Guild Wars 2

Guys, the community is more toxic than it’s ever been. The cause is the price tag for HoT being more expensive than we would have originally thought and more expensive than some can afford. But please, can’t we stop with all of this threatening and hate? If you can’t afford the expansion pack, I’m sorry. I don’t mean to be mean or unsympathetic but things cost money. Gw2 has no subscription fee and this expansion pack has no doubt been a huge drain of resources for Anet. They have to get their worth out of it. Just wait until it goes on sale or save up if you really need to get it. If you don’t think 50$ is worth whatever the expansion pack contains then just wait until it goes on sale or don’t buy it. Anet has been busting their kitten to offer all of this new content to us. Can’t we all please return some respect for their providing us with years of free and enjoyable content and what will no doubt be an extremely awesome expansion pack?

Edit: Just to make sure everyone knows, HoT itself costs $50, the free base game was just a bonus for new players. I agree that this isn’t quite fair but I don’t find it offensive. Consider that we got season two for free just for playing while anyone else will have to buy it for about 1600 gems. Also, if you’re going to get mad at Anet get mad about the fact that the game’s cost has basically been reduced by 75% and is comfortably sitting there. I feel like it’d be the best move to offer a special option where players who already own the game get some compensation for pre purchasing such as a new character slot and a few hundred gems while the new players just get the base game. The fact that the base game can be picked up for free and that the base game is getting dirt cheap anyways should be seen as a cry for help. Gw2’s been losing a lot of players. People have left for a number of reasons that mostly justifiable. What I mean is that I think we need to accept the situation if we want Gw2 to continue being a game at all. To those who are offended by this scheme, please don’t go nuts and encourage boycotting Anet and mass petitions to stop playing the game like some have. The people who are the most angry about this are those who have owned the game for a long time, myself included. What if the game does go bankrupt? Do you think it will have been worth it when the hours you have put into the game go completely to waste just so you can get back at Anet? I know this applies to a very small portion of the player base though, most are just kittened and I get it. I just hope that things will cool down.

Please stop with the apologist angle.

They very well knew they were kittening over their playerbase when they included the core game for free to new players and excluded char slots/benefits to existing players.

They also very well knew that selling as many units of the core game as possible through discounts while saying it would be required to play the expac, and then including the core game for free with the expansion and editing the FAQ would rort players AKA “bait and switch”.

Whether the relatively small amount of content is worth $50 is a separate issue and well worth discussing, but the deceitful tactics and dismissive attitude towards existing players is pretty much unequivocal.

that is, they are willingly trashing the community for a few extra $$$. They totally do deserve this. As you can see from the lack of concern, the management don’t even care.

They don’t deserve my money either. I only had the game for a little over a month or two and I now need to buy the game again for $50?

The devs, forum staff, customer support staff and all the other good people working at Anet don;t deserve this. The kittenheads that came up with this pricing scheme and those responsible for the shady business practices deserve every bit of it.

Treetoptrickster.4205:

Guys, the community is more toxic than it’s ever been. The cause is the price tag for HoT being more expensive than we would have originally thought and more expensive than some can afford. But please, can’t we stop with all of this threatening and hate? If you can’t afford the expansion pack, I’m sorry. I don’t mean to be mean or unsympathetic but things cost money. Gw2 has no subscription fee and this expansion pack has no doubt been a huge drain of resources for Anet. They have to get their worth out of it. Just wait until it goes on sale or save up if you really need to get it. If you don’t think 50$ is worth whatever the expansion pack contains then just wait until it goes on sale or don’t buy it. Anet has been busting their kitten to offer all of this new content to us. Can’t we all please return some respect for their providing us with years of free and enjoyable content and what will no doubt be an extremely awesome expansion pack?

Oh please the tears, the drama…

if you don’t like the “toxic” atmosphere just stay away from the “toxic” threads, and don’t click ‘em. There problem solved. But you just gotta take a peak don’t you? eh? and then you don’t like it, but you still do it…

I don’t get some people, it’s not enough that they have the option to not get involved or pay attention to something, no no, they don’t even want others to do it. if you’re happy nobody else gets to complain cause it upsets you or something?

You have not fully grasped all the problems people have with the prepurchase. Most are fine with $50, as long as they get $50 worth of value. Many feel this is not the case.

Anet is dependent on it’s return customers to keep generating income. They therefore will need to provide enough value, or risk alienating a large group of their gemstore sponsors.

Futher more, this has exploded to where it is now due to a total lack of damage control by Anet. A post by Colin saying they either look into it, or that it is indeed final would have done a lot to mitigate that. They chose not to do so, even as Colin responded to questions about ascended gear on this very forum.

I sympatise with your sentiments, but it’s a situation of their own making.

Edit: there is no free content. If you never spend a dime in the genstore and played the living story ‘for free’, you played something that was paid for by veterans through gemstore purchases.

Treetoptrickster.4205:

Guys, the community is more toxic than it’s ever been. The cause is the price tag for HoT being more expensive than we would have originally thought and more expensive than some can afford. But please, can’t we stop with all of this threatening and hate? If you can’t afford the expansion pack, I’m sorry. I don’t mean to be mean or unsympathetic but things cost money. Gw2 has no subscription fee and this expansion pack has no doubt been a huge drain of resources for Anet. They have to get their worth out of it. Just wait until it goes on sale or save up if you really need to get it. If you don’t think 50$ is worth whatever the expansion pack contains then just wait until it goes on sale or don’t buy it. Anet has been busting their kitten to offer all of this new content to us. Can’t we all please return some respect for their providing us with years of free and enjoyable content and what will no doubt be an extremely awesome expansion pack?

Deserve what? Respect? or Deserve a pat on the shoulder for a job well done?

I will give credit when credit is due. ANET DID gave us a great game. In fact, it is currently the only game I am still playing because it is fun! Even with the grinding, it is still fun to play with other players in world events/dungeons/story. The Living Story is good. I will give them that. But it could be better, but storytelling is a whole different dimension. At least ANET gave it a shot. I would say they get a B- for storyline on the Living Story.

We the “entitled” veteran players are the ones keeping this game healthy. Over the years, I have bought gems just to support ANET.

However, my respect for ANET has rocked bottom due to all this nonsense. I will not buy the HoT expansion now. I will only buy after launch date. Doesn’t matter to me if I play it months later. I still love the game. I just hate what ANET is doing.

And yes, ANET deserve all this. They brought it on themselves.

And not everyone who is upset with the pricing scheme is upset because they can’t afford it.

I just haven’t seen enough of HoT to say that I’m not getting the proverbial finger by having pre-purchased the original game. Money is tight with me. I can budget out $50-$75 easily for a one time purchase.

There’s currently nothing in the game that I have gotten that I would miss if I had bought the game today.

So it really seems like new players are getting a LOT more bang for their buck with this purchase. If I knew more about HoT and could place it’s value at a higher amount than I do, it would lessen the sting of the bundle.

And there isn’t even all that good of a reason to pre-purchase. I don’t want to spoil HoT by playing the beta and a title isn’t all that special. I only played the beta for GW2 base because I had never played an MMO before and I wanted to try out the game before I bought it.

wow, i clutched my chest when i read this, …really moving…
but no.

ever catch a person you thought was a best friend suddenly trying to figure out how to get money from you ? not fun.

I have the up most respect for anets artists and programmers, i don’t like how they are getting pimped.

Treetoptrickster.4205:

can’t we stop with all of this threatening and hate?

Umm.. I haven’t seen a bunch of threatening and hate, what I see are a bunch of valid concerns about a pay model that is unkind to loyal fans. I wonder, at what point is it ok for fans to take their heads out of the clouds and start to push back on unfriendly practices?

Julie Yann.5379:

The devs, forum staff, customer support staff and all the other good people working at Anet don;t deserve this. The kittenheads that came up with this pricing scheme and those responsible for the shady business practices deserve every bit of it.

This! X10 Someone posted a similar thought on reddit.

Its a business.

They aren’t your friends. They don’t particularly care about you. They do not have your best interests in mind in regards to the game.

They are here to make money, and will do what they think they can get away with to do so. Especially with NCsoft hanging over their shoulder.

What they don’t deserve is so much blind faith. They can stand up for themselves, should they bother to do so.

Pretty Pixie.8603:

Edit: there is no free content. If you never spend a dime in the genstore and played the living story ‘for free’, you played something that was paid for by veterans through gemstore purchases.

This. I’ve spent plenty more than the Expansion cost in gems because I wanted to support the game (before the expansion was announced, when we didn’t think there would be one…) You’re welcome, to the people who paid the initial game cost and nothing more. The expansion is simply not worth $50 and I don’t like the chronic inconsistency. There are two factors at play here: “perceived value” and good/bad faith in operations.

Anyhow, I’ve started playing a new game this week, quite happy with it now. Checking here to see if there’s any update but I see none.

Treetoptrickster.4205:

Guys, the community is more toxic than it’s ever been. The cause is the price tag for HoT being more expensive than we would have originally thought and more expensive than some can afford. But please, can’t we stop with all of this threatening and hate? If you can’t afford the expansion pack, I’m sorry. I don’t mean to be mean or unsympathetic but things cost money. Gw2 has no subscription fee and this expansion pack has no doubt been a huge drain of resources for Anet. They have to get their worth out of it. Just wait until it goes on sale or save up if you really need to get it. If you don’t think 50$ is worth whatever the expansion pack contains then just wait until it goes on sale or don’t buy it. Anet has been busting their kitten to offer all of this new content to us. Can’t we all please return some respect for their providing us with years of free and enjoyable content and what will no doubt be an extremely awesome expansion pack?

Price isn’t the issue, it’s paying twice for the base game without getting the base game or compensation so Johny McNoob can get it for “FREE.”

If you have no clue read my signature, it’s Anets action on a much larger dollar scale.

I fully get that NCSoft is behind the pricing most likely, but if ANet knew that they were gonna slap the $50 price tag on it, then ANet should’ve developed $50 worth of content for the game, and as many of us have seen so far, it doesn’t look like that.

What this does look like, is a last minute plan to make an xpac and now it is probably being rushed to completion. It all looks a bit desperate if you ask me.

HoT could very well be worth $50 and we just haven’t seen anything yet. However, knowing ANet’s track record for the last few years, much is overhyped and much is underdelivered. They expect the community to trust them that we will be getting $50 worth of content? I don’t blame the community at all for how it is handling this, they are a product of a trust that has been degrading for the last couple years between the devs and their playerbase.

There is a disconnect, and their silence on this issue is only making things worse. They need to completely change their communication policy if there is any hope on salvaging what is left of this now toxic community. It’s sad, to see the community in it’s current state, but I saw it coming, I think we just got that straw that broke the camels back…

well in all fairness, i’m not sure it’s that easy to make a ton of content super fast, not to mention. …from what i’ve seen in the videos, the areas are more vertical now….this makes it bigger but in a different dimension.

what really gets me, is I’d rather see a post from them saying “Guys, we need your support” and not some buy 1 get 1 free deal when there is only one software to buy.
suddenly the little stuff like character slots feel like a big deal…..all because they just couldn’t say – guys – this is a fund raiser! Instead i feel like a consumer having to defend my right to inspect the offering and watch my back.

yes, it’s a business, but they are still human and walked the earth with us having fun and growing together too. You want to make it all business ? fine, show me what you got. if i like it, i’ll support it, right now, i’m not liking it.

The cause is the price tag for HoT being more expensive than we would have originally thought and more expensive than some can afford

Wrong.

If they had let the price tag the same, but given those that have the original game core something “extra”, like ppl suggested a char slot, or even something else no matter what, then you wouldn’t have this discussion and uproar.

Anet made 2 mistakes :

1. first announcing you needed the game core then chaging their Faq later on without notice.

2. Blatantly telling people there will be NO change to their ‘bundles’, if you can call em that, and giving the core game as a ‘bonus’ to new players.

Those 2 facts are what P. players off. Not the price tag.

As far as i’m concerned, i don’t care about the price tag, i care about the content, and honestly, i’m not impressed. If you look at a game from a different category, an FPS, they manage to sell an ‘expansion’ (in fact a standalone one) for only 20$. And for that you get one hell of a single play experience definately worth 20$, i’d even buy 10 of those to keep playing it. It’s not about the cash, it’s about how you present it and what’s in it.

There are two factors at play here: “perceived value” and good/bad faith in operations.

and that’s right on the dot.

I got this game as a present and i’ve only spend cash on gems, so as far as i’m concerned, i could throw this game into the trash and not be ‘hurt’ by it. But spending cash on something i know nothing about and don’t even know when it is coming is in my opinion overeagerness.

I think that Anet is/was trying to lure in new players to fill the gap of those that already left and didn’t plan on returning. Declining player numbers prove that. But that plan backfired in a way they didn’t intended or predicted.

If you have a few people running in one direction screaming fire, 90% will follow them blindly and you have a mob. The other 10% waits till they see the fire and by then it’s to late to escape. Wether there’s a fire or not, you lose a lot of people, and that’s completely on Anet’s marketing division.

I’m one of the 0.1% that waits for the fire while holding an extinguisher. Getting ready to hop out if the fire’s to hot.

Treetoptrickster.4205:

Can’t we all please return some respect for their providing us with years of free and enjoyable content and what will no doubt be an extremely awesome expansion pack?

“Free” content?

I don’t know about you, but I have bought the right to play GW2. And ArenaNet has furiously been trying to make money through their Gem Store, be it with their scam-like BLC lottery system, by creating inconveniences to sell convenience (see the very small size of the bank), by allowing people to buy gold with gems and thus becoming P2W, or by any of the other questionable ways ArenaNet has used to make money at their players’ expenses.

And “extremely awesome expansion pack”? Really? Based on everything ArenaNet has told us, the expansion looks like a small DLC that other games would have charged 10$ for, made in a hurry so ArenaNet can offset all the losses they had after the failed China release. Hardly “extremely awesome”.

PorceleinEve.2973:

Treetoptrickster.4205:

Guys, the community is more toxic than it’s ever been. The cause is the price tag for HoT being more expensive than we would have originally thought and more expensive than some can afford. But please, can’t we stop with all of this threatening and hate? If you can’t afford the expansion pack, I’m sorry. I don’t mean to be mean or unsympathetic but things cost money. Gw2 has no subscription fee and this expansion pack has no doubt been a huge drain of resources for Anet. They have to get their worth out of it. Just wait until it goes on sale or save up if you really need to get it. If you don’t think 50$ is worth whatever the expansion pack contains then just wait until it goes on sale or don’t buy it. Anet has been busting their kitten to offer all of this new content to us. Can’t we all please return some respect for their providing us with years of free and enjoyable content and what will no doubt be an extremely awesome expansion pack?

Oh please the tears, the drama…

if you don’t like the “toxic” atmosphere just stay away from the “toxic” threads, and don’t click ‘em. There problem solved. But you just gotta take a peak don’t you? eh? and then you don’t like it, but you still do it…

I don’t get some people, it’s not enough that they have the option to not get involved or pay attention to something, no no, they don’t even want others to do it. if you’re happy nobody else gets to complain cause it upsets you or something?

Not really, I just don’t want everybody to end up leaving the game and then having tons of hours going to waste because gw2 just ceases to exsist.

Treetoptrickster.4205:

Guys, the community is more toxic than it’s ever been. The cause is the price tag for HoT being more expensive than we would have originally thought and more expensive than some can afford. But please, can’t we stop with all of this threatening and hate? If you can’t afford the expansion pack, I’m sorry. I don’t mean to be mean or unsympathetic but things cost money. Gw2 has no subscription fee and this expansion pack has no doubt been a huge drain of resources for Anet. They have to get their worth out of it. Just wait until it goes on sale or save up if you really need to get it. If you don’t think 50$ is worth whatever the expansion pack contains then just wait until it goes on sale or don’t buy it. Anet has been busting their kitten to offer all of this new content to us. Can’t we all please return some respect for their providing us with years of free and enjoyable content and what will no doubt be an extremely awesome expansion pack?

I’ve not seen a single threat outside of people talking about taking legal action, which I think is more of a "_technically_ we could… " / idle threat conversation than a “I’m suing anet!!!” threat.

A lot of “hatred” also seems missing aside from people who hate the elitist/entitled vet crowd.

Take a step back and think about it. If we didn’t like the devs, didn’t like the first almost 3 years we’ve gotten, would we be here, 4 days later still posting?
I’m pretty sure most if not all of the people who don’t like GW or Anet aren’t posting anymore.

The cost: Yes there are some people who can’t afford it; this is true. It is most definitely not the majority of those complaining. It is rude to both parties to “lump them together.”
I agree that arenanet has undoubtedly put a ton of resources(cash) into the development of HoT.
I know that I personally never asked them to, nor did I ever want them to, I wish they put resources/revenue back into the core game as they originally promised when I originally pre-purchased CE of GW2. I was willing to look past this, and she’ll out some dough on HoT anyway.
Until I saw that my $50 was worth less to Arenanet than a new players.
I, like many others, simply want to be treated fairly.

You do raise a good point of respect being a two way street. The thing is those of us speaking out didn’t decide to do it at random. And at least half of us don’t care about the cost one bit.
If HoT was $10. And new players got HoT+core for their $10; while my $10 got me HoT only, I’d still speak out. As I am being disrespected; if responses to arenanet’s actions are offensive, then please, feel free to report posts, the forum moderators (arenanet) will take it from there. There is no need to create a thread about it.
all you are accomplishing is stirring the pot.

Treetoptrickster.4205:

Guys, the community is more toxic than it’s ever been.

I wouldn’t say the community has been toxic. Quite the opposite. The community has spoken out against an unfair and unbalanced purchase selection. Just because you may not agree with their sentiments does not make the community any less.

Anet does deserve this. In fact, more gaming companies deserve this. Gamers need to get a backbone and start acting like actual consumers making smart decisions instead of being guilted into buying or blindly supporting a company and everything they do.

Right now, the gaming environment is filled with unfinished games being released early and force players to patch in games, adding in DLC late that costs way too much for things that could have been released in the game had they not tried to get more money out of loyal fans and a system where fans call other gamers “entitled” if they ask for more and claim we should be lucky we get to play it at all.

Money is enough praise for the company. Right now, they need criticism or else nothing would change.

How does Anet not deserve this? It’s clearly a serious enough issue if it’s received this much backlash. Between the clear disparity in value between what new players and existing players are getting, the super shady bait-and-switch FAQ, and the fact that they expect us to throw down as much money as most full games cost for an expansion with a currently indeterminate amount of content; people have every right to be up in arms.

They planned this very poorly, and every dollar lost with this blunder is completely justified if you ask me.

Action and consequences. You have to be responsible for your marketing. You can’t welcome good PR and ignore the bad ones. Man it up or go out with it.

You know what we need to do? We need to bundle all the angry people into one posting area and let them go at it. Yall a trip always trying to flame anyone that want to post about being apologetic or showing sympathy… smh. Anet f’ed up. We get it… YOU get it. Community has given its feedback and its recommendation for a solution to fix some of it. Give Anet a week. And go do something other else other than being the bad of the situation…

Treetoptrickster.4205:

Not really, I just don’t want everybody to end up leaving the game and then having tons of hours going to waste because gw2 just ceases to exsist.

Bad company practices tend to do that, not the customer’s fault, but the company’s. If you want to protect the game you love, side with the side of the consumers, not the company. If you did that, instead of blaming the consumers, the company would actually listen (instead of ignoring us because of people like you enabling them) and then the future of your game would be better served. Your own interests too. But, to each their own.

Treetoptrickster.4205:

Guys, the community is more toxic than it’s ever been.

Ukraine’s the most violent it’s ever been. but then, people tend to react badly when they’re being screwed over.

okay, the pre-purchase isn’t exactly Russian operations in Ukraine, but the point stands.

sometimes, when people are getting angry and worked up, it’s because something is angering them, and working them up.

and maybe that’s what needs changed…

ANet doesn’t need anyone to hold it’s hand. The forum chatter is not going to hurt it’s feelings. They need to know what people are thinking, and that’s what the forums are an outlet for.

There’s a difference between being toxic, and being rightfully angry. If you look through all the pages of complaints, people are on the whole quite in agreement about what is wrong with this expansion. And they can explain their anger quite well.

This is not a mob of players being unreasonable, or feeling entitled. These are angry customers, and this forum is the ONE place where they SHOULD vent their anger.

Julie Yann.5379:

The devs, forum staff, customer support staff and all the other good people working at Anet don;t deserve this. The kittenheads that came up with this pricing scheme and those responsible for the shady business practices deserve every bit of it.

^This. While the developers don’t deserve the backlash, it’s evident that the marketing and pricing scheme was ll-thought and is an absolute mess for everyone under every aspect.

They will start apologizing when they don’t sell planned 2 milion copies of expansion. They are now doing silence treatment but not for long.
from the Bible Gal 6.7 “A man reaps what he sows”