 80. I get the gear and I am all dressed up with no place to go. No hard mode and no additional maps.

And how can you wear gear when you haven’t reached its level yet?

There’s no necessecity for a toon to be 80 to wear max gear. look at GW1. You could buy max gear as soon as you could get to it and afford it. By the time I was doing my alts i could get max gear at very low levels.

Fixes? Gear could max out at level 20 for example. Perhaps there could be maps higher than level 80. perhaps a hardmode.

Lastly, i thinjk there’s too much gear in this game anyway.

SHM.7628:

I just finished leveling a necro and it dawned on me. I grinded away to 80 It’s finally time to get get my gear, but I did everything. The maps entierly open. By 80 your build is pretty etched in stone.

Of course, I can’t get any temple armor because good luck getting one open durring a living story event. I would like to do get the temples for fun anyway. Let’s face it, Orr is a graveyard anyway. (no pun intended.)

Yes there’s living story, but that is dead in a week after release. Plus it further kills the other maps. Personal story? Once you don’t need the XP what is the point? Its usually an unrewarding pain.

If you only play 1 build then you’re only limiting yourself. Try other styles.

If you leveled 1-80 exploring the world then now might be time to jump into some dungeon groups.

Have you done fractals? Nope, cuz they’re 80 only. And they’re getting an update soon so there will be more to love.

WvW. Now that you’ve got your PvE build sussed out, try giving WvW a shot and finding your build for that. And gear…you’re gonna need new gear so that’s something to work toward. And despite the fact that WvW is accessible at level 2, you really aren’t competitive until around 80.

Want to do Orr but it’s dead (pun intended)? Then organize a group. Gather guildies, gather first-timers, gather random Lions Archers and lead your assault on the temples.

And most people find the Personal Story to be a highlight of the game. If you don’t like it you don’t have to play it, but many like it. It’s not always about the rewards, but the journey.

You can’t complain about no end game if you just don’t want to do it. It’s there. That’s like complaining that Papa Johns doesn’t have any topping selection because you only like pepperoni.

Basharic.1654:

Clockwork Bard.3105:

A lot of the GW2 community kind of reminds me of that one kid at Chuck E. Cheese’s.

See, when you go to Chuck E. Cheese’s, you eat pizza and you play games (or I guess you could spend your whole day in the urine-soaked ball pit). Some games give out tickets. Those tickets can be exchanged for little gifts. To complete the experience, it’s nice to at least go home with a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles pencil topper.

But there’s always that one kid who knows the trick. He knows that skee-ball pays out way more tickets than anything else, if you’re good at it. And he’s good at it. So that’s all he plays for 6 hours straight, with only a quick break for pizza. By the end, he’s probably sick of skee-ball. But the tickets! He’s going home with pencil toppers of all four Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles!

There’s a lot more to do in the game when you’re not chasing the tickets.

This right here is dead on. I’ve been playing since beta, and I know I’m in the ball park of 2500 hours played. 2 k of which is on my main. And I still love the hell out of this game.

It retains my interest through living story, WvW, and sPvP, all of which I do depending on my mood. I have all that time in and STILL not even close to significant rank in PvP, nor a dungeon master title. I hate plugging and my guild is both small and often busy irl.

The key is I never do anything that doesn’t really interest me. It creates this positive feedback loop where every time I Iog in I’m entertained or challenged in some way. Which keeps me logging in.

Yet somehow while playing this game in ways the “uber” players would consider stupid and inefficient, I’ve managed to enjoy the hell out of this game to date, AND still have plenty left to do.

You make some very valid points. You should only do what you enjoy. I’d never enjoy a great deal of what this game has to offer because much of it is for the uber player. I find what i like and I do it too.

Anyway, the intent behind my post is that I like to PVE. I put in the hours get to 80 nad I’ve done all the PVE I enjoy already. I think it’s more a question of the content not being grated properly than it being bad per se.

I am not a gear chaser either. There’s really only one set of gear you are going to focus on That is your top tier 80 gear. But why? I’ve run through the content without it. The same could be said about crafting. Why bother?

Seras.5702:

SHM.7628:

I just finished leveling a necro and it dawned on me. I grinded away to 80 It’s finally time to get get my gear, but I did everything. The maps entierly open. By 80 your build is pretty etched in stone.

Of course, I can’t get any temple armor because good luck getting one open durring a living story event. I would like to do get the temples for fun anyway. Let’s face it, Orr is a graveyard anyway. (no pun intended.)

Yes there’s living story, but that is dead in a week after release. Plus it further kills the other maps. Personal story? Once you don’t need the XP what is the point? Its usually an unrewarding pain.

If you only play 1 build then you’re only limiting yourself. Try other styles.

If you leveled 1-80 exploring the world then now might be time to jump into some dungeon groups.

Have you done fractals? Nope, cuz they’re 80 only. And they’re getting an update soon so there will be more to love.

WvW. Now that you’ve got your PvE build sussed out, try giving WvW a shot and finding your build for that. And gear…you’re gonna need new gear so that’s something to work toward. And despite the fact that WvW is accessible at level 2, you really aren’t competitive until around 80.

Want to do Orr but it’s dead (pun intended)? Then organize a group. Gather guildies, gather first-timers, gather random Lions Archers and lead your assault on the temples.

And most people find the Personal Story to be a highlight of the game. If you don’t like it you don’t have to play it, but many like it. It’s not always about the rewards, but the journey.

You can’t complain about no end game if you just don’t want to do it. It’s there. That’s like complaining that Papa Johns doesn’t have any topping selection because you only like pepperoni.

Its not that i don’t like what they are offering (Your Papa John’s analogy) I like the PVE a lot. (I am a straight up PVE player.) It’s more of a question of How its all laid out opposed it it being “bad”.

Some of what you said is true. I don’t really care for PVP. (Its not like I’ve never done dungeons) Obviously I haven’t done fractals on this toon because It just hit max level. I have leveled 7 toons to 80 already for the record though. Fractals and dungeons are not my thing. even less so in GW2 with its wonky camera.

You brought up living story. Yes, some of it was amazingly enjoyable. It’s either super fun or super annoying. The first week its a super fun and easy. After the zerg dies out its ridiculously difficult.

GW2 seems to only have 2 dificulty levels. Toddler easy and impossibly difficult. For example the halloween crafting was near impossible to do without purchasing the mats. High level crafting, legendaies, gear chase and map completion fall into this catagory for me too.

Clockwork Bard.3105:

Dante.1508:

There is no End Game….

Spoon boy.8932: Do not try and play the end game. That’s impossible. Instead… only try to realize the truth.

Neo.0001: What truth?

Spoon boy.8932: There is no end game.

Neo.0001: There is no end game?

Spoon boy.8932: Then you’ll see, that it is not the end game that plays, it is only yourself.

Anet Smith1976: Did you know that the first GW2 was designed to be a perfect gaming world? Where none grinded, where everyone would be happy. It was a disaster. The hardcore refused to accept the program. Entire guilds were lost. Some believed we lacked the programming language to describe your perfect MMO world. But I believe that, as a species, MMO players define their reality through suffering and misery. The perfect world was a dream that your primitive cerebrum kept trying to wake up from. Which is why the GW2 world was redesigned to this: the peak of WoW civilization.

Basharic.1654:

Clockwork Bard.3105:

A lot of the GW2 community kind of reminds me of that one kid at Chuck E. Cheese’s.

See, when you go to Chuck E. Cheese’s, you eat pizza and you play games (or I guess you could spend your whole day in the urine-soaked ball pit). Some games give out tickets. Those tickets can be exchanged for little gifts. To complete the experience, it’s nice to at least go home with a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles pencil topper.

But there’s always that one kid who knows the trick. He knows that skee-ball pays out way more tickets than anything else, if you’re good at it. And he’s good at it. So that’s all he plays for 6 hours straight, with only a quick break for pizza. By the end, he’s probably sick of skee-ball. But the tickets! He’s going home with pencil toppers of all four Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles!

There’s a lot more to do in the game when you’re not chasing the tickets.

This right here is dead on. I’ve been playing since beta, and I know I’m in the ball park of 2500 hours played. 2 k of which is on my main. And I still love the hell out of this game.

It retains my interest through living story, WvW, and sPvP, all of which I do depending on my mood. I have all that time in and STILL not even close to significant rank in PvP, nor a dungeon master title. I hate plugging and my guild is both small and often busy irl.

The key is I never do anything that doesn’t really interest me. It creates this positive feedback loop where every time I Iog in I’m entertained or challenged in some way. Which keeps me logging in.

Yet somehow while playing this game in ways the “uber” players would consider stupid and inefficient, I’ve managed to enjoy the hell out of this game to date, AND still have plenty left to do.

My thoughts exactly. Well said.

There was an endgame: playing fotm 70+, but they are taking this away from us.

SHM.7628:

There’s no necessecity for a toon to be 80 to wear max gear. look at GW1. You could buy max gear as soon as you could get to it and afford it. By the time I was doing my alts i could get max gear at very low levels.

To be fair, the stats on gear in GW make up a lot less of your character’s capabilities than it does in most MMO’s, including GW2. Still, I’d have to agree that I found the GW gear method more fun than I find the GW2 method, or the WoW method for that matter.