Guild Wars 2

Ive seen it said in lots of threads lots of time people would willing buy gems and then just buy whatever skins they wanted from BL. Now obviously the gem store is anets plan to make money on a game with no subscription fee so why this random crap with the boxes a few people are happy but as a whole its just pissing people off.

Basically people got tricked with this event expecting reasonable drop rates so they will make some money but how many people who got kittened on the boxes or just heard about how bad the drop rates are are going to buy gems again. If the skins had just been released on Bl people could have just got what they wanted and would still be willing to spend money on future events.

It just seems like such a completely counterproductive way to go about allowing people to get the skins that i honestly cannot think of a good reason it was handled in this fashion this gambling gimmick is just going to backfire when it could have simply been here are the skins here are what they cost simple as that.

I think that any reasonable person who would spend $20 and not get anything would realize that the drop rates are not very high. After that they would stop buying them. If $20 was a horrible loss for them financially they wouldn’t be spending it on a video game anyways. ANet stated that there was only a chance of getting a rare item. The definition of RARE pretty much implies that it won’t be given out like candy. There was zero trickery involved.

samrogan.9132:

I think that any reasonable person who would spend $20 and not get anything would realize that the drop rates are not very high. After that they would stop buying them. If $20 was a horrible loss for them financially they wouldn’t be spending it on a video game anyways. ANet stated that there was only a chance of getting a rare item. The definition of RARE pretty much implies that it won’t be given out like candy. There was zero trickery involved.

Actually, in the original patchnotes, the word “Rare” was never used.

AN could have released the numbers on the drop rate if they’d wanted this to be some pseudo legendary skin scheme to compete with legendaries. The people who figured it would be a reasonable drop rate worked on an assumption, yes. But their choices were to assume AN would be reasonable, or to not participate. I’m more upset that my assumption was wrong.

Honestly though, AN had nothing to lose by making these skins some kind of throwaway trinket everyone could enjoy for a few weeks. Instead they went for something that’s pounding out bits of the economy and selling for 40-70 gold. I’m just not sure why they have to do it that way.

because overwhelming the game with reasons to buy gems crowds out the people who do not really want to buy gems.

If everything was made available through the cash shop, then there would not be a huge demand for gem purchases – people would buy the skin they want, and that would be it.

The black lion chests were never meant to be mass purchased with real money. They were meant to be mass purchased if at all with fake money by people who spend a lot of time farming – and for those people, the chests themselves are a great deal in supplementing their farming abilities. These people will get several skins that they can use not for a profit, but to offset the loss from buying so many keys to keep their stockpile of farming implements in check.

That’s why the prices on the market are reasonable. People who farm can afford to sell skins at reasonable prices because they’re better served by going out in the field rather than haggling over prices, which is why the armor is pretty cheap and most of the weapons are affordable as well. It’s not worth it to them to try to control the market; the inventory space is much more valuable.

A good system would be to warn off people from spending tons of real money on the game at once, and instead provide an incentive for people who have lots of fake money that has zero value in real life to get a small perk that will eventually be diffused to the “I’ll pay a little bit of cash for what I want but that’s it” population that benefits from the spike in gem demand to supplement their gold income and buys one item of their choosing. This system at least accomplishes this task.

@samrogan: This is what I did. Spent $20 on keys, opened chests, was disappointed, put my wallet away. That still doesn’t make me feel any better about the shady business tactics involved here. ANet hyped up the BLC for halloween, but never posted the actual odds of obtaining the items everyone was hoping to get. IMO, this is where they made their biggest mistake. Be honest and upfront with your customers, that’s all.

Bobobejumbo.4951:

@samrogan: This is what I did. Spent $20 on keys, opened chests, was disappointed, put my wallet away. That still doesn’t make me feel any better about the shady business tactics involved here. ANet hyped up the BLC for halloween, but never posted the actual odds of obtaining the items everyone was hoping to get. IMO, this is where they made their biggest mistake. Be honest and upfront with your customers, that’s all.

They’ve never posted the actual odds of getting anything ever – and if they did, words wouldn’t cut it.

People just seriously need to stop asking for handouts, this isn’t easy-land, this is GW2. I spent $20 and I happened to get a sword skin. If I didn’t get it, bummer, I have a $20 GW2 quota for the month.

You people need to stop complaining, they said “rare”… not “free rare item with every $20 invested”

Honestly enough of the whinning already I’m really tired of the " gimmie " attitude and entitlement views of so many of these gamers. Can we get a moderator to bundle all of these into one thread so those who wish to complain can go to thread A and the rest of us can stop having to shift through all these whinning and worthless posts and actually discuss the game.

What’s funny is if you tag these posts where person " x " is complaining about not having the godly gear or items they’re also soon complaining about being bored because there is nothing to do either.

In all seriousness though I know I’m not the only one tired of the negative and whinning posts. Anyone else agree or do you all enjoy the drama here ? I’d rather have some good discussions or debates about things and get back to my gaming instead of shifting through what posts may or may not even be worthy of being here.

Creaky.8596:

People just seriously need to stop asking for handouts, this isn’t easy-land, this is GW2.

Are you trying to imply this game is in any way difficult?

GreyFeathers.8175:

Honestly enough of the whinning already I’m really tired of the " gimmie " attitude and entitlement views of so many of these gamers. Can we get a moderator to bundle all of these into one thread so those who wish to complain can go to thread A and the rest of us can stop having to shift through all these whinning and worthless posts and actually discuss the game.

What’s funny is if you tag these posts where person " x " is complaining about not having the godly gear or items they’re also soon complaining about being bored because there is nothing to do either.

In all seriousness though I know I’m not the only one tired of the negative and whinning posts. Anyone else agree or do you all enjoy the drama here ? I’d rather have some good discussions or debates about things and get back to my gaming instead of shifting through what posts may or may not even be worthy of being here.

Maybe the whining wouldn’t be as irritating, if the niggling voice in the back of your head didn’t keep saying “They’re right… GW2 isn’t the messiah of RPGs you want it to be”.

Eon.5428:

Ive seen it said in lots of threads lots of time people would willing buy gems and then just buy whatever skins they wanted from BL. Now obviously the gem store is anets plan to make money on a game with no subscription fee so why this random crap with the boxes a few people are happy but as a whole its just pissing people off.

Basically people got tricked with this event expecting reasonable drop rates so they will make some money but how many people who got kittened on the boxes or just heard about how bad the drop rates are are going to buy gems again. If the skins had just been released on Bl people could have just got what they wanted and would still be willing to spend money on future events.

It just seems like such a completely counterproductive way to go about allowing people to get the skins that i honestly cannot think of a good reason it was handled in this fashion this gambling gimmick is just going to backfire when it could have simply been here are the skins here are what they cost simple as that.

It wont backfire.
Theyll do it again.
Responsible consumers know how these things work, and if someone didnt, i believe theyve learned their lesson and now have a better understanding of the business world.

Having said that if people would quit kittening and pay attention to whats going on, they might see that the greatsword skin everyone wants has gone down to about 25g (last i looked).

These prices will continue to go down now that there are even more ways to get the skins.

Seriously….these threads.

kaffaljidhma i don’t understand you said if everything was available through cash shop then there wouldn’t be any reason to buy gems arent those two basically the same thing? Also how would having the skin available in cash shop be any different then the way it is now what person who dint buy keys from the cash shop is really going to have more than 2 or 3 keys to open chest anyways.

Now sure spending 20 dollars realizing the chest weren’t worth it and stopping is a good idea but why not just have the skin available to be bough and people can spend 20 or whatever bucks and get what they want then think that was a good deal ill buy skins next event too.

This chest thing was such a bad idea i would bet money that next event they will either drastically increases odds or finding things in chest, allow you to earn skins in game someway that doesn’t involve farming tons of gold or buy skins from cash shop because this chest thing is a great way to insure people dont buy gems.

GreyFeathers.8175:

Honestly enough of the whinning already I’m really tired of the " gimmie " attitude and entitlement views of so many of these gamers. Can we get a moderator to bundle all of these into one thread so those who wish to complain can go to thread A and the rest of us can stop having to shift through all these whinning and worthless posts and actually discuss the game.

What’s funny is if you tag these posts where person " x " is complaining about not having the godly gear or items they’re also soon complaining about being bored because there is nothing to do either.

In all seriousness though I know I’m not the only one tired of the negative and whinning posts. Anyone else agree or do you all enjoy the drama here ? I’d rather have some good discussions or debates about things and get back to my gaming instead of shifting through what posts may or may not even be worthy of being here.

And your whining about people whining, which is worse. No one is forcing you to read these threads. Even better, no one is forcing you to comment in them either. Customer’s are not satisfied, and are expressing their dissatisfactions. It’s up to ANet to determine whether they are being unreasonable or not. If you do not feel the same as them, good for you, move along, as it has nothing to do with you.

The people they are pushing away aren’t the ones who they are particularly worried about. They have a different target with the gambling… *cough*whales*/cough*

GreyFeathers.8175:

Honestly enough of the whinning already I’m really tired of the " gimmie " attitude and entitlement views of so many of these gamers. Can we get a moderator to bundle all of these into one thread so those who wish to complain can go to thread A and the rest of us can stop having to shift through all these whinning and worthless posts and actually discuss the game.

What’s funny is if you tag these posts where person " x " is complaining about not having the godly gear or items they’re also soon complaining about being bored because there is nothing to do either.

In all seriousness though I know I’m not the only one tired of the negative and whinning posts. Anyone else agree or do you all enjoy the drama here ? I’d rather have some good discussions or debates about things and get back to my gaming instead of shifting through what posts may or may not even be worthy of being here.

In what way did i ever say i just want the skins given away? Letting people purchase skins from cash shop is them earning their right to the skin by paying for it also not everyone has the gold to buy them that way.

SanguiniusChan.6032:

Maybe the whining wouldn’t be as irritating, if the niggling voice in the back of your head didn’t keep saying “They’re right… GW2 isn’t the messiah of RPGs you want it to be”.

For the record my niggling voice is actually saying "Sam, you need to get off of guild wars, you have real life things to do, I know it amazing but you have a job.

Honestly people , lesson learned DONT GIVE THEM MONEY.

Thats is it , that is the “voice” they listen to. When the wallets talk , they make silence and listen.

Hopefully , if enough of us teach them anything , christmas will be a better time.

Eon.5428:

Basically people got tricked with this event expecting reasonable drop rates so they will make some money but how many people who got kittened on the boxes or just heard about how bad the drop rates are are going to buy gems again. If the skins had just been released on Bl people could have just got what they wanted and would still be willing to spend money on future events.

At least some people understand and aren’t just following the leader/fanboying.

Today I forgot I paid £50 for the game because it feels more like a f2p game than actual f2p games themselves. There’s no need to have this feeling a lot are getting from this method of ArenaNet trying to get money. I played LOTR Online a lot and never had the feeling of “Give us your money so we can make profit” – and that is f2p for those who don’t know. Generating points to spend via doing achievement style goals made me want – yes I said want – to buy Turbine points, I purchased inventory slots, the new class, cosmetic items, and after all that I felt good about the game and still do. This ‘lottery’ stuff in GW2 is literally the mirror opposite.

Eon.5428:

kaffaljidhma i don’t understand you said if everything was available through cash shop then there wouldn’t be any reason to buy gems arent those two basically the same thing? Also how would having the skin available in cash shop be any different then the way it is now what person who dint buy keys from the cash shop is really going to have more than 2 or 3 keys to open chest anyways.

Now sure spending 20 dollars realizing the chest weren’t worth it and stopping is a good idea but why not just have the skin available to be bough and people can spend 20 or whatever bucks and get what they want then think that was a good deal ill buy skins next event too.

This chest thing was such a bad idea i would bet money that next event they will either drastically increases odds or finding things in chest, allow you to earn skins in game someway that doesn’t involve farming tons of gold or buy skins from cash shop because this chest thing is a great way to insure people dont buy gems.

It is terribly easy to afford any one thing in the cash shop using in game gold, which you can earn at an extraordinary rate once you know what you’re doing.

It is best for the microtransaction model if there was some sink enticement for people who have accumulated vast amounts of in game wealth (which earns the company nothing) to re-invest in the gem store. Especially rare items coupled with farming utilities (useless to casual players who want gold fast instead of earning it game) accomplishes this.

It would be best if casuals who don’t play this game reguarly just waited for the people with tons of gold to start buying keys en masse with fake money that didn’t drain their actual real bank accounts by one cent, and then when the gem price is inflated, cash in with a reasonable amount of money to get a whole lot of game gold at once. With that newfound, unearned (in the game at least) wealth, they could pick whatever item they wanted without having to rely on the RNG at all, and the game rich/real world poor could supplement their income a bit without having to spike the consumer.

That’s how the system should work, otherwise the farmers would ignore the events (because wasted game time is wasted gold income) and the only profit would be from casuals who actually want the skin – which is not everyone.

The skin could look wicked cool and this could work, but if the skin just looks decent, the absence of rarity to inflate its value makes it a bad investment in company resources.

TL;DR:

People with lots of gold buy gems for keys and face the RNG

They drive up prices of gems

People with no gold and some cash don’t touch the RNG or just dabble a little, then buy gems as a shortcut to gold

They buy the items they want off the gold rich people, who recoup their losses

Nobody becomes uber rich or uber poor, the economy is stable, and Arena Net gets a load of money.

This is how it should work and is how it will work once everyone gets the hang of it.

Maxxian.3980:

Are you trying to imply this game is in any way difficult?

Nope, I am simply implying that people are asking for everything to be handed to them like that ‘one other game that just recently came out from the competition’. WoW is So easy that people are quitting because the handouts have made the game no longer rewarding.

I prefer the current design of difficulty and rewards.

Creaky.8596:

Maxxian.3980:

Are you trying to imply this game is in any way difficult?

Nope, I am simply implying that people are asking for everything to be handed to them like that ‘one other game that just recently came out from the competition’. WoW is So easy that people are quitting because the handouts have made the game no longer rewarding.

I prefer the current design of difficulty and rewards.

Thats just it though i dont think people mind paying for what they want(in a none lottery way) or earning it but there is no way to earn these skins other than dumping money on keys and hoping to get lucky or having lots of gold in game.

UGH quoting is not working again…fine.

@Creaky
Thanks for the clarification, I hope i didn’t come across as trollish but I know there are people out there that think this game is difficult and it makes me nervous from a gamer’s standpoint…like you said…look at WoW.

Anyways now that we have that sorted out…I think the whole concept of these chests are beyond pointless. As a matter of fact I would argue they are counterproductive in the GW2 community. If ANet came out and said “$10 and you get whatever Halloween skin you want” this whole conversation would never have happened and everyone would be happy. Instead we have numerous forum posts showing disdain towards ANet.

I will note though that it was clearly marked that there was only a “chance” to get one of the skins so it was definitely a gamble. Which brings me to my next point…why is there gambling in an MMO? Now yes we don’t have slot machines out in Lion’s Arch but I find it in poor taste that people can spend RL money on something…and get nothing…in a video game. Again yes it was the persons choice to engage in the activity but why the Kitten Kitten was it implemented this way?

TL:DR Should have made the skins a direct purchase ANet!

you don’t get nothing; you get whatever was in the black lion chests before the event. It’s not like you need 2 keys to open a chest now.

kaffaljidhma.1496:

you don’t get nothing; you get whatever was in the black lion chests before the event. It’s not like you need 2 keys to open a chest now.

And the contents IMO do not justify the cost. It is way cheaper to just buy the boosters you want.

That’s not true. Most boosters cost more gems than 1 key, which also gives you a service, unless you’re buying karma boosters, which you will need less now that we have liquid karma. Due to magic find, all the rest are interchangeable: put on the buffs and magic find, or put on the magic find booster and your best gear.

Gah the Quote/Edit buttons do not work again…

Clarification…the main reason I found the whole putting skins into the BLC is because prior to this event I had never heard of anyone buying keys. I just found it a cheap gimmick to get people to buy keys to buy chests to get nothing more than they would have prior to the event.

Make sense?

I opened 100 chests fully aware it was a gamble, but gambled anyway.
Got loads of black lion tools, which I’ll use, loads of boosters and 8 black lion salvage kits, which are 300 gems each, so I’m happy with that return even if i didn’t get any halloween stuff.

What I am upset about, but I’m fully aware its my fault, is I destroyed the 300 tonics, 8 hours before the mad king chest announcement, because I just saw them as unnecessary bank slot fillers.

Oh and I got the greatsword skin, which I sold for 40g

I think halloween has been brilliant, whatever distracts the QQ ers from making precursor threads

I’ll start stacking gems for christmas now

I know people who run around with 180% magic find as a result of opening black lion chests, and they’re really close to buying their first legendary despite not ever having done any gem to gold conversion (except for 2 nights ago). So I dunno.

kaffaljidhma.1496:

That’s not true. Most boosters cost more gems than 1 key, which also gives you a service, unless you’re buying karma boosters, which you will need less now that we have liquid karma. Due to magic find, all the rest are interchangeable: put on the buffs and magic find, or put on the magic find booster and your best gear.

Ha working again.

3 out of the 6 boosters cost 25 gems more than a key. However you take out the random element so it by far cheaper to just directly buy they booster you want. Especially since there are more than 6 types of boosters that come out of the BLC.

Anyways we are derailing this forum so lets agree to disagree

Well it’s important to realize the utility of boosters for your own sake if you’re struggling for game income. For some people, any booster will do, and the services part helps alleviate the cost of doing lucrative things (transmuting, mining, salvaging, fighting bosses that kill you or damage your armor, filling your inventory) so if you’re flexible and just want some boost help, the chests are not a bad idea. If you can only do it one way and you only need one type of booster or service, then don’t buy the chest, but I know plenty of people where this is not the case.

kaffaljidhma.1496:

Well it’s important to realize the utility of boosters for your own sake if you’re struggling for game income. For some people, any booster will do, and the services part helps alleviate the cost of doing lucrative things (transmuting, mining, salvaging, fighting bosses that kill you or damage your armor, filling your inventory) so if you’re flexible and just want some boost help, the chests are not a bad idea. If you can only do it one way and you only need one type of booster or service, then don’t buy the chest, but I know plenty of people where this is not the case.

Fair enough. Respect