Guild Wars 2

Just wanted to share the lores of the mini dungeons in fractals and ask for ideas. First of all, it is known that the events you go through have eitehr happened in history or are going to happen. And they dont have to be in tyria. You enter the fractals with the help of an asura named Dessa, where you meet in her lab due to a malfunctioning asura gate that was suppose to lead to to a paradise. Alright. Lets get into it. BTW if i make any mistakes, please do correct me.

First dungeon – One where you take ascalon. In this dungeon you are turned into a flame legion charr and have to go through WvW like events to take over ascalon. This is obviusly a tyrian event, which happeneed in the past.

Next – Raving Asura. You seem to be teleported to the future of rata sum, and you do a jumping puzzle up to a raving asura (seems to have gone mad). During this time, Dessas seems worried and excuses herself elswhere. When you defeat what the raving asura throws at you, he says you cant be real, because everyone is gone then carries off. Could the asura be related to Dessa in any way? Appparently there was a relationship between 2 asuras, though i think its not them, but could it be that the raving asura was a friend or closer than to dessa, and in the future something horrible in their research happened causing everyone except for him to die?

Any thoughts guys?

More coming soooon

I believe the Charr-dungeon is actually taking place a few minutes before the Foefire. Dessas reaction after killing the boss does imply that it is about to happen.

As for the Raving Asura I think that might be the “future self” from the Asura Personal Quest (the one responsible for the Steam Creatures)

lordkrall.7241:

I believe the Charr-dungeon is actually taking place a few minutes before the Foefire. Dessas reaction after killing the boss does imply that it is about to happen.

As for the Raving Asura I think that might be the “future self” from the Asura Personal Quest (the one responsible for the Steam Creatures)

Sorrry my mistake for teh charr i just wanted to get this out quickly and see what other people think. As for the asura the one responsible was indeed ‘you’, but you defeated him and also you did not act to evil in the future. Even if you did not choose that story line, it is proven that all the stories still exist but someone eelse goes through them. So thats my opinion idk

The ‘unidentified fractal’ is obviously some sort of ‘possible’ future for Rata Sum. I think the reason why Dessa is freaked out is less because of a personal connection, but more because it would be shocking to see your home in an apocalyptic landscape. Of course, my comment has no real merit since I haven’t completed this one

Am i only one who finds that raving asura reminiscent of goemm the mad?

I agree that the ascalon part is ascalon city just before the foefire. You breach the gate and the asura tells you of a great disturbance comming your way. I also think the asura fragment is Rata Sum in the future. But just the future not a different reallity. I would recomment you to watch the post of woodenpotatoes on youtube. He talks about this a lot.

Kevoros.2946:

First of all, it is known that the events you go through have eitehr happened in history or are going to happen.

Not necessarily. Some are, of course, mimicries of past events or future events, but not everything in the Mists is a copy of something else.

Kevoros.2946:

Next – Raving Asura. You seem to be teleported to the future of rata sum, and you do a jumping puzzle up to a raving asura (seems to have gone mad). During this time, Dessas seems worried and excuses herself elswhere. When you defeat what the raving asura throws at you, he says you cant be real, because everyone is gone then carries off. Could the asura be related to Dessa in any way?

I do not think there’s a tie between Dessa and the asura. She leaves because the wrecked place is Rata Sum. It’s a post apocalyptic view of her species.

That’d freak any (sane) person.

lordkrall.7241:

I believe the Charr-dungeon is actually taking place a few minutes before the Foefire. Dessas reaction after killing the boss does imply that it is about to happen.

Except:
1) That looks nothing like Ascalon City, even in GW2.
2) The Flame Legion never made it that far into Ascalon City, based on first-hand witnesses accounts (the Fireshadow warband who were watching from the Viewing Hill).
3) When the Foefire happened, the soldiers all fled. No fleeing soldiers can be found here.
4) If this was the Foefire event, Anet did a massive screw up by not showing it.

lordkrall.7241:

As for the Raving Asura I think that might be the “future self” from the Asura Personal Quest (the one responsible for the Steam Creatures)

Extremely unlikely.

Firstly, there are a multitude of futures. The Grand Sovereign figure that is a possible future version of the asura PC won’t exist in all of them. Secondly, unless that asura mimics the appearance of any asura in the dungeon, that’s even more so to be unlikely.

It’s likely just a survivor of Rata Sum’s destruction, which is simply one of many possible futures.

I have to agree about the idea that the battle scenario is not about the taking of Ascalon City. As Konig said, the place looked nothing like Ascalon City! By that point in time Ascalon City was nothing more than the dried up river basin, all the buildings and such were burned out husks. And the layout of the town is nothing comparative to any Ascalonian City that I have seen, or remember.

I wish the Devs we learn a little more about fractals, or that crosses a NPC who explains or is it etc …
We know what is happening around us!

The charr battle could easily have been in some other Ascalonian city, or even Ascalon City itself: after all, not everything is the Mists is an exact copy of history. This could be an alternate history, or even an alternate future where the searing never happened… The possibilities are endless.

Also, at the beginning you start that fractal in an Ash Legion tent – there was already a rebellion against the Flame Legion at this point, so that seems out of place. However, the war with the charr has been going on for 1,200 years more or less, so there’s a huge span for when that could be taking place.

I haven’t played that one fully, but is it very off to suggest it’s part of the searing?

Well, if I remember right, there is a decent amount of grass and such still around on the ground, because of this one would believe that this was before the searing or long enough afterwards that life started growing back in the region. I would say it was a pre-searing invasion of perhaps a city north of the wall. I have trouble believing that it could be an insurgence against the flame legion just because of the fact that I was fighting alongside a group of veteran flame legion guys the whole fight.

I don’t think anyone argued it’s an insurgence against the Flame Legion.

Rather, we’re Flame Legion outselves, but we have hints of Ash Legion aiding us (the Flame Legion). So that implies it’s prior to Eye of the North.

Sorry, I misread your last post, reading it as the whole thing was an insurgence against the flame legion as opposed to just during the point in time after the Eye of the North. But, for those who claim it is closer to the time of the foe-fire (Noting that we haven’t technically seen Ascalon since the beginning of the game, because locations are trapped in time), we could say that this is after the flame legion got the Claw of Kahn Ur and wrangled some control over the other legions for a short period of time.

Is the great northern wall thingumie visible? I hadn’t thought to look until now (while I’m at work). It could be a clue, assuming the map orientation in the fractal matters at all. If it’s to the south, the battle could be one leading up to the searing. If it’s north and close by, this could be Ascalon City. If it’s not there at all, the battle could be far to the south of the wall and be one of the last villages to fall during or shortly after the searing.

The Great Northern Wall is visible in that Fractal (see attached image), but it is also in its ruin-like state, suggesting that The Searing has already taken place.

Assuming that the map orientation of this area is wrong, the Charr are in fact attacking Southwards, meaning that they and the defending city are South of the GNW.
Now from what those of us who know what Ascalon City originally looked like in GW1 and what a GW2 rendition of the same place might look like, we can safely say this is not Ascalon City.

I highly suspect this Fractal (assuming it is based on historical events, past or future) to be of the Charr attack on the city of Rin, and that the great disturbance mentioned by Dessa is Rurik arriving with Stormcaller, about to devastate the invading Charr.

Ah! Good call. I forgot all about the whole Stormcaller thing. I know, it’s only the first 1/8 of Prophecies.

It’s not like pre-searing Ascalon city was well detailed. If the tiny area you could walk around was actually, literally all of Ascalon, then it was by no means was one of Tyria’s (the continent (I’m so glad we don’t have a continent called Earth)) 3 greatest cities. Just as LA back then and DR now have all sorts of little filler buildings all over, I assume there was much more to Ascalon than what we saw.

Well the Ascalon City that we saw in Guild Wars 1 was more of an encampment than anything else. It was mostly tents used to make use of the most defensible area left in the region. I mean the wall around the old Ascalon City to the south was ruined to the point of you being able to walk right over it, thus they chose a small place with 1 or two major choke points to use to defend those left. I do have a feeling that eventually the humans would have expanded back out to the remains of the old city and repair the wall/rebuild houses. I mean this would almost be necessary if they wanted to mount a proper defense. It is just that when we saw Ascalon City it was merely two years after their world was literally blown apart. They just hadn’t had the time at all to recuperate.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

I don’t think anyone argued it’s an insurgence against the Flame Legion.

Rather, we’re Flame Legion outselves, but we have hints of Ash Legion aiding us (the Flame Legion). So that implies it’s prior to Eye of the North.

I wouldn’t say that alone is reason to place it before Eye of the North. Pyre’s activities started the glimmerings of rebellion, but the majority of the other three legions were still behind the Flame until after the Foefire – it’s unclear whether this is because it took that long for the rebels to build up enough support, or whether the other legions had already decided to overflow the Flame but decided that it was better to wait until after they’d consolidated in Ascalon before starting a civil war. Given that the Battle of Golghein happened four years after the Black Citadel was established, though, I’d suspect at least a little of the former – the other legions regarded making sure they had a tight grip on Ascalon more important than overthrowing the Shamans.

Well because of the state of the Great Northern Wall in this instance, and the amount of greenery that had returned to the land, I get the feeling that is has to be some time after the Eye of the North. More than likely this is just one of the battles they had to fight to prepare for the Invasion of Ascalon.

Konig is right, but perhaps the Ascalonian battle is from the Segway between Pre-Searing and player involvement. If I recall right, 3 years have passed between that time; also, the development of cities in GW1 were much smaller than any other city in GW2, heck Ebonhawk is way larger then Ascalon.

Also, comment above me makes sense too.

I was kinda thinking that the Uncategorized Fractal is Rata Sum somewhere in the past where the Asura made a bad call while building said city. And… the Raving Asura is somehow related to Dessa. I’unno. :S

sevtrisen.5247:

I was kinda thinking that the Uncategorized Fractal is Rata Sum somewhere in the past where the Asura made a bad call while building said city. And… the Raving Asura is somehow related to Dessa. I’unno. :S

Dunno why you’d think it was in the past; the city fundamentally looks like it does today, except of course that the entire trade core and council section has been completely destroyed and dynamics has come adrift form the rest of the structure(The uncategorised fractal specifically takes place in the dynamics college and the decks immediately below it)

In his ramblings the survivor says something about a breach – lot of possible meanings though; structurally breached by an attack? An experiment gone awry? Containment failiure of the power systems?

I actually felt sad at the uncategorised fractal conclusion when i realised its Rata Sum in the future. It felt so desolate ( apart from the darn harpies). The raving asura creating the golems for companionship. But i think this is just one of the possible future in the mist. I don’t think Dessa had any direct connection to this but she probably is concerned that such a future exist for Rata Sum. Maybe she left to get more detailed data on this fractal.

The battlefield feels like it was during gw1 to me since the flame legion is assaulting a Ascalonian city. But i think that it is a siege that actually failed. Without the players, the charr couldn’t actually breech the gate.

A-Net has a very strong interest in story (most of the main storyline aside, unfortunately) and we should keep in mind that with A-Net, larger storylines are often crafted from smallers ones on the fly, but also that A-Net isn’t a stranger to throwing out the pieces and slowly putting it together in front of us. I feel the uncategorized fractal is very obviously part of a larger overall story, one that connects Dessa’s origin, her ‘boyfriend’ (I can’t get over that, haha), the consortium, and the fractal itself.

So what do we know? Here are the facts, along with some reasonable extrapolations in my opinion:
- Dessa is an Asura who comes from a Tyria (probably ours) during a time between the end of GW1 and several years prior to the beginning of GW2. The evidence for this is her reference to Lion’s Arch as a pirate city, which was only ever true during the intervening time between games. We think she isn’t from the future, as she uses older model golems and for sanity’s sake we’ll rule out some kind of retro-futurism.

- Dessa is disturbed by the events of the uncategorized fractal, and noticeably has to pull herself together through the events. She maintains a cool disassociation during the fractal, a tone that is missing from all other fractals. Clearly she is avoiding something, that isn’t entirely common to Asura, especially Krewe leaders.

- Dessa, at some point, loses a loved one because of events set in motion by the Consortium. We also know the Consortium has kept an eye on her, and for some reason has opened a portal to her lab in the mists. Dessa is under the assumption that she is receiving official aid, and is not aware that it is through the Consortium. It could be that the Consortium wishes to use Dessa’s research to make a killing in the vacation market, who wouldn’t want a vacation to an infinite variety of exotic locales located just steps from home…

- Within the uncategorized fractal itself we encounter a large Asuran ruin, filled with old-model golems modified into companion pets by a male Asura who is clearly suffering from some sort of mental debility and it is very strongly suggested that it was brought on by extended solitude. He even goes so far as to disbelieve the existence of our heroes as they fight his catbots. He references some sort of accident, using words such as screaming, falling, etc.

Now, with this information I’d like to make a guess:

First, the raving asura is someone close to Dessa, possibly a former Krewe member but more likely her lost boyfriend. Something happened to him, likely a mishap with the Mistlock device (I’m assuming the mistlock is the name of the machine Dessa uses to lock on to fractals) which ejected him into an unknown fractal. Did the Consortium push him into testing the limits of the device in their avarice? She does hint that the Consortium led him to his fate, suggesting that she was not the decider in that scenario. Now, to me this is a very good start but it also raises an interesting question: Why doesn’t Dessa request a rescue, no matter how insane he is wouldn’t she want him back? The entire theory kind of falls apart under that light. Tentatively, we could say that the accident locked him into the fractal as a disturbance, and we all know how disturbances need to be handled, unfortunately. Could we be extracted before the full execution of our duties to save the life of a loved one Dessa can no longer reach? In this scenario, the actual location of the fractal is secondary to the inhabitants, it could be this was Rata Sum years after some cataclysm, but there simply isn’t enough info yet, and to me that question starts getting answered by answering the ones we have already. I’m sure we’ll be revisiting this fractal again in the future.

If there were a giant horn near the ascalonian city we could confirm it’s Rin.
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/File:Rin_in_Ruin.jpg

I will like to add in my 2 copper worth on raving asura, can be a far stretch. (Warning : Wall of Text)

Assumptions: 1. One part of Order of Whisper’s storyline ‘Magic Sucks’ http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magic_Sucks suggests asura krewe can have more than one facility to carry out their research, and can use teleportation to travel between facilities.
2. The existence of Inquest in Arcane council more or less suggests asura prefer results to ethics. So they may have this tendency to trade moral for glory.
3. At Pearl Islet, Southsun Cove, an asuran gate is being constructed by golems, without an asura supervising nearby. It’s odd to me because I always see an asura within a stone throw from every gate, so:
i) golems can be programmed to perform elaborate task without supervision
ii) the human consortium representative is probably an onlooker who is interested with the gate, or probably being on covert espionage mission to steal gate technology for consortium.
4. There is this thing call ‘hidden folder’, where we put our err…. ‘controversial’ treasures in it and keep it away from plain sight. You can’t see this folder doesn’t mean you can’t access it.

Now, my far-fetch theory:
1. As ‘Uncategorised Fractal’ namesake suggests, this fractal is deliberately left unnamed because it may be intended to stay hidden from public eyes, just like the hidden folders. As a researcher on probably controversial subjects, a private pocket universe with limited point of entry, isolated from jurisdictions and prying eyes, is a like a paradise.
2. The 4 prisoners in first room are most likely to be subjects captured (probably from real world) for further experimentation. They do not show signs of dragon’s influence, so I can safely assume the experiments are most likely nothing to do with dragons, and most likely not to approval of Arcane Council. Furthermore the 4 do not show sign that they have been neglected for a long period of time, so either they are clones or they are captured recently. Therefore this fractal has been accessed shortly before set up of Lion’s Arch’s portal.
3. The working golems share cat-like theme (whiskers, dat ears & ‘meows’), so it is most likely the idea of krewe chief instead of apprentices. If Anet is playing stereotype card in this story, I will assume the chief is a female, as women are usually associated with dressing things up cutely in pop culture. A hidden area is usually info privy to top level personnel, so I assume Dessa is the krewe chief of the raving asura, probably from an earlier project. As shown by golems at Pearl Islet, the building itself may not be the Rata Sum, but a replica, constructed by golems and is intended to be a floating private lab However the whole building collapsed from sky onto harpies nest, thus parts of the building seem splatter around like it is crashing down hard, based on what I observe during the cinematic.
4. Dessa once mentioned she lost her boyfriend to consortium due to ‘financial machination’ and advise player not to avail themselves to consortium. In Lostshore event, the scavenger hunts reveal consortium has funded covert expeditions to uncharted regions, while Dessa is surprised her fractal hub is accessed from a new location, meaning consortium has been supporting Dessa from elsewhere before setting up a portal at Lion’s Arch. She might have diverted some resources from consortium to construct the failed lab. A suggestion why Dessa has to abandon this fractal & the raving asura – if this fractal is being revealed to consortium, Dessa will lose her funding. Launching a rescue operation may be too resource intensive and subject to risk of exposure. Dessa has to make a choice then…
5. Adding everything up, I speculate that Dessa wants to set up a private lab that is located outside any jurisdiction (The Mist), run by cat theme golems (Dessa’s fetish? She does wear what appears to be a catsuit.) while she can perform experiments without control of Arcane Council, on wider variety of subjects as they can be procured from other time period, while the lab is being funded from siphoning from consortium’s resources secrely. Too bad the lab does not float perfectly as expected….

It will be cool if Anet can develop a new list of achievements for lore-loving crowd, dropping a few important clues on background of fractals & other point of interests (i.e. EOTN outpost) and, if it is not too much to ask for, a title associated with investigation in pop culture, i.e. ‘Mystery Inc’, ‘Fringe Division’, etc :p

Another far-off theory of mine is Dessa uses the fractal as her private prison. It is used to lock away her boyfriend who was sent by consortium to spy on her research so he can branch off & start his own krewe to research on fractal, most probably due to lack of progress that spans from pre-Sylvari period. The golems there are mostly likely serve as wardens. As it is a covert operation, consortium will deny its involvement and stay away after the boyfriend’s disappearance. As the boyfriend turns mad from isolation, releasing him may put Dessa’s reputation at risk due to the ethical nature of having an unauthorised private prison and have driven a prisoner mad.

I’m resurrecting a “dead” thread because I had a thought on this the other day….

I wonder if somehow the raving asura saw or somehow knows what Scarlet has seen and this has driven him mad. We know Scarlet killed her mentor but she did do considerable research in Rata Sum…..

Other thoughts?

all fractals are from history and there for cant be the futur(stated by devs) and given the mini story about scarlet i would gess its very unlikely hes seen it tho it is possible that the lab did do reacher of that kind when it worked

I do not recall anyone saying it cannot be inclusive of future events. The Mists are connected to all times. Past, Present, and Future, through the Rift (or the Rift is a piece of the Mists that connects to all places and times, one or the other). Either way, I believe it is just as likely that they could be future events. But if you have the link that says they cannot be future events I would be intrigued to see it, because I believe they would be writing themselves out of a potentially interesting story.

A dev (already forgot who) said that all Fractals are of past events on the forum. It was in a thread dedicated to speculating upon the nature of the Uncategorized Fractal.

Edit: Found it.

Scott McGough.6897:

We’re not ready to reveal the whole truth about the Uncategorized Fractal yet, but I can tell you that it does not represent a potential future for Rata Sum. All of the other fractals represent discrete sections of the past, recreated. We have the ancient past, more recent past, and mythic/lost to history past, but there are no futures in there.

The similarities between the two maps cited is more a function of asuran architecture having common elements rather than a story-related easter egg. In other words, the maps look similar because they were designed and built by like-minded builders with similar design aesthetics, not because they represent the same place at different points in history.

Hope this helps,

Though one could be nitpicky (as someone has been) and argue that he was saying all Fractals except Uncategorized is of the past, the syntax of his sentence indicates otherwise.

Links to other out-of-game Fractal lore for those who missed:
http://wartower.tumblr.com/post/49691195928/in-this-lorespecial-episode
http://www.guildmag.com/magazine/issue9/interview.htm

Summary of the two links above: The Fractals do not represent perfect histories, the closest to perfect histories that can exist would be how it happened if we were there. Some Fractals may even be a mixture of multiple times and places. Cliffside is a representations of the beginnings of history, inspired by the myth of Prometheus, and Urban Battlegrounds is an alternative version of The Searing. Aquatic Fractal is implied to be a mixture of Ascalonian and Elonian history, and may be pre-historic events. And minor implied confirmation that Volcanic Fractal deals with Primordus corrupting living beings (it was asked if that was the case and we got told that Primordus can corrupt the living though via different means than the others).

I’d say, personally, that they are shooting themselves in the foot if they claim that there will not be any futuristic fractals. It is already set up to be a possibility with the lore of the mists. Still, I digress.

Could the raving lunatic be what’s left after the first evacuation of Rata Sum?

It’s not Rata Sum, read the dev post here https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/lore/The-Uncategorized-Fractal-is-Rata-Sum/first

As for the ascalonian fractal, it appears to be right before the whole foefire thing.
Edit: Didn’t take the time to read all the posts and saw that Konig beat me to the dev reply.

Narcemus.1348:

I’d say, personally, that they are shooting themselves in the foot if they claim that there will not be any futuristic fractals. It is already set up to be a possibility with the lore of the mists. Still, I digress.

They have never actually said there won’t be any future one, they have said that none of the CURRENT ones are from the future.

Narcemus.1348:

I’d say, personally, that they are shooting themselves in the foot if they claim that there will not be any futuristic fractals. It is already set up to be a possibility with the lore of the mists. Still, I digress.

That’s not what was said at all.

Just that, presently, there are no modern or future fractals.

We know they’ll want to expand the kinds of fractals over time, so there could easily end up being fractals based off of events we can do in game (imagine a Fractal featuring the Battle of Claw Island, but all three mentors are there and we fight beside them against the Risen forces… then Zhaitan – with its original model to show that his messed up version is, as the latest GM interview says, partially due to the starving and other Pact actions – show up for epic battle time) as well as things that “can happen” or “may happen” (Battle of Divinity’s Reach anyone? Or perhaps when the other ED get models, witness a fight between Primordus and Jormag with us in the middle?).

The potentials are endless. They can still do modern (like the Thaumanova Reactor explosion could be considered as), futuristic, and “alternate versions” of modern/past/future.

THE DOCTOR.3510:

It’s not Rata Sum, read the dev post here https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/lore/The-Uncategorized-Fractal-is-Rata-Sum/first

As for the ascalonian fractal, it appears to be right before the whole foefire thing.
Edit: Didn’t take the time to read all the posts and saw that Konig beat me to the dev reply.

Thanks, I hadn’t seen that one. Has the lab in Brisbane been ruled out yet? What about Rata Pten? Could this be related to what caused the Asura to go underground?

But if Scarlet is a Chronomancer (able to warp time and space) she might be able to change things in the past and if she had contact with the raving asura the knowledge that she has could have driven him mad as well…

Just a thought.

Chronomancers don’t exist in canon. Same with everything else that’s only from Utopia or concept art.