Most people called this, but I was hoping that there would be some difference in the personal story for Revenant characters, both because I want to experience something new and because the timeline gets all wonky, with the personal story taking place before Rytlock goes to the Mists.
I’m mildly disappointed—I was hoping to have a WoW Deathknight-like situation where they started you at an elevated level, gave you an introductory quest/story chain, and then inserted you in the story at that point (Joining an Order would be a good place for that)—but I’m still excited to play the Revenant.
Server — Fort Aspenwood
Mains — Mathias of the Wood [Ranger]; Collaborator Bluatt [Engineer]
Alts — Necromancer, Warrior, Elementalist
Professions have never effected the Personal Story.
It seems rather weird that they would suddenly make a completely new personal story for a single new profession due to that.
It doesn’t make the timeline any more wonky than going to do the Personal Story as a Reaper for example.
I believe there was even a dev post stating Revs would get the same race-based start as anyone else, so there was no need for us to “call it.”
What does seem wonky here is the bit about Rytlock has already come back and passed on the secrets. He did all that in 10 minutes? Or are we getting a ret-con and somehow that’s all happening “now” without DE and the biconics knowing about it before they leap into the jungle?
Would have been great to be taught by Rytlock himself, in the Mists, indeed, as it was meant to be.
In term of lore, it poses serious chronologic problems, but as far as I remember, Anet does not give a s**t.
It was easier to justify it lore-wise before Rytlock was declared as the “world’s first Revenant”, but I have a feeling it is recoverable. The Mists can affect time, so I could see Revenants running through a simulation of the past through the Mists, doing the personal story as they go and eventually killing Zhaitan in their own “instance”, all the while still existing in the game as it is right now, before the assault on Mordremoth. This will likely not be explained at all in-game, but hopefully Anet tells us something canon about this. It’s hard to justify otherwise.
I believe there was even a dev post stating Revs would get the same race-based start as anyone else, so there was no need for us to “call it.”
What does seem wonky here is the bit about Rytlock has already come back and passed on the secrets. He did all that in 10 minutes? Or are we getting a ret-con and somehow that’s all happening “now” without DE and the biconics knowing about it before they leap into the jungle?
Yea, they made it very clear there was no Revenant exclusive story content right from the first Revenant info reveal.
Agreed, this all doesn’t make sense in a story telling way. Like it was said above, one could IMAGINE that the Zhaitan storyline is your Rev essentially playing through the events in a Fractal-ish manner in the Mists.
But if it’s just a simulation it makes no sense for others to be calling you the Commander. If that happened in some alternate universe.
Agreed, this all doesn’t make sense in a story telling way. Like it was said above, one could IMAGINE that the Zhaitan storyline is your Rev essentially playing through the events in a Fractal-ish manner in the Mists.
But if it’s just a simulation it makes no sense for others to be calling you the Commander. If that happened in some alternate universe.
What if you’re reverse-channeling the commander of the Pact :O
Agreed, this all doesn’t make sense in a story telling way. Like it was said above, one could IMAGINE that the Zhaitan storyline is your Rev essentially playing through the events in a Fractal-ish manner in the Mists.
But if it’s just a simulation it makes no sense for others to be calling you the Commander. If that happened in some alternate universe.
They could incorporate time travel nonsense to “make it fit”
XD
Server — Fort Aspenwood
Mains — Mathias of the Wood [Ranger]; Collaborator Bluatt [Engineer]
Alts — Necromancer, Warrior, Elementalist
The Mist works in mysterious ways.
It can easily be explained by simply returning at a point earlier on in the history of Tyria after going into the Mist and training as a Revenant.
Or they could say that revenants existed all along, in secret, waiting for the right moment to come forth, the moment ordained by some prophecy or other — and then Rytlock jumped the gun and blew the big reveal for everyone.
And what’s the matter with all those Ritualist that lived adventures through Tyria 250 years ago?
Maybe Rythlock bring the new name for them, but I don’t believe he were the “first” in have communion with the Mist.
I’ll have to wait for Anet story solution, but at the moment, my Revenant will have power since the beggining but he tried to hide them whatever were possible because they were not well seen. However, after Rythlock’s travel, maybe the people change their minds and makes Revenants more well acepted to can stop concealing.
The Mist works in mysterious ways.
It can easily be explained by simply returning at a point earlier on in the history of Tyria after going into the Mist and training as a Revenant.
Here is an example of that being confusing/bad. Beta spoilers ahead:
Say you are a Rev and you enter Maguuma to rescue people. You fight several waves of Mordrem until you are faced against the mounted rider which Rytlock jumps out to attack. You then proceed the fight and win.
Then Kas says, “What is that new magic you’re using?” To Rytlock.
While, as a Rev, I had been using the SAME king of magic since the start. Kas SHOULD know about it, especially if I played through LS2 with my Rev.
The Mist works in mysterious ways.
It can easily be explained by simply returning at a point earlier on in the history of Tyria after going into the Mist and training as a Revenant.
Here is an example of that being confusing/bad. Beta spoilers ahead:
Say you are a Rev and you enter Maguuma to rescue people. You fight several waves of Mordrem until you are faced against the mounted rider which Rytlock jumps out to attack. You then proceed the fight and win.
Then Kas says, “What is that new magic you’re using?” To Rytlock.
While, as a Rev, I had been using the SAME king of magic since the start. Kas SHOULD know about it, especially if I played through LS2 with my Rev.
Well, once upon a time, I played a cleric in a 2nd edition D&D campaign… only, I wasn’t really playing a cleric, I was playing a thief. Only myself and the DM knew the truth. The other players had no clue until several sessions in, when one of them figured it out after seeing my ‘cleric’ attempt a backstab.
If anyone among the biconics might figure it out, it surely would be Jory, our pre-destined rock. Everybody else is too wrapped up in their own personal dramas.
In WoW, Death Knights started at lv 55, meaning that they still have to do everything in the Burning Crusade [which happens BEFORE the Death Knights in Wrath of the Lich King were a thing]. It literally doesn’t matter.
@Tachenon : I get what you’re saying but I don’t think it really works in this case. Revs are pretty flashy with their skills; I’m turning into a demon avatar, solid stone, or summoning the cornerstone of Sylvari morals. Even if my character mentioned they were a Rev, it wouldn’t be possible for one current class to do all this.
@Empemiel : It matters to people who value consistent storytelling, especially people in the RP community.
@Tachenon : I get what you’re saying but I don’t think it really works in this case. Revs are pretty flashy with their skills; I’m turning into a demon avatar, solid stone, or summoning the cornerstone of Sylvari morals. Even if my character mentioned they were a Rev, it wouldn’t be possible for one current class to do all this.
@Empemiel : It matters to people who value consistent storytelling, especially people in the RP community.
No other game has really done it, so i don’t think it matters.
Also since when does the RP community apply to any decision made in any MMO?
@Tachenon : I get what you’re saying but I don’t think it really works in this case. Revs are pretty flashy with their skills; I’m turning into a demon avatar, solid stone, or summoning the cornerstone of Sylvari morals. Even if my character mentioned they were a Rev, it wouldn’t be possible for one current class to do all this.
@Empemiel : It matters to people who value consistent storytelling, especially people in the RP community.
Well, the biconics could be in on it. “Hey, guys — listen, I’m gonna tell you something, but it’s a secret, you gotta swear to never tell anybody!” and then after a battle you can say stuff like, “Oh, wow, Kas, that demon illusion you cast on me almost scared me!” And wear glasses when you’re not fighting. Or something.
Alternately…
Kasmeer: I saw you turn into a demon!
You: Well, yeah. Unlimited Potion of Demon Transformation! Picked that up before I met you guys, back when I helped defeat Teq! I have one for quaggans, too. Watch!
@Tachenon : I get what you’re saying but I don’t think it really works in this case. Revs are pretty flashy with their skills; I’m turning into a demon avatar, solid stone, or summoning the cornerstone of Sylvari morals. Even if my character mentioned they were a Rev, it wouldn’t be possible for one current class to do all this.
@Empemiel : It matters to people who value consistent storytelling, especially people in the RP community.
No other game has really done it, so i don’t think it matters.
Also since when does the RP community apply to any decision made in any MMO?
You seem to think we’re asking for a huge change when a lot of the confusion can be cleared up with dialogue. Anet is making it harder on themselves by continually portraying Revs to be NEW!!
A possibility: Rytlock used the Mists to return back in time of Tyria and make Rev skills a thing, but his students were sworn not to say who first taught them. (because idk timeline kitten) That way Revs have always been a thing, Rytlock is still the “first” Rev, and Past!Rytlock is unaware of the actions his future self will do, perhaps until the moment the Mist rift opened and it clicked for him.
Saying Rytlock is the first Rev and nothing else, The new team being confused and surprised by Rev abilities, are all things Anet has done that are shooting themselves in the foot from a storyline point of view.
Would have been great to be taught by Rytlock himself, in the Mists, indeed, as it was meant to be.
In term of lore, it poses serious chronologic problems, but as far as I remember, Anet does not give a s**t.
It was easier to justify it lore-wise before Rytlock was declared as the “world’s first Revenant”, but I have a feeling it is recoverable. The Mists can affect time, so I could see Revenants running through a simulation of the past through the Mists, doing the personal story as they go and eventually killing Zhaitan in their own “instance”, all the while still existing in the game as it is right now, before the assault on Mordremoth. This will likely not be explained at all in-game, but hopefully Anet tells us something canon about this. It’s hard to justify otherwise.
Rytlock has a friendly chronomancer who sent him back in time to deliver the lore to the masses.
kitten though he forgot to mention about mordremoth. What was he thinking?!?!
Here is an example of that being confusing/bad. Beta spoilers ahead:
Say you are a Rev and you enter Maguuma to rescue people. You fight several waves of Mordrem until you are faced against the mounted rider which Rytlock jumps out to attack. You then proceed the fight and win.
Then Kas says, “What is that new magic you’re using?” To Rytlock.
While, as a Rev, I had been using the SAME king of magic since the start. Kas SHOULD know about it, especially if I played through LS2 with my Rev.
New magic can refer to a specific ability. Such as the Dragon (I believe he uses that specifically). And if the Dragon stance is the Elite Specialization, we simply might not have access to it until after that instance (we don’t know how they are unlocked as of yet as far as I am aware).
Here is an example of that being confusing/bad. Beta spoilers ahead:
Say you are a Rev and you enter Maguuma to rescue people. You fight several waves of Mordrem until you are faced against the mounted rider which Rytlock jumps out to attack. You then proceed the fight and win.
Then Kas says, “What is that new magic you’re using?” To Rytlock.
While, as a Rev, I had been using the SAME king of magic since the start. Kas SHOULD know about it, especially if I played through LS2 with my Rev.
New magic can refer to a specific ability. Such as the Dragon (I believe he uses that specifically). And if the Dragon stance is the Elite Specialization, we simply might not have access to it until after that instance (we don’t know how they are unlocked as of yet as far as I am aware).
I hope that’s what she’s referring to, but he only just showed up, so it’s almost certain she’s talking about Revenant skills in general.
Here’s an idea the mists send Rytlock back in time before Zhaitan’s death, he teaches us everything he knows and he makes-up with Logan a second time. It’s a win-win! You’re welcome Anet
Or Rytlock’s journey to the Mists in the present, affected the timeline and “awakened” revenants in the past!
Yah. Lorewise, it makes no sense. Rytlock is the first Revenant and he didn’t become one until after Zhaitan was defeated and the new dragon threat appears. But then, your new Revenant appears and goes off to defeat Zhaitan and meets Rytlock before he becomes a Revenant. The only explanation is (fill in anything you like because the lore is completely twisted around with this scenario).
It must be how the game is set up. You have to pick the Revenant at character selection because the professions are set in stone and unalterable. Any way to try to get around this causes problems. If the profession is Unnamed at character creation then that will confuse people and if it’s given another name, it will confuse people. Even if they get around that, there is still the problem of giving them a quest to meet Rytlock in the mists, as there are no profession bound quests and the game isn’t set up for them.
Be careful what you ask for
ANet may give it to you.
Why couldn’t it make sense? And why must every Revenant player must have “gone back in time” to train? It’s much simpler than that:
Rytlock entered the Mists and found Razah (http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Razah), who taught him the basics of being a Ritualist, which, with Rytlock’s more martial prowess became the Revenant. He returned to a time two years ago where he secretly taught others these abilities without revealing himself.
Fast forward to the present and suddenly one day having Revenants all over the place makes sense to us because Rytlock altered the past and thus, our memories.
Why couldn’t it make sense? And why must every Revenant player must have “gone back in time” to train? It’s much simpler than that:
Rytlock entered the Mists and found Razah (http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Razah), who taught him the basics of being a Ritualist, which, with Rytlock’s more martial prowess became the Revenant. He returned to a time two years ago where he secretly taught others these abilities without revealing himself.
Fast forward to the present and suddenly one day having Revenants all over the place makes sense to us because Rytlock altered the past and thus, our memories.
In other words, step 2 happened.
Attachments:
Be careful what you ask for
ANet may give it to you.
If anything they are likely to throw something in there in the sense of a “story.” It would seem highly unbelievable and a little offputting if they just shoehorned in the specialisations without a proper introduction.
Note: Im sure rev will have something, but nothing personal story wise. Remember it’s your race that has a personal story, not the profession
Necro Jesus is a thing apparently The Zerker Bunker meta is the biggest bug in the game
I don’t care that it doesn’t fit, I just wanted a new PS to do. I love the PS, but I’ve done it, several times now. Yes, yes, its different by class and the choices you make, but I need the base PS refreshed. It needs to keep up with the terrain differences. But, I guess if I have to pick that the designers work on an expansion over refreshing PS, I’ll take the expansion. And no, before you ask, Living Story isn’t the same. It’s not built into starting a new toon and besides, that’s the same freakin story for every toon. I can’t imagine doing it every time I make a new character.
The devs stated, iirc, way back at PAX East(?) or during someones interview at the press test back in March that there are Revenants already in the world. Just because we haven’t seen them, doesn’t mean that they don’t exist or that they screw up the lore of the game and should get their own story.
Then Kas says, “What is that new magic you’re using?” To Rytlock.
While, as a Rev, I had been using the SAME king of magic since the start. Kas SHOULD know about it, especially if I played through LS2 with my Rev.
When Rytlock first exited The Mists, he entered the past which created an alternate universe. This is where new characters will be playing after HoT. History repeats itself and Rytlock once again falls into The Mists during the cleansing. This time however, he exits to our current universe, which causes a distortion and merges the two timelines. You retain the memories of whichever universe you had the strongest ties to.
Time manipulation has limitless possibilities. Make up whatever story you want.
Just think of it as… Chronomancers deciding to play a prank and threw Revenants into the past, then screwed up the timeline a bit, and there we go! Deus Ex Machina~
The Mist works in mysterious ways.
It can easily be explained by simply returning at a point earlier on in the history of Tyria after going into the Mist and training as a Revenant.
Here is an example of that being confusing/bad. Beta spoilers ahead:
Say you are a Rev and you enter Maguuma to rescue people. You fight several waves of Mordrem until you are faced against the mounted rider which Rytlock jumps out to attack. You then proceed the fight and win.
Then Kas says, “What is that new magic you’re using?” To Rytlock.
While, as a Rev, I had been using the SAME king of magic since the start. Kas SHOULD know about it, especially if I played through LS2 with my Rev.
Well, once upon a time, I played a cleric in a 2nd edition D&D campaign… only, I wasn’t really playing a cleric, I was playing a thief. Only myself and the DM knew the truth. The other players had no clue until several sessions in, when one of them figured it out after seeing my ‘cleric’ attempt a backstab.
If anyone among the biconics might figure it out, it surely would be Jory, our pre-destined rock. Everybody else is too wrapped up in their own personal dramas.
But clerics can backstab you just have to dual class to thief and be a human.
champion magus
previously rank 2 on old leaderboards
EG.secret.OG.NAVI.sorrychief
The devs stated, iirc, way back at PAX East(?) or during someones interview at the press test back in March that there are Revenants already in the world. Just because we haven’t seen them, doesn’t mean that they don’t exist or that they screw up the lore of the game and should get their own story.
I remember something along those lines too, i just wish i knew where i saw that at. Because honestly it clears up everything. Just like there are still Ritualists, Dervishes and Paragons in the world today, we dont see those either, but they are there.
The pvp community reminds me of what Obi-kittenenobi describes Mos Eisley as from star wars.
The devs stated, iirc, way back at PAX East(?) or during someones interview at the press test back in March that there are Revenants already in the world. Just because we haven’t seen them, doesn’t mean that they don’t exist or that they screw up the lore of the game and should get their own story.
Retconned lore, to get around the problem they made calling him the first Revenant. They could have said the first known Revenant.
Actually it’s clear from the rest of the NPC’s reactions in the HoT beta that none of them have any idea what the hell Rytlock is. He shows up and uses Revenant Magic and gets questioned about it and told he’ll explain later.
Professions have never effected the Personal Story.
It seems rather weird that they would suddenly make a completely new personal story for a single new profession due to that.
It doesn’t make the timeline any more wonky than going to do the Personal Story as a Reaper for example.
Actually it does, Rytlock is Canonically the the first Revenant, and he doesn’t become a Revenant until well after the events of the initial personal story, whereas, there has been no story elements tied to the Elite specialisations, which can not be unlocked until after level 80, by which point you should have already completed the Personal Story if you do it at the recommended levels (well maybe not the last part if you’re dragging your heels). There’s a clear paradox.
And yet we have rather clear information about the Mists not working the same way as Tyria itself. Therefore it is not all that much of a stretch to think that he simply came back before he actually left due to the timeline being wonky.
As for the elite specialisations however: There were no reapers when the personal story first took place, and yet now there can be reapers doing the personal story. You are not forced to do it on level, and there are plenty of people who just use Tomes to level up to 80 as once. Just the same as with Revenant.
If we are going to have a specific story for Revenant “because they didn’t exist before” we should have a specific story for Elite Specializations as well, seeing as they didn’t exist before either.
It doesn’t make the timeline any more wonky than going to do the Personal Story as a Reaper for example.
Or that traveling between Prophecies-era Tyria/Cantha and Elona in GW1 involved time travel, and the same with all the base regions and EotN, for that matter.
I don’t mind it being kept intact. I mean, sure it can leave some plotholes in that how can I be a Revenant if the class wouldn’t be made available until much later in the story, but I see my characters as the kind in which that their class does not define what they are.
Actually it’s clear from the rest of the NPC’s reactions in the HoT beta that none of them have any idea what the hell Rytlock is. He shows up and uses Revenant Magic and gets questioned about it and told he’ll explain later.
