Guild Wars 2

Zehnchu.4985:

If you can’t see the difference between achievement and Mastery insights you have nothing further to add

Maybe you can explain the meaningful difference between:

• Finding a thing in an out-of-the-way spot — each strongbox in VB grants a mastery point
• Reaching a spot marked on the map (that is tricky to get to) — each mastery insight grants one point.

I get that one is called a “Mastery Insight” and the other is called an “Achievement”, but I’m not sure that anyone outside of GW2 would sort them in different categories in terms of the mechanics of unlocking them.

Obviously, many achievements are more difficult to unlock, many are more time consuming. But they all have in common that they require something more than just wandering around aimlessly; we have to go out of our way to fulfill the requirements.

There are 22 mastery insights in the four original HoT maps and fewer than 10 are needed to complete the story. The five LS3 maps require 17 points and have 14 insights, a deficit that can be easily made up from the surplus in the original four HoT maps.

Since the game offers far more unlock points than required to play the story and navigate the maps… and it even offers more points than needed to max all masteries, why does this distinction matter?

I don’t like adventures (if I wanted to play console-style games, I’d, you know, own a console). However, they are in the game and I’m willing to give them a try just to see if I was missing something (I wasn’t). I also recognize that if I want to mastery the game (e.g. max all the masteries), I need to go outside my comfort zone.

Zehnchu.4985:

Vayne.8563:

Zehnchu.4985:

Vayne.8563:

I maxed out all the masteries in HOT just from doing HOT anyway before the living story stuff even came out.

I am sure a lot of people did too when it was still shinny, yet it still doesn’t dismiss the fact that it is a flawed system.

The majority of mastery points in HoT and base game are gained from achievements only, how many mastery points gained by Mastery insights 36.

That doesn’t make it flawed. Even mastery insights are an achievement. So 100% of the mastery points are based on achievements. They put enough easy stuff in there (strong boxes and insights) to get all the basic ones. If you’re decent at arcade type stuff there’s far more you can get easily.

You can get many in Dragon Stand just by running the meta. The system isn’t flawed because you say it’s flawed.

At the beginning people were getting them because it was busy and new. Now they can further that goal in new zones as well.

Not sure what you find flawed about that.

If you can’t see the difference between achievement and Mastery insights you have nothing further to add

Mastery Insights is an achievement category for achievements earned by communing with Maguuma Mastery Insights located in Verdant Brink, Auric Basin, and Tangled Depths.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mastery_Insights

All LS3 mastery insights are a part of achievements in their respective story tabs.

I hate the mastery achievements system. I am not going to spend the rest of my life trying to do things I hate to do the things I would like to be able to do. I have no interest in wasting away to do those things. I bought this game to have fun and not to have a second full time job trying to get mastery points by some miracle chance there is enough people on at the time I am and the events are completed. I have no interest in Jumping puzzles. I hate PVP and I have no ability or wish to do raids. So I will now be left out of all the things I could have build through crafting because I can not get the mats and recipes I need to create them without mastery points I can’t get. You changed the dynamics of a game that was fun and unhindered to players like me and took the fun of keeping up with others away.

Daphnie.6730:

I hate the mastery achievements system. I am not going to spend the rest of my life trying to do things I hate to do the things I would like to be able to do. I have no interest in wasting away to do those things. I bought this game to have fun and not to have a second full time job trying to get mastery points by some miracle chance there is enough people on at the time I am and the events are completed. I have no interest in Jumping puzzles. I hate PVP and I have no ability or wish to do raids. So I will now be left out of all the things I could have build through crafting because I can not get the mats and recipes I need to create them without mastery points I can’t get. You changed the dynamics of a game that was fun and unhindered to players like me and took the fun of keeping up with others away.

You only need 112 out of 185 available mastery points to max the masteries required to craft HoT legendary weapons. Hardly a hindrance.

Ayrilana.1396:

Daphnie.6730:

I hate the mastery achievements system. I am not going to spend the rest of my life trying to do things I hate to do the things I would like to be able to do. I have no interest in wasting away to do those things. I bought this game to have fun and not to have a second full time job trying to get mastery points by some miracle chance there is enough people on at the time I am and the events are completed. I have no interest in Jumping puzzles. I hate PVP and I have no ability or wish to do raids. So I will now be left out of all the things I could have build through crafting because I can not get the mats and recipes I need to create them without mastery points I can’t get. You changed the dynamics of a game that was fun and unhindered to players like me and took the fun of keeping up with others away.

You only need 112 out of 185 available mastery points to max the masteries required to craft HoT legendary weapons. Hardly a hindrance.

Assuming that you started your Masteries knowing that you were going to make a Legendary and so planned your Mastery progression with that in mind, you are correct. I don’t happen to know any people who did that although I’m sure it is technically possible.

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

Daphnie.6730:

I hate the mastery achievements system. I am not going to spend the rest of my life trying to do things I hate to do the things I would like to be able to do. I have no interest in wasting away to do those things. I bought this game to have fun and not to have a second full time job trying to get mastery points by some miracle chance there is enough people on at the time I am and the events are completed. I have no interest in Jumping puzzles. I hate PVP and I have no ability or wish to do raids. So I will now be left out of all the things I could have build through crafting because I can not get the mats and recipes I need to create them without mastery points I can’t get. You changed the dynamics of a game that was fun and unhindered to players like me and took the fun of keeping up with others away.

You only need 112 out of 185 available mastery points to max the masteries required to craft HoT legendary weapons. Hardly a hindrance.

Assuming that you started your Masteries knowing that you were going to make a Legendary and so planned your Mastery progression with that in mind, you are correct. I don’t happen to know any people who did that although I’m sure it is technically possible.

Not like there’s much else to spend maguuma mastery points on…

Did you mean Core Tyria Mastery Points?

Djinn.9245:

nottsgman.8206:

if you’re going for a legendary, you must do some things you might not enjoy.

Not sure why.

It should be obvious … the game is not designed around an individual’s wants.

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

Did you mean Core Tyria Mastery Points?

Both. You need the core Tyria crafting masteries, but you also need Itzel, Nuhoch, Exalted and Gliding masteries maxed out to buy stuff for Gift of Insights for HoT legendaries.

If people don’t want to go out of their comfort zone to earn things that’s their problem, not the games. Mastery points are not excessively difficult to get, you just have to do something specific.

I disregarded them referring to core masteries as the thread is about HoT ones and they replied to my post which was about HoT ones.

Haleydawn.3764:

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

Did you mean Core Tyria Mastery Points?

If people don’t want to go out of their comfort zone to earn things that’s their problem, not the games. Mastery points are not excessively difficult to get, you just have to do something specific.

Interesting perspective. It’s easy for you to say that people have a problem, but sometimes player problems can turn into game problems. People choosing to leave the game due to frustration with ANet’s decisions could very well be a problem for the developer. I’m not sure that yet another reason to bleed players is ideal for GW2.

As for me, I would not have minded the way Masteries were implemented had ANet not spoken of them as an alternative type of progression instead of the usual level-based progression we see with XPacs. Level progression has always been via experience in any RPG I’ve ever seen, and XP is always gained doing almost anything the game offers. So, we went from an open acquisition progression system to a combined open/closed system.

Zehnchu.4985:

Vayne.8563:

Zehnchu.4985:

Vayne.8563:

I maxed out all the masteries in HOT just from doing HOT anyway before the living story stuff even came out.

I am sure a lot of people did too when it was still shinny, yet it still doesn’t dismiss the fact that it is a flawed system.

The majority of mastery points in HoT and base game are gained from achievements only, how many mastery points gained by Mastery insights 36.

That doesn’t make it flawed. Even mastery insights are an achievement. So 100% of the mastery points are based on achievements. They put enough easy stuff in there (strong boxes and insights) to get all the basic ones. If you’re decent at arcade type stuff there’s far more you can get easily.

You can get many in Dragon Stand just by running the meta. The system isn’t flawed because you say it’s flawed.

At the beginning people were getting them because it was busy and new. Now they can further that goal in new zones as well.

Not sure what you find flawed about that.

If you can’t see the difference between achievement and Mastery insights you have nothing further to add

Oh I can see the difference. If you can’t see the difference between easy achievements anyone can do and hard achievements that take time and energy than you’re probably right. There’s nothing further to add.

You seem to think achievements are all hard and all take time when in fact quite a few of the achievements are not actually harder or more time consuming than communing with a point.

For example you can get a single mastery point for communing with an insight and you can get a single mastery point for opening a strong box. They both take equal amount of time. They’re both achievements.

You can get a mastery point for gliding under 3 arches in AB which anyone can do in a matter of seconds, but that’s also an achievement.

You can get an achievement by doing events during the dragon stand meta…in fact, virtually every achievement in dragon stand is attainable just by playing dragon stand normally without doing anything unusual. That’s a fair whack of achievement points.

So saying a mastery insight is fine and dandy and other achievements are bad because they’re not mastery insights is just a bit of a misnomer.

To be fair there are harder achievements to get also, but they’re not as numerous as the easier achievements to get.

All the achievements you actually need to play the game can be gotten with easy achievements.

But they’re still ALL achievements. You’re simply arbitrarily removing the easy ones and saying this are okay because they’re easy. I’m adding easy ones to the list. The way to find achievement points is simply to look at your achievement panel…even the mastery insights.

There is an extreme excess of mastery points in the game, and many are simply doing events or something simple in a story instance. I didn’t want to play wvw for all my legends but I did it anyway because the legends are meant to make you do a lot of stuff to earn them.

Ayrilana.1396:

I disregarded them referring to core masteries as the thread is about HoT ones and they replied to my post which was about HoT ones.

My bad. I’ve never made a HoT Legendary, and I didn’t remember (if I was even ever aware) that it required full Mastery completion. Ooops.

IndigoSundown.5419:

So, we went from an open acquisition progression system to a combined open/closed system.

Good point, never saw it that way, probably because I wasn’t here when masteries were implemented. If the idea was indeed to add something similar to levelling, but without XP and linear progress, then the current system is definitely more closed than simple XP-levelling. You get XP for everything you do, the game doesn’t force your to go “out of your way”. You can even level up without killing things, or without doing quests. If you really wanted to spend the time, you could level a character to 80 by harvesting plants and do nothing else. Well, getting to the plants would also give you XP via exploration.

Although I really like the mastery system, and much prefer it over usual levelling and simply increasing max level with every expansion, it certainly is a different approach to force players into content they don’t like.

And please don’t discuss the word “forced” anymore, of course you could just opt out, so it’s not really forced in this sense. Most people here use “forced” like in “if you want to get Tequatl’s Hoard, you are forced to participate in the event.” Because there is no other way to get it.

Not saying that it’s good or bad, but the mastery system is more closed than usual levelling. It also makes it more special. After some time playing, every character will reach level 80, but you can play for years without making it to 186 mastery points. You don’t see how a character got to level 80, could have just logged in every day and used tomes of knowledge all the way, or the boost. When you see a 186, you know this player had at least one raid kill, knows his way around HoT and fractals, and spent a lot of time actively playing the game.

Dorothy Sapphire.4392:

Why should I be forced to do a part of the game I don’t want to do to get my legendary short bow?

The same reason every legendary is forcing you do to some WvW, some map completion and either some dungeons or some HoT map grind. To make you experience more of the game. It’s a solid approach.

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

nottsgman.8206:

if you’re going for a legendary, you must do some things you might not enjoy.

Not sure why.

It should be obvious … the game is not designed around an individual’s wants.

Just because the game is not designed around each person’s wants does not equate to people must do things they don’t enjoy. An alternative to forcing players to do things they don’t want is for the devs to create choices in the system, for instance.

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

nottsgman.8206:

if you’re going for a legendary, you must do some things you might not enjoy.

Not sure why.

It should be obvious … the game is not designed around an individual’s wants.

Just because the game is not designed around each person’s wants does not equate to people must do things they don’t enjoy. An alternative to forcing players to do things they don’t want is for the devs to create choices in the system, for instance.

If they cater to every player and allow them to obtain anything from solely doing what they want to do then the entire reward structure falls apart. Imagine me being able to get legendary weapons from just doing world bosses because that’s all that I want to do.

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

nottsgman.8206:

if you’re going for a legendary, you must do some things you might not enjoy.

Not sure why.

It should be obvious … the game is not designed around an individual’s wants.

Just because the game is not designed around each person’s wants does not equate to people must do things they don’t enjoy. An alternative to forcing players to do things they don’t want is for the devs to create choices in the system, for instance.

If they cater to every player

Creating choices /= “cater to every player”. No need for hyperbole.

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

nottsgman.8206:

if you’re going for a legendary, you must do some things you might not enjoy.

Not sure why.

It should be obvious … the game is not designed around an individual’s wants.

Just because the game is not designed around each person’s wants does not equate to people must do things they don’t enjoy. An alternative to forcing players to do things they don’t want is for the devs to create choices in the system, for instance.

If they cater to every player

Creating choices /= “cater to every player”. No need for hyperbole.

But what if some players still don’t want to do those choices?

Ayrilana.1396:

Imagine me being able to get legendary weapons from just doing world bosses because that’s all that I want to do.

Why not? It’s just a question of how killing World Bosses would lead to a legendary weapon. Just having them drop is boring and too easy. World Bosses could drop specific items that are needed though, or achievements could be related to the acquisition. They could even time gate drops like they do with Legendary Insights in raids (for armor though). And material requirements don’t have to change because buying them or farming them is something that can be expected from everybody. Maybe add a challenge mote to World Bosses that triggers their spawn outside the normal schedule. Triple Trouble challenge mote would certainly be something a random pug couldn’t do.

There are ways to let people play the way they want, without diminishing the value of rewards. If World Bosses were a path to a legendary weapon, the devs needed to make sure that the effort and time spent on getting them equals the time and effort people spent on other paths of acquisition. It’s not even like that now, because the material part can be done by sheer monetary power (gems to gold) and some precursors can be bought on the trading post. And you don’t know what people did to get the precursor or the materials.

Faaris.8013:

Ayrilana.1396:

Imagine me being able to get legendary weapons from just doing world bosses because that’s all that I want to do.

Why not? It’s just a question of how killing World Bosses would lead to a legendary weapon. Just having them drop is boring and too easy. World Bosses could drop specific items that are needed though, or achievements could be related to the acquisition. They could even time gate drops like they do with Legendary Insights in raids (for armor though). And material requirements don’t have to change because buying them or farming them is something that can be expected from everybody. Maybe add a challenge mote to World Bosses that triggers their spawn outside the normal schedule. Triple Trouble challenge mote would certainly be something a random pug couldn’t do.

There are ways to let people play the way they want, without diminishing the value of rewards. If World Bosses were a path to a legendary weapon, the devs needed to make sure that the effort and time spent on getting them equals the time and effort people spent on other paths of acquisition. It’s not even like that now, because the material part can be done by sheer monetary power (gems to gold) and some precursors can be bought on the trading post. And you don’t know what people did to get the precursor or the materials.

How are they legendary if all that you did was grind world bosses all day which requires little effort as you can semi-AFK them? Almost on the grounds of the core ones which could be bought. At least the new ones require you to do multiple things without taking shortcuts.

Ayrilana.1396:

How are they legendary if all that you did was grind world bosses all day which requires little effort as you can semi-AFK them?

You ignore the part where I wrote that the devs need to make sure that the time and effort is similar to other ways of acquisition. This means that just semi-afking a World Boss would not get you closer to a legendary weapon. On the other hand, just exploring the world does that now, every newly discovered waypoint is a little step closer to a legendary weapon. You could literally just hit outorun in one direction and get XP and a tiny bit more world completion, that’s less effort than semi-afking a World Boss.

Faaris.8013:

Ayrilana.1396:

How are they legendary if all that you did was grind world bosses all day which requires little effort as you can semi-AFK them?

You ignore the part where I wrote that the devs need to make sure that the time and effort is similar to other ways of acquisition. This means that just semi-afking a World Boss would not get you closer to a legendary weapon. On the other hand, just exploring the world does that now, every newly discovered waypoint is a little step closer to a legendary weapon. You could literally just hit outorun in one direction and get XP and a tiny bit more world completion, that’s less effort than semi-afking a World Boss.

Autorun doesn’t get you very far at all and you very well could not activate a single WP or POI.

So Anet should revamp world bosses yet again in order to make it so that those that want to do only world bosses can get their legendary weapons? How would they even revamp them so that players put in the same effort/time as it takes right now?

Players will not enjoy everything in this game just like they wouldn’t in other games. Anet tends to put in rewards to incentivize players to do various content which players may not normally do. You saw this with dailies, legendary weapons, and so on. If the rewards are not worth earning by doing some things that you do not want to do then simply don’t go for them.

To go back on topic with achievements and mastery points, Anet has given players plenty of choices in which mastery points players can earn to max their masteries. The complaints I see from players about the “lack of choices” is from those that complain only after they crossed off a bunch that they didn’t want to do.

With legendary weapons, there will be a certain amount of effort involved to obtain it. Whether that is through achievements, just worldbosses or whatever else they(Anet) decide to be legendary doesn’t really matter to be honest. In fact some world bosses are already part of obtaining a legendary weapon.

I must say though, some mastery points in core tyria as well as HoT are after completing very niche or very grindy achievements. It usually doesn’t feel like mastery points should be there at all, especially as those achievements you generally obtain after the maxing out the mastery tracks to begin with. They feel very pointless to me to be honest.

Still though, Anet has decided from the beginning that legendary weapons are obtained through taking part in all parts of the game. Including WvW, and PvP to some extend.
Sadly for HoT legendaries this means players must to some degree embrace that the not so well liked adventures are a part of HoT and thus the journey to a HoT legendary.

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

nottsgman.8206:

if you’re going for a legendary, you must do some things you might not enjoy.

Not sure why.

It should be obvious … the game is not designed around an individual’s wants.

Just because the game is not designed around each person’s wants does not equate to people must do things they don’t enjoy. An alternative to forcing players to do things they don’t want is for the devs to create choices in the system, for instance.

If they cater to every player

Creating choices /= “cater to every player”. No need for hyperbole.

But what if some players still don’t want to do those choices?

It is indeed not possible to cater to everyone. This is why developers choose to cater to large demographics. It’s really all they can do.

However, in the game’s history, there have been large demographics which get ignored for considerable lengths of time. For instance, players who prefer harder, instanced content were without much in the way of new things to do for years. WvW players were, for a long time, largely ignored.

HoT presented a swing towards niche content for open world players. With the LS3 maps, the pendulum is swinging back the other way. However, some HoT goals are still gated behind niche content. It’s natural for players who dislike certain rewards being locked behind niche content like adventures to complain, just as instanced content and WvW aficionados complained.

You’ll note that both of those demographics have gotten a bone thrown to them, WvW more recently. So, complaining does serve a purpose. I fail to see the purpose, though, of always defending the status quo. That attitude is generally bad for game health. Developers would be wise to take blind defense of everything they do with a grain of salt.

I don’t think any players got ignored at all to be honest. For WvW they did alot of things that the WvW community didn’t like, and for those who wanted more challenging content there was Tequatl revamp, triple trouble wurm, Molten facilities, aetherpath, Aetherblade dungeon, to some extend the nightmare tower, watchwork marrionette, Assault knights and the encounter on scarlets drill.

Each time, lots of complaints were there these things were way too hard. Also the game was structured not around mega servers and mega zerg everything into dust like there is now and not all ascended gear was released yet either.

So, I would phrase that more as, players didn’t get challenges in areas they expected, and if it was there, it was only there for 4 weeks or so. (if not 2)

tl;dr. Ignored sounds like ArenaNet actively or purposefully didn’t provide them with content. Which is not true. Which doesn’t have to match up with what people felt ofcourse.

FrizzFreston.5290:

tl;dr. Ignored sounds like ArenaNet actively or purposefully didn’t provide them with content. Which is not true. Which doesn’t have to match up with what people felt of course.

You’ll note I wrote, “harder instanced content.” There was a big gap between the Aetherpath addition and raids, during which time only 1 or 2 fractals were added. As far as WvW goes, well, there were a few changes that almost no one acknowledged wanting after the fact. While ignored may be inaccurate, it was certainly what was being claimed by both groups.

There were long periods of time when there were very few changes or additions of any sort. It wasn’t specifically WvW or FotM that was left out. Of course, since those areas get less attention in the first place, any reduction in updates sure felt like being ignored.

But that’s completely moot with regards to the OP’s complaint.

Dorothy Sapphire.4392:

Yes I really hate that A-Net is forcing me to do achievements that I care nothing about and don’t really want to do. Not including enough Mastery points on the HoT maps themselves to finish all the masteries is a bad decision on their part. In order to get the last 12 mastery points I need to finish the last mastery I have to do achievements, and I do not like doing achievements. Why should I be forced to do a part of the game I don’t want to do to get my legendary short bow? A-Net please I know you can find challenging ways to add more mastery spots on the maps themselves so those of us who don’t like do the achievements don’t have to. It is like telling every play you must do raids or you must play wvw or pvp. Let us play our way.

There are 22 mastery insights in the original four maps. 10 points are required to do the story. Anything more than those 10 means going above & beyond. At that point, I don’t think it’s fair to say that anyone is “forced” into anything.

I don’t think the OP is lamenting not being able to finish the HoT Story, but lamenting the fact there is effort required to acquire a HoT Legendary.

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

I don’t think the OP is lamenting not being able to finish the HoT Story, but lamenting the fact there is effort required to acquire a HoT Legendary.

Which, in my opinion, falls into “above & beyond” what is required. No one is forced to make a legendary. One can even purchase more than half of the existing legendaries without HoT,

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

nottsgman.8206:

if you’re going for a legendary, you must do some things you might not enjoy.

Not sure why.

It should be obvious … the game is not designed around an individual’s wants.

Just because the game is not designed around each person’s wants does not equate to people must do things they don’t enjoy. An alternative to forcing players to do things they don’t want is for the devs to create choices in the system, for instance.

This theme is reoccurring with you. I frankly disagree with that statement you make, not because it’s my opinion, but because I understand GW2 isn’t philanthropy. If you spend time in a game, you ARE limited by the avenues that the devs give you to ‘win’ it. If you don’t like those avenues, then the reality is that you are SOL. There is no democracy here, no one asked us how we would like to earn legendaries. Is that bad? Maybe, but that’s not our call. You get the game the finite number of devs in a finite amount of time can deliver.

Besides … You exactly define what playing an MMO is all about. There are things you must do to earn certain rewards. I mean, what any particular players wants to do is completely irrelevant to how the game is designed. It’s absolutely ridiculous to imply someone MUST get a legendary in the first place. It’s a luxury item. So no, no one MUST do masteries for legendaries because legendaries aren’t MUST have items. In addition, that argument fails on another level … you can also make a first gen legendary. Those ones don’t require masteries.

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

I don’t think the OP is lamenting not being able to finish the HoT Story, but lamenting the fact there is effort required to acquire a HoT Legendary.

I find it interesting that so many people don’t understand the difference between not enjoying certain things and being lazy. It’s really amazing.

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

nottsgman.8206:

if you’re going for a legendary, you must do some things you might not enjoy.

Not sure why.

It should be obvious … the game is not designed around an individual’s wants.

Just because the game is not designed around each person’s wants does not equate to people must do things they don’t enjoy. An alternative to forcing players to do things they don’t want is for the devs to create choices in the system, for instance.

This theme is reoccurring with you. I frankly disagree with that statement you make, not because it’s my opinion, but because I understand GW2 isn’t philanthropy. If you spend time in a game, you ARE limited by the avenues that the devs give you to ‘win’ it. If you don’t like those avenues, then the reality is that you are SOL. There is no democracy here, no one asked us how we would like to earn legendaries. Is that bad? Maybe, but that’s not our call. You get the game the finite number of devs in a finite amount of time can deliver.

Besides … You exactly define what playing an MMO is all about. There are things you must do to earn certain rewards. I mean, what any particular players wants to do is completely irrelevant to how the game is designed. It’s absolutely ridiculous to imply someone MUST get a legendary in the first place. It’s a luxury item. So no, no one MUST do masteries for legendaries because legendaries aren’t MUST have items. In addition, that argument fails on another level … you can also make a first gen legendary. Those ones don’t require masteries.

Yes it is actually recurring with me that I prefer choices in how I play to an MMO experience “on rails”.

And I also disagree that an MMO “is all about” things you must do to earn certain rewards. Imagine an MMO that allowed you to gain one type of currency with ANY gameplay you preferred. Say you could earn it by Open World PvE, various instanced PvE, WvW, PvP, crafting, fishing, gathering, trading, etc. Then you could trade this currency that you earned by doing what you like in the game for any reward that you chose.

I have played the majority of AAA western MMOs as well as several asian MMOs and have never seen as many different currencies as in GW2. It’s a bit ridiculous really.

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

nottsgman.8206:

if you’re going for a legendary, you must do some things you might not enjoy.

Not sure why.

It should be obvious … the game is not designed around an individual’s wants.

Just because the game is not designed around each person’s wants does not equate to people must do things they don’t enjoy. An alternative to forcing players to do things they don’t want is for the devs to create choices in the system, for instance.

This theme is reoccurring with you. I frankly disagree with that statement you make, not because it’s my opinion, but because I understand GW2 isn’t philanthropy. If you spend time in a game, you ARE limited by the avenues that the devs give you to ‘win’ it. If you don’t like those avenues, then the reality is that you are SOL. There is no democracy here, no one asked us how we would like to earn legendaries. Is that bad? Maybe, but that’s not our call. You get the game the finite number of devs in a finite amount of time can deliver.

Besides … You exactly define what playing an MMO is all about. There are things you must do to earn certain rewards. I mean, what any particular players wants to do is completely irrelevant to how the game is designed. It’s absolutely ridiculous to imply someone MUST get a legendary in the first place. It’s a luxury item. So no, no one MUST do masteries for legendaries because legendaries aren’t MUST have items. In addition, that argument fails on another level … you can also make a first gen legendary. Those ones don’t require masteries.

For years after GW2 launched people talked about Legendary Armor. No one knew how it would be implemented. Look who gets it now that it’s here! It’s the demographic that bucked the system and asked for what they wanted, a type of content that was never even on the radar for this game. I guess the status quo is not as sacrosanct as you want it to be.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

nottsgman.8206:

if you’re going for a legendary, you must do some things you might not enjoy.

Not sure why.

It should be obvious … the game is not designed around an individual’s wants.

Just because the game is not designed around each person’s wants does not equate to people must do things they don’t enjoy. An alternative to forcing players to do things they don’t want is for the devs to create choices in the system, for instance.

This theme is reoccurring with you. I frankly disagree with that statement you make, not because it’s my opinion, but because I understand GW2 isn’t philanthropy. If you spend time in a game, you ARE limited by the avenues that the devs give you to ‘win’ it. If you don’t like those avenues, then the reality is that you are SOL. There is no democracy here, no one asked us how we would like to earn legendaries. Is that bad? Maybe, but that’s not our call. You get the game the finite number of devs in a finite amount of time can deliver.

Besides … You exactly define what playing an MMO is all about. There are things you must do to earn certain rewards. I mean, what any particular players wants to do is completely irrelevant to how the game is designed. It’s absolutely ridiculous to imply someone MUST get a legendary in the first place. It’s a luxury item. So no, no one MUST do masteries for legendaries because legendaries aren’t MUST have items. In addition, that argument fails on another level … you can also make a first gen legendary. Those ones don’t require masteries.

For years after GW2 launched people talked about Legendary Armor. No one knew how it would be implemented. Look who gets it now that it’s here! It’s the demographic that bucked the system and asked for what they wanted, a type of content that was never even on the radar for this game. I guess the status quo is not as sacrosanct as you want it to be.

Yes time to ask for a fishing system and thats where gen 2 legendary armor components will drop.

That could actually make sense for underwater weapons. XD

All I can say is.. try not to think of them as achievements, but tasks, or part of the progress duties. And many achievements that reward mastery points are almost given out like candy when you normally play

IndigoSundown.5419:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

nottsgman.8206:

if you’re going for a legendary, you must do some things you might not enjoy.

Not sure why.

It should be obvious … the game is not designed around an individual’s wants.

Just because the game is not designed around each person’s wants does not equate to people must do things they don’t enjoy. An alternative to forcing players to do things they don’t want is for the devs to create choices in the system, for instance.

This theme is reoccurring with you. I frankly disagree with that statement you make, not because it’s my opinion, but because I understand GW2 isn’t philanthropy. If you spend time in a game, you ARE limited by the avenues that the devs give you to ‘win’ it. If you don’t like those avenues, then the reality is that you are SOL. There is no democracy here, no one asked us how we would like to earn legendaries. Is that bad? Maybe, but that’s not our call. You get the game the finite number of devs in a finite amount of time can deliver.

Besides … You exactly define what playing an MMO is all about. There are things you must do to earn certain rewards. I mean, what any particular players wants to do is completely irrelevant to how the game is designed. It’s absolutely ridiculous to imply someone MUST get a legendary in the first place. It’s a luxury item. So no, no one MUST do masteries for legendaries because legendaries aren’t MUST have items. In addition, that argument fails on another level … you can also make a first gen legendary. Those ones don’t require masteries.

For years after GW2 launched people talked about Legendary Armor. No one knew how it would be implemented. Look who gets it now that it’s here! It’s the demographic that bucked the system and asked for what they wanted, a type of content that was never even on the radar for this game. I guess the status quo is not as sacrosanct as you want it to be.

The irony is that these fringe developments, like Legendary armor, have such a small return on investment. Yeah sure Anet … please implement more game content that only a fraction of players care about … see where the game goes then. They stretch themselves thin and place significant resources away from the core of the game. This expansion coming … better come soon and be amazing.

I’m not against new things. I am against the ridiculous idea that people demand customized MMO content to suit their own desires and willingness of doing things just to get loot they aren’t willing to earn with the current systems. These people make it sound like there are no choices for them. The fact is that they dismiss all these choices (except the one where they don’t earn the loot) then turn around and act sensational about how it’s impossible for them or how they MUST do completely optional content for the most luxurious items in the game. MMO’s don’t work that way. We know that. This one is no exception.

Djinn.9245:

Yes it is actually recurring with me that I prefer choices in how I play to an MMO experience “on rails”.

And I also disagree that an MMO “is all about” things you must do to earn certain rewards. Imagine an MMO that allowed you to gain one type of currency with ANY gameplay you preferred. Say you could earn it by Open World PvE, various instanced PvE, WvW, PvP, crafting, fishing, gathering, trading, etc. Then you could trade this currency that you earned by doing what you like in the game for any reward that you chose.

I have played the majority of AAA western MMOs as well as several asian MMOs and have never seen as many different currencies as in GW2. It’s a bit ridiculous really.

Well, your idea is just wrong then. I have yet to play an MMO that doesn’t have the algorithm “Do this activity Get that thing” which means you MUST do something to get things.

I don’t get what currencies have to do this discussion at all. Even if there was ONE currency, this and every other game would still follow the “Do this activity Get that thing” algorithm.

I don’t get what player willingness has to do this discussion either. Achieving content that no player will dislike is an insurmountable task. They serve a market; if someone isn’t part of that market, then the player needs to make better choices about what games they play, not the company to try to placate that player with content they want.

Obtena.7952:

They serve a market; if someone isn’t part of that market, then the player needs to make better choices about what games they play, not the company to try to placate that player with content they want.

But we are part of their market, otherwise we wouldn’t be here. We are not people who just started the game and already know how it could be better and suit our playstyle more. There’s a difference between your scenario and feedback from recurring customers. We are customers not in a traditional sense, we are players. We share the same hobby and feel like we belong to a club that we support financially to keep it running. Saying “just go play another game” ignores that and tries to push players out of the community, and it’s certainly not wise for a game company to say that to their players. There are cases where people’s expectations of the game differ so greatly from reality or the company’s vision that opting out is the best solution, but if players who generally love to spend time playing the game have suggestions and complaints, you better listen, and act where it makes sense.

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

Yes it is actually recurring with me that I prefer choices in how I play to an MMO experience “on rails”.

And I also disagree that an MMO “is all about” things you must do to earn certain rewards. Imagine an MMO that allowed you to gain one type of currency with ANY gameplay you preferred. Say you could earn it by Open World PvE, various instanced PvE, WvW, PvP, crafting, fishing, gathering, trading, etc. Then you could trade this currency that you earned by doing what you like in the game for any reward that you chose.

I have played the majority of AAA western MMOs as well as several asian MMOs and have never seen as many different currencies as in GW2. It’s a bit ridiculous really.

Well, your idea is just wrong then. I have yet to play an MMO that doesn’t have the algorithm “Do this activity Get that thing” which means you MUST do something to get things.

I don’t get what currencies have to do this discussion at all. Even if there was ONE currency, this and every other game would still follow the “Do this activity Get that thing” algorithm.

I don’t get what player willingness has to do this discussion either. Achieving content that no player will dislike is an insurmountable task. They serve a market; if someone isn’t part of that market, then the player needs to make better choices about what games they play, not the company to try to placate that player with content they want.

My currency example is to show a method where you could allow players to play how they want and all have access to the same rewards. It’s really very simple.

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

Yes it is actually recurring with me that I prefer choices in how I play to an MMO experience “on rails”.

And I also disagree that an MMO “is all about” things you must do to earn certain rewards. Imagine an MMO that allowed you to gain one type of currency with ANY gameplay you preferred. Say you could earn it by Open World PvE, various instanced PvE, WvW, PvP, crafting, fishing, gathering, trading, etc. Then you could trade this currency that you earned by doing what you like in the game for any reward that you chose.

I have played the majority of AAA western MMOs as well as several asian MMOs and have never seen as many different currencies as in GW2. It’s a bit ridiculous really.

Well, your idea is just wrong then. I have yet to play an MMO that doesn’t have the algorithm “Do this activity Get that thing” which means you MUST do something to get things.

I don’t get what currencies have to do this discussion at all. Even if there was ONE currency, this and every other game would still follow the “Do this activity Get that thing” algorithm.

I don’t get what player willingness has to do this discussion either. Achieving content that no player will dislike is an insurmountable task. They serve a market; if someone isn’t part of that market, then the player needs to make better choices about what games they play, not the company to try to placate that player with content they want.

My currency example is to show a method where you could allow players to play how they want and all have access to the same rewards. It’s really very simple.

Except the point of the rewards tied to content is to actually do the content that the rewards are tied to.

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

Yes it is actually recurring with me that I prefer choices in how I play to an MMO experience “on rails”.

And I also disagree that an MMO “is all about” things you must do to earn certain rewards. Imagine an MMO that allowed you to gain one type of currency with ANY gameplay you preferred. Say you could earn it by Open World PvE, various instanced PvE, WvW, PvP, crafting, fishing, gathering, trading, etc. Then you could trade this currency that you earned by doing what you like in the game for any reward that you chose.

I have played the majority of AAA western MMOs as well as several asian MMOs and have never seen as many different currencies as in GW2. It’s a bit ridiculous really.

Well, your idea is just wrong then. I have yet to play an MMO that doesn’t have the algorithm “Do this activity Get that thing” which means you MUST do something to get things.

I don’t get what currencies have to do this discussion at all. Even if there was ONE currency, this and every other game would still follow the “Do this activity Get that thing” algorithm.

I don’t get what player willingness has to do this discussion either. Achieving content that no player will dislike is an insurmountable task. They serve a market; if someone isn’t part of that market, then the player needs to make better choices about what games they play, not the company to try to placate that player with content they want.

My currency example is to show a method where you could allow players to play how they want and all have access to the same rewards. It’s really very simple.

Except the point of the rewards tied to content is to actually do the content that the rewards are tied to.

And many people object to an “on rails” gaming experience (which is the point of this thread).

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

Yes it is actually recurring with me that I prefer choices in how I play to an MMO experience “on rails”.

And I also disagree that an MMO “is all about” things you must do to earn certain rewards. Imagine an MMO that allowed you to gain one type of currency with ANY gameplay you preferred. Say you could earn it by Open World PvE, various instanced PvE, WvW, PvP, crafting, fishing, gathering, trading, etc. Then you could trade this currency that you earned by doing what you like in the game for any reward that you chose.

I have played the majority of AAA western MMOs as well as several asian MMOs and have never seen as many different currencies as in GW2. It’s a bit ridiculous really.

Well, your idea is just wrong then. I have yet to play an MMO that doesn’t have the algorithm “Do this activity Get that thing” which means you MUST do something to get things.

I don’t get what currencies have to do this discussion at all. Even if there was ONE currency, this and every other game would still follow the “Do this activity Get that thing” algorithm.

I don’t get what player willingness has to do this discussion either. Achieving content that no player will dislike is an insurmountable task. They serve a market; if someone isn’t part of that market, then the player needs to make better choices about what games they play, not the company to try to placate that player with content they want.

My currency example is to show a method where you could allow players to play how they want and all have access to the same rewards. It’s really very simple.

Except the point of the rewards tied to content is to actually do the content that the rewards are tied to.

And many people object to an “on rails” gaming experience (which is the point of this thread).

Then they don’t have to earn those specific rewards. I’m pretty sure Anet doesn’t want to develop content that will get ignored because people banked up “currency” from elsewhere in the game.

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

Yes it is actually recurring with me that I prefer choices in how I play to an MMO experience “on rails”.

And I also disagree that an MMO “is all about” things you must do to earn certain rewards. Imagine an MMO that allowed you to gain one type of currency with ANY gameplay you preferred. Say you could earn it by Open World PvE, various instanced PvE, WvW, PvP, crafting, fishing, gathering, trading, etc. Then you could trade this currency that you earned by doing what you like in the game for any reward that you chose.

I have played the majority of AAA western MMOs as well as several asian MMOs and have never seen as many different currencies as in GW2. It’s a bit ridiculous really.

Well, your idea is just wrong then. I have yet to play an MMO that doesn’t have the algorithm “Do this activity Get that thing” which means you MUST do something to get things.

I don’t get what currencies have to do this discussion at all. Even if there was ONE currency, this and every other game would still follow the “Do this activity Get that thing” algorithm.

I don’t get what player willingness has to do this discussion either. Achieving content that no player will dislike is an insurmountable task. They serve a market; if someone isn’t part of that market, then the player needs to make better choices about what games they play, not the company to try to placate that player with content they want.

My currency example is to show a method where you could allow players to play how they want and all have access to the same rewards. It’s really very simple.

Except the point of the rewards tied to content is to actually do the content that the rewards are tied to.

And many people object to an “on rails” gaming experience (which is the point of this thread).

Then they don’t have to earn those specific rewards. I’m pretty sure Anet doesn’t want to develop content that will get ignored because people banked up “currency” from elsewhere in the game.

True, many people could just give in and do what they don’t like, or could decide not to go for a reward that involves content they don’t like. Or the customers could provide feedback to the company who can then choose whether they want to do something about it. Perfectly valid option.

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

Yes it is actually recurring with me that I prefer choices in how I play to an MMO experience “on rails”.

And I also disagree that an MMO “is all about” things you must do to earn certain rewards. Imagine an MMO that allowed you to gain one type of currency with ANY gameplay you preferred. Say you could earn it by Open World PvE, various instanced PvE, WvW, PvP, crafting, fishing, gathering, trading, etc. Then you could trade this currency that you earned by doing what you like in the game for any reward that you chose.

I have played the majority of AAA western MMOs as well as several asian MMOs and have never seen as many different currencies as in GW2. It’s a bit ridiculous really.

Well, your idea is just wrong then. I have yet to play an MMO that doesn’t have the algorithm “Do this activity Get that thing” which means you MUST do something to get things.

I don’t get what currencies have to do this discussion at all. Even if there was ONE currency, this and every other game would still follow the “Do this activity Get that thing” algorithm.

I don’t get what player willingness has to do this discussion either. Achieving content that no player will dislike is an insurmountable task. They serve a market; if someone isn’t part of that market, then the player needs to make better choices about what games they play, not the company to try to placate that player with content they want.

My currency example is to show a method where you could allow players to play how they want and all have access to the same rewards. It’s really very simple.

Except the point of the rewards tied to content is to actually do the content that the rewards are tied to.

And many people object to an “on rails” gaming experience (which is the point of this thread).

Then they don’t have to earn those specific rewards. I’m pretty sure Anet doesn’t want to develop content that will get ignored because people banked up “currency” from elsewhere in the game.

True, many people could just give in and do what they don’t like, or could decide not to go for a reward that involves content they don’t like. Or the customers could provide feedback to the company who can then choose whether they want to do something about it. Perfectly valid option.

Which the company appears to have made their stance known based on how rewards have been tied to specific content. It’s a very key method to drive players to do specific content.

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

Yes it is actually recurring with me that I prefer choices in how I play to an MMO experience “on rails”.

And I also disagree that an MMO “is all about” things you must do to earn certain rewards. Imagine an MMO that allowed you to gain one type of currency with ANY gameplay you preferred. Say you could earn it by Open World PvE, various instanced PvE, WvW, PvP, crafting, fishing, gathering, trading, etc. Then you could trade this currency that you earned by doing what you like in the game for any reward that you chose.

I have played the majority of AAA western MMOs as well as several asian MMOs and have never seen as many different currencies as in GW2. It’s a bit ridiculous really.

Well, your idea is just wrong then. I have yet to play an MMO that doesn’t have the algorithm “Do this activity Get that thing” which means you MUST do something to get things.

I don’t get what currencies have to do this discussion at all. Even if there was ONE currency, this and every other game would still follow the “Do this activity Get that thing” algorithm.

I don’t get what player willingness has to do this discussion either. Achieving content that no player will dislike is an insurmountable task. They serve a market; if someone isn’t part of that market, then the player needs to make better choices about what games they play, not the company to try to placate that player with content they want.

My currency example is to show a method where you could allow players to play how they want and all have access to the same rewards. It’s really very simple.

Except the point of the rewards tied to content is to actually do the content that the rewards are tied to.

And many people object to an “on rails” gaming experience (which is the point of this thread).

Then they don’t have to earn those specific rewards. I’m pretty sure Anet doesn’t want to develop content that will get ignored because people banked up “currency” from elsewhere in the game.

True, many people could just give in and do what they don’t like, or could decide not to go for a reward that involves content they don’t like. Or the customers could provide feedback to the company who can then choose whether they want to do something about it. Perfectly valid option.

Which the company appears to have made their stance known based on how rewards have been tied to specific content. It’s a very key method to drive players to do specific content.

A stance which has changed over the game’s lifespan. Legendary weapons used to be only obtainable by buying a precursor or making it in the forge, have gotten legendary journeys, then what we have now.

Alongside rewards being solely available in a gamemode also reward tracks have been added in the last two years for WvW and PvP.

So, it’s not like rewards are ONLY tied to specific content, and it’s not that rewards are ONLY right if available in multiple avenues.
Though for legendary weapons it’s kind of strange to be nitpicky about what you need to do.

FrizzFreston.5290:

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

Yes it is actually recurring with me that I prefer choices in how I play to an MMO experience “on rails”.

And I also disagree that an MMO “is all about” things you must do to earn certain rewards. Imagine an MMO that allowed you to gain one type of currency with ANY gameplay you preferred. Say you could earn it by Open World PvE, various instanced PvE, WvW, PvP, crafting, fishing, gathering, trading, etc. Then you could trade this currency that you earned by doing what you like in the game for any reward that you chose.

I have played the majority of AAA western MMOs as well as several asian MMOs and have never seen as many different currencies as in GW2. It’s a bit ridiculous really.

Well, your idea is just wrong then. I have yet to play an MMO that doesn’t have the algorithm “Do this activity Get that thing” which means you MUST do something to get things.

I don’t get what currencies have to do this discussion at all. Even if there was ONE currency, this and every other game would still follow the “Do this activity Get that thing” algorithm.

I don’t get what player willingness has to do this discussion either. Achieving content that no player will dislike is an insurmountable task. They serve a market; if someone isn’t part of that market, then the player needs to make better choices about what games they play, not the company to try to placate that player with content they want.

My currency example is to show a method where you could allow players to play how they want and all have access to the same rewards. It’s really very simple.

Except the point of the rewards tied to content is to actually do the content that the rewards are tied to.

And many people object to an “on rails” gaming experience (which is the point of this thread).

Then they don’t have to earn those specific rewards. I’m pretty sure Anet doesn’t want to develop content that will get ignored because people banked up “currency” from elsewhere in the game.

True, many people could just give in and do what they don’t like, or could decide not to go for a reward that involves content they don’t like. Or the customers could provide feedback to the company who can then choose whether they want to do something about it. Perfectly valid option.

Which the company appears to have made their stance known based on how rewards have been tied to specific content. It’s a very key method to drive players to do specific content.

A stance which has changed over the game’s lifespan. Legendary weapons used to be only obtainable by buying a precursor or making it in the forge, have gotten legendary journeys, then what we have now.

Alongside rewards being solely available in a gamemode also reward tracks have been added in the last two years for WvW and PvP.

So, it’s not like rewards are ONLY tied to specific content, and it’s not that rewards are ONLY right if available in multiple avenues.
Though for legendary weapons it’s kind of strange to be nitpicky about what you need to do.

Precursors are not the same as they weren’t tied to specific content. You could get them as a drop anywhere of but them off the TP.

The only thing reward tracks provide that can be obtained elsewhere are dungeon skins. This is also different from being able to bank a currency to buy up future rewards.

Faaris.8013:

Obtena.7952:

They serve a market; if someone isn’t part of that market, then the player needs to make better choices about what games they play, not the company to try to placate that player with content they want.

But we are part of their market, otherwise we wouldn’t be here. We are not people who just started the game and already know how it could be better and suit our playstyle more. There’s a difference between your scenario and feedback from recurring customers. We are customers not in a traditional sense, we are players. We share the same hobby and feel like we belong to a club that we support financially to keep it running. Saying “just go play another game” ignores that and tries to push players out of the community, and it’s certainly not wise for a game company to say that to their players. There are cases where people’s expectations of the game differ so greatly from reality or the company’s vision that opting out is the best solution, but if players who generally love to spend time playing the game have suggestions and complaints, you better listen, and act where it makes sense.

I think you have to be a little more honest than this. The market is a spectrum and if you are on the fringe of that, there is no sensible financial reason to take a limited resource to capture it at the expense of the core market you serve.

Placating people that want choose your own adventure in an MMO are in theory not even part of the MMO market because this currently doesn’t exist. No MMO that I have seen dynamically creates content suited to the player based on their preferences. Demanding such a thing is silly. It can’t be done in a reasonable way by hardcoding an algorithm, which is what we have right now.

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Obtena.7952:

Djinn.9245:

Yes it is actually recurring with me that I prefer choices in how I play to an MMO experience “on rails”.

And I also disagree that an MMO “is all about” things you must do to earn certain rewards. Imagine an MMO that allowed you to gain one type of currency with ANY gameplay you preferred. Say you could earn it by Open World PvE, various instanced PvE, WvW, PvP, crafting, fishing, gathering, trading, etc. Then you could trade this currency that you earned by doing what you like in the game for any reward that you chose.

I have played the majority of AAA western MMOs as well as several asian MMOs and have never seen as many different currencies as in GW2. It’s a bit ridiculous really.

Well, your idea is just wrong then. I have yet to play an MMO that doesn’t have the algorithm “Do this activity Get that thing” which means you MUST do something to get things.

I don’t get what currencies have to do this discussion at all. Even if there was ONE currency, this and every other game would still follow the “Do this activity Get that thing” algorithm.

I don’t get what player willingness has to do this discussion either. Achieving content that no player will dislike is an insurmountable task. They serve a market; if someone isn’t part of that market, then the player needs to make better choices about what games they play, not the company to try to placate that player with content they want.

My currency example is to show a method where you could allow players to play how they want and all have access to the same rewards. It’s really very simple.

Except the point of the rewards tied to content is to actually do the content that the rewards are tied to.

And many people object to an “on rails” gaming experience (which is the point of this thread).

Then they better rethink their whole immersion into MMO’s. Again, show me an MMO does not follow the “do this get that” algorithm … they don’t exist. Ever MMO work ‘on rails’ because the whole thing is hardcoded into the game. Game AI has to get much better than it is to adjust activities and rewards to a players preference or gamestyle.