Former PvP Forum Specialist
2015-2016
Fort Aspenwood
2015-2016
Fort Aspenwood
Precursor Crafting Overpriced?
Im fine with the old one being stupidly expensive. As the basis for their design was to keep equal and not undervalue existing precursors.
So tell me what value the new set of Legendaries has, when the only way they can be obtained is through a collection. This is an issue i hope gets looked into. It probably won’t and the reasoning will be that because its new we had to value against an existing counterpart, while completely dismissing that the previous counterparts still have other means of acquisition.
It’s good where it is. Gives people a chance to go this is too expensive for me and back out before they put in too much time and effort.
If it’s time and effort enjoyed then that’s way more valuable content to the overall population of the game than a scarecrow at the start scaring away the majority.
What you are suggesting, in my view, is that putting the hardest level of a game first would be better because then people wouldn’t get disappointed once they reach it at the end and can’t finish it after so much time and effort in the first place. Which means that what you’re saying is, getting disappointed earlier is better. But I’m not quite sure that’s true in this case.
I suppose it functions greatly at discouraging people, but why would any game discourage itself from playing it right at the start? I would say that would be entirely backwards.
If anything could use some encouraging it would be the legendary creation.
Anyway, that’s entirely subjective I suppose, maybe I’m just used to incrementing difficulty, effort and time rather than the other way around.
So it’s supposed be cheap and quick and then suddenly become long and expensive?
I’ve played plenty of games where the difficulty is at the beginning of the game rather than the end. With a couple of those games not really having an end (Sims 2 and 3, not as easy when they don’t have money, pretty easy when they do.). And it’s more like the middle levels being harder than the beginning or end since precursor crafting doesn’t have that many steps.
People Complain about Rng Factor of Precursors -> Anet Adds Crafting for 100% Guarantee of one -> People still complain
._.
I’m guessing that people who complain about price want anet to constantly update the recipes every 2-3 days to ensure the materials required is on par with what players put their precursors for?
the complaint was about aquisition methods.
one method costs you a random amount of gold, the averaged out to 60% of the highest tp cost,
and the other was the higher tp cost
so cost was always the problem.
the other facet is, the material parts are the least engaging, and most annoying parts of the precursor crafting process. They make the process worse.
too much in this games item balancing revolves around destroying an excess of generated items. almost every implementation of this feels nasty and off putting in the game.
10,000 drinks 7200 silk 2350 orbs.
when will they learn its not simply about balancing consumption vs generation, its also about choosing the proper magnitudes.
If you were content (as many of us are), to slowly build towards your legendary, you would be spending much less.
The total cost is the same, just because you spend mats and not gold doesn’t mean the value is less.
No, the total cost for me is going to be much less — those building them now are spending a premium on time or coin to acquire their mats. I am selling those very mats now and will be repurchasing them again later, at reduced prices. I’ll spend less on labor and/or coin — the difference is that I won’t acquire the new shinies until much, much later.
Or put another way, the variables affecting total expenses are: labor, coin, and calendar date — I am trading the last one (when I acquire) in order to save on the first two.
no the prices will not go down, precursors overall rose in value, so will these materials. they will continue to introduce new legendaries and new specialized items which use the same materials.
prices you see 3 months after the release are basically the stabilized prices, they will only rise with inflation, or fluctuate based on game design changes.
if in 3 years the value of dusk continued to rise, what makes you think breaking dusk into 2000 pieces will cause each piece to drop?
prices of materials will only rise as more demand is generated, unless they develop less than 6 precurors a year, and dont create new items that need ascended mats.
the bulk of the cost for ascended materials is created from the demand for ascended materials. these items are created more often to meet the demand, they wont go down much in value, people will just produce less of them, except for cloth and leather.
People Complain about Rng Factor of Precursors -> Anet Adds Crafting for 100% Guarantee of one -> People still complain
._.
I’m guessing that people who complain about price want anet to constantly update the recipes every 2-3 days to ensure the materials required is on par with what players put their precursors for?
Not even that … they think they should be CHEAPER than what players put up their precursors for. You don’t need a Ph. D. in Economics to know why that is nonsense.
If you were content (as many of us are), to slowly build towards your legendary, you would be spending much less.
The total cost is the same, just because you spend mats and not gold doesn’t mean the value is less.
No, the total cost for me is going to be much less — those building them now are spending a premium on time or coin to acquire their mats. I am selling those very mats now and will be repurchasing them again later, at reduced prices. I’ll spend less on labor and/or coin — the difference is that I won’t acquire the new shinies until much, much later.
Or put another way, the variables affecting total expenses are: labor, coin, and calendar date — I am trading the last one (when I acquire) in order to save on the first two.
no the prices will not go down, precursors overall rose in value, so will these materials. they will continue to introduce new legendaries and new specialized items which use the same materials.
prices you see 3 months after the release are basically the stabilized prices, they will only rise with inflation, or fluctuate based on game design changes.if in 3 years the value of dusk continued to rise, what makes you think breaking dusk into 2000 pieces will cause each piece to drop?
prices of materials will only rise as more demand is generated, unless they develop less than 6 precurors a year, and dont create new items that need ascended mats.
the bulk of the cost for ascended materials is created from the demand for ascended materials. these items are created more often to meet the demand, they wont go down much in value, people will just produce less of them, except for cloth and leather.
Yes, the equilibrium price will be higher than it was before HoT launched, but we may not have hit those equilibrium prices yet. It takes time for equilibrium prices to be reached.
We have guild halls being worked on (As time passes fewer and fewer guilds will require higher mats). Demand for new gear for pre-HoT characters will go down. Think of all the people who were making new gear for their characters in preparation for the elite specs and/or revenant.
If you were content (as many of us are), to slowly build towards your legendary, you would be spending much less.
The total cost is the same, just because you spend mats and not gold doesn’t mean the value is less.
No, the total cost for me is going to be much less — those building them now are spending a premium on time or coin to acquire their mats. I am selling those very mats now and will be repurchasing them again later, at reduced prices. I’ll spend less on labor and/or coin — the difference is that I won’t acquire the new shinies until much, much later.
Or put another way, the variables affecting total expenses are: labor, coin, and calendar date — I am trading the last one (when I acquire) in order to save on the first two.
no the prices will not go down, precursors overall rose in value, so will these materials. they will continue to introduce new legendaries and new specialized items which use the same materials.
prices you see 3 months after the release are basically the stabilized prices, they will only rise with inflation, or fluctuate based on game design changes.if in 3 years the value of dusk continued to rise, what makes you think breaking dusk into 2000 pieces will cause each piece to drop?
prices of materials will only rise as more demand is generated, unless they develop less than 6 precurors a year, and dont create new items that need ascended mats.
the bulk of the cost for ascended materials is created from the demand for ascended materials. these items are created more often to meet the demand, they wont go down much in value, people will just produce less of them, except for cloth and leather.
Yes, the equilibrium price will be higher than it was before HoT launched, but we may not have hit those equilibrium prices yet. It takes time for equilibrium prices to be reached.
We have guild halls being worked on (As time passes fewer and fewer guilds will require higher mats). Demand for new gear for pre-HoT characters will go down. Think of all the people who were making new gear for their characters in preparation for the elite specs and/or revenant.
The cost is such that, as one finishes, another starts. Or rather it seems more work on it than finish.
This demand did not go down in years of precursors before, until population dropped very low.
Basically as long as the game has a bealthy population, the cost will be high. And since the new legendaries equalize the item demand, all of these items will stay valueable.
The rush is over, these are long term prices now.
If you were content (as many of us are), to slowly build towards your legendary, you would be spending much less.
The total cost is the same, just because you spend mats and not gold doesn’t mean the value is less.
No, the total cost for me is going to be much less — those building them now are spending a premium on time or coin to acquire their mats. I am selling those very mats now and will be repurchasing them again later, at reduced prices. I’ll spend less on labor and/or coin — the difference is that I won’t acquire the new shinies until much, much later.
Or put another way, the variables affecting total expenses are: labor, coin, and calendar date — I am trading the last one (when I acquire) in order to save on the first two.
no the prices will not go down, precursors overall rose in value, so will these materials. they will continue to introduce new legendaries and new specialized items which use the same materials.
prices you see 3 months after the release are basically the stabilized prices, they will only rise with inflation, or fluctuate based on game design changes.if in 3 years the value of dusk continued to rise, what makes you think breaking dusk into 2000 pieces will cause each piece to drop?
prices of materials will only rise as more demand is generated, unless they develop less than 6 precurors a year, and dont create new items that need ascended mats.
the bulk of the cost for ascended materials is created from the demand for ascended materials. these items are created more often to meet the demand, they wont go down much in value, people will just produce less of them, except for cloth and leather.
Yes, the equilibrium price will be higher than it was before HoT launched, but we may not have hit those equilibrium prices yet. It takes time for equilibrium prices to be reached.
We have guild halls being worked on (As time passes fewer and fewer guilds will require higher mats). Demand for new gear for pre-HoT characters will go down. Think of all the people who were making new gear for their characters in preparation for the elite specs and/or revenant.
The cost is such that, as one finishes, another starts. Or rather it seems more work on it than finish.
This demand did not go down in years of precursors before, until population dropped very low.
Basically as long as the game has a bealthy population, the cost will be high. And since the new legendaries equalize the item demand, all of these items will stay valueable.
The rush is over, these are long term prices now.
It takes time for prices to perfectly match supply and demand. Demand and Supply have both not been relatively steady for long enough for equilibrium prices to have been reached.
And smaller guilds are still on their guild upgrades as they don’t have the manpower to get through them. So the number of guilds using up mats and increasing the demand there is still likely higher than the average demand for mats from guilds.
And we’ve hit Wintersday. And this Wintersday comes with a very grindy achievement if you want the shoulders. Which has lowered the supply of mats. Since demand hasn’t changed drastically, a lowered supply will raise prices. So we are not at the equilibrium price for the average time of the year even if demand has fallen to average levels.
If you can’t afford the scenic route, don’t take it. Other routes are cheaper
why would one take it at all considering how much cheaper other routes are?
Some people prefer the less hectic path. This is like needing to earn gold fast enough to get the precursor before it goes up in price dramatically.
Some people prefer to see the sights and aren’t in a rush to reach their destination. This is like wanting to go on a journey to get the precursor.
Not everyone has more fun doing things the cheapest and most efficient way.
Not really. Some people just don’t actually do the research to know the real cost, or not bother to calculating them. They choose it without knowing it, and some of them complain because they felt like they’re being scammed into doing it until they can’t turn back anymore. (Step 2 anyone?)
They spent more effort without knowing it, and justify their effort by saying it’s a “journey” so they feel less bad about taking the tedious route. It’s a psychological phenomenon of human-being.
It’s good where it is. Gives people a chance to go this is too expensive for me and back out before they put in too much time and effort.
If it’s time and effort enjoyed then that’s way more valuable content to the overall population of the game than a scarecrow at the start scaring away the majority.
What you are suggesting, in my view, is that putting the hardest level of a game first would be better because then people wouldn’t get disappointed once they reach it at the end and can’t finish it after so much time and effort in the first place. Which means that what you’re saying is, getting disappointed earlier is better. But I’m not quite sure that’s true in this case.
I suppose it functions greatly at discouraging people, but why would any game discourage itself from playing it right at the start? I would say that would be entirely backwards.
If anything could use some encouraging it would be the legendary creation.
Anyway, that’s entirely subjective I suppose, maybe I’m just used to incrementing difficulty, effort and time rather than the other way around.
So it’s supposed be cheap and quick and then suddenly become long and expensive?
I’ve played plenty of games where the difficulty is at the beginning of the game rather than the end. With a couple of those games not really having an end (Sims 2 and 3, not as easy when they don’t have money, pretty easy when they do.). And it’s more like the middle levels being harder than the beginning or end since precursor crafting doesn’t have that many steps.
True, there are many games that have their difficulty at the learning stage. But I was mostly talking about using it to discourage people, since that’s what you implied.
Not that there’s many steps indeed, but if they could make it more compelling by manipulating the costs a bit, so it’s more manageable at the start and more expensive near the end. Or maybe just spread the material investment more evenly. Meaning the other extreme of cheap at the start and then suddenly expensive doesn’t sound great either. Making people invested in the process would seemingly be better, than scaring them away at ANY time.
“It isn’t working!” CL4P-TP
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik
For now I’m worried about the price of amalgamated gemstone.
It use 2250 orbs or crests or doubloons and stack of T6 dust to craft New legendary.
That’s a lot.
This is the last gold sink I need to pass.
People Complain about Rng Factor of Precursors -> Anet Adds Crafting for 100% Guarantee of one -> People still complain
._.
I’m guessing that people who complain about price want anet to constantly update the recipes every 2-3 days to ensure the materials required is on par with what players put their precursors for?
Not even that … they think they should be CHEAPER than what players put up their precursors for. You don’t need a Ph. D. in Economics to know why that is nonsense.
Game economics is half designed, half actual economics. It’s a matter of how many of the precursors you want in your game vs how obtainable you want them to be.
So what some people really wanted is for precursors to be easier to obtain, in general.
Which is totally up for debate.
“It isn’t working!” CL4P-TP
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik
People Complain about Rng Factor of Precursors -> Anet Adds Crafting for 100% Guarantee of one -> People still complain
._.
I’m guessing that people who complain about price want anet to constantly update the recipes every 2-3 days to ensure the materials required is on par with what players put their precursors for?
Not even that … they think they should be CHEAPER than what players put up their precursors for. You don’t need a Ph. D. in Economics to know why that is nonsense.
Game economics is half designed, half actual economics. It’s a matter of how many of the precursors you want in your game vs how obtainable you want them to be.
So what some people really wanted is for precursors to be easier to obtain, in general.
Which is totally up for debate.
It’s not a matter of that at all, because it’s evident that Anet didn’t implement crafting with the goal of making them more obtainable. People sure do have a knack for imagining what they want and thinking it’s what it should be. I don’t believe there is any debate if precursors should be easier to obtain because regardless of what the results of that debate is, it’s not relevant.
People Complain about Rng Factor of Precursors -> Anet Adds Crafting for 100% Guarantee of one -> People still complain
._.
I’m guessing that people who complain about price want anet to constantly update the recipes every 2-3 days to ensure the materials required is on par with what players put their precursors for?
Not even that … they think they should be CHEAPER than what players put up their precursors for. You don’t need a Ph. D. in Economics to know why that is nonsense.
Game economics is half designed, half actual economics. It’s a matter of how many of the precursors you want in your game vs how obtainable you want them to be.
So what some people really wanted is for precursors to be easier to obtain, in general.
Which is totally up for debate.It’s not a matter of that at all, because it’s evident that Anet didn’t implement crafting with the goal of making them more obtainable. People sure do have a knack for imagining what they want and thinking it’s what it should be. I don’t believe there is any debate if precursors should be easier to obtain because regardless of what the results of that debate is, it’s not relevant.
Its always a matter of that, it’s just that ArenaNet made the decision on that already. (is what you mean to say) ArenaNet designed it one way, and some players thought it a different way. It just means players had different expectations and formed different opinions about it. It’s that simple. And the relevance of people’s opinion on that matter is always relevant to ArenaNet.
Though I don’t think that the difference between TP price and crafted price is that relevant at all, as the two methods are entirely different in the way they are executed.
“It isn’t working!” CL4P-TP
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik