Guild Wars 2

the current HP system in gw2 that requires players to join “HP trains” in order to gain Hero Points seems broken and unchallenging. players gain HeroPoints just for being part of a group and not for actually having skills in the game.
for me it seems that it has lost its purpose , i have a suggestion that is meant to keep the feeling of the game being an mmo as well as making the hero points challenging -

- HPs will become instances in the world that you can enter in order to complete a hero challenge
- 5 people may join u in the instance

this is my current suggestion , if u have any way to improve this idea or have a better idea pls reply , and thanks for reading this

Best fix: Ban all Champion+ encounters.

There, no more trains. Everyone wins.

Except that joining a train is not required. Absolutely not. What you need to do is create a group of 2 or 3 people o get most of these HP’s. As a mesmer main the great majority of my HP’s were done with a maximum of 5 people. The only exception was the mushroom HP in tangled depth next to rata novus.

i was on a train in verdant brink. i dont remember who the heros were and what they even look like since all i see are bunch of names, but got the points nontheless which is what matters to me.

It’s not a problem, and all but 1 or 2 can be Solo’d the only one I could not Solo was the champion arrowhead

I didn’t join an HP train to max any of my toons. There are a large number of HP that can be done via channeling; no fighting required (just some uncommon sense about avoiding aggro). For the rest, I grouped up with 2-3 friends for some champs, followed a map chat call to “anyone killing [insert champ name]”, created my own map chat call out, and killed a few with whoever happened to be around.

I didn’t max any out during the first month and some weren’t finished until about 8-12 months after HoT launched.

The only time I’ve joined an HP train has been for map currency or map completion. (And in both cases, because it was more fun for me. I didn’t feel that I had to.)

I pretty much did as Illconceived said. I have joined an HP train or two (I have 8 characters), but I usually only get a few HP as I am not good enough at platforming to follow. They are a convenience but by no means necessary.

Making it instanced content just makes it a little bit harder to get help. If you want a challenge, then just do them by yourself. They can all be done solo, even if some are clearly intended for a group.

I happen to like the seamless cooperation in GW2 open world PvE. I think requiring formal groups and instanced content is the wrong way to go.

shadowcaster.3789:

the current HP system in gw2 that requires players to join “HP trains” in order to gain Hero Points

Faulty assumption. Hero point trains are something that developed to make hero point aquisition more streamlined and/or easier, that does not equal required though.

shadowcaster.3789:

Hero Points seems broken and unchallenging.

Who said hero points need to be challenging? I’ve always been under the impression they were ment as added immersion and fun mini games, just like the original ones in vanilla tyria.

shadowcaster.3789:

i have a suggestion that is meant to keep the feeling of the game being an mmo as well as making the hero points challenging

The game is a MMO though, why would you actively want to damage it’s very core aspect?

Sorry but somehow I simply can’t understand this suggestion. It’sdownright damaging to the very nature of the game.

I don’t have a problem with the way Hero points are right now. It would be a very unnecessary annoyance to require an instance to do them. I like being able to assist someone with a HP when I’m just passing by. I also like that I can join in a group (whether it be a train of 20 or a group of 4) roaming around the map doing HPs, especially when I’m playing a class I’m less than familiar with and will fail miserably solo.

Like others have said, there are quite a few soloable ones. Many don’t even require combat, especially if you’re playing a class that has access to stealth or invulnerability. On a Lv40 Elementalist I managed to get 16 HoT HPs solo (though 2 were from a partly completed DS map, would have managed the other 4 if the meta finished).

All in all, I just don’t see a need to change them.

If you play your character well you may clear some solo (and that’s actually a nice challenge of which you speak of), while others with minor help (1 or 2 more). It’s not that terrible.

Looking at VB, and going from memory, there’s like 6 channeling HPs, 3 I’ve done duo (my general play “mode”) and 2 I’ve needed the help of a couple randoms or just jump in when I see a few others doing it.
I might misremember one or two easily duoable as channeling just from lack of challenge.

I dunno, I’ve been able to solo quite many of them. Sometimes I was in a pinch in needed help of 1 or 2 other people.
No need to join HP trains for everything. We’ve seen that HP trains make it easier, but they’re far from required

Rauderi.8706:

Best fix: Ban all Champion+ encounters.

There, no more trains. Everyone wins.

u want to end one of the principal points of the game???

Cyninja.2954:

Who said hero points need to be challenging?

Anet, because beep boop they’re worth 10 points now

…the fact that they’re only worth 10 points to devalue the ones from the core game that players already had is completely coincidental, of course.

Managed to do nearly all of them either solo or with whoever happened to be around at the time, no train required. . .

ilI like how the op says they are not challenging and then procceds to say you join a group to do them.

Hyper Cutter.9376:

Cyninja.2954:

Who said hero points need to be challenging?

Anet, because beep boop they’re worth 10 points now

…the fact that they’re only worth 10 points to devalue the ones from the core game that players already had is completely coincidental, of course.

apparently a big part of the game didnt have the core tyria omes if we look at how they cried about the hp points for the e specs on release

I love how people have initiative to HP train and that’ll help another people that doesn’t have guild etc. ( Whatever the reason is ), if you say " broken and unchallenging " just do it yourself solo or with your friends Cause sometimes even if you have a guild doesn’t mean they always have time for you too.

Aeolus.3615:

Rauderi.8706:

Best fix: Ban all Champion+ encounters.

There, no more trains. Everyone wins.

u want to end one of the principal points of the game???

I left off the /s for a reason.
I don’t consider group content for personal character growth to be a principle point of the game. That’s been debated, at length, on the boards pretty much since the release of HoT.
While some very kind players have been awesome enough to lead the charge in zones to do HP trains, many players resent being forced into group content that way. I can remember quite a few times during my HoT experience where I got blindsided by an overpowered champion (thus negating most of my ability to CC or defend like in the rest of open world), and it really put me off of the game.
I was determined to get through it, but I guarantee some players looked at that and stopped logging in. They didn’t bother going to the forums to complain, they just quit.

I’ve never needed a train either, though there are definitely a few HP which I will skip if I’m not going for map completion. The pile of guano is one where even a few players can have trouble with, plus getting help up there isn’t very convenient.

Fortunately, if you say something like “can I have help with this point. It is terrible and I’ve been trying for the last 30 minutes”, you will generally get some people agreeing either out of pity or because they need the point too.

Most or all of HPs can be soloed pretty casually, and you can unlock an elite spec by doing the channels. I guide new players through it often.

Rauderi.8706:

Aeolus.3615:

Rauderi.8706:

Best fix: Ban all Champion+ encounters.

There, no more trains. Everyone wins.

u want to end one of the principal points of the game???

I left off the /s for a reason.
I don’t consider group content for personal character growth to be a principle point of the game. That’s been debated, at length, on the boards pretty much since the release of HoT.
While some very kind players have been awesome enough to lead the charge in zones to do HP trains, many players resent being forced into group content that way. I can remember quite a few times during my HoT experience where I got blindsided by an overpowered champion (thus negating most of my ability to CC or defend like in the rest of open world), and it really put me off of the game.
I was determined to get through it, but I guarantee some players looked at that and stopped logging in. They didn’t bother going to the forums to complain, they just quit.

I know of MANY people that quit the game pretty fast because of this. Personal growth should be just that, personal.
Forced grouping is a long dead aspect of MMO’s as the main audience for MMO’s now work jobs, take care of their houses, kids, etc…
Heck the lack of an in game automated group finder for dungeons and such is a notable lacking point considering it is now an industry standard.

I rather enjoy the game, and keep coming back to it with breaks in between. It has it’s failings, but they all do. Just hope they keep working on QoL improvements.

You need 25 HoT hero challenges to max out an elite spec.

There are 20 soloable. Could be a bit higher depending on skill level.

There are at least 6 that are easily doable with 2 people.

At least from looking at the math it seems fine to me.

Agreed with all the “HPs are fine as they are” crowd. I am an absolutely horrible necro, and even on that class I soloed my way to completing the reaper line. I will admit the VB Guano HP took me a couple tries, but I managed it.

Every time I see a call for help with HPs, I go and help if I’m not holding down part of the meta. I’ve never once felt an HP train was required.

The first time you try to do all the HP’s by yourself it really sucks and it helps to do a train ESPECIALLY if you don’t have all the useful maguuma masteries. But after you’ve gotten all the points for one character and you have things like updraft, bouncing mushrooms, nuhock wallows, you pretty quickly figure out what you can solo and it’s not so bad.

I still think the system is very flawed though. If someone hates the HOT maps, tough luck, Anet will force you to play these crap maps in order to play the elite spec you bought for $30 to $60. At least in the core game, you could get to 80 by doing a lot of different stuff and any map was eligible to get you XP. I think this “funnel system” is what drove away a lot of the player base.

Points gained from the core maps still works as well. In fact you can fully unlock the elite spec without touching any HoT HP.

Khisanth.2948:

Points gained from the core maps still works as well. In fact you can fully unlock the elite spec without touching any HoT HP.

Is that true? Last I checked you would be short about 30 points or so. Though that does limit you only to not unlocking the last elite skill on the line, or doing a couple of the fairly trivial communes in the Verdant Brink.

Khisanth.2948:

Points gained from the core maps still works as well. In fact you can fully unlock the elite spec without touching any HoT HP.

There are 200 central tyria points and it takes 250 points to max your elite…

To be fair, someone could grind the crap out of wvw if they wanted but that would be a nightmare

TorsoReaper.8530:

Khisanth.2948:

Points gained from the core maps still works as well. In fact you can fully unlock the elite spec without touching any HoT HP.

There are 200 central tyria points and it takes 250 points to max your elite…

To be fair, someone could grind the crap out of wvw if they wanted but that would be a nightmare

If you do have all the central Tyria ones, it’s not hard to find a few Commune points or non-group hero challenges. There’s at least 3 in Verdant Brink that are Commune, one that isn’t too challenging in the lower biome. Then do the one in Tarir from the north gate, boom-done.
But that involves getting the rest of the HPs from central Tyria. I’m not quite that patient. :P

Oh right. Miscalculated but there are 6 communes in Verdant Brink. 7 if you count the one near the wyverns. The one at Creeping Crevasse involves fighting but it is a veteran although depending on which mob you get the champion spider in TD can be much easier because teragriffs have some terabble implementation.

There’s also some WvW commune points as well.

But really, 200 CT +5 Points in VB are easy. Auric Basin has a few as well.

The worst case scenario is on my warrior which had (and still has) 1% map completion. In that case I did all of them down to tangled depths, at which point I asked a friend for help. =p

Also note that once you pass 225 or so, your elite is practically complete save for the elite utility. Depending on the build this can be sooner….

In some cases you don’t need to full unlock the grandmaster traits either.

On the other hand some people make the mistake of slotting in the elite spec as soon as it is unlocked. Now you end up missing a trait line while attempting to content intended to be more difficult. Not exactly an ideal setup.

without reading numerous replies – sayin about hp trains spoiling the getting of hp`s is a bit wrong – ive ran both small and large hp trains and tbh there is a big difference – big trains are not a case of doing very little work , unless you have been in a big train you wont notice that the hp champs scale up . Ive seen the Golem Hp in ab with 5 ppl spawn 2 foes plus the “target” and then with 20+ ppl ive seen the “target” along with 5 foes – an increase of 3 and ive seen around 7 with a big zerg . HP trains are nothing like champ trains – hp trains run with or without a tag and are no different to 5 ppm in the map asking who wants to team up . Us coms who do hp trains dont get mega amounts of loot ( unlike champ trains ) and with us its not about the loot but “helping” others , ive yet to see a hp train force ppl on the map to join – its up to the player if they wish to join a train or not . Also ive done all my chrs cept mesmer ( who is used for hp trains now ) with a few guildies or solo where possible . Hp trains can be alot of fun and at least on a quiet ab map it gives it a bit of life . Why not complain that by doing wvw/eotm you can basically get all HoT/CT hp without even setting foot in hot or outside racial start zones just from rank up chests .

i just used proof of heroics from wv ot unlock hero challenges i missed.

I think they should do away with HPs being a requirement for elite specs and instead have them be repeatable content that gives map-related rewards.

Something like:

HPs spawn on a timer, like most events, and are set to spawn more often during lulls in meta periods and more rarely (or never) during the most intense meta periods (ex: the octovine in VB).

Completing them gives you pieces of mastery points, with you needing 50 pieces total to make one mastery point. The combat HPs give you 10 pieces, so if you do 5 of those, you get 1 mastery point. The non-combat ones (communing) give you 2 pieces and reset on a separate, daily timer.

If you eventually have used all the mastery points you can use and are ending up with excess pieces, you can, instead of combining the pieces into complete mastery points, sell them to an exchange merchant, who gives you HoT map currencies (ex: leyline crystals) in exchange for mastery pieces at a ratio of 1 crystal for every 2 mastery pieces.

This change could theoretically be applied fully to the HoT HPs only, at first. For the Core Tyria HPs, the only change would be that they now give pieces of masteries (the idea being to save time changing every HP in the game and plus, the HoT HPs are the ones that really warrant the challenge of repetition anyway).

Rauderi.8706:

TorsoReaper.8530:

Khisanth.2948:

Points gained from the core maps still works as well. In fact you can fully unlock the elite spec without touching any HoT HP.

There are 200 central tyria points and it takes 250 points to max your elite…

To be fair, someone could grind the crap out of wvw if they wanted but that would be a nightmare

If you do have all the central Tyria ones, it’s not hard to find a few Commune points or non-group hero challenges. There’s at least 3 in Verdant Brink that are Commune, one that isn’t too challenging in the lower biome. Then do the one in Tarir from the north gate, boom-done.
But that involves getting the rest of the HPs from central Tyria. I’m not quite that patient. :P

Hot was the beginning of the break bar, and most of them are breakable by one player with a few CC. I can only think of like two that seemed like they were designed for more than two players.

It is intimidating, but most of them were doable solo, and fairly easy with a small number ofpeople.

Labjax.2465:

I think they should do away with HPs being a requirement for elite specs and instead have them be repeatable content that gives map-related rewards.

Something like:

HPs spawn on a timer, like most events, and are set to spawn more often during lulls in meta periods and more rarely (or never) during the most intense meta periods (ex: the octovine in VB).

There are already enough ‘stand around waiting for something to spawn’ in the game. It does not need more. That is just a terrible idea.

Labjax.2465:

I think they should do away with HPs being a requirement for elite specs and instead have them be repeatable content that gives map-related rewards.

Please no. I don’t want to repeat identical events for every character I have, to get elite specs.

Incidental, hero challenges are already repeatable content that gives map-related rewards. The difference is that we can choose any challenge we like, on any map.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Labjax.2465:

I think they should do away with HPs being a requirement for elite specs and instead have them be repeatable content that gives map-related rewards.

Please no. I don’t want to repeat identical events for every character I have, to get elite specs.

Incidental, hero challenges are already repeatable content that gives map-related rewards. The difference is that we can choose any challenge we like, on any map.

huh? dont we already repeat identical events for every charachter to get elite specs? i though he wanted to remove hero points from elite specs completely.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Labjax.2465:

I think they should do away with HPs being a requirement for elite specs and instead have them be repeatable content that gives map-related rewards.

Please no. I don’t want to repeat identical events for every character I have, to get elite specs.

Incidental, hero challenges are already repeatable content that gives map-related rewards. The difference is that we can choose any challenge we like, on any map.

phys.7689:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Labjax.2465:

I think they should do away with HPs being a requirement for elite specs and instead have them be repeatable content that gives map-related rewards.

Please no. I don’t want to repeat identical events for every character I have, to get elite specs.

Incidental, hero challenges are already repeatable content that gives map-related rewards. The difference is that we can choose any challenge we like, on any map.

huh? dont we already repeat identical events for every charachter to get elite specs? i though he wanted to remove hero points from elite specs completely.

Yeah, I’m just as confused as you, phys. I’m suggesting they are no longer required at all (except, I spose, for map completion, but even that… I thought about proposing that they are removed from the map completion requirement for HoT maps, since they would be even more clearly defined as cyclical content intended for groups in this way and map completion is traditionally something that is designed to be manageable solo).

Right now, you do have to repeat identical events for every character you have, to get elite specs. I’m wanting to get away from that irritation.

phys.7689:

Hot was the beginning of the break bar, and most of them are breakable by one player with a few CC. I can only think of like two that seemed like they were designed for more than two players.

Gonna have to call foul there. With warrior hammer, I should have no problem breaking a bar designed for solo, possibly even 2-3 players. Many of these things aren’t worth the cooldowns because of how much their particular bars weigh or refresh.

Rauderi.8706:

phys.7689:

Hot was the beginning of the break bar, and most of them are breakable by one player with a few CC. I can only think of like two that seemed like they were designed for more than two players.

Gonna have to call foul there. With warrior hammer, I should have no problem breaking a bar designed for solo, possibly even 2-3 players. Many of these things aren’t worth the cooldowns because of how much their particular bars weigh or refresh.

i remember solo breaking at least two champions for hero points on my mesmer. maybe some are different. now if more people come it requires more cc, so weirdly more people tended to make some things more difficult. the wyvern is an example of this, with a small group, easy break, large group always fail the breaks.

and it did take two or three skills, but the classes who need cc breaks can usually spec a lot of them. also dif skills have dif break power.

Labjax.2465:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Labjax.2465:

I think they should do away with HPs being a requirement for elite specs and instead have them be repeatable content that gives map-related rewards.

Please no. I don’t want to repeat identical events for every character I have, to get elite specs.

Incidental, hero challenges are already repeatable content that gives map-related rewards. The difference is that we can choose any challenge we like, on any map.

phys.7689:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Labjax.2465:

I think they should do away with HPs being a requirement for elite specs and instead have them be repeatable content that gives map-related rewards.

Please no. I don’t want to repeat identical events for every character I have, to get elite specs.

Incidental, hero challenges are already repeatable content that gives map-related rewards. The difference is that we can choose any challenge we like, on any map.

huh? dont we already repeat identical events for every charachter to get elite specs? i though he wanted to remove hero points from elite specs completely.

Yeah, I’m just as confused as you, phys. I’m suggesting they are no longer required at all (except, I spose, for map completion, but even that… I thought about proposing that they are removed from the map completion requirement for HoT maps, since they would be even more clearly defined as cyclical content intended for groups in this way and map completion is traditionally something that is designed to be manageable solo).

Right now, you do have to repeat identical events for every character you have, to get elite specs. I’m wanting to get away from that irritation.

Ok now I’m confused. What exactly are you proposing? A single chain of events that you do once per toon? I’d be okay with that.

(Your original description sounded an awful lot like what people asked for and we had for nearly two years: doing one event per trait. That was awful.)

As it stands now, I can do whatever hero challenges I want, whether everything in Core + a few in HoT or lots of stuff in HoT. I can go to WvW and use proofs of heroics. I have a lot of options. It just happens that it’s efficient to choose certain challenges and so some people feel it’s repetitive.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Ok now I’m confused. What exactly are you proposing? A single chain of events that you do once per toon? I’d be okay with that.

(Your original description sounded an awful lot like what people asked for and we had for nearly two years: doing one event per trait. That was awful.)

As it stands now, I can do whatever hero challenges I want, whether everything in Core + a few in HoT or lots of stuff in HoT. I can go to WvW and use proofs of heroics. I have a lot of options. It just happens that it’s efficient to choose certain challenges and so some people feel it’s repetitive.

I’m suggesting that unlocking specs is no longer a ‘goal’ at all. You just get them once you’re high enough level. Including elite specs. And then at that point, HPs are repurposed to be something else.

I don’t really understand the point of making us unlock specs to begin with.

Labjax.2465:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Ok now I’m confused. What exactly are you proposing? A single chain of events that you do once per toon? I’d be okay with that.

(Your original description sounded an awful lot like what people asked for and we had for nearly two years: doing one event per trait. That was awful.)

As it stands now, I can do whatever hero challenges I want, whether everything in Core + a few in HoT or lots of stuff in HoT. I can go to WvW and use proofs of heroics. I have a lot of options. It just happens that it’s efficient to choose certain challenges and so some people feel it’s repetitive.

I’m suggesting that unlocking specs is no longer a ‘goal’ at all. You just get them once you’re high enough level. Including elite specs. And then at that point, HPs are repurposed to be something else.

I don’t really understand the point of making us unlock specs to begin with.

the point is the same reason we have to unlock skills and traits by leveling in core. To have progression again. To give you a real reason and benefit for exploring the new maps.
Mastery also serves this purpose, but mastery is only for the area its in, while you can take elite specs anywhere.

I honestly didnt have much beef with the concept of hero points, once they reduced it to 250, it was kind of foolish at 400, by the time you could use the specialization, you had already finished all the zones.

phys.7689:

the point is the same reason we have to unlock skills and traits by leveling in core. To have progression again. To give you a real reason and benefit for exploring the new maps.
Mastery also serves this purpose, but mastery is only for the area its in, while you can take elite specs anywhere.

I honestly didnt have much beef with the concept of hero points, once they reduced it to 250, it was kind of foolish at 400, by the time you could use the specialization, you had already finished all the zones.

Ok… and what purpose does progression serve?

Let me guess, something like, “So people have goals.”

But why do goals need to be tied to something so essential to learning and playing your class, like access to your specs?

Labjax.2465:

phys.7689:

the point is the same reason we have to unlock skills and traits by leveling in core. To have progression again. To give you a real reason and benefit for exploring the new maps.
Mastery also serves this purpose, but mastery is only for the area its in, while you can take elite specs anywhere.

I honestly didnt have much beef with the concept of hero points, once they reduced it to 250, it was kind of foolish at 400, by the time you could use the specialization, you had already finished all the zones.

Ok… and what purpose does progression serve?

Let me guess, something like, “So people have goals.”

But why do goals need to be tied to something so essential to learning and playing your class, like access to your specs?

hmm thats probably because its the thing people most want to do. If i have to choose one thing thats going to make me want to do content its probably going to be new skills/builds/ways to play the game.

the next best thing is a series of challenging content progression thats fairly easy to start (10 man is a hurdle to me)

skins dont impress me, increasing damage is mostly so that i can better do challenging content, its not a joy in and of itself.

Gw2 is a lot about the maps, so they need some carrots to make people explore.

What is your general purpose in doing new maps?

phys.7689:

Labjax.2465:

phys.7689:

the point is the same reason we have to unlock skills and traits by leveling in core. To have progression again. To give you a real reason and benefit for exploring the new maps.
Mastery also serves this purpose, but mastery is only for the area its in, while you can take elite specs anywhere.

I honestly didnt have much beef with the concept of hero points, once they reduced it to 250, it was kind of foolish at 400, by the time you could use the specialization, you had already finished all the zones.

Ok… and what purpose does progression serve?

Let me guess, something like, “So people have goals.”

But why do goals need to be tied to something so essential to learning and playing your class, like access to your specs?

hmm thats probably because its the thing people most want to do. If i have to choose one thing thats going to make me want to do content its probably going to be new skills/builds/ways to play the game.

the next best thing is a series of challenging content progression thats fairly easy to start (10 man is a hurdle to me)

skins dont impress me, increasing damage is mostly so that i can better do challenging content, its not a joy in and of itself.

Gw2 is a lot about the maps, so they need some carrots to make people explore.

What is your general purpose in doing new maps?

Hmm. Thanks for asking.

I guess for me, I like doing new maps for the satisfaction of completion. The map completion system in this game gives me a feeling of satisfaction when I’ve filled out everything it wants me to do.

This is one reason why HoT was such a disappointment for me, because I’d traditionally done such map completion solo, and I couldn’t do that very well, if at all, with the way the hero points were made for groups.

Edit: The transmutation charge is a nice icing on the cake for me as well, since I’m into skins and fashion.

Labjax.2465:

phys.7689:

Labjax.2465:

phys.7689:

the point is the same reason we have to unlock skills and traits by leveling in core. To have progression again. To give you a real reason and benefit for exploring the new maps.
Mastery also serves this purpose, but mastery is only for the area its in, while you can take elite specs anywhere.

I honestly didnt have much beef with the concept of hero points, once they reduced it to 250, it was kind of foolish at 400, by the time you could use the specialization, you had already finished all the zones.

Ok… and what purpose does progression serve?

Let me guess, something like, “So people have goals.”

But why do goals need to be tied to something so essential to learning and playing your class, like access to your specs?

hmm thats probably because its the thing people most want to do. If i have to choose one thing thats going to make me want to do content its probably going to be new skills/builds/ways to play the game.

the next best thing is a series of challenging content progression thats fairly easy to start (10 man is a hurdle to me)

skins dont impress me, increasing damage is mostly so that i can better do challenging content, its not a joy in and of itself.

Gw2 is a lot about the maps, so they need some carrots to make people explore.

What is your general purpose in doing new maps?

Hmm. Thanks for asking.

I guess for me, I like doing new maps for the satisfaction of completion. The map completion system in this game gives me a feeling of satisfaction when I’ve filled out everything it wants me to do.

This is one reason why HoT was such a disappointment for me, because I’d traditionally done such map completion solo, and I couldn’t do that very well, if at all, with the way the hero points were made for groups.

Edit: The transmutation charge is a nice icing on the cake for me as well, since I’m into skins and fashion.

i get what you re saying, but for me, though i get a bit of thrill out of map completion, i generally need a reason to do it, or i just ignore it. Doing only what i need to, or what i run across, until maybe i happen to be close enough to completion, that map complete is a big enough carrot.
after my first char, i only stay in a map long enough to get enough xp to hit the next map. I focus on dynamic events, cause they give big exp.

Hot map hero points are a better balance imo, yeah they are harder, but they are 10 points, which is worth it. Each one offers more signifigant char progress. you only need i think 25 for full spec.

whereas you could go to tyria to get a number of those extra points, it d take forever. On my newer chars, i think you need like 70 or 100 skill points more than you get for leveling now, i generally would rather get them in Hot than tyria.

like i said before i didnt really appreciate hot till i started to have to replay it a lot on alts and for farming hope and unlocking ascended elite weaps. The repetion and map goals there were more engaging than back when i had to do similar stuff in tyria.

this all of course subjective.