Guild Wars 2

Myxam.2790:

Political Correctness? No. I don’t give a kitten about being called a Cabbage, or jokes about Salads.

Giving real, tangible reasons to ostracize part of the playerbase on their Species/Race Selection? Yes, Its especially bad on PvP-heavy servers like Blackgate. Getting whispered “You are sub-human filth you dirty rotton cabbage” is not appreciated or welcomed, and I’m glad the player got banned but this is exactly what I’m talking about.

kitten NO TO THE SYLVARI-HOLOCAUST >:|

You seriously got some players reacting like that to you in the game? I’m disgusted!
I’m all for roleplaying, but racism like that?!
Sylvari is my least favourite race of the lot, I just don’t like the design, no bad feelings. Cabbagehead, yeah, I can laugh about that. I’ve got no problem with someone calling my asura a gnome or asura-players writing bookah in the chat.

Put the corrupted sylvari into prisons! Free them once mordremoth is dealt with and they are returned to their former self.

But seriously! I’m fed up with this topic! Is anyone here actually reading what is being written here? Are you even noticing what kind of thoughts and “interesting ideas” you have on screen here, in a forum for a fantasy mmorpg for children?

Internment camps?! Sub-human and that kind of kitten?! That’s the last kitten ed shove!

I can’t even start to describe to you how wrong this whole idea is!
I’m from germany and to everyone who is so interested in this kind of topic, one suggestion: Come here and visit the KZ’s we turned into memorials for that kind of crime! Go along the halls, look through the grated windows and look at the photographs to see the despair in the eyes of the humans(children, women, men) who knew they would die because some sick monsters had a sick ideology.
Are internment camps and racism still interesting/funny? Still want to replay that stuff with plant-people in a fantasy world?
How about that, back at the memorial: Visit the rooms where the possessions of the people had been kept. Where the cutoff hair was stored to fill bunkbeds for soldiers at the warfront! Do you really want that kind of thematics in Tyria?!
What should it be called? LIONTZ BIRKENARCH?!

You know what’s the terrible thing about it? Not a single word I told you about those inhuman places isn’t true! I’ve been to several of those memorials. Even one where they forced the prisoners to build bombs in a salt-mine, as a makeshift bunker! A salt-mine with a church in it and in other parts people knew they’d die while being slaves for a sick cult of maniacs!
And do you know what the most terrible thing is?
Seventy years since that war ended and I’m coming here to the forum of a game(which is rated for children) to find those “interesting ideas” again.
I think I’m gonna be sick for a while.

I can understand where you’re coming from, tekfan. (And personally speaking, I would be appalled at any Sylvari-oriented bigotry or “ethnic cleansing” that occurs in HoT.) However, this may also be an excellent way for older generations to teach newer ones the horrors that can come when racial, religious or political hatreds are allowed to go too far. I have faith that ANet will not be portraying such behaviour or attitudes in a positive light, and the story will have our characters trying to prevent such inequities (or worse, massacres) from taking place.

Zaxares.5419:

I can understand where you’re coming from, tekfan. (And personally speaking, I would be appalled at any Sylvari-oriented bigotry or “ethnic cleansing” that occurs in HoT.) However, this may also be an excellent way for older generations to teach newer ones the horrors that can come when racial, religious or political hatreds are allowed to go too far. I have faith that ANet will not be portraying such behaviour or attitudes in a positive light, and the story will have our characters trying to prevent such inequities (or worse, massacres) from taking place.

Through video games? The only way that works is to actually go and be in that situation or someplace you can experience that. My brother is 18 now, but when he was in 8th grade the school was doing fund raises for a trip to go to Washington DC. One of the places he went to was the Holocaust museum not exactly sure which one, but by the end of it, every single bully in the school was crying, and they went around telling the kids who they bullied they where sorry when that got back. THAT is the way to teach kids, not through a video game…..

(Yes i read your post and saw you areagainst this, im just pointing out that a video game is going to be a horrible way to do this, as these are the kids who play many many games about Killing human beings of all colors, types, shapes.)

And To the person who got the message about the “Dirty Rotten Cabbage” thing, ive seen similar things posted in map chats across FC, its disgusting and horrible, and the people who do it are the worst kind of troll, and or human being. Especially when some of us write back-stories for our characters and put time into them….

heh this topic amuses me as charr player to no end. Its ok when charr get racism..but god forbid the sylvari get a share of the cake for once…

Zaxares.5419:

I can understand where you’re coming from, tekfan. (And personally speaking, I would be appalled at any Sylvari-oriented bigotry or “ethnic cleansing” that occurs in HoT.) However, this may also be an excellent way for older generations to teach newer ones the horrors that can come when racial, religious or political hatreds are allowed to go too far. I have faith that ANet will not be portraying such behaviour or attitudes in a positive light, and the story will have our characters trying to prevent such inequities (or worse, massacres) from taking place.

Considering they failed to even portrait the main character of their own story in a way that created a positive reaction (Try-hearde) — I really don’t want them to tackle controversial topics.

Basaltface.2786:

heh this topic amuses me as charr player to no end. Its ok when charr get racism..but god forbid the sylvari get a share of the cake for once…

Charr get racism? Where? Everywhere i go with my 8 Charr characters all i get are complements because of how cool they look… and no, if this was a thread about Charr Concentration camps it would get the same if not more amount of support.

Basaltface.2786:

heh this topic amuses me as charr player to no end. Its ok when charr get racism..but god forbid the sylvari get a share of the cake for once…

When the Charr players get a thread asking the Developers to intern their characters in Concentration Camps, I will be saying no there as well.

Basaltface.2786:

heh this topic amuses me as charr player to no end. Its ok when charr get racism..but god forbid the sylvari get a share of the cake for once…

Who does this? Is it players or do you think its in-game?

Charr treat each other worse than anybody else could.

I think Zaxares has a valid point. Having such themes, in a light where it is clearly something that only the villains will do, can serve as a means of demonstrating how horrible such policies are.

One of the more poignant examinations of the Holocaust I’ve come across was Harry Turtledove’s “Darkness” series:

With all that said, an internment camp doesn’t necessarily need to mean actual atrocities. Most of the belligerents, in both world wars, had internment camps for people who were connected with hostile countries – however, apart from people effectively being jailed because they had a certain ethnic and cultural background, these were relatively civilised institutions. Having sylvari being interned as a precaution against being taken over by Mordremoth – without any intention to do worse to them than denying them their freedom – may be a rational precaution given the circumstances.

However bad anti-sylvari prejudice might get, though, I don’t think we’re ever going to be put into a position of agreeing with it.

Myxam.2790:

As a Sylvari Player… No. Are you out of your kittening mind? How about we leave the mature content out a game that’s accessable to children, we already have enough of them running around screaming about murdering people over their skin color and sexual preferences (ala COD and DayZ).

And it was a Gods kitten ed bad idea to give into the Sylvari are Dragonspawn Theory because now you’re just going to see more of this crap in chat about how “Sylvari are less than people.”

If this is the friendliest community in gaming, then it really paints a bad picture.

censorship of things because they are dark or touch on bad things is stupid. Such a story is fiction, even if there are real world equivalent, but just like we shouldn’t forget those things, we shouldn’t stop such things from being discussed or explored in art/fiction. The whole “Oh no its bad we shouldn’t let people see this” children or not idea is just bs. People can understand fiction from reality.

draxynnic.3719:

I think Zaxares has a valid point. Having such themes, in a light where it is clearly something that only the villains will do, can serve as a means of demonstrating how horrible such policies are.

One of the more poignant examinations of the Holocaust I’ve come across was Harry Turtledove’s “Darkness” series:

Show Spoiler

hide spoiler

It’s fairly clear early on that it’s a replaying of World War 2 in a fantasy universe. “Algarvian” hatred for “Kaunians” is established early on, but it isn’t until Algarve gets mired in the fighting with the setting’s equivalent of Russia that the Algarvians try to break the stalemate by sacrificing Kaunians to power dark blood magic. The “fridge brilliance” moment is when you realise this act – generally enough to immediately label someone as the blackest villain in most fantasy settings – at least had the excuse that it had a purpose beyond senseless slaughter out of irrational hatred.

Or, to put it another way – blood mages performing mass sacrifices to power some foul magic = Still not as bad as the kittens.

With all that said, an internment camp doesn’t necessarily need to mean actual atrocities. Most of the belligerents, in both world wars, had internment camps for people who were connected with hostile countries – however, apart from people effectively being jailed because they had a certain ethnic and cultural background, these were relatively civilised institutions. Having sylvari being interned as a precaution against being taken over by Mordremoth – without any intention to do worse to them than denying them their freedom – may be a rational precaution given the circumstances.

However bad anti-sylvari prejudice might get, though, I don’t think we’re ever going to be put into a position of agreeing with it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internment_of_Japanese_Americans

How about nope. Same logic, and in some of these places was just as bad.

zenleto.6179:

Basaltface.2786:

heh this topic amuses me as charr player to no end. Its ok when charr get racism..but god forbid the sylvari get a share of the cake for once…

Who does this? Is it players or do you think its in-game?

Charr treat each other worse than anybody else could.

mostly players though you get enough obvios racism from ebonhawke and seperatists and actually humans in general if you really wanna search for it. As for players..yea mostly “human purist players” really do hate charr…cant blame em though…ya know.. gw1 and stuff. Not like it bothers me personally too much but its there. Sylvari actually never had this and it amuses me to no end having the topics pop up and people whining about it.

Basaltface.2786:

mostly players though you get enough obvios racism from ebonhawke and seperatists and actually humans in general if you really wanna search for it. As for players..yea mostly “human purist players” really do hate charr…cant blame em though…ya know.. gw1 and stuff. Not like it bothers me personally too much but its there. Sylvari actually never had this and it amuses me to no end having the topics pop up and people whining about it.

Players do it because dont you know! every single person who plays a charr has to be a furry(like me! im a furry!) but didnt you know that! If you play charr, you are a furry! welcome to the furry crowd! the most hated and despised group on internet, because well we are different.

The racism from ebonhawke and separatists as much as i hate to admit, is kind of ok, the Charr have been attacking the ascalonians for 250+ years, thats a long time to set hatreds in and make prejudices almost a guarantee, but you dont see prison camps now do you? Racism yes, Prison camps, Concentration camps? no. Thank goodness.

Dante.1763:

Zaxares.5419:

I can understand where you’re coming from, tekfan. (And personally speaking, I would be appalled at any Sylvari-oriented bigotry or “ethnic cleansing” that occurs in HoT.) However, this may also be an excellent way for older generations to teach newer ones the horrors that can come when racial, religious or political hatreds are allowed to go too far. I have faith that ANet will not be portraying such behaviour or attitudes in a positive light, and the story will have our characters trying to prevent such inequities (or worse, massacres) from taking place.

Through video games? The only way that works is to actually go and be in that situation or someplace you can experience that. My brother is 18 now, but when he was in 8th grade the school was doing fund raises for a trip to go to Washington DC. One of the places he went to was the Holocaust museum not exactly sure which one, but by the end of it, every single bully in the school was crying, and they went around telling the kids who they bullied they where sorry when that got back. THAT is the way to teach kids, not through a video game…..

(Yes i read your post and saw you areagainst this, im just pointing out that a video game is going to be a horrible way to do this, as these are the kids who play many many games about Killing human beings of all colors, types, shapes.)

I have to disagree with you over video games not being a good medium for teaching/talking about weighty real life issues. That’s like claiming that books like the Diary of Anne Frank or movies like Schindler’s List are not good ways to teach people about the horrors of the Holocaust. Of course they won’t provide the same experience as going to a Holocaust museum, but they can be powerful and moving experiences in their own right.

It all comes down to whether or not the audience is willing to listen and grasp the lessons that are being imparted. Sometimes they will get it on their own, sometimes they will need guidance or instruction from others. And sometimes they will just not be receptive at all, or even take the wrong lesson away from it altogether.

Basaltface.2786:

zenleto.6179:

Basaltface.2786:

heh this topic amuses me as charr player to no end. Its ok when charr get racism..but god forbid the sylvari get a share of the cake for once…

Who does this? Is it players or do you think its in-game?

Charr treat each other worse than anybody else could.

mostly players though you get enough obvios racism from ebonhawke and seperatists and actually humans in general if you really wanna search for it. As for players..yea mostly “human purist players” really do hate charr…cant blame em though…ya know.. gw1 and stuff. Not like it bothers me personally too much but its there. Sylvari actually never had this and it amuses me to no end having the topics pop up and people whining about it.

Ah yeah, this jogs the memory. I’ve seen people blithering about Charr from GW1. As for Ebonhawke, I’ve never thought of it as racism but more the hatred of someone who’s been at war with the same enemy forever. I’ll have to go back and have a look.

Dante.1763:

Basaltface.2786:

mostly players though you get enough obvios racism from ebonhawke and seperatists and actually humans in general if you really wanna search for it. As for players..yea mostly “human purist players” really do hate charr…cant blame em though…ya know.. gw1 and stuff. Not like it bothers me personally too much but its there. Sylvari actually never had this and it amuses me to no end having the topics pop up and people whining about it.

Players do it because dont you know! every single person who plays a charr has to be a furry(like me! im a furry!) but didnt you know that! If you play charr, you are a furry! welcome to the furry crowd! the most hated and despised group on internet, because well we are different.

The racism from ebonhawke and separatists as much as i hate to admit, is kind of ok, the Charr have been attacking the ascalonians for 250+ years, thats a long time to set hatreds in, but you dont see prison camps now do you? Racism yes, Prison camps, Concentration camps? no. Thank goodness.

i am not a furry.. just sayin. I play charr cause i like ork\ogre like races…heck id play an ettin if i could. I wouldnt touch charr if they would be something along the lines of “cat girls” like you know em from every other mmo. I like the somewhat clumsy feel of them a lot and it really feels like you navigate a 440 lbs mountain of teeth, claws and muscles arround tyria…and they are sorta steampunk as a bonus what i happen to like a lot. But yea..sylvari prison camps? Heh.. i really dunno why people pull that out of their minds and hence why this is just chuckle worthy

zenleto.6179:

Basaltface.2786:

zenleto.6179:

Basaltface.2786:

heh this topic amuses me as charr player to no end. Its ok when charr get racism..but god forbid the sylvari get a share of the cake for once…

Who does this? Is it players or do you think its in-game?

Charr treat each other worse than anybody else could.

mostly players though you get enough obvios racism from ebonhawke and seperatists and actually humans in general if you really wanna search for it. As for players..yea mostly “human purist players” really do hate charr…cant blame em though…ya know.. gw1 and stuff. Not like it bothers me personally too much but its there. Sylvari actually never had this and it amuses me to no end having the topics pop up and people whining about it.

Ah yeah, this jogs the memory. I’ve seen people blithering about Charr from GW1. As for Ebonhawke, I’ve never thought of it as racism but more the hatred of someone who’s been at war with the same enemy forever. I’ll have to go back and have a look.

lol yea just make a charr for kittens and giggles and go over there, talk to the npcs and take a look at the propaganda posters that demonise charr…or heck just get near seperatist camps or hideouts and listen to what these guys say about charr…or heck just look at the heart quests related to charr vs seperatists…these guys do everything in their power to ruin the daily lives of charr.

Here a poster… says “no peace with the beasts”

http://www.artofpri.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/ts42-e1329895700991.jpg

Myxam.2790:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internment_of_Japanese_Americans

How about nope. Same logic, and in some of these places was just as bad.

There were also smaller camps of Germans in the UK and British citizens in Germany.

There is a distinction in the logic between ‘lock people up because we imagine they may be a threat’ and ‘lock people up because we imagine they may be a threat and then kill them (whether overtly or through working them to death). I’m not saying it’s a good thing to be doing – as I said, if something like this does come up I suspect it will only be coming from the villains and we will be opposing it – but one is something that an otherwise decent person might do if they’re afraid enough, while the other is simply vile.

Zaxares.5419:

I have to disagree with you over video games not being a good medium for teaching/talking about weighty real life issues. That’s like claiming that books like the Diary of Anne Frank or movies like Schindler’s List are not good ways to teach people about the horrors of the Holocaust. Of course they won’t provide the same experience as going to a Holocaust museum, but they can be powerful and moving experiences in their own right.

It all comes down to whether or not the audience is willing to listen and grasp the lessons that are being imparted. Sometimes they will get it on their own, sometimes they will need guidance or instruction from others. And sometimes they will just not be receptive at all, or even take the wrong lesson away from it altogether.

And im going to have to respectfully disagree with you on that, Its not the same. I have never ever once felt the emotion i have felt in a video game, in ANY video game. than i did from watching Schindler List, or any of the other Holocaust movies ive watched. Can video games? Yes they can, i suppose if done right, im an emotional person for various reasons, but i have never once felt anything like i did when i was watching Schindler’s list in a video game, Movies, literature, and museums yes, but never a video game. Although, this would get me outraged to no end if it was implemented… and then again, i typically dont play story driven games, i split my time between RTS games, wot and GW2…if you do know of any games that may make me change my mind, do PM them to me though

But as you said, this is a MMORPG, you are going to get ALL kinds of players, those that wont feel anything, those that will affect positively and those that affect negatively, and the trolls who will take this as chance to abuse those players who play sylvari, and thats not a good thing, period.

Basaltface.2786:

i am not a furry.. just sayin. I play charr cause i like ork\ogre like races…heck id play an ettin if i could. I wouldnt touch charr if they would be something along the lines of “cat girls” like you know em from every other mmo. I like the somewhat clumsy feel of them a lot and it really feels like you navigate a 440 lbs mountain of teeth, claws and muscles arround tyria…and they are sorta steampunk as a bonus what i happen to like a lot. But yea..sylvari prison camps? Heh.. i really dunno why people pull that out of their minds and hence why this is just chuckle worthy

Thats not the point though whether you are a furry or not, People see a charr and instantly think furry. Furrys are a very hated group. Orks and ogres are exempt from the furry hatred, but you get a huge walking cat, and the player behind it is instantly seen as a furry.

Dante.1763:

Zaxares.5419:

I have to disagree with you over video games not being a good medium for teaching/talking about weighty real life issues. That’s like claiming that books like the Diary of Anne Frank or movies like Schindler’s List are not good ways to teach people about the horrors of the Holocaust. Of course they won’t provide the same experience as going to a Holocaust museum, but they can be powerful and moving experiences in their own right.

It all comes down to whether or not the audience is willing to listen and grasp the lessons that are being imparted. Sometimes they will get it on their own, sometimes they will need guidance or instruction from others. And sometimes they will just not be receptive at all, or even take the wrong lesson away from it altogether.

And im going to have to respectfully disagree with you on that, Its not the same. I have never ever once felt the emotion i have felt in a video game, in ANY video game. than i did from watching Schindler List, or any of the other Holocaust movies ive watched. Can video games? Yes they can, i suppose if done right, im an emotional person for various reasons, but i have never once felt anything like i did when i was watching Schindler’s list in a video game, Movies, literature, and museums yes, but never a video game. Although, this would get me outraged to no end if it was implemented… and then again, i typically dont play story driven games, i split my time between RTS games, wot and GW2…if you do know of any games that may make me change my mind, do PM them to me though

But as you said, this is a MMORPG, you are going to get ALL kinds of players, those that wont feel anything, those that will affect positively and those that affect negatively, and the trolls who will take this as chance to abuse those players who play sylvari, and thats not a good thing, period.

It’s not that surprising. Most video games don’t tend to delve into deep psychological or philosophical issues; they usually function more as escapism and empowerment fantasies. This common perception of video games is also why most people don’t think of them as a media channel for serious commentary, because the general idea is that games are still “childish” and “for fun”.

I can think of three games off the top of my head that really affected me emotionally.

Planescape: Torment – This is an old game from the 1990’s, but it’s probably the best of the three on my list. It centers around a single question, “What can change the nature of a man?” It delves into many themes including responsibility, regret and redemption. You can pick it up from GoG.com for fairly cheap, I believe.

Spec Ops: The Line – I can’t really go into details about this game without spoiling it, but let’s just say that this is one of those games where if you complete it once, then replay it again knowing what you know, EVERYTHING in the game changes when you see it in a different light.

Katawa Shoujo – This is a free indie game in the “visual novel” style developed by a group that sprang from 4chan. Don’t let that discourage you though; it’s very well written, and offers a very moving look into the lives and issues grappled with on a daily basis by disabled people. Note that this game does contain sexual content, so that may be a factor in your decision on whether or not to play it. (Could be encouraging or discouraging. )

I don’t know if i like these rumors. Since the sylvari are a young race, in its childhood so to say, and as it seems without any choice to wether join or deny mordremoth it’s not right to treat them like criminals. However, this may be part of the motivation to finally run down mordremoth.
What i’m really curious about is how they will solve the problem for sylvari players. I have a feeling like the pale tree won’t survive HoT, maybe sacrificing itself or something like that to shut down the dragons influence for her kind. Just an idea. Or do we already have some more specific informations about this?

Zaxares.5419:

It’s not that surprising. Most video games don’t tend to delve into deep psychological or philosophical issues; they usually function more as escapism and empowerment fantasies. This common perception of video games is also why most people don’t think of them as a media channel for serious commentary, because the general idea is that games are still “childish” and “for fun”.

I can think of three games off the top of my head that really affected me emotionally.

Planescape: Torment – This is an old game from the 1990’s, but it’s probably the best of the three on my list. It centers around a single question, “What can change the nature of a man?” It delves into many themes including responsibility, regret and redemption. You can pick it up from GoG.com for fairly cheap, I believe.

Spec Ops: The Line – I can’t really go into details about this game without spoiling it, but let’s just say that this is one of those games where if you complete it once, then replay it again knowing what you know, EVERYTHING in the game changes when you see it in a different light.

Katawa Shoujo – This is a free indie game in the “visual novel” style developed by a group that sprang from 4chan. Don’t let that discourage you though; it’s very well written, and offers a very moving look into the lives and issues grappled with on a daily basis by disabled people. Note that this game does contain sexual content, so that may be a factor in your decision on whether or not to play it. (Could be encouraging or discouraging. )

Sadly this is true, and when games do try and make it matter to the player more often than not they fail because its not done correctly, and in a game like GW2 not doing it correctly just isnt an option, because if you fail the outrage is going to be huge.
Hmm, ill look into those, thank you much! And Well, im sure you can take a guess which way ill be leaning based on me being a furry! xD

Clyan.1593:

I don’t know if i like these rumors. Since the sylvari are a young race, in its childhood so to say, and as it seems without any choice to wether join or deny mordremoth it’s not right to treat them like criminals. However, this may be part of the motivation to finally run down mordremoth.
What i’m really curious about is how they will solve the problem for sylvari players. I have a feeling like the pale tree won’t survive HoT, maybe sacrificing itself or something like that to shut down the dragons influence for her kind. Just an idea. Or do we already have some more specific informations about this?

We do not, this is the OPS speculation idea on what will happen to lions arch, and if the community agree with him or not.

My response is this:

As a child, my parents asked me a question, “If your friend jumps over a cliff, will you follow them?”

“Of course not!” I answered, “I don’t want to die.”

“Then that is how you must act if someone wants you to engage in evil.”

As players, we don’t have to accept the devs storylines or their rules. During Season 1, a lot of RP guilds rejected the Scarlet storyline in favor of other (mostly human) stories.

GUILDS, put anti-racism rules in place right now. I know some groups have already started to do this. If Anet does add this sickening junk like to the game, we don’t have to allow it in our groups EVER. We have control over who joins our guilds. If a player engages in anything mimicking kittensm (pro-Hilter philosophy), ISIS, or any other hate group, that person should be g-kicked.

I don’t care if the racism is fictional or not. Racism is discrimination (a taboo in US American society). It makes other feel singled out and uncomfortable. It takes the fun out of the game. Roleplaying Ferguson, Guantanemo, or any other hate crime ISN’T FUN. To see what I mean, replace the the word Sylvari with black people, Hispanics, Jews, Muslims, or any stereotyped group.

It’s simple to re-write a Concentration Camp scene. Just DM a rescue scene. If you need real-life inspiration, remember that many people helped Jewish folks escape the concentration camps during WW2.

In my RP groups, I don’t DM Cthulu. Nor do I play DM vs Player. My goal as a guild officer is to help my players have their characters triumph over evil. Ever since Trahearne’s spotlight theft, my gaming goal has been to return the hero status to the player.

We players came here to take on the roles of heroes. Racism in any character isn’t heroic.

Ugh . . . this thread just makes my skin crawl. Again, no for the many, many valid reasons people posted.

Just no.

tekfan.3179:

But seriously! I’m fed up with this topic! Is anyone here actually reading what is being written here? Are you even noticing what kind of thoughts and “interesting ideas” you have on screen here, in a forum for a fantasy mmorpg for children?

Internment camps?! Sub-human and that kind of kitten?! That’s the last kitten ed shove!

But somehow you’re okay with:

Murder
Blackmail
Theft
Arson
Graphic on screen asphyxiation
Rampant sexual innuendo
Violent Insanity
Murder of innocent civilians.
Carpet bombing an entire platoon of friendly forces, by the player, resulting in their mass death.

Oh, and also

The fact that it is an established onscreen and offscreen fact that sylvari were tortured and experimented on in asuran laboratories based solely on their race.

The overarcing thread here is that evil acts are the misguided efforts of bad or confused people. Horrible, awful things have and will continue to happen in this world. The tone, however is consistant. Player characters are always presented as heroic and virtuous, rather than complicit in these horrible acts. That heroism and virtue, to exist, requires evil to fight against.

What makes you think any part of the plot will place us as complicit with the jailing and mistreatment of sylvari? Even if such things come to pass, the trailer seems to indicate that our characters and the biconics are the shining beacon of reason in a world gone mad. You can’t have exemplary characters like that if the thing they struggle against does not exist. A large theme, like it or not, of the expansion, just like the base game, is racism and how it is wrong. In the release content that racism is explored in the continual charr/human relation, and we’ve been killing racist separatists from both factions of playable races for years.

This is not a game “for children” and in fact, the ESRB rates this as T, which means they consider it appropriate for ages 13+

I’d say the lack of explicit graphic sexual content, dismemberment, or other such onscreen depictions, while alluding to or discussing them is par for the course. See the recent boom of teen-marketed films and teen-marketed books. They all introduce mature and complex issues whilst avoiding explicit and graphic depictions of especially distressing or violent acts. If you allow your underage children to play a game you were informed was intended for a teenage-and-older demographic, that isn’t Anet’s fault, it’s yours.

In my personal opinion, I would prefer not to have something like this in a game I play for fun. That said, how I view the NPC communities’ reacting to the ‘possibility’ of corruption would depend on how the developers implement it and how well they do it.

As for whether or not every single sylvari works for Mordremoth, ArenaNet has already disproven that.

Aside from the fact that would completely wipe out a playable race, the developers have stated in their articles, and shown on Points of Interest, that one of the metaevents in the new maps involves the players helping Laranthir, a sylvari member of the Vigil, and his Pale Riders, an all-sylvari unit, gather supplies, rescue Pact survivors, and protect them from Mordrem.

If I lived in lions arch, I think I`d be handing out torches and pitchforks, frankly.

Sylvari were already feared and reviled by the citizenry due to scarlet`s actions, not to mention those of the nightmare court and now everything the people were worried about has been proven true. Add to this the fact that some of the sylvari in the city may well flip out and start murdering people, while under the dragon`s influence, and you`ve got every reason to put every single one of them to the flame.

Even as a sylvari character, you shouldn’t trust yourself. What is to stop you from doing all these things. One moment you may be with your party, merrily fighting bandits and the next you wake up from a blackout, covered in the blood of your allies, having murdered them all when they were wounded or distracted. Mordremoth has put its chosen agents in the one place where they could do the most damage, ie in the ranks of those who could work against it.

It has some very interesting story potential, especially for sylvari characters themselves and it shouldn’t be seen in the light of real world racism or the holocaust. The sylvari are not some oppressed and misunderstood group – instead they are all potential mass murderers and sleeper agents who one cannot afford to trust. Even the pale tree seems to be struggling against the terrible compulsion to serve the dragon and she was previously considered above reproach, sufficient for world leaders to heed her call.

Its bad enough that the Nightmare Court may well be the only Sylvari we can actually trust.

Just thought I’d mention this hear, for players worried what the whole Dragon Minion thing would mean for them.

If you play through Season 2 Living Story on a Sylvari, you get a number of extra dialogue options. In one of them the Pale Tree actually tells you that she and the Dream stand between you (a Sylvari who lives connected with the Dream) and a darkness that would destroy everything. She also tells you that the Soundless and Nightmare Court, who have cut themselves off from/deny the Dream, do not have that protection.

Aerin and Scarlet were both Soundless (or at least Scarlet had her defences cracked open by Omadd’s machine. A lot of the stuff on her seems to imply she was Soundless though. With her refusal to heed the Pale Tree and her desire to seek her own path away from that influence).

Also take into note the Pale Reavers, who have already been shown to be in HoT. One interaction line we’ve seen one say in the Points of Interest is “My mind is my own.” Not all Pact Sylvari were corrupted, but enough of them were to compound the incident and the fleet’s destruction.

On another note, I highly doubt Anet will kill off the Pale Tree, for the simple reason of it would totally screw over the Personal Story for anyone starting a Sylvari character afterwards

Lastly, Sylvari may be vulnerable to corruption by one of the Elder Dragons, but it’s proven that the other four races can be corrupted by more than one. They can always argue that in their favour. We’ve seen the following:

Asura
Undead (Zhaitan), and Kudu corrupted himself with energy from multiple dragons (Crucible of Eternity)

Humans
Undead (Zhaitan) and Branded (Kralkatorik)

Norn
Icebrood (Jormag) and Undead (Zhaitan)

Charr
Undead (Zhaitan) and Branded (Kralkatorik)

Sylvari have proven immune to all of the above, and the Pact had to deal with their dead rising up as an enemy a moment later when they fought to reach Zhaitan. I hardly see them changing that overall mentality now, even with the fleet trashed. Some will be understandly angry, but I think there’ll still be the solidarity as well

^

well id be kittening kittened and distrustfull and most likely would re-enact the movie “the thing” with every sylvari that crosses my path… flamer and everything. Dragon minions (usually) are pretty darn obviosly dragon minions with visible corruption. Sure there where a few (notable risen) that disguised themselfes or used mesmer powers to generate illusions (notable the mesmer in the manor in orr that is more or less a sentinel of the mouth of zhaitan in the basement) but all dragon minions more or less try to kill non minions or to corrupt em (like the norn guy who uses a sword made from jormags blood in the durmand story branch). Sylvari on the other hand lived among the other races, fought side by side the other races, led them to battle (traherne) and learned about them and that all while beeing basically dragon minions themselfes…unknowingly in most cases..sure but it doesnt change the fact. I personally most likely couldnt trust somebody that easily could kill me in my sleep or stab me in the back on the battlefield when some dragon that obviosly is out to corrupt the world gets the bright idea to just focus his powers on the sylvari next to me and forces him\her to do it and im calling it now that this is gonna happen a lot. I seriosly doubt that to resist a dragon´s power is something that can just be shrugged off afterall….or did you ever come across a minion of the other dragons that was like “sup guys im on your side btw, nice knowing you, lets fight the one who made\corrupted me lol kay?” Also… im certain sylvari didnt resist anything…or did you ever saw a risen destroyer or a branded undead? In fact minions of different dragons actually fight eachother if they cross paths.

BrotherBelial.3094:

Myxam.2790:

As a Sylvari Player… No. Are you out of your kittening mind? How about we leave the mature content out a game that’s accessable to children, we already have enough of them running around screaming about murdering people over their skin color and sexual preferences (ala COD and DayZ).

And it was a Gods kitten ed bad idea to give into the Sylvari are Dragonspawn Theory because now you’re just going to see more of this crap in chat about how “Sylvari are less than people.”

If this is the friendliest community in gaming, then it really paints a bad picture.

This has been the plan for them since Eye of the North. Watch the announcement video and get over it.

Link plz,,,,,,,,,,,

I don’t have a link but I do believe Colin confirmed it in a video interview. Or maybe on the POI right after PAX South? I distinctly recall explicit commentary regarding how the minion status had been designed in from the start of the race, and that the devs were worried they’d put too many clues in the Sylvari starting Dream section where you fight the Shadow of the Dragon.

PopeUrban.2578:

tekfan.3179:

…

But somehow you’re okay with:
…
Rampant sexual innuendo
…
Carpet bombing an entire platoon of friendly forces, by the player, resulting in their mass death.

Oh, and also

The fact that it is an established onscreen and offscreen fact that sylvari were tortured and experimented on in asuran laboratories based solely on their race.

The overarcing thread here is that evil acts are the misguided efforts of bad or confused people. Horrible, awful things have and will continue to happen in this world. The tone, however is consistant. Player characters are always presented as heroic and virtuous, rather than complicit in these horrible acts. That heroism and virtue, to exist, requires evil to fight against.

What makes you think any part of the plot will place us as complicit with the jailing and mistreatment of sylvari? Even if such things come to pass, the trailer seems to indicate that our characters and the biconics are the shining beacon of reason in a world gone mad. You can’t have exemplary characters like that if the thing they struggle against does not exist. A large theme, like it or not, of the expansion, just like the base game, is racism and how it is wrong. In the release content that racism is explored in the continual charr/human relation, and we’ve been killing racist separatists from both factions of playable races for years.

Rampant sexual innuendo? I wonder where you got that from.

Let’s talk about the inquest-asura experimenting on sylvari. The inquest don’t care about the race or nature of something, as long as they can research it and can gain superiority of it.
If glowing rocks had fallen of the Pale Tree, the inquest would have researched those. Sadly, this faction doesn’t care if their specimens are geological material or sapient beings with feelings. Monstrous? Yes. Racist? No.
Asura in general may be arrogant and condescending, but walk through Rata Sum and listen to their widespread believe: “Everything has a place in the eternal alchemy.”

The racist splinter factions are the human seperatists and the charr renegades.
We agree on the fact that the game depicts racism as wrong and promotes strength through unity and diversity, condemning the activities of those factions wherever possible.

The violence in the game is not deniable. Just look at all the conditions of the game: Bleeding, fear, cripple,…quite violent indeed.
Am I OK with that? I wouldn’t have bought the game if I wouldn’t be OK with the level of violence.
However, you mentioned it yourself but didn’t put it in context with your list: We see those horrible things in order to depict how cruel our adversaries are.
The carpet-bombing is actually a good example: We never intended to kill our own troops. It was a orrian mesmer who tricked us. It’s horrible and our character acts accordingly. We don’t go off with a shrug in the story, we find the culprit and make sure it won’t hurt another being anymore.
Another example: Ever since Scarlet destroyed Lions Arch we can follow a corrupt asuran Lion Guard with her new human co-worker. In the end she is shown being racist towards sylvari. However, the human Lion Guard talks her down and they walk off. The human newbe shows the strength the corrupt officer hadn’t.

Now let me answer what I think is your question: Why am I against an internment camp if I tolerate the rest?
For this I need to ask you some questions:
Who would build this internment camp?
Who would be ok with it?
How would the sylvari be treated?

Basically: This world that shows us how racism is bad would in the same time allow for an internment camp. Would the leaders of the different races be ok with that or even build this place?
Will we see un-corrupted sylvari being tortured by guards? Will asura come and conduct more horrible experiments on corrupted and uncorrupted sylvari in order to understand the process?

And my most important question:
Why was the idea of an internment camp so “interesting” in this thread, when we could have a prison instead? I can’t speak for every country here on earth, but where I come from a prison is a place where the inmates are treated humanely, while they are imprisoned to punish them for crimes and protect the society from them.
A prison gives us a place to depict this struggle between fear-induced racism and protecting the innocent, which includes uncorrupted sylvari too.
So why would we need an internment camp? A place that in our real history always involved the mistreatment of people, just because they were of a certain ethnicity or religion?

You mentioned that for heroism and virtue to exist we would need evil. We got 5 terrible dragons with corrupting abilities left. Why would we need to add the most possible amount of racism from formerly free-minded beings to the evil?

Myxam.2790:

As a Sylvari Player… No. Are you out of your kittening mind? How about we leave the mature content out a game that’s accessable to children, we already have enough of them running around screaming about murdering people over their skin color and sexual preferences (ala COD and DayZ).

And it was a Gods kitten ed bad idea to give into the Sylvari are Dragonspawn Theory because now you’re just going to see more of this crap in chat about how “Sylvari are less than people.”

If this is the friendliest community in gaming, then it really paints a bad picture.

Wow…

i feel like in a SJWs discussion again.
GUYS its a game. if you are inreal life effected by racsim in a made up scenario and become racist yourself ( are there evne palnt humans?) then something is wrong with you NOT THE GAME.
The only concern should be that the topic is handled good and not slopy.
Even a story told from the eyes of the antagonist still can be showing his errors in relation to our society.

or in short make sure that people know that bads thign are bad even if they are depicted. DON`T 50 SHADES THE THING!

To all those sylvari fans who question why a dark side needs to be added;

BECAUSE IT MAKES FOR A kitten GOOD STORY.

Now i wouldnt personally advocate a death camp, but if there was one in game, It make make for a really poiyant narrative that would actually hook me emotionally and intelligently.

I want a story of black, white and all the shades of grey at once, for that would draw real comparison to real stories.

Totally fed up of this bullkitten good vs evil and no depth to either side. YEY lets all run through the kittening fields with our unicorn rainbow shooting bows and destory a dragon without any idea of what we are fighting for.

Was so happy to see the sylvari turn at the end of the last episode.. That with the mursatt coming back gives me actual faith that gw2 narrative will be interesting like gw1.

EDIT: Just to show how intelligent the story could be if there was a prison camp:

So imagine a camp for corrupted sylvari being made, ellen keil could make her intentions clear that they are to protect such sylvari from being killed in the open world. She gains support from councils around tyria to keep them locked up in a ‘peaceful’ way. Evon sees this as an oppurtunity to further his pragmatic agenda, and brings the asura in to do specific research, to find out more about mordy and the corruption state.

Sylvari even support this idea aslong as its peaceful, and thus some fearful of corruption (maybe they have started hearing mordy in their mind) have actually gave themselves to the prison camp.

Now some time later the player interacts with certain prisoners to find out some of those that are less under mordys influence have been taken away from the camp (they could say they heard screams in the night or something like that).

After investigation, we find out members of the asura reseach team were actually inquest and have been carrying out horrific research on the slyvari starting to be corrupted. We and ellen kiel go to a secret base to find a mass grave and an inquest lab. We destroy it and happy days and realise the dangers of such a prison camp being made in the first place… But the kicker is, for those that are truly corrupted being targets out in the open world, the prison camp is a nessecary evil until mordy is defeated and the corruption cleansed… giving us the players more climatic reasons why we have to kill mordy.

Then when you piece this together with the theories of dragons being forces of nature that give the world balance by consuming abundant magic.. you have a recipe for a really deep story where doing the right thing might not be right. A story of shades of grey.

Parlourbeatflex.5970:

To all those sylvari fans who question why a dark side needs to be added;

BECAUSE IT MAKES FOR A kitten GOOD STORY.

Now i wouldnt personally advocate a death camp, but if there was one in game, It make make for a really poiyant narrative that would actually hook me emotionally and intelligently.

I want a story of black, white and all the shades of grey at once, for that would draw real comparison to real stories.

Totally fed up of this bullkitten good vs evil and no depth to either side. YEY lets all run through the kittening fields with our unicorn rainbow shooting bows and destory a dragon without any idea of what we are fighting for.

Was so happy to see the sylvari turn at the end of the last episode.. That with the mursatt coming back gives me actual faith that gw2 narrative will be interesting like gw1.

EDIT: Just to show how intelligent the story could be if there was a prison camp:

So imagine a camp for corrupted sylvari being made, ellen keil could make her intentions clear that they are to protect such sylvari from being killed in the open world. She gains support from councils around tyria to keep them locked up in a ‘peaceful’ way. Evon sees this as an oppurtunity to further his pragmatic agenda, and brings the asura in to do specific research, to find out more about mordy and the corruption state.

Sylvari even support this idea aslong as its peaceful, and thus some fearful of corruption (maybe they have started hearing mordy in their mind) have actually gave themselves to the prison camp.

Now some time later the player interacts with certain prisoners to find out some of those that are less under mordys influence have been taken away from the camp (they could say they heard screams in the night or something like that).

After investigation, we find out members of the asura reseach team were actually inquest and have been carrying out horrific research on the slyvari starting to be corrupted. We and ellen kiel go to a secret base to find a mass grave and an inquest lab. We destroy it and happy days and realise the dangers of such a prison camp being made in the first place… But the kicker is, for those that are truly corrupted being targets out in the open world, the prison camp is a nessecary evil until mordy is defeated and the corruption cleansed… giving us the players more climatic reasons why we have to kill mordy.

Then when you piece this together with the theories of dragons being forces of nature that give the world balance by consuming abundant magic.. you have a recipe for a really deep story where doing the right thing might not be right. A story of shades of grey.

Frankly, i wouldnt have a problem with it if, and only IF it was for those Sylvari who lost their minds to the dragon like Scarlett. My Sylvari would have no problem with that either, since the Sylvari in it lost their minds and are dangerous. And the “Attack” on the laboratory would be a neat dungeon too! but calling it a prison camp, and going with more than a few of the responses in this thread, about putting all Sylvari in it? No. Thats when it becomes a kitten-esque style prison camp. But, imprisoning the Sylvari who lost their minds to Mordremoth and are actively attacking innocents? I have no problem with that.

My problem with your story is, from what we know so far, Mordremoth doesnt influence them slowly. He took Control of Scarlett, and Arian(however you spell his name) Over time because he was not yet awake. Yet when the pack goes to attack him in the air fleet, almost all the Sylvari outright get snatched by Mordremoth almost instantly.

So maybe instead of having the Player character talk to a Sylvari prisoner, maybe have them talk to say…a citizen of Lions Arch, Could be a human, Charr, or Asura, or even one of the sub races in the game. Heck it could be a Skritt who broke into the laboratory to steal shinies for all i care and come upon a mass grave or even a experiment in progress.

I don’t see how an internment camp immediately makes the story grey. If anything, it’d just make me roll my eyes. Why do we need to bring in such specific terrible things that happened irl into a video game story to make it ‘grey’? Why do they even need to be locked up? I don’t recall anyone locking humans, asura, charr, and norn up to make sure they don’t die and become horror movie zombies. And nobody prevents people from going to the Brand and becoming purple crystal monsters.
People in-universe hating and wanting to kill sylvari will probably happen (even though they themselves were subject to possible Dragon Minion-dom…), so we have racism. We could hear of (and maybe encounter) Inquest doing Inquest things.
Besides, wouldn’t keeping all of the weak-minded sylvari in the Grove, next to mommy tree, be a much better idea?

I can’t see Norn going along with it, at least if they stick to existing lore. Norn allow /icebrood/ and Svanir in their home city. Why’s it ok to tolerate serving one dragon and not the other?

Myxam.2790:

kitten NO TO THE SYLVARI-HOLOCAUST >:|

So a Sylvari genocide then?
Honestly I don’t get what everyone’s going on about, this is clearly an example of… if you don’t mind me referencing some TV tropes, Ron the Death Eater (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/RonTheDeathEater). Somehow there’s something rather… cathartic?… about painting the goody goody Sylari as evil soulless villians.

CobrasVenom.6539:

I don’t see how an internment camp immediately makes the story grey. If anything, it’d just make me roll my eyes. Why do we need to bring in such specific terrible things that happened irl into a video game story to make it ‘grey’

Because fictional settings allows us to explore topics that would conventionally be seen as dark or taboo in a relatively safe environment (given that the environment is fictional), allow for the exploration of underlying themes and idea and of course potentially offering the opportunity to compelling story telling.

Stark.1350:

It’s rather embarrassing to me, as a human being, see so many people take a freaking video game so incredibly seriously.

Bad things happen. As do dark things. As do things that aren’t “politically correct”. Develop some thick skin or unplug. My god.

You could suffer to follow a bit of your own advice there.

“Ugh, you don’t think like I do? I am, like, SO embarrased with humanity! Like, Omigosh! Unplug already!”

Make no mistake. You and others who are responding as such are as cringe worthy as the people you’re blasting.

And I’ve chosen to read everything you people say in a snarky pre-teen voice for comedic effect. It’s cathartic.

So these people who are ok with slaughtering millions of humanoids and creatures in game, are not ok with ‘dark’ themes.
…
…
k

Myxam.2790:

How about we leave the mature content out a game that’s accessable to children

Guild Wars 2 is rated T for Teen by the ESRB.

And it was a Gods kitten ed bad idea to…

give into

…the Sylvari are Dragonspawn Theory because now you’re just going to see more of this crap in chat about how “Sylvari are less than people.”

There is evidence that Anet planned for this since before launch of the original game. They didn’t “give in” to anyone, the Sylvari were always meant to be related to Mordremoth.

If this is the friendliest community in gaming, then it really paints a bad picture.

This has nothing to do with the community. It’s about the story. News flash! Drama helps sell a good story and get people emotionally invested. I daresay threads like this are evidence that it’s working.

Xenon.4537:

This has nothing to do with the community. It’s about the story. News flash! Drama helps sell a good story and get people emotionally invested. I daresay threads like this are evidence that it’s working.

Precisely this, But the idea of an internment camp is a bad one, as it isnt that, it should be “LA becomes place to hold corrupted Sylvari” would probably have been a better, and less provocative title. ’LA becomes Sylvari Internment camp" conjures up images of the holocaust where EVERY Sylvari, regardless of if they are corrupted or not are sent to it, and are tortured and killed there.

I would like this idea only if the players suffer for it. If all Sylvari characters were stuck in the internment camp, unable to leave and unable to go anywhere else (even the Mists or WvW), with their characters slowly becoming weaker and weaker so eventually they can’t even move, and with their items slowly breaking and being lost. Add a log-in stop system so players woudn’t be able to change characters after a while after logging as a Sylvari, a loop eternally showing the character doing the /cry animation in the character selection screen, and some creative elements in the environment around the characters themselves inside Lion’s Arch, and it would be a nice lesson in history.

Dante.1763:

Xenon.4537:

This has nothing to do with the community. It’s about the story. News flash! Drama helps sell a good story and get people emotionally invested. I daresay threads like this are evidence that it’s working.

Precisely this, But the idea of an internment camp is a bad one, as it isnt that, it should be “LA becomes place to hold corrupted Sylvari” would probably have been a better, and less provocative title. ’LA becomes Sylvari Internment camp" conjures up images of the holocaust where EVERY Sylvari, regardless of if they are corrupted or not are sent to it, and are tortured and killed there.

I doubt they will make it that dark, but I’m willing to bet there will at least be some prejudice in the story. I mean Rytlock in the trailer clearly says “You can’t trust Sylvari.” And we immediately see people attacking Canach as he says “We are not your enemy!” Clearly there will be some racial conflict. That doesn’t mean Anet is supporting racism, it just means the story will use racism as a plot device to conjure up more drama which is perfectly fine. Some of the best movies involve the issue of racism. The point of the story is to illustrate just how bad racism is, and glorify those who fight against it.

By the way, the whole point of a good story is to provoke a reaction from the audience. Yet you are saying they should have used something less provocative? That’s counter-intuitive.

well.. the only thing that SHOULD happen to sylvari is some trippy stuff in the story…like remember the toxic offshoots? If you go near them your char gets…lets say a bit trippy. An altered version of that easy could be a way to show that corruption is trying to take over and brings with it some phantasms to battle and some “i see you…..” mordi sweet talk. Meanwhile non sylvari chars just fight off some “normal” mordrem and done. Player fights and resists the corruption and stuff is fixd…well atleast for the player sylvari. I totally wouldnt mind to see npc sylvari just breaking down and turning over the HoT story…i mean we had it with pact members in orr too that turned risen…like the infiltrator chick at the manson with the mouth of zhaitan…and the master hunter norn that went predator on our kitten to name some examples ontop of my head.

Xenon.4537:

I doubt they will make it that dark, but I’m willing to bet there will at least be some prejudice in the story. I mean Rytlock in the trailer clearly says “You can’t trust Sylvari.” And we immediately see people attacking Canach as he says “We are not your enemy!” Clearly there will be some racial conflict. That doesn’t mean Anet is supporting racism, it just means the story will use racism as a plot device to conjure up more drama which is perfectly fine. Some of the best movies involve the issue of racism. The point of the story is to illustrate just how bad racism is, and glorify those who fight against it.

By the way, the whole point of a good story is to provoke a reaction from the audience. Yet you are saying they should have used something less provocative? That’s counter-intuitive.

Not at all. alot of people are horrified by prison camps(different then internment camps like what i dont want to see, the death camps, yes prisoners where held there, but most where jews, gypsys and other “degenerates” or “Wastes of society”) But, If you use a prison camp, you meet in the middle ground, i still dont want to see it(Family members in the military, not fun to think about “What if they get captured” while im playing a game). But at the same time its a good way to tell a story and it will get reactions, and i personally while i have problems with it, i would totally defend having them in game as it would be sure to get threads popping up all over the forums about how horrible it is.

And their use of Racism as a plot device has already gotten some pretty horrible things being said in whispers, map chat and say, near players of sylvari. I had one person whisper me basically saying that i deserve to die because of my character choice. Ive seen other things posted around in map chat that are worse. I dont want to see more of that, i dont want to get whispers like that. If you put in Internment camps where sylvari corrupted or not are held, it will get much much worse, in fact….it will get worse if this idea goes through at all.

Movies can get away with it easier, as nobody is going to go up to lets say..go up to an Asian person outside a movie theater, after watching a movie that included racist scenes against Asians, and be racist to them. Why? because that person can fight back physically and they have to worry about other peoples reactions. Online though, as has been shown in screenshots around the forums and other internet places, when presented with the option to be racist people will be horrible about it, in this game or other games. People take advantage of the ability to not be known for the worst.

I never ever once saw somebody troll sylvari in such fashions until ANET had them get corrupted. In some places its incredibly toxic, i wont even set foot in pvp anyore on my sylvari because of how bad it was the other day. Turning map chat, or whispers off is not an option for me and i shouldnt have to turn them off because of stupid kitten racist players. My block list has gotten longer and longer every day because of things said non jokingly in map chat. its annoying and its a shame to see it in GW2.

I still would rather see prison camps for corrupted sylvari only, than any and all sylvari. and would still very much defend them though, as it does make perfect sense. If they are in prison camps, they may be restored to normal after Mordremoth is dead, we havent seen evidence this will happen, but there is that former Icebrood in Frostgorge sound who is no longer Icebrood, but still hears the call of the dragon. And of course it will makes us feel better as players if we fight against those trying to commit atrocities against other human like beings! But the damage to the player base has already been done, and i hope it doesnt get worse.

Dante.1763:

…I still would rather see prison camps for corrupted sylvari only….

The problem being that any sylvari is now a major threat and the races of Tyria need to take preventative action to protect themselves. The threat of sylvari is not that they are dangerous “when corrupt”, its that they seem perfectly friendly, positive and harmless and then suddenly turn on their previous allies and friends.

And every single on of them is going to say “we are fine, its unfair to treat us like this, you`ve got it all wrong”, just before they poison your supplies or flip the switch on the self-destruct button of your airship.

The only ones I would trust are the corrupted ones, as at least we can clearly establish what side they are on and can plan accordingly.

chronometria.3708:

Dante.1763:

…I still would rather see prison camps for corrupted sylvari only….

The problem being that any sylvari is now a major threat and the races of Tyria need to take preventative action to protect themselves. The threat of sylvari is not that they are dangerous “when corrupt”, its that they seem perfectly friendly, positive and harmless and then suddenly turn on their previous allies and friends.

And every single on of them is going to say “we are fine, its unfair to treat us like this, you`ve got it all wrong”, just before they poison your supplies or flip the switch on the self-destruct button of your airship.

The only ones I would trust are the corrupted ones, as at least we can clearly establish what side they are on and can plan accordingly.

Amusingly enough, in the book (EoD), that’s what it’s like for any person of any race looking upon Jormag’s champion. No chance, instant corruption, unless they had powerful and rare protection against it. Even the protective items used by Destiny’s Edge didn’t give complete protection, just a ‘saving throw’ of sorts which would be completely negated anyway if you made eye contact. I don’t see any real problem with the Sylvari that isn’t canonically shared by every race.

tekfan.3179:

Why was the idea of an internment camp so “interesting” in this thread, when we could have a prison instead? I can’t speak for every country here on earth, but where I come from a prison is a place where the inmates are treated humanely, while they are imprisoned to punish them for crimes and protect the society from them.
A prison gives us a place to depict this struggle between fear-induced racism and protecting the innocent, which includes uncorrupted sylvari too.
So why would we need an internment camp? A place that in our real history always involved the mistreatment of people, just because they were of a certain ethnicity or religion?

You mentioned that for heroism and virtue to exist we would need evil. We got 5 terrible dragons with corrupting abilities left. Why would we need to add the most possible amount of racism from formerly free-minded beings to the evil?

You need to consider a few things:

1: The annihilation of the pact and the splintering of mutual trust between major racial powers is a major plot point. This is done specifically to undo the total and unshakable unity we were left with at the end of the original personal story. This was done to ensure this next leg of the story has room for us to be heroes again.

2: Internment camp does not necessarily equate to graphic depictions of torture. It is a place where individuals of group X are rounded up with the (often misguided) idea that the general populace needs to be protected from them. The United States ran such places filled with American Japanese at the same time they were mobilizing the the wake of pearl harbor to go fight you-know-who. The only major difference is that people were treated much better in the american camps, although establishing such places is generally viewed from a historical perspective as wrong. The people in power mistakenly thought it was the right idea at the time. If it makes you feel better to call it a “Sylvari Prison Camp” go right ahead. The inquest called theirs a “laboratory”. The fact remains that there is a place that sylvari, based solely on the fact that they are sylvari, will be sent for the good of everyone else, and this action alone will create the primary conflict that cuts us off from the military resources we would otherwise have access to as a necessary function of the plot.

3: It isn’t just theorized that sylvari, by nature of simply being sylvari, are a threat to the general populace. It is a physiological fact. The conflict over what to DO about it is obviously at the heart of the HoT storyline. The leaders of the world’s major races will not remain staunch allies at the outset of HoT. We are not unified. The primary conflict is that some feel the Sylvari need to be imprisoned, controlled, or eradicated, and that some do not.

4: The trailer has multiple scenes depicting Sylvari being on the short end of the stick, and Player Characters and the Biconics choosing the third option of killing Mordremoth, with little to no assistance from the world’s major powers to quell a world that is in dire conflict over the issue. This is why Glint’s Egg and the Sceptre of Orr are so integral to that plot. This is why we find ourselves making alliances with new factions within the jungle. These objects and allies are force multipliers to offset the fact that we no longer possess pact or racial leadership support of our actions.

5: This entire series of events is a good thing for the story. It places us as heroes once again rather than rank and file troops. When you think about LA (or any other location) housing sylvari prisoners, you must consider it in the greater scope. Such misuses of power are evidence of an insurmountable public opinion that prevents us from relying on our old alliances and armies to combat the threat. They are what drives our story to taking such an outlandish risk. Obviously they will not impact player Sylvari.