Call me a Troll if you want, but from my point of view, the Jedi are evil….no, wait! ….From my point of view, you are the Trolls, trying to force your viewpoint onto me.
With comments like this, it is hard to find evidence of you not being a troll. The Jedi are part of the Star Wars franchise not the Guild Wars Franchise, thus it seems you just saying that to try and provoke a knee-jerk response from Jedi fans. This is common behavior of a Troll.
As for the airship the players still wouldn’t get it if the Pact did contested with the Lionguard. The airship would simply disappear until another Elder Dragon acts up.
Having a “different point of view” is rather different than ignoring evidence laid in front of your nose, by the way.
evidence of what? With the exception of the mail that you guys showed me (Which doesn’t prove much other than the Lionguard’s incessant habit of forcibly deputizing people, even when outside their realm of influence), you have shown me no evidence so far other than your own interpretation of how the events transpired. Am I not allowed the same luxury? Must I agree with your interpretation of events and only your interpretation of events?
Forcibly?
You chose to assault the Aetherblade Retreat. Ergo, you chose to be deputized.
Because forcibly is really with your consent.
Sure, from a game design it may be “forcibly” but this is ArenaNet forcibly making it so that you get deputized when doing the dungeon – you can still chose not to do the dungeon. The Lionguard aren’t the one forcing you (or your character) to do anything.
And excuse me, but I have not provided my interpretation on how the events transpired. I, myself, have only provided dialogue quotes – others may have included their interpretations while also including quotes, but I haven’t. And to claim I’m doing something I’m not is rather rude, as you were earlier in this thread by doing the very same.
I wasn’t just referring to you with that post (I did say you guys), and you did talk about me ignoring ‘evidence laid infront of my nose’ when there has been 1 piece of evidence from everyone in this thread so far.
Also, seeing to what extent the Lionguard and Captain’s Council will go when deputizing people in the recent living world patch ::
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Escape_from_Lion's_Arch_(living_world)#ambient_dialogue
… something tells me that I would have been accused of being an Aetherblade supporter and hunted down by the Lionguard if I didn’t go along with that mail anyways.
Call me a Troll if you want, but from my point of view, the Jedi are evil….no, wait! ….From my point of view, you are the Trolls, trying to force your viewpoint onto me.
With comments like this, it is hard to find evidence of you not being a troll. The Jedi are part of the Star Wars franchise not the Guild Wars Franchise, thus it seems you just saying that to try and provoke a knee-jerk response from Jedi fans. This is common behavior of a Troll.
So…, I’m a troll for having a different point of view, and I’m a troll for quoting a movie too (a relevant quote too by the way). have anything else you want to add?
The line about “You’ll get executed” is (I believe it, others do to) simply to MAKE Evon play along, because everybody knows otherwise he’ll go “kitten you” and walk away and the Lionguard needs supplies now more then ever. For all his professed caring for the city and warning people, he’s more then happy to leave them to rot. I’ve seen it ingame, towards the end of the cycle he runs out with Dolyaks, and upon hearing Shud’s goal to shut down the gate after civilians get through, he charges through it with his merchandise loaded dolyaks, and shuts down the gate. He literally strands a group of civilians and Captain Shud simply to save his own hide and his merchandise.
So basically “Tell him about his new job, if he refuses, pull that line.”
edit: Hell, if the Captains Council did have a meeting before splitting across the camps, I wouldn’t be surprised if Shud had brought that up and it was harsher then normal simply because they were sick of Evon’s badmouthing and stranding them and others in need.
Also, that wasn’t when LA was in ruins with clouds of Miasma killing chunks of the population.
I wasn’t just referring to you with that post
Well you did quote just me.
you did talk about me ignoring ‘evidence laid infront of my nose’
I never denied this.
Also, seeing to what extent the Lionguard and Captain’s Council will go when deputizing people in the recent living world patch ::
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Escape_from_Lion's_Arch_(living_world)#ambient_dialogue… something tells me that I would have been accused of being an Aetherblade supporter and hunted down by the Lionguard if I didn’t go along with that mail anyways.
Are you referring to Evon Gnashblade? That’s rather different, given how they sought him out, while us players were not. Not to mention Kiel and Evon are bitter rivals – I kind of view that as Kiel abusing her power in times of need – which Aetherblade Retreat, was not. And Evon would only be shot because he’s already been deputized (against his will; while we were with our will).
You’re comparing two completely different scenarios.
And keep in mind that the dialogues happening in the open world technically happen after the escort events. Just as the Marionette event only happened once in lore. Thus, Kiel’s forcibly deputizing Evon is after he took his merchandise through the last active asura gate in the city and shut it down before civilians can get through, effectively abandoning the entire city and subsequently going on “I told you all!” BS-ranting.
So…, I’m a troll for having a different point of view, and I’m a troll for quoting a movie too (a relevant quote too by the way). have anything else you want to add?
That’s not what he was saying at all.
No one – not a single person – is calling you a troll because of your point of view. It’s how you’re handling the argument which is the reason why you’re being called a troll. Your arguing in a fashion similar to how a troll does.
I wasn’t just referring to you with that post
Well you did quote just me.
I’m sorry, allow me to quote every relevant post, so you know who exactly I was talking to.
People seem to miss the fact Kiel didn’t claim the Airship. Magnus did. Which mean contesting it would involve the Lionguard and maybe even the Captain’s council.
The amount of hassle that would create would be way too much when as a Pact commander you could find an airship that isn’t currently on a mission and request them to help you out with whatever.
Which is entirely what LA would say. “Go boss around one of your own airships. We are claiming this for LA.”
Also… this quote/mail
Sigh…
“<Character name>,
The Aetherblade scoundrels have a base inside Lion’s Arch! I need deputies for a raid on their hideout. Consider yourself deputized. Head to the base of the waterfall at Diverse Ledges as soon as you can.
—Lionguard Inspector Ellen Kiel"
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dragon_Bash_mail
You were an acting deputy of the Lionguard. Why you accepted the role is your own business, but while raiding that base that was the part you were playing.
In reality, by charging in their with Kiel, you were acting as a lionguard deputy. Which means all your effort was also “Lionguard effort”.
Ellen Kiel worked really hard, all the way until we got to this dungeon, because she did nothing, as I said. so….nope.
She did nothing? She was ressing my one PUG all the time, so she was doing more than half of the work. Pfft, besides what do I need with a starship . . . I mean, airship? Could you imagine the repair bills, the upkeep costs, the Consortium insurance bills? No thanks, let her have the headache.
Its also the kind of quality that got Lions Arch destroyed apparently, because her inspiring words could do nothing to save the city. That, or she is lying. so….nope.
Of course her inspiring words didn’t help. Captain Evon kept saying she was full of crap right up until he started “Kiel didn’t do anything to save you but I warned everyone about this” . . . not only that but all his supporters kept saying she was a lying liar who lied and unfit for the council, so really . . .
Does it surprise you the Council basically said “yeah, they don’t trust you so we should?” . . .
Magnus is making a political play that probably has nothing to do with Kiel anyways, so much as spreading his influence?…yeah, lets go with that one.
At least his heart is in the right place. “Fort Marriner has never fallen under my watch and it isn’t going to now!” Of course, that miasma, it’s a killer. Someone needs to do something about that air quality in LA.
Because he had known Ellen for years, and we’re just adventures who breeze through every once in a while? Because it was Ellen’s initiative that got us to do the heavy lifting, and that is precisely the kind of quality you’re looking for in a member of a ruling council? Because Ellen has worked hard all her life for the good of the city, and we pule like spoiled brats if we aren’t paid every time we lift a finger? Because we’re already second in command of the organization that invented the airship? Because only King Solomon would suggest cutting an airship into five parts? Take your pick.
Sigh…
“<Character name>,
The Aetherblade scoundrels have a base inside Lion’s Arch! I need deputies for a raid on their hideout. Consider yourself deputized. Head to the base of the waterfall at Diverse Ledges as soon as you can.
—Lionguard Inspector Ellen Kiel"
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dragon_Bash_mail
You were an acting deputy of the Lionguard. Why you accepted the role is your own business, but while raiding that base that was the part you were playing.
(to be continued…)
(Continued…)
However, I do not see any hypocrisy in her lines – nor any contradiction. Kiel did not commandeer the Aetherblade ship for herself. Magnus did, and then gave it to Kiel. For all Kiel (or us, for that matter) know, Magnus worked out a deal with the Pact behind the scenes.
Which is yet another inconsistency. Maybe Magnus held the Pact at gunpoint, knowing they were weakened after fighting an Elder Dragon, and wouldn’t argue about losing one of their airships to the future reindeer….I mean…political games.
How is that an inconsistency? First off, as has been mentioned before, that airship might not even belong to the Pact. However, even if it did, they literally have dozens of them, and no real immediate need or even use for more. Seeing as their whole ideal is bringing the military forces of Tyria together, why in the name of all Six Gods do you insist that they should fight over, or even begrudge, their closest non-order military allies keeping a single airship that they recovered at their own risk?
You mean, at Our Own Risk.
We were there on behalf of, and therefore as agents of, the Lionguard.
However, I do not see any hypocrisy in her lines – nor any contradiction. Kiel did not commandeer the Aetherblade ship for herself. Magnus did, and then gave it to Kiel. For all Kiel (or us, for that matter) know, Magnus worked out a deal with the Pact behind the scenes.
Which is yet another inconsistency. Maybe Magnus held the Pact at gunpoint, knowing they were weakened after fighting an Elder Dragon, and wouldn’t argue about losing one of their airships to the future reindeer….I mean…political games.
How is that an inconsistency? First off, as has been mentioned before, that airship might not even belong to the Pact. However, even if it did, they literally have dozens of them, and no real immediate need or even use for more. Seeing as their whole ideal is bringing the military forces of Tyria together, why in the name of all Six Gods do you insist that they should fight over, or even begrudge, their closest non-order military allies keeping a single airship that they recovered at their own risk?
There… better? (not that its in any particular order)
Also, seeing to what extent the Lionguard and Captain’s Council will go when deputizing people in the recent living world patch ::
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Escape_from_Lion's_Arch_(living_world)#ambient_dialogue… something tells me that I would have been accused of being an Aetherblade supporter and hunted down by the Lionguard if I didn’t go along with that mail anyways.
Are you referring to Evon Gnashblade? That’s rather different, given how they sought him out, while us players were not. Not to mention Kiel and Evon are bitter rivals – I kind of view that as Kiel abusing her power in times of need – which Aetherblade Retreat, was not. And Evon would only be shot because he’s already been deputized (against his will; while we were with our will).
You’re comparing two completely different scenarios.
And keep in mind that the dialogues happening in the open world technically happen after the escort events. Just as the Marionette event only happened once in lore. Thus, Kiel’s forcibly deputizing Evon is after he took his merchandise through the last active asura gate in the city and shut it down before civilians can get through, effectively abandoning the entire city and subsequently going on “I told you all!” BS-ranting.
It still sets a precedent that makes me think about what could have happened if there was an option to ignore Kiel and see ingame consequences of that action. (…Maybe the gift Scarlet sent me wouldn’t have blown up in my face?)
(edited by Chrispy.5641)
Also, seeing to what extent the Lionguard and Captain’s Council will go when deputizing people in the recent living world patch ::
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Escape_from_Lion's_Arch_(living_world)#ambient_dialogue… something tells me that I would have been accused of being an Aetherblade supporter and hunted down by the Lionguard if I didn’t go along with that mail anyways.
Are you referring to Evon Gnashblade? That’s rather different, given how they sought him out, while us players were not. Not to mention Kiel and Evon are bitter rivals – I kind of view that as Kiel abusing her power in times of need – which Aetherblade Retreat, was not. And Evon would only be shot because he’s already been deputized (against his will; while we were with our will).
You’re comparing two completely different scenarios.
And keep in mind that the dialogues happening in the open world technically happen after the escort events. Just as the Marionette event only happened once in lore. Thus, Kiel’s forcibly deputizing Evon is after he took his merchandise through the last active asura gate in the city and shut it down before civilians can get through, effectively abandoning the entire city and subsequently going on “I told you all!” BS-ranting.
It still sets a precedent that makes me think about what could have happened if there was an option to ignore Kiel and see ingame consequences of that action. (…Maybe the gift Scarlet sent me wouldn’t have blown up in my face?)
I think you might be missing some context to Evon’s conscription? He’s probably the biggest arms dealer in Lion’s Arch and most of the Liongaurd’s armories were probably destroyed or occupied when Scarlet and her allies attacked. It seemed like a more practical than political action on Kiel’s part (although I wouldn’t rule out that the council made a more directed focus on him due to his actions at the asura gates) so why would she bother hunting you down? It would be far more effective to just assault the Aetherblade hideout with a Liongaurd force than to spend man-power to hunt down a single adventurer that’s out of Lion’s Arch’s jurisdiction.
Also Scarlet being Scarlet, yeah it would have still exploded.
(edited by Xase.5064)
There’s also the bit about, you know, Evon actively stirring up malcontent in the refugee camps. Going as he was, he could have started a riot, one that would benefit no one but his public image. Conscription was really the only way to stop him without driving him out or declaring him a criminal. He ought to be thankful it came to this.
There’s also the bit about, you know, Evon actively stirring up malcontent in the refugee camps. Going as he was, he could have started a riot, one that would benefit no one but his public image. Conscription was really the only way to stop him without driving him out or declaring him a criminal. He ought to be thankful it came to this.
Hey! He’s a politician and a businessman. A dirty, crooked, greedy person that doesn’t care anything at all for a life, but atleast he doesn’t try to hide everything about him behind a wall….like pretty much every actual person in power in Lions Arch does.
So…, I’m a troll for having a different point of view, and I’m a troll for quoting a movie too (a relevant quote too by the way). have anything else you want to add?
That’s not what he was saying at all.
No one – not a single person – is calling you a troll because of your point of view. It’s how you’re handling the argument which is the reason why you’re being called a troll. Your arguing in a fashion similar to how a troll does.
I think that for the fact that there is exactly 1 whole person on my side of the argument, I am handling myself pretty well.
There’s also the bit about, you know, Evon actively stirring up malcontent in the refugee camps. Going as he was, he could have started a riot, one that would benefit no one but his public image. Conscription was really the only way to stop him without driving him out or declaring him a criminal. He ought to be thankful it came to this.
Hey! He’s a politician and a businessman. A dirty, crooked, greedy person that doesn’t care anything at all for a life, but atleast he doesn’t try to hide everything about him behind a wall….like pretty much every actual person in power in Lions Arch does.
He’s shady, he’s a politician yes, but when his bashing revolves around “All of your neighbors and loved ones are dead because THEY REFUSED TO LISTEN TO ME.”, his stunt at the gate leads to possible rioting. I mean, imagine if one of those few civilians walked by and then went “Hey, I remember you, at the gate you shut it off before anybody else could get through! I saw a number of people killed trying to reach another exit!”
The forced to supply Lionguard Is most likely the council getting back at him for both the bashing and stranding a number of civilians as well as Captain Shud in the middle of LA.
And frankly, in this situation, I’d rather see “This man is helping the Lionguard retake the city and avenge our fallen!” then “That man left a number of people and a Captain of the council to die in the center of town, and now is bashing them and accusing them of all the deaths. Hypocrite!”
There’s also the bit about, you know, Evon actively stirring up malcontent in the refugee camps. Going as he was, he could have started a riot, one that would benefit no one but his public image. Conscription was really the only way to stop him without driving him out or declaring him a criminal. He ought to be thankful it came to this.
Hey! He’s a politician and a businessman. A dirty, crooked, greedy person that doesn’t care anything at all for a life, but atleast he doesn’t try to hide everything about him behind a wall….like pretty much every actual person in power in Lions Arch does.
He’s shady, he’s a politician yes, but when his bashing revolves around “All of your neighbors and loved ones are dead because THEY REFUSED TO LISTEN TO ME.”, his stunt at the gate leads to possible rioting. I mean, imagine if one of those few civilians walked by and then went “Hey, I remember you, at the gate you shut it off before anybody else could get through! I saw a number of people killed trying to reach another exit!”
The forced to supply Lionguard Is most likely the council getting back at him for both the bashing and stranding a number of civilians as well as Captain Shud in the middle of LA.
And frankly, in this situation, I’d rather see “This man is helping the Lionguard retake the city and avenge our fallen!” then “That man left a number of people and a Captain of the council to die in the center of town, and now is bashing them and accusing them of all the deaths. Hypocrite!”
Now with the Council forcing Evon to help, they just opened the possibility of Evon being the good guy in all of this, if he can spin it right. And with the assumption/fact that the Captain’s Council, the actual ruling body did little to nothing to prepare Lion’s Arch for the attack, they don’t really have much in the way of credibility themselves, atleast no more than any other ex-pirate would.
I still see Evon Gnashblade coming out of this in a stronger position than he was before, and pretty much everyone else in a weaker position than before this started(except maybe the lionguard, and that’s if they all didn’t die getting the civilians out of the city)
I don’t mind if Evon comes out ahead in this, just so long as he does it by helping the city. To be honest I anticipate that he’ll get Peter’s seat on the Council… which would be disappointing, but might be for the best.
I’m sorry, allow me to quote every relevant post, so you know who exactly I was talking to.
Way to take my comment out of context, buddyboy. You don’t even need to quote to denote who you’re responding to. In your case, simply not quoting anyone would have made it more general.
And your means of responding to that only furthers the argument that you’re a troll. Because that’s how trolls respond.
It still sets a precedent that makes me think about what could have happened if there was an option to ignore Kiel and see ingame consequences of that action. (…Maybe the gift Scarlet sent me wouldn’t have blown up in my face?)
Except that during Sky Pirates, Lion’s Arch wasn’t in such a state of emergency in which:
Even if we ignored the call, we were – to Kiel’s eyes – people who had no affiliation or reason to assist Kiel (being Commanders of the Pact, our job is to stop dragons not local terrorist threats – we just stop local terrorist threats as a hobby). And even then, we already assisted her during the investigation and finding out Mai Trin. She already owed us and wouldn’t have found the base without us. She’s a pirate, but she’s not unreasonable.
I still see Evon Gnashblade coming out of this in a stronger position than he was before, and pretty much everyone else in a weaker position than before this started(except maybe the lionguard, and that’s if they all didn’t die getting the civilians out of the city)
This, I would agree. Not many will take note of him abandoning civilians because he got conscripted and followed orders in order to not be outlawed.
I would not be surprised if Kiel, Magnus, and Evon end up being the top dog celebrities of Lion’s Arch after this. Aside from “he who killed Scarlet.”
Personally, I would rather have him on the council than half of those who are on it. He may be a dirty backstabber, but from what I recall reading, if he was elected then LA’s defenses would have been boosted. So he’d actually be doing something unlike, say, Hao Len who owns the banking of LA.
I would not be surprised if Kiel, Magnus, and Evon end up being the top dog celebrities of Lion’s Arch after this. Aside from “he who killed Scarlet.”
I would give Captain Shud a lot credit as well. She didn’t do anything flashy, but she stayed behind to man the Asura gate to evacuate civilians. Not to mention, she made sure to take the gates leading to the other cities offline, so Scarlet couldn’t use them. Which I’m sure the other cities’ leaders are grateful for.
If Peter is MIA/dead, and the council holds a vote on next member (Which I believe is how it was stated, the Evon vs Kiel election was purely for trade agreement and whoever won that got the seat), I don’t see Evon getting in easily or smoothly.
Kiel and Magnus likely aren’t going to be fans of him with the bashing, and Shud may hold a grudge at his closing the gate in her face and several civilian’s faces.
If Peter is MIA/dead, and the council holds a vote on next member (Which I believe is how it was stated, the Evon vs Kiel election was purely for trade agreement and whoever won that got the seat), I don’t see Evon getting in easily or smoothly.
Kiel and Magnus likely aren’t going to be fans of him with the bashing, and Shud may hold a grudge at his closing the gate in her face and several civilian’s faces.
While that is true, he was the only other person really in the running during the last vacancy, and we haven’t seen any other citizens come to the fore of the Lion’s Arch community since then. Unless they pull a new character out of the blue (sadly not outside the realm of possibility), Evon is really the only choice.
If Peter is MIA/dead, and the council holds a vote on next member (Which I believe is how it was stated, the Evon vs Kiel election was purely for trade agreement and whoever won that got the seat), I don’t see Evon getting in easily or smoothly.
Kiel and Magnus likely aren’t going to be fans of him with the bashing, and Shud may hold a grudge at his closing the gate in her face and several civilian’s faces.
While that is true, he was the only other person really in the running during the last vacancy, and we haven’t seen any other citizens come to the fore of the Lion’s Arch community since then. Unless they pull a new character out of the blue (sadly not outside the realm of possibility), Evon is really the only choice.
What about Lionguard Thurma? from Southsun and the Aetherblade TA path? She’s in the lionguard tents in bloodtide near the south entrance to LA.
I could see post-attack them wanting to promote another Lionguard to the spot, to better help defenses. Of course, unless we see another major LA person (Maybe not to us, but to LA) come forth… Evon is one of the candidates.
Odgen’s Hammer savings guy for council?
Or… Hero-tron for Council, acting as Evon’s puppet!
To be a member of the Captain’s Council, one must be a captain of a ship, with their own crew and sea-worthy ship (or airship, as recently adapted since the Pact’s formation).
Neither Turma nor o-Tron (god I hope that golem goes the way of the dozen+ named NPCs in the Orrian personal story…) has any of the three statuses. They aren’t qualified to be on the Council.
I dunno, Turma always seemed to have a kind of bloodthirsty vibe to her. I don’t know that she’d want the seat, and even if she did she’d need a ship and money. I suppose Magnus could sponsor her too, but to my knowledge there’s no particularly close tie between them.
(Zommoros for Council! We’ve certainly fed him enough mats to build a ship, and maybe a crew too)
Shhhhhhhhhhhh Konig I was joking andaddingnothingofsubstancetothisdiscussion. Didn’t you hit my drama button. ;(
But yeah seriously speaking I don’t think either that we have any likely candidate beside Captain Evon Gnashblade.
Suwash for Captain’s Council.
Or Mai Trin. She actually got things done!
While that is true, he was the only other person really in the running during the last vacancy, and we haven’t seen any other citizens come to the fore of the Lion’s Arch community since then. Unless they pull a new character out of the blue (sadly not outside the realm of possibility), Evon is really the only choice.
Why do I suddenly get the bad feeling there is going to be at least one person who is going to ask Anet to nominate a Quaggan for the council?
The irony of that post, Darkbattlemage, is quite humorous given the one directly above it.
The irony of that post, Darkbattlemage, is quite humorous given the one directly above it.
I just noticed the post after I hit reply, had to look up who Suwash was since I don’t know that many Quaggan npcs from memory.
Or… Hero-tron for Council, acting as Evon’s puppet!
…actualy, I would be totally okay with that!!!
I’m literally cackling at the pure gold that is the content of this thread. I did all the work I deserve candy! Gimme candyyyy!!!!
(edited by Syryn.7591)
Actually, there is no Sylvari member of the Captain’s Council, to my knowledge. This must be addressed. Sareb for Captain’s Council! (And I could see Evon sponsoring her, if he’s currently unpopular with the Council for various reasons.)
Actually, there is no Sylvari member of the Captain’s Council, to my knowledge. This must be addressed. Sareb for Captain’s Council! (And I could see Evon sponsoring her, if he’s currently unpopular with the Council for various reasons.)
… huh. Y’know, I don’t think I saw Sareb in any of the camps. She might be dead.
Yeah, I’ve considered that possibility too. However, it’s possible that some of the LA NPCs may have been taken captive and brought to the Breachmaker (for whatever reason. Maybe Scarlet wants more soup?) We may possibly run into Sareb (and maybe Raisin Face and Squooshed Face) in this week’s update.
You seem to play games to be important and the center of attention. If you can’t tolerate following a story without taking all the glory, then this game is simply not for you.
I guess I am amazed that still at this day, some players complain that the game world of an MMORPG (GW2 is an MMORPG) does not revolve around them, even from a lore’s standpoint.
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