(edited by Wolfeng.3784)
Core of the problem: False Advertising.
Core of the problem: False Advertising.
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: ZudetGambeous.9573
The real problem is that they have not revealed $50 worth of content… so far we have seen $15-20 worth…
Core of the problem: False Advertising.
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Knighthonor.4061
June 23rd trait patch drama will overshadow all this price drama in the coming week.
June 23rd trait patch drama will overshadow all this price drama in the coming week.
True. For those that still play. For people like me that have only been logging in for the daily reward and then logging out we will still be talking and thinking about how we spent money on accounts during sales when it was revealed HoT required the base game to play.
Leader of The Guernsey Milking Coalition [MiLk] Sanctum of Rall
June 23rd trait patch drama will overshadow all this price drama in the coming week.
Go on with your life blindly accepting anything a company does. Be it illegal or not.
Core of the problem: False Advertising.
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Knighthonor.4061
June 23rd trait patch drama will overshadow all this price drama in the coming week.
Go on with your life blindly accepting anything a company does. Be it illegal or not.
Wait was this post meant for somebody else?
June 23rd trait patch drama will overshadow all this price drama in the coming week.
Go on with your life blindly accepting anything a company does. Be it illegal or not.
Wait was this post meant for somebody else?
Sorry, I’m raging still. hard to think.
fyi, they could have…
HoT: $49.99
*requires GW2 to play
HoT + GW2 special pre-purchase bundle: $59.99.
Pre-purchase now and save an additional 17%.
GW2 was being sold for $10. The heroic edition bonuses alone were valued at $20. Cut those and… might as well give it away. Since GW2 isn’t F2P however, bundle it.
The problem is not the price, its the value.
First of all i see no reason for 3 tiers of expacks. It could’ve easily be 2 – deluxe and ultimate and get rid of the joke that standard is.
The game had PERFECT perks when it launched 3 years ago. What changed? Did they replace someone in the marketing/PR team? I bought the cheap version but i didn’t feel guilty about it, later on I upgraded to digital deluxe.
If I buy the standard version, I’ll feel guilty I only gave you guys 50$. And that’s bad. Because I really don’t see the value in paying more.
Everytime I create a new character and get the Hero Band, even though its rather useless, It warms my heart. It instantly reminds me that, hey, I was there, 3 years ago, at headstart. Back then ANet appreciated every dollar I gave them. Man was that a nice feeling. Still is. Add that to HoT and you’ll swim in gold.
You know, not every restaurant is required to serve you mints after meal for free. But it sure feels awesome seeing it happen.
I almost feel sorry for ANet. I bet someone from uptop came up with this joke of pre-purchase packs. It looks a lot more like F2P crap founders pack than Guild kittening Wars 2 expansion pack
(edited by Ravenmoon.5318)
Thank you, been saying this since day one. While criticizing the price tag for being too high is a perfectly valid complaint, the primary issue is the fact that Anet engaged in false advertising. Since HoT was announced, they sold thousands upon thousands of copies of the base game using it, even having sales to promote it. Anet was basically saying “Hey, we have an expansion coming out soon. You should purchase the base game while it’s on sale!” They did this, knowing for at least the past month or two that HoT would include the base game, and that a standalone option at a reduced price would not be available. Anybody who bought the game in anticipation for HoT got screwed hard.
And to the people who hit the reply button and are typing out “but the base game is a bonus,” stop and think for a second. Do you really think a AAA game developer would sacrifice that much revenue? You are painfully naive if you really think that Anet isn’t going to subsidize the cost of the base game somewhere. That’s where your $50 price tag comes from.
Thank you, been saying this since day one. While criticizing the price tag for being too high is a perfectly valid complaint, the primary issue is the fact that Anet engaged in false advertising. Since HoT was announced, they sold thousands upon thousands of copies of the base game using it, even having sales to promote it. Anet was basically saying “Hey, we have an expansion coming out soon. You should purchase the base game while it’s on sale!” They did this, knowing for at least the past month or two that HoT would include the base game, and that a standalone option at a reduced price would not be available. Anybody who bought the game in anticipation for HoT got screwed hard.
And to the people who hit the reply button and are typing out “but the base game is a bonus,” stop and think for a second. Do you really think a AAA game developer would sacrifice that much revenue? You are painfully naive if you really think that Anet isn’t going to subsidize the cost of the base game somewhere. That’s where your $50 price tag comes from.
We can’t know for sure wheter or not they knew it would include the base game. But the fact is it does now, and that changes everything.
I’m still waiting to see what they come up with to fix this mess. Silence is definately not the way to handle this.
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
I’m really glad gamers are finally being vocal about companies screwing over consumers. There is a reason that today you often get half finished products that release patches over the course of a year, a bunch of DLC content they charge at 25% of what you already paid for the game (content that likely should have or could have easily been added to the game before launch), products that pushed out early with sequels in mind before you barely throw your loyalty into the first game, and so on.
Game companies do things like this because they know there will be a legion of people that are “just grateful they get to play it” and are willing to continually pay extra money and get less and less. Gamers aren’t making companies earn their money, rather game companies are making gamers beg for their product.
I hope more and more gamers start holding companies to higher standards. Imagine if your cable company kept coming up with more and more “packages” of channels and reducing the amount you have on your current package every year. Are you just going to be like “well I guess I’ll upgrade and pay 10 more so I can keep ESPN and the food network”? A lot of people will switch companies and get better deals. Likewise, I wish gamers would do the same.
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
One of the “Core Problems” here, in my opinion, is that they’re now saying that after only a few years, our original purchase of Guild Wars 2 has a value of $0. The game is essentially free, since it can no longer be purchased, and is now part of a package (not “bundle”) that we are required to purchase in order to enjoy the same basic “ever changing world” that we promised (in a “manifesto”, nonetheless) when we bought the game initially.
I see this as being very similar to when a Buy-To-Play game goes Free-To-Play after a few months or years. In each and every case I can find, however, when a paid game in has gone Free-To-Play, people who purchased the game beforehand have been given some sort of compensation to make up for their initial purchase, which was now unnecessary. Sometimes they get a few free months in a new, optional subscription service; sometimes it’s a few free exclusive skins, or a couple of free dungeon packs, or whatever. But in this case, those of us who bought the game are being offered NOTHING to compensate for our initial purchase, which has been rendered worthless by a new policy of giving it away by the company we purchased it from.
Now I know this isn’t exactly the same, because GW2 is not actually Free-To-Play (thank god), this case is somewhat unprecedented. Paid games going Free-To-Play is the closest analogy I could think of for what’s really bothering me about this. I mean, Heart of Thorns cost $50. For everyone. The core game is “Free” to anyone who buys it… unless they already bought it, in which case they get nothing extra. So the game is Free, but not Free-To-Play as there is still a paywall. It’s weird. But I feel that by making the core game “Free” with NO NOTICE, people who bought the game do deserve some compensation, along the lines of people who bought, say, The Secret World, which is Buy-To-Play, but when they dropped their sub (and the price of the game) they gave people free subs to their optional sub service (TSW had a “Lifetime Subscription” option when it came out, after all). Or ESO, which literally paid players 500 crowns each the first time they logged in after they dropped their subscription. Again, these examples aren’t identical, because GW2 has always had a unique Buy-To-Play model, but they are similar in a way. If the core game is now “Free”, and only free, even if it’s behind a paywall, it is not unreasonable for people who bought the game to feel that they should be compensated for the perceived loss of value in the game that they purchased, since that loss of value is a direct result of the a new policy instituted by the company that sold it to them.
I don’t exactly know how to fix this, what the compensation should be; heck, I might be completely wrong here, even. But it feels like my $60 purchase has seen its value drop to $0 now that the only option Anet has is to receive the same core game for Free, even if you do have to buy something else to get it. Especially since I’m now obligated to buy that same expansion for full price, if I want to continue to enjoy the same, regular updates that were promised during the game’s initial release.
Bakuon/Bakuon Thief [MAS]/ ex-[ATac]
Core of the problem: False Advertising.
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Tribal Sage.5642
Ignore the fact that a group of people is getting something for free while the other doesn’t.
That is a minor issue, they can do something about it or not.The real problem however is that ever since they announced HoT, they said you would need the base game.
For months they had sales of the game, for months they profited with that information.And now all of a sudden the FAQ changes and states that HoT includes the base game for free.
What has Anet done so far to adress this issue? A single forum post saying people could look for a refund? That may or may not work?
How many of those customers will actually see that forum post? (I can’t even find it on the forums anymore)
Where is the blog post about it? The twitter about it? The email about it? The full list of what people can expect when getting refunded? Will they lose their account, will they lose the link they made with GW1? What are their going to do about people who bought the game in another store? There were sales all over the place because of THEIR information.
Another problem:
Their pre-purchase video says we will get access to the heart of the maguuma, but during the beta we had to complete that piece of the living story to enter it. Is that final?
If I pre-purchase do I get the whole Season 2? The lack of info, and the fear that info may change at any time is a serious concern when money is involved.
Also: Forget the price.
Just to give you some insight, people can in fact get a refund but there’s 2 conditions as explained to me by a supervisor. Here’s the word for word response from him..
Game Support Supervisor:Unfortunately, there is nothing we can offer at this time. If the purchase was made via our buy.guildwars2.com site within 30-days ago, we would offer to refund the initial purchase and disable the code so that you can purchase the expansion of your choice. We don’t have any other expansion purchase options at this time.
Please let us know if you have any other questions.
I know people can get a refund, if they somehow find out about it.
The only consumers that know about this are the ones that actually took the time to read thousands of complaints and somehow find that anet is refunding purchases.
It’s not even a stick in the forums. What happens to all those that bought the game believing they had to buy it to enjoy HoT and don’t check the forums? Is it ok to trick those people?
Core of the problem: False Advertising.
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: IndigoSundown.5419
The only consumers that know about this are the ones that actually took the time to read thousands of complaints and somehow find that anet is refunding purchases.
ANet has a history of announcing things across multiple platforms with no central clearing house for information. It’s, frankly, a shame they don’t establish a protocol whereby anytime anyone releases info they send an email with the link to the forum Mods. who then post the link with a short sentence describing it in the info section on the forum front page. Then, if they announced this on a variety of platforms, anyone who wants info would know exactly where to look. Cryptic, a second rate developer, does this. It’s a shame Anet is so disorganized that they don’t even think about it.
Since they haven’t, the only advice I have is for people who have an issue is to contact Customer Service.
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
This is the court of public opinion not a law court. And I doubt you are a lawyer, so please don’t speak if you have equal background to the op as if he has inferior education on this matter to you. Anyone who was not given a refund and can offer significant reason could most likely take this to a court of law, but a 10$ difference in price is not worth 10s of thousands of dollars. Look at what happened to mcDonalds though. A consumer spilled their coffee on themselves and won a court case against McDonalds, anything can get into a court of law by that logic.
Have fun. Be Alive. K Thnx Bye.
(edited by Sadrien.3470)
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Actuallly, I don’t agree with this. Deception implies the intent to deceive.
Do you know when the actual decision for this was made? Do you know at what point the people who made the decision at a high level communicated it down to a lower level, the guys who would actually edit the FAQ for example?
There are many things I’ve said that eventually turn out to be different, but that doesn’t mean I was trying to deceive anyone.
From what it looks to me, the original decision was to continue to sell the core game. There was likely other people who had other ideas in management, and eventually, at some point recently, it was decided that that wouldn’t be in the best interest of the company. So they decided to change it.
Changes in companies always take time. They were preparing for E3, preparing for a big patch. Are you really sure there’s an intent to deceive here? Or did a single line from a single FAQ get overlooked.
Remember how big this project is. Remember everything that’s going on at the company. This line appears in one single FAQ page, that’s it.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
This is the court of public opinion not a law court. And I doubt you are a lawyer, so please don’t speak if you have equal background to the op as if he has inferior education on this matter to you. Anyone who was not given a refund and can offer significant reason could most likely take this to a court of law, but a 10$ difference in price is not worth 10s of thousands of dollars. Look at what happened to mcDonalds though. A consumer spilled their coffee on themselves and won a court case against McDonalds, anything can get into a court of law by that logic.
I’m not a lawyer, but I have experience with consumer law regardless, from the other end. So my experience may well be more than the OPs. Regardless, it’s not up to you to tell me what to do either way. I’m as entitled to post my opinions here as you are.
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
This is the court of public opinion not a law court. And I doubt you are a lawyer, so please don’t speak if you have equal background to the op as if he has inferior education on this matter to you. Anyone who was not given a refund and can offer significant reason could most likely take this to a court of law, but a 10$ difference in price is not worth 10s of thousands of dollars. Look at what happened to mcDonalds though. A consumer spilled their coffee on themselves and won a court case against McDonalds, anything can get into a court of law by that logic.
I’m not a lawyer, but I have experience with consumer law regardless, from the other end. So my experience may well be more than the OPs. Regardless, it’s not up to you to tell me what to do either way. I’m as entitled to post my opinions here as you are.
Then he is entitled to them too. hypocritical post much.
Have fun. Be Alive. K Thnx Bye.
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
Yes, I do. Anet is a AAA game developer with many different people working on different things. It’s not like one team of 20 people is scrambling to finish everything. Anet has a department that’s in charge of the business aspect. They pushed the core game hard using HoT. It was the selling point of the core game for months. They also had to have had plans for how the bundles would work and how they were priced. We’re dealing with corporate entities here. Every detail is meticulously planned.
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
This is the court of public opinion not a law court. And I doubt you are a lawyer, so please don’t speak if you have equal background to the op as if he has inferior education on this matter to you. Anyone who was not given a refund and can offer significant reason could most likely take this to a court of law, but a 10$ difference in price is not worth 10s of thousands of dollars. Look at what happened to mcDonalds though. A consumer spilled their coffee on themselves and won a court case against McDonalds, anything can get into a court of law by that logic.
I’m not a lawyer, but I have experience with consumer law regardless, from the other end. So my experience may well be more than the OPs. Regardless, it’s not up to you to tell me what to do either way. I’m as entitled to post my opinions here as you are.
Then he is entitled to them too. hypocritical post much.
Actually you are the one being hypocritical. I didn’t tell him not to post. I just weighed in with my opinion on what he posted. I did tell him that he made a claim and that without the legal background that claim is wrong. When people use the word false advertising, if they can’t prove it, that’s also against the law. If you accuse someone of false advertising falsely, that’s illegal.
But you’re telling me not to post my opinion. And my opinion was he shouldn’t make those claims without knowing more…not that he’s not entitled to an opinion.
However there is such a thing as defaming. It is against the law, and it shouldn’t be done lightly. So my post is on topic and helpful. Telling me not to post is NOT on topic, and you probably should avoid doing it in the future.
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
Yes, I do. Anet is a AAA game developer with many different people working on different things. It’s not like one team of 20 people is scrambling to finish everything. Anet has a department that’s in charge of the business aspect. They pushed the core game hard using HoT. It was the selling point of the core game for months. They also had to have had plans for how the bundles would work and how they were priced. We’re dealing with corporate entities here. Every detail is meticulously planned.
It only takes one guy to forget or not check. No matter how big the business. More people doesn’t mean better organization. A lot of times, more people means more confusion. It also depends on how much everyone is doing at the same time.
If you don’t see it as a possibility, then I don’t know what to tell you. I’ve been in too many situations in too many business where stuff that absolutely can’t be missed got missed.
I agree with ZudetGambeous. Where is the 50 bucks worth of content? Personally, I don’t care about a new class, guild halls, PvP, or WvW but that’s just me. If you like those upgrades go for it. Buy it.
I want to know how many zones are in the new expansion. How big are they? For 50 bucks I would expect at least as many zones as the original game. Am I going to get my butt kicked when I explore them because I am a casual gamer and I don’t like being forced to group up unless I’m going to a dungeon.
I like the world boss timers, its kept me playing the game long after I got bored with every thing else, so how many world bosses are you adding and are they going to be asinine like the evolved jungle worm that nobody ever does?
It took you guys to long to come up with this expansion in the first place. I want to make sure it doesn’t suck before I buy it.
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
Yes, I do. Anet is a AAA game developer with many different people working on different things. It’s not like one team of 20 people is scrambling to finish everything. Anet has a department that’s in charge of the business aspect. They pushed the core game hard using HoT. It was the selling point of the core game for months. They also had to have had plans for how the bundles would work and how they were priced. We’re dealing with corporate entities here. Every detail is meticulously planned.
It only takes one guy to forget or not check. No matter how big the business. More people doesn’t mean better organization. A lot of times, more people means more confusion. It also depends on how much everyone is doing at the same time.
If you don’t see it as a possibility, then I don’t know what to tell you. I’ve been in too many situations in too many business where stuff that absolutely can’t be missed got missed.
Anet’s entire marketing strategy for about 4 months and the fact that they would have to subsidize the cost of the core game somewhere seem like pretty massive details to “miss”
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Actuallly, I don’t agree with this. Deception implies the intent to deceive.
Do you know when the actual decision for this was made? Do you know at what point the people who made the decision at a high level communicated it down to a lower level, the guys who would actually edit the FAQ for example?
There are many things I’ve said that eventually turn out to be different, but that doesn’t mean I was trying to deceive anyone.
From what it looks to me, the original decision was to continue to sell the core game. There was likely other people who had other ideas in management, and eventually, at some point recently, it was decided that that wouldn’t be in the best interest of the company. So they decided to change it.
Changes in companies always take time. They were preparing for E3, preparing for a big patch. Are you really sure there’s an intent to deceive here? Or did a single line from a single FAQ get overlooked.
Remember how big this project is. Remember everything that’s going on at the company. This line appears in one single FAQ page, that’s it.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
I’m sorry but it’s really hard to believe how easily someone can try to belittle such a big issue that caused a lot of this rage and how many people it affected with legitimate reason to complain.
Anet is a company that has been running GW2 for 3 years let alone GW1, you really can’t belittle deception like this, no matter how much FAQs could have been overlooked.
FAQs…
Lest We Forget
Lest We Forget
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Actuallly, I don’t agree with this. Deception implies the intent to deceive.
Do you know when the actual decision for this was made? Do you know at what point the people who made the decision at a high level communicated it down to a lower level, the guys who would actually edit the FAQ for example?
There are many things I’ve said that eventually turn out to be different, but that doesn’t mean I was trying to deceive anyone.
From what it looks to me, the original decision was to continue to sell the core game. There was likely other people who had other ideas in management, and eventually, at some point recently, it was decided that that wouldn’t be in the best interest of the company. So they decided to change it.
Changes in companies always take time. They were preparing for E3, preparing for a big patch. Are you really sure there’s an intent to deceive here? Or did a single line from a single FAQ get overlooked.
Remember how big this project is. Remember everything that’s going on at the company. This line appears in one single FAQ page, that’s it.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
I’m sorry but it’s really hard to believe how easily someone can try to belittle such a big issue that caused a lot of this rage and how many people it affected with legitimate reason to complain.
Anet is a company that has been running GW2 for 3 years let alone GW1, you really can’t belittle deception like this, no matter how much FAQs could have been overlooked.
I’m not belittling anything. Not even a little. I’m saying that you shouldn’t use the word deception unless you can prove intent. And if you can’t prove intent, and you just believe it without proof, you’re slandering a company. I edited for a living for long enough to know when the wrong word is used. Deception implies intent. If you’re telling me that at crunch time something like that couldn’t have been missed, I’m telling you now, you’re wrong. It is ENTIRELY possible for companies bigger or smaller to miss stuff like this. If you don’t believe it, you don’t have enough experience to comment. I’ve seen some very big companies make some very big mistakes. The Intel P5 mistake comes to mind off the top of my head. Not only did the ship a processor with a math function that didn’t work, but the refused to take it back at first, until social pressure forced them to. And Intel is a lot bigger than Anet.
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Actuallly, I don’t agree with this. Deception implies the intent to deceive.
Do you know when the actual decision for this was made? Do you know at what point the people who made the decision at a high level communicated it down to a lower level, the guys who would actually edit the FAQ for example?
There are many things I’ve said that eventually turn out to be different, but that doesn’t mean I was trying to deceive anyone.
From what it looks to me, the original decision was to continue to sell the core game. There was likely other people who had other ideas in management, and eventually, at some point recently, it was decided that that wouldn’t be in the best interest of the company. So they decided to change it.
Changes in companies always take time. They were preparing for E3, preparing for a big patch. Are you really sure there’s an intent to deceive here? Or did a single line from a single FAQ get overlooked.
Remember how big this project is. Remember everything that’s going on at the company. This line appears in one single FAQ page, that’s it.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
I’m sorry but it’s really hard to believe how easily someone can try to belittle such a big issue that caused a lot of this rage and how many people it affected with legitimate reason to complain.
Anet is a company that has been running GW2 for 3 years let alone GW1, you really can’t belittle deception like this, no matter how much FAQs could have been overlooked.
I’m not belittling anything. Not even a little. I’m saying that you shouldn’t use the word deception unless you can prove intent. And if you can’t prove intent, and you just believe it without proof, you’re slandering a company. I edited for a living for long enough to know when the wrong word is used. Deception implies intent. If you’re telling me that at crunch time something like that couldn’t have been missed, I’m telling you now, you’re wrong. It is ENTIRELY possible for companies bigger or smaller to miss stuff like this. If you don’t believe it, you don’t have enough experience to comment. I’ve seen some very big companies make some very big mistakes. The Intel P5 mistake comes to mind off the top of my head. Not only did the ship a processor with a math function that didn’t work, but the refused to take it back at first, until social pressure forced them to. And Intel is a lot bigger than Anet.
You make a very good point, I do believe now that deception is the wrong word, but false advertising is not the wrong term to use.
All I was saying is don’t give Anet credit for something they have left out in the open (not addressed FAQ change for existing players) and don’t tell people “you don’t have enough experience to comment” where it is not your place to.
FAQs…
Lest We Forget
Lest We Forget
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Actuallly, I don’t agree with this. Deception implies the intent to deceive.
Do you know when the actual decision for this was made? Do you know at what point the people who made the decision at a high level communicated it down to a lower level, the guys who would actually edit the FAQ for example?
There are many things I’ve said that eventually turn out to be different, but that doesn’t mean I was trying to deceive anyone.
From what it looks to me, the original decision was to continue to sell the core game. There was likely other people who had other ideas in management, and eventually, at some point recently, it was decided that that wouldn’t be in the best interest of the company. So they decided to change it.
Changes in companies always take time. They were preparing for E3, preparing for a big patch. Are you really sure there’s an intent to deceive here? Or did a single line from a single FAQ get overlooked.
Remember how big this project is. Remember everything that’s going on at the company. This line appears in one single FAQ page, that’s it.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
I’m sorry but it’s really hard to believe how easily someone can try to belittle such a big issue that caused a lot of this rage and how many people it affected with legitimate reason to complain.
Anet is a company that has been running GW2 for 3 years let alone GW1, you really can’t belittle deception like this, no matter how much FAQs could have been overlooked.
I’m not belittling anything. Not even a little. I’m saying that you shouldn’t use the word deception unless you can prove intent. And if you can’t prove intent, and you just believe it without proof, you’re slandering a company. I edited for a living for long enough to know when the wrong word is used. Deception implies intent. If you’re telling me that at crunch time something like that couldn’t have been missed, I’m telling you now, you’re wrong. It is ENTIRELY possible for companies bigger or smaller to miss stuff like this. If you don’t believe it, you don’t have enough experience to comment. I’ve seen some very big companies make some very big mistakes. The Intel P5 mistake comes to mind off the top of my head. Not only did the ship a processor with a math function that didn’t work, but the refused to take it back at first, until social pressure forced them to. And Intel is a lot bigger than Anet.
You make a very good point, I do believe now that deception is the wrong word, but false advertising is not the wrong term to use.
All I was saying is don’t give Anet credit for something they have left out in the open (not addressed FAQ change for existing players) and don’t tell people “you don’t have enough experience to comment” where it is not your place to.
False advertising also implies intent. Changing your mind isn’t false advertising. Back in the day, I advertised something for a certain price. The ad for that item was in my regular ad in the papers for so long, I never bothered checking it. I had a million other things to do. I missed it.
The price of that item jumped in cost to us, so the price in the paper was less than I paid for it.
You can bet that I did everything I could not to sell that at that price. Not because I wanted to falsely advertise, but because I didn’t connect the price hike in my brain with the ad. Hell I didn’t even remember that item was in the ad until people came in for it.
When I told some people, naturally they accused me of lying and false advertising. It didn’t feel very good, and they were wrong. It was an oversight I corrected as soon as I discovered it.
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Actuallly, I don’t agree with this. Deception implies the intent to deceive.
Do you know when the actual decision for this was made? Do you know at what point the people who made the decision at a high level communicated it down to a lower level, the guys who would actually edit the FAQ for example?
There are many things I’ve said that eventually turn out to be different, but that doesn’t mean I was trying to deceive anyone.
From what it looks to me, the original decision was to continue to sell the core game. There was likely other people who had other ideas in management, and eventually, at some point recently, it was decided that that wouldn’t be in the best interest of the company. So they decided to change it.
Changes in companies always take time. They were preparing for E3, preparing for a big patch. Are you really sure there’s an intent to deceive here? Or did a single line from a single FAQ get overlooked.
Remember how big this project is. Remember everything that’s going on at the company. This line appears in one single FAQ page, that’s it.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
I’m sorry but it’s really hard to believe how easily someone can try to belittle such a big issue that caused a lot of this rage and how many people it affected with legitimate reason to complain.
Anet is a company that has been running GW2 for 3 years let alone GW1, you really can’t belittle deception like this, no matter how much FAQs could have been overlooked.
I’m not belittling anything. Not even a little. I’m saying that you shouldn’t use the word deception unless you can prove intent. And if you can’t prove intent, and you just believe it without proof, you’re slandering a company. I edited for a living for long enough to know when the wrong word is used. Deception implies intent. If you’re telling me that at crunch time something like that couldn’t have been missed, I’m telling you now, you’re wrong. It is ENTIRELY possible for companies bigger or smaller to miss stuff like this. If you don’t believe it, you don’t have enough experience to comment. I’ve seen some very big companies make some very big mistakes. The Intel P5 mistake comes to mind off the top of my head. Not only did the ship a processor with a math function that didn’t work, but the refused to take it back at first, until social pressure forced them to. And Intel is a lot bigger than Anet.
You make a very good point, I do believe now that deception is the wrong word, but false advertising is not the wrong term to use.
All I was saying is don’t give Anet credit for something they have left out in the open (not addressed FAQ change for existing players) and don’t tell people “you don’t have enough experience to comment” where it is not your place to.
False advertising also implies intent. Changing your mind isn’t false advertising. Back in the day, I advertised something for a certain price. The ad for that item was in my regular ad in the papers for so long, I never bothered checking it. I had a million other things to do. I missed it.
The price of that item jumped in cost to us, so the price in the paper was less than I paid for it.
You can bet that I did everything I could not to sell that at that price. Not because I wanted to falsely advertise, but because I didn’t connect the price hike in my brain with the ad. Hell I didn’t even remember that item was in the ad until people came in for it.
When I told some people, naturally they accused me of lying and false advertising. It didn’t feel very good, and they were wrong. It was an oversight I corrected as soon as I discovered it.
Alright, alright, white knight Anet if you must but my choice of words does not change the problem that was cause for me and many others in the FAQ issue.
What if it was/is intentional? I am not saying that it is intentional but you also cannot know for sure.
FAQs…
Lest We Forget
Lest We Forget
I snip.
snip
Actuallly, I don’t agree with this. Deception implies the intent to deceive.
Do you know when the actual decision for this was made? Do you know at what point the people who made the decision at a high level communicated it down to a lower level, the guys who would actually edit the FAQ for example?
There are many things I’ve said that eventually turn out to be different, but that doesn’t mean I was trying to deceive anyone.
From what it looks to me, the original decision was to continue to sell the core game. There was likely other people who had other ideas in management, and eventually, at some point recently, it was decided that that wouldn’t be in the best interest of the company. So they decided to change it.
Changes in companies always take time. They were preparing for E3, preparing for a big patch. Are you really sure there’s an intent to deceive here? Or did a single line from a single FAQ get overlooked.
Remember how big this project is. Remember everything that’s going on at the company. This line appears in one single FAQ page, that’s it.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
I’m sorry but it’s really hard to believe how easily someone can try to belittle such a big issue that caused a lot of this rage and how many people it affected with legitimate reason to complain.
Anet is a company that has been running GW2 for 3 years let alone GW1, you really can’t belittle deception like this, no matter how much FAQs could have been overlooked.
I’m not belittling anything. Not even a little. I’m saying that you shouldn’t use the word deception unless you can prove intent. And if you can’t prove intent, and you just believe it without proof, you’re slandering a company. I edited for a living for long enough to know when the wrong word is used. Deception implies intent. If you’re telling me that at crunch time something like that couldn’t have been missed, I’m telling you now, you’re wrong. It is ENTIRELY possible for companies bigger or smaller to miss stuff like this. If you don’t believe it, you don’t have enough experience to comment. I’ve seen some very big companies make some very big mistakes. The Intel P5 mistake comes to mind off the top of my head. Not only did the ship a processor with a math function that didn’t work, but the refused to take it back at first, until social pressure forced them to. And Intel is a lot bigger than Anet.
You make a very good point, I do believe now that deception is the wrong word, but false advertising is not the wrong term to use.
All I was saying is don’t give Anet credit for something they have left out in the open (not addressed FAQ change for existing players) and don’t tell people “you don’t have enough experience to comment” where it is not your place to.
False advertising also implies intent. Changing your mind isn’t false advertising. Back in the day, I advertised something for a certain price. The ad for that item was in my regular ad in the papers for so long, I never bothered checking it. I had a million other things to do. I missed it.
The price of that item jumped in cost to us, so the price in the paper was less than I paid for it.
You can bet that I did everything I could not to sell that at that price. Not because I wanted to falsely advertise, but because I didn’t connect the price hike in my brain with the ad. Hell I didn’t even remember that item was in the ad until people came in for it.
When I told some people, naturally they accused me of lying and false advertising. It didn’t feel very good, and they were wrong. It was an oversight I corrected as soon as I discovered it.
Alright, alright, white knight Anet if you must but my choice of words does not change the problem that was cause for me and many others in the FAQ issue.
What if it was/is intentional? I am not saying that it is intentional but you also cannot know for sure.
The issue then can be dealt with. Anet is offering people refunds. And in some cases, anyway, it seems progress isn’t lost. That’s what someone has posted on reddit anyway.
So if it’s not intentional, and Anet will stand behind it, it’s time to send a support letter to customer service and get it worked out.
Because I can guarantee you that possibly falsely accusing a company of false advertising isn’t going to help you and it isn’t going to get that company on side. Deal politely and fairly with customer service and people who bought it recently will most likely receive help.
It’s better to light a single candle than curse the darkness.
I snip.
snip
Actuallly, I don’t agree with this. Deception implies the intent to deceive.
Do you know when the actual decision for this was made? Do you know at what point the people who made the decision at a high level communicated it down to a lower level, the guys who would actually edit the FAQ for example?
There are many things I’ve said that eventually turn out to be different, but that doesn’t mean I was trying to deceive anyone.
From what it looks to me, the original decision was to continue to sell the core game. There was likely other people who had other ideas in management, and eventually, at some point recently, it was decided that that wouldn’t be in the best interest of the company. So they decided to change it.
Changes in companies always take time. They were preparing for E3, preparing for a big patch. Are you really sure there’s an intent to deceive here? Or did a single line from a single FAQ get overlooked.
Remember how big this project is. Remember everything that’s going on at the company. This line appears in one single FAQ page, that’s it.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
I’m sorry but it’s really hard to believe how easily someone can try to belittle such a big issue that caused a lot of this rage and how many people it affected with legitimate reason to complain.
Anet is a company that has been running GW2 for 3 years let alone GW1, you really can’t belittle deception like this, no matter how much FAQs could have been overlooked.
I’m not belittling anything. Not even a little. I’m saying that you shouldn’t use the word deception unless you can prove intent. And if you can’t prove intent, and you just believe it without proof, you’re slandering a company. I edited for a living for long enough to know when the wrong word is used. Deception implies intent. If you’re telling me that at crunch time something like that couldn’t have been missed, I’m telling you now, you’re wrong. It is ENTIRELY possible for companies bigger or smaller to miss stuff like this. If you don’t believe it, you don’t have enough experience to comment. I’ve seen some very big companies make some very big mistakes. The Intel P5 mistake comes to mind off the top of my head. Not only did the ship a processor with a math function that didn’t work, but the refused to take it back at first, until social pressure forced them to. And Intel is a lot bigger than Anet.
You make a very good point, I do believe now that deception is the wrong word, but false advertising is not the wrong term to use.
All I was saying is don’t give Anet credit for something they have left out in the open (not addressed FAQ change for existing players) and don’t tell people “you don’t have enough experience to comment” where it is not your place to.
False advertising also implies intent. Changing your mind isn’t false advertising. Back in the day, I advertised something for a certain price. The ad for that item was in my regular ad in the papers for so long, I never bothered checking it. I had a million other things to do. I missed it.
The price of that item jumped in cost to us, so the price in the paper was less than I paid for it.
You can bet that I did everything I could not to sell that at that price. Not because I wanted to falsely advertise, but because I didn’t connect the price hike in my brain with the ad. Hell I didn’t even remember that item was in the ad until people came in for it.
When I told some people, naturally they accused me of lying and false advertising. It didn’t feel very good, and they were wrong. It was an oversight I corrected as soon as I discovered it.
Alright, alright, white knight Anet if you must but my choice of words does not change the problem that was cause for me and many others in the FAQ issue.
What if it was/is intentional? I am not saying that it is intentional but you also cannot know for sure.
So if it’s not intentional, and Anet will stand behind it, it’s time to send a support letter to customer service and get it worked out.
Because I can guarantee you that possibly falsely accusing a company of false advertising isn’t going to help you and it isn’t going to get that company on side. Deal politely and fairly with customer service and people who bought it recently will most likely receive help.
It’s better to light a single candle than curse the darkness.
I lit the candle and Anet blew it out, even after asking for some compensation via FAQ edit, nothing was done.
FAQs…
Lest We Forget
Lest We Forget
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Again you can’t prove it’s deceptive until you can prove intent. And it wasn’t even advertising it was a FAQ for a game that wasn’t out yet. Oversights aren’t illegal, they’re not even immoral.
So unless you have proof of actual intent, all you can say is they screwed up. Otherwise, you’re using language as a weapon. And frankly it doesn’t need to be used that way unless you can prove intent.
I snip.
snip
snip
From what it looks to me, the original decision was to continue to sell the core game. There was likely other people who had other ideas in management, and eventually, at some point recently, it was decided that that wouldn’t be in the best interest of the company. So they decided to change it.
Changes in companies always take time. They were preparing for E3, preparing for a big patch. Are you really sure there’s an intent to deceive here? Or did a single line from a single FAQ get overlooked.
Remember how big this project is. Remember everything that’s going on at the company. This line appears in one single FAQ page, that’s it.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
I’m sorry but it’s really hard to believe how easily someone can try to belittle such a big issue that caused a lot of this rage and how many people it affected with legitimate reason to complain.
Anet is a company that has been running GW2 for 3 years let alone GW1, you really can’t belittle deception like this, no matter how much FAQs could have been overlooked.
I’m not belittling anything. Not even a little. I’m saying that you shouldn’t use the word deception unless you can prove intent. And if you can’t prove intent, and you just believe it without proof, you’re slandering a company. I edited for a living for long enough to know when the wrong word is used. Deception implies intent. If you’re telling me that at crunch time something like that couldn’t have been missed, I’m telling you now, you’re wrong. It is ENTIRELY possible for companies bigger or smaller to miss stuff like this. If you don’t believe it, you don’t have enough experience to comment. I’ve seen some very big companies make some very big mistakes. The Intel P5 mistake comes to mind off the top of my head. Not only did the ship a processor with a math function that didn’t work, but the refused to take it back at first, until social pressure forced them to. And Intel is a lot bigger than Anet.
You make a very good point, I do believe now that deception is the wrong word, but false advertising is not the wrong term to use.
All I was saying is don’t give Anet credit for something they have left out in the open (not addressed FAQ change for existing players) and don’t tell people “you don’t have enough experience to comment” where it is not your place to.
False advertising also implies intent. Changing your mind isn’t false advertising. Back in the day, I advertised something for a certain price. The ad for that item was in my regular ad in the papers for so long, I never bothered checking it. I had a million other things to do. I missed it.
The price of that item jumped in cost to us, so the price in the paper was less than I paid for it.
You can bet that I did everything I could not to sell that at that price. Not because I wanted to falsely advertise, but because I didn’t connect the price hike in my brain with the ad. Hell I didn’t even remember that item was in the ad until people came in for it.
When I told some people, naturally they accused me of lying and false advertising. It didn’t feel very good, and they were wrong. It was an oversight I corrected as soon as I discovered it.
Alright, alright, white knight Anet if you must but my choice of words does not change the problem that was cause for me and many others in the FAQ issue.
What if it was/is intentional? I am not saying that it is intentional but you also cannot know for sure.
So if it’s not intentional, and Anet will stand behind it, it’s time to send a support letter to customer service and get it worked out.
Because I can guarantee you that possibly falsely accusing a company of false advertising isn’t going to help you and it isn’t going to get that company on side. Deal politely and fairly with customer service and people who bought it recently will most likely receive help.
It’s better to light a single candle than curse the darkness.
I lit the candle and Anet blew it out, even after asking for some compensation via FAQ edit, nothing was done.
Without seeing your post to Anet I can’t say, but at least some people have gotten results with customer service.
I agree that Anet marketing department didn’t really think that part though. They should have made a decision earlier and communicated it more clearly. It is also true that they seem to lack competence in the PR department, which did bit them in the past. Something for the management to learn from. Such mistakes can be costly.
That said, most of the folks here are behaving like pre-pubertary kids without an ounce of brain. Which they probably are. If you bought the base game recently, return it and get the HoT. Including the base game with HoT is a very customer-friendly move by Anet and something most other MMOs could learn from. All this ‘but I’m a veteran and all these noobs get it for free’ whine is childish and dumb. You all should be ashamed of yourself.
I bough GW2 before it was released and because I am busy with my work, I have only played it for several hundred hours, if at all. I am still very happy with my purchase. And I have pre-purchased HoT, because I think the new changes and content will improve the game tremendously. I am not even sure that I will play the thing because I just don’t have time. But this is a very good product and I want to support the company.
(edited by green plum.7514)
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Again you can’t prove it’s deceptive until you can prove intent. And it wasn’t even advertising it was a FAQ for a game that wasn’t out yet. Oversights aren’t illegal, they’re not even immoral.
So unless you have proof of actual intent, all you can say is they screwed up. Otherwise, you’re using language as a weapon. And frankly it doesn’t need to be used that way unless you can prove intent.
from the buy page —Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns expansion(includes Guild Wars 2 core game)
Since buying this makes the core games magically merge, by all means explain how two core versions of the same game in one account?
Bender the offender – Proud violator of 17 safe spaces –
I snip.
snip
snip
From what it looks to me, the original decision was to continue to sell the core game. There was likely other people who had other ideas in management, and eventually, at some point recently, it was decided that that wouldn’t be in the best interest of the company. So they decided to change it.
Changes in companies always take time. They were preparing for E3, preparing for a big patch. Are you really sure there’s an intent to deceive here? Or did a single line from a single FAQ get overlooked.
Remember how big this project is. Remember everything that’s going on at the company. This line appears in one single FAQ page, that’s it.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
I’m sorry but it’s really hard to believe how easily someone can try to belittle such a big issue that caused a lot of this rage and how many people it affected with legitimate reason to complain.
Anet is a company that has been running GW2 for 3 years let alone GW1, you really can’t belittle deception like this, no matter how much FAQs could have been overlooked.
I’m not belittling anything. Not even a little. I’m saying that you shouldn’t use the word deception unless you can prove intent. And if you can’t prove intent, and you just believe it without proof, you’re slandering a company. I edited for a living for long enough to know when the wrong word is used. Deception implies intent. If you’re telling me that at crunch time something like that couldn’t have been missed, I’m telling you now, you’re wrong. It is ENTIRELY possible for companies bigger or smaller to miss stuff like this. If you don’t believe it, you don’t have enough experience to comment. I’ve seen some very big companies make some very big mistakes. The Intel P5 mistake comes to mind off the top of my head. Not only did the ship a processor with a math function that didn’t work, but the refused to take it back at first, until social pressure forced them to. And Intel is a lot bigger than Anet.
You make a very good point, I do believe now that deception is the wrong word, but false advertising is not the wrong term to use.
All I was saying is don’t give Anet credit for something they have left out in the open (not addressed FAQ change for existing players) and don’t tell people “you don’t have enough experience to comment” where it is not your place to.
False advertising also implies intent. Changing your mind isn’t false advertising. Back in the day, I advertised something for a certain price. The ad for that item was in my regular ad in the papers for so long, I never bothered checking it. I had a million other things to do. I missed it.
The price of that item jumped in cost to us, so the price in the paper was less than I paid for it.
You can bet that I did everything I could not to sell that at that price. Not because I wanted to falsely advertise, but because I didn’t connect the price hike in my brain with the ad. Hell I didn’t even remember that item was in the ad until people came in for it.
When I told some people, naturally they accused me of lying and false advertising. It didn’t feel very good, and they were wrong. It was an oversight I corrected as soon as I discovered it.
Alright, alright, white knight Anet if you must but my choice of words does not change the problem that was cause for me and many others in the FAQ issue.
What if it was/is intentional? I am not saying that it is intentional but you also cannot know for sure.
So if it’s not intentional, and Anet will stand behind it, it’s time to send a support letter to customer service and get it worked out.
Because I can guarantee you that possibly falsely accusing a company of false advertising isn’t going to help you and it isn’t going to get that company on side. Deal politely and fairly with customer service and people who bought it recently will most likely receive help.
It’s better to light a single candle than curse the darkness.
I lit the candle and Anet blew it out, even after asking for some compensation via FAQ edit, nothing was done.
Without seeing your post to Anet I can’t say, but at least some people have gotten results with customer service.
You don’t have any reason to trust anyone on the internet including me, but if you open your mind just a crack, is there not a provided chance that the customer service was blunt and unhelpful in my situation?
FAQs…
Lest We Forget
Lest We Forget
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Again you can’t prove it’s deceptive until you can prove intent. And it wasn’t even advertising it was a FAQ for a game that wasn’t out yet. Oversights aren’t illegal, they’re not even immoral.
So unless you have proof of actual intent, all you can say is they screwed up. Otherwise, you’re using language as a weapon. And frankly it doesn’t need to be used that way unless you can prove intent.
from the buy page —Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns expansion(includes Guild Wars 2 core game)
Since buying this makes the core games magically merge, by all means explain how two core versions of the same game in one account?
Let’s go over this one more time in slow motion.
Anet had a FAQ up that said that you need to buy Guild Wars 2 to play HoT. Everyone should know this by now.
Now it’s possible that Anet knew all along that this was not the case, but I don’t believe that, and I doubt anyone can prove it. It’s just as easy to believe that sometimes after that FAQ was posted, meetings were held, arguments were had, and a side one that didn’t want to sell the original game separately for whatever reason.
This happened at a time when huge expansions were going into the game, when E3 was coming up, when everyone was running around in circles. So when the decision was changed, and it may very well have been changed the week before E3 for all we know, no one got to changing the FAQ.
The may have been an attempt at deceit, but just as likely it slipped through the cracks. It’s not like it’s printed on the Guild Wars 2 buy page or anything. It was an a FAQ for a game that wasn’t out yet.
So as soon as Anet realize it was wrong, it was changed, which is what I would have done.
I snip.
snip
snip
From what it looks to me, the original decision was to continue to sell the core game. There was likely other people who had other ideas in management, and eventually, at some point recently, it was decided that that wouldn’t be in the best interest of the company. So they decided to change it.
Changes in companies always take time. They were preparing for E3, preparing for a big patch. Are you really sure there’s an intent to deceive here? Or did a single line from a single FAQ get overlooked.
Remember how big this project is. Remember everything that’s going on at the company. This line appears in one single FAQ page, that’s it.
Is it really so hard to believe it was overlooked in the rush to get everything done?
I’m sorry but it’s really hard to believe how easily someone can try to belittle such a big issue that caused a lot of this rage and how many people it affected with legitimate reason to complain.
Anet is a company that has been running GW2 for 3 years let alone GW1, you really can’t belittle deception like this, no matter how much FAQs could have been overlooked.
snip
You make a very good point, I do believe now that deception is the wrong word, but false advertising is not the wrong term to use.
All I was saying is don’t give Anet credit for something they have left out in the open (not addressed FAQ change for existing players) and don’t tell people “you don’t have enough experience to comment” where it is not your place to.
False advertising also implies intent. Changing your mind isn’t false advertising. Back in the day, I advertised something for a certain price. The ad for that item was in my regular ad in the papers for so long, I never bothered checking it. I had a million other things to do. I missed it.
The price of that item jumped in cost to us, so the price in the paper was less than I paid for it.
You can bet that I did everything I could not to sell that at that price. Not because I wanted to falsely advertise, but because I didn’t connect the price hike in my brain with the ad. Hell I didn’t even remember that item was in the ad until people came in for it.
When I told some people, naturally they accused me of lying and false advertising. It didn’t feel very good, and they were wrong. It was an oversight I corrected as soon as I discovered it.
Alright, alright, white knight Anet if you must but my choice of words does not change the problem that was cause for me and many others in the FAQ issue.
What if it was/is intentional? I am not saying that it is intentional but you also cannot know for sure.
So if it’s not intentional, and Anet will stand behind it, it’s time to send a support letter to customer service and get it worked out.
Because I can guarantee you that possibly falsely accusing a company of false advertising isn’t going to help you and it isn’t going to get that company on side. Deal politely and fairly with customer service and people who bought it recently will most likely receive help.
It’s better to light a single candle than curse the darkness.
I lit the candle and Anet blew it out, even after asking for some compensation via FAQ edit, nothing was done.
Without seeing your post to Anet I can’t say, but at least some people have gotten results with customer service.
You don’t have any reason to trust anyone on the internet including me, but if you open your mind just a crack, is there not a provided chance that the customer service was blunt and unhelpful in my situation?
Sure, I had a couple of run ins with customer service, and they were unhelpful and I went back and tried again, with more detail or more tact and I got the result I wanted. I’m not saying you’re lying. I’m saying other people claim they’ve achieved results.
You are missing the main point here, please understand that people are upset as a result and everyone affected by this have not been compensated for it.
FAQs…
Lest We Forget
Lest We Forget
Ok Vayne. You make excelent points, and I agree with you at some stuff.
I definately don’t have a degree in law, but what you are saying to me is basically “unless you work at Anet, or have an employee with you to prove it, you have nothing”.
So, what could a consumer do in that case? Since by your logic he has absolutely nothing, just continue pushing support until they refund him?
I’ve seen people saying they had success, I’ve seen others saying they got nothing, I’ve seen others saying they had to push and push, until things worked. Is that how we as consumers should accept things?
Some times it works, some times it doesn’t? Just because it was 10$ it’s ok to treat the situation lightly?
My logic is, I’ve seen companies run ads for television saying “Hey, pay what you want for this product” and then all you could choose was how many payments to make, taken to the law, people won products paying as little as a dollar.
Yeah, they had no intent to deceive, it was an oversight, but mistake or not, the campaign said something and that wasn’t true. It’s the same here, they said something, and that is no longer true.
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Again you can’t prove it’s deceptive until you can prove intent. And it wasn’t even advertising it was a FAQ for a game that wasn’t out yet. Oversights aren’t illegal, they’re not even immoral.
So unless you have proof of actual intent, all you can say is they screwed up. Otherwise, you’re using language as a weapon. And frankly it doesn’t need to be used that way unless you can prove intent.
from the buy page —Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns expansion(includes Guild Wars 2 core game)
Since buying this makes the core games magically merge, by all means explain how two core versions of the same game in one account?
Let’s go over this one more time in slow motion.
Anet had a FAQ up that said that you need to buy Guild Wars 2 to play HoT. Everyone should know this by now.
Now it’s possible that Anet knew all along that this was not the case, but I don’t believe that, and I doubt anyone can prove it. It’s just as easy to believe that sometimes after that FAQ was posted, meetings were held, arguments were had, and a side one that didn’t want to sell the original game separately for whatever reason.
This happened at a time when huge expansions were going into the game, when E3 was coming up, when everyone was running around in circles. So when the decision was changed, and it may very well have been changed the week before E3 for all we know, no one got to changing the FAQ.
The may have been an attempt at deceit, but just as likely it slipped through the cracks. It’s not like it’s printed on the Guild Wars 2 buy page or anything. It was an a FAQ for a game that wasn’t out yet.
So as soon as Anet realize it was wrong, it was changed, which is what I would have done.
you really believe that a AAA company after months of planning made such a silly error? because they definitely haven’t tried to scam the player base before by re-skining an exist armor – getting called out on it and then replacing it with another re-skinned armor.
Maybe you can answer this for the round table of white knights – What does it really matter to you if existing players are asking for a cheaper base expansion price? how does that affect you in the long run?
Bender the offender – Proud violator of 17 safe spaces –
I think the OP needs to go get a law degree before making claims like this. This would never go to court. Anet is offering refunds to people, and a FAQ for an unreleased game wouldn’t be considered advertising anyway.
Even if it isn’t technically illegal, it doesn’t change what Anet did. Semantics aside, Anet engaged in highly deceptive advertising. As for the refunds, they’re being done manually and you’ll lose all progress. They aren’t going to compensate everyone who got burned.
Again you can’t prove it’s deceptive until you can prove intent. And it wasn’t even advertising it was a FAQ for a game that wasn’t out yet. Oversights aren’t illegal, they’re not even immoral.
So unless you have proof of actual intent, all you can say is they screwed up. Otherwise, you’re using language as a weapon. And frankly it doesn’t need to be used that way unless you can prove intent.
from the buy page —Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns expansion(includes Guild Wars 2 core game)
Since buying this makes the core games magically merge, by all means explain how two core versions of the same game in one account?
Let’s go over this one more time in slow motion.
Anet had a FAQ up that said that you need to buy Guild Wars 2 to play HoT. Everyone should know this by now.
Now it’s possible that Anet knew all along that this was not the case, but I don’t believe that, and I doubt anyone can prove it. It’s just as easy to believe that sometimes after that FAQ was posted, meetings were held, arguments were had, and a side one that didn’t want to sell the original game separately for whatever reason.
This happened at a time when huge expansions were going into the game, when E3 was coming up, when everyone was running around in circles. So when the decision was changed, and it may very well have been changed the week before E3 for all we know, no one got to changing the FAQ.
The may have been an attempt at deceit, but just as likely it slipped through the cracks. It’s not like it’s printed on the Guild Wars 2 buy page or anything. It was an a FAQ for a game that wasn’t out yet.
So as soon as Anet realize it was wrong, it was changed, which is what I would have done.
you really believe that a AAA company after months of planning made such a silly error? because they definitely haven’t tried to scam the player base before by re-skining an exist armor – getting called out on it and then replacing it with another re-skinned armor.
Maybe you can answer this for the round table of white knights – What does it really matter to you if existing players are asking for a cheaper base expansion price? how does that affect you in the long run?
Of course I believe it. How the hell did Intel which is a bigger company, release a pentium chip with a major mathematical flaw in it and then refuse to take it back. Big companies have errors all the time. Sometimes it’s even easier in bigger companies.
A lot depends on how busy people are, how understaffed, how many people are doing different jobs. Anyone that’s worked for big companies, knows weird stuff gets missed. Particularly when you’re on a breakneck pace schedule.
Ok Vayne. You make excelent points, and I agree with you at some stuff.
I definately don’t have a degree in law, but what you are saying to me is basically “unless you work at Anet, or have an employee with you to prove it, you have nothing”.
So, what could a consumer do in that case? Since by your logic he has absolutely nothing, just continue pushing support until they refund him?
I’ve seen people saying they had success, I’ve seen others saying they got nothing, I’ve seen others saying they had to push and push, until things worked. Is that how we as consumers should accept things?
Some times it works, some times it doesn’t? Just because it was 10$ it’s ok to treat the situation lightly?
My logic is, I’ve seen companies run ads for television saying “Hey, pay what you want for this product” and then all you could choose was how many payments to make, taken to the law, people won products paying as little as a dollar.
Yeah, they had no intent to deceive, it was an oversight, but mistake or not, the campaign said something and that wasn’t true. It’s the same here, they said something, and that is no longer true.
Yes they messed up, yes they are doing what they can to give rebates. They will come out with a statement next week I am sure. Yes a core group will still be flipping out. I am also fairly sure that additions will be made to all levels of pre-order, not a precursor for all as I am sure at least one person will write is minimum but probably the beta tab we get will be permanent instead of removed on release.
Anet has done nothing for people who did not have the purchase within 30 days, but were none the less misled by the FAQ.
I can understand @Vayne that you feel the need to defend and/or white knight Anet but you can’t just lightly place the mislead and lack of compensation for customers in my situation. What happened with the FAQ was not dealt with properly and I can’t see how you would say otherwise.
They changed it and offered no compensation, not even an apology to people that they could ‘not help’.
FAQs…
Lest We Forget
Lest We Forget
Well XeoShock, sorry you weren’t helped, I really do understand your frustration.
But I think we’lll get a statement from Anet after they figure out how to fix it, and people just aren’t willing to wait for that statement. Next week some time, probably after the update.
Thank you but you really do sound like an employee of Anet.
FAQs…
Lest We Forget
Lest We Forget
Core of the problem: False Advertising.
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Hybarf Tics.2048
The real problem is that they have not revealed $50 worth of content… so far we have seen $15-20 worth…
Exactly this. And please don’t even mention Guild Halls when they were supposed to be part of GW 2’s release.