Guild Wars 2

I’m super excited about HoT, but a friend who just got the game recently asked me: “But are you going to be more powerful than me if you get HoT?”

I told him: “From what I read in the forums, the previews, the wiki and the official page, masteries are for level 80 only and will take some effort to get. So yeah, I would be more `powerful´ in the long run, but it’s not like I buy it and get insta-über powerful.”

Did I tell him the truth? Is getting the DLC going to make my character super powerful with non-dlc players?

Thanks for your time

Kitty.6219:

I’m super excited about HoT, but a friend who just got the game recently asked me: “But are you going to be more powerful than me if you get HoT?”

I told him: “From what I read in the forums, the previews, the wiki and the official page, masteries are for level 80 only and will take some effort to get. So yeah, I would be more `powerful´ in the long run, but it’s not like I buy it and get insta-über powerful.”

Did I tell him the truth? Is getting the DLC going to make my character super powerful with non-dlc players?

Thanks for your time

You didn’t tell him the exact truth. (See: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/reimagining-progression-the-mastery-system/ )
I’m sorry, I can get pretty long-winded but I like to be as concise as possible. So, here goes.

You will not be more powerful in a sense, the level cap will not increase, you will not get stronger gear, your stats will not increase in any way, shape, or form due to the mastery system. The mastery system that you see in the link I provided has broken down masteries into a few categories.

They are as follows:

• Master Lore: Attunement with new ally races can be trained to understand their language, unlocking secret locations and access to battle techniques that can weaken your shared enemies.
  [This essentially boils down to flavor text, cool areas, and a new ability or two, utility skills, if you will. These abilities won’t be more powerful than the ones that you get in the base game. (Example: The new healing abilities they added a while back)]

• Master Legends: Train in legendary crafting to learn to create all existing legendary weapon precursors and new legendary weapon precursors introduced with Heart of Thorns.
  [You get to craft precursors via the scavenger hunt, this won’t make you more powerful, as the only benefit Legendaries give aside from cosmetics is the ability to change stats out of combat, which just saves you an extra bag slot (i.e if I had a Bifrost, I wouldn’t carry a Clerics AND a Berzerker’s staff on my ele) Legendaries DO NOT give a stat increase, they are the EXACT SAME as ascended gear stat-wise.]

• Master Exploration: Mastering jungle movement will unlock the ability to hang glide to previously unreachable locations as well as the ability to use special mushrooms to traverse the Heart of Maguuma faster.
  [You get a hang glider in the jungle, and you can eat mushrooms that give you a swiftness buff it seems. This won’t make you more powerful than your friend either.]

• Master Combat: The Heart of Maguuma will be home to some of the most challenging combat in Guild Wars 2, and Masteries will give you the tools you need to excel in these fights. Hunt new enemies, master abilities to defeat champions, and become more deadly against the new creatures waiting in the jungle.
  [“Become more deadly against the new creatures waiting in the jungle.” Implies that whatever bonuses this mastery tree entails will only affect the jungle. Also, more new skills, again no more powerful than the ones already available.]

• Master Fractals: Uncover new depths in the Fractals of the Mists to gain powerful new abilities to overcome difficult fractal challenges, garner greater rewards, and unlock more powerful infusions.
  [New abilities and you unlock “more powerful” infusions. So… higher levels of AR? Again, not a power increase, sounds more like a faster way to put AR on your alts.]

When it comes to specializations such as Rangers becoming Druids and being able to use a staff it’s also not a power increase, you will basically just be able to have a spec that he cannot on his ranger, as well as a weapon that he is unable to wield. Similar to if we both had Necros, and I had a staff & well build but you couldn’t have one, my build isn’t going to be more powerful, you just can’t use it unless you have the expansion.

TL;DR: Arenanet is being very careful about NOT creating a power-creep with their expansions, for this reason they are being very meticulous about not adding in extra levels, stats, higher tiers of gear, ect. for those that buy HoT. You will NOT be more powerful than your friend, you will simply have the option to use different utilities and have one extra weapon/class combination than him, you will be different but not more powerful.

Since masteries are not in any way or form usable in PvP I really don’t see how one could measure that.

It also seems like the masteries themselves are tied to very specific things, so while you might be more powerful than a creature in the Jungle you would most likely still be at the same level against a Ghost in Ascalon.

The masteries in the jungle will only affect content in the jungle. So for example the hang glider won’t be used outside the heart of the maguuma so it won’t make any difference in the “core” content" at all, so you will be the exact same as your friend, not more powerful.

What remains to be seen is if masteries outside the jungle will be available to non-expansion owners or not. If masteries in “core” content are available even without the expansion, then you won’t have any kind of advantage over your friend even with those.

If, however, the masteries in the “core” content require buying the expansion then it all depends on what those masteries actually give. But it should make you slightly better than your friend (otherwise why have them?)

I hope the “core” masteries are either available to non-expansion owners as well or, if they aren’t, they don’t give any mathematic advantage whatsoever (like +5% damage vs Risen or similar)

Can you define “WIN” in PvE? Masteries are for PvE content and are only enabled on PvE content. WvW already has Masteries and is going for a revamp to make it more like PvE Masteries but will not require purchasing the expansion.

However to answer your question. You may get some advantage that you would not have otherwise. A lot of the advantages are restricted to the new maps. Some may not but they also may not give a statistical advantage(It may break some older maps). You will also have to “Level Up” in your Mastery Tracks. So even if PvE had a “Win” Masteries do not make the game pay to win. In my mind by your friends definition a level cap increase would be pay to win.

PvP everyone will always be on the same level. So in truth the only competitive mode tests skill and is balanced as such is PvP.

It was confirmed in yesterdays blog post that the Masteries are only for owners of HoT.

More specifically this part:

The ability to train Masteries is unlocked at level 80 for all players that own Heart of Thorns.

lordkrall.7241:

It was confirmed in yesterdays blog post that the Masteries are only for owners of HoT.

More specifically this part:

The ability to train Masteries is unlocked at level 80 for all players that own Heart of Thorns.

Then the second part of my post applies: let’s hope there is no mathematical advantage from those masteries that are in the “core” game. I don’t want to see a “LF4 Zerkers, 15k AP, 20 Ascalon Mastery points only” because that Ascalon mastery gives +5% damage vs ghosts but is only available in the expansion.

maddoctor.2738:

Then the second part of my post applies: let’s hope there is no mathematical advantage from those masteries that are in the “core” game. I don’t want to see a “LF4 Zerkers, 15k AP, 20 Ascalon Mastery points only” because that Ascalon mastery gives +5% damage vs ghosts but is only available in the expansion.

Even if it gets to that it’s not like there won’t be any other parties, and you get the hypothetical Mastery you can join those.

As for specializations, which is what I think the OP meant, they’re just spouse to be another way of playing the professions, not be more powerful.
I don’t get what’s tripping people, just like the Revenant, it’s NOT spouse to be an OP class.

maddoctor.2738:

Then the second part of my post applies: let’s hope there is no mathematical advantage from those masteries that are in the “core” game. I don’t want to see a “LF4 Zerkers, 15k AP, 20 Ascalon Mastery points only” because that Ascalon mastery gives +5% damage vs ghosts but is only available in the expansion.

I honestly would not worry about it unless they revamp the dungeon (I don’t think they will do) you can laugh in their faces as the requirement would be completely arbitrary and not needed just as “LFM Zerks, 80 only, 15k AP” for AC path 1 is currently in the game. To be frankly honest you sound like you would not want to play with them anyways it would be a unenjoyable experience for you. It would be best to make your own group. The game currently has high enough population and enough people running the dungeons that don’t care that you will get your group filled up rather fast. Perhaps down the line if population ever becomes a problem the groups created like this would become a problem. Only time will tell.

I understand your concern however. There will be players that will require mastery points regardless if there is a stat increase or not (Don’t ask me why). Because they mistake Mastery points from skill instead of

An indicator of how much of the game you’ve experienced.

Just like they use achievement points currently.

In most MMORPGs, progression is almost over for those who don’t buy the expansion and it will probably be the same here for the most part.

This is not living world season that you are buying if you like the story. This is an expansion that you buy if you want to keep playing GW2 while getting new features and updates.

You can play WoW without any expansion however, doing that will limit you from progression byeond what you got at the start of the game, for the most part. Same thing will aply here I would assume. This is how the MMO industry works.

nGumball.1283:

In most MMORPGs, progression is almost over for those who don’t buy the expansion and it will probably be the same here for the most part.

This is not living world season that you are buying if you like the story. This is an expansion that you buy if you want to keep playing GW2 while getting new features and updates.

This is ultimately what it comes down to. Do you want to progress in PvE? You will need to buy Heart of Thorns.

I take it that this is the first time that these players have played an MMO game or rather any game. Content has always normally been locked out for those that don’t buy the expansions or DLC’s. I don’t know why all of a sudden they feel that this should not apply towards them when it’s really not the norm.

Thank you for all the replies

The Fractal one is purely to force fractal runners into buying the Xpac and the combat ones are going to likely going to weak to the point of ‘why even bother’ so they don’t create dreadful Powercreep that actually gives people a sense of progression. Essentially the masteries are mostly fluff to disguise the fact that they’re making you pay to play Living Story +