Guild Wars 2

Why are the skins even mixed in with the spec?

We were told time and again that masteries were to be the ongoing progression introduced with HoT, not the new specs. I was looking forward to playing the new content with the new spec not scrambling to find 20 – 40 hero challenges across four maps and hoping there’s content left once I actually have the spec unlocked.

SamTheGuardian.2938:

Vayne.8563:

You’re ruining your own HoT experience. Anet isn’t responsible for that. Some of those points are undoubtedly for the skin anyway, not the spec.

No one wants the Elite spec to be their prize for completing HoT, we all want to play HoT with the Elite Specs. So for those who have not done world competition learning that we have to play though about 70% of HoT before being able to max trait lines and play the spec is infuriating.

As you will learn over the coming days, what the OP is planning to do Everyone else will be doing also!!! People want the Elite Specs. Yes we want the new maps and story narrative too, but for most the Elite Specs are the biggest part of what lured us in. Even for those who want the story a good number want to experience HoT from the beginning playing as something new. Most will hop on the train with players who jump in and do nothing but grind hero challenges for the first few weeks (or months for the more casuals) before unlocking their Elite Spec then go back and do the instanced story.

A lot of people don’t come to the forums so expect an exciting time on launch day, but by early to mid next week expect everyone to be hero point grinding leaving dynamic events that don’t award hero points abandoned and large chucks of these rather difficult level 80 jungle maps abandoned. Those who go into the game grinding hero points are just playing it as ArenaNet intended. They knew people would do this. They knew it would divide the PvE community and turn the game into a grind fest. They also know that’s what gets the most players pulling out the credit cards for the gem store.

I hope their strategy backfires. I believe it will and many who bought and have played GW2 because of it’s casual friendly, anti-grind design will either quit PvE or quit the game altogether. The flood of F2P customers that came on board in recent months will convert to HoT purchasers (if they haven’t already) they will inherit it. The non HoT purchasing F2P customers will continue to use the gem store. So boat loads of revenue will be flowing in from gem store purchases for F2P accounts and HoT grinders looking for boost items. This is what the changes are all about. Future content will be just as grindy as the PvE side of GW2 makes it’s full transition to becoming another trashy F2P MMO. Hope I’m wrong, but the patterns are pretty clear.

This is the reason I haven’t bought HOT yet. They are turning this game from something that I’ve been praising for years as the best MMO into an another generic, grind and gear infested cash game.

Tapioca.9062:

Why are the skins even mixed in with the spec?

We were told time and again that masteries were to be the ongoing progression introduced with HoT, not the new specs. I was looking forward to playing the new content with the new spec not scrambling to find 20 – 40 hero challenges across four maps and hoping there’s content left once I actually have the spec unlocked.

I don’t think they’re mixed in, I assume they’re at the end (I could be wrong). The point is that means you need 400 to unlock everything including the unique skins for that specialization. Which means you could theoretically play the profession long before you actually get 400 points.

Smokin Dice.9103:

I need FOUR HUNDRED points total to unlock my herold?

That is false.

You only need 60 HP to unlock the Herald. Additional HP will be required to gain access to the rest of the skills. Without actually having any facts yet on which items/traits/skins/etc are available at which HP level, it could very well be that the higher HP cost items in each specialization are actually cosmetic, etc.

Edit: And another thing, why in the heck do people keep posting that Anet doesn’t know how people play their game? I can’t say I agree with everything that a company always does, but an MMO, or any technology-based company, has access to HUGE HUGE HUGE amounts of customer data through all kinds of analytical and heuristic software. THEY ABSOLUTELY KNOW WHAT THEIR CUSTOMERS WANT/DO/ETC. The decisions they make based on that data may make a tiny fraction of people (which just so happens to be the extremely vocal minority) unhappy, but rest assured the majority will probably be pretty thrilled with the changes in most cases.

Geeze, the whining. It sucks that I have got sort through so much drivel to actually get meaningful posts…

Some people would like to enjoy the jungle as the new spec, rather than being rewarded for doing X% of the jungle.

Is it really too much to ask for

Calcifire.1864:

herald is goingto be in a particularly nasty spot for two reasons however:

we don’t have a chance to get the bonus points everyone else does

our big mechanical change is Legendary Dragon Stance. guess what happens if you equip it? you lose all your utilities, since utilities on Rev are tied to stance, we need to buy a heal, three utilities and the elite just to have access to a utility bar AT ALL.

for 60 points all other classes gain a weapon and mechanic, and in return lose a traitline. Heralds gain a weapon and lose a traitline, and if they try to use their mechanic they lose their utilities until they get more points.

it’s like if reapers had to spend hero points to unlock each individual reaper shroud skill.

Sure we get that chance. just do personal story or some map completion? it’s still there, Revenants can access that content same as everyone else. Does mean no maguuma on day one, but that is exactly why I haven’t saved up a ton of tomes for mine. figured I have to get him to 80, might as well do some maps and the personal story that way I have some HP to spare.

Remember when that other game we don’t mention started allowing players to instantly have lvl 90 characters? and everyone hated those players because they had no idea how to play that class, yet were instantly max level? I feel like tome-ing a rev to 80 will only cause these issues. I am choosing to level him the old fashioned way.

Your second point is fair though. I don’t know that it is overwhelmingly disparaging, but it is going to be tough. Herald might not be something I use until I get all the skills unlocked, where as the others can be used piecemeal since you can feed of the old utilities. I’ll give you this one.

EDIT: Wait… you could just not equip Glint as your legend, but take the herald line for the shield as a start… I think I’m calling this one a bit of a stalemate. you could still be a herald with Shir/mal for instance.

Shademehr.1397:

Smokin Dice.9103:

I need FOUR HUNDRED points total to unlock my herold?

That is false.

You only need 60 HP to unlock the Herald. Additional HP will be required to gain access to the rest of the skills. Without actually having any facts yet on which items/traits/skins/etc are available at which HP level, it could very well be that the higher HP cost items in each specialization are actually cosmetic, etc.

I already changed that.. sorry.
but you still need over 200 points to unlock all skills and traits as confirmed by Colin himself

The Problem is within Anet itself.
They only think about the end result, but not how people will get there or what will be prioritized…

WOW! Much like buying a cheeseburger but instead of enjoying it, one looks forward to bowel movement way before digestion happens, then rages because nothing is coming out.

Calcifire.1864:

herald is goingto be in a particularly nasty spot for two reasons however:

we don’t have a chance to get the bonus points everyone else does

our big mechanical change is Legendary Dragon Stance. guess what happens if you equip it? you lose all your utilities, since utilities on Rev are tied to stance, we need to buy a heal, three utilities and the elite just to have access to a utility bar AT ALL.

for 60 points all other classes gain a weapon and mechanic, and in return lose a traitline. Heralds gain a weapon and lose a traitline, and if they try to use their mechanic they lose their utilities until they get more points.

it’s like if reapers had to spend hero points to unlock each individual reaper shroud skill.

No the class mechanics is Facet of Nature, Dragon stance is the utility set. Upon unlock you loose one trait line like everybody but can use a new button like every other class. Herald is not forced to slot dragon stance in the legend slot

Smokin Dice.9103:

The Problem is within Anet itself.
They only think about the end result, but not how people will get there or what will be prioritized…

Pretty sure they thought about how people were going to get there and the prevailing consensus was not 10 minutes into day one.

Smokin Dice.9103:

Shademehr.1397:

Smokin Dice.9103:

I need FOUR HUNDRED points total to unlock my herold?

That is false.

You only need 60 HP to unlock the Herald. Additional HP will be required to gain access to the rest of the skills. Without actually having any facts yet on which items/traits/skins/etc are available at which HP level, it could very well be that the higher HP cost items in each specialization are actually cosmetic, etc.

I already changed that.. sorry.
but you still need over 200 points to unlock all skills and traits as confirmed by Colin himself

That may not be true either. We don’t know that. All we know is that IF you have completed all the hero challenges, in the normal base game it will cost 200ish points to unlock the complete “elite spec training line”. This line will include things besides traits. It will include unique skins (for example, a staff and helmet for Dare Devil) and possibly things like sigils and runes (or recipes) too. It’s entirely possible that we may be able to fully unlock the actual skills with only 100ish HP. That’s 10 hero challenges in the new maps.

I’m not saying you’re wrong here, you may be right. (heck i may even be wrong, lots of info and inaccuracies swirling around) But lets not get all caught up in the anti-hype and reserve judgement for when we actually have a chance to see for ourselves in the actual game.

tichai.4351:

Jeez, gamers are so weird

Lol I’d say this about sums it up, but really, it doesn’t even come close. Weird is a strong understatement.

I remember the last time I went to a movie, I DEMANDED that they show me the ending right away because that’s what I really wanted. Instead they FORCED me to GRIND the rest of the movie before showing me the ending that I PAID for. I cant believe people would do this! They are ruining their movie! Turning it into nothing but a GRINDY CASH GRAB!!!!!!

Fadhli.9086:

WOW! Much like buying a cheeseburger but instead of enjoying it, one looks forward to bowel movement way before digestion happens, then rages because nothing is coming out.

its more like French-fried potatoes with ketchup and mayonaise..
I want to FIRST pick up a fry and then slowly dip it in either ketchup or mayonaise.. and dont want my fries to be burried beneath, and soaked up with ketchup and mayonaise mixed.
I want to play as I want, I dont want to eat all ketchup and mayonaise before I can even see a fry..

displacedTitan.6897:

I remember the last time I went to a movie, I DEMANDED that they show me the ending right away because that’s what I really wanted. Instead they FORCED me to GRIND the rest of the movie before showing me the ending that I PAID for. I cant believe people would do this! They are ruining their movie! Turning it into nothing but a GRINDY CASH GRAB!!!!!!

I was just thinking of that time I had to do 20 – 40 jumping jacks before I was allowed to have my 3D glasses. And then I had to see the movie nine different times. What an absolute delight of an experience that wasn’t a chore at all.

CobaltSixty.1542:

Smokin Dice.9103:

The Problem is within Anet itself.
They only think about the end result, but not how people will get there or what will be prioritized…

Pretty sure they thought about how people were going to get there and the prevailing consensus was not 10 minutes into day one.

you dont see the problem though.. because YOU CAN DO IT IN 10 MIN!.. but you have to rush through all the contant.. so more then 50% of all people will do that.. and that is BAD.
either lock it behind something reasonable or dont lock it at all….

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

tichai.4351:

Jeez, gamers are so weird

Lol I’d say this about sums it up, but really, it doesn’t even come close. Weird is a strong understatement.

Irrational is the word I think we are all looking for.

But then again, this only serves as proof as to why we can’t have World Peace or proper focus on space travel, or new technologies…

Baldrick.8967:

How long does it take to run a character from starter zone (or lion’s arch) to the entrance for the new places? As most of my level 80 wvw toons have like 3% map completion.

An Asura gate from LA would have been nice…

Any new char has one waypoint unlocked in each starter map. From where you are, waypoint to the Metrica Province waypoint. Head north to Brisbane. Head to the southwest edge of the map towards the fort on the border. That will get you to Silverwastes. In the beta the portal was at the southwest border of that map.

I doubt you’ll be able to rush through content for hero points because you need masteries to get everywhere in the jungle.

Shademehr.1397:

Smokin Dice.9103:

Shademehr.1397:

Smokin Dice.9103:

I need FOUR HUNDRED points total to unlock my herold?

That is false.

You only need 60 HP to unlock the Herald. Additional HP will be required to gain access to the rest of the skills. Without actually having any facts yet on which items/traits/skins/etc are available at which HP level, it could very well be that the higher HP cost items in each specialization are actually cosmetic, etc.

I already changed that.. sorry.
but you still need over 200 points to unlock all skills and traits as confirmed by Colin himself

That may not be true either. We don’t know that. All we know is that IF you have completed all the hero challenges, in the normal base game it will cost 200ish points to unlock the complete “elite spec training line”. This line will include things besides traits. It will include unique skins (for example, a staff and helmet for Dare Devil) and possibly things like sigils and runes (or recipes) too. It’s entirely possible that we may be able to fully unlock the actual skills with only 100ish HP. That’s 10 hero challenges in the new maps.

I’m not saying you’re wrong here, you may be right. (heck i may even be wrong, lots of info and inaccuracies swirling around) But lets not get all caught up in the anti-hype and reserve judgement for when we actually have a chance to see for ourselves in the actual game.

I think you might have missed colins post yesterday..
to unlock EVERYTHING from an elite (runes, skins etc.) it will take 400 points..
the only information we got from colin about “skills and tratis” is that it will take MORE then 200 points to unlock them..
so to play a core elite spec and not going for the fancy stuff you’ll need at least 201 hp

Smokin Dice.9103:

because YOU CAN DO IT IN 10 MIN!.. but you have to rush through all the contant.. so more then 50% of all people will do that.. and that is BAD.

What?!!! assumptions again ? Ok I should stop caring then

BrotherBelial.3094:

CobaltSixty.1542:

Gotta have everything immediately, am I right guys?

^This.

why is it people feel these day’s that playing a game involves nothing other than playing what they want to play. They don’t want to level, they don’t want to progress, they want everything from the word go. They want everything handed to them, then some of them will say the game is too easy, or boring and that there is nothing to do.

The truth has been spoken

Sarif.1827:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

tichai.4351:

Jeez, gamers are so weird

Lol I’d say this about sums it up, but really, it doesn’t even come close. Weird is a strong understatement.

Irrational is the word I think we are all looking for.

But then again, this only serves as proof as to why we can’t have World Peace or proper focus on space travel, or new technologies…

I was thinking more along the lines of kittening insane, but sure… we can go with irrational.

20 Maguuma hero points.

Ranael.6423:

Smokin Dice.9103:

because YOU CAN DO IT IN 10 MIN!.. but you have to rush through all the contant.. so more then 50% of all people will do that.. and that is BAD.

What?!!! assumptions again ? Ok I should stop caring then

how is that an assumptoin? you get HoT, you go into the jungle, you only do HP, you ignore any other contant in there, you get the elite, done. (repeat 8 times)

thats stupid design in my opinion…

Anyhow, getting back to the point. I fully support the OP’s right to cry about something that the OP considers to be unreasonable, even though it is not unreasonable.

Maybe the devs will see the OP’s endlessly bitter complaining and take the opportunity to spend the remaining 17 hours before launch reworking the whole game to meet the OP’s short-sighted requirements.

I didn’t get my Ranger elite until I played it for many hours (when the game first came out). Why should it be any different for a different class?

Am I totally missing something?

DoctorDing.5890:

Anyhow, getting back to the point. I fully support the OP’s right to cry about something that the OP considers to be unreasonable, even though it is not unreasonable.

Maybe the devs will see the OP’s endlessly bitter complaining and take the opportunity to spend the remaining 17 hours before launch reworking the whole game to meet the OP’s short-sighted requirements.

it is short sighted yes.. in the long run the system is great.. but in the early week of launch, what 50% of all people will do is ignore all content and farm HP in maguuma instead of ejoying it, because it is possible to do so.. and you want to tell me that this is reasonable design?
I can only say it again, if it was locked behind a story gate I would be fine with it, so I could play and enjoy, but the sole fact that you can rush the content to get it early is why people will do exactly that..
If it is possible people will do it…

Neva Eilhart.5347:

I’m really disappointed with this decision.

I do get why you’re locking specializations behind hero points. You probably want players to have this sense of progession as they slowly unlock their specialization.
And that’s fine.

But to me, you went the lazy way about it by tying it to Hero Points. You could have tied it to the personal story-line, so players could unlock their new powers as the story unfolds and Destiny’s Edge 1.0/2.0 unlocks it too. That would have been a nice addition to content.

Or you could have sticked to what happened in the beta, giving access to specializations as soon as we step into the jungle, which would have been fine because we will eventually get the spec through HP grinding.

But since you made this decision, now every player willing to use their elite is going to rush through the amazing maps and events just to get enough HP in order to actually start playing the expansion.

And don’t get me wrong on this, I’m not saying the specialization is the only viable spec to grind through the jungle. I’m saying that it is basically the most game-changing feature of the expansion, and people were expecting to play those specs through the new content, not to grind again some HP to start enjoying them.

This^

Couldn’t have said this better. This was yet another shady decision by ANET. The forums were filled with posts asking about this at least a week or so before this announcement. There was deafening silence from ANET in response because they knew they were going to do this. Waiting on maximum sales before dropping this bomb was in poor taste. They were fully aware of how big of a selling point the e-specs are and that they set zero expectations of not being able to play them upon release. This is almost as dirty as the character slot debacle. They could have spoken up to give players the correct expectation and opportunity to grind out some hero points significantly in advance. This hits players with multiple alts and limited play hours particularly hard. I have several characters that I actually despise the base class mechanics on and only leveled in anticipation of playing the e-specs on. As you can imagine, they have minimal hero points and this pretty much negates the entire point of leveling them to begin with. I can appreciate the compromise ANET has made with this in regards to higher hero point yield from the new zones, but that still means that we have to complete the new zones nearly in their entirety, to fully enjoy the e-specs. Who, in their right minds, would do hero points in central tyria for 1 point each…when they can get 10 points each for the HoT ones come Friday? I guess this is going to depend on how gated these hero points in HoT are by mastery as well (mushrooms, gliding, etc). We are not even guaranteed to be able to access these new HoT hero points unless we complete a certain level of mastery grinding first. 400 hero points + and undisclosed level of mastery grinding + setting/allowing false expectations + extremely/intentionally late reveal of these issues …seems pretty low ANET.

Tapioca.9062:

displacedTitan.6897:

I remember the last time I went to a movie, I DEMANDED that they show me the ending right away because that’s what I really wanted. Instead they FORCED me to GRIND the rest of the movie before showing me the ending that I PAID for. I cant believe people would do this! They are ruining their movie! Turning it into nothing but a GRINDY CASH GRAB!!!!!!

I was just thinking of that time I had to do 20 – 40 jumping jacks before I was allowed to have my 3D glasses. And then I had to see the movie nine different times. What an absolute delight of an experience that wasn’t a chore at all.

hahahahahaha made my day, thank you. :’D
so rediculous..

Smokin Dice.9103:

DoctorDing.5890:

Anyhow, getting back to the point. I fully support the OP’s right to cry about something that the OP considers to be unreasonable, even though it is not unreasonable.

Maybe the devs will see the OP’s endlessly bitter complaining and take the opportunity to spend the remaining 17 hours before launch reworking the whole game to meet the OP’s short-sighted requirements.

it is short sighted yes.. in the long run the system is great.. but in the early week of launch, what 50% of all people will do is ignore all content and farm HP in maguuma instead of ejoying it, because it is possible to do so.. and you want to tell me that this is reasonable design?
I can only say it again, if it was locked behind a story gate I would be fine with it, so I could play and enjoy, but the sole fact that you can rush the content to get it early is why people will do exactly that..
If it is possible people will do it…

Imagine how many of those attacking you now, will be crying in the next few weeks, when their brain gets down from all this anticipation high, and suddenly realize what exactly you were talking about.

No company should be letting its customers get clarification on something so important to their new product only 48 hours before the product ships. If they only knew about it 48 hours before launch that just shows unproffessional tardiness – if they did know and kept it back only to ignore the response that shows wilful manipulations of perceptions for extra sales.

Hell im just a very casual casual it doesn’t even really affect me as I will pootle around regardless but its a terrible strategy and they keep doing it over and over again – Traits and pre purchase character slot im looking at you…

Elites were never considered to be ‘progression’ systems – that was Masteries – Elites were supposed to be an ALTERNATIVE game play spec – you don’t block access to them behind completing the entire vanilla spec.

Smokin Dice.9103:

Tapioca.9062:

displacedTitan.6897:

I remember the last time I went to a movie, I DEMANDED that they show me the ending right away because that’s what I really wanted. Instead they FORCED me to GRIND the rest of the movie before showing me the ending that I PAID for. I cant believe people would do this! They are ruining their movie! Turning it into nothing but a GRINDY CASH GRAB!!!!!!

I was just thinking of that time I had to do 20 – 40 jumping jacks before I was allowed to have my 3D glasses. And then I had to see the movie nine different times. What an absolute delight of an experience that wasn’t a chore at all.

hahahahahaha made my day, thank you. :’D
so rediculous..

Yes his analogy was totally ridiculous and very poorly thought out. It made my day as well.
As if doing jumping jacks was GRINDING… I LOVE jumping jacks and thus it isn’t GRINDING to me. Wearing those 3D glasses though is GRINDY just to watch the ENDING of the movie that I PAID for! The nerve of them! Why would you RUIN my movie with those 3D glasses after giving me some AMAZING jumping jacks!!!!!!!!!

Smokin Dice.9103:

Tapioca.9062:

displacedTitan.6897:

I remember the last time I went to a movie, I DEMANDED that they show me the ending right away because that’s what I really wanted. Instead they FORCED me to GRIND the rest of the movie before showing me the ending that I PAID for. I cant believe people would do this! They are ruining their movie! Turning it into nothing but a GRINDY CASH GRAB!!!!!!

I was just thinking of that time I had to do 20 – 40 jumping jacks before I was allowed to have my 3D glasses. And then I had to see the movie nine different times. What an absolute delight of an experience that wasn’t a chore at all.

hahahahahaha made my day, thank you. :’D
so rediculous..

The best part is that they told me I actually had to do four hundred jumping jacks but because I was doing them at that cinema every jumping jack actually counted for ten. What a bargain, right? They also told me that the two-hundred jumping jacks I’d done earlier would give me access to half of the 3D glasses. It was a pretty exciting day.

sharkswithlazers.7632:

Many people are acting like those of us who are upset are being entitled and that we should have been prepared to play the content to enjoy the progression.

First off, this aspect wasn’t touted as progression. Mastery was. This was something everyone had anticipated on enjoying from the get go. This isn’t “skipping” content. Everyone here wants to play the new zones and quests with the elite spec we’ve waited months for. The sad part is that many players will have played through nearly all the novel content before they can get the elite spec. I had imagined that I’d be playing my reaper with my twilight or eternity at maguuma tomorrow night. Now I realize that I’ll be running around with that stupid dagger that has made necro so irrelevant for so long. My wife and I both made legendaries for these characters’ elite specs. We have been waiting to equip them. Alas, we will continue to wait because Anet drops a bomb on us last minute.

Secondly, we’ve a right to complain when they tell us, right before launch that the aspect that most players are most excited about has a huge amount of effort required to obtain.

Lastly, players were explicitly told that their efforts in map completion would pay off and that they’d have enough HP for elite specs. Now, right before launch, after many of us spent months gridning those stupid challenges across over a dozen characters, they tell us that our efforts were both A) not enough and absurdly inefficient because hero challenges in maguuma are worth ten times as much as they are in Tyria.

And yes, we should play the content yada yada yada. But don’t encourage your whole player base to prepare for something then pull the rug out from beneath them right before their efforts are about to pay off.

Yes, I have been carrying around the new weapons for at least a month just waiting to equip them. Now I have to decide if I want to basically sacrifice one of my 3 trait lines with an incomplete one just to be able to equip the weapon.

For my guardian and necro the answer will probably be yes since they need those new weapons more than the traits, but not exactly happy about it. All my other characters will be kittened though as sacrificing a line for a weapon would not be worth it to them.

Fadhli.9086:

WOW! Much like buying a cheeseburger but instead of enjoying it, one looks forward to bowel movement way before digestion happens, then rages because nothing is coming out.

It’s more like buying a cheeseburger, but getting the cheese only after taking a bite of the burger.

Your HoT experience? Without even playing?
Please.

Rococo.8347:

Elites were never considered to be ‘progression’ systems – that was Masteries – Elites were supposed to be an ALTERNATIVE game play spec – you don’t block access to them behind completing the entire vanilla spec

This is exactly how they laid out the whole progressions system excluding legendary weapons and gear, which were expected to be a grind. The masteries were to be our replacement to leveling and frankly I have no issue with that at all and enjoy the thought of working towards that but I have a major problem with this last minute addition. Nobody expected to have to dump points into specs and traits they have no intention of using before being able to unlock the elites. This was omitted because they knew there would be backlash and it doesn’t matter how you try and color that it was simply wrong to do so.
As of now it’s a mute point but I can tell you that I’ve learned my lesson and won’t be dumping cash in advance for anymore expansions unless the major points of functionality are laid out clearly from the onset.

Swagger.1459:

So maybe we will have all the hero point challenges lined up at the zone entrance for us?

That would be a great compromise I think

Unlikely but it would be a nice surprise. With so many people entering HOT all at once it would basically be run up, get in a hit or two if there is a guard, then commune or grab the item.

I doubt anyone expects that though. Which makes it all the more annoying when people go ‘oh, it is only 40 HPs, that is easy’.

Ranael.6423:

Bettik.4982:

Ranael.6423:

I really can’t feel sorry for those people. Nobody ever said that doing World Completion will grant a big advantage to Espec unlock, ever. People assumed it would and played accordingly.

They did say, “The new system will come to the live game before the launch of Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns™, allowing players to experience the changes to core specializations and stockpile Hero Points for their elite specializations. While elite specializations will be available to everyone who purchases the expansion, the upcoming core specialization changes will affect the base game.”
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/ready-up-core-specializations-summary/

Yeah I know that article. So yes stockpile…
In fact those who have done so have a 50% advantage on the other, you can have up to half your mastery track unlocked in 18 hours…. not so bad. I don’t see written “… and stockpile Hero Points to fully unlock their elite specialization as soon as the expansion will be released”

It is interesting to hear Colin say world completion was around 200 points (he does not know the #? really?). World completion is 179 points. Yes, I know there are more in the borderlands and such, but they have not been part of world completion for awhile now.

I had figured I would get to 140 or so then do a LFG so a bunch of us could help each other with the challenges we were each unable to solo. I have all of my characters above 100 and my original plans were to have my ones most in need of the new specs to have at least 120 by launch.

displacedTitan.6897:

Yes his analogy was totally ridiculous and very poorly thought out. It made my day as well.
As if doing jumping jacks was GRINDING… I LOVE jumping jacks and thus it isn’t GRINDING to me. Wearing those 3D glasses though is GRINDY just to watch the ENDING of the movie that I PAID for! The nerve of them! Why would you RUIN my movie with those 3D glasses after giving me some AMAZING jumping jacks!!!!!!!!!

well if you think that the 3D glasses should be the end of the movie.. I think they should help enjoy the movie experience..

Tapioca.9062:

The best part is that they told me I actually had to do four hundred jumping jacks but because I was doing them at that cinema every jumping jack actually counted for ten. What a bargain, right? They also told me that the two-hundred jumping jacks I’d done earlier would give me access to half of the 3D glasses. It was a pretty exciting day.

I love you <3

We’re talking here about a couple of days, you waited for 3 years now. Gosh, what the kitten is all the fuss about. Get a grip.

Smokin Dice.9103:

Ranael.6423:

Smokin Dice.9103:

because YOU CAN DO IT IN 10 MIN!.. but you have to rush through all the contant.. so more then 50% of all people will do that.. and that is BAD.

What?!!! assumptions again ? Ok I should stop caring then

how is that an assumptoin? you get HoT, you go into the jungle, you only do HP, you ignore any other contant in there, you get the elite, done. (repeat 8 times)

thats stupid design in my opinion…

Why are you ignoring everything else? That’s nonsensical. Do the stuff while you unlock HPs. You can start spending those points immediately into your elite spec, so while you’re playing the game, as intended, you are simultaneously unlocking your elite spec options and building your class.

Doesn’t that make a lot more sense?

Have we all basically forgotten how to level up? You don’t just get your stuff all at once while leveling, you build it over time. This is effectively the same thing. As you are progressing through the area you find and complete the challenges gaining more and more access to your new spec.

Smokin Dice.9103:

DoctorDing.5890:

Anyhow, getting back to the point. I fully support the OP’s right to cry about something that the OP considers to be unreasonable, even though it is not unreasonable.

Maybe the devs will see the OP’s endlessly bitter complaining and take the opportunity to spend the remaining 17 hours before launch reworking the whole game to meet the OP’s short-sighted requirements.

it is short sighted yes.. in the long run the system is great.. but in the early week of launch, what 50% of all people will do is ignore all content and farm HP in maguuma instead of ejoying it, because it is possible to do so.. and you want to tell me that this is reasonable design?
I can only say it again, if it was locked behind a story gate I would be fine with it, so I could play and enjoy, but the sole fact that you can rush the content to get it early is why people will do exactly that..
If it is possible people will do it…

And that is their business. Let people play the way they want to. It doesn’t hurt anything if they do that. It’s entirely unnecessary to do it, but people do unnecessary things all the time. It doesn’t mean you have to do it too, they’re not gaining an advantage over anyone by playing that way. I’m certainly not going to do it that way once I’ve had enough of Halloween and actually step into HoT.

Menadena.7482:

Ranael.6423:

Bettik.4982:

Ranael.6423:

I really can’t feel sorry for those people. Nobody ever said that doing World Completion will grant a big advantage to Espec unlock, ever. People assumed it would and played accordingly.

They did say, “The new system will come to the live game before the launch of Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns™, allowing players to experience the changes to core specializations and stockpile Hero Points for their elite specializations. While elite specializations will be available to everyone who purchases the expansion, the upcoming core specialization changes will affect the base game.”
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/ready-up-core-specializations-summary/

Yeah I know that article. So yes stockpile…
In fact those who have done so have a 50% advantage on the other, you can have up to half your mastery track unlocked in 18 hours…. not so bad. I don’t see written “… and stockpile Hero Points to fully unlock their elite specialization as soon as the expansion will be released”

It is interesting to hear Colin say world completion was around 200 points (he does not know the #? really?). World completion is 179 points. Yes, I know there are more in the borderlands and such, but they have not been part of world completion for awhile now.

I had figured I would get to 140 or so then do a LFG so a bunch of us could help each other with the challenges we were each unable to solo. I have all of my characters above 100 and my original plans were to have my ones most in need of the new specs to have at least 120 by launch.

Don’t know what world completion you’re going, but I have over 200 points and I’m not even done on my Theif

Kal Spiro.9745:

Menadena.7482:

Ranael.6423:

Bettik.4982:

Ranael.6423:

I really can’t feel sorry for those people. Nobody ever said that doing World Completion will grant a big advantage to Espec unlock, ever. People assumed it would and played accordingly.

They did say, “The new system will come to the live game before the launch of Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns™, allowing players to experience the changes to core specializations and stockpile Hero Points for their elite specializations. While elite specializations will be available to everyone who purchases the expansion, the upcoming core specialization changes will affect the base game.”
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/ready-up-core-specializations-summary/

Yeah I know that article. So yes stockpile…
In fact those who have done so have a 50% advantage on the other, you can have up to half your mastery track unlocked in 18 hours…. not so bad. I don’t see written “… and stockpile Hero Points to fully unlock their elite specialization as soon as the expansion will be released”

It is interesting to hear Colin say world completion was around 200 points (he does not know the #? really?). World completion is 179 points. Yes, I know there are more in the borderlands and such, but they have not been part of world completion for awhile now.

I had figured I would get to 140 or so then do a LFG so a bunch of us could help each other with the challenges we were each unable to solo. I have all of my characters above 100 and my original plans were to have my ones most in need of the new specs to have at least 120 by launch.

Don’t know what world completion you’re going, but I have over 200 points and I’m not even done on my Theif

According to wiki there are only 202 hero challenges in the (current) world (189 pve, 3 per bl, and 4 in eb). Oddly, I could swear that have 214 on my ele, and she has everything unlocked. Confuzzled….

Gonna have to recheck that when I get home.

Delius.1968:

Remember, remember:

It doesn’t suck your life away and force you onto a grinding treadmill; it doesn’t make you spend hours preparing to have fun rather than just having fun; and of course, it doesn’t have a monthly fee.

“it doesn’t make you spend hours preparing to have fun rather than just having fun”

Or so they said: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/guild-wars-2-design-manifesto/

That’s exactly what’s wrong with gated class mechanics.

That is assuming you can only have fun when you have everything unlocked. That is the problem with said manifesto lines. Fun is highly subjective. If you take that in mind then the manifesto as stated is impossible to fulfill for everyone.

You can say it’s a controversy and that they lied or whatever not. But fact remains that it’s very likely that there’s no inherent need to have the elite specialisations. Only a personal need. The content is there.

In fact, this whole unlock scheme (skillpoints) has been in the game since the beginning. And yes. People complained about that too. But it is definitely not the case that they went against what they said.

You don’t need the E specialisation from the start on to have fun with the content. Unless you want to do the content on your own preferred gamerules.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Menadena.7482:

Ranael.6423:

Bettik.4982:

Ranael.6423:

I really can’t feel sorry for those people. Nobody ever said that doing World Completion will grant a big advantage to Espec unlock, ever. People assumed it would and played accordingly.

They did say, “The new system will come to the live game before the launch of Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns™, allowing players to experience the changes to core specializations and stockpile Hero Points for their elite specializations. While elite specializations will be available to everyone who purchases the expansion, the upcoming core specialization changes will affect the base game.”
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/ready-up-core-specializations-summary/

Yeah I know that article. So yes stockpile…
In fact those who have done so have a 50% advantage on the other, you can have up to half your mastery track unlocked in 18 hours…. not so bad. I don’t see written “… and stockpile Hero Points to fully unlock their elite specialization as soon as the expansion will be released”

It is interesting to hear Colin say world completion was around 200 points (he does not know the #? really?). World completion is 179 points. Yes, I know there are more in the borderlands and such, but they have not been part of world completion for awhile now.

I had figured I would get to 140 or so then do a LFG so a bunch of us could help each other with the challenges we were each unable to solo. I have all of my characters above 100 and my original plans were to have my ones most in need of the new specs to have at least 120 by launch.

Don’t know what world completion you’re going, but I have over 200 points and I’m not even done on my Theif

According to wiki there are only 202 hero challenges in the (current) world (189 pve, 3 per bl, and 4 in eb). Oddly, I could swear that have 214 on my ele, and she has everything unlocked. Confuzzled….

Gonna have to recheck that when I get home.

It was 202 at launch.
Since then Maguuma Wastes was added (11 points) and the krait obelisk in personal instance. 202+11+1 =214, there is a chance your memory is working totally fine

There are so many statements about “specializations being part of horizontal progression”: they introduce masteries as horizontal progression. We don’t need specialization as a part of it. WvW players got shafted again. We paid for what? Specializations. Probably also for guild arenas but I don’t think, they are big enough for serious GvGs.
I don’t now how other WvW players think about grinding hp but I have other tasks to do after the release, like: learning the new map and all the shortcuts, new tactics, siege deployment, the new siege weapon, claiming/buffing objectives and so on. There is enough “horizontal progression” for WvWers without even farming hp or leveling masteries.

i will farm heropoints in hot, and if there is an interresting mission/quest i will just skip it.

thats what anets wants me to do, and i do it

Edit: how many heropoints does this maguuma thingy have? i hope enough so that i dont have to farm the rest of tyria