Guild Wars 2

“The Desert Borderlands Map will be replacing the old Borderlands map (Alpine Borderlands) when the expansion releases and we might reintroduce the old map in a rotation or tournament.”

Really….. replacing 3 perfectly good maps with 1 huge clustered map. I think this is a really bad idea. The old maps better come back real quick because if Anet seriously thinks this is going to help the WvW community at all, its not. It’s cool and all that Anet doesn’t care about WvW but it’d be nice if you’d leave us alone and not introduce this horrid idea and potentially ruin the whole game mode. It’s the most pve oriented WvW map i’ve ever seen. Fighting on this map is practically impossible, its a huge siege fest, overall its just bad news for the WvW community and your going to lose ALOT of wvw players thanks to this.

Kindly reconsider this idea Anet.

Best regards, somebody who actually cares about the future of WvW.

First of all: borderlands will be in rotation new>old>etc. etc.
Those 3 borderlands maps will be replaced in rotation for 3 new borderlands maps.
I care and I think will like those borderlands, I like eotm also.

Mem no Fushia.7604:

First of all: borderlands will be in rotation new>old>etc. etc.
Those 3 borderlands maps will be replaced in rotation for 3 new borderlands maps.
I care and I think will like those borderlands, I like eotm also.

I think they somehow said they would replace the current Alpine Borderlands, and these might come back in tournaments… Don’t know if it was clumsily worded or if it will be that way, but sounded like the current BL will disappear.

VergilDeZaniah.3295:

Mem no Fushia.7604:

First of all: borderlands will be in rotation new>old>etc. etc.
Those 3 borderlands maps will be replaced in rotation for 3 new borderlands maps.
I care and I think will like those borderlands, I like eotm also.

I think they somehow said they would replace the current Alpine Borderlands, and these might come back in tournaments… Don’t know if it was clumsily worded or if it will be that way, but sounded like the current BL will disappear.

I am sure that I heard words in rotation in some interviews. In one week you will see new borderlands in next week you will see old borderlands that is how I understand it.

Mem no Fushia.7604:

First of all: borderlands will be in rotation new>old>etc. etc.
Those 3 borderlands maps will be replaced in rotation for 3 new borderlands maps.
I care and I think will like those borderlands, I like eotm also.

Eotm isn’t WvW, the fact that you like Eotm totally invalidates your opinion about this map.

Like I said, these borderland maps are geared towards PvE players, NOT WvW. WvW is supposed to be about large scale fights, and this new map tries its absolute hardest to make that scenario harder to accomplish.

Kudos to Anet for at least TRYING to expand WvW and put out more content for it, but they’re just making it worse.

Terrible idea, terrible map, rip WvW as we know it. Perma EB queues here we come, maybe Anet can replace EB too with some wannabee PvE map.

zedixa acting like a WvW purist isn’t gonna get you any favors. Believe me I feel the same way about EOTM. The difference is I love the EOTM map. I hate how it was implemented and I can’t see it in its current form as a part of WvW.

As far as the new wvw map goes. I see it as being much more of a success. There are places for small groups. Places for large groups. Chokepoints, siege areas, fight areas. The towers are MASSIVE and I can’t wait to fight inside some of them.

Frankly..as far as the “perfectly good” borderlands go….. Were bored mate. We are actually bored of fighting on the same map for eternity. Ive lost more wvw friends to BOREDOM than anything else. And when I told them new maps were coming they logged into the game again. ANYTHING to add a piece of diversity that allows multiple playstyles is good.

Many of us (I can’t claim to speak for a large number of people and I won’t. But I can claim to speak for a group of around 60 of my friends from various servers and game type and even other games that are thinking about coming here) Want more than just a seige map. We also want more than JUST another fight map. And more than just another blob fest map.

This map actually seems to do a good job of that. from the trailer footage ive seen so far. Ive been able to actually SEE places where a blob would be a bad idea. Where splitting it up into multiple zergs will make taking a place more possible. and frankly. Thats the kind of thing I PERSONALLY want in this map. Less of the same.

zedixa.4063:

Mem no Fushia.7604:

First of all: borderlands will be in rotation new>old>etc. etc.
Those 3 borderlands maps will be replaced in rotation for 3 new borderlands maps.
I care and I think will like those borderlands, I like eotm also.

Eotm isn’t WvW, the fact that you like Eotm totally invalidates your opinion about this map.

Like I said, these borderland maps are geared towards PvE players, NOT WvW. WvW is supposed to be about large scale fights, and this new map tries its absolute hardest to make that scenario harder to accomplish.

Kudos to Anet for at least TRYING to expand WvW and put out more content for it, but they’re just making it worse.

Terrible idea, terrible map, rip WvW as we know it. Perma EB queues here we come, maybe Anet can replace EB too with some wannabee PvE map.

Didn’t they try to make zerging harder? cuz of many complaints about zergs? So they actually acomplished something.

If they would go along with philosophy: wvw = large scale fights, they would make map without terrain, objects, anything, just 3 spawns and butchering all the time.

eotm is wvw, and contain more than 3 worlds thanks to how overflow works it isn’t invalidate anything, It invalidates only when you wanna to look it like that.

Harder content is next what many ppl wanna, what is wrong with lords that you need sth more than aa? or it increased pve in wvw that much?

Replacing all the old BL maps, which a lot of guilds who are out looking for fights enjoy is a big mistake. I know a lot of people who don’t want random pve events, statues that blow you off ledges, jumping puzzle mechanics all going on in the middle of a fight.

The map looks cool and has some interesting looking mechanics but forcing it on players who have repeatedly told you this is not what we want, not exactly a good way to get people to buy your expansion and continue to support GW2. I for one will be waiting to buy the expansion till after I see the effect these new maps have on WvW. If large scale fights are ruined by siege, ledges,pve content. Well I probably won’t be buying the expansion if that is the case. I already am frustrated by ANET refusing to support GvG, but at this point it seems like you are giving us the middle finger and saying well we just don’t care about you, if your goal is moving the fights oriented guilds and players to a different game well you might just accomplish that.

johnno.7543:

Replacing all the old BL maps, which a lot of guilds who are out looking for fights enjoy is a big mistake. I know a lot of people who don’t want random pve events, statues that blow you off ledges, jumping puzzle mechanics all going on in the middle of a fight.

The map looks cool and has some interesting looking mechanics but forcing it on players who have repeatedly told you this is not what we want, not exactly a good way to get people to buy your expansion and continue to support GW2. I for one will be waiting to buy the expansion till after I see the effect these new maps have on WvW. If large scale fights are ruined by siege, ledges,pve content. Well I probably won’t be buying the expansion if that is the case. I already am frustrated by ANET refusing to support GvG, but at this point it seems like you are giving us the middle finger and saying well we just don’t care about you, if your goal is moving the fights oriented guilds and players to a different game well you might just accomplish that.

They’re refusing to support GvG because it’s a minority feature that they don’t like to support for this game. They support PvE guild events (missions) because it’s fun community things that get guilds to do things together (such as jumping puzzles, boss kills, races, and more). That’s why they’re doing Guild Halls too. WvW is a community (server) driven PvP event that allows a whole server to identify together as one and fight as one against another server. But GvG is not that, it’s a way of segregating communities way further, making huge arguments and fights and just way too much political drama. Besides that it would take way from their designed WvW, which is something that they don’t want to do at all.

GvG is not a majority feature.

GvG is not a community friendly feature.

GvG is not fun [for 80%+ of the community].

GvG is not what GW2 is about.

It’s been 2.5 years since launch. If you haven’t figured that out by now, then there’s really no helping you. I’m sorry it’s taken this long for the GvG community to realize it, and will probably take longer too.

Edit: OH, and another thing. WvW isn’t strictly PvP. If you want strictly players fighting players, you’d go into the Mists and queue for sPvP. World vs World is about worlds fighting against other worlds for the most points/control of the map. That doesn’t prevent the inclusion of PvE objectives. Quite the contrary, they are fully included in that. World vs World is a matter of this world trying to obtain the strongest bosses, build the strongest walls, set up the hardest hitting traps, and getting the biggest lasers against the other worlds. That is how they dominate. That is how WvW is designed. In fact, originally the EB JP was part of this in that your team could block off an enemy entirely from getting to it because the entrance was inside keeps that could be captured; that was to prevent enemies from getting the siege in there.

I mentioned GvG not being supported and you completely focus on that part of my post even though i wasn’t really making an argument about that. I would estimate the balance between guilds that care more about fights and guilds that care about holding structures and placing siege is roughly the same. Neither side is wrong for playing the game the way they enjoy it(both styles of play are mentioned right in the description of WvW on gw2 website). Right now we have the capacity for the different groups of players to enjoy WvW and coexist with each other. Changing WvW to cater completely to the play style of either group i think would be a negative thing. We had options on how we wanted to enjoy WvW and at this point it feels like we now will have no choice but to play a certain way. Either way you look at it your going to lose players by not keeping a balance between both groups. Would it not make more sense to develop somthing that appeals to both sides?

johnno.7543:

Either way you look at it your going to lose players by not keeping a balance between both groups. Would it not make more sense to develop somthing that appeals to both sides?

No, it’s not and no it doesn’t. You’re essentially asking them to create something that wasn’t there to appeal to a group that they’re not aimed at appealing to. This game was never and will never be about GvG in the set up sense that you’re talking about (guild zerge of 15-30 vs same number); they got a bone tossed at time with the Obsidian Sanctum area and the up coming GvG sPvP roster (5vs5 mode).

But to say this game is going to lose players over not designing something to appeal to a group that they weren’t designing for in the first place is like…. Okay, that’s like saying that this game will lose raiders for not having raiding as a major feature for HoT. It’s like saying that this game will lose gear progression chasers because they’re not adding in new gear tiers or new levels. These are things that this game just isn’t being designed for, period. If they lose delusional players who thought this game was something it wasn’t, so be it. Those players aren’t going to be strongly vocal enough to force a change out of A.Net from the design paths they chose. We’re playing the game they designed, not designing the game for them.

zedixa.4063:

Mem no Fushia.7604:

First of all: borderlands will be in rotation new>old>etc. etc.
Those 3 borderlands maps will be replaced in rotation for 3 new borderlands maps.
I care and I think will like those borderlands, I like eotm also.

Eotm isn’t WvW, the fact that you like Eotm totally invalidates your opinion about this map.

Like I said, these borderland maps are geared towards PvE players, NOT WvW. WvW is supposed to be about large scale fights, and this new map tries its absolute hardest to make that scenario harder to accomplish.

Kudos to Anet for at least TRYING to expand WvW and put out more content for it, but they’re just making it worse.

Terrible idea, terrible map, rip WvW as we know it. Perma EB queues here we come, maybe Anet can replace EB too with some wannabee PvE map.

I find your statement to equally cripple your validity. You have an opinion on how WvW should be, but I disagree. I don’t think it should be just a 100x scale of PvP, it should be asymmetrical and be as much about small-scale and roaming as it is about mindless[or tactical, as I hope this map makes it] zerging.

Plus, isn’t WvW a mix between PvP and PvE? If you want skill-based PvP, why not suggest equalized equipment and stat amulets from PvP, hm? Point is, PvE does indeed belong in WvW to a certain extent, to not have it would just make WvW, well, horribly unfun except for maybe blobs who don’t mind turning mindless for an hour or so.

Good riddance i say. Finally non generic looking WvW map.

I followed through this whole post and will not reply to some specific person but in general to all of you. Someone said guild who do GvG are in minority. Well the best way to see that happen is if the developers give us a way to go through this process officially. Personally I believe if GvG which is created by gamers is introduced officially by Anet it will kill the WvW format of the game. Tell me How many commanders you have on your server who are not in a GvG guild and open tag like half of the day. Atleast on FSP (my server) where we have atleast 10 plus guilds (big or small) will not play WvW if this format of GvG is offically delivered to players from Anet. It will hurt WvW a lot.

So people here also say that this is not the vision of Anet and was only a player driven thing which Anet do not have to comply to. I agree with this and they should follow their vision of the game and drive it where ever they want wvw to be. This new borderland feels like EOTM 2.0 but with some more plays. Where EOTM eventually turned into a farm fest and one blob to rule them all format to level up characters. This new desert borderland feels like a more objective driven borderland. In order to take down larger objectives you need to co ordinate multiple groups to deactivate a keeps defences by taking over its shrines by a small group and larger group be at ready to smash its walls or doors down to cap it. I am hoping this will change the current zerg fests that plague WvW. Which was eventually what transformed people into creating their own driven format of WvW which is GvG at this time for some quality fights. But again my concern with this new map will be how difficult will it be to cap bigger objectives. How much siege placement / How strong will be shrine buffs / how many places to approach a big objective (Walls / doors that are attackable) and how strong will be siege for attackers will sum it down into a good or bad experience for WvW players who play how it is meant to be played (Anet format of the game). I mean will this new map be eventful where you will have this rush of battle and constantly tides changing or will it be so hard to take keeps that for the 2-6 hours I spend everyday in wvw will be just to try and take an objective off enemy and PvD to no avail with enemies sitting like ducks in their prized upgraded objective. Saying at this time it is fail or not is foolish. No body know how many people will actually like this new objective system.

Now back to GvG created by players. I was actually excited when they said Stronghold will introduce GvG to GW2 on the announcement panel. But it all shattered when I learned it was just another PvP format and is taken from the GvG format of GW1. Found that to be too good to be true.

I think the only reason they have not introduced bigger format of team death matches is because they dont have a raid like party system like other MMO’s. Where there is 1 raid leader with tag and there could be 10 parties of 5 people each to know their current status. GW2 currently does not support parties more than 5 and queing up for a match of lets say 20v20 will not be possible with the current party system. Not saying it is hard to do something like that. They already have squad chat in game and join squad option. Which can be used as a basis for queing up for GvG (TDM Player based). Hell we even have an area in OS for GvG but is plagued by randoms who can enter at will and disturb fights between 2 guilds.

I for one love GvG as it makes you better in co ordinating your attacks as a group of individuals working together to become better. If Anet does not want to yield to customer demands its ok because it is their product. I also do believe intorducing player based GvG format will mean Bye bye to WvW by a lot of guilds. atleast in primetime when guilds raid they will not anymore and will just GvG when they have their max strength of players online.

Siphaed.9235:

GvG is not a majority feature.

GvG is not a community friendly feature.

GvG is not fun [for 80%+ of the community].

GvG is not what GW2 is about.

Edit: OH, and another thing. WvW isn’t strictly PvP. If you want strictly players fighting players, you’d go into the Mists and queue for sPvP. World vs World is about worlds fighting against other worlds for the most points/control of the map. That doesn’t prevent the inclusion of PvE objectives. Quite the contrary, they are fully included in that. World vs World is a matter of this world trying to obtain the strongest bosses, build the strongest walls, set up the hardest hitting traps, and getting the biggest lasers against the other worlds. That is how they dominate. That is how WvW is designed. In fact, originally the EB JP was part of this in that your team could block off an enemy entirely from getting to it because the entrance was inside keeps that could be captured; that was to prevent enemies from getting the siege in there.

Lol so much hate for GvG.

GvG is not a majority feature. = agreed

GvG is not a community friendly feature. = I disagree. I can bet you have never done a gvg in your life and have no clue what you are talking about.

GvG is not fun [for 80%+ of the community]. = Only uptil the time GvG happened on borderlands and those guilds din play for PPT making their server loose on that border. Now we have OS dedicated space for GvG (Not so dedicated though). You only think its not fun. There is a whole lot of people who love it. And majority are commanders from GvG guilds you so much karma train around when in WvW. Take them away and you got nothing to drive your PPT in prime time.

GvG is not what GW2 is about. = maybe. What then Guild wars stand for. If that is based on some guild wars in GW1 and not these guild systems we have in this game. The name should have been changed to something else clearly defining the two different eras / timelines in Tyria. First was guild wars and second is something else I dont know Rise of Dragons or something. What does my guild represent in this game if there is no system of competition and leader boards to know where me and my guild stands in the game. You think stronghold is gona cover that? 5v5 representing a guilds skills at combat and coordination just insults my judgement. If this is the max format of competitive leaderboards we will get then what the hell are the rest of the people in my guild for? PvE? pfff which we do once a week for rewards lol. Dungeons do not drive this game at all except if one needs gold. They did not update them regularly or bring new ones. only living story which is soloable.

I really liked what I saw at Rezzed. WvW is the one format I really haven’t played a lot of. I never liked that defending wasn’t more prominent and it looks like that’s going to be a thing of the past. I am really excited.

My concern is that the old Borderlands maps won’t get incentive to defend. Which, with the new map isn’t that big of a deal. I always thought defending should be a bigger deal than it is now though.

The new map looks fantastic though. Great job!

I love a lot of the ideas on the new HoT WvW map that look to be designed to help split apart zergs for more effective gameplay but the question remains if gamers will actually play it that way. Also a bit leery of the lag consequences on layer heavy map like this but that will have to wait and see for launch.

I wish they did not need to take away the Alpine Borderland map even if only temporarily, choice is a good thing and letting players decide which map fits their preferred playstyle seems like a better way to go. I guess in the distant future that might mean there would be 3 unique borderland maps to pick from but waiting another 2 years for another map might not cut it. I would have rather seen the layout for EB, EotM and this new desert map going into rotation as the 4th center choice but I am sure ANET has plans to work things out.

Looking forward to seeing some BETA news soon.

I don’t really understand most of the complaints leveled at the new map style, to me it seems that some people (not all, don’t get me wrong) want there to still be a major element of mind-numbing, follow the tag in an massive zerg, where the only person who is actually having to think is the commander and maybe a few select scouts. I do know however that there are small roaming parties parties that really enjoy taking objectives with few numbers.

I just think that a map that might jog the mindless zerg out of its collective stupor to actually be able to become (hopefully) engaged in the objective taking a bit more.

I know that a lot of people are likely not to be of the exact same opinion, and I want to remind any of those that this is just my opinion on the matter and I do not expect anyone to agree…

zedixa.4063:

“The Desert Borderlands Map will be replacing the old Borderlands map (Alpine Borderlands) when the expansion releases and we might reintroduce the old map in a rotation or tournament.”

Really….. replacing 3 perfectly good maps with 1 huge clustered map. I think this is a really bad idea. The old maps better come back real quick because if Anet seriously thinks this is going to help the WvW community at all, its not. It’s cool and all that Anet doesn’t care about WvW but it’d be nice if you’d leave us alone and not introduce this horrid idea and potentially ruin the whole game mode. It’s the most pve oriented WvW map i’ve ever seen. Fighting on this map is practically impossible, its a huge siege fest, overall its just bad news for the WvW community and your going to lose ALOT of wvw players thanks to this.

Kindly reconsider this idea Anet.

Best regards, somebody who actually cares about the future of WvW.

What is with all this “fighting” crap? WvW is supposed to be about SIEGE’S (if you want to fight go to PvP) >.>

sparc.3649:

zedixa.4063:

“The Desert Borderlands Map will be replacing the old Borderlands map (Alpine Borderlands) when the expansion releases and we might reintroduce the old map in a rotation or tournament.”

Really….. replacing 3 perfectly good maps with 1 huge clustered map. I think this is a really bad idea. The old maps better come back real quick because if Anet seriously thinks this is going to help the WvW community at all, its not. It’s cool and all that Anet doesn’t care about WvW but it’d be nice if you’d leave us alone and not introduce this horrid idea and potentially ruin the whole game mode. It’s the most pve oriented WvW map i’ve ever seen. Fighting on this map is practically impossible, its a huge siege fest, overall its just bad news for the WvW community and your going to lose ALOT of wvw players thanks to this.

Kindly reconsider this idea Anet.

Best regards, somebody who actually cares about the future of WvW.

What is with all this “fighting” crap? WvW is supposed to be about SIEGE’S (if you want to fight go to PvP) >.>

You did necro a thread with a year since last replay, didn’t you? Today is the 6th of March and you responded to something with the 16th of March (2015) as last date.