Guild Wars 2

I mean, really seems rather elitist to say that, Well because you don’t play enough to freaking bad. Super easy solution, Tier raiding so there is an Ascended mode and an Exotic mode. I mean it’s almost literally a numbers tweak since all exotic gear is the same, just like ascended gear. They don’t have to change the raid mechanics, they can still make ball busting hard, just make it available to more people. They can also change the loot level to be a tier lower in gear and the loot appearance so the ascended people can still feel “Special”. Let the appearance of legendary gear be the carrot on the stick to get the ascended gear for raiding.

When the Raiding content they are giving us is something far more interesting and mechanically complex, than the now “Berserker Meta” Dungeons/Fractals, and benefits from the NEED to have a mixed raid group IE. Tank, Support, and Condi dmg. Lowering the barrier of entry for those who are coming from other games (WoW) and just want to raid with friends and nothing else is not a bad thing, give them options. Instead of having them spend ten years running around the world farming for ascended pieces and legendaries, That should be Optional.

Ascended gear took me about 15 hours of game time to get. Spend 5 hours a week working on your ascended set and you will have it in 3 weeks. The amount of development time that would go into managing the separate raids is just silly. You want the developers to spend their time rather than you just getting the gear.

The main carrot is the skins and legendary armor drops (aka the stuff needed for legendary armor progression).

Take that away on a lower difficulty mode, and people will rage and abandon the easier content.

I do agree though, it would be nice to have some sort of solo story availability to see the story from raids unravel. Then again, there always is youtube to watch this stuff on once it got cleared.

There is not gate. You can go in and do if in Mastercrafted gear if you want to. You probably won’t win it without at least Exotic, but it is not actually gated. Something being gated would suggest that you NEEDED the gear in order to even access the content.

Agreed. I think it’d be nice to set them up like Fractals. No gate and it scales which actually aids in teaching people how to run them. The byproduct of scaling is that people get to learn how to do it and hopefully they keep raiding which keeps the population of raiders decent.

That being said, the community will gate this for LFG. It’s the nature of the beast. At the end of the day the gear gating for entry into the raid is an odd thing because subsequent raids in 1 year and 2 years and so on will all have the ascended gate for entry. There’s no treadmill. Adding in scaling is a good idea. Each raid can then be learned before hitting the highest difficulty. I realize the “gate” is just a recommended one. The hard gate will be the fine people in “the best MMO community in all of gaming”.

This is competitive content. If you want to be a part of it, put in the time to get the gear. Do not ask ANet to push it towards casual. While the armor takes a while, ascended is not even that hard to get.

Besides, my understanding is they updated the post to say that it’s only recommended for raids, not required. It is only 5%, after all.

Raids are suppose to be the most chllenging content of the game, therefore it isn’t an issue at all that it require Ascend armor.

Also ascend armor aren’t hard to get, just time consuming because you can craft 1 item daily, and even if you play a small amount of time you should have it rdy by now.

Btw “require” isn’t acurate, it will be appreciate but good players will be able to do it in exotic.

Cyninja.2954:

The main carrot is the skins and legendary armor drops (aka the stuff needed for legendary armor progression).

Take that away on a lower difficulty mode, and people will rage and abandon the easier content.

I do agree though, it would be nice to have some sort of solo story availability to see the story from raids unravel. Then again, there always is youtube to watch this stuff on once it got cleared.

That’s the thing though having the ability to change the stats of any piece of exotic on the fly is still pretty powerful, and it doesn’t need to look as cool legendary gear it just has to be functional.

Also I’m not saying to make the content easier just scale to be just as difficult as the Ascended Mode without needing ascended gear.

I find it so strange that so many GW2 veterans are so against making things more accessible for everyone while not changing the actual difficulty across the board. Not talking about you in particular Cyninja, just in general.

There is no “solution” needed. You complain about putting in the basic effort to gear up for the content level…saying that you don’t have enough time in game to do so. If you don’t have enough time in game to have crafted a couple of components a day or even during a week…of ascended gear….then what makes anyone think you have enough time to even attempt a raid? I mean it literally takes seconds to craft the pieces to make ascended gear. You don’t have to craft an entire ascended gear piece in a day…or even in a week. You don’t have to farm materials…they are all sitting right there in the TP except for a few things like dragonite. If you have been playing the game at all, then you should have tons of dragonite, empyreal fragments, and bloodstone dust accumulated…especially since you have apparently never crafted any ascended items. Those things literally drop from every game mode in some way. Even the common components like silk, iron, etc drop from just playing the game. If you had time to get exotic gear…then you definitely had time to be working on ascended gear. You just chose not to. Why would anyone (developers or other players) invest in someone who simply “chooses not to”? This sounds like part of that crowd that always complained about not wanting or needing to craft ascended, which was over a year ago I think. Now look where that attitude has them. They had plenty of time to get with the program. You have created this situation yourself. The good news is that its not too late to resolve it yourself. Get busy crafting instead of expecting everyone else to cater to you for being lazy or stubborn.

This is foolhardy at best this isn’t WoW or any other traditional MMO

Putting in a block not matter the kind including armor would just tear open another big hole in this games fundamental design structure.

It’s a game of DPS and thus a game of burst

Adding in an ascended armor req would do nothing more than remove classes from que. The Beserker meta was nothing but the heavy armor classes and if the game is difficult enough to warrant ascended then then of the 9 classes people will only have 1 go to for each role. This game lacks the level of class identity needed and if things are so difficult they require ascended then no doubt it would be too difficult to even think of bringing in a lesser class. Other MMO’s aren’t exactly balanced and classes get ignored(WoW-Shaman as they bring zip to the table that other classes can’t do better) but the classes are balanced enough to take others along in raids as every class brings something to the table.

More or less the classes are so unbalanced and so unrefined that too many of them will probably be ignored for raiding even if they were wearing ascended and I feel no game should penalize people for there class. Though punishing people for there class is something Gw2 is known for since we had the Zerker Meta It would be nice to separate them for raids but not only would this lead to more time creating raids it wouldn’t seperate elitists from casuals. Every time I run a new guildy through story mode I end up chewing out some elitist who thinks it’s explorable the same would be true for casual raid mode.

For the record my main is Mez who does have asc also ascended is 10% after they updated it. Also what skill is there in obtaining Ascended!? If anything they should just have a Guild Raid and pug raid with pug getting a buff.

Lome.8239:

This is competitive content. If you want to be a part of it, put in the time to get the gear. Do not ask ANet to push it towards casual. While the armor takes a while, ascended is not even that hard to get.

Besides, my understanding is they updated the post to say that it’s only recommended for raids, not required. It is only 5%, after all.

It is if you don’t care to run Fractals, which is why I’m assuming it’s so easy to get as many people keep saying.

And its not about catering to “Casuals” it about accessibility getting more people to the content faster. Instead of only aiming at the people at the top. I said I didn’t want it to easier for the exotic people than it is for the ascended people. Just easier to get into the door for other people. I mean, I’m a pretty experience raider in WoW and would like to try it because there is actually now a reason to have other roles in a group than just the Zerkers gear the community says you need in dungeons or fractals.

Oh and thanks for the update didn’t know that.

lordkrall.7241:

There is not gate. You can go in and do if in Mastercrafted gear if you want to. You probably won’t win it without at least Exotic, but it is not actually gated. Something being gated would suggest that you NEEDED the gear in order to even access the content.

Alright, just heard about the update Anet made to the post.

Its already clear they don’t care about any of the previous fundamental design structures if they are going to make healing a stand alone thing. That point is already moot.

Its also clear from what they have been telling us and showing us for HoT raids, that its no longer just a game of dps and burst, but also of support and survival. Yes, dps is still required…as the enemies aren’t going to kill themselves!

Quality level of your armor has absolutely nothing to do with removing any class from participation. There are the full range of ascended armor stats available to all classes…not even sure what you were smoking with that statement. The “berserker meta” never had anything to do with heavy versus light versus medium armor type. Really, I want some of what you are smoking asap! Elementalists ended up being the prime component in zerk groups to the extent that you wanted more than one in a group. I’m pretty sure they were not wearing heavy armor. My mesmer also never had any issues in any group that advertised meta or zerk. Of course, I wasn’t running around camping GS in these groups with nomad gear on either. I’m also sure thieves were part of the meta to a degree as well…medium armor. I’m pretty sure the only classes that could legitimately complain about not being able to get into meta groups were necromancers and rangers. Necromancers had/have a legitimate gripe, but that has nothing to do with gear….that’s 100% stubborn development wanting them to be a special snowflake…intentionally keeping them from being group friendly. Rangers 100% had the ability to play in the meta runs…the class was just so overloaded with nomad bearbows that no one would trust one to not bring this to a group….spamming knock back with their longbows from max range the entire fights. Now they have an option that almost makes them required for serious attempts at raids….druid. On that side note about the WoW Shaman, my enhancement shaman was awesome and was even asked for in raids…those rogues and dps warriors were even annoying in how persistent they were in demanding specific totems. Bloodlust was also a nice contribution in burn phases.

Undoubtedly there is going to be a new meta in HoT raiding, its human nature to try and find the most effective and efficient route to solving a puzzle. Again, this has nothing to do with ascended armor. I agree with you that no game should penalize for the class you choose, but that is entirely a design issue on ANET’s part. Even then, the only classes that I see having potential issues are necromancers/reapers and possibly daredevils. Not so sure about the daredevils as I haven’t checked them out thoroughly yet. As far as class balance issues go, I don’t think it is anywhere near what you are intimating. Yes, my chronomancer has sub par dps, but the utility and support coupled with this mid to low tier dps guarantees a raid spot for at least one chronomancer. That is balance in my opinion. If each class can bring highly valued things to the table…enough to offset dps inequities…then balance is on the right track. I would love it if they also fixed the dps inequities too though.

This thread topic was really about wanting to be coddled for refusing to craft ascended gear…which is a completely invalid complaint on so many levels. There is no skill in obtaining any gear. There is simply effort. Anyone could pick up random masterwork gear. Anyone could brute force face roll dungeons to get exotic gear…or simply buy it off the TP…or even craft it themselves. The same with ascended gear. The issue is preparedness versus wanting a handout and for others to cater to laziness/stubbornness. Why would they put the development time and resources in…specifically for people that cannot be bothered to put in any of the same investment?

1. Wait a couple of weeks after each raid wing has debuted.
2. Review video on Youtube.
3. Form your own PuG group, with the heading, “Exotics OK” or, “Exotic/Ascended mix OK.”
4. Watch it fill up.
5. Do raid.

/thread

xadine.7069:

Raids are suppose to be the most chllenging content of the game, therefore it isn’t an issue at all that it require Ascend armor.

Also ascend armor aren’t hard to get, just time consuming because you can craft 1 item daily, and even if you play a small amount of time you should have it rdy by now.

Btw “require” isn’t acurate, it will be appreciate but good players will be able to do it in exotic.

It’s only recommended not required.

Like someone said earlier, give it a few weeks and Pug’s will go through it like any other content. (yeah, chew on that you self proclaimed PRO’s)

Geogun.6347:

That should be Optional.

It probably will be.

I think Ascended as recommended for Raids is fine because it’s at the top of the difficulty curve. The difficulty curve for instanced-based content in this game is roughly Dungeons -> Fractals -> Raids. There are Fractals that are much easier than Dungeon paths (based on levels) and even among Dungeons there are huge differences, but as a rule of thumb that’s how the difficulty goes.

I won’t expect someone who hasn’t done Dungeons or Fractals to do Raids. And if they actually took some time to do Fractals they’d have Ascended by now, or can get enough Ascended items before the Raid is released. How can anyone expect to do good at Raids and still not done Fractals? And I’m not talking about a hard requirement, like Agony, but a challenge/difficulty requirement. IF someone can’t play well as part of a team in Fractals, can’t communicate, can’t use good builds and rotations, how do they expect to have any possibility at running Raids and succeeding?

I see any “attempts” at asking for Ascended requirements to be removed (or lessened) as a “I want to skip Fractals” button. Which, as explained above about the difficulty curve, really shouldn’t happen. “Veterans” of Guild Wars 2 instanced content are those who will go in Raids, that’s why it is called “Challenging Group Content” after all, if it’s easier than Citadel of Flame Path 1 then it’s not challenging.

Eldbrand Charging.8902:

xadine.7069:

Raids are suppose to be the most chllenging content of the game, therefore it isn’t an issue at all that it require Ascend armor.

Also ascend armor aren’t hard to get, just time consuming because you can craft 1 item daily, and even if you play a small amount of time you should have it rdy by now.

Btw “require” isn’t acurate, it will be appreciate but good players will be able to do it in exotic.

It’s only recommended not required.

Doing TT with organized core of players is also only recommended, not required. You can try doing it with pure pug. You will 99.9% fail it, but you can.
Saying something is just recommended doesn’t mean anything. The content is still balanced for ascended, not exotics, and the enrage mechanic exists to punish anyone trying to run it undergeared.

Its not even a gear gate, unless agony is present in Raids ascended is NOT REQUIRED, if people truly think the guy with the 5% stat boost is gonna magically be better than another guy in mixed gear (ascended/exo) who knows how to efficiently play his class, then their fools.

I have 2 F2P in my guild that have ascended gear already.

less than 1000 achi points.

come on

I’m sick of the people complaining about having to actually play the game to play the game. Why would you buy a game and then not play it? I think most of these people are just trolls.

Full Ascended Armour (the most expensive part of Ascended Gear) gives +20 Primary Stat and +16 Secondary Stats, it is a LIE to say that the tiny stat difference will in any way block people from content.

There is NO BARRIER to Raids from Ascended, people who say there is are incorrect or lying.

Chobits.2430:

I’m sick of the people complaining about having to actually play the game to play the game. Why would you buy a game and then not play it? I think most of these people are just trolls.

I’ve played all of the content in GW2 (personal story done, LS1, LS2, dungeons, fractals, WvWvW, sPVP), and I don’t have full ascended yet, because I haven’t grinded out the hundreds of gold it takes to make even a single full set, especially since my favorite game mode, sPVP, doesn’t generate kitten for gold. This is doubly worse, because before HOT, my favorite class was considered worthless in PVE, so I didn’t focus on gearing a character I mostly use for solo / PVP content.

Also, if everyone takes this advice, it will only further inflate the costs for things, as TP prices will increase.

I think people who enjoy grinding in MMOs have no clue how most people feel about it. And make no mistake, ascended gear is a long grind that takes lots of time, but no real skill.

@Coulter
I like how you quickly jumped from the relatively low difference of stats on ascended armor to saying that ascended as a whole is similarly irrelevant.

Astralporing.1957:

Eldbrand Charging.8902:

xadine.7069:

Raids are suppose to be the most chllenging content of the game, therefore it isn’t an issue at all that it require Ascend armor.

Also ascend armor aren’t hard to get, just time consuming because you can craft 1 item daily, and even if you play a small amount of time you should have it rdy by now.

Btw “require” isn’t acurate, it will be appreciate but good players will be able to do it in exotic.

It’s only recommended not required.

Doing TT with organized core of players is also only recommended, not required. You can try doing it with pure pug. You will 99.9% fail it, but you can.
Saying something is just recommended doesn’t mean anything. The content is still balanced for ascended, not exotics, and the enrage mechanic exists to punish anyone trying to run it undergeared.

BS. We heard the same kind of crap from the so called “Pro” players in GW1 when Urgoz and the Deep came out, guess what Pug’s did just fine, the biggest joke was the first few runs by the so called “Pro’S”, like a 12 hour run, 2 weeks later pug’s did it in less than 4 hours. fast forward a couple of years and people did it SOLO + 1 hero.
But I guess that’s why all the so called “Pro” (self proclaimed) players are so afraid raids will be open to all.

Wicked Demiurge.3107:

Chobits.2430:

I’m sick of the people complaining about having to actually play the game to play the game. Why would you buy a game and then not play it? I think most of these people are just trolls.

I’ve played all of the content in GW2 (personal story done, LS1, LS2, dungeons, fractals, WvWvW, sPVP), and I don’t have full ascended yet, because I haven’t grinded out the hundreds of gold it takes to make even a single full set, especially since my favorite game mode, sPVP, doesn’t generate kitten for gold. This is doubly worse, because before HOT, my favorite class was considered worthless in PVE, so I didn’t focus on gearing a character I mostly use for solo / PVP content.

Also, if everyone takes this advice, it will only further inflate the costs for things, as TP prices will increase.

I think people who enjoy grinding in MMOs have no clue how most people feel about it. And make no mistake, ascended gear is a long grind that takes lots of time, but no real skill.

its not a grind. this is such a lie. Again, I have 2 F2P in MY GUILD that have LESS than 1000 achi points, that play for fun, and have half their gear ascended. such cry babies

Azure.8670:

Wicked Demiurge.3107:

Chobits.2430:

I’m sick of the people complaining about having to actually play the game to play the game. Why would you buy a game and then not play it? I think most of these people are just trolls.

I’ve played all of the content in GW2 (personal story done, LS1, LS2, dungeons, fractals, WvWvW, sPVP), and I don’t have full ascended yet, because I haven’t grinded out the hundreds of gold it takes to make even a single full set, especially since my favorite game mode, sPVP, doesn’t generate kitten for gold. This is doubly worse, because before HOT, my favorite class was considered worthless in PVE, so I didn’t focus on gearing a character I mostly use for solo / PVP content.

Also, if everyone takes this advice, it will only further inflate the costs for things, as TP prices will increase.

I think people who enjoy grinding in MMOs have no clue how most people feel about it. And make no mistake, ascended gear is a long grind that takes lots of time, but no real skill.

its not a grind. this is such a lie. Again, I have 2 F2P in MY GUILD that have LESS than 1000 achi points, that play for fun, and have half their gear ascended. such cry babies

Farming hundreds of gold (or equivalent in materials), which requires them to play content that is easy, but not what they would prefer to play, is the dictionary definition of grind.

Furthermore, achievements have nothing to do with it. Doing SW chest runs from dawn till dusk may be the fastest way to get more ascended gear, depending on what your bank looks like, but you won’t earn any achievements points that way.

This is a game, not a Herculean trial. Calling people “cry babies” for not wanting to play parts of GW2 they don’t enjoy as much before raiding is not only a toxic attitude, but a dumb attitude.

Astralporing.1957:

@Coulter
I like how you quickly jumped from the relatively low difference of stats on ascended armor to saying that ascended as a whole is similarly irrelevant.

Because every other Ascended item is easy to get, Armour is the only thing that takes time. Do a bit of thinking…

I agree that there should be multiple difficulty tiers, but the lower tier needs to also offer Legendary Precursor armor. That’s the entire point of the raid for most players who honestly couldn’t give a kitten about raiding otherwise.

What is the Ascended Gear Gate OP talks about and can I eat it?

It will be 3 years next month since ascended were introduced. If you don’t have 1 full set of gear after 3 years, then you haven’t been playing the game at all. I’m very casual and have 9 Full Sets of Gear.

Chobits.2430:

It will be 3 years next month since ascended were introduced. If you don’t have 1 full set of gear after 3 years, then you haven’t been playing the game at all. I’m very casual and have 9 Full Sets of Gear.

Pssht, don’t come with this kind of logic, you’ll offend the “I deserve everything handed to me NOW!” crowd.

Chobits.2430:

It will be 3 years next month since ascended were introduced. If you don’t have 1 full set of gear after 3 years, then you haven’t been playing the game at all. I’m very casual and have 9 Full Sets of Gear.

Super lazy hiatus vet over here, not complaining at all just laughing at people who realy think ascended is absolutely needed to do raids. Currently working on equipping my thief, necro, and future rev with a set

Doam.8305:

For the record my main is Mez who does have asc also ascended is 10% after they updated it. Also what skill is there in obtaining Ascended!? If anything they should just have a Guild Raid and pug raid with pug getting a buff.

They wrote that ascended was going up to 10% in a dev preview, but they decided not to raise it. It is the same as it was.

Ohoni.6057:

I agree that there should be multiple difficulty tiers, but the lower tier needs to also offer Legendary Precursor armor. That’s the entire point of the raid for most players who honestly couldn’t give a kitten about raiding otherwise.

Ohoni’s beliefs all on show guys, don’t let him influence raid design.

Astralporing.1957:

Eldbrand Charging.8902:

xadine.7069:

Raids are suppose to be the most chllenging content of the game, therefore it isn’t an issue at all that it require Ascend armor.

Also ascend armor aren’t hard to get, just time consuming because you can craft 1 item daily, and even if you play a small amount of time you should have it rdy by now.

Btw “require” isn’t acurate, it will be appreciate but good players will be able to do it in exotic.

It’s only recommended not required.

Doing TT with organized core of players is also only recommended, not required. You can try doing it with pure pug. You will 99.9% fail it, but you can.
Saying something is just recommended doesn’t mean anything. The content is still balanced for ascended, not exotics, and the enrage mechanic exists to punish anyone trying to run it undergeared.

I pug teq all the time, so far the only time it’s failed is when we literally had 5 people on the map, which was obviously not enough.

Its not a gate. Dont use misleading language.

There is no gear gate. Please stop saying there is, as it is probably just confusing people. There is a skill gate, like all content, and while Im not totally against an easy mode to help people learn it, i dont think the content will be nearly difficult enough to warrant one. Maybe in the first few weeks itl be hard, but by month 2 pug groups will be clearing all 3 wings in an hour in exotics> IF it really proves a lot harder than that, and pugs really cant beat it at all, then an easy mode with reduced rewards (like severely reduced) wouldnt be a bad idea.

But again, its not a gear gate. Please stop calling it that.

Sizer.3987:

There is no gear gate. Please stop saying there is, as it is probably just confusing people. There is a skill gate, like all content, and while Im not totally against an easy mode to help people learn it, i dont think the content will be nearly difficult enough to warrant one. Maybe in the first few weeks itl be hard, but by month 2 pug groups will be clearing all 3 wings in an hour in exotics> IF it really proves a lot harder than that, and pugs really cant beat it at all, then an easy mode with reduced rewards (like severely reduced) wouldnt be a bad idea.

But again, its not a gear gate. Please stop calling it that.

Thank you hate when fools on either side of the argument argue gear>=skill when its the opposite. The content is skill gated and can be done in exo’s or ascended, depending on whether this last wing breaks ANets promise of Agony not appearing outside fractals then mixed Exo/Ascended will and should always be enough to get through the majority of upper-level PvE content

Nate.3927:

Astralporing.1957:

Eldbrand Charging.8902:

xadine.7069:

Raids are suppose to be the most chllenging content of the game, therefore it isn’t an issue at all that it require Ascend armor.

Also ascend armor aren’t hard to get, just time consuming because you can craft 1 item daily, and even if you play a small amount of time you should have it rdy by now.

Btw “require” isn’t acurate, it will be appreciate but good players will be able to do it in exotic.

It’s only recommended not required.

Doing TT with organized core of players is also only recommended, not required. You can try doing it with pure pug. You will 99.9% fail it, but you can.
Saying something is just recommended doesn’t mean anything. The content is still balanced for ascended, not exotics, and the enrage mechanic exists to punish anyone trying to run it undergeared.

I pug teq all the time, so far the only time it’s failed is when we literally had 5 people on the map, which was obviously not enough.

TT = Triple Trouble, not Tequatl.

Nate.3927:

Astralporing.1957:

Eldbrand Charging.8902:

xadine.7069:

Raids are suppose to be the most chllenging content of the game, therefore it isn’t an issue at all that it require Ascend armor.

Also ascend armor aren’t hard to get, just time consuming because you can craft 1 item daily, and even if you play a small amount of time you should have it rdy by now.

Btw “require” isn’t acurate, it will be appreciate but good players will be able to do it in exotic.

It’s only recommended not required.

Doing TT with organized core of players is also only recommended, not required. You can try doing it with pure pug. You will 99.9% fail it, but you can.
Saying something is just recommended doesn’t mean anything. The content is still balanced for ascended, not exotics, and the enrage mechanic exists to punish anyone trying to run it undergeared.

I pug teq all the time, so far the only time it’s failed is when we literally had 5 people on the map, which was obviously not enough.

TT (Triple Trouble – the Three-headed wurm), not Teq. I’d really like to see you pug that one.