Worst Thief in the world, yes I am.
Dragon Lore
I’ll try to be concise (I don’t have much time now), I’m sure someone will write down all the details later (and correct what I got wrong).
1) We’re not too sure if they’re the same species or not, actually.
In case they are, the main differences are obviously in age and power.
It is hinted that other dragons can become an elder dragons in place of an old one, but we don’t know more than that.
2) We don’t know for sure not knowing what happened in Cantha and Elona.
But we can be pretty sure that we have 6 Elder Dragons (Primordus, Jormag, Zhaitan (Dead), Deep sea dragon, Kralkatorrik, Mordremoth)
3)No, they just live somewhere. Obviously their presence change the environment around them, anyway.
4) All but Zhaitan
5) Tequatl was strong to begin with being a dragon champion. He became stronger after Zhaitan demise, probably absorbing some of the magical power going loose after the orrian dragon death.
6) We don’t really know.
The only thing we know for sure is that they need to absorb magic to stay awake.
How they do it could be different, though.
1) The elder dragons seem to not only be beings, but a force. They’re ancient and way more powerful than other dragons…but not much is known about them. It is speculated by certain characters that if Glint were to live long enough, she could have absorbed Kralkatorrik’s power, becoming an elder dragon via ascension ala Kormir absorbing abbadon’s power. (so…potentially elder dragons are to dragons as the Gods are to humans)
2) Dragons are unknown, numerous probably if you consider wyverns…there’s the salt spray dragons, other Canthan dragons….the dragon champions are usually smaller dragons. uhhh….I’m sure there’s other dragon-like creatures (we’ve also only seen Cantha, Elona, and Tyria…and nothing is known about the rest of the continents around the globe)
3) Elder dragons have different aspects. Zhaitan was Shadow and Death. Mordremoth is Mind and Nature. We aren’t 100% sure about the other dragons (although Kralk seems to be storm and crystal) they do not. however represent the areas in which they roam around.
4) All Except for Zhaitan
5) I think part of that isn’t just lore…It’s just that he was a huge point of the meta events and that he was Zhaitan’s big bad champion so he’s more well-known.
6) mostly just speculation. We honestly don’t know much about the dragons other than they are huge…and old…and strong. Zhaitan obviously got killed. Moredremoth is called the “most destructive so far” of the elder dragons by Ogden Stonehealer.
GW1’s final expac Eye of the North set up Primordus. It doesn’t really touch on the Elder Dragons beyond that (some prequel stuff for Svanir and Drakkar as well). It just sets up what is to come later and introduces some early lore for them to build on.
As for Tequatl, we were told shortly after his re-launch we would get an explanation for his increase in power. Much like a few strands from S1, this was either dropped or forgotten about.
Most has already been answered, but here’s my take.
As for GW1, we fought dragon minions(destroyers, an icebrood, and depending on how you look at things, maybe branded), we saw Primordus and Kralkatorrik hibernating, we saw Primordus almost wake up, and we saw quite a few non-elder dragons, all of them but Glint and her kid in Cantha.
1) That’s… ambiguous. The clearest difference with the GW2 dragons is that the Elders are in charge and the others are minions. It’s loosely hinted they could replace them should the role become vacant (more on that shortly), and that possibly might mean the Elders were originally just plain dragons, but at this point it’s supposition. As for GW1 dragons… they’re possibly the same species, or at least similar, to Tequatl and such, but we don’t know. Glint is implied to be, and by extension her kid, but the Canthan dragons are only distantly implied to be linked. It’s also worth noting we’ve had a vision that suggests each Elder is an intrinsic part of the universe, suggesting they’re either replaced when they die or very bad things happen, whereas normal dragons, not so much.
2) Six Elders, by all accounts. Regular dragons… enough that there’s not much use in trying to count them, although all the ones we currently see in-game are servants to an Elder or, with HoT betas, a wyvern, which may or may not be a dragon. Zhaitan seemed to have dozens of dragons in his service, at the least, and the Canthan dragons appeared to be full species with healthy populations. There were also quite a few bone dragons marching with the orrian (but not risen, probably) undead in Kryta, but they certainly don’t seem to be around any longer.
3) Not really, but they do tend to twist the land around them into a certain way. Orr was a humid cesspit of decay, Jormag seems to have everything covered over by corrupted ice, and so on.
4) Primordus (fire), Jormag (ice), Kralkatorrik (crystal), Mordremoth (jungle), and the deep sea dragon, whose name may or may not start with an S.
5) Part of it’s probably mechanics, but as mentioned above, there’s very loose suggestion he’s sucking up Zhaitan’s energy, maybe on his way to becoming the next Elder Undead Dragon (but he is, canonically, dead now). EDIT: To expand a little, the dwarves believed, if Glint had survived long enough, she could have become an Elder by sucking up enough magic. The fact that Tequatl’s boost in power is considered lore suggests a similar process might have been happening.
6)Uncertain at this time. Most of the weapons deliberately built to exploit weaknesses have only been tested on risen. Ditto with strengths- we see similarities in how minions are made and act, but we haven’t necessarily pushed into any dragon’s territory other than Zhaitan’s… until HoT, anyway, so maybe we’ll see soon.
R.I.P., Old Man of Auld Red Wharf. Gone but never forgotten.
(edited by Aaron Ansari.1604)
1) What’s the difference between base Dragons and Elder Dragons?
In effect, we don’t rightfully know. This is mainly because we don’t know the origin of the Elder Dragons.
But as far as we know: There are only six Elder Dragons, they are ancient beings that lived over 30,000 years (and probably much, much longer), as you’ll learn in Season 2 they hold ties to the very foundation of the world. They’re also capable of corrupting other beings – which we’ve had no indication of non-Elder Dragons being capable of (unless you speak of dragon champions).
It should be noted that dragons like Tequatl, The Shatterer, Glint, Shadow of the Dragon, Claw of Jormag, etc. etc. are dragon champions, and not (necessarily) actual – originally – dragons. The Shatterer for example is a construct made in the shape of a dragon.
Dragons are a group of species of which most could be found in Cantha. Saltspray Dragons being the most prominent of them. In Tyria there was a dragon species which died out known – known to players as Bone Dragons (their zombie forms). And one can probably count the recently discovered with HoT Wyverns.
But we don’t know much about the relation – if any – between them and the Elder Dragons. Though it would not be surprising if Elder Dragons are just really old and magically powerful members of 1-6 different dragon races (such as Mordremoth being a Moss Dragon that were so common in the Echovald Forest of Cantha).
2) How many Dragons and Elder Dragons do we have?
Six Elder Dragons.
Dragons are entire species – so a lot; hundreds upon hundreds.
Unless you mean dragon champions (Tequatl, Shatterer, etc.) in which case numerous but not probably no more than a few hundred at best. I’m sure you can go into each Orr map + Arah story and count the number of dragons out there, and you’d end up with probably 30-40 or so. But no actual number has been given.
3) Do the Elder Dragons “represent” certain areas? (Khal is desert/heat, Jor is mountain/snow, Zhai is wasteland/dead…etc)
This will be brought up in Season 2.
But the non-S2 stuff is:
Primordus is Fire.
Kralkatorrik is Crystal.
Jormag is Ice.
Zhaitan is Death/Undeath.
Mordremoth is Plant.
4) Which Elder Dragons are still alive?
Primordus, Jormag, Kralkatorrik, Mordremoth, and the name-unknown-to-players deep sea dragon. Only Zhaitan is dead, as you just killed him.
5) Why is Tequatl so special? (compared to all the other dragons, he is the only mini + wing + title + metaMegaevent…)
This was part of the Season 1 storyline, which was basically “Tequatl got a power boost after Zhaitan’s death, reason unknown but related to story.” This was shown via a boost to the meta event – before he was as simple as fighting The Shatterer, not very prominent – but had nothing really told other than “he got a power boost and we don’t know why”.
Season 2 gives potential answers to it. I will not spoil for you.
And the other dragon champions have meta events to them too. They’re just not so grand because Tequatl got a rework the others didn’t (to many players’ dismay). The only reason Tequatl has the wings, mini, and title is due to the Season 1 release that buffed him.
6) Do the strengths and weaknesses vary heavily between each Elder Dragon?
While they’re all capable of corrupting the same way – except potentially Mordremoth for reasons I find annoying personally (to me, he feels different for the sole purpose of plot drama and to have a certain Season 2 spoiler you likely know about if you’ve been following HoT info but I won’t spoil anyways) – they do this corruption differently.
I’ll note right now that while most people think Zhaitan only corrupts corpses, this is not true. Throughout the game we see him corrupting – directly from his minions/champions or indirectly via artifacts – the living, the dead, plants, the land, the air, and water. Jormag is seen corrupting the same sans plants (dead, living, land, air, and water); Kralkatorrik is seen corrupting most (living, land, plants, air, and water); and Primordus is seen only corrupting land but told to us capable of corrupting living beings too.
In short: they can do the same thing.
But they do this differently. Their corruption takes different forms (fire, ice, crystal, decay, etc.), and their methods of corrupting differs (Kralkatorrik breaths on what he corrupts; Primordus forms corruption in vats of lava; Zhaitan radiates corruption; Jormag convinces people to join his side and then corrupts them).
As shown at the end of Season 2, what tactics and weaponry worked on Zhaitan and his risen don’t seem to work so well on mordrem. Just as you wouldn’t expect what works for destroying ice (icebrood) to work well in fighting molten rock (destroyers) or hardened crystals (branded).
we saw quite a few non-elder dragons, all of them but Glint and her kid in Cantha.
Rotscale and the bone dragons would disagree.
As would Shiny.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
(edited by Konig Des Todes.2086)
GW1’s final expac Eye of the North set up Primordus. It doesn’t really touch on the Elder Dragons beyond that (some prequel stuff for Svanir and Drakkar as well). It just sets up what is to come later and introduces some early lore for them to build on.
You forgot the most important one, we saw Kralky’s spine spikes!
I know other people have answered these questions but I thought I’d throw in my 2 cents.
1) Elder Dragons aren’t so much dragons as powerful forces of nature that take the form of dragons. I doubt they really have any hard science behind them biology-wise and/or they evolved from or are related to another species. However, we do have drakes in Tyria and Elona, which are relatives of the Canthan dragons, which seem to be Eastern-based dragons, such as the miniature Mythical Dragon we have in GW2. As for the dragons champions, they to probably aren’t true ‘dragons’. Now with HoT coming we’ll also have Wyverns, which are the closest we’ve seen so far to true western-style normal dragons.
2) There are 6 known Elder Dragons, Primordus, Jormag, Zhaitan, ‘Steve’, Kralkitorrak and Mordemoth. So far it seems all of them have several champions that also take the form of dragons, besides Steve, as we’ve never seen any of his champions or minions. There are numerous drakes, dragons and wyverns, we know drakes and dragons are related but we’re not sure about wyverns, its likely though.
3) Each elder dragon has its own spheres of influence or magical elements it specializes in. Primordus is Fire (and possibly Earth), Jormag is Ice (and maybe Illusion? I’d say mind but we know Mordremoth has mind), Zhaitan had Death and Shadow, Steve is probably Water, Kralkitorrak is Crystal and Air/Lightning, and finally Mordremoth is Plant/Jungle and Mind
4) All the Elder Dragons are currently alive save Zhaitan, who is defeated at the end of the personal story. Heart of Thorns is moving in on Mordremoth, and Kralkitorrak or Steve might be next.
5) Because Elder Dragons devour magic, when Zhaitan died all that magic was released. Tequatl ‘evolved’ by feeding off of that magic, and its been hinted at that if a champion devoured enough magic it could become an Elder Dragon, which Glint might’ve eventually become if she had lived. Because of this, if Tequatl hadn’t been killed he might have become the next Zhaitan.
6) We really don’t know about this one. Zhaitan was defeated by the pact fleet, not really by a specific thing that could be a weakness, so we’re not sure. Although they may be weaker against things depending on element (like fire might be more effective against Jormag or Mordremoth)
Grand Paladin Tyrux [RoFR]
Human Dragonhunter
Tarnished Coast
Human Dragonhunter
Tarnished Coast
Most of these are answered, but I wanted to throw my thoughts in.
1.
The details on what the Elder Dragons (EDs) are or how they came to be are unknown. But since it is inferred that Glint was on the verge of becoming an ED, then the ED’s are just dragons, but really old and strong. EDs also seem to act like sponges, absorbing magic from the world while awake, and then bleeding it out as they sleep.
2.
There are 6 known ED’s. Some have pointed out that its weird that 5 of the 6 (no idea where Bubbles the Deep Sea Dragon is) are located on just one continent, when we know there are two other full sized continents out there and probably more. So its possible there are other ED’s out there somewhere. As for normal dragons, a lot. Although most normal dragons seemed to be tied to an ED, glint was shown to be able to exist without that tie, and in the first game there was another full grown dragon in Cantha, and we do not yet know if it had an ED or not.
3.
It would be more accurate to say the areas themselves represent the ED, not the other way around. EDs corrupt the area around them, so the areas show the EDs elements.
4.
All of them, except for zhiatan.
5. Teq is special for three reasons. First off, the devs wanted to have a special hard fight and Teq was selected. On a more lore based note, Teq was one of zhiatans champions so he started out strong. And after Zhiatan was killed, his magic bled from his corpse and flooded the system (the world). Teq absorbed alot of this magic, and could have possibly been on his way to becoming an ED.
6.
The actual strengths and weaknesses of the Elder Dragons aren’t really known. Some of their abilities and methods are known (Primordious makes minions from rock, while zhiatan makes them from corpses, while Jormag bribes people with the promise of power, while Mordremoth grows them). Whether their actual strength differs is unknown. Plus some have been awake for longer( primordious for 200 years vs Bubbles for 50), so its unknown if their time spent awake and absorbing magic makes them stronger. Zhiatan was defeated, if I understand correctly (it wasn’t really explained in game, one of the asuran personal story missions shows a guy that build an anti dragon weapon), by poisoning/corrupting magic and then blasting zhiatan with it, he absorbed it like the sponge he was and the poison weakened/killed him.
2.
There are 6 known ED’s. Some have pointed out that its weird that 5 of the 6 (no idea where Bubbles the Deep Sea Dragon is) are located on just one continent, when we know there are two other full sized continents out there and probably more. So its possible there are other ED’s out there somewhere.
I want to address this really quick, because it’s a big discussion, but in short: everything we have tells us there’s only six. ‘Everything’, in this case, is remaining records from the jotun and dwarves, the human Scroll of the Five True Gods, and a vision we had in S2, where we see the Elder Dragons as part of ‘the All’, a cosmological model of reality. If there were more than six, we should have seen them there.
That does leave it odd that they clustered at Tyria- but not so odd given what we know of the last rising. The seers gathered up all the remaining magic, or put another way, all the remaining dragon food. We don’t yet know what triggers the dragons to fall asleep, but it doesn’t seem too surprising that most of them were in the area of the last known food when it happened.
R.I.P., Old Man of Auld Red Wharf. Gone but never forgotten.
known to players as Bone Dragons (their zombie forms). And one can probably count the recently discovered with HoT Wyverns.
Could Bone Dragons be reanimated Wyverns perhaps? Similar body shape but I get the impression Bone Dragons did have back legs
known to players as Bone Dragons (their zombie forms). And one can probably count the recently discovered with HoT Wyverns.
Could Bone Dragons be reanimated Wyverns perhaps? Similar body shape but I get the impression Bone Dragons did have back legs
No. Bone Dragons once had six limbs like typical dragons per their lore – but when they rose their strength was too great that their rotting body could not handle the stress and the back half broke off. This is why it looks like their body is incomplete – because it is.
Furthermore, even if their look was complete, their legs would be in a greatly improper place to be wyverns (and imbalanced at that).
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.