Guild Wars 2

Baolun.8316:

Taking time out to stab someone you don’t like while you’re actively being chased by a bigger threat is just plain dumb. Secure your own escape first, THEN betray the hero.

There’s an old saying: “I don’t have to outrun the tiger. I just have to outrun you.” I think that’s what she was supposed to be thinking when she did it.

It didn’t work.

First, she was on an airship over a jungle teaming with things ready to kill her.
Then the weak willed sylvarie turned, chances are, some attacked her, maybe getting in a few grazes, but at least wearing her down.

Next, and people seem to keep forgetting this, ITS REMARKABLE SHE EVEN SURVIVED A CRASH. Many of the soldiers either died or were seriously injured with all the blimps going down. You think she just walked out of it unscathed? Come on.

Next, chances are after the crash, having sustained injuries, she most likely didn’t get taken prisoner without a fight. So once again, more injuries.

Finally, basically being starved and tortured (locked up with Faolin I consider torture at least), no treatment of injuries (we can assume a few cracked ribs, since if I remember correctly she was moving her arms and legs ok), and chances are being moved deeper into the jungle didn’t provide much rest.

But despite all that, you expect her to still be able to put up a fight? Sorry, no.

Palador.2170:

Baolun.8316:

Taking time out to stab someone you don’t like while you’re actively being chased by a bigger threat is just plain dumb. Secure your own escape first, THEN betray the hero.

There’s an old saying: “I don’t have to outrun the tiger. I just have to outrun you.” I think that’s what she was supposed to be thinking when she did it.

It didn’t work.

Not to mention, double benefit. By having Eir left behind we would be preoccupied with saving Eir, thus letting Faolin escape. It was really a win / win from Faolin’s point of view in attacking Eir.

Serophous.9085:

But despite all that, you expect her to still be able to put up a fight? Sorry, no.

Part of the problem there is that they didn’t show any of those injuries.

She looked just like she always does. No blood. No bruises. Nothing.

It would have taken extra work, but they could have done something to make it very clear that she was on her “last legs” even before the betrayal. Then there would be less debate as to why she didn’t fight back, we’d have an obvious answer why.

Actually, she’s clearly bloody and bruised in that cutscene.

Rottaran Owain.6789:

Actually, she’s clearly bloody and bruised in that cutscene.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kU5euLJ8pqY

Well, yes, but let’s disregard that too and get back to complaining, shall we?

Captain Unusual.9163:

Rottaran Owain.6789:

Actually, she’s clearly bloody and bruised in that cutscene.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kU5euLJ8pqY

Well, yes, but let’s disregard that too and get back to complaining, shall we?

No no, lets actually examine this scene, since this is the whole point. I see some minor scrapes on her face, which is to be expected, and she’s filthy, also to be expected. But she moves just fine, smooth and without trouble. She’s an action hero, so even falling an unknown distance into wreckage and thorny vines only minorly inconvenienced her. She doesn’t seem dehydrated or malnourished, and we don’t actually have any reason to assume they weren’t fed or watered during transport. Mordremoth doesn’t need live subjects, but it is a lot easier to move people if they do the moving themselves, so it would have been worthwhile to them to feed the captives.

She then gets stabbed in the side. It’s probably painful, but even despite that she has the wherewithal to pull the thorn out and throw it accurately into Foalain’s back while she runs away. She then has the strength, not only to get up and face the Vinewrath, but to drop into a ready stance like she was going to do anything at all in a fight with it.

She doesn’t, at any point, appear to be anything but capable and battle ready. Then, inexplicably, she does nothing while it stabs her in the chest. That’s the problem people have with this scene.

Serophous.9085:

Palador.2170:

There’s an old saying: “I don’t have to outrun the tiger. I just have to outrun you.” I think that’s what she was supposed to be thinking when she did it.

It didn’t work.

Not to mention, double benefit. By having Eir left behind we would be preoccupied with saving Eir, thus letting Faolin escape. It was really a win / win from Faolin’s point of view in attacking Eir.

a) “I don’t have to outrun the tiger…” is reasonable when you’re running from a beast that wants 1 meal, not so much when you’re running from, essentially, a large organization that wants as many prisoners as possible.

b) Mordremoth has made it clear that it basically wants to eat all of Tyria and enslave everyone. Faolain claims she doesn’t want this to happen, and I think most of the “good guys” are pragmatic enough to set aside their quarrels and work with a villain if necessary to defeat the Big Bad – the Pact is clearly going to need all the help it can get after Mordremoth wrecked the fleet. If Faolain wasn’t terminally stupid, she’d surely realize that.

I did think of one way Faolain’s actions make sense, though – if her judgement is already being affected by Mordremoth. Dragon influence nudges her into making a stupid decision that makes her easier to recapture, and once that’s done she can be fully corrupted.

Baolun.8316:

Shoe.5821:

We’ve always been trying to kill Faolain though

It’s not like we could get angrier at her

But Eir was willing to help her escape from Mordremoth, presumably both due to general decency and due to not wanting Mordy to get another powerful minion by corrupting her. And they were being chased by a Mordremoth minion when Faolain betrayed her! Taking time out to stab someone you don’t like while you’re actively being chased by a bigger threat is just plain dumb. Secure your own escape first, THEN betray the hero.

It’s the Halfling-Dragon Principle: “If you find yourself in the company of a halfling and an ill-tempered dragon, remember that you do not have to outrun the dragon; you simply have to outrun the halfling.”

Except Norn are like the opposite of Halflings, but they’re still slower than a dragon (minion).

it ended like nothing, and im unhappy

Rich Fuel.7253:

it ended like nothing, and im unhappy

My favorite part was probably that her VA voices one of the first NPCs you talk to after leaving that story instance.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Captain Unusual.9163:

Rottaran Owain.6789:

Actually, she’s clearly bloody and bruised in that cutscene.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kU5euLJ8pqY

Well, yes, but let’s disregard that too and get back to complaining, shall we?

No no, lets actually examine this scene, since this is the whole point. I see some minor scrapes on her face, which is to be expected, and she’s filthy, also to be expected. But she moves just fine, smooth and without trouble. She’s an action hero, so even falling an unknown distance into wreckage and thorny vines only minorly inconvenienced her. She doesn’t seem dehydrated or malnourished, and we don’t actually have any reason to assume they weren’t fed or watered during transport. Mordremoth doesn’t need live subjects, but it is a lot easier to move people if they do the moving themselves, so it would have been worthwhile to them to feed the captives.

She then gets stabbed in the side. It’s probably painful, but even despite that she has the wherewithal to pull the thorn out and throw it accurately into Foalain’s back while she runs away. She then has the strength, not only to get up and face the Vinewrath, but to drop into a ready stance like she was going to do anything at all in a fight with it.

She doesn’t, at any point, appear to be anything but capable and battle ready. Then, inexplicably, she does nothing while it stabs her in the chest. That’s the problem people have with this scene.

You have to remember this game is rated T for teen, and as such, they are legally restrained as to how much violence, blood, and gore they can depict. To show Eir as fatally wounded, pained, and weakened as she truly was, would have been crossing that line; simply put, ANets hands were tied, they said her wounds were so bad she couldn’t survive, so it’s up to your imagination to fill that in.

1. Fighting on an airship: even if she received no combat wounds, battle fatigue would still set in
2. Suffering a crash landing in a flaming air ship: she would likely receive burns, lacerations, crushed ligaments, broken bones, shock and/or a concussion from the impact. How many of these conditions she suffered or how major they turned out to be is unknown, but she would not escape unscaved.
3. imprisoned for days without food, water, and medical attension: not only would she be malnuterished, but infections from her wounds would be setting in.
4. Forced to run to escape the enemy encampment: many of you claim that if she was able to run, she must be well enough to fight. However, I see this as her using the very last of her strength, aided by addrinalin and the will to survive. In this scenario, it was give it everything you’ve got or die. And she did give it everything she had, so that by the time she was stabbed, had nothing left. You say a norn should fight to the bitter end, but I think her capacity to run in the physical condition she was in, was a feat legendary enough to make any norn bost.
5. Finally, she was stabbed: perhaps the greatest damage done here was by Eir herself when she ripped out the thorn… being stabbed where she was in the first place can be fatal, but at least leaving the thorn impaled in her side bottled up the blood. Ripping it out as she did, without immediate medical help to close up the wound and replenish her blood pretty much sealed her fate. But once again, this was an act worthy of a great norn, she chose to die fighting. While this choice means she will die, at least she is able to but an end to her foe.

With all that said, there is no doubt in my mind that, not only would she die under these conditions, but would have no where near the strength to go down fighting. AND YET SHE DID. She didn’t give up on life until the very end, pouring all her strength into running, and she chose to die fighting, sacrafising what miniscute chance she had at surviving to finish off faolain. These are feats to be proud of, feats worthy of a norn.

changing tracks——-
That being said however, I cannot agree with her death. Besides giving her son a little push to defeat mordremoth -which, he was determined to do and in the process of doing anyways- her death did absolutely NOTHING to further the plot. They didn’t even make her sacrafice, her final victory, the death of faolain meaningful/impactful, because the very next instance faolain is back, and suddenly Eir died for nothing. That’s BULLkitten!

Moreover, the fact that Eir -the leader, and thus most prominent member of Destiny’s Edge- was left behind in the first place, when Mordremoth wanted the key figures of the pact brought to him makes no sense at all. She should have never been left there to begin with, but should have been dragged along with the rest of DE deeper into the jungle. That is what the dragon would have wanted, so the only reason for her to have been left behind was because ANET wanted to pull a cheap emotional blow on their audience. And an emotional impact for no other purpose than the impact itself… that’s just bad writing.

At least Treahearn had a hero’s death, at least his sacrafice laid the dragon low.

I sill have hope and dont give up. Eir – iconic GW2 character go down like some mere NPC. I hope that wa sso short and flat because Anet team have something special stored for us. I was told by some other Eir big fan that “glints egg could be the key. glint had the power to give life its only fitting her child carry the same will there is still hope and Eir is my fav character too”.

What got me was the literal “press f to honor” prompt after.

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

1. Fighting on an airship: even if she received no combat wounds, battle fatigue would still set in

She, and we, have done far worse with no trouble, so that’s not really the case. Besides the fact that she didn’t actually fight. The fight hadn’t even started before it was ended.

2. Suffering a crash landing in a flaming air ship: she would likely receive burns, lacerations, crushed ligaments, broken bones, shock and/or a concussion from the impact. How many of these conditions she suffered or how major they turned out to be is unknown, but she would not escape unscaved.

You’re attributing real world human conditions to her. Even discounting that this is a game she is of a completely alien species to humans, even though they appear similar they are not. It is reasonable to assume that he muscles are tougher, her bones are denser, any number of physiological differences to negate what a human might experience. And that doesn’t even get into the action hero aspect of her life. She is literally more resilient than normal people.

3. imprisoned for days without food, water, and medical attension: not only would she be malnuterished, but infections from her wounds would be setting in.

This is an assumption you and others are making. When did it say she was starved and not provided water?

4. Forced to run to escape the enemy encampment: many of you claim that if she was able to run, she must be well enough to fight. However, I see this as her using the very last of her strength, aided by addrinalin and the will to survive. In this scenario, it was give it everything you’ve got or die. And she did give it everything she had, so that by the time she was stabbed, had nothing left. You say a norn should fight to the bitter end, but I think her capacity to run in the physical condition she was in, was a feat legendary enough to make any norn bost.

Even if all the rest were true, the biggest burst of adrenaline she is going to experience, assuming Norn even have adrenaline, would be just before she’s about to die after being stabbed.

5. Finally, she was stabbed: perhaps the greatest damage done here was by Eir herself when she ripped out the thorn… being stabbed where she was in the first place can be fatal, but at least leaving the thorn impaled in her side bottled up the blood. Ripping it out as she did, without immediate medical help to close up the wound and replenish her blood pretty much sealed her fate. But once again, this was an act worthy of a great norn, she chose to die fighting. While this choice means she will die, at least she is able to but an end to her foe.

A gut shot is usually fatal without treatment, and it’s highly likely that alone could have killed her over time, without magic, but it’s also not a quick death. It’s a lingering slow death, meaning while it would have been unpleasant and painful it wouldn’t have dropped her, just slowed her down.

Very well stated and put. Eir was disgraced by ANET !

Lady Elyssa.2469:

In chapter 6 of the HoT story, Prisoners of the Dragon when Eir is defeated by a minion of Mordremoth as much as this was foreshadowed, her legacy and her honour have, I feel, been disgraced.

First and foremost Eir was Norn and for over 200 years Norn have been known to be great solo Hunters and Eir was firm in her role in during the start of young Norn’s in guiding them to build their own legends.

Eir was a fierce and strong ally with Wisdom enough to have once lead Divinity’s Edge.

Eir may have been a little weakened from being imprisonment and was clearly worse for wear but with her Totem spirit being Wolf I believe she would have conserved her Strength and even though stabbed by Faolin, she still gave as good as she got.

To see Eir being impaled in to a nearby tree without one last fight, however futile, is what bring disgrace to her Legacy and in my eyes, even if Eir knew the fight was already lost she would have relished that one last chance to go out fighting with tooth and claw.

Eir could have Become the Wolf and entered a Blood Frenzy to recoup some of her strength, Eir could have and indeed should have gone out fighting, with her honour as a Norn intact.

Eir deserves a Heroes death as she also deserves a Heroes Remembrance.

Kal Spiro.9745:

She, and we, have done far worse with no trouble, so that’s not really the case. Besides the fact that she didn’t actually fight. The fight hadn’t even started before it was ended.

You’re missing the point, while battle wounds and fatigue alone is no big deal, when compacted with EVERYTHING ELSE she suffered with, it all begins to add up and take a toll on you. Norn may be stronger, heartier, tougher, with more stanima and endurence than us, but even their bodies have limits. Every tried playing a norn character??? They die just as easily, from the same wounds as a human character. And the npc’s die even easier, dropping like flies left and right, norn npcs included. Granted Eir is faaaar stronger than your average npc norn, but not much stronger than the player character.

You’re attributing real world human conditions to her. Even discounting that this is a game she is of a completely alien species to humans, even though they appear similar they are not. It is reasonable to assume that he muscles are tougher, her bones are denser, any number of physiological differences to negate what a human might experience. And that doesn’t even get into the action hero aspect of her life. She is literally more resilient than normal people.

Even action movie/game hero’s are not invinsible, they have their limits, weaknesses, flaws, and vulnerabilities. At least, well structured ones do. I remember more than one scene where Harison ford gets his kitten handed to him. The same can be said about different humanoid species such as norn, yes their bodies are tougher, but tougher doesn’t mean invensible. Action hero’s take the same wounds normal people do, and they hurt by those wounds too, just, not as much, as action hero’s have the ability to ‘shake it off’, and ‘grin and bear it’. But that they are able to ignore the wounds and keep going does not mean that they are not effected by the wounds all together. Once again, this is a matter of compacting events and their subsequental wounds, while the crash alone may not have such dire effects on her, when added up with all the other things she went though, the reprocusions are severe

This is an assumption you and others are making. When did it say she was starved and not provided water?

This is in fact NOT an assumption, go replay it, Eir said it herself after you rescue her…

Even if all the rest were true, the biggest burst of adrenaline she is going to experience, assuming Norn even have adrenaline, would be just before she’s about to die after being stabbed.

She didn’t anticipate there would be a fight and put all her energy into escaping, by the time she’s stabbed, even if addrinalin does kick in, she’s too weak to do much with it.

A gut shot is usually fatal without treatment, and it’s highly likely that alone could have killed her over time, without magic, but it’s also not a quick death. It’s a lingering slow death, meaning while it would have been unpleasant and painful it wouldn’t have dropped her, just slowed her down.

In reality, a gut shot would drop most people. Not a quick death no, but they wouldn’t be up and on their feet either, not to mention in fighting condition. Yet Eir did stand, threw a knife-sized-thorn with enough force to impale faolain 2,3 yards away, and faced her death head on, with eyes open and acceptance (which is also a norn feat to be proud of, as it requires bravery most people lack) with everything up til now compacted she didn’t have the energy to fight, so she went out the bravest, proudest way a norn could in her situation, facing death head on. I think that was well portrayed to anyone paying attension.

No, I state again, my problem wasn’t how she died, but that she died in the first place. Being held prisoner there makes no sense, and her death did nothing to further the story, ANET even robbed her of a hero’s death by bringing faolain back to life, making Eir’s death pointless. That is how Anet insulted Eir.

Norn are no more resilient than a human of comparable experience.

A, “gut shot,” is not necessarily a slow death. It can be very quick, particularly when the victim’s resistance to shock has been degraded by other injuries, deprivation, etc.

Assuming that Eir did not want to die, it is a reasonable expectation that if she was capable of an action that would have delayed or prevented her death she would have at least attempted said action. She did not dodge the death blow and so logically she couldn’t.

Ultimately she stared death in the face and didn’t falter, didn’t look away, didn’t blink. Brave as hell to the end. Definitely worthy of respect.

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

You have to remember this game is rated T for teen, and as such, they are legally restrained as to how much violence, blood, and gore they can depict. To show Eir as fatally wounded, pained, and weakened as she truly was, would have been crossing that line; simply put, ANets hands were tied, they said her wounds were so bad she couldn’t survive, so it’s up to your imagination to fill that in.

I’m aware of the rating, but there’s still more they could have done to make it clear how injured she was.

A good choice would have been to have one arm hanging limp and useless. That alone would have made it clear that she couldn’t really fight. Her hair could have been a mess, and her armor actually torn up. Possibly torn up on purpose to make some crude bandages or a splint for an arm or leg. And go without food and drink for a day, and tell me how your voice sounds. Tough or not, after what she’d been through, her voice should have been rougher.

They didn’t need to show a bunch of blood or horrific injuries to get the point across, but they needed to do more than what they did. I guess what I’m trying to say is that she doesn’t ACT injured. She acts like she’s fine, but just gives up. I know that’s not what the story says, but that’s what we’re getting from her looks and especially her actions. I think that’s part of what doesn’t sit well with people.

Palador.2170:

I’m aware of the rating, but there’s still more they could have done to make it clear how injured she was.

I think that an inability to react to a fairly slow, telegraphed, attack is a solid indication of something being seriously wrong with an experienced combatant of legendary status.

Ashen.2907:

Palador.2170:

I’m aware of the rating, but there’s still more they could have done to make it clear how injured she was.

I think that an inability to react to a fairly slow, telegraphed, attack is a solid indication of something being seriously wrong with an experienced combatant of legendary status.

Or it’s a solid indication of bad writing.

But… hey! Maybe she’s planning on coming back as a glowing blue ghost so she can give Braham advice as he slowly works up to confronting his father.

Palador.2170:

Or it’s a solid indication of bad writing.

Nah.

Being able to hold her own in a fight after being dropped out of an exploding aircraft, provided no medical care for gods know how many internal injuries from the impact, starved, dehydrated, and stabbed would have been the bad writing.

Almost all of you are debating about some conditions that should or shouldn’t cause Eir’s death or ability to fight back, survive. The point here is that they shouldnt kill Her at first place. They can’t? Of course they can…its their game. But they totally forgot or rather never even thought that theres strong fanbase of Destiny’s Edge characters rly attached to them. And if u dont understand it or think its silly at least please let it be and dont make fun of it.

Ashen.2907:

Palador.2170:

Or it’s a solid indication of bad writing.

Nah.

Being able to hold her own in a fight after being dropped out of an exploding aircraft, provided no medical care for gods know how many internal injuries from the impact, starved, dehydrated, and stabbed would have been the bad writing.

Which takes us back to the point that she didn’t look or act like she was in that kind of condition.

From the moment we free her, we see her stand up, run, stop to help an enemy, repays the stab by pulling the thorn out and performing a masterful throw with what is basically an unbalanced spike, and then… “Oh, right. This is the part where I die. Okay, I’ll just stand here.”

Zabiyaka.2567:

Almost all of you are debating about some conditions that should or shouldn’t cause Eir’s death or ability to fight back, survive. The point here is that they shouldnt kill Her at first place. They can’t? Of course they can…its their game. But they totally forgot or rather never even thought that theres strong fanbase of Destiny’s Edge characters rly attached to them. And if u dont understand it or think its silly at least please let it be and dont make fun of it.

No, I think they DO understand that Eir has some fans. That’s one of the reasons they killed her. Killing someone nobody cares about has no real impact.

As I’ve said earlier, I don’t like that it happened like this to begin with. But it did, and I doubt it will somehow be undone. Giving good feedback (pro and con) might make future story segments better, though.

What got me was the literal “press f to honor” prompt after.

given that this didnt actually seem to do anything, i’m convinced it was a deliberate joke

“Oh, right. This is the part where I die. Okay, I’ll just stand here.”

that actually does make a lot of sense from the norn pov. they are very tied to their narratives, and if you’ve decided ’i’m going to die anyway’ then you face death like a true norn rather than scrambling around in panic like a coward.

Palador.2170:

Zabiyaka.2567:

Almost all of you are debating about some conditions that should or shouldn’t cause Eir’s death or ability to fight back, survive. The point here is that they shouldnt kill Her at first place. They can’t? Of course they can…its their game. But they totally forgot or rather never even thought that theres strong fanbase of Destiny’s Edge characters rly attached to them. And if u dont understand it or think its silly at least please let it be and dont make fun of it.

No, I think they DO understand that Eir has some fans. That’s one of the reasons they killed her. Killing someone nobody cares about has no real impact.

As I’ve said earlier, I don’t like that it happened like this to begin with. But it did, and I doubt it will somehow be undone. Giving good feedback (pro and con) might make future story segments better, though.

But for many ppl its a very negative impact towards a game itself. Taking away enjoyment of GW and desire for further play. U mean some wet eyes touchy moment and I mean totally wrecking someones experience or and feelings.

Palador.2170:

Ashen.2907:

Palador.2170:

Or it’s a solid indication of bad writing.

Nah.

Being able to hold her own in a fight after being dropped out of an exploding aircraft, provided no medical care for gods know how many internal injuries from the impact, starved, dehydrated, and stabbed would have been the bad writing.

Which takes us back to the point that she didn’t look or act like she was in that kind of condition.

From the moment we free her, we see her stand up, run, stop to help an enemy, repays the stab by pulling the thorn out and performing a masterful throw with what is basically an unbalanced spike, and then… “Oh, right. This is the part where I die. Okay, I’ll just stand here.”

How would you show her injuries? You mentioned bandages and splints, but you have to remember they are not taking care of her, so who would tie on the bandage, and from where would they get the medical supplies.

I suppose they could have showed her limping, or an arm hanging uselessly at her side and possible even created a destroyed armor skin. But while I admit they could have done more, they did show pain and weakness on her face, so they didn’t ignore showing her condition all together as you suggest.

I think the running and stabbing is actually her fighting back to the best of her ability as a norn should. A feat that she had to give her all to accomplish, and having done it had nothing left.

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

How would you show her injuries? You mentioned bandages and splints, but you have to remember they are not taking care of her, so who would tie on the bandage, and from where would they get the medical supplies.

I suppose they could have showed her limping, or an arm hanging uselessly at her side and possible even created a destroyed armor skin. But while I admit they could have done more, they did show pain and weakness on her face, so they didn’t ignore showing her condition all together as you suggest.

I think the running and stabbing is actually her fighting back to the best of her ability as a norn should. A feat that she had to give her all to accomplish, and having done it had nothing left.

I’d think that a norn ranger, of all people, would know how to perform a little personal first aid.

And I agree, that was all she had to give. What I’m saying is that they didn’t show that very well. One line of dialogue and some cosmetic changes to her face, that’s it. This was Eir’s final moment, and they just… well, they did less than they needed to.

Even a good final line from her, if it had been done right, would have helped. Imagine if she had used that last moment to ask Wolf to watch over Braham, or to tell Snaff that she will see him soon.

(Also, the people in DE 2.0 need to learn to just go out and BUY their new weapons, instead of prying them from the blood-soaked hands of the remains of their nearest and dearest.)

also i went and watched it again and it wasnt slow or telegraphed it was a really fast tailstab after a bunch ofposturing

Eir is my favarte character in the game.. thats why my main character is a norn too. when i first see Eir wallpapers, i want play this race. She looks so legandary.

But now, ANet just killed her like that. Not even a fight. What an insult for a norn.

I didn’t like the death scene much either. It felt odd. I didn’t get the feeling that Eir accepted her fate (though I thought that would have been nice). Nor did I think she was unable put up some semblance of a fight. She seemed confused and unsure of herself, like a deer caught in the headlights.

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

Palador.2170:

Ashen.2907:

Palador.2170:

Or it’s a solid indication of bad writing.

Nah.

Being able to hold her own in a fight after being dropped out of an exploding aircraft, provided no medical care for gods know how many internal injuries from the impact, starved, dehydrated, and stabbed would have been the bad writing.

Which takes us back to the point that she didn’t look or act like she was in that kind of condition.

From the moment we free her, we see her stand up, run, stop to help an enemy, repays the stab by pulling the thorn out and performing a masterful throw with what is basically an unbalanced spike, and then… “Oh, right. This is the part where I die. Okay, I’ll just stand here.”

How would you show her injuries? You mentioned bandages and splints, but you have to remember they are not taking care of her, so who would tie on the bandage, and from where would they get the medical supplies.

I suppose they could have showed her limping, or an arm hanging uselessly at her side and possible even created a destroyed armor skin. But while I admit they could have done more, they did show pain and weakness on her face, so they didn’t ignore showing her condition all together as you suggest.

I think the running and stabbing is actually her fighting back to the best of her ability as a norn should. A feat that she had to give her all to accomplish, and having done it had nothing left.

Pretty much this.

She did a masterful job, as a Norn should, of hiding her weakness to the best of her ability, for as long as she could. Admirable.

Glacial.9516:

I didn’t like the death scene much either. It felt odd. I didn’t get the feeling that Eir accepted her fate (though I thought that would have been nice). Nor did I think she was unable put up some semblance of a fight. She seemed confused and unsure of herself, like a deer caught in the headlights.

How I expected it

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Eir’s stare pierces through the Modrem, sizing it up and weighing her options. She prepares herself and focuses on the stinger’s movement. It lunges toward her and she waits, waits, waits and NOW! Dodges to the side, tumbling in the dirt and landing on one knee. She never takes her eyes off the beast.

It raises its appendage for a second strike, this time from above . Eir again leaps at the last second, but she overestimates her strength. She’s too slow. The sharp tip scrapes across her thigh, drawing a cry from Eir that sounds out with as much ferocity as it does pain. Braham calls to Eir, “Hang on Mother, I’m coming!” and charges ahead of his companions through the vines and foliage.

Eir pulls herself to her feet. She’s gasping for air and is nearly out of strength. The Mordrem knows it too. It’s readying its tailspike for the final blow, deciding just how it wants to pierce into Eir’s flesh and how pleased its Mordremaster will be with it. The stinger stiffens and locks onto her. It cuts through the air with arrow-like speed. Eir knows she can’t possibly get out of its way, not with her wounded leg. Her spirit wavers.

Braham breaks through the foliage and cries out, “MOTHER!” Eir turns to him and looks into Braham’s eyes. She nods to him affirmingly. “Not yet. My story isn’t over,” she whispers to herself, “It will live on. Through Braham.” She smiles before turning back to the Mordrem with fierce determination, accepting her fate.

Alternate ending

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The stinger stiffens and locks onto her. It cuts through the air with arrow-like speed. Eir knows she can’t possibly get out of its way, not with her wounded leg. Her spirit wavers. Hope is draining from her like sand in an hourglass. She closes her eyes, her entire being focused on the sound of impending death from the Mordrem spike piercing through the air when… A familiar yelp rings out and breaks Eir’s silence. She opens her eyes to see Garm, impaled by the stinger just inches before her.

Her eyes widen and fury builds inside her like nothing seen before at the death of her beloved companion. Her body shakes with uncontrollable power. She growls and eyes the Mordrem. She begins to change, not into Bear or Wolf, but into some ferocious hybrid over four times as large. She charges the mordrem, tearing into it with vicious claws and ripping its appendages off with her powerful jaws. In a matter of seconds she turns the Mordrem into a scattered mess of tendrils and thorns.

Braham and co. break through the vine barriers and see beast-Eir in a frenzy. Braham runs to her and tries to console her but Eir’s mind is lost. She slashes back at Braham and knocks him away with grievous wounds to his chest. The rest of Destiny’s Edge 2.5 move in to care for Braham and calm Eir.

But Eir kills them all. Mordemoth looks like this -> (O.O). Nearby Mordrem warriors slowly back away, keeping their hands in front of them and not showing any threatening signs. Wherever she goes, vines retreat from Eir’s location and Mordemoth’s minions quickly flee. The same is said for the other Dragon minions. Perhaps the Elder Dragons shall consider forming a Pact of their own…

Some interesting alternatives you have suggested and I think that if I was to consider suggesting alternative ending options then I think mine would go something like this:

This would have been a much more deserving end with Eir’s fiery nature shining through until the end and it would have shown her skill as a tactician and not letting her friends and son simply walk headlong in to the waiting trap to be picked off as Faolin had been.

Braham Eirson is always too quick to simply rush in head first, a trait clearly inherited from his mother. Eir chose to stand her ground and fight and she sacrificed herself that her friends and her son might live.

This would be something to shake Braham to his very core but not without also teaching him some valuable lessons. Braham would go on to re-evaluate his previously reckless and thoughtless approach to simply rushing in to dangerous situations.

From this Braham’s transition to becoming a Dragonhunter would have proved worthwhile and his growth in wisdom that allows him to still support his friends in a way that honors his mothers memory as well as to finally begin down his own path of becoming a Legendary Hunter on the greatest hunt of all, Dragons!

Palador.2170:

I’d think that a norn ranger, of all people, would know how to perform a little personal first aid.

And I agree, that was all she had to give. What I’m saying is that they didn’t show that very well. One line of dialogue and some cosmetic changes to her face, that’s it. This was Eir’s final moment, and they just… well, they did less than they needed to.

Even a good final line from her, if it had been done right, would have helped. Imagine if she had used that last moment to ask Wolf to watch over Braham, or to tell Snaff that she will see him soon.

I agree with this sentiment, they could have, and should have shown more of her injurys/weakness.

As for the weapons, it’s pretty normal for a decendent to enherit their ancestors weapons/armor, it’s tradition and family pride for a cherished family artifact to be passed down the line to remember and honor them by.

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

As for the weapons, it’s pretty normal for a decendent to enherit their ancestors weapons/armor, it’s tradition and family pride for a cherished family artifact to be passed down the line to remember and honor them by.

Its less expensive too.

Playing this encounter with a number of people live at the time the scene impacted us. A lot were in the state of disbelief and it triggerred emotional ties so I would say in that regard that ANet succeeded. Its also brought more empathy to Braham’s character and added new depth to him. As far as Eir being in a state to fight, to me the turning and facing down the vinetooth translated into this, but no, considering the state that people were in after being released I wouldn’t expect much reaction time from Eir. The same creature dropped rested members of the players own group pretty fast as well when replaying the scene solo told a story as well.

Justlike most people I absolutely hate Eir dying in the first place. Anyone else, Zojja or Logan perhaps, but Eir?!?
Anyways her end was not all bad. The way it appeared to me, when Brahm called out and warned her, she nodded slightly as if saying: I know. She made peace with there not being a chance at survivel. Not for her. So she made peace, nodded toward her son and friends, and turned to face her death head on.
But that’s just my 2 cents

What I want to know is…what happened to Garm?

megakittytron.5971:

What I want to know is…what happened to Garm?

Probably died falling from the airship. Or was killed shortly after defending Eir from the mordrem who captured her.

megakittytron.5971:

What I want to know is…what happened to Garm?

Braham mentions not knowing if he was with her in the crash, so no one’s sure.

If they wanted to kill a member of DE for drama that ends up not going anywhere, I don’t know why they killed off Eir instead of Zojja, who’s hardly done anything and never shows up because of issues between ANet and Felicia Day.

Orrrrrr, ok hear me out. Maybe Garm survived somehow, but is severely wounded and Rox ends up finding him and adopting him as a ranger pet? Or maybe Braham adopts him (but Braham is not a ranger like Eir). Garm can’t be dead darnit! sniff sniff

Not sad that Eir’s gone. By the time GW2 came around, she was tremendously soft.

Still, she should have been better written to go down fighting.

And yet, props for that throw vs Faolain~
I just wish she hadn’t gone down like a chump afterward. :\

Aedelric.1287:

Just think next time mate.

Eir’s death was not wasted, and her death may not have been heroic but it had more meaning. Being killed Mordy infront of Braham has given him drive to defeat the Dragon and perhaps all Dragons giving a bland character more depth and forwarding his story.

Faolin being the reason for Eir’s death also creates conflict within Caithe as she loves Faolin but was a good friend to Eir. Ultimately she makes a decision to side with us and fight to avenge Eir and give peace to her love.

It also gives your own character an enemy to focus on as during much of the story Mordremoth has no face. As I said, it my not be heroic but it does have meaning, it furthers two fairly mediocre characters stories.

Anyway her death is of no great loss to me, their are more interesting characters.

Read: lazy storywriting. Seems to a theme with this game nowadays.

Aedelric.1287:

Lady Elyssa.2469:

I make no justification for stating facts.

You may not be aware but forum titles cannot be changed except by the Mods, who I am sure should they agree with your opinion will be more than happy to.

Just think next time mate.

Eir’s death was not wasted, and her death may not have been heroic but it had more meaning. Being killed Mordy infront of Braham has given him drive to defeat the Dragon and perhaps all Dragons giving a bland character more depth and forwarding his story.

Faolin being the reason for Eir’s death also creates conflict within Caithe as she loves Faolin but was a good friend to Eir. Ultimately she makes a decision to side with us and fight to avenge Eir and give peace to her love.

It also gives your own character an enemy to focus on as during much of the story Mordremoth has no face. As I said, it my not be heroic but it does have meaning, it furthers two fairly mediocre characters stories.

Anyway her death is of no great loss to me, their are more interesting characters.

In Dante’s Inferno there are nine layers. Betrayers and traitors are placed in the ninth. Not only is betraying people who think of you as a friend and “ally” very wrong but betraying someone right after they save your life adds a whole other dimension. For perspective wrathful murderers and warmongers are placed in the seventh circle.

But we don’t need to go with Dante to know that Faolin crossed a moral event horizon and is therefore irredeemable. One cannot simply be neutral, those with Faolin are by default against us, as they are on the very side of someone who betrayed us.

Agemnon.4608:

Aedelric.1287:

Lady Elyssa.2469:

I make no justification for stating facts.

You may not be aware but forum titles cannot be changed except by the Mods, who I am sure should they agree with your opinion will be more than happy to.

Just think next time mate.

Eir’s death was not wasted, and her death may not have been heroic but it had more meaning. Being killed Mordy infront of Braham has given him drive to defeat the Dragon and perhaps all Dragons giving a bland character more depth and forwarding his story.

Faolin being the reason for Eir’s death also creates conflict within Caithe as she loves Faolin but was a good friend to Eir. Ultimately she makes a decision to side with us and fight to avenge Eir and give peace to her love.

It also gives your own character an enemy to focus on as during much of the story Mordremoth has no face. As I said, it my not be heroic but it does have meaning, it furthers two fairly mediocre characters stories.

Anyway her death is of no great loss to me, their are more interesting characters.

In Dante’s Inferno there are nine layers. Betrayers and traitors are placed in the ninth. Not only is betraying people who think of you as a friend and “ally” very wrong but betraying someone right after they save your life adds a whole other dimension. For perspective wrathful murderers and warmongers are placed in the seventh circle.

But we don’t need to go with Dante to know that Faolin crossed a moral event horizon and is therefore irredeemable. One cannot simply be neutral, those with Faolin are by default against us, as they are on the very side of someone who betrayed us.

Except we work with a Nightmare Court duchess in Dragon’s Stand.

My problem with Eir’s death is how pathetic and disappointing it was in a dramatic and quality storytelling sense.

For one thing, in the scene, she just turns around and stares at the creature and does absolutely nothing to attempt to get away or fight. This is a very un-Norn-like response, especially from a master hunter and fighter like Eir. She would have fought or at least dodged and run. Period.

Next, Eir dies to a random minion with no fight early on in the jungle expedition. Talk about underwhelming. It’s almost ridiculous. It feels way too soon, for one thing, and there was nothing about the details of her death that makes us feel anything other than, “Oh, wow, that was quick.” Or, “Oh, wow, I liked Eir. I wish she hadn’t died.” Such weak emotion for something that should have felt epic and horrifying.

A much better death for Eir (since, apparently, she had to die) would have been to have her and Braham continue to strengthen their fledgling relationship while struggling through the legion of Mordrem all the way to Dragon’s Stand. This might have even included a frank talk between her and Braham about his upbringing and his father, so we better understand that part of the story.

Then, while fighting either the dragon itself or one of its extremely powerful lieutenants near the end, she finds herself in a position where she and Zojja are in a dangerous situation and only one of them can make it out alive, and Eir sacrifices herself for Zojja, someone she’s had a really rocky relationship with for years.

Dying in this way, Eir goes down as a skilled and courageous warrior. She adds something incredibly heroic to her legend, and she finds a kind of absolution for her guilt over Snaff’s death. If written well, it could also have had elements of brave humor and tearjerking emotion.

Overall, I’m just really disappointed with the way they chose to kill off such a wonderful and integral member of the legendary Destiny’s Edge.

It is kinda depressing now playing through all the old story mode dungeons with my Revenant, seeing Eir show up. . . knowing how her story ends.

Daralii.8940:

megakittytron.5971:

What I want to know is…what happened to Garm?

Braham mentions not knowing if he was with her in the crash, so no one’s sure.

If they wanted to kill a member of DE for drama that ends up not going anywhere, I don’t know why they killed off Eir instead of Zojja, who’s hardly done anything and never shows up because of issues between ANet and Felicia Day.

Interesting, what issues?

Well, I already knew Eir was going to die before the expansion came out and this was pretty much how I envisioned it. Honestly I think her death was fitting for a Norn. Lorewise to a Norn, dying in battle and having your legend told is the best way to go rather than dying of old age (which very few do). Sure you could say “she wasn’t battling the Vinetooth specifically” but she was still fighting against all of the jungle.

So as bummed as I am to see her go, I am not surprised at all.