Guild Wars 2

Tachenon.5270:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Tachenon.5270:

Dante.1763:

Diovid.9506:

It’s not about the lore/immersion, it’s about the animations/programming/artwork needed to make all skins, skill animations, emotes, jumping, swimming and so on work on a non-bipedal creature.

This is the extra stuff i was referring to Tachenon.

And yes, horses doing flips is right out, condescending tone, mind it, it otherwise conversations wont go anywhere, like this one. Im not even going to respond to you, with that, im out, have a good day sir and or madam whichever you happen to be.

They’re not horses. They’re centaurs. Things which could not possibly exist anyway, so saying that they can’t do impossible things is, well, kinda silly. Don’t you think?

That’s not being condescending, that’s stating what should be obvious.

While I’m not against centaurs as a playable race, I highly doubt we’ll see it. They would need a lot of different animations for certain skills, like death blossom. I get that it’s a game and its fantasy, but Anet does tend to stick to a certain amount of realism. There is no way they would get the rump up over their heads in any comfortable (or believable) manner. Horses don’t move like that, and while yes, they are centaurs, their entire lower half is equine.

I disagree with Anet sticking to a certain amount of realism, or even to any amount of realism, for reasons cited previously in this thread. There are many, many more examples. Mount Maelstrom, for one — what could live in that big chamber full of lava? Nothing realistic.

A centaur performing acrobatics would be no more unrealistic or unbelievable than just about anything else in the game. Why would centaurs be able to do things horses can’t do? Because they also have human-like brains, and, like humans, they could train themselves to do things that otherwise might seem impossible.

If the animators can’t pull it off, that’s one thing. But saying it can’t be done because ‘centaurs can’t do that!’ is not a valid excuse.

I said some, and given what comes out of the lava, there is an acceptable level of suspension of disbelief there.

Again, there are realistic limitations to the form; human-like brains or otherwise. To do aerobatics with a centaur would be beyond that acceptable level of suspension of disbelief that is necessary in games and movies.

Animators can animate pretty much anything, if they so choose. However, not all of it comes out…good.

As for “valid excuse”s simply saying “I want it, I want it” isn’t a valid reason to have it either.

Conncept.7638:

And you just proved my point, not about you being a doomsayer (that wasn’t my point in the first place), but about your comment that ‘Centaur are impossible’. People said in GW1 that the Charr were impossible, obviously they were wrong. Your point that the centaur are impossible is just as unfounded, being nothing more than your own assumption based on your lack of knowledge of the game systems.

Essentially you’ve presented the argument:

“It can’t work, because I personally do not know how it could.”

Which is completely nonsensical. Inability to provide evidence that something could work is not proof that it can’t.

There are few things that the developers cannot get to work in such a broad system as is present in a large scale MMO, and Centaurs as a race are not one of them. Sweeping generalizations against new content such as the one you posted earlier are completely worthless as points of discussion.

Actually im basing my argument more around what ive seen the centuars in game doing. They dont do fancy animations. They are kept simple and workable, i wonder why that is honestly….Hmmm… And again, the clipping of armor. They make a human armor and stretch it to the other races, that is how they do armor in this game, if they cant take time to make armor fit the one beast race in game(Which they dont, clipping issues galore on charr), can you imagine the issues they would have with centuars? i can, personally.

Another point, from the lore, weve never been able to play as villians. But wait, we can play as charr now! After 250 years have gone by, and they completely changed their ways. In GW1 we had friendly centaurs, however they where very limited to the Maguuma jungle, In GW2 i think theres..maybe one village of friendly centuars? They dont have a capital city that we can see(at least one that we can get into without attacking). ugh i wish i could type the rest of this out, but i have to head off to work!

Mortifer.2946:

Look at FB picture. Can it be true? :P

Are you that naive? :P

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Again, there are realistic limitations to the form; human-like brains or otherwise. To do aerobatics with a centaur would be beyond that acceptable level of suspension of disbelief that is necessary in games and movies.

The I raise you the Rule-Of-Cool to counter your acceptable-suspension-of-disbelief! :P

Dante.1763:

In GW2 i think theres..maybe one village of friendly centuars?

That we know of!

CureForLiving.5360:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Again, there are realistic limitations to the form; human-like brains or otherwise. To do aerobatics with a centaur would be beyond that acceptable level of suspension of disbelief that is necessary in games and movies.

The I raise you the Rule-Of-Cool to counter your acceptable-suspension-of-disbelief! :P

lawl

The bridge with the idiot lemmings is → that-a-way

(and for those that don’t get it, to quote my mother “would you jump off a bridge if everyone else was doing it”)

Conncept.7638:

And you just proved my point, not about you being a doomsayer (that wasn’t my point in the first place), but about your comment that ‘Centaur are impossible’. People said in GW1 that the Charr were impossible, obviously they were wrong. Your point that the centaur are impossible is just as unfounded, being nothing more than your own assumption based on your lack of knowledge of the game systems.

Essentially you’ve presented the argument:

“It can’t work, because I personally do not know how it could.”

Which is completely nonsensical. Inability to provide evidence that something could work is not proof that it can’t.

There are few things that the developers cannot get to work in such a broad system as is present in a large scale MMO, and Centaurs as a race are not one of them. Sweeping generalizations against new content such as the one you posted earlier are completely worthless as points of discussion.

What about my points?

I don’t think it’s fair to compare Charr to Centaurs. It is a daunting task to refit everything for a Charr compared to a human and for a centaur I honestly don’t think the armor would be much of an issue. As some have said so far, the only things that would need major redesigns are leg and foot armors. What was it exactly that the players were saying about the Charr? I am curious; I wasn’t around for much of GW1 so I don’t know. Still, Charr are agile and flexible creatures that can move somewhat similar to bipedal creatures. Centaurs move like horses because they share the same body type. Not only would it be the first playable race to be of a non-bipedal creature type, but their body type does not accommodate certain motion within the world of Tyria itself.

Dante might be saying it weirdly, but they are not necessarily wrong. If you think of the shape of a Centaur, it is essentially an L laying on its side. The long part of the L does not flex in the vertical direction much at all, and its flexibility in the horizontal plane is limited as well. A horse body achieves its agility through speed, acceleration, and a moderate ability to turn quickly. It doesn’t roll (which could be avoided by implementing side-stepping for dodging), but when it comes to things like D/D thief #3, GS Guardian #2, Thief Elite Dagger storm, etc, this body type just doesn’t keep up with a bipedal body.

The only way I could see this even coming close to working is if the body of the Centaur did not whirl around and instead, in the instance of Death Blossom, they did an evasive dash towards the target while throwing some daggers around. It would look clunky, but it could possibly work.

MiniEquine.6014:

Try to look at it from the animation stand-point. How, exactly, does one animate a centaur doing a flip? It could only be some jerky, ragdoll-type, legs outstretched kind of thing that would be incredibly poor looking.

I see it more as a lunge toward the target, a spring, with the forelegs tucked in, then a mid-air roll in which the blades lash out, followed by a kick from one or more of the hind legs, then the front legs unfolding for the landing.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

To do aerobatics with a centaur would be beyond that acceptable level of suspension of disbelief that is necessary in games and movies.

Again, I must disagree. As previously mentioned, our guys can swim pretty darned well in heavy armor. Not to mention all the rolls and flips and the jumping and the running and falling from great heights. We can walk across lava and not die. We can be hurled from a catapult to the top of a high tower, and again, not die.

The point being: our disbelief is already mounted on industrial shock absorbers, and so death blossoming centaurs are no more damaging to the suspension of disbelief than asura not killing themselves whenever they move their heads.

I’m thinking its druid because of the vines. Centaurs aren’t very nature themed in GW2 so the vines must be something else. Of course it may just be there to say HoT because HoT is nature themed. Still believe druid theory though. Only one way to find out…Wait and See. P.S. does anyone know when HoT is going to be released? Or even a good guess?

Tachenon.5270:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

To do aerobatics with a centaur would be beyond that acceptable level of suspension of disbelief that is necessary in games and movies.

Again, I must disagree. As previously mentioned, our guys can swim pretty darned well in heavy armor. Not to mention all the rolls and flips and the jumping and the running and falling from great heights. We can walk across lava and not die. We can be hurled from a catapult to the top of a high tower, and again, not die.

The point being: our disbelief is already mounted on industrial shock absorbers, and so death blossoming centaurs are no more damaging to the suspension of disbelief than asura not killing themselves whenever they move their heads.

Lol I do actually agree with you on some of your examples. However, I disagree on the centaurs. We’ll just have to leave it at that.

Tachenon.5270:

MiniEquine.6014:

Try to look at it from the animation stand-point. How, exactly, does one animate a centaur doing a flip? It could only be some jerky, ragdoll-type, legs outstretched kind of thing that would be incredibly poor looking.

I see it more as a lunge toward the target, a spring, with the forelegs tucked in, then a mid-air roll in which the blades lash out, followed by a kick from one or more of the hind legs, then the front legs unfolding for the landing.

I could see all but the roll. They definitely can’t do forward or backward flips, so those would be right out. So far as I’m aware, horses and especially centaur are unable to roll mid-air. They would need a lot more of a jump to even make it without making the animation too fast or having them look like they are floating.

Even if they can figure out Death Blossom, how do their figure out Dagger Storm? That’s 8 seconds of whirling around instead of just the 1/4 seconds during DB.

When humans perform the Dagger Storm, they twirl around in a dramatically unrealistic manner. Why can’t a centaur simply rear up and twirl around in an equally unrealistic manner?

Or execute a dramatically unrealistic pirouette. ;-)

Tachenon.5270:

When humans perform the Dagger Storm, they twirl around in a dramatically unrealistic manner. Why can’t a centaur simply rear up and twirl around in an equally unrealistic manner?

Or execute a dramatically unrealistic pirouette. ;-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gg4hartoXJ4

Lol, that video. I kept waiting for the exciting thing, but then I realized the horse was already doing it, haha.

On topic, they could possibly stand on their hind-quarters and spin like that, but this might cause issues with how tall they would be at that point. It would look sorta like Black Beauty here:

http://ia.media-imdb.com/images/M/MV5BMjEwNTc3NzI4NF5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTcwOTk3MDcyMQ@@._V1_SY317_CR10,0,214,317_AL_.jpg

Diovid.9506:

Tachenon.5270:

If the animators can’t pull it off, that’s one thing. But saying it can’t be done because ‘centaurs can’t do that!’ is not a valid excuse.

I imagine that it’s not that it can’t be done but that it would be a lot of work and then still look kinda awkward. It’s a costs/benefits thing (as is everything of course).

This is basically IT, ie it CAN certainly be done, but it would require probably about 3-4 times as much work as for a bipedal race, and the result would likely still come out either kinda clunky, or at the edge of comedy like, thus it is VERY VERY VERY unlikely.

Also for armors… it is NOT as simple as just scaling down armor and it all fits perfectly, it has to fit exactly to the body, and snap into it according to the character we make during character creation that can have quite a lot of small changes that the armors have to fit to, there is probably some kind of autoscaling thing for that, but they have to make sure the textures down get weird and stretchy or similar, when that happen.
Also chest is nowhere NEAR that of the humans for a LOT of the armors, what about all the coats and dresses? (which is a large amount of medium and light armor)

MiniEquine.6014:

Even if they can figure out Death Blossom, how do their figure out Dagger Storm? That’s 8 seconds of whirling around instead of just the 1/4 seconds during DB.

You turn https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3F06jMlh-g into something like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyNpp5MVSTA

Easy XD

CureForLiving.5360:

MiniEquine.6014:

Even if they can figure out Death Blossom, how do their figure out Dagger Storm? That’s 8 seconds of whirling around instead of just the 1/4 seconds during DB.

You turn https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3F06jMlh-g into something like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyNpp5MVSTA

Easy XD

Wouldn’t really work, as the torso of a centaur (ie where they daggers are being throw from) is at the front of the horse body, not the middle, making it look very weird and wrong to have them spin around the middle of the horse body

GummiBear.2756:

CureForLiving.5360:

MiniEquine.6014:

Even if they can figure out Death Blossom, how do their figure out Dagger Storm? That’s 8 seconds of whirling around instead of just the 1/4 seconds during DB.

You turn https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3F06jMlh-g into something like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyNpp5MVSTA

Easy XD

Wouldn’t really work, as the torso of a centaur (ie where they daggers are being throw from) is at the front of the horse body, not the middle, making it look very weird and wrong to have them spin around the middle of the horse body

Bah I’m still holding out hope! :P

Oh flyin spaghetti! Spinning thief horses launching daggers! This thread made my day.

I think it’s hilarious people are accepting that spinning around is in any way a sensible strategy for throwing daggers in the first place…

How about the centaur thief just stands there and waves their arms a lot? A few backhand tosses to cover behind them and assorted side and forward flicks for the rest of the field of fire. That would actually be about 30 times more plausible than Daggerstorm is now…

Nike.2631:

I think it’s hilarious people are accepting that spinning around is in any way a sensible strategy for throwing daggers in the first place…

How about the centaur thief just stands there and waves their arms a lot? A few backhand tosses to cover behind them and assorted side and forward flicks for the rest of the field of fire. That would actually be about 30 times more plausible than Daggerstorm is now…

I guess that’d be a suggestion for the Thief forums though I think they have Dagger Storm working how it’s supposed to be, which is not an accuracy-based skill. The idea is to just throw as many daggers in as many directions at once, and it also has the added effect of dealing 8x more damage to point blank targets than it does to targets at maximum range. They should at least make sure they can match the arm movements with the number of projectiles, which they avoid having to do because your character is spinning around fast.

Just to clarify, when I described my idea of a centaur executing the death blossom maneuver, and I said ‘roll’, I didn’t mean they’d roll forward like someone doing a somersault. I meant they’d roll like a plane rolling on its longitudinal axis. More or less. With a little arc in there, too. Ahem.

It’s officially the Revenant Legend reveal for Ventari!

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/revenant-compassion-as-a-way-of-life/

MiniEquine.6014:

It’s officially the Revenant Legend reveal for Ventari!

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/revenant-compassion-as-a-way-of-life/

Supportive/Healing, staff, and Ventari…. yup lot of us called that

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

MiniEquine.6014:

It’s officially the Revenant Legend reveal for Ventari!

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/revenant-compassion-as-a-way-of-life/

Supportive/Healing, staff, and Ventari…. yup lot of us called that

even got a “I Can Outrun a Centaur!” headline as someone mentioned something like that too :P

GummiBear.2756:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

MiniEquine.6014:

It’s officially the Revenant Legend reveal for Ventari!

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/revenant-compassion-as-a-way-of-life/

Supportive/Healing, staff, and Ventari…. yup lot of us called that

even got a “I Can Outrun a Centaur!” headline as someone mentioned something like that too :P

I saw that…

..and shook my head

The REAL reason we will never have playable centaurs: mounts, including horses, are on the table and centaurs riding horses would look… awkward.

Then again, ya know, maybe it’s the other way around. Maybe the REAL reason we won’t ever have mounts, including horses, is because playable centaurs are stabled on that fabled table, waiting to be enabled!

MiniEquine.6014:

It’s officially the Revenant Legend reveal for Ventari!

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/revenant-compassion-as-a-way-of-life/

So? No one really expected a playable centaur. But the conversation has long gone from ‘are we getting centaurs?’ to ‘lets get ourselves some centaurs!’ (and of course you bunch of naysayers. Fooo kill-joys foo).

Tachenon.5270:

The REAL reason we will never have playable centaurs: mounts, including horses, are on the table and centaurs riding horses would look… awkward.

Mounts have never really been on the table though…

CureForLiving.5360:

MiniEquine.6014:

It’s officially the Revenant Legend reveal for Ventari!

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/revenant-compassion-as-a-way-of-life/

So? No one really expected a playable centaur. But the conversation has long gone from ‘are we getting centaurs?’ to ‘lets get ourselves some centaurs!’ (and of course you bunch of naysayers. Fooo kill-joys foo).

Tachenon.5270:

The REAL reason we will never have playable centaurs: mounts, including horses, are on the table and centaurs riding horses would look… awkward.

Mounts have never really been on the table though…

It’s not necessarily about the topic’s title. People were thinking it was the Druid reveal within this thread as well, I was merely pointing out that it was, in fact, the Revenant reveal. And us “neigh”-sayers (:P) have good reasons for being so.

Make this an outfit