Guild Wars 2

For starters, I know when FO4’s official launch date is. That already tells me more about FO4 than HoT by a mile.

I would rather a game have a flexible launch date than to have it release in the shape AC: Unity did. The lack of launch date does not bother me in the least, it’ll come out when it comes out, almost certainly within the year. If it matters to you, fair enough, that can rule your decisions, but don’t project it as something universal.

But still date aside, we do know more about HoT than we do FO4, objectively. We have more details about the classes, we’ve had plenty of hands on opportunities to play some of its content, and considering it’s part of the game we’re already playing, we have a feel for how it will actually play and fit in with our existing characters. There’s also hours worth of ingame footage from the expansion out there already. Thousands of players have actually played as the new class.

Yeah, FO4 can be expected to borrow from FO3, but we don’t know exactly where it’ll be the same and where it’ll be different beyond the few specific examples given.

If you do know more about FO4 than about HoT, then you either have insider knowledge of FO4 that has not been made publicly available, or you haven’t been paying attention to HoT coverage, neither of which is ANet’s fault.

@Ohoni your opinions will differ from others but remember that unless you speak in fact (with proof provided) you’re speaking your opinions on matters. The two things that are out of your control are your ability to make someone buy HoT and have them stop posting.

Ohoni.6057:

Then back away from the discussion, because I guarantee you right now that HoT will definitely not be of equivalent size to the launch game. If it is, I will buy you a copy myself. Given your ultimatum, you will not be buying HoT, so there’s no more reason for you to be participating in the discussion.

This is what I am referring to. There is no need for the other poster to refrain from posting. You can disagree.

Ohoni.6057:

Yeah, FO4 can be expected to borrow from FO3, but we don’t know exactly where it’ll be the same and where it’ll be different beyond the few specific examples given.

And New Vegas, and Skyrim. A lot of Skyrim, actually.

If them telling you the game engine being utilized doesn’t tip you off to what you can expect? Then you haven’t been paying attention, yourself.

And that’s not even counting things like the expanded crafting system, being able to make your own settlements, or taking notice of particular landmarks in the videos.

Sorry, but from where I’m standing? The 30 some minutes of game footage that exists for FO4 tells me more than the countless piddly fluff filled dev articles have when it comes to HoT due to the general substance.

As for the release date? They can change that if need be. Rockstar did the same with GTAV- PC. But having that initial date? That tells me how far along they are with development. That tells me that, with only five months to go, that the game is mostly complete and everything is polish at this point.

ANet, so far as I can tell, doesn’t have a single clue when HoT is going to exist. They don’t even know what year it’s going to be a thing. There’s no telling where everything lies on the completion scale.

Ohoni.6057:

If you do know more about FO4 than about HoT, then you either have insider knowledge of FO4 that has not been made publicly available, or you haven’t been paying attention to HoT coverage, neither of which is ANet’s fault.

No, FO4’s small trailers and E3 appearance just managed to contain more substance. But, then, that’s what I’ve come to expect from Bethesda. After all, they’ve delivered Morrowind, FO3, Oblivion, New Vegas, and Skyrim.

ANet? Well, SAB sure was fun. It’s a shame they’re hellbent on ignoring the best content they’ve ever released. It’s what I’ve come to expect though.

Oh, and because I know this will come up from someone, just generally speaking: Yeah, we can also expect FO4 to be buggy and then also expect all of that to be fixed by the modding community because as always, the SKU development kit will be handed out with the game in some fashion. Can also expect a ton of mods.

Meanwhile, GW2 will continue to be the only MMO I’ve ever seen with an unmodifiable UI.

Aidenwolf.5964:

Ohoni.6057:

Then back away from the discussion, because I guarantee you right now that HoT will definitely not be of equivalent size to the launch game. If it is, I will buy you a copy myself. Given your ultimatum, you will not be buying HoT, so there’s no more reason for you to be participating in the discussion.

This is what I am referring to. There is no need for the other poster to refrain from posting. You can disagree.

The thing is though, that it is reaching a point were you are just repeating the same rehashed points over and over. You’re not bringing anything new to the table. You merely flipflop being stuck in your own semantics and notions about value is. Come on.
It’s so telling that you and a few others are literally hammering this down everyones throats. I’ve seen you in at least 30 threads going on about this. It’s annoying.

People get it. They get it. Now move on, and let the chips fall where they may. You’re putting a serious damper on constructive discussions with your non-constructive vilification and conspiracy theories. It’s childish.

Sad Swordfish.9743:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Ohoni.6057:

Then back away from the discussion, because I guarantee you right now that HoT will definitely not be of equivalent size to the launch game. If it is, I will buy you a copy myself. Given your ultimatum, you will not be buying HoT, so there’s no more reason for you to be participating in the discussion.

This is what I am referring to. There is no need for the other poster to refrain from posting. You can disagree.

The thing is though, that it is reaching a point were you are just repeating the same rehashed points over and over. You’re not bringing anything new to the table. You merely flipflop being stuck in your own semantics and notions about value is. Come on.
It’s so telling that you and a few others are literally hammering this down everyones throats. I’ve seen you in at least 30 threads going on about this. It’s annoying.

People get it. They get it. Now move on, and let the chips fall where they may. You’re putting a serious damper on constructive discussions with your non-constructive vilification and conspiracy theories. It’s childish.

I’m acting childish? I’m spreading conspiracy theories? Quite the opposite actually, but since we’ve never conversed I won’t mind that it won’t happen again.

I’m unhappy with the Heart of Thorns packages so I go to the forums and discus why I’m unhappy with these packages (pricing, features). As a veteran player I’ve been broadly painted as entitled, a whiner, and a crybaby by players like you.

I have been directly called a conspiracy theorist and childish (by you), and one of the most famous white knights dared to liken me to a bigot. All because as a customer, I am not pleased with the product Anet is selling as currently packaged.

I’ve kept my calm far better than I would’ve dreamed.

Aidenwolf.5964:

Sad Swordfish.9743:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Ohoni.6057:

Then back away from the discussion, because I guarantee you right now that HoT will definitely not be of equivalent size to the launch game. If it is, I will buy you a copy myself. Given your ultimatum, you will not be buying HoT, so there’s no more reason for you to be participating in the discussion.

This is what I am referring to. There is no need for the other poster to refrain from posting. You can disagree.

The thing is though, that it is reaching a point were you are just repeating the same rehashed points over and over. You’re not bringing anything new to the table. You merely flipflop being stuck in your own semantics and notions about value is. Come on.
It’s so telling that you and a few others are literally hammering this down everyones throats. I’ve seen you in at least 30 threads going on about this. It’s annoying.

People get it. They get it. Now move on, and let the chips fall where they may. You’re putting a serious damper on constructive discussions with your non-constructive vilification and conspiracy theories. It’s childish.

I’m acting childish? I’m spreading conspiracy theories? Quite the opposite actually, but since we’ve never conversed I won’t mind that it won’t happen again.

I’m not going to dig through your posts to undermine you. You have your opinion and view of things and that is fine, but I feel you are clogging up almost every thread, posting the same things, and it feels like spam.
It feels like it stifles communication to me when the same thing is being repeated. I mean look at even your signature. Your coming at this like some hardcore radical activist.

Packaging the core game with HoT is redundant. When they announced HoT last time, did they not offer the core game for $10 (or in and around that time)?

Any new players who wanted to get in on the action would have already bought their accounts at $10 prior HoT even coming out. So this begs the question, did Anet know at that time they were going to package the core game in with HoT effectively screwing over all those new players who dropped $10?

Or is it a case of their marketing teaming having a brain fart in forgetting their company already offered the core game at $10 only a few months earlier?

Sad Swordfish.9743:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Sad Swordfish.9743:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Ohoni.6057:

Then back away from the discussion, because I guarantee you right now that HoT will definitely not be of equivalent size to the launch game. If it is, I will buy you a copy myself. Given your ultimatum, you will not be buying HoT, so there’s no more reason for you to be participating in the discussion.

This is what I am referring to. There is no need for the other poster to refrain from posting. You can disagree.

The thing is though, that it is reaching a point were you are just repeating the same rehashed points over and over. You’re not bringing anything new to the table. You merely flipflop being stuck in your own semantics and notions about value is. Come on.
It’s so telling that you and a few others are literally hammering this down everyones throats. I’ve seen you in at least 30 threads going on about this. It’s annoying.

People get it. They get it. Now move on, and let the chips fall where they may. You’re putting a serious damper on constructive discussions with your non-constructive vilification and conspiracy theories. It’s childish.

I’m acting childish? I’m spreading conspiracy theories? Quite the opposite actually, but since we’ve never conversed I won’t mind that it won’t happen again.

I’m not going to dig through your posts to undermine you. You have your opinion and view of things and that is fine, but I feel you are clogging up almost every thread, posting the same things, and it feels like spam.
It feels like it stifles communication to me when the same thing is being repeated. I mean look at even your signature. Your coming at this like some hardcore radical activist.

I don’t back down. You’ve now called me a conspiracy theorist, childish, and a radical, you need to move along.

DeadlySynz.3471:

Packaging the core game with HoT is redundant. When they announced HoT last time, did they not offer the core game for $10 (or in and around that time)?

Any new players who wanted to get in on the action would have already bought their accounts at $10 prior HoT even coming out. So this begs the question, did Anet know at that time they were going to package the core game in with HoT effectively screwing over all those new players who dropped $10?

Or is it a case of their marketing teaming having a brain fart in forgetting their company already offered the core game at $10 only a few months earlier?

It just doesn’t make sense (to me) to buy a product in anticipation of another product with so little about it was shown during the $10 sale from two months ago.

But primarily I don’t think it’s a given you would just get the expansion. I would much rather have $10 GW2 than buying the expansion for $50 today if I was a new player. I would learn the basics, level up, wait until the expansion went on sale. There are hundreds and thousands of hours of gameplay core GW2. By the time you’re ready for HoT you could scoop up a good deal presumable.
HoT doesn’t have a release date yet. Nobody knows when it is coming out. Everything rides on the challenging game content. Everyone in my guild is waiting for that specifically. Besides the revernant and the new specializations, that is the big draw, because dungeons/fractals/world bosses is what they spend a lot of their time doing today. It’s what the expansion is about for them. Not the new zones.

Also one thing I just love is how people act like victims they got GW2 for $10 during a sale. What about the people who paid $40 for GW2 the day before that sale started? they got screwed over much worse. where is the value in that? < it just proves that if everyone acted so hostile and toxic about everyone getting better deals than they themselves had it would be even more unbearable than it already is to listen to these villifications.
I’ve seen so little constructive feedback about what good etiquette and communication should be. I’ve only seen people being hostile and showing no good ideas how to make things better in the future. It reminds me a lot of the pathetic Left 4 Dead 2 fiasco( http://i.imgur.com/yLucX.jpg ). People talk big but really they are often just tactics to try and rile things up. It’s why you see a small but very vocal group of posters going on about this in every freaking thread.

@Ohoni your opinions will differ from others but remember that unless you speak in fact (with proof provided) you’re speaking your opinions on matters. The two things that are out of your control are your ability to make someone buy HoT and have them stop posting.

Never in doubt.

This is what I am referring to. There is no need for the other poster to refrain from posting. You can disagree.

Yes, but that poster clearly has nothing to add to the discussion, since his expectations for the product will never be met. He declared that he will not be satisfied unless certain conditions are met, and those conditions definitely will not be met, so he definitely will not be satisfied. So far as he’s concerned, the product has already failed, so while I can’t stop him from posting, it would be better for everyone, himself included, if he saved the time between now and launch and just got on with his life.

And New Vegas, and Skyrim. A lot of Skyrim, actually.

If them telling you the game engine being utilized doesn’t tip you off to what you can expect? Then you haven’t been paying attention, yourself.

Having played all those games, I can tell you that each differs significantly from one to the next. They are all high quality, certainly, but each different. My point is, we know for a fact more about HoT than we do about FO4, and we can assume based on prior experiences at least as much about HoT as we can about FO4, but subjectively it’s entirely up to you how you allow that to impact your own purchasing decisions. I’m not saying you have to pre-order either of them, I’m just saying that it’s not wrong of ANet to OFFER the pre-order right now, players are able to take them up on it, or not, of their own will.

As for the release date? They can change that if need be. Rockstar did the same with GTAV- PC. But having that initial date? That tells me how far along they are with development. That tells me that, with only five months to go, that the game is mostly complete and everything is polish at this point.

Lol, if you believe that then I’ve got a bridge to sell you in Cantha.

ANet, so far as I can tell, doesn’t have a single clue when HoT is going to exist. They don’t even know what year it’s going to be a thing. There’s no telling where everything lies on the completion scale.

You’re free to believe that, but I don’t. I imagine they have a target window, and I would bet it’s early fall, but they aren’t in the habit of giving firm release dates for things until they are ready to go, and I don’t blame them for that. If it bothers you that they don’t give long distance release dates then that’s fine, but it doesn’t make them wrong for not doing so.

Any new players who wanted to get in on the action would have already bought their accounts at $10 prior HoT even coming out. So this begs the question, did Anet know at that time they were going to package the core game in with HoT effectively screwing over all those new players who dropped $10?

They also just made a major announcement at E3, and will continue to promote HoT over the summer. It’s not unreasonable to assume that every day there are people who are hearing about HoT for the first time, and might want to jump in.

As with the gem store, there’s always that one guy willing to spends hundreds of dollars.
For every person who’s not buying HoT (like me) there’s probably 3 people who couldn’t care any less what HoT adds or doesn’t add to the game, how bad or good it is, etc.

Nick.6972:

As with the gem store, there’s always that one guy willing to spends hundreds of dollars.
For every person who’s not buying HoT (like me) there’s probably 3 people who couldn’t care any less what HoT adds or doesn’t add to the game, how bad or good it is, etc.

The sad truth about most gamers I’m this Era, the same gamers also enjoy complaining when the game the pre-purchase doesn’t meet their expectations/the expectations it set for itself

I am not prepurchasing.

I think the price point will be reasonable but before I order I need to know:

1/ If it will run at a decent performance on my PC
2/ That Anet will do right by those people who bought AFTER the expac announcement and upgrade them to HoT for free
3/ That the content within is worth the value.

Those are my priorities in that order. I don’t care about doing the betas since I would rather wait till full release, and I dont care about titles, so prepurchase offers nothing to me.

What does matter is whether or not my PC will have a tantrum if I try to run HoT at or near high quality.

Teon.5168:

Nakatsu Hime.3520:

Although I don’t want to rake though the coals about pricing-points too much (I DO think it is aimed a bit high), but I notice a very high proportion of posters here highlight the lack of the offer of a new character slot for existing users a very bad deal.

If I was in some sort of control, but was unable or unwilling to alter the price-points, I would organise it so the base expansion pack’s CD code was dual-purpose. Those new users could use it to create a new GW2 account, but existing users could redeem the code against at least one new character-slot.

Not an ideal solution, but I bet many here would consider that option.

As others have said in threads, the original game was offered with far less character slots then there were actual characters. I don’t recall that ever bugging the heck out of anyone who bought the original game. /shrug

So? ‘Less’ character slots, and ‘No’ character slots are different ends of a stick – no?
I’m sure it WOULD have bugged the heck out of you if GW1 only came with a single slot – or none?
Anyway, I see you went straight to what happened about a decade ago, which has little, if nothing to do with this issue. Plus, I outlined a perfectly valid get-out for anet.

So go ahead and potter off and spend $75+ to get your slot, because – trust me – this situation IS bugging the hell out of GW2 users – just not you . /shrug

GuzziHero.2467:

I am not prepurchasing.

I think the price point will be reasonable but before I order I need to know:

1/ If it will run at a decent performance on my PC
2/ That Anet will do right by those people who bought AFTER the expac announcement and upgrade them to HoT for free
3/ That the content within is worth the value.

Those are my priorities in that order. I don’t care about doing the betas since I would rather wait till full release, and I dont care about titles, so prepurchase offers nothing to me.

What does matter is whether or not my PC will have a tantrum if I try to run HoT at or near high quality.

Why would Anet do #2? I got the base game for a friend for 20.00. Why should people who got the game for 20.00 recently, get HOT for free? That would kitten me off and I bought the ultimate xpac. So I bought the original game at 60.00, I bought friends the original game at between 20.00 and 60.00 and bought the ultimate xpac yet I don’t think I should be getting anything for free.

GuzziHero.2467:

2/ That Anet will do right by those people who bought AFTER the expac announcement and upgrade them to HoT for free

Will never happen. Same reason why nobody gets upgraded to the last WoW expansion for free if they joined after that announcement. Besides, they have been doing sales for the core game a lot.

Frankly, I didn’t read most of this topic, but has anybody bothered to consider that the “Core game access” may ALSO be a pre-order bonus?

I saw nothing that really implies buying HoT will get you the core game post release. I won’t be pre-purchasing just yet, but I plan to.

Aidenwolf.5964:

I paid $150 for my pre purchase of GW2 I’ve bought gems since 2012 off and on with cash, I bought an account for my wife who also buys gems, I’ve built 2 custom PCs worth thousands that we play on, so this isn’t about being unable to pay $50 for an expansion.

When I bought GW2 I was wary of the gemstore which we were promised wouldn’t drive development, which was a lie (or as the hard core call it a shift in business models), but I’d already bought the game and loved it so we let that slide. This time however, I’m expected to reward Anet with another purchase (2 actually) with no idea if they’ve included raids or the size of the new map or anything of substance, they want me to trust them. Then they want to penalize me for owning the game by devaluing my purchase vs a brand new player’s purchase? No. I’ll play the core game and live in WvW if I have to, in protest.

“When I bought GW2 I was wary of the gemstore which we were promised wouldn’t drive development, which was a lie (or as the hard core call it a shift in business models)” > “I’ve bought gems since 2012”

Don’t buy gems if you do not like what it does to the game! A company will sell you everything you are willing to buy, even if you buy it while finding it crap at the same time.

I was very much like you, well I wasn’t wary of the gem-store at first as Anet had a good name of focusing on expansions, not on the gem-store and the game was promoted as B2P. So I have always treated this game as a B2P game. Just as you, I did buy the CE, but I did never buy any gems (and I did complain about the focus on them), now I have no problem with kitten,- or more expansion (will likely go for the Deluxe as they do not have a CE, so the Deluxe is the most extensive physical edition) but will get even less acceptance for the gem-store as the $50,- price fits a B2P model, not a cash-shop model.

You did say you disliked something but at the same time you supported it. That is not smart my friend.

Tere.4759:

Why would Anet do #2? I got the base game for a friend for 20.00. Why should people who got the game for 20.00 recently, get HOT for free? That would kitten me off and I bought the ultimate xpac. So I bought the original game at 60.00, I bought friends the original game at between 20.00 and 60.00 and bought the ultimate xpac yet I don’t think I should be getting anything for free.

Because they were mislead into buying the core game?

At the VERY least, anyone who purchased after HoT announcement should be given HoT at a reduced cost.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Celtic Lady.3729:

I don’t see how they can change it now after so many people have purchased the packages as they are. All those people would have to be compensated somehow.

They can always include something with the purchase.

An in game plushie of Colin might do the trick.

The problem is that people where expecting that extra (character slot) even with a $35 – $40,- version of the game. So it would help a little but not a lot.

Many GW2 players simply have started to see GW2 as a cash-shop / F2P game, because that is really what GW2 did become with their heavy focus on the cash-shop.

However with that they also expect expansions of a lower price, if we where 1 year after release now, and GW2 would have done almost nothing with the cash-shop, putting all those cosmetics and other stuff we now have in the cash-shop, into the world, people would see GW2 as a B2P game and would have no problem with the $50,- prize-tag. (even while it would have only been a year ago they spend that money on GW2)

But who knows, maybe they plan on going back to the B2P model (it should be), then maybe they should announce that as an explanation as to why the expansion is above the price the market does. That should help, while the question is if people trust them on their word.

The thing they did with the faq can’t really be fixed anymore.

Aidenwolf.5964:

Sad Swordfish.9743:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Ohoni.6057:

Then back away from the discussion, because I guarantee you right now that HoT will definitely not be of equivalent size to the launch game. If it is, I will buy you a copy myself. Given your ultimatum, you will not be buying HoT, so there’s no more reason for you to be participating in the discussion.

This is what I am referring to. There is no need for the other poster to refrain from posting. You can disagree.

The thing is though, that it is reaching a point were you are just repeating the same rehashed points over and over. You’re not bringing anything new to the table. You merely flipflop being stuck in your own semantics and notions about value is. Come on.
It’s so telling that you and a few others are literally hammering this down everyones throats. I’ve seen you in at least 30 threads going on about this. It’s annoying.

People get it. They get it. Now move on, and let the chips fall where they may. You’re putting a serious damper on constructive discussions with your non-constructive vilification and conspiracy theories. It’s childish.

I’m acting childish? I’m spreading conspiracy theories? Quite the opposite actually, but since we’ve never conversed I won’t mind that it won’t happen again.

I’m unhappy with the Heart of Thorns packages so I go to the forums and discus why I’m unhappy with these packages (pricing, features). As a veteran player I’ve been broadly painted as entitled, a whiner, and a crybaby by players like you.

I have been directly called a conspiracy theorist and childish (by you), and one of the most famous white knights dared to liken me to a bigot. All because as a customer, I am not pleased with the product Anet is selling as currently packaged.

I’ve kept my calm far better than I would’ve dreamed.

I didn’t liken you to a bigot, I changed the original post at your request and explained it. I once has some respect for you, but you’re angry and you’re taking it out on everyone else. It’s not cool.

You’re not just saying something, but there’s a distinct bite to what you’re saying. Talking about people who work for Anet calling the Freshmen etc. I get that you’re emotional, but I think you’re picking on other people with the strength for your language and may not even realize it. I felt offended by your posts.

Drayos.8759:

Guild wars do NOT make as much money from Gem Store as they do any other F2P/B2P because they of the fact they sacrificed that factor by putting NO Micro-transactions into it, No Cash shop Spam Releases of Outfits etc etc, Not having Mounts in the game and ALLOWING you to convert your gold to gems, They make up for the fact they allow players to choose to just never spend a Dime in the Gem Shop by their Expansion Releases.

they DO NEED the expansion release incomes, thats just factual… to claim they dont is stupid.

WoW just wow Is there a point to keep telling these white knight that they are only spreading incorrect information ?
All of that to defend a company which current offer screw them over.

papry.8096:

Drayos.8759:

Guild wars do NOT make as much money from Gem Store as they do any other F2P/B2P because they of the fact they sacrificed that factor by putting NO Micro-transactions into it, No Cash shop Spam Releases of Outfits etc etc, Not having Mounts in the game and ALLOWING you to convert your gold to gems, They make up for the fact they allow players to choose to just never spend a Dime in the Gem Shop by their Expansion Releases.

they DO NEED the expansion release incomes, thats just factual… to claim they dont is stupid.

WoW just wow Is there a point to keep telling these white knight that they are only spreading incorrect information ?
All of that to defend a company which current offer screw them over.

Calling people white knights because they disagree with your opinion is wrong, and irrelevant. Every poster, for or against the game, can be wrong or can be right. I’ve seen plenty of misinformation from people who aren’t white knights. Do you go into their threads and try to discredit them with a name? Because all it does it make you look bad.

And I disagree that the company is screwing anyone over, though I agree a percentage of the community sees it that way. A percentage of the community also doesn’t.

jihm.2315:

what the kitten is wrong with people this days?

Austerity.

Instead of fighting to try to make sure they are paid enough, it feels easier to refuse to spend any money.

GuzziHero.2467:

Tere.4759:

Why would Anet do #2? I got the base game for a friend for 20.00. Why should people who got the game for 20.00 recently, get HOT for free? That would kitten me off and I bought the ultimate xpac. So I bought the original game at 60.00, I bought friends the original game at between 20.00 and 60.00 and bought the ultimate xpac yet I don’t think I should be getting anything for free.

Because they were mislead into buying the core game?

At the VERY least, anyone who purchased after HoT announcement should be given HoT at a reduced cost.

Mislead? How. Frankly that’d kitten off even more players because then you’d have the guys going “WHAT THE kitten? I bought GW2 the day before/week before they announced that!”

And the people who have been in the game since beta/launch (Like me and many others, including most GW1 vets) would be kittened off even more.

This is just like people kittening about paying full price for something the week before a sale goes live and moan endlessly about “How they would’ve waited until the sale if they had known about it, GIMME REFUND FOR THE AMOUNT THE DIFFERENCE WOULD BE!”

I don’t know of a single business that’d go “Oh, I’m so sorry, here, let me refund the full price item and give you the discount item!” if you bought it before the sale.

Now if you got it DURING the sale and were charged full price, that’s another issue.

Kalavier.1097:

GuzziHero.2467:

Tere.4759:

Why would Anet do #2? I got the base game for a friend for 20.00. Why should people who got the game for 20.00 recently, get HOT for free? That would kitten me off and I bought the ultimate xpac. So I bought the original game at 60.00, I bought friends the original game at between 20.00 and 60.00 and bought the ultimate xpac yet I don’t think I should be getting anything for free.

Because they were mislead into buying the core game?

At the VERY least, anyone who purchased after HoT announcement should be given HoT at a reduced cost.

Mislead? How. Frankly that’d kitten off even more players because then you’d have the guys going “WHAT THE kitten? I bought GW2 the day before/week before they announced that!”

And the people who have been in the game since beta/launch (Like me and many others, including most GW1 vets) would be kittened off even more.

This is just like people kittening about paying full price for something the week before a sale goes live and moan endlessly about “How they would’ve waited until the sale if they had known about it, GIMME REFUND FOR THE AMOUNT THE DIFFERENCE WOULD BE!”

I don’t know of a single business that’d go “Oh, I’m so sorry, here, let me refund the full price item and give you the discount item!” if you bought it before the sale.

Now if you got it DURING the sale and were charged full price, that’s another issue.

Most businesses give you a refund of the difference on items you bought that go on sale within one week to 30 days depending on the company (in the US anyway).

rhapsody.3615:

Kalavier.1097:

GuzziHero.2467:

Tere.4759:

Why would Anet do #2? I got the base game for a friend for 20.00. Why should people who got the game for 20.00 recently, get HOT for free? That would kitten me off and I bought the ultimate xpac. So I bought the original game at 60.00, I bought friends the original game at between 20.00 and 60.00 and bought the ultimate xpac yet I don’t think I should be getting anything for free.

Because they were mislead into buying the core game?

At the VERY least, anyone who purchased after HoT announcement should be given HoT at a reduced cost.

Mislead? How. Frankly that’d kitten off even more players because then you’d have the guys going “WHAT THE kitten? I bought GW2 the day before/week before they announced that!”

And the people who have been in the game since beta/launch (Like me and many others, including most GW1 vets) would be kittened off even more.

This is just like people kittening about paying full price for something the week before a sale goes live and moan endlessly about “How they would’ve waited until the sale if they had known about it, GIMME REFUND FOR THE AMOUNT THE DIFFERENCE WOULD BE!”

I don’t know of a single business that’d go “Oh, I’m so sorry, here, let me refund the full price item and give you the discount item!” if you bought it before the sale.

Now if you got it DURING the sale and were charged full price, that’s another issue.

Most businesses give you a refund of the difference on items you bought that go on sale within one week to 30 days depending on the company (in the US anyway).

Are you saying Anet isn’t doing that?

rhapsody.3615:

Kalavier.1097:

GuzziHero.2467:

Tere.4759:

Why would Anet do #2? I got the base game for a friend for 20.00. Why should people who got the game for 20.00 recently, get HOT for free? That would kitten me off and I bought the ultimate xpac. So I bought the original game at 60.00, I bought friends the original game at between 20.00 and 60.00 and bought the ultimate xpac yet I don’t think I should be getting anything for free.

Because they were mislead into buying the core game?

At the VERY least, anyone who purchased after HoT announcement should be given HoT at a reduced cost.

Mislead? How. Frankly that’d kitten off even more players because then you’d have the guys going “WHAT THE kitten? I bought GW2 the day before/week before they announced that!”

And the people who have been in the game since beta/launch (Like me and many others, including most GW1 vets) would be kittened off even more.

This is just like people kittening about paying full price for something the week before a sale goes live and moan endlessly about “How they would’ve waited until the sale if they had known about it, GIMME REFUND FOR THE AMOUNT THE DIFFERENCE WOULD BE!”

I don’t know of a single business that’d go “Oh, I’m so sorry, here, let me refund the full price item and give you the discount item!” if you bought it before the sale.

Now if you got it DURING the sale and were charged full price, that’s another issue.

Most businesses give you a refund of the difference on items you bought that go on sale within one week to 30 days depending on the company (in the US anyway).

And pre-order bonuses change sometimes.

Even in that case, it’s not true here. They got the game, now expansion is announced. It’s not like GW2 core went on sale suddenly.

Even then, I’m sure in most cases you wouldn’t get a bundle package at a discounted prize simply because you already have a piece of it.

Because they were mislead into buying the core game?

At the VERY least, anyone who purchased after HoT announcement should be given HoT at a reduced cost.

They’ve been offered a refund, which was appropriate. Problem solved.

Many GW2 players simply have started to see GW2 as a cash-shop / F2P game, because that is relaly what GW2 did become with their heavy focus on the cash-shop.

If you want to see what a REAL cash shop game is, check the one where every single content update costs $5-15 to unlock the new missions, powersets, etc. GW2 is NOT a real cash shop game.

Sorry, I wasn’t making an argument for either side. Simply stating a fact since the person I quoted has NEVER seen a business give refunds for items that go on sale after purchase. If it was sarcasm, my apologies.

I am not suggesting that Anet deliberately mislead people. They just didn’t think about it properly. This is not a launch/pre launch failure. It is a PR failure.

Now the implementation of Ascended gear after their ‘no grind’ philosophy, and their promises that exotic would be top-tier… THAT was deliberately misleading.

rhapsody.3615:

Sorry, I wasn’t making an argument for either side. Simply stating a fact since the person I quoted has NEVER seen a business give refunds for items that go on sale after purchase. If it was sarcasm, my apologies.

Ah, well, admittedly I don’t go to many sales so I didn’t know that Interesting and good to know (though honestly I personally wouldn’t care most of the time either way…)

And most of the time when I see kittening about that stuff, it’s directly related to game cash shops…

Vayne.8563:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Sad Swordfish.9743:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Ohoni.6057:

Then back away from the discussion, because I guarantee you right now that HoT will definitely not be of equivalent size to the launch game. If it is, I will buy you a copy myself. Given your ultimatum, you will not be buying HoT, so there’s no more reason for you to be participating in the discussion.

This is what I am referring to. There is no need for the other poster to refrain from posting. You can disagree.

The thing is though, that it is reaching a point were you are just repeating the same rehashed points over and over. You’re not bringing anything new to the table. You merely flipflop being stuck in your own semantics and notions about value is. Come on.
It’s so telling that you and a few others are literally hammering this down everyones throats. I’ve seen you in at least 30 threads going on about this. It’s annoying.

People get it. They get it. Now move on, and let the chips fall where they may. You’re putting a serious damper on constructive discussions with your non-constructive vilification and conspiracy theories. It’s childish.

I’m acting childish? I’m spreading conspiracy theories? Quite the opposite actually, but since we’ve never conversed I won’t mind that it won’t happen again.

I’m unhappy with the Heart of Thorns packages so I go to the forums and discus why I’m unhappy with these packages (pricing, features). As a veteran player I’ve been broadly painted as entitled, a whiner, and a crybaby by players like you.

I have been directly called a conspiracy theorist and childish (by you), and one of the most famous white knights dared to liken me to a bigot. All because as a customer, I am not pleased with the product Anet is selling as currently packaged.

I’ve kept my calm far better than I would’ve dreamed.

I didn’t liken you to a bigot, I changed the original post at your request and explained it. I once has some respect for you, but you’re angry and you’re taking it out on everyone else. It’s not cool.

You’re not just saying something, but there’s a distinct bite to what you’re saying. Talking about people who work for Anet calling the Freshmen etc. I get that you’re emotional, but I think you’re picking on other people with the strength for your language and may not even realize it. I felt offended by your posts.

I didn’t call you out by name because I do still have some respect for you but saying I’ve offended you is a step too far my friend. I do appreciate that you alterred the post in question I’ll leave it there.

Devata.6589:

Aidenwolf.5964:

I paid $150 for my pre purchase of GW2 I’ve bought gems since 2012 off and on with cash, I bought an account for my wife who also buys gems, I’ve built 2 custom PCs worth thousands that we play on, so this isn’t about being unable to pay $50 for an expansion.

When I bought GW2 I was wary of the gemstore which we were promised wouldn’t drive development, which was a lie (or as the hard core call it a shift in business models), but I’d already bought the game and loved it so we let that slide. This time however, I’m expected to reward Anet with another purchase (2 actually) with no idea if they’ve included raids or the size of the new map or anything of substance, they want me to trust them. Then they want to penalize me for owning the game by devaluing my purchase vs a brand new player’s purchase? No. I’ll play the core game and live in WvW if I have to, in protest.

“When I bought GW2 I was wary of the gemstore which we were promised wouldn’t drive development, which was a lie (or as the hard core call it a shift in business models)” > “I’ve bought gems since 2012”

Don’t buy gems if you do not like what is does to the game! A company will sell you everything you are willing to to, even if you buy it while finding it crap at the same time.

I was very much like you, well I wasn’t wary of the gem-store at first as Anet had a good name of focusing on expansion, not on the gem-store and the game was promoted as B2P. So I have always treated this game as a B2P game. Just as you as did buy the CE, but I did never buy any gems (and complained about the focus on them), now I have no problem with kitten,- or more expansion (will likely go for the Deluxe as they do not have a CE, so the Deluxe is the most extensive physical edition) but will get even less acceptance for the gem-store as the $50,- price fits a B2P model, not a cash-shop model.

You did say you disliked something but at the same time you supported it. That is not smart my friend.

I can’t argue with one word of that you’re absolutely right. I can promise never again though

Aidenwolf.5964:

Vayne.8563:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Sad Swordfish.9743:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Ohoni.6057:

Then back away from the discussion, because I guarantee you right now that HoT will definitely not be of equivalent size to the launch game. If it is, I will buy you a copy myself. Given your ultimatum, you will not be buying HoT, so there’s no more reason for you to be participating in the discussion.

This is what I am referring to. There is no need for the other poster to refrain from posting. You can disagree.

The thing is though, that it is reaching a point were you are just repeating the same rehashed points over and over. You’re not bringing anything new to the table. You merely flipflop being stuck in your own semantics and notions about value is. Come on.
It’s so telling that you and a few others are literally hammering this down everyones throats. I’ve seen you in at least 30 threads going on about this. It’s annoying.

People get it. They get it. Now move on, and let the chips fall where they may. You’re putting a serious damper on constructive discussions with your non-constructive vilification and conspiracy theories. It’s childish.

I’m acting childish? I’m spreading conspiracy theories? Quite the opposite actually, but since we’ve never conversed I won’t mind that it won’t happen again.

I’m unhappy with the Heart of Thorns packages so I go to the forums and discus why I’m unhappy with these packages (pricing, features). As a veteran player I’ve been broadly painted as entitled, a whiner, and a crybaby by players like you.

I have been directly called a conspiracy theorist and childish (by you), and one of the most famous white knights dared to liken me to a bigot. All because as a customer, I am not pleased with the product Anet is selling as currently packaged.

I’ve kept my calm far better than I would’ve dreamed.

I didn’t liken you to a bigot, I changed the original post at your request and explained it. I once has some respect for you, but you’re angry and you’re taking it out on everyone else. It’s not cool.

You’re not just saying something, but there’s a distinct bite to what you’re saying. Talking about people who work for Anet calling the Freshmen etc. I get that you’re emotional, but I think you’re picking on other people with the strength for your language and may not even realize it. I felt offended by your posts.

I didn’t call you out by name because I do still have some respect for you but saying I’ve offended you is a step too far my friend. I do appreciate that you alterred the post in question I’ll leave it there.

I honestly think we crossed wires somewhere, because we’ve never had this problem before. Either I misinterpreted something or you did but I never intended any offense. There are people I wouldn’t mind offending, mind you, but you’re not one of them.

I apologize if I’ve crossed some lines.

Vayne.8563:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Vayne.8563:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Sad Swordfish.9743:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Ohoni.6057:

Then back away from the discussion, because I guarantee you right now that HoT will definitely not be of equivalent size to the launch game. If it is, I will buy you a copy myself. Given your ultimatum, you will not be buying HoT, so there’s no more reason for you to be participating in the discussion.

This is what I am referring to. There is no need for the other poster to refrain from posting. You can disagree.

The thing is though, that it is reaching a point were you are just repeating the same rehashed points over and over. You’re not bringing anything new to the table. You merely flipflop being stuck in your own semantics and notions about value is. Come on.
It’s so telling that you and a few others are literally hammering this down everyones throats. I’ve seen you in at least 30 threads going on about this. It’s annoying.

People get it. They get it. Now move on, and let the chips fall where they may. You’re putting a serious damper on constructive discussions with your non-constructive vilification and conspiracy theories. It’s childish.

I’m acting childish? I’m spreading conspiracy theories? Quite the opposite actually, but since we’ve never conversed I won’t mind that it won’t happen again.

I’m unhappy with the Heart of Thorns packages so I go to the forums and discus why I’m unhappy with these packages (pricing, features). As a veteran player I’ve been broadly painted as entitled, a whiner, and a crybaby by players like you.

I have been directly called a conspiracy theorist and childish (by you), and one of the most famous white knights dared to liken me to a bigot. All because as a customer, I am not pleased with the product Anet is selling as currently packaged.

I’ve kept my calm far better than I would’ve dreamed.

I didn’t liken you to a bigot, I changed the original post at your request and explained it. I once has some respect for you, but you’re angry and you’re taking it out on everyone else. It’s not cool.

You’re not just saying something, but there’s a distinct bite to what you’re saying. Talking about people who work for Anet calling the Freshmen etc. I get that you’re emotional, but I think you’re picking on other people with the strength for your language and may not even realize it. I felt offended by your posts.

I didn’t call you out by name because I do still have some respect for you but saying I’ve offended you is a step too far my friend. I do appreciate that you alterred the post in question I’ll leave it there.

I honestly think we crossed wires somewhere, because we’ve never had this problem before. Either I misinterpreted something or you did but I never intended any offense. There are people I wouldn’t mind offending, mind you, but you’re not one of them.

I apologize if I’ve crossed some lines.

Accepted. I feel as though some posters confuse a similarly named poster with me and speak as if we’re carrying on a conversation we’ve never had.

Whatever the reason for the perceived animus I assure you it was unintended on my end.

I don’t know what all the fuss is about. IF you don’t want to pre order it because the cost is too high, then don’t pre order it. IF by the time it releases, the price does not come down, then don’t buy it. If 6 months in HoT goes on sale at a price you are willing to pay, then buy it.

I’m one of those players who bought the game recently, less than a month ago to be precise, for its full retail price of 40$ and I’m not bothered about the base game getting bundled together with the expansion. It will entice more people to give it a whirl.

However, the expansion being 50$ for even those who already have the base game makes me wait with the purchase. Most likely until it goes on sale. Not because I wish to boycott it or disagree with Arenanet’s pricing strategy but because putting down 90$ on a single game in a month is just something I can’t justify. That’s half a year worth of subscription.

I’ll continue to support the gem shop through a 10$ gem purchase each month but the expansion is a no-go for now. That being said, I wish Arenanet luck with the launch and I do hope that those who buy the expansion will enjoy it.

Tea.7025:

I’m one of those players who bought the game recently, less than a month ago to be precise, for its full retail price of 40$ and I’m not bothered about the base game getting bundled together with the expansion. It will entice more people to give it a whirl.

However, the expansion being 50$ for even those who already have the base game makes me wait with the purchase. Most likely until it goes on sale. Not because I wish to boycott it or disagree with Arenanet’s pricing strategy but because putting down 90$ on a single game in a month is just something I can’t justify. That’s half a year worth of subscription.

I’ll continue to support the gem shop through a 10$ gem purchase each month but the expansion is a no-go for now. That being said, I wish Arenanet luck with the launch and I do hope that those who buy the expansion will enjoy it.

If you bought via ANETs site you can get a refund for your purchase and then buy the game at 50. From what I understand though you lose your current account.

rhapsody.3615:

Kalavier.1097:

GuzziHero.2467:

Tere.4759:

Why would Anet do #2? I got the base game for a friend for 20.00. Why should people who got the game for 20.00 recently, get HOT for free? That would kitten me off and I bought the ultimate xpac. So I bought the original game at 60.00, I bought friends the original game at between 20.00 and 60.00 and bought the ultimate xpac yet I don’t think I should be getting anything for free.

Because they were mislead into buying the core game?

At the VERY least, anyone who purchased after HoT announcement should be given HoT at a reduced cost.

Mislead? How. Frankly that’d kitten off even more players because then you’d have the guys going “WHAT THE kitten? I bought GW2 the day before/week before they announced that!”

And the people who have been in the game since beta/launch (Like me and many others, including most GW1 vets) would be kittened off even more.

This is just like people kittening about paying full price for something the week before a sale goes live and moan endlessly about “How they would’ve waited until the sale if they had known about it, GIMME REFUND FOR THE AMOUNT THE DIFFERENCE WOULD BE!”

I don’t know of a single business that’d go “Oh, I’m so sorry, here, let me refund the full price item and give you the discount item!” if you bought it before the sale.

Now if you got it DURING the sale and were charged full price, that’s another issue.

Most businesses give you a refund of the difference on items you bought that go on sale within one week to 30 days depending on the company (in the US anyway).

There’s a legal cooling off period for everything bought on the internet in the EU. Not completely sure how long, but I think it’s 14 days. Which would make the ANet policy a generous one in that respect.

Problem is just that this only extends to goods bought directly from ANet. I’ve seen some ticked off posts from people who bought retail on the strength of the original HoT FAQ, and who are NOT getting their money back.

Here’s what’s going to happen. Everyone who is raging about this price and lack of content will come to the forums and post about it. They’ll make grandiose statements about how they’ll NEVER buy the xpac or speak to other peoples intentions on buying it. the forum threads will be condensed into one massive thread and the post counts with get upt to 10k-12k at which time Anet with claim something happened in the system and that thread was lost. People will QQ for a little more but no where near extent like before because everything has been said and people are tired and don’t want to redo everything. Everyone moves on and buys the game, spends a couple gems for an extra slot and enjoys the xpac.

Where do I come up with this you may ask and what “proof” do I have? I ask you to turn your attention to the introduction of Ascended gear.

Cheers and enjoy HoT!

Palimow.6342:

Here’s what’s going to happen. Everyone who is raging about this price and lack of content will come to the forums and post about it. They’ll make grandiose statements about how they’ll NEVER buy the xpac or speak to other peoples intentions on buying it. the forum threads will be condensed into one massive thread and the post counts with get upt to 10k-12k at which time Anet with claim something happened in the system and that thread was lost. People will QQ for a little more but no where near extent like before because everything has been said and people are tired and don’t want to redo everything. Everyone moves on and buys the game, spends a couple gems for an extra slot and enjoys the xpac.

Where do I come up with this you may ask and what “proof” do I have? I ask you to turn your attention to the introduction of Ascended gear.

Cheers and enjoy HoT!

I (and many others with me) never said I would never buy it. I assure you, HoT will be bought at such a time as I deem the price to be good value for what the expansion offers… but definitely no sooner.

And for the record: at this time, the basic expansion without a free character slot is NOT what I consider value for money. The digital items (especially the finisher) are useless and pointless fluff, imho, so the other expansion bundles aren’t even a consideration.

So… I’ll do what I do now: collect my log-in reward, work towards an achievement or two for 30 mins or so, and go do something else, like my RL job. And I will not be buying gems anymore.

I would be very impressed if anything is actually accomplished from all this, but from an outside perspective I don’t see the resolve needed to hold out post launch.

Everyone knows that Anet lies to their community, their community becomes distracted from the subject, loses focus, and goes back to playing the same shallow game that they’ve always played.

I for one as a person have yet to play post ascended, it’s a gear grind. A gear grind that the game is continually being developed around, hell they’re even buffing the base stats of ascended gear for some reason. Yet, I’m sure more and more people will harp on about how “No one is forcing you to craft Ascended Gear”.

With that said:

“No one is forcing you to buy the expansion.”

Palimow.6342:

Here’s what’s going to happen. Everyone who is raging about this price and lack of content will come to the forums and post about it. They’ll make grandiose statements about how they’ll NEVER buy the xpac or speak to other peoples intentions on buying it. the forum threads will be condensed into one massive thread and the post counts with get upt to 10k-12k at which time Anet with claim something happened in the system and that thread was lost. People will QQ for a little more but no where near extent like before because everything has been said and people are tired and don’t want to redo everything. Everyone moves on and buys the game, spends a couple gems for an extra slot and enjoys the xpac.

Where do I come up with this you may ask and what “proof” do I have? I ask you to turn your attention to the introduction of Ascended gear.

Cheers and enjoy HoT!

Doubt anyone said they’re boycotting HoT (I’m certainly not) I’m simply not buying it until I consider it worth my money without being shortchanged.

The ascended introduction isn’t what you want to use as proof though, half those players at least, never came came back.

If the price comes down to a something I consider reasonable for what’s been presented, sure, I’ll buy.

If it turns out HoT opens up the rest of our current big map, or opens up Cantha or Elona, and/or gives us playable Tengu, or Largos, or Centaurs, with starting zones for each, and new personal stories (sans level gaps) and anet has craftily kept it all a big secret until launch day, sure. I’ll buy.

Until then… pfft. No.

Tachenon.5270:

If the price comes down to a something I consider reasonable for what’s been presented, sure, I’ll buy.

If it turns out HoT opens up the rest of our current big map, or opens up Cantha or Elona, and/or gives us playable Tengu, or Largos, or Centaurs, with starting zones for each, and new personal stories (sans level gaps) and anet has craftily kept it all a big secret until launch day, sure. I’ll buy.

Until then… pfft. No.

Sorry but i laughed at this.
You want everything on the big wishlist done before you will buy it?
Ha…I’ll see you in game on launch day.

However, the expansion being 50$ for even those who already have the base game makes me wait with the purchase. Most likely until it goes on sale. Not because I wish to boycott it or disagree with Arenanet’s pricing strategy but because putting down 90$ on a single game in a month is just something I can’t justify. That’s half a year worth of subscription.

I’ll continue to support the gem shop through a 10$ gem purchase each month but the expansion is a no-go for now. That being said, I wish Arenanet luck with the launch and I do hope that those who buy the expansion will enjoy it.

If that’s your philosophy, you might want to just hold off on the gem purchases. I mean, the expansion likely won’t be out for at least a few months, possible five or more, so if you just saved up that $10 each month you’d have plenty to buy the expansion by the time it came out, or shortly after.

The ascended introduction isn’t what you want to use as proof though, half those players at least, never came came back.

It stands to the power of the Great Ascended Exodus that I’ve been playing the game since beta and this is the first I’ve heard of it. Seriously, people were bothered when Ascended armor came out?

Yeah, these things work so well and the players can be taken seriously. Look how well the boycott worked with Modern Warfare 2, check out all those people who agreed to Boycott MW2, and see how they all did not play the game on day 1. This screenshot was taken on day 1 of the release

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Galen Grey.4709:

The expansion is still “expanding” the core game, nothing has changed there.

I’ll be honest. I stopped reading your post after this gem.

why which part of it you found to be false exactly?

Galen Grey.4709:

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Galen Grey.4709:

The expansion is still “expanding” the core game, nothing has changed there.

I’ll be honest. I stopped reading your post after this gem.

why which part of it you found to be false exactly?

The part where you did not agree with them.