Guild Wars 2

I think so.

If they added raids without the expansion. It would have been awesome.

You guys already know the issues, don’t need to explain.

No.

most definitely not. in fact despite its flaws (many i might add which have been fixed by now) the expansion saved GW2

Nope, the core game remains untouched (however Anet has released small lore events every 2 weeks for now). If anything it added things to the game.

I really don’t think adding only raids without something else would have been profitable….If they had done this, they would have lost time making sure that the most casual extreme laid back player would have been able to complete the raids. I prefer options in a more challenging content and I think it is awesome that they ramped up the difficulty in open world (crossing my fingers for more in the next living story update) because I am really not into completing the raids so far. Granted, the balance was a bit off at the beginning but it really is a trillion times far from being a waste of resources

For the 9 months of virtually no content pre-HoT plus the issues with HoT we lived with for 6 months did shrink the community.

I think the April update fixed a lot of the issues with HoT as well as reverse some decisions they unilaterally made. And I think we are seeing a lot of players returning.

Plus HoT gave us gliding in core Tyria which is AWESOME!!

Nope, not ruined at all. Still enjoying playing all parts of the game and I have been playing pretty much every day since Beta over 3 yrs ago. I still have not run out of things to do and doubt that I will.

Nah, the only thing that made me exhausted of gw2 and made me take a few months break was building a legendary tbh. And now I’m back!

No.
Without Heart of Thorns I wouldn’t be playing the game these days.

I stopped playing because I didn’t have the expansion (could not afford it at the time, not because I didn’t want it). When I was gifted it as a birthday present I came back, and have enjoyed my time a lot. So much stuff I can go and solo, so many things I can go and join in on without having to find a group.

And then the April update made it even better. And with more raids being added, I’ve noticed more raid guilds looking for people, or guilds running more raids (I only recently got into GW2 raids).

No.

Never interested in raid, elite spec and extended story line is what i buy HoT for. As long as each extension provide more story and more elite spec, i am game.

I lack the perspective to truly understand what you mean by “ruined the game”. I started playing GW2 this year. HoT introduced me to maps like nothing I’ve seen before in this game or any other. The events are great, the visuals are gorgeous, but what I can’t get over is the complexity of these environments. From my perspective, HoT map design is a huge improvement over the core maps. I’m also really enjoying gliding, elite specs, and raids.

I appreciated the ease of content in the starter maps. It allowed me to learn the basics. But I don’t feel as if the difficulty increased much at all until nearly level 80. Many of the enemies seemed pitifully slow and responded poorly to movement (circling, moving in and out of melee range, kiting, etc.). These movement tricks still work well in HoT, but the enemies move faster, hit harder, and there tend to be more of them.

I also much prefer events to hearts, and noticed that events seem far more prevalent in higher level zones. The HoT event-based maps were perfect for me.

Having said that, I really dislike the megaserver system. I enjoy running around the jungle solo. There’s plenty of loot and I’m capable enough to solo most events or at least hang in there until backup arrives. But what I’d really like to be able to do is just zone in to an HoT map with the reasonable expectation that it will fill up with people and we’ll start knocking out events. My biggest frustration with these maps is that I can’t just start playing and expect to get anywhere.

The only other issue I have is a question of development resources. I’m too new to really know the time frame for development in this game. From reading the forums, players here have very diverse interests and ANet seems unable to satisfy them all. So, my concern given the many negative responses to the content I appear to enjoy most is obviously when can I expect to see more of it?

Four amazing maps. But only four. When will there be more? I’d love to see others like TD and VB, but many players I talk to strongly disagree.

The game was badly in need of both new things to do and new ways to play existing characters. So, no, not ruined. The mistakes they did make — and my list might be very different from yours — simply meant less profit for them.

Tzozef.9841:

I think so.

If they added raids without the expansion. It would have been awesome.

You guys already know the issues, don’t need to explain.

So raids with the expansions are terrible but same raids without it awesome. makes sense.

Nope HoT was awsome but GW2 need lot more events,maybe LS spoil me but I want new/recycle event each month

HoT is absolutely amazing quality wise , in every aspect of HoT was done really well and enjoyable at least to me. The problem with HoT is that it lacks quantity, and it would have been fine if they release content quickly after HoT drops to make up for it. But we are closing in on a year now without content drop outside of raid, Like really Anet?

NO, cause I now have autoloot and don’t have to worry about picking stuff up.

Good environments, artwork, sound, skills. Some masteries are nice too.
Just should have been priced like an xpac, as much of the content is “grindy bloat”. I’m going to use that term now often. “Grindy Bloat”.

Not ruined for me. As a open world PvE only player (I don’t WvW, raid, and only fractal sometimes), I’m totally enjoying Heart of Thorns.

I really don’t understand where all these doom and gloom threads come from.

No. You still have your core game to puddle around in if you don’t like the HoT maps.

How could anything that brought us gliding and auto loot possibly be wrong?

No. There are some things to learn from HoT for sure, but to say it’s ruined Guild Wars 2 is going a bit far.

Considering I bought HoT for elite specizalations I’m ok with it. I think the new maps personally are horrible though the way they were designed. Only really like the meta on verdant brink

I think the mastery system was good and bad. Good because it’s something to do, bad because I found getting mastery points on top of the xp kinda dumb. Won’t ever max anything because of that

I think once we get ls3 things will be better and the April update was nice

HoT is the start of moving PvE toward skill progression.

No, it is not a failure, though it can be improved.

The way it was launched as vastly unfinished unpolished with trillions of bugs, with new classes and specializations that made pvp’ers scream high and loud and all the nerfings as a result of that – I have to say yes. Not to mention how it destroyed megaserver with infinate mapchanging offers to yet an even more barren map.

Prior to the expac the game was thriving with a community worth the name. Lots of players out there. Now maps are mostly empty unless daily events are on that map. HoT maps apart from one copy of meta event are now also showing the same signs.
The main gathering squares in cities like Divinty’s Reach and Lions Arch were full of players – now only a few hang around. I’m curious how many have left the game.

When the expac dropped players changed the way they play. Stressed out by hunting both masterypoints and collections you hardly saw anyone taking their time to rez a downed/defeated player. Many have already said it but I concur; the fun went out the window with HoT and like the others I can’t really put my finger on why – just a feeling that came on launch day.

Graphically and compositionwise the new maps are well done though personally I’m not fond of Metroidvania style. Events are too long and boring the grind for points and collections are not a game, it’s labour plain and simple.

In hindsight I could have passed on Heart of Thorns. ArenaNet used to be much better coming out with new interesting and fun events and festivals.

HoT has done nothing but make the game much, much better in every way.

The only thing to really suffer is PVP, but it’s still really good and fun(imo).

No, it’s put the game on the path to where it needs to go. It hasn’t fixed everything but it’s a right direction.

Tzozef.9841:

I think so.

If they added raids without the expansion. It would have been awesome.

You guys already know the issues, don’t need to explain.

It would have been boring and of no use for a large majority of people who were waiting for new PvE stuff that does not require min maxing of gear and skill rotation. It´s bad enough that Anet thinks that it is ok to hide story and exclusive stuff behind raids, but I surely would not have bought an expansion to raid.

HoT maps were harsh, hard to navigate, unrewarding, full of filler stuff, rather small but not unbeatable. Anet removed the first and third point, so they are reacting to player numbers I guess.

Anyone who really believes that it ruined the game has probably left…

Yes, big time waste of money and terrible how they force mechanics into it so you’re almost forced to purchase it and use it.

no, but it drove away a good portion of the veteran players, and replaced them with F2Pers
so, they will have a community , that is even more divided , when the next xpac is
released
it was their choice, and this was the consequence

Well, in my humble opinion, it didn’t help the game.

Added too little content and more stagnation afterwards.

We are back to the main problem of GW2, it is just not going anywhere.

Shiyo.3578:

HoT has done nothing but make the game much, much better in every way.

The only thing to really suffer is PVP, but it’s still really good and fun(imo).

hot managed to shrink and divide one of the nicest communities in the history of mmos
i get, that you like it , but it was really bad for this game
they basically took raid content, and used it in the “open world”
they have already nerfed it once, but its still raid content
and the maps..they look awesome, but playing them feels like a clinch with a horny vampire
no fun..no more money

Heart of Thorns most certainly ruined Guild Wars 2.

HoT itself not (it´s great), but grinding Mastery points did it for me. Have todo too much unwated achievments or adventure for them.

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Well, in my humble opinion, it didn’t help the game.

Added too little content and more stagnation afterwards.

We are back to the main problem of GW2, it is just not going anywhere.

“horisontal progression”..it just doesnt work for many casuals
level scaling didnt help in the long term either
they can still save it, but they have to change direction

No, it’s the opposite.

With HOT, the devs could finally understand some design problems:
- playing metamap (PvE) is completely different from a dev (mono)server that on a prod (mega)server
- PvP build diversity is not adding specialization
- WvW is a unique game mode in its own and not just guilds’ PvP
- …

Many players had already reported this problems years ago and most players find that the solutions don’t come quickly enough.
April Update is an attempt to stop the hemorrhage, but some problems are so deeply rooted in the code that it may take time and ANET has any interest to treat well its communication on these problems (if possible avoid the last year VeteranGate)

It did not “ruin” the game, but did it “hurt” the game?
Yes, the original HoT release did hurt the game in quite a few aspects, that dampened the excitement about the things they added with the expansion.

e.g.:
>> guild progression: GHs are (even after the April update trying to balance Scribing) awful to upgrade and have fun with for small guilds, especially for those who played WvW.
>> the ruin of normal crafting: GH upgrades and precursor crafting (as good as it is eliminating arbitrary RNG) has broken normal crafting for new players or alt characters. It is way too expensive to be useful these days.
>> base game concepts completely unfriendly to solo-exploring: The HoT maps make it pretty much impossible to get hero points and mastery points in solo game play mode. This is completely different to what the base game allows you to do when enjoying to play alts. As you need huge amounts of HPs to unlock elite specializations, the fun of getting those by switching to alts for a few minutes is gone. Character progression is “work” in GW2 now.
>> treatment of WvW: The neglect of WvW over the years left players in no good mood before HoT was released. The Desert Borderlands went live and had no chance to begin with. The lighting weapon meta event caused map lags and was badly scaled to be done by few people, not resulting in good open field fights over the mid area. The map had too many “barriers” to roam (although travelling times were more a psychological issue) and upgrades were the domain of the filthy rich large guilds. When Anet finally made DBL good in the spring update, they already announced the return of the (old & stale) Alpine BL. No ideas for seasons, ranks came too late and still don’t have appropriate WvW rewards & no WvW exclusive skins etc. It is still a mess.
>> Story, Lore & Raids: With LS season 3 coming later than everyone expected, putting Gw2 lore picking up strings from past events (GW1, Bloodstones, White Mantle & GW2 Bandit mystery etc.) in a game mode that is catered to the hard core gamer is an absolute no-go.

Will GW2 be a “fun game” in the future months, perhaps with a second expansion?
I have my doubts and would say NO right now.
Does it offer chances to “work” for goals. Yes does. We as players have to decide, when “working for a game” has depleted all the fun we can have with it and then move on to other things that still make us genuinely smile.

HoT didn’t ruin the game…

The extreme negative posts before HoT did deminish the amount of players buying the HoT upgrade… People knew for sure it would be nothing before any beta started. This destroyed the majority of the interested playerbase and thus GW2, not HoT.

It recovered nicely though…. I find many friends return. I really hope this positive change will continue, and GW2 will be reborn at the next updates for LS….

At first when HoT arrived I thought it was as the negative part of the ppl described
only little content, just 4 maps

• Unbalanced, unsoloable
• Way to complicated
• Hard grind
• Mostly boring

mostly because ppl focussed so mutch on this specific point, but I’m still enjoying the maps,

• I have a lot of fun with newer builds, the specialisations are nice, though I find myself still using some “classic builds” as not all builds can be improved upon by elite specialisations.
• I enjoy gliding, and the other newly introduced masteries, they tend to add some new angles.
• I have run raids and I suck at it (mostly due to too little time to be really succesful) But I love the raids the concept and implementation. I find the “leetist attitude around raids” annoying to say the least. I understand ppl want experienced ppl, but the selection process is a farce, with fake pings and all kinds of illusionary trickery which would make most mesmers proud. It is as stupid as the 7.5K AP for AC pings 2 years ago. And noobies even with good gear and plenty of experience have little chance, this makes the HoT raids a major selling point useless as a selling point for Gw2 and HoT… the leetists will destroy a huge part of the fanatic casuals and thus also for the player base. Remember pure casuals and F2P’s will not carry your game.
• I like the new rework of fractals, BUT I tend to find the loot a bit subpar.
• I’m happy certain choices developers made were (partially) reversed (read dungeon reward update and the consequent return of Dungeon Runners though most are fastrunners not the old leet speedgrinders (which also tends to be a positive thing )
• and I’m happy with the return of the icemaps as WvW borders, I would still like a WvW competition/matchup for 3 weeks with the icelands, the EotM and the desert borders and the starting locations changing each week, for wvw credits for the special armors/weapons)
• I like the new dailies

I’m looking forward to the LS S3 and the new expansion I hope it will be of better quantity and comparable quality as HoT in it’s PRESENT form.

I think all changes in balancing have been a pre to HoT.

I think all changes in blancing classes however to support the PvP wannabee E-sports illusion a farce and detrimental to wvw and PvE gameplay…

SO HoT was Ok.
Ppl tend to have been the main problem in selling HoT and some are really making parts (RAIDs in particular) unattractive. This also shows the change from Leet dungeon specs and speedruns towards Leetist Raids and sometimes high tier fractals. Though I need to mention: The most used title by Fractal leetists who fail hard tends to be Eternal… Most Eternals tend to be VERY temporary.

BUT in the end the people playing Gw2 and HoT are the main selling point for gw2 as a whole, and I love the Gw2 community, it’s still open and friendly…. And even in Raids there are more and more people trying to open up raids for people intersted in starting thier journey to full legendary gear. And initiative I applaude.

If we were to poll this thread, it seems like only a tiny of percentage of the posters feel this way, but I’ll add my no to to mix. I don’t think HoT ruined the game.

I do think some people don’t like HoT, and it ruined the game for them, but then it expanded the game for me.

Hopefully though, Anet has learned a couple of lessons from the HoT launch and the next expansion will be better.

battledrone.8315:

Shiyo.3578:

HoT has done nothing but make the game much, much better in every way.

The only thing to really suffer is PVP, but it’s still really good and fun(imo).

hot managed to shrink and divide one of the nicest communities in the history of mmos
i get, that you like it , but it was really bad for this game
they basically took raid content, and used it in the “open world”
they have already nerfed it once, but its still raid content
and the maps..they look awesome, but playing them feels like a clinch with a horny vampire
no fun..no more money

You’re certainly welcome to your opinion, but the comment about taking raid content and applying it to open world is perplexing. What do you mean by that? The boss events? I don’t see how that qualifies as “raid” content in the open world.

vifesprit.3514:

No, it’s the opposite.

With HOT, the devs could finally understand some design problems:
- playing metamap (PvE) is completely different from a dev (mono)server that on a prod (mega)server
- PvP build diversity is not adding specialization
- WvW is a unique game mode in its own and not just guilds’ PvP
- …

Many players had already reported this problems years ago and most players find that the solutions don’t come quickly enough.
April Update is an attempt to stop the hemorrhage, but some problems are so deeply rooted in the code that it may take time and ANET has any interest to treat well its communication on these problems (if possible avoid the last year VeteranGate)

That is definitely a problem I hope they find a solution to quickly. I hear the issue comes down to making the new maps convenient to groups of players who wish to play together. But whatever they did makes it difficult for anyone to log into these maps and just PLAY.

When I attempt to do that in HoT, I generally have to wait through the remainder of the cycle and then sometimes the map will fill up and we’ll succeed on the meta a couple of hours later (maybe!).

I know about LFG and taxis and I use them, but I really wish there was a better way. I feel I shouldn’t have to do that to play these maps the way they were intended. And again, they are really excellent maps. I love most of them (not a big fan of the DS events, though!).

For me personally it certainly did ruin the game.

From the stuff i care about i dont got much, from the stuff i hate i got plenty.

- Only 4 legendaries (and i bought HoT to make some)

- Only a handfull of armor skins in the 50(!!!!) bucks expansion

- Elite specs that are a MUST nowadays if you want to do any content at all in groups

- No in game gliders, only through gem store in the 50(!!!!) bucks expansion

- Pathetic short story and only 2 short branching paths that amount to nothing at all

- Only 4 maps (that might be beautifull designed without a doubt tho)

- Still no balance split between the 3 very different game modes
(make a moba already if you wanna shoehorn everybody into a certain niche only)

- Messed up rewards to dungeons and fractals to promote raids
(fixed meanwhile… but still)

- Certain stats locked behind raids

- Heavy grind if you want any of the few skins added at all

- No lore on the revenant given at all (“later cub”… yeh almost a year later now)

Ontop of all that comes HoT unrelated stuff for me like outfits and constant mega nerfs to everything nice rather then good adjustments and the darn focus on esperts.
But whatever, im only online here and there anymore. My years of gw2 addiction are over already. Shame… i used to love the game from the bottom of my heart.

how does you not liking the things they added equate to ‘ruining’ the game.

Adding 4 lengendary skins doesnt ruin a game
adding a handful armor skins does not ruin a game
elite specs is only a must when you play with people who ‘demand’ you pick stuff.
No in game sliders, this was not taken away by Hot.
Pathetic short stories did not ruin the game.
only 4 beautifully designed zones did not ruin the game.
There was balance issues before, and there will allways be balance issues – this is an aspect of mmos.
Dungeon rewards are fixed.
certain stats being special awards for Raids did not ruin the game.
Heavy Grind, this is subjective, if your stupid enough to so soemthing you think is ‘Heavy Grind’ your not in control if your own behaviour, this has nothing to do with HOT, it just offered more for those that want it.
No Lore for revenant did not Ruin GW2.

Listing a huge list of things you subjectively don’t like does not ruin a game.

No but it did not HELP it at all and lost allot of ppl

What really dampens my fun in the game is the repetition Anet forces us through since the end of ls1. One horribly boring lukewarm festival from last year with a new currency hunts the next one. Classical guinea pig wheel stuff here.

Although I am curious for the actual bandit events, that is finally good stuff again.

hmmmm , some people would complain all the time , with HoT or without .
I have a lot of fun with HoT , so definitely not ruined my game

PvE? Nope, if players are unhappy with HoT, they could always fall back on core Tyria. Moreover, the April patch addressed most of the issues that players had with the HoT meta(s).

As for WvW and PvP? well, the damage has already been done.

Maybe not, but just about as close as you could get and still keep the doors open.

Ruined the game? I wouldn’t go that far. I mean, the expansion itself wasn’t as good as what people were expecting, if the many negative forum posts are any indication, ( I know I expected more) but in the overall scheme of things, I don’t think it really changed a whole lot in the core game. And HoT was a bit grindy and repetitive at times, but it wasn’t bad enough to ruin the entire GW2 experience. And who knows, maybe it will get better. The last two updates had overwhelmingly positive responses, which is a first since HoT launched. Hopefully Anet learned what they did right/wrong in the past and can move forward in a way most people can enjoy.

Nope, devs ruined it. Unplayable expansion story (glitching bugs) too much zerg stuff for individuals, not friendly raid system (you need rl friends or a guild to join you). WvWvW died, same as dungeons did. Well pvp is the only thing alive. I enjoyed beta and i would love to play the game it was as released … Too much grind appeared (new armors and useless stuff like ascended) why would you even farm ascended armor if fractals are dead above some lvls, and raids are so restrictive? Do people actually play some classes like necro anymore (an example)? The game feels more like: adapt to our rules, than “relax and find players to do some stuff”. No more dungeons, no new fractals, besides it took 3 years to add some new stuff or a new LFG system. Im out of the game now, but i wouldn’t buy new expansions. THERE ARE good things like gliding, very well designed new maps, new items. But devs literally broke it with stupid decisions. Keys are filling your inventory (why for god sake can’t you put it into player’s wallet…), masteries require raw grind. So, old stuff got abandoned and the new is avaible for hardcore players with lot of time for the game.