Guild Wars 2

why did the probes self destruct?

so scarlet’s probes have a bit of dialog when you interact with it,
something along the lines of it looks like it self destructed.

why would she self destruct the probes when she could have caused more damage and fear with them up?

this just further adds to my theory that she was fighting the corruption the whole time and that she was working towards a way to stop his inluance.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Technically, Jaken, all the Pale Tree is saying she believes to be the case is that Scarlet opened herself to Mordremoth when she (Scarlet) left the Pale Tree’s protection. That is, she’s speculating on how it happened, not what happened.

She seems to have trouble identifying the correct allegiance of dragon champions, if past evidence is anything to go by.

Alhacrast.5948:

I’m calling it right now; Demmi Beetlestone is the true heir.

That would be really confusing for players who hadn’t done that branch of the PS.

We got two answers (for now, maybe I missed some of them. I need to read the library a bit more) with this patch.

The secret of the Master of Peace
The Master has the last egg of Glint, which was in stasis. He worked with Odgen on creating the Zephirites and to protect it. He is now presumebly out to protect and hatch it.

The Pale Tree Vision
This vision was actually pretty straight forward. The ball of light was Glints egg which descended down into Glints layer.
Mordremoth seems to be after it, maybe because he knows that it could be dangerous to him.
This has not to be all of it, though

Rognik.2579:

Not to mention that Demmi is Caudecus’s daughter, so he’ll probably claim the throne first.

For the sake of argument, if the line of descent came from Demmi’s mother, then Caudecus would be excluded that way.

S2E6 did not answer much, just more questions… Excuse me writers, but didn`t you say you wanted to lift the veil on some things? Or did you just throw some more breadcrumps around for us?

Answers
Well, none so far. The Master of Peace is dead and we got a Cliffhanger, while the Egg is being stolen. So much for that.
Can we please go back to Odgen and ask him some real questions?

Possible answers
- Mordremoth being intelligent
It seems the last Boss was a bit more intelligent then the other beastlike creatures, as it directed the fireflies with guestures and picked out targets.

New Questions
- What is up with Caithe?
Caithe stole the egg and acted very strange. Could she also be under someone influence like Aerin and possible Scarlet?
What is her secret. Scarlet mentioned some dark secret in the Aetherblade dungeon.

Angel McCoy.1832:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

If I had to guess, the tipping point for her would have been the Scarlet’s End instance, where she basically goes berserk and starts summoning illusions like crazy. More of a self-made psychological block than any external influence – she did seem unsure of herself prior to Scarlet’s End, and seeing what she did then likely made her realize “wow, I’m better than I thought! I should stop looking so down on myself”. Motivation and self-esteem tend to be heavy motivators on things that are based on willpower – like magic seems to be.

A very astute observation.

Sorry for answering so late. I did not catch that.

Even if she had the power all along, the story so far made it out as something special. Even with something like a Messmer Collective , we need a bit more exposition to her possible new abilities, as they do not seem that great, compared to other Mesmers we have seen (NCIS lie telling does not count).

So far she is only a talented Mesmer and up till now this mystery feels like a red hering.

Jaken.6801:

Possible answers
- Mordremoth being intelligent
It seems the last Boss was a bit more intelligent then the other beastlike creatures, as it directed the fireflies with guestures and picked out targets.

All Mordrem Trolls can do this – though it’s bees, not fireflies. Furthermore, this is very much lower tactics than standard “lieutenants” (mid ranked minions as I call them – sentient minions that are less common than the mindless grunt, but only seem to control a small group of said grunts, or work alone, unlike champions who can command entire armies’ worth of minions) and champions.

Jaken.6801:

Angel McCoy.1832:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

If I had to guess, the tipping point for her would have been the Scarlet’s End instance, where she basically goes berserk and starts summoning illusions like crazy. More of a self-made psychological block than any external influence – she did seem unsure of herself prior to Scarlet’s End, and seeing what she did then likely made her realize “wow, I’m better than I thought! I should stop looking so down on myself”. Motivation and self-esteem tend to be heavy motivators on things that are based on willpower – like magic seems to be.

A very astute observation.

Sorry for answering so late. I did not catch that.

Even if she had the power all along, the story so far made it out as something special. Even with something like a Messmer Collective , we need a bit more exposition to her possible new abilities, as they do not seem that great, compared to other Mesmers we have seen (NCIS lie telling does not count).

So far she is only a talented Mesmer and up till now this mystery feels like a red hering.

The funny thing about Kasmeer is that – aside from all biconics being perma invulnerable throughout Season 2 (which makes all fights afk fests quite literally as they’ll keep fighting even if you’re defeated thus resulting in no reset unless you click return to checkpoint) – Kasmeer has lost all “superness” after Trouble at Fort Salma. Her “lie detection” in Party Politics was not only irrelevant for the most part, but poorly done (and never made out to be magical in-game still). And in E5, she gets wiped out the first chance she enters combat, and in E6 she has nothing special about her in the maze.

I didn`t notice that about the other trolls, but i never said he was a champion. Just a bit more intelligent then beast and husk creatures. (oh yeah, bees… not the bees…)

About Kasmeer.
Well as the other Biconics she is reduced to delivery girl and exposition dump. The only thing we got from them in the last few patches was character developement.

I cross her off as an red hering and as you have gathered allready, she has just awoken to her true potential, instead of getting an unnatural power boost.

Don`t know if I should call it a shame, but if there is no intervention i will cross her from the list, to make room for some more relevant questions. Iam on the limit in my first post and it is a sad that I am mostly adding things, instead of being able to cross them off.

I sometimes wish a writer would swoop down and help at some of these. At least telling us if we have reached the limit of what they are about to tell ingame.
For example the whole Scarlet thing. Are we done with her yet? I don`t care about a suprise and i think after S1 and the beginning of S2 she had enough time.
If they wanted to explain her more, then they would have done so already.

So yeah, this list needs some crossing off. Finish some mysteries already Dont want to have to wait for GW3

Never said you called the Mordrem Punisher a champion (though it and the Lurcher likely are lesser champions), but was pointing out that Mordremoth having an intelligent minion doesn’t make Mordrem more intelligent than other dragon minions, or Mordy more intelligent than the other Elder Dragons, as intelligence amongst dragon minions vary between mindless and super tactical (with, usually, the more intelligent the minions is, the higher ranking it has).

Oh, bees? I thought it was ‘red circles of homing’ or something that were chasing my guys in there, didn’t notice any bees.

Anyway, yeah, not the bees. Aahh.

Jaken.6801:

What is her secret. Scarlet mentioned some dark secret in the Aetherblade dungeon.

Is her relationship with Faolain common knowledge? I know that the PC, Trahearne, and the Pale Tree know. Who else?

Everyone knows that Caithe and Faolain were lovers. It’s common enough knowledge – especially amongst sylvari. That’s far from a secret – if there’s any secret amongst it that Caithe tries to hide, it’s that she still has feelings for Faolain (she does deny such a lot – as well as feeling hurt by the loss – in the early PS).

It’s common knowledge among the Nightmare Court, certainly, and I seem to recall a random Grove NPC saying something to the effect of ‘Caithe hasn’t been the same since Faolain left’. I’d say it’s either an open secret or common knowledge. It certainly can’t be what Scarlet was referring to- Caithe refuses to discuss that with us, and we got front row seats to her relationship during TA story.

Sylvari don’t look at love like the other races. They don’t distinguish male and female when comes to loving, afaik. So there’s no need to keep that a secret.

A bit of devil’s advocate here, because I don’t believe it is a secret, but it wouldn’t be because Faolain’s a woman. It’s because she’s the leader of the Nightmare Court. It’d be like having Stalin for an ex.

Aaron Ansari.1604:

It’s common knowledge among the Nightmare Court, certainly, and I seem to recall a random Grove NPC saying something to the effect of ‘Caithe hasn’t been the same since Faolain left’. I’d say it’s either an open secret or common knowledge. It certainly can’t be what Scarlet was referring to- Caithe refuses to discuss that with us, and we got front row seats to her relationship during TA story.

Hmmm… Sylvari believe that falling into Nightmare is a one-way street, and no one comes back. Maybe Caithe’s nasty secret is that at some point Faolain actually did convince her to fall and embrace Nightmare, and somehow she managed to find her way back to the Dream.

perilisk.1874:

Aaron Ansari.1604:

It’s common knowledge among the Nightmare Court, certainly, and I seem to recall a random Grove NPC saying something to the effect of ‘Caithe hasn’t been the same since Faolain left’. I’d say it’s either an open secret or common knowledge. It certainly can’t be what Scarlet was referring to- Caithe refuses to discuss that with us, and we got front row seats to her relationship during TA story.

Hmmm… Sylvari believe that falling into Nightmare is a one-way street, and no one comes back. Maybe Caithe’s nasty secret is that at some point Faolain actually did convince her to fall and embrace Nightmare, and somehow she managed to find her way back to the Dream.

The problem with that scenario is that Faolain would know, and at least one of these secrets is something that Faolain doesn’t even know…so there goes that theory out the window.

Zaklex.6308:

The problem with that scenario is that Faolain would know, and at least one of these secrets is something that Faolain doesn’t even know…so there goes that theory out the window.

If it was Faolain’s doing, yes. But if she preceded Faolain into Nightmare, and since then has been fighting to keep from falling back, like a junkie trying to stay clean…

That seems unlikely – if not impossible – to me.

It is Caithe herself that advocates there is no return from the Nightmare. If she thought there was a return, then she’d be putting Faolain through said return. It’s her loss and continuous reminder that Faolain cannot be saved to keep herself from falling into Nightmare to join Faolain that causes Caithe to continuously advocate that there is no return from Nightmare.

One thought that just started bothering me was that… Why was Master of Peace down there, in middle of all Mordrem minions instead of running in the opposite direction?

The destination of the Zephyrites before their crash seem to be that golden location from the Pale Tree’s vision – at least that is the PC’s claim – and it seemed by the Masters’ dialogue the Master of Peace was heading there even by foot for the egg’s sake.

And according to the vision, it is beyond the Mordrem in the Silverwastes – which is why we’re heading north rather than south, which is where the Season 1’s ending cinematic implies for Mordremoth’s location (Mordy seems to be closer to where The Falls was in gw1, but we seem to be heading towards Bloodstone Fen instead – and it is odd that Mordy stretched north before going east towards civilization).

Konig Des Todes.2086:

(and it is odd that Mordy stretched north before going east towards civilization).

That’s presuming he spread to the Silverwastes before the attacks on Kessex, Timberline, and IM. From what we’ve seen the last couple of patches, I get the feeling that what we see is just where he’s pushing up, that his real spread is being done underground- and we have no way to measure how far and how thick in which directions that’s gotten, just that we can see it’s pretty beneath the Silverwastes.

He struck through Dry Top before any of those, and that is, by all appearances, north of where he himself is.

I would not be surprised if he spread north first, then east. But even if he thickened in Silverwastes after his assaults elsewhere, it’s curious as to why it’s so thick in the Silverwastes (and going off of the Pale Tree’s vision, it was thick there even by E4).

Maybe he’s following the egg like he was following the artifacts in E2?
And then maybe Caithe is taking the egg to the Nightmare Court so Mordy can destroy them (lol)

Underdark.3726:

Maybe he’s following the egg like he was following the artifacts in E2?
And then maybe Caithe is taking the egg to the Nightmare Court so Mordy can destroy them (lol)

Considering how far the Master got (seriously, the most powerful user of the best mobility magic in Tyria took 5 episodes to move the length of a small zone?), The Silverwastes infestation would, if anything related to him, have been meant to cut him off.

Going back to Aerin and the destruction of the Zephyrite ships, it seems slightly coincidental that Mordremoth would find a soundless Sylvari on the airships. I seem to remember Aerin demanding power (the egg?) from the Master of Peace before the crash so did Mordremoth know the egg was there already? Was there already a spy who could pass information to Mordremoth and get Aerin on board the ship?

Episode 5’s discussion with the Masters hinted to me that Aerin was already influenced by the voice before joining the Zephyrites – and was Soundless already. His talks of sharing with the dream and “not speaking to himself” seemed to be a facade.

“He was open—almost obsessive—about that. He claimed his connection to the Pale Tree and your Dream made him less of an individual. He called you all “the hive.” I don’t believe he meant to flatter."
→In your opinion, did he show any signs of corruption by an Elder Dragon?
“It didn’t occur to me until after the crash as I tried to understand what had just happened. There were signs, bursts of anger. He said odd things about believing the world must be destroyed.”
→Was that all?
“Sometimes he talked to himself as if trying to keep certain urges at bay. I felt at the time like he was in a battle of wills. Arguing with himself.”

A stark contrast to his display during Festival of the Four Winds, but he was talking to himself then too, and had some strange lines such as:

“Pale Mother guide me…the Zephyrites are right in front of me, but how can I convince them to let me help?”

Why would the Zephyrites need help?

“Ok, Aerin, this is it! The Zephyrites are here, you’re here… This is the beginning of great things for you.”

Beginning of great things, eh? Like… obtaining a dragon egg?

I looks like there isn’t enough evidence about Aerin yet. Those conversations can be read either way.

Why would the Zephyrites need help? The only reason why they would take him on board in the first place would be to help their commune. They don’t want his goods, money, or anything else.

Episode 7 with no real “answer” thanks to an cliffhanger.

Can`t cross of Caithe like that.

Got a new Question though.

How will the Skritt get the ship out?
Are they like Gibbs from NCIS?

Other questions are mostly possible QA mistakes or unintended retcons, or pretty obvious stuff.

No offense Angel (you said you would follow this) but since you were so excited two months ago i hoped we could actually cross things off, not add to it.
Just a question: Will any of these even be tackled in the season? (which has only one episode left and so far we got one and a half answer. )

I am just concerned on how long things will be dragged behind us. I mean, I bet there are things on the list that won`t even be touched in the near future, or won`t even be revisited (if so please give us an official statement on these cases (like Scarelts true intent for example) so we can be done with it. You play the Mystery thing enough already)

Boring story is boring.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

A stark contrast to his display during Festival of the Four Winds, but he was talking to himself then too, and had some strange lines such as:

“Pale Mother guide me…the Zephyrites are right in front of me, but how can I convince them to let me help?”

Why would the Zephyrites need help?

“Ok, Aerin, this is it! The Zephyrites are here, you’re here… This is the beginning of great things for you.”

Beginning of great things, eh? Like… obtaining a dragon egg?

Unless I’m misremembering, didn’t this last episode carry some implication that Sylvari might misinterpret their Wyld Hunts and be led astray? Maybe something like that explains why Aerin felt so determined to join the Zephyrites. Could Mordremoth corrupt a Dreamer’s interpretation of his Wyld Hunt? Say, he found someone whose hunt was naturally to join the Zephyrites, and corrupted him to instead want the power of the egg.

Alternatively, the Nightmare Court have their Dark Hunts. The Nightmare Court is also part of the Sinister Triad, which conveniently operates where the ships went down. The attack might not have been been Mordremoth’s doing at all, and could have been planned before he became active; it seems less likely, as Aerin was evidently mad rather than tendril twirling evil — but it could just be that he isn’t a Courtier, but instead someone tortured into serving them (like the Sylvari in Twilight Arbor), except as a sleeper agent.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Episode 5’s discussion with the Masters hinted to me that Aerin was already influenced by the voice before joining the Zephyrites – and was Soundless already. His talks of sharing with the dream and “not speaking to himself” seemed to be a facade.

“He was open—almost obsessive—about that. He claimed his connection to the Pale Tree and your Dream made him less of an individual. He called you all “the hive.” I don’t believe he meant to flatter."
->In your opinion, did he show any signs of corruption by an Elder Dragon?
“It didn’t occur to me until after the crash as I tried to understand what had just happened. There were signs, bursts of anger. He said odd things about believing the world must be destroyed.”
->Was that all?
“Sometimes he talked to himself as if trying to keep certain urges at bay. I felt at the time like he was in a battle of wills. Arguing with himself.”

A stark contrast to his display during Festival of the Four Winds, but he was talking to himself then too, and had some strange lines such as:

“Pale Mother guide me…the Zephyrites are right in front of me, but how can I convince them to let me help?”

Why would the Zephyrites need help?

“Ok, Aerin, this is it! The Zephyrites are here, you’re here… This is the beginning of great things for you.”

Beginning of great things, eh? Like… obtaining a dragon egg?

I dunno. This is one of the weirder inconsistencies from season two imo. Aerin before boarding the Zephyrite ship was very convincingly a loyal sylvari. He was talking the usual talk that indicated he was still connected to the Dream like other sylvari – it’s included in your quote.

When the ship crashed in Dry Top and we chased after him in episode one I have a hard time buying that he was Soundless simply because that doesn’t match his portrayal the day before the patch hit. His portrayal was nothing like how the Zephyrites describe him, nothing like how we are led to believe he is on the Zephyrite ship. I don’t think he was pretending to be a Dream sylvari, I think he was one.

This is a problem for me because Aerin (supposedly) has a massive moment of character development off screen when he supposedly chooses to reject the Dream. He is clearly established as a Dream following sylvari when we first meet him but a central point in the very next episode (and throughout this season) is that he rejected the Dream (which is a big deal for a sylvari) and became vulnerable to Mordremoth’s mental corruption. All the speculation related to this is muddied because the reality shown to the player does not establish Aerin as “Soundless” when we last saw him, it seems deliberately clear he is not.

Maybe there is a reason for this (maybe Aerin is supposed to be seen as not Soundless because he wasn’t and something forces its way into his mind) but so far it’s unclear, at least to me, what is going on with Aerin’s story. I suspect they’ve done a major moment of character development for him off screen).

Revisiting this now that the season’s over…

Jaken.6801:

• What was Scarlets real goal?*

Still nothing more on this than we had at the end of S1.

• Who is Mister E?*

Not answered or progressed.

• What are Kasmeers powers and why does she have them?*

Not answered or progressed.

• Vision 1: What Scarlet Saw?*

Learned in the Durmand PRiory that it’s the All, a less strict way of looking at the Eternal Alchemy, but we still don’t know what the import of the colliding orbs and resulting discoloration is.

• Vision 2: The Pale Trees Vision*

In-game it’s theorized that the probable Forgotten ruins are the golden location, but ultimately we still don’t know, beyond that the sphere is Glint’s egg and the dragon/vines seem to fairly clearly represent Mordremoth trying to claim it.

• Why did Tequatle become stronger?*

Possibly not answered or progressed, but we did learn that lesser dragons are believed to have the potential to become Elder Dragons by consuming enough magic.

• The Medalion and the true heir*

Not answered or progressed.

• What is Mordremoths goal?*

Not answered or progressed.

• Who or what is Anise?*

Not answered or progressed.

• What is the consortium up to?*

Not answered or progressed.

• What happened in the fractals laboratory?*

Not answered or progressed.

• What will Evon Gnashblade do?*

Not answered or progressed, although apparently business is going well.

• Whats the Master of Peaces Goal and what is the secret of the Zephirites?*

We know the secret was the egg, but not how he intended to keep it safe.

• Will Mai Trin and the Aetherblades come back?*

Not answered or progressed, unless somethings changed in EotM.

• Who corrupted Aerin?*

Hasn’t been specifically addressed, but evidence seems to pretty overwhelmingly point to being corrupted by Mordremoth because he cut himself off from the Dream.

• What is the dark secret of the Super Adventure Box?*

Not answered or progressed.

• What happend to Rytlock?*

Teased, but not answered or meaningfully progressed.

• What is Caithe`s agenda?

Progressed- like the Master of Peace, she’s trying to keep the egg safe, and we have no idea how.

All said- honestly, I find it a little depressing how little we got. I just wish we had known from the start that the Season was just a lead-in to something else, so that I could have moderated my expectations accordingly.

It is beginning to look a bit like the TV-show LOST.

New questions every episode, but rarely any clear answers.

That’s… not an inaccurate analogy, and one that I admit I don’t find particularly satisfying myself after all the waits and cliffhangers.

We’re STILL cliffhangered regarding the egg, after having three episodes hanging on that same cliff. Now we’ve had a big fight, but in the end we’ve just got more cliffhangers.

draxynnic.3719:

That’s… not an inaccurate analogy, and one that I admit I don’t find particularly satisfying myself after all the waits and cliffhangers.

We’re STILL cliffhangered regarding the egg, after having three episodes hanging on that same cliff. Now we’ve had a big fight, but in the end we’ve just got more cliffhangers.

Yo, dawg, I heard you like cliffh- NO! We don’t.

I’m seriously dissapointed about this. They said we would know who is Mr. E by the end of S2, and we got nothing. We were promised answers and we mostly just got more questions that rooted up from the tiny bit of explanations we got.

Cliffhangers does NOT mean leaving things unanswered.

This episode was fun, but ultimately dissapointing, when viewed from a lore/story perspective.

It sure feels like an online-version of Assassin’s Creed with all the cliffhangering.
(It’s a word now)

I’m kinda… ok scratch that, I am disappointment that Anet’s only and really only way of building suspense ingame is mystery about what the plot is about. We never seem to know what the heck we’re doing exactly or what our role is. It’s like they didn’t learn at all from LS1 about this.

A story about the present as opposed to digging in the past doesn’t mean that we have to be clueless about everything that is going on around us. We could be invested in relationships, in decisions and consequences we have to make, in the growth of characters, in political situations in Tyria, … but nah the LS itself has always been about tune in next time for a rng-chance of finding out what even exactly is going on.

It wasn’t until the ending trailer of this episode that we’ve come to face that kinda stuff with the sylvari = minions consequences. And the forced mystery-factor didn’t contribute to it at all which is kind of the point I’m trying to make.

@Aaron.
These are exactly my sentiments.
Season 2s only purpose seemed to be only to set things up for Heart of Thorns and nothing more.
For me, this is really a bad move, as it just leaves a very unsatisfying taste afterwards.

Right now I am really disapointed with S2. The twist, the ideas are great.
However the overall amount of satisfaction is not on the same level.
This is a story that would have worked if it was just a few chapters of a book or half of a TV Season, maybe.
However this is supposed to be a complete Season and on that note it failed in my opinion.

These are the things we got a conclusion at:
- Master of Peace (sorta)
- Caithe`s Secret (which hijacked the story in the last stretch of the Season and is the “big reveal” in the end)
- Brahams Mommy issues

That`s it. Other storylines are still waiting to be concluded.
- Taimis experiment and new Master (the Charr)
- Belinda and Majory
- Countess Anise
- Mister E
- Canachs agenda (though we see a glimps)
- The meaning of the Visions
- Mordremoth (which was obvious)
- The pale trees agenda
- Rythlok
- White Mantle
- Inquest involvement
- zephirites
- etc…

And many others I just can`t think of right now.

Don`t get me wrong. It was good for the bigger picture, in that we are able to see what it is supposed to be.
However the single parts are just no good and it is just a mess.

Another question I would like to see answered is. How did Scarlet knew about the secret?

Aaron Ansari.1604:

Revisiting this now that the season’s over…

• What is the consortium up to?*

Not answered or progressed.

Not entirely. They’re investigating the remains of the Tower in Kessex. Evon also invoked them in strong-arming X-Tron into becoming a spy.

But you’re right. We’ve mostly got a lot of mysteries on our hands.

Vrede.8942:

Another question I would like to see answered is. How did Scarlet knew about the secret?

might have overheard it, like faolain with wynne, or she knew because she was corrupted herself (and thus learned the secret by living it), but most likely it’s not something that will ever be answered, because it was intended to be just a teaser that there was more to caithe, rather than a plot.

With the revelation that Sylvari are indeed dragon minions, it stands to reason that the Dream is actually the “hive mind” of Mordremoth, in the same way that all other dragon minions share a hive mind with their Elder Dragon. Therefore, once Scarlet became corrupted, she knew everything Mordremoth did, and thus was able to access the Dream to learn things a normal Sylvari wouldn’t know.