Guild Wars 2

I dont see a guardian using traps, I mean there like a Tanky/Head-on kind of class and I dont see it as a head-on class anymore. Since you gave it a bow now there is more distance to be made with a bow also traps? really a head on class using traps lol. I think maybe you could have gave it axes or a two handed axe I think its a better look and feel I can imagine a guardian with axes being a kitten killing dragon kitten. Plus in heart of thorns Monsters are trees chop them axes! But yea just a Guardian fan opinion.

While we don’t know how to combat the new builds yet those using them are not used to doing so at present. That levels the field a little.

To be very honest I have been facing these in WvW, they are more powerful than the old builds there. Unfortunately there looks like there will be no way that people can get these new toys without paying.

Guild Wars 2 goes Pay To Win. Gtatz anet.

It is so fun to read some peoples comments about Anet Overpowering with purpose to get people to buy the game so they get the OP classes :P

Ok, I admit that Reaper, Herald and Scrapper can be a bit OP but c’mon this is just we who come up with the builds to be OP as soon as they know how to nerf those builds they will do it, just look at Ele who was OP almost from Expac announcement yea that wasn’t a class behind a paywall was it? NO! It was just OP and now they release spec’s that hasn’t been played by us players enough to iether see if they are OP or if it is just we who havent learned how to counter them yet.

Take of your stupid tinfoil hats and do what you want. I am pretty sure Anet would loose more money if Elite Spec’s where OP with purpose becouse I beleave more would quit rather than buy the expac sooner or later and reputation would go on Youtube, Twich and other streamers and more people won’t even go F2P.

This is nothing different than to other MMO’s I have played and heard about.
Here is two of them:
WoW – I remember some friends of mine complained about a new class in there (Death Knight or something) where totaly OP at release.
LoTRO – Runekeepers and Wardens was way OP at release of the Expac and almost ruined PvP for a whole year.

Spicyhash.7605:

Ark Bladesteele.2943:

If everybody is overpowered then nobody is overpowered. What a silly argument.

If not everyone is playing the elite specs then not everyone is overpowered. Where’s your rebuttal now?

I don’t wear armor, everyone else is OP, nerf armor ANet pls

I do think the elite specs are a little strong in their effects and unique abilities. However I have had no issues dealing with any of them using only core specs, out side of some sustain builds. But low risk being rewarded is status quo for GW2 and is no different or worse than any other meta.

EdgarMTanaka.7291:

This is nothing different than to other MMO’s I have played and heard about.
Here is two of them:
WoW – I remember some friends of mine complained about a new class in there (Death Knight or something) where totaly OP at release.
LoTRO – Runekeepers and Wardens was way OP at release of the Expac and almost ruined PvP for a whole year.

You can add ESO to that list, characters could meet a vampire and be bitten, making them vampires too. The vampire equivalent of the necro life steal skills could drain a zerg dry – you couldn’t do enough damage to kill it. That meant the only option being try to escape, if you were still alive.

Not the point though, this isn’t WoW, or LotRO. This is Guild Wars 2 and the Devs should be thinking more before they change anything. So far they have tried several ‘improvements’ which turned out to be complete failures.

Things are imposed on us rather than them asking or even having development areas in game for it. Because of that any failures are entirely the fault of the development team.

there is reason why classes can choose only 1 elite spec bc they are more powerful lines than others… atm there is only 1 out there but in future you have choice between meny elite specs and you can only have 1 ( they are ment to be more powerful than other trait lines)

Morfedel.4165:

Which legendary foes are you just standing in their main attacks shrugged it off? Because I’ve been playing four different elite specs, and as an example the wyvern or the axe master, were downing people right and left with no effort, good lord the axe master literally did 1.8 million points of damage to me with its head shot ability. And the wyvern downed me several times along with everyone else in the fights I was in. So what legendary is it that you’re scoffing at?

As a Reaper? Wyvern, Arah’s Giganticus Lupicus, and Legendary Spellmaster Macsen (at Ascendant’s Ring – the other canopy boss). And I wasn’t even optimized the first time I fought the Wyvern, where I was totally underwhelmed because I was never forced out of death shroud let alone downed.

Gwyllion’s mass one-hit kill is probably the only attack the reaper can’t just shrug off.

But if they’re all overpowered, isn’t that balance? Isn’t growing into awesomeness what games are all about? I played most of the characters in beta and in my opinion they’re awesome. Elite specs should be stronger. And yes I have had a serious whipping in spvp and wvw from beta characters while playing my normal characters and I find myself thinking – “Just wait till I get my elite spec going on this character…”

I have been doing PvP all weekend and have not had any issues with the new elite specs, unless I face someone who is actually better. Ran into a permaswiftness Revenant, healnova druid, pound face Power/Precision Reaper, I think a DH at some point, not many of those.

I honestly have not had an issue. The biggest issue is that these classes are new and for the most part play very differently from what would be expected of the class you are facing. It is less a l2p issue and more a learn the new class mechanics issue.

I did the weekend with Engineer, Guardian, Thief, and Ranger.

Aurisai.3416:

But if they’re all overpowered, isn’t that balance?

Only if those who don’t use elite specs aren’t overpowered.

Either non-HoT needs an elite spec which is as balanced as HoT’s elite specs, or elite spec needs to be as balanced as non-elite specs.

Simple as that.

Otherwise you run into the same issue as pay to win. Which is explicitly something ArenaNet said they don’t want.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

elite spec needs to be as balanced as non-elite specs.

Good thing they are. This is learning new mechanics, not dealing with overpowered stuff. You need to get it out of your head that “Reaper”=“Necro” and “Druid”=“Ranger.” How you approach these things needs to be totally different, even if a lot of their capabilities are the same.

Different approach required =/= overpowered.

I’m sorry, but how is managing to stay alive while standing in the Legendary Wyvern’s fire as a Reaper for about ten times longer than any other profession/elite spec anything but overpowered?

You said that elite specs are balanced to non-elite specs. I can’t speak for all nine, but for some this isn’t true at all.

There’s more to it than just different approaches.

First off it’s typical for new stuff to be OP in every game, over the next month or two it will be toned down, is this your first MMO ?

Second you’re over exaggerating, players don’t know how to combat the specs yet. Given time players with either realize the method to combat each spec or they will realize the spec truly is OP and needs to be toned down.

You post shows exactly how little you know about these specs.
Reaper seems to be the only one you actually pointed out the ability/trait that you felt was the problem and even then it seems you were to lazy to look up the name of the trait.

So ya let’s listen to the guy that can’t even bother to do some research about the classes he complains about. I seriously hope Anet ignores this thread based on the laziness of it.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Aurisai.3416:

But if they’re all overpowered, isn’t that balance?

Only if those who don’t use elite specs aren’t overpowered.

Either non-HoT needs an elite spec which is as balanced as HoT’s elite specs, or elite spec needs to be as balanced as non-elite specs.

Simple as that.

Otherwise you run into the same issue as pay to win. Which is explicitly something ArenaNet said they don’t want.

Sorry, but in my opinion buying an expansion does not qualify as “pay to win”. It is a given that if you want to play the game to its full that you will actually buy the game (now free) and its expansions. GW1 was exactly the same. If you didn’t buy the expansions you didn’t get access to the new skills/heroes and most likely weren’t as competitive simply because you couldn’t put together as strong a build as those that could pick from a larger pool of abilities.

Spicyhash.7605:

Since when does ANet balance things by making them more powerful? I thought their philosophy was the complete opposite of power creep?

Mesmer is incredibly cheese right now, exacerbated by chronomancer
Scrapper is OP with perma stab/stuns/might
Revenant has way too much mobility, too much sustain, and entirely too much DPS.
Reaper death’s charge is overpowered and I play a necro. The exploding chill trait combined with chill of death does way too much damage. It’s a joke.

Stop buffing stuff and start nerfing stuff. This has nothing to do with ‘L2P’ and i know bad players abusing the current mechanics will say so, so just thought I’d get that out there.

This is pretty typical in games of this genre, they make new specs OP to sell expansions, then nerf them down the line.

On personal level, I have done a whole bunch of PVP and WVW this weekend using my regular characters. In large group combat the difference was irrelevant except we did like druid for backline support, really ideal. In small groups and 1 vs 1 I have had pretty close to 50/50, was actually around 55/45 overall. They were tougher fights and had just a slight edge it seemed, but there were also plenty that I was able to defeat with relative ease.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

I’m sorry, but how is managing to stay alive while standing in the Legendary Wyvern’s fire as a Reaper for about ten times longer than any other profession/elite spec anything but overpowered?

You said that elite specs are balanced to non-elite specs. I can’t speak for all nine, but for some this isn’t true at all.

There’s more to it than just different approaches.

First off, I don’t think you were actually in the wyvern’s fire. A bunch of Rangers are using the new fire wyvern pet, especially at that fight, so you were probably standing in friendly fire.

How do I know this? Because unless you’re getting a ton of focused healing being spammed on you, you will still drop in about 8 seconds or less of standing in that fire as a Reaper. And that’s assuming you had full life force and health.

You can melee the wyvern as a Reaper with ease, yes, but only from the sides or back.

Misguided.5139:

Amber.2637:

Misguided.5139:

Amber.2637:

They do seem to have a lot going for them. My main is a guardian who I play as a tanky support, but after playing the druid and revenant, they seem very strong in comparison so far. The druid has a few issues of its own, like the celestial avatar meter building up too quickly when healing, but the burst is high. I might be wrong about this, but the revenant so far seems to take the guardian’s role and does a better job at it.

Actually, they go together like peanut butter and jelly. Guardian excels at a number of things Revenant isn’t so great at (stability (outside retribution trait line), condition clear, reflection) plus offer aegis, etc.

That is true. :P I was mostly worried about the Revenant’s condition clearing and powerful boon uptime in comparison to the Guardian. The Revenant’s Purifying Essence skill seems to be very good for removing conditions. I guess the small radius and the need to position it correctly are a bit of the downside though.

I think the number of people using Ventari will be modest. Most popular build is liable to be Shiro/Glint, which has zero condition clear, aside from possible single condition removal on legend swap. And if they are using Ventari, they are giving up a lot of offense to do so. In that regard, it is fair that they’d be rather good at healing/support. Boon duration increase from Herald is great, and makes all that stability and protection a Guardian is putting out last longer.

I’m jumping from Guardian to Revenant, but for my money, there is ALWAYS going to be room for both in a group. Revenant is good at lots of things, but they aren’t really masters of most of them. For instance, a Herald can put out a nice chunk of might, but if you have a phalanx warrior, then can put their energy into fury instead. They can adapt to group composition, which is One of the things I like about them.

Why do people keep saying revenant has no condi defense?

Shiro: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Riposting_Shadows

Mallyx: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Empowering_Misery (and this isnt even counting things like their sources of resistance)

Jalis: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Soothing_Stone

Ventari: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Purifying_Essence

Herald has more than one way to invert damage, there are a couple traits as well between more than one trait line. Granted, they don’t have anything that clears ALL condis, but thats far from saying they have NO defense against conditions at all. Every single legendary has some form of condi defense however

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Morfedel.4165:

Which legendary foes are you just standing in their main attacks shrugged it off? Because I’ve been playing four different elite specs, and as an example the wyvern or the axe master, were downing people right and left with no effort, good lord the axe master literally did 1.8 million points of damage to me with its head shot ability. And the wyvern downed me several times along with everyone else in the fights I was in. So what legendary is it that you’re scoffing at?

As a Reaper? Wyvern, Arah’s Giganticus Lupicus, and Legendary Spellmaster Macsen (at Ascendant’s Ring – the other canopy boss). And I wasn’t even optimized the first time I fought the Wyvern, where I was totally underwhelmed because I was never forced out of death shroud let alone downed.

Gwyllion’s mass one-hit kill is probably the only attack the reaper can’t just shrug off.

I’m not entirely sure I buy that. I played the reaper too (played four different ones, Reaper being one of). Did you stand in the fire next to the wyverrn and melee him the entire time?

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

I’m sorry, but how is managing to stay alive while standing in the Legendary Wyvern’s fire as a Reaper for about ten times longer than any other profession/elite spec anything but overpowered?

You said that elite specs are balanced to non-elite specs. I can’t speak for all nine, but for some this isn’t true at all.

There’s more to it than just different approaches.

First off, I don’t think you were actually in the wyvern’s fire. A bunch of Rangers are using the new fire wyvern pet, especially at that fight, so you were probably standing in friendly fire.

How do I know this? Because unless you’re getting a ton of focused healing being spammed on you, you will still drop in about 8 seconds or less of standing in that fire as a Reaper. And that’s assuming you had full life force and health.

You can melee the wyvern as a Reaper with ease, yes, but only from the sides or back.

You realize that’s 5 different legends right? Shiro has a soft CC removal, that isn’t “condition protection”. Jalis can remove 3 every 30 seconds on their heal. Every 30 seconds Herald can soak some healing from them, but that’s it.

Ventari is clunky and the cost of removal is really high, and Mallyx is probably your only legend good against conditions, though still weak against boon rip/corruption.

It’s a case where you might have to play Revenant to realize you can try to dig and justify it, but unless you play it, you just won’t really get it.

That said, Herald/Mallyx can handle conditions at least decently well. But that’s pretty much the only combination that feels real safe with conditions.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

First off, I don’t think you were actually in the wyvern’s fire. A bunch of Rangers are using the new fire wyvern pet, especially at that fight, so you were probably standing in friendly fire.

How do I know this? Because unless you’re getting a ton of focused healing being spammed on you, you will still drop in about 8 seconds or less of standing in that fire as a Reaper. And that’s assuming you had full life force and health.

You can melee the wyvern as a Reaper with ease, yes, but only from the sides or back.

I was definitely taking damage, and on a character with ~30k health and ~25k death shroud. Was definitely longer than 8 seconds.

Morfedel.4165:

I’m not entirely sure I buy that. I played the reaper too (played four different ones, Reaper being one of). Did you stand in the fire next to the wyverrn and melee him the entire time?

I wasn’t in the fire the entire time, no, but when he was down I was melee’ing him (first fight I had, second fight I alternated between ranged and melee for a different experience). But when I was in the fire, by the time I only lost half of my death shroud everyone left and right of me would be downed/defeated (which I took as a queue to strafe around the wyvern).

The whole time I played the scrapper with gyros and hammer, I felt underpowered. When I stopped using the gyros and keep only the hammer, the spec became much more efficient, but still extremely clunky. The traits are great, but I don’t see the OP in there when my normal engie, without spec, is still better than the scrapper.

LockeLiefather.1085:

Chill out guys and wait with bashing company that gives you entertainment for 2 years straight without subscription fee for expansion release. When HoT comes live we’ll see how f2p accounts will be feeling, and how in fact everything will work.

I’m a ranger… I’m waiting for the justification of “entertainment” I mean, sadism for 2 years of being a ranger

Revue ants I have killed so quickly

Dragon hunters are far too capable in WvW because of their ranged traps though.

Daredevil is weak. Tempest is weak. Druids ok. Berserker is fine.

Reaper is….strong but slow.

Chrono I haven’t fought yet thank god.

Random.4691:

First off it’s typical for new stuff to be OP in every game, over the next month or two it will be toned down, is this your first MMO ?

Second you’re over exaggerating, players don’t know how to combat the specs yet. Given time players with either realize the method to combat each spec or they will realize the spec truly is OP and needs to be toned down.

You post shows exactly how little you know about these specs.
Reaper seems to be the only one you actually pointed out the ability/trait that you felt was the problem and even then it seems you were to lazy to look up the name of the trait.

So ya let’s listen to the guy that can’t even bother to do some research about the classes he complains about. I seriously hope Anet ignores this thread based on the laziness of it.

First off it’s typical for ANet to take 6 months between each balance patch and then completely do the opposite of a good balance patch, is this your first few months with ANet?

Seriously it took them over a year and three months to make Skyhammer possible to dodge, increase the time on the panels disappearing and stop them from disappearing while stealthed, for that entire time it was destroying Solo Queue and they didn’t give a kitten even though it would take less than 5 minutes to remove it from the map rotation. I believe ANet will have learned in these 3 years and fix the obvious red flags in 3 weeks even though they always have managed to do the opposite for the 2 years I played since launch.

Kailee.8790:

LockeLiefather.1085:

Chill out guys and wait with bashing company that gives you entertainment for 2 years straight without subscription fee for expansion release. When HoT comes live we’ll see how f2p accounts will be feeling, and how in fact everything will work.

I’m a ranger… I’m waiting for the justification of “entertainment” I mean, sadism for 2 years of being a ranger

By “saism” you mean “My class is unplayable because ele zerk team is clearing dung in 6 minutes, and rangers in 4”? Ranger is really specific class, because of synergy with your pet, you can’t just flat give rangers one button obliterate skill because any class that has that skills (Houndred blades, meteor shower etc.) doesn’t have a pet, which if not bugged CAN deal damage, and can rez you when you’re downed.

Real problem with rangers was/is not class itself but content it is faced against. If you make a game with any form on invulnerability, player’s will exploit it to it’s boundaries. You can make anything from tanks to healers, give man a dodge and he will learn to mitigate all damage and go full DPS on the enemy. Dark Souls is fine example.

In such world, ranger’s are imparied because pet can’t mitigate damage and deal great DPS. Stupid AI makes him stant in enemy’s AoE and cluster of mobs till it’s dead. Now everything is fairly balanced, but it wasn’t that bad as ppl say. It just wasn’t meta.

from what i’ve experienced as a pvp player, the elite specs that people complain about just have a kitten ton of CC. this isn’t a problem in a 1v1 but in a group fight it just destroys classes without an invuln