Guild Wars 2

Black Flag stomps forum bug dead.

my issue with HoT is if i have NPCs in an area/story instance and they just stand there in the corner what is the point in having them beyond look a meat shield that does nothing. i had 2x instances of an NPC during a fight sitting in the corner of the room twiddling his thumbs while i am getting targeted by the boss or whatever was in the part of the story. i do not mind a challenge but when i have to deal with things not working i am reminded of how i felt with skyrim dragonborn dlc and how a fight got looped cause the stupid thing i was fighting decided it would stand in middle and not do anything but sit in invincible mist state, which just makes me mad cause i work so hard to get to a point and i get stopped by something stupid.

mean only thing i want is them to remove the stupid insta reset things cause that is bull to begin with. cause i can’t even use a revive orb or nothing cause i get downed and then 1 shot again after i am downed.

Honestly, the biggest issue besides the awesome that is Raptor Packs is Mordrem Snipers and other Stealthers/repositioner mobs.

Mordrem Sniper issue isn’t bad at the minion level but when you encounter a scaled up Champion version, it starts to almost one-shot people. In a massive battle, this happens frequently because you can’t keep your eyes on all things (there is no tell from the guy next to you that is being targeted and you are between the stealthed Mordrem and the intended target thanks to piercing). If they had AoE ground effects instead, it wouldn’t be much of an issue (see Mordrem Guard Punisher).

There are plenty of other stealth mobs that reposition but there are few ways to counter it in most player builds besides a well timed dodge after counting that mob went into stealth.

That all being said, leave it as is and see if players adapt.

To react on those who say you cannot run past them. I ran through all four maps and haven’t died once because of running. The only time I died was because I fell on the ground and you weren’t allowed there. And one time because I stopped to revive someone, I then died and the person I revived ran away (Thanks mate).

It is true that sometimes you have to pause, or prepare a bit to run through something, get some stab, stealth or Condi cleanse ready.

But you people are making it sound way worse then it is, in the old maps you can press R (Auto-run) and occasionally correct your direction while watching TV. There were a handful of spots where I still could die but mostly there was no danger.

The only thing that I will admit to is that sometimes the amount of damage seem a bit over-tuned. In my opinion it would be better to be able to take two or three more hits before you die. Keep the mechanics though. keep in mind I am saying this while still in full berserker gear. And I have seen builds that have already adapted that generate a lot more toughness while only losing 300-400 power.

Navigating will also get a lot easier once you progress.

I don’t think ArenaNet overreacted. I think their reaction was reasonable. There’s always room for improvement in execution, but I like the direction they’re headed. This game desperately needed more challenging PvE content. No one gets it perfect the first time.

thing is as always with these kinds of issues: Is it really a problem for average players (or whatever “the more casual” signifies) or is it a problem of really bad players who think of themselves as average?

Stasticeel.2745:

The only thing that I will admit to is that sometimes the amount of damage seem a bit over-tuned. In my opinion it would be better to be able to take two or three more hits before you die. Keep the mechanics though. keep in mind I am saying this while still in full berserker gear. And I have seen builds that have already adapted that generate a lot more toughness while only losing 300-400 power.

I like the damage output because it forces people to really consider using something other than berserker gear. I’ve been running in almost full berserker gear so far, and I’ve paid the price. I’m glad that I now have a legitimate reason to run something other than berserker, besides doing something “different”. The only reason I’m not running another stat set yet is because I haven’t decided which stat set to use.

Guys please stop derailing the topic…
This is not a topic about whether you like the content or not or whether you are a pro or a noob.

It doesn’t matter how bad a player is, if he won’t buy the expansion or any of the future expansions then that’s an opportunity lost for ANet.

The point of this whole topic is that an expansion should have a balance in order to catter for all kind of players to maximize profits and population, and HoT currently doesn’t. And this impacts all of us on the long run.
At least that’s my opinion.

The new content hasn’t been out long enough for me to determine whether it was made too difficult or if I need to adjust to the increased level of challenge. Could be either, and even then what is too easy/hard for me is different for someone else.

Here’s what’s interesting: every last aspect of the expansion is more difficult – the map, mob density, the things that teleport right on top of you and kill, the mobs with that have aoe poisons or adds, the near one shot snipers, and so on. When it shakes out I wonder if “average GW2 player” (“average” as in demographic, not skill) will learn to enjoy it or reject it completely. I don’t see there being a lot of middle ground.

Edit: the filter thinks the synonym for “determine” that starts with “as” is a bad word.

Voluptus.3509:

Vocal minority who want it harder???

Totally untrue. And here’s why:

People are far, far more likely to post when they’re frustrated or angry than if they’re bored or feeling lackluster.

- For each person who posts screaming that things are too hard there are only ten more who don’t make the effort to post.

- But for each person who posts asking for things to be more complex and challenging there are hundreds who just shrugged their shoulders and wandered off to do something else because they were bored.

- For every complaint you hear about there are ten more you don’t.
- For every customer who says your performance was “good” there are a thousand more who don’t say it.
- For every person who takes the time to tell you you’re doing great there are about fifty more who are silent, but hopefully will tip!

I’d say 99 of 100 people who want more content that requires people to work together do NOT say anything. They just get bored with running around solo and turn the game off.

About half of the people who think things are too hard come to the forums and complain.

you basically just made up a scenario with no actual logic or data to support it.

VaLee.5102:

HoT will not always be end content.

Content should be doable even with only a handful of people on a map.

I agree with the OP I have booked the week off to play HOT, and I am disappointed. it in fact makes me even more angry at how much they are asking for this add on!!! There is a lot wrong with it right now, But its early days yet. There are some areas such as the guild over halls that NEED to be made Easier OR give us a blooming tutorial! the way its all been rushed and mishmashes is very off putting!

Then there’s the new maps. Dear Gods I can only do those for an hour or so before I get so blooming fed up with them I have to find something else to do! there are FAR to many events going off ALL AT ONCE and no where near enough map population to cover them all! ( I am talking a map that is full here)

Don’t even get me started on the bugged out mystery point, with failing to show up on the map at times or when you do find them they FAIL to give you the point!

They have Changed to much to fast and half of the stuff your seeing in hot now was NOT even on the Beta’s for testing!

Im a filthy Casual and a directionally challenged one at that ( so vertical maps full of dead ends is hell for me) – I haven’t set foot in the Jungle yet because the horror stories of the first couple of days just put me off. Megaserver issues doesn’t help…

I don’t want to die a.l.l.t.h.e.t.i.m.e

I going to give it a go tomorrow though – can anyone suggest bests stats for beefing myself up? Im taking in an Engineer and Ele was thinking of swapping out to defensive stats in a couple of armor pieces and rings etc – Knights for engineer?

Why do people assume that casual players suck at this game? Is casual suddenly a codeword for "bad: or “braindead”?

Here’s a little schooling for you: A casual player is simply someone who plays less than others, and enjoys smaller pieces of content rather than walking in with a completionist attitude.

A casual player is completely capable of everything any other player can do in the open world. It just means they have less time to do so.

Quite the contrary, because a casual player chews smaller pieces of content at a time, the stronger enemies give casual players a sense of adventure, and unlocking an uncontested waypoint would feel like a big accomplishment to them. It actually works in their favor, because it makes the game feel like a journey, rather than a stroll.

Also, please stop trying to ruin my expansion with bad feedback. I don’t want the devs to get confused and kill the thrilling experience of traveling through the new zones.

Kain Francois.4328:

Is casual suddenly a codeword for "bad: or “braindead”?

People often seem to use it that way, but that’s just because they don’t understand what casual actually means. It says more about them than it does about the casual player.

DoctorDing.5890:

I was slightly alarmed to see the recent ANet HP announcement say that they are very happy with the difficulty level of HoT. I can’t help but think they have lost touch with their core audience. I’ve recently left another game where the devs listened to the vocal minority who said they wanted it harder. It stopped being fun for me, and for others, so that game now has fewer players and might struggle to survive.

Casual players are the bread and butter of these games which means providing a huge quantity of relatively easy content. I don’t think the expansion can be a commercial success if it only targets hardcore players so, yes, I think it will get nerfed sooner or later. Open world stuff should not be a struggle for normal players with average kit. But it’s hard to ask those players what they want because most of them will never come to the forum.

Those HoT maps are big. There is plenty of room to accommodate players of all skill levels. Maybe Anet need to learn from GW1 and have a hard mode version of each map for those who are “in it to win it” rather than ramping up the difficulty in the normal maps.

Put simply: some players don’t play for the challenge.

you have the ENTIRE core game for casual play…. the game lacked any serious PvE, sure, fractals, and dungeons, but fractals just ended up being more hp more damage… with HoT we finally have hardcore pve content with mechanics that make it challenging, and you complain? end game is supposed to be challenging, 1-80 you learn your class, 80+ you learn the fights

Xbon.9086:

you have the ENTIRE core game for casual play….

This makes zero sense. Players of both persuasions are buying the expansion and looking to keep progressing. Therefore, there should be new content for both of them.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Xbon.9086:

you have the ENTIRE core game for casual play….

This makes zero sense. Players of both persuasions are buying the expansion and looking to keep progressing. Therefore, there should be new content for both of them.

anet didnt realize one of the main reasons expansions add new races/starter level experiences.
That said, anet has serious problems creating content for their current races/fanbase, the best they can do is reskin races, which…. might not be a bad idea if executed well.

What it all comes back to, is content creation quality and quantity. Based on the last few years, i dont think you can expect a lot of content

Voluptus.3509:

Vocal minority who want it harder???

Totally untrue. And here’s why:

People are far, far more likely to post when they’re frustrated or angry than if they’re bored or feeling lackluster.

- For each person who posts screaming that things are too hard there are only ten more who don’t make the effort to post.

- But for each person who posts asking for things to be more complex and challenging there are hundreds who just shrugged their shoulders and wandered off to do something else because they were bored.

- For every complaint you hear about there are ten more you don’t.
- For every customer who says your performance was “good” there are a thousand more who don’t say it.
- For every person who takes the time to tell you you’re doing great there are about fifty more who are silent, but hopefully will tip!

I’d say 99 of 100 people who want more content that requires people to work together do NOT say anything. They just get bored with running around solo and turn the game off.

About half of the people who think things are too hard come to the forums and complain.

Besides the obvious “out of thin air”, can you tell me how you arrived at this hypothesis? What sort of hard data do you base it on? What sort of actual percentages of the player base, and other crucial numerical factors makes you arrive at your “truth”?

If it is just your opinion, as I assume it is….that’s fine. But don’t state it like it is some sort of obvious fact that was arrived at by looking at hard numbers and stats.

Stating your opinion like that doesn’t change the fact that it is still, JUST your opinion.

Carry on.

I have yet to actually meet anyone outside this forum thread actually complaining about difficulty.

Come on, I’ve been doing Hero Point trains with people who have only 1,600 AP, and it’s been a blast!

Also, VaLee.5102 has 5,200 Achievement Points. I don’t think they can speak for the casual player.

Most people here that are enjoying the content are seeing the problems with it. The maps are hard. If you like that level of difficulty then fine, but but there is no challenge save for those that care about combat. They added moves that can tear you apart in seconds. Most enemies have high DPS/instakill and high HP. There is a reason why they gave up on dungeons. They’ve basically turned all of the HoT into meta-event open world dungeons. You can’t even earn Hero points without at least 5 people. So if it’s built like a dungeon and is based on groups like dungeons, they why not make them dungeons? It’s like they don’t understand their own game or market.

None of these comments being made are unique to the forums. But there is one fact that I am sure of, Anet will never make an expansion like this again.

IndigoSundown.5419:

While I’m all for harder fights, I think the OP has a point. Unfortunately, all we can do is spitball how “many” are in each camp. ANet will have a better idea. However, it’s going to take time for this to shake out. The true test will be what the maps are like once the initial exploration push is done with and most of the players are only bothering to farm the meta events for shinies.

Flesh may be on to something, though. It’s a compromise, but unlike many, it does leave those who like challenge with interesting fights. If they want more mobs at once, they can always gather ’em up.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

They might be able to satisfy both sides by decreasing trash mob density (some areas have large numbers of strong mobs, just standing there) rather than decreasing difficulty. Allow for people to more easily run to get to where they want but keep the fights at the current level for when they do fight.

I have yet to find a single area that is over run with to many trash mobs(not even the location in Auric with all the Pocket Reapers) that I can’t just run past…and I do mean no where. I’m also one of the people that loved Cursed Shore upon release, and find it utterly boring to run through now…really, I’m right in an Elder Dragons back yard and I can literally run from end to end without dying not even once? I can already run through the entire Verdant Brink zone without getting downed, and that’s on my Ranger with only Exotic gear. As for stating that we weren’t told all of HoT would be challenging…I beg to differ. There were numerous times when people asked about thee challenging group content and something was shown and it was explained that what ever they showed was not the challenging group content everyone was waiting for…which if you comprehended those statements properly it meant that all content was challenging to a degree…and I consider myself a casual player(not in time spent, the true definition of casual).

Xbon.9086:

you have the ENTIRE core game for casual play….

So casual players shouldn’t buy HOT? Yes I’m sure anet would just love that given how badly Wildstar tanked by catering too much to the 1%ers.

Rococo.8347:

Im a filthy Casual and a directionally challenged one at that ( so vertical maps full of dead ends is hell for me) – I haven’t set foot in the Jungle yet because the horror stories of the first couple of days just put me off. Megaserver issues doesn’t help…

I don’t want to die a.l.l.t.h.e.t.i.m.e

I going to give it a go tomorrow though – can anyone suggest bests stats for beefing myself up? Im taking in an Engineer and Ele was thinking of swapping out to defensive stats in a couple of armor pieces and rings etc – Knights for engineer?

What are the stats you use now? If you use a Power build Knights could work or even Soldiers if you want even more defense. With a condi build you could go Rabid or Dire. I did not change my build on my Ranger and that build isn’t tanky. Having a pet helped somewhat. I always try content first on my normal build and only change it if I die too much.

Exploring in the first map is much easier at day time. And if you stay at a (busy) outpost at night time you probably survive without too many problems. Some outposts are really close to a WP so if you die you can get back easily. Some areas in the second map have a high concentration of mobs, I try to sneak by the mobs there or find another path.

I would definitely give it a try as the maps are gorgeous. At least what I have seen from the first two maps. Particularly in the second map I had some moments that I just said in my chair looking at the beauty of the view (hint: view on city).

IndigoSundown.5419:

The true test will be what the maps are like once the initial exploration push is done with and most of the players are only bothering to farm the meta events for shinies.

I wonder what will ArenaNet do then. Will they try to improve the maps, or will they nerf everything else so HoT becomes the “less bad” option where to play in?

I’m worried they’ll do nothing once the initial masses completing their maps move on and alts and new players simply won’t be able to complete their jungle maps at all.

There’s no question that the new maps are more difficult than the old maps. But that was what people said about Southsun, Dry Top, Silverwastes, and even Orr (when they first got there). Later, the community (overall) figured out how to survive and then thrive with the new maps/content. This typically takes weeks or even months, since it takes us a while to realize our original builds + playstyles aren’t suited for the new content and some more time to adapt.

tl;dr it’s too soon to state whether the game is “too hard” or “just right” or “too easy” now.

Celtic Lady.3729:

I’m worried they’ll do nothing once the initial masses completing their maps move on and alts and new players simply won’t be able to complete their jungle maps at all.

They will do something when that happens, I say when cause its a stone cold certainty it will happen, the maps are really difficult to get around for farming purposes.

I honestly don’t believe that open world in HoT is too hard for anyone outside of those who have physical or mental problems that prevent them from playing Twitch games to begin with (and this game shouldn’t be balanced around them). “Casual” players shouldn’t have any trouble with this content beyond time-gated stuff and Arena-net has already reversed positions on the biggest time gate in the expansion – elite specializations.

Casual does not mean bad players though many bad players in this game seem to defend themselves by wrapping themselves in the cloak of “causal”. Yes the majority of any game’s population are casuals… no casuals aren’t players who don’t like difficult or can’t handle difficult content. Casual is just a style of play primarily characterized by a lack of time commitment.

Most of the mobs are trash unless the map has a lot of people in it… the verticality is probably what causes the “empty map feeling” for those who seem to complain a lot about all mobs having gold or bronze nameplates. I can go through the same area several times in one day and each time the mobs are a different level. Verdant Brink seems to be the most difficult map (not including meta events).

I don’t see a problem with difficulty of the map as a whole. If you die, you can just waypoint and start over and perhaps think of some way to run around or get a few friends to play with you. After all you are walking around in a lv80 zone, the difficulty should be higher than other areas. I do think event rewards should be more than just some exp and copper or else no one will feel properly motivated to actually stick around in the new maps after their masteries are done.

My objection is more geared toward the poor coding and planning for the launch of this expansion. Anet had over half a year to prep for the launch of HoT, not to mention the closed beta events and weekends they had to test their server and codes. Yet on launch what is happening? Server crash everyday because their server is not dealing with with the sudden influx of players. New living story having bugs and problems all over. New fractal merchant getting disabled with no warning and we can’t even buy the new AR stuff to advance in fractal. Not to mention the new builds plaguing us 2-3 times per day forcing players to relog and cutting off our enjoyment AND still not fixing the server problem. Seriously Anet ‘WHY ARE YOU SO UNPREPARED?’

This is unprecedented poor service by a gaming company that hosts a pay to play. If I knew HoT launch was going to be such a disaster i would have held off pre-purchasing and saved myself 4 days of hassle trying and failing to enjoy HoT.

morrolan.9608:

Xbon.9086:

you have the ENTIRE core game for casual play….

So casual players shouldn’t buy HOT? Yes I’m sure anet would just love that given how badly Wildstar tanked by catering too much to the 1%ers.

What’s your vision of expansion content that happens AT the end game to progress more? If it says the same as the rest of the game, what the hell is the point of the expansion? Everything you do leads up to the expansion, and the expansion is where your skills are tried and tested to the maximum of their capacity.

I’m fine with enemy numbers and damage being reduced but I don’t like how Anet are trivialising Hero challenges. I was looking forward to doing a rather tough hero challenge again this evening only to find out it had been down graded from a Champion to a Veteran. I then went to another Hero challenge expecting a fun fight only to find that the Champion mob had been removed entirely! I was really disappointed. Devalued the whole experience by requiring minimal to no reason for me to implement any acquired skill or previous learning. Also meant one less thing to need to do with other players…in an MMO.

Xbon.9086:

morrolan.9608:

Xbon.9086:

you have the ENTIRE core game for casual play….

So casual players shouldn’t buy HOT? Yes I’m sure anet would just love that given how badly Wildstar tanked by catering too much to the 1%ers.

What’s your vision of expansion content that happens AT the end game to progress more? If it says the same as the rest of the game, what the hell is the point of the expansion? Everything you do leads up to the expansion, and the expansion is where your skills are tried and tested to the maximum of their capacity.

Thats end/elder game content. An xpac isn’t end game its further progression. In a normal mmo an xpac will have additional levels. End game is stuff like world bosses, raids, high end fractals, PvP, high level WvW. Endgame content can be added to with an xpac but the xpac itself isn’t end game content.

morrolan.9608:

Xbon.9086:

morrolan.9608:

Xbon.9086:

you have the ENTIRE core game for casual play….

So casual players shouldn’t buy HOT? Yes I’m sure anet would just love that given how badly Wildstar tanked by catering too much to the 1%ers.

What’s your vision of expansion content that happens AT the end game to progress more? If it says the same as the rest of the game, what the hell is the point of the expansion? Everything you do leads up to the expansion, and the expansion is where your skills are tried and tested to the maximum of their capacity.

Thats end/elder game content. An xpac isn’t end game its further progression. In a normal mmo an xpac will have additional levels. End game is stuff like world bosses, raids, high end fractals, PvP, high level WvW. Endgame content can be added to with an xpac but the xpac itself isn’t end game content.

You have to be level 80 to access the new areas and it’s assumed you completed the first story arc.

This is endgame content.

It only feels unreasonably hard because you people didn’t bother to learn the game mechanics on your way here.

It’s like you guys played a jrpg and just ran from every fight and then complain the non-optional boss is too hard because you never got the experience on the way there.

Substance E.4852:

It only feels unreasonably hard because you people didn’t bother to learn the game mechanics on your way here.

you just ran from every fight

This is a completely illogical assumption on your part.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Substance E.4852:

It only feels unreasonably hard because you people didn’t bother to learn the game mechanics on your way here.

you just ran from every fight

This is a completely illogical assumption on your part.

When did I say anyone here ran from a fight in GW2? I used running from a random encounter in a jrpg as an analogy for taking the easiest route to advance that ultimately hurts you because it leaves one unprepared.

Please don’t try to take quotes out of context, it just makes you look bad.

Substance E.4852:

It only feels unreasonably hard because you people didn’t bother to learn the game mechanics on your way here.

This is a completely illogical assumption on your part.

(Same difference.)

Celtic Lady.3729:

Substance E.4852:

It only feels unreasonably hard because you people didn’t bother to learn the game mechanics on your way here.

This is a completely illogical assumption on your part.

(Same difference.)

I don’t think logic means what you think it means.

Either you know the game’s mechanics and can get through the content or you don’t and can’t.

Want to know the secret to how I know this? Because plenty of people have not only gotten through the content, but also didn’t find it so unreasonable as to complain about it.

Meanwhile, I’m sitting here watching people get steamrolled flat by Arrowheads like Wile E Coyote because they aren’t even dodging the obvious “do not get hit by this!” barrel roll attack while meleeing.

VaLee.5102:

To begin with, this is not a discussion about masteries or hero points, but the expansion as a whole.

We all know there was a large group of people who were asking for challenging content in GW2, and I was one of them. But I think the way they implemented in HoT was something like “They want hard content? We will give them hard content! YOLO!”.

You don’t make a whole expansion cattered just for the a certain group of people, there needs to be a balance. There were other MMOs that went full hardcore and we all know how they ended.
Now you got the situation where the more casual of the players (which are quite a lot) are uttermost frustrated and are not enjoying the content.

They could’ve left the meta events in the maps and raids as challeging content, while leaving the general maps accessible for those who are just interested in exploring, gathering, doing little events, etc. That way you would please both groups of players.
Adventures are a good example of content done right, you have the Bronze tier pretty much accessible to anyone, while the Gold tiers will probably be done by those who want a challenge.

I don’t think any of the hardcore players really enjoy random packs of elite mobs placed everywhere for no reason either.
The new maps feel like Orr on release, with more leaves. And we all know how Orr ended up, even now after the nerf, the only people who go there are the ones doing the Cursed Shore train and the ones going for map completion.

And please think about this in general, do not mindlessy reply, do you think releasing an expansion designed to a single target audience is good for the game in the long run?
Do you think the casual players will quit the expansion maps after the hype is gone? And if yes, how will that affect the game in those areas?

Keep in mind that a lot of the casual players cannot afford to improve, they have limited gameplay time, real life responsabilities, etc and they just want to relax a couple of hours a week for example.

this expansion don’t throw any unfair difficulty,you die because either you don’t know CC, or dodge or moving and positioning you have to learn what ever happens and within one month your hands will adapt so please cut the crap.

you die cz of your own shorcomings.

morrolan.9608:

Xbon.9086:

morrolan.9608:

Xbon.9086:

you have the ENTIRE core game for casual play….

So casual players shouldn’t buy HOT? Yes I’m sure anet would just love that given how badly Wildstar tanked by catering too much to the 1%ers.

What’s your vision of expansion content that happens AT the end game to progress more? If it says the same as the rest of the game, what the hell is the point of the expansion? Everything you do leads up to the expansion, and the expansion is where your skills are tried and tested to the maximum of their capacity.

Thats end/elder game content. An xpac isn’t end game its further progression. In a normal mmo an xpac will have additional levels. End game is stuff like world bosses, raids, high end fractals, PvP, high level WvW. Endgame content can be added to with an xpac but the xpac itself isn’t end game content.

And if level was increased, gear that cost hundreds of dollars is invalidated, they took the right route by making it end game hard PvE content for hardcore playerbase to USE that gear that cost hundreds of $.

Substance E.4852:

morrolan.9608:

Thats end/elder game content. An xpac isn’t end game its further progression. In a normal mmo an xpac will have additional levels. End game is stuff like world bosses, raids, high end fractals, PvP, high level WvW. Endgame content can be added to with an xpac but the xpac itself isn’t end game content.

You have to be level 80 to access the new areas and it’s assumed you completed the first story arc.

This is endgame content.

Nope GW2 is different from most themepark mmos in that since the introduction of ascended gear the progression has been horizontal. There are horizontal progression systems in HOT but they are still progression systems taking the place of actual character levels. It is analogous to other mmo xpacs which provide extra levels. For reasons that Xbon above has stated adding levels to GW2 is virtually impossible now.

It only feels unreasonably hard because you people didn’t bother to learn the game mechanics on your way here.

It’s like you guys played a jrpg and just ran from every fight and then complain the non-optional boss is too hard because you never got the experience on the way there.

This is just a knee jerk ad hominem response, I can do HOT just fine in my original specs. The original criticism of the elite spec acquisition was that it was a tedious grind, and that it was about ‘preparing to have fun’ rather than actually having fun with the new content.

Where are these numbers coming from? People say minority, majority, average? Where, list your sources? Less then 10% of the players of Gw2 use this forum, and less then 6% of those 10% actually reply and post. (Gasp! Where are my sources! I don’t have one, I just spoke to a few people and they gave me this number) HoT is an expansion, its made to be hard! Because that’s what people wanted! Its like a dungeon, You go into Arah…Path 3. By yourself, unless you know what your doing…Guess what you will die! Same thing with HoT, you can travel the HoT by yourself, you will die! Several, several times! But you know what? You get back up, ask yourself how it happened, and change your tactics. Casual content, no you want to be spoon fed. My Grand Father plays this game, He has arthritis, he has dementia, but playing this game helps him focus, and he spends time with his grand children. He plays maybe two or three hour a week. He is Casual, and when ever one of the Kids in this game complains about it being to hard. He laughs! Because if he can do it! Then why cant you!? People say that the casuals are the bread and butter? Show me your source? Show me your statistic? Casuals come and go like the summer wheat, Hard core players stay till thing dies!

People to this day! Will not, and or are afraid to go to Arah! Because they claim its to hard….Really? No! I’m sorry, Arah is easy to do, all you have to do is learn the mechanics, learn the enemies! And BAM! You win, the same thing applies to this game. Learn the mechanics, learn the monsters, and learn what works best. If your running through the game, with ONE weapon set, and expect to face roll through. Thats YOUR fault! Not Anets!

I haven’t been happy with the expansion. I was ok with the 400 HP requirement. However just getting around the first zone is not fun whatsoever. If I’m playing a game and not having fun, then that is when I quit playing.

This is the first expansion of any game I’ve ever purchased where (not even a week out) I’ve had no desire to log in and do the content that was released. That’s not a good sign at all. Yesterday I did Halloween stuff and had more fun in the labyrinth than I’ve had in HoT.

VaLee.5102:

Keep in mind that a lot of the casual players cannot afford to improve, they have limited gameplay time, real life responsabilities, etc and they just want to relax a couple of hours a week for example.

I have real life responsibilities and limited gameplay time, I’m sort of casual player. But I want difficult and challenging content. I hate those whiners who says HoT is too difficult for them. I’m disappointed by the ANet decision to nerf HoT because now i will never feel that difficulty on my own. Sorry for my english, it’s not my native language.

So after 6 days you are able to conclude that the content is too hard? All the mobs are new and you need to get to know their moves and patterns. A lot of people seem discouraged when you can’t beat something in first try. Teq was hard to begin with and so was SW bosses but now they are almost never failed at. Don’t bring up this whiney bs so early. Furthermore as anet stated, era of berserker gear is over (i know you are clad in that). So if you are dying all the time the real issue at hand is your inability to adapt. ANET DON’T NERF ANYTHING!

MikaHR.1978:

I wonder what would sales be if ANet was clear its hardore only expansion, and if youre not “hardcore” yo have “other 25 areas to play in”

ANet shold have been frank about it and say in advance that HoT is:

- annoying (“difficult”)
- super grindy
- group only focused
- full of “prepare to have fun” and empty of “fun”

This is the kind of attitude that annoys me. It’s such a knee-jerk reaction to an obviously rushed expansion. If you purchased it thinking otherwise you needed to do more research as I did. If you pre-purchase any game my sympathy levels drop to almost zero but that’s another thread.

Before you get me wrong I’m not saying Anet is without fault here but the customer also has some personal responsibility and accountability to make an informed decision and I get the feeling many got sucked into pre-purchase expecting vanilla open-world in new clothing on release.

At least give Anet a chance to balance things out before you throw your toys out of the cot.

As I stated before this is really the lesser of two evils given the information pre-release, Release the expac as 100% easymode and hardcores will just walk and never come back. They deserved harder content but it wasn’t ready and as previously stated maybe this is a temporary fix until raids are sorted.

Casuals, majority or not, will just take it as a slight hindrance, do something else, and come back in a month when the expansion is no doubt closer to the polished product Anet originally intended.

morrolan.9608:

Xbon.9086:

you have the ENTIRE core game for casual play….

So casual players shouldn’t buy HOT? Yes I’m sure anet would just love that given how badly Wildstar tanked by catering too much to the 1%ers.

Yup, i wonder if person you quoted will refund the expansion to all those hes sending “to play core game”

WeedyZeGreedy.8635:

So after 6 days you are able to conclude that the content is too hard? All the mobs are new and you need to get to know their moves and patterns. A lot of people seem discouraged when you can’t beat something in first try. Teq was hard to begin with and so was SW bosses but now they are almost never failed at. Don’t bring up this whiney bs so early. Furthermore as anet stated, era of berserker gear is over (i know you are clad in that). So if you are dying all the time the real issue at hand is your inability to adapt. ANET DON’T NERF ANYTHING!

1. Teq was nerfed…couple of times

2. That was perfectly AVOIDABLE content that didnt COST 50$ to play.

Wildstar says hello.

Xbon.9086:

If it says the same as the rest of the game, what the hell is the point of the expansion?

To give the players more of what they already like. A novelty. It can also introduce new gameplay options and mechanics, but those also shoudl be designed with the core of the player community in mind.

Xbon.9086:

Everything you do leads up to the expansion, and the expansion is where your skills are tried and tested to the maximum of their capacity.

There are expansions like that, and, in other games, games that are more about vertical progression, they may even be a good idea. In GW2 not so much.

There are also other types of expansions, that do not go up, but sideways, that happen to fit GW2-like games more. As an example, look at GW1, and the campaign expansions (Factions and Nightfall). It’s something like that which i’d expect in this game.

Macilnor.7385:

I hate those whiners who says HoT is too difficult for them.

Don’t. They keep this game running. If they decide to leave, you will have no GW2 to play in anymore.

Basically, don’t expect people to shell out cash for a content they don’t like, in order for you to be able to play it. Other players are not here for charity, they are here to have fun too.

fireflyry.7023:

This is the kind of attitude that annoys me. It’s such a knee-jerk reaction to an obviously rushed expansion. If you purchased it thinking otherwise you needed to do more research as I did. If you pre-purchase any game my sympathy levels drop to almost zero but that’s another thread.

Before you get me wrong I’m not saying Anet is without fault here but the customer also has some personal responsibility and accountability to make an informed decision and I get the feeling many got sucked into pre-purchase expecting vanilla open-world in new clothing on release.

At least give Anet a chance to balance things out before you throw your toys out of the cot.

As I stated before this is really the lesser of two evils given the information pre-release, Release the expac as 100% easymode and hardcores will just walk and never come back. They deserved harder content but it wasn’t ready and as previously stated maybe this is a temporary fix until raids are sorted.

Casuals, majority or not, will just take it as a slight hindrance, do something else, and come back in a month when the expansion is no doubt closer to the polished product Anet originally intended.

Who the kitten cares about hardcore. They are IRRELEVANT.

Wildstar says hello.

LOTRO says hello.

SWTOR says hello.

Need any more?

Hardcores are NOT holy cow. I guess its ANets turn to learn hard way now.

Suggesting that you pay 50$ and then wait for some indefinite amount of time to maybe get something enjoyable. THATS attitude that annoys other >95% of playerbase.