Guild Wars 2

hi i always wondered why there is no “easy” way to see at least some kind of ranking at the end of especially boss fights in instances wich helps us get better.

i m not saying this because i want to get players with lower dps excluded – i personally try not to create or join Berserker meta groups. But to give everyone a chance to see his/her partipication on a particular fight and get a chance to actually see if he did well because he did the same ammount of work-not dammage! as the others or if he succeeded because 4 player were just carrying him through everything. my suggestion would be a bar wich counts everything dps ; healing ; boonremoval;… in one point for each player and in the end the party will be shown someting like a notification over the bonus chest:

player a: 20% player b: 15% player c: 25% player d: 25% player e: 15%

[==|=|=|=|===]

i m writing this because i like a nice community and right at the point where the end game players meet it gets salty. such bar would give everyone a better way to improve himself.
reallity until now shows:

No one really knows certain how effective his/her build really is and needs to rely on educated guessing + testing or getting infos from the community. exactly this is the reason why out of a good idea – not showing it to prevent people to exclude weaker chars – it actually caused that good groups exclude other good players because they rely on something others told them without even considering that ther are other good builds not only “meta zerg” ones.

i think such a bar would really help to see more builds actually played since then everyone could see what he´s doing and one way or another will really get a surprise.

a prominent example and main reason why i m writing this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d2b7dpC0liQ

i think with such a bar this whole argument wouldnt have occured.

Kampfpinguin.4892:

i m writing this because i like a nice community and right at the point where the end game players meet it gets salty. such bar would give everyone a better way to improve himself.
reallity until now shows:

nnnno

Kampfpinguin.4892:

hi i always wondered why there is no “easy” way to see at least some kind of ranking at the end of especially boss fights in instances wich helps us get better.

Because in a group setting, there is no easy way of ranking a player’s participation in a fight.

I’ve seen dps/heal/whatever meters in other games, and while they are a good way to work on your own rotations if you use the output responsibly, they too often were misused to put down players who participated in ways beyond the meter’s scope (group buffs, debuff clearing, crowd control etc.) or by players who regularly chose skills that showed up well on the meters instead of more helpful ones that would add to the whole group performance for ego reasons.

In this game without a dedicated tank/healer/dps setup, skills like group buffs, crowd control and similar are even more important to the performance of a 5-man-team, and individual damage can be heavily impacted by these soft group-related skills. How do you rate a player that doesn’t do top personal damage, but buffs the whole group to do even more damage? While they boost the overall group damage at the cost of personal damage, there’s no way to objectively measure and rate this contribution.

Performance meters are a good tool in responsible hands, but in the hands of average mmo players they have a tendency to make people concentrate on only a very narrow part of the picture and often lead to rivalry among individual group members instead of concentration of what’s best for the group as a whole.

@Rasimir.6239 you are right it is not easy and i am aware that

“Performance meters are a good tool in responsible hands, but in the hands of average mmo players they have a tendency to make people concentrate on only a very narrow part of the picture and often lead to rivalry among individual group members instead of concentration of what’s best for the group as a whole.”

but right now – as shown in my link above…right now manny groups are all about “broscience” -with such a tool we would at least have some way to prove them wrong.

Rasimir.6239:

In this game without a dedicated tank/healer/dps setup, skills like group buffs, crowd control and similar are even more important to the performance of a 5-man-team, and individual damage can be heavily impacted by these soft group-related skills. How do you rate a player that doesn’t do top personal damage, but buffs the whole group to do even more damage? While they boost the overall group damage at the cost of personal damage, there’s no way to objectively measure and rate this contribution.

in those other games there are also support skills being used, and some fights call for higher burst damage at the expense of lower sustained damage. The people who know this take the results with a pinch of salt and use them mainly for self improvement.

Here, we don’t have a recount, so the natural born bashers bash professions and builds they think are not optimal in a perfect scenario, while combat in this game with no dedicated tanks or healers means the scenario is as far from perfect as can be imagined.

Kitten, i’ve seen metazerk warirors ranging bosses with a rifle in fractals.

When you get recount or another DPS meter – you start playing just for recount. In the game for you will be only numbers and nothing more. Do you want that? Elitists, please, go play WoW.

I played for recount 8 years. And after 8 years “numbers game” I’m here, because there is no this idiocy and I can only enjoy the game.
This does not mean that I play bad or I have bad build.
This means that I PLAY. And I don’t look permanently how numbers in my recount changes.

Watch your efficiency. Get away from other people. Just play.

id rather be able to enjoy my play style and the raid/fractal/dungeon/w.e than worry about preforming in a numbers game, i’ve got dodging to do

@Mayga.7241 thats why i m talking about effectiveness not dps! and i m not saying i want to know what they are counting in their calculation+i dont want to see real time rankings you are right thats what those programms in wow are made for. But im convinced some kind of notification at the end of a fight would give everyone a very effective tool to improve if he wants to.

WORST. IDEA. EVER.

How would that ever make a situation less salty?

Liquicity.3621 exactly! and thats not what i m asking for thats why i wrote my example in my 1. post a notification at the end nothing more.

Pathetic idea. You just want a tool to screen people and “have a reason” to kick them from party/guild… go away!

DoctorDing.5890 it would help everyone with improving their playstile +build

I’ve never seen a DPS meter that properly assigned a portion of a character’s damage done to the person who made that possible via buffs. Or one that said after you took fatal damage but didn’t go down very point you did for the rest of the fight belongs to your healer…

Most people do not want DPS meters. They do not help you get better, playing the game helps you get better, having the “meta” stats and builds that lend them self’s to max DPS will help you do better, only if you are not currently using them. Also some classes do more DPS. So a DPS meter is not a good tool to help people get better, as some classes will never hit the same numbers as others.

mazut.4296 ??? right now people often get kicked because they aren t using “meta” – there is even sometimes gearcheck! i want a tool wich shows the result AFTER the instance to slowly prove those people wrong. -how can you kick someone after a game?

BrotherBelial.3094

i m not talking about pure dps!

for example if your traits are for boonremoval + healing then they could consider the dammage your party got from boons + your average healing done compared to others.

Kampfpinguin.4892:

@Mayga.7241 thats why i m talking about effectiveness not dps! and i m not saying i want to know what they are counting in their calculation+i dont want to see real time rankings you are right thats what those programms in wow are made for. But im convinced some kind of notification at the end of a fight would give everyone a very effective tool to improve if he wants to.

Oh, come on, you’re talking about exactly what I wrote. It’s impossible to measure the pure effectiveness, too many nuances must be considered for it. But it’s very easy to measure DPS and HPS. And I understand very well why you need something to measure. And you know it.

I don’t need any tool that will show me my effectiveness. I can calculate it myself. And I don’t need a tool for comparison with other. Because I have no problem with my ego and self-rating.

Mayga.7241 have you seen the video?`i dont think so.

There was written “DPS=65983”.

thats why i knew you didn t watch it. – thats not the point of the clip.

but your way of thinking is EXACTLY why i want such a notification.

you didn t even try to get some information you just tryed to use what i m calling broscience.

I was raid leader in WoW. My whole game was to study the logs and tracking DPS HPS, damage to mobs, damage to the boss, standing in the void. I do insanely bored. Here I enjoyed the game. Until HoT.
And my efficiency i see without tools.

It was a sign with “sarcasm” inscription.

I watched video. There is nothing new or unusual. That’s what I’m saying.

Nike.2631:

I’ve never seen a DPS meter that properly assigned a portion of a character’s damage done to the person who made that possible via buffs. Or one that said after you took fatal damage but didn’t go down very point you did for the rest of the fight belongs to your healer…

There’s usually a healer recount, too. The main role of the dps is to do dps. As long as he stays alive, kicking kitten, he is doing his job. The healer saving his butt is also doing his job and shoulnd’t be credited for the damage he is not doing.

On the other hand, recount never showed the effect of buffs, but people always knew that bloodlust/heroism were a must

BrotherBelial.3094:

Most people do not want DPS meters. They do not help you get better, playing the game helps you get better, having the “meta” stats and builds that lend them self’s to max DPS will help you do better, only if you are not currently using them. Also some classes do more DPS. So a DPS meter is not a good tool to help people get better, as some classes will never hit the same numbers as others.

no, having the meta stats and build only allows you to max dps against a piñata boss.

In a long fight, where the boss has time to actually do something other than dying, your meta build may do a lot less damage than some suposedly third rate build, just because that build adapts to the fight better and is able to get closer to its full potential.

A recount tool would help me chose my own build, instead of having to watch boring videos of people that took the time to measure the build’s efectiveness.

Mayga.7241:

It was a sign with “sarcasm” inscription.

I watched video. There is nothing new or unusual. That’s what I’m saying.

NO, there is nothing new, yet people are still arguing about it, because there is no too to prove who is wrong (well, nemesis claims HE is the tool).

the funny thing is: such a system is already in place but i think it is not really working that well because it only tryes to count participation and its tied to loot wich i think in this case right now is resaonable but not reliable enough(sometimes no loot at the end if you use a wp because no one rezzed you and they killed some boss too fast). yes i m talking about gold silver bronze medals. wich right now are not really helpfull in terms of usefulness.