Guild Wars 2

Being a genius is being smarter than most people in the society we live in.

If everybody was a genius in Asura Society then nobody is a genius in Asura Society since being a genius would be considered “Normal”. So you’re not a genius, you’re just “Normal” like all the other Asuras. Sure we all are different, think different, we all know science and tech stuff but that only means you’re normal since the word genius is now just normalize and carries little to no value in Asuran society.

Let me give you a real life example:
An autistic guy can behavior disorder of some kind, but be a living calculator. I mean this guy can calculate ANYTHING and even BEYOND what a Super Computer can all in his Head… We call these people savant. They are freakin Awesome and have real value at what they excel at. Normal people can’t do what they can so they are really by definition, a genius!!! Probably at that one subject. But you don’t have to be a savant to be a genius, you can have normal traits and still outsmart most people and excel at it beyond what’s considered normal.

But from my understanding on what it means to be a genius, is that you need to be smarter than the average Asura, you need to go above and beyond what any Asura can do and achieve.

Oh and a real genius, doesn’t consider himself/herself as a genius. He or she acts on it and others see the results.

If Tiami shared her findings with other Asuras I’m pretty sure all Asuras would find tons of viable solutions even if the solutions are all different. I guess this is what bothers me when it comes to Asura society.

Would we ever get a true genius Asuran character? One that doesn’t praise himself/herself for being a genius? One that just acts on it while others praise him/her?

I like to know your thoughts. =)

DreamyAbaddon.3265:

Would we ever get a true genius Asuran character? One that doesn’t praise himself/herself for being a genius? One that just acts on it while others praise him/her?

We had one…his name was Snaff. RIP

RyuDragnier.9476:

DreamyAbaddon.3265:

Would we ever get a true genius Asuran character? One that doesn’t praise himself/herself for being a genius? One that just acts on it while others praise him/her?

We had one…his name was Snaff. RIP

I mean one that’s alive and in game for our story. =)
Snaff is only present in the GW2 Novel.

“Genius” in asura society seems to be a title for reaching a certain level of accomplishment and recognition. You could consider it to be equivalent to a PhD. (Snaff refers to Zojja as a genius-in-training, and their relationship could be seen as analogous to a professor supervising a research student.)

Which is a misuse of the term according to its standard English definition, but keep in mind that the asura see themselves as smarter than other races (YMMV on whether they actually are, or whether it’s just that they have a better education system and that results in them being more knowledgeable) – so clearly any asura that reaches that level of accomplishment must be a genius by the standards of the wider population of Tyria.

Perhaps, Asura use the definition of having an extraordinarily high intelligence rating on a psychological test, as an IQ above 140, or whatever number they wish to use.

Maybe they use the term in comparison to other organisms, races, species.

Or, as above, maybe it doesn’t mean the same thing in the universe of Tyria as it does in our universe.

It would probably take a genius to figure it out. ; )

RyuDragnier.9476:

DreamyAbaddon.3265:

Would we ever get a true genius Asuran character? One that doesn’t praise himself/herself for being a genius? One that just acts on it while others praise him/her?

We had one…his name was Snaff. RIP

I want a mini Snaff <3

draxynnic.3719:

“Genius” in asura society seems to be a title for reaching a certain level of accomplishment and recognition. You could consider it to be equivalent to a PhD. (Snaff refers to Zojja as a genius-in-training, and their relationship could be seen as analogous to a professor supervising a research student.)

Which is a misuse of the term according to its standard English definition, but keep in mind that the asura see themselves as smarter than other races (YMMV on whether they actually are, or whether it’s just that they have a better education system and that results in them being more knowledgeable) – so clearly any asura that reaches that level of accomplishment must be a genius by the standards of the wider population of Tyria.

If being a genius is just a title then it’s a pretty “Normal” or “basic” title for the lack of better words. To be honest, that title sounds more like “Highschool diploma” equivalence not PhD because Highschool diploma everyone can get but PdD not many people get. So considering everybody in Asura society is a genius, that title would mean “Hey I just graduated highschool!” and bragging about it… It’s not even a degree man! That’s just my opinion anyways.

The thing is that not everyone in asuran society, but they pretend to be and aim to be.

Not all Asura are geniuses. Many are average worker Asura that get on a krew and do jobs, but they’re nameless and low to average rank and doing the equivalent of blue collar jobs. It’s the named Asura that we speak to who have titles and are above average that are calling themselves geniuses and inflating how important they are and how much they know.

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Big_Machine_Krewe_Member

DreamyAbaddon.3265:

draxynnic.3719:

“Genius” in asura society seems to be a title for reaching a certain level of accomplishment and recognition. You could consider it to be equivalent to a PhD. (Snaff refers to Zojja as a genius-in-training, and their relationship could be seen as analogous to a professor supervising a research student.)

Which is a misuse of the term according to its standard English definition, but keep in mind that the asura see themselves as smarter than other races (YMMV on whether they actually are, or whether it’s just that they have a better education system and that results in them being more knowledgeable) – so clearly any asura that reaches that level of accomplishment must be a genius by the standards of the wider population of Tyria.

If being a genius is just a title then it’s a pretty “Normal” or “basic” title for the lack of better words. To be honest, that title sounds more like “Highschool diploma” equivalence not PhD because Highschool diploma everyone can get but PdD not many people get. So considering everybody in Asura society is a genius, that title would mean “Hey I just graduated highschool!” and bragging about it… It’s not even a degree man! That’s just my opinion anyways.

I think we can quantify what ‘genius’ means according to the asura based on Zojja being a ‘genius in training’. Her relationship with Snaff, as discussed above, is very much one of research student and supervisor – she’s progressed past coursework in general and is doing her own research (with supervision). That’s at least the equivalent of an honours degree.

Yes, we see a lot of asura ‘geniuses’, but I think that reflects that asura society places a higher emphasis on academic pursuits than even modern human society does. Research degrees in real life are something that people generally only pursue if they’re planning to go into a research discipline or a related field – among asura, the expectation is that every asura wants to be doing cutting-edge work and the only reason not to is that you don’t have the capability. So it’s likely that the proportion of asura with the equivalent of research degrees is much higher than we’d be used to, to the point where in asura society not having one would be viewed as similar to someone leaving school at 16 in real life (although it’s more likely, as someone else said, that we get an inflated idea of how many geniuses there are because named asura are more likely to be, and not achieving the title is more like not having a bachelor’s degree). Nevertheless, it does seem to require the equivalent of a research degree, it’s just that asura place a much higher priority on science and research than modern society does.

Your comment regarding high school diplomas, however, segues into something that I was thinking after my previous post: Imagine someone from modern times being transported back in time. Someone with a high school diploma who’s transported back into the Middle Ages would probably be regarded as a genius (or a witch) based on what they’ve learned from a modern curriculum, assuming they’ve retained most of it – what we now consider to be a basic education was simply unknown back then. With more advanced education, you could shorten the time gap. A holder of a bachelor’s degree in a scientific discipline today, for instance, could well earn a Nobel Prize if they took their knowledge back to the turn of the 20th century and presented it as their own work.

And the asura are arrogant enough that this is pretty much how they view the rest of Tyria. They grudgingly admit that the charr are ahead in some respects (because the charr have handicapped themselves by minimising use of magic, and have thus come up with things that the asura wouldn’t have because it’s more efficient to just use magic) but by and large the other races are so backward from the asuran perspective that the average or slightly above-average asura would be a genius from the perspective of any “lesser” race… or at least that’s how the asura see it.

DreamyAbaddon.3265:

Being a genius is being smarter than most people in the society we live in.

And they are.
They are generally smarter than humans, norn, charr, sylvari and pretty much every other intelligent race that’s around on Tyria right now.
I get with ‘society’ you only meant asura society, but I think you should look at Tyrian society as a whole. Tyria is not like Earth where there’s only 1 intelligent species.

Blasphemy. All Asuran are genius.

BTW TL;DR.

The asura are not natural geniuses. They were exposed to the technology and science since they were progeny. Any race that experience the same level of exposure and interest would be with par.

That’s my take on it as well. Asura aren’t actually inherently that much smarter than other races – but they are better educated, which is something to be proud of in itself.

And as has often happened in the real world, they conflate “more knowledgeable” with “more intelligent”.

cyberzombie.7348:

The asura are not natural geniuses. They were exposed to the technology and science since they were progeny. Any race that experience the same level of exposure and interest would be with par.

Worth noting: The engineer profession is a product of Iron Legion charr creativity, not Asuran.

cyberzombie.7348:

The asura are not natural geniuses. They were exposed to the technology and science since they were progeny. Any race that experience the same level of exposure and interest would be with par.

Not entirely true. The fact they have all this technology and science to begin with shows they are generally smarter than the other races of Tyria. All this advanced technology/scientific knowledge they expose their children to doesn’t just grow on trees.

I mean I could agree with this argument if it was for a certain percentage of their population. But if an entire race is this advanced and so far ahead of other races in technological and scientific fields, I’m pretty sure it’s because of more than just better education.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

cyberzombie.7348:

The asura are not natural geniuses. They were exposed to the technology and science since they were progeny. Any race that experience the same level of exposure and interest would be with par.

Not entirely true. The fact they have all this technology and science to begin with shows they are generally smarter than the other races of Tyria. All this advanced technology/scientific knowledge they expose their children to doesn’t just grow on trees.

I mean I could agree with this argument if it was for a certain percentage of their population. But if an entire race is this advanced and so far ahead of other races in technological and scientific fields, I’m pretty sure it’s because of more than just better education.

It’s not just the education system. It’s an entire culture that focuses on academic success. That, to me, explains enough without needing to resort to biological explanations. As in, if a Charr or a Human was raised in a similarly stimulating environment (which means both the education system and the culture) then they would, on average, be equally succesful I’d wager.

I also have a suspicion that the asura had a head start. While Primordus would ultimately destroy most of asuran civilisation, the magic leaking from his sleeping form could have meant that they had access to usable magic (not just spirit-wrangling) well before the gods started releasing magic from the bloodstone.

In fact, while I haven’t been able to find it lately, I do recall an interview mentioning that the asura detected an upsurge in magic when Abaddon was handing out magic, only to dip down again (but still remaining above previous levels) after the bloodstone was split. This indicates that the asura were measuring magic levels (and therefore had both means and motivation to do so) at a time when most races believed “magic” meant calling up your ancestor from the Mists and asking for a favour… if it existed for them at all.

So when it comes to magical studies, the asura have a significant head start on everyone else except the elder races. And it’s primarily in magical studies – specifically, the treatment of magic as a science – that their advantages lie. It’s been noted that charr are better at technology when that technology is not augmented by magic, while humans* are better at using magic in an intuitive fashion. The asura are just better when it comes to treating magic like a science.

*Possibly sylvari and norn too, but they haven’t been directly addressed. Sylvari, at least, seem to have a similar relationship to magic as humans, though.