Guild Wars 2

Great video who explains where humans come from.Personally i think that the ascalonians are an other tribe of humans.There culture,architecture and appearance is very diffrent to Krytans/Elonians/Orrians and Canthanians.

here is also a map who shows the “migration period” theory.
http://www.directupload.net/file/d/3615/gwmmnaax_jpg.htm

Well, the Krytans are supposedly Elonians or Elonians hybridized with Tyrians, and we can’t say anything about Orr because all that’s intact for the player to see is the architecture… which is implied to be largely done by the gods. But. I don’t usually like picking apart WoodenPotatoes’ videos because that misses the entire point of the kitten thing, but… here goes.

(listening to this in another window, so if he corrects himself in the annotations, I’ll miss it)

Bit about Kryta being an Elonian colony: That’s what the lore clearly states. Dig a little deeper and you get a confused mess. I’ll skip the spiel on ways that they might be reconciled, but what we have as stated fact in the lore is that Kryta was conquered and named in the early days of Tyrian humanity by an Orrian royal named Mazdak, and that Kryta was “established as a colony of Elona” in 300 A.E.

The statement that humanity was on Elona longer than Tyria is false. Humans arrived on the mainlands of both continents in the same year, 205 BE, although the Elonians did manage to become an organized kingdom a hundred years before the Tyrians did.
The timeline goes thusly:
205 BE: humans appear on Istan, Elona, and Tyria.
200 BE: Founding of the Dynasty of the Primeval Kings, who ruled Istan and Elona
100 BE: Founding of Ascalon, which at the time encompassed all three Tyrian kingdoms.
2 AE: Orr becomes an independent kingdom.

Orr was not the first Tyrian nation to exist, but before it existed the land was still the first place in Tyria that humans called home- timeline is unclear on that point, but the humans were brought to the world at the location of Arah.

Strictly speaking, while the Kurzicks and Luxons did appear on Cantha after the Canthans, they still arrived before the Canthans united into the Dragon Empire, and were in fact full members of the Dragon Empire for a short time at its very beginning.

The gods bringing the Forgotten to Tyria is most likely false. That comes from an origin story that the devs have since decided is pretty thoroughly wrong. The exact nature of the interaction between the Forgotten and the human gods is still up in the air, although it is clear that such interaction happened.

All in all, the video is an excellent overview of the facts and most popular theories. There are a couple misstatements that I pointed out, but you can’t blame WP for that when the devs seem to keep changing their minds. I add my endorsement, however little that might be worth, as it is a great primer if you’re interested in this sort of thing.

Hey Aaron great Post!
Now my real question is why the ascalonian are so diffrent than the other? I know that the Krytans are “Elonian colonist”.Orrians i think are also childs from elona.But ascalonians have really big difference in culture/architecture and appearance.What did you think about my “migration period theory”? i didnt write dates on this map but i think that the ascalonians originally come from the north or east like on the map where i posted in the first post.

Stated lore is that the Ascalonians migrated from what later became Orr, and that they arrived in what is now Ascalon from the south and pushed the charr north. I don’t think the facts leave room for a group of humans coming from the east, especially given that east of Ascalon is semi-stated to have belonged to the charr back then.

I’m curious, though- what makes you think that they’re different? Maybe you’ve seen something I missed. I always thought the Ascalonians looked almost identical to the lighter end of the Krytan spectrum, and their culture also seems very similar- noble class, feudal government, royal line descended from Doric, same way of looking at the gods. It’s difficult to say for sure, as in GW1 we see Kryta under a very radical departure from their traditional society, and in GW2 it’s after hundreds of years of incorporating refugees from many diverse places, but accounting for those the only differences I’ve picked up on are dress, architecture, and treatment of the dead- and two of those might simply come down to differences in the climates of the regions.

Erm, Kryta aren’t “children of Elona” – the country was originally established by Orrians, and was later colonized by Elona over 300 years later.

Orr and Elona were originally established around the same time, though Tyrians were of divided tribes for 105 years, when Ascalon was founded they united under King Doric (those of Orr may have united sooner, but Doric wasn’t crowned until 100 AE, the same year Ascalon was named, though not the year settlements began there, it should be noted). Elonians, however, began a kingdom 5 years after settling in Elona. Nonetheless, the humans who became Orrian, Ascalonians, and the original Krytans made landfall the same year those who became Elonians did.

BTW, it is not a confusing mess. It’s just jumbled and not laid out properly because we don’t have all the dates. But when we’re told that Kryta was colonized, that is not when it was founded. Even as far back as Prophecies, we’ve been told that King Doric ruled over the three Tyrian kingdoms (Orr, Kryta, and Ascalon). So it isn’t like Mazdak brings in completely new lore.

The only confusing part is Orr becoming independent, because Orr is heavily hinted to be the first of the kingdoms, rather than Ascalon (as it was a “prince of Orr” whom established Kryta before the Exodus of the Gods). It likely derives not from name of the kingdom, but rather that Doric decided to rule primarily from Ascalon instead of Orr.

As to humans being brought to Orr from the other world – while this may be true, it should be noted that when humanity arrived in 205 AE, it was via boat. Per both jotun and human records. This indicates that while humanity may or may not have been brought the world at Orr (remember that Orr were religious fanatics to a point, so it would not be surprising for them to “alter” history for their favor, no different than Christianity doing the same to Celtic and Norse mythology in the past).

Ascalon is, without a doubt, of Orrian origin. Proof lies in King Doric.

I will note, lastly, that there is no indication that the devs “keep changing their mind” – as I said, we’ve been told since day 1 that Kryta existed before the Exodus, when King Doric lived, and it should be noted that “established as a colony” is not exactly the same as “first time established as human living space.” Even pre-existing cities, lands, and countries can be established as a colony. Even if its via purchasing between kingdoms (ala Louisiana Purchase kind of stunts).

Aaron Ansari.1604:

I’m curious, though- what makes you think that they’re different? Maybe you’ve seen something I missed. I always thought the Ascalonians looked almost identical to the lighter end of the Krytan spectrum, and their culture also seems very similar- noble class, feudal government, royal line descended from Doric, same way of looking at the gods.

Its on there cultural difference and appearance.As we know the ascalonians are much like europeans,orrians like arabian/babylonia and elona like eygptian/african.When the ascalonians are realated to them then there must be culture points that are similar or the same but there aren’t.Only similar thing is the religion,the six gods.

Look on my map what i have created.I pull there a “proto ascalonian” tribe who marches west in the early days and builded an ancient ascalonian tribe.when the ancient ascalonian tribe was formed they may have interacions with orrians (maybe they takeover in this period also the faith of the six gods) and perhaps with elonians.After this period the ascalonians moved north against the charr and formed the kingdom of ascalon.

a hard fact is, a bunch of datas we have are written from ancient Orrians

with my theory i will say that the ascalonian is an other tribe of human.Perhaps they arrived sooner/later in tyria(i personally think they where sooner).But they lived much like barbarians who doens’t had a high culture…….,with the interactions with orr(maybe also elona) they take the religion from them and some culturall things like building citys ect. later they etablished ascalon what we know.

Keep in mind that it’s been over a thousand years between Doric’s time and Guild Wars 1. A lot can change in a thousand years – in Europe, that’s roughly the distinction between the height of the Roman Empire while Christians were still being persecuted, to the early Middle Ages. Even in Italy itself, the Romans probably wouldn’t recognise much from the culture and architecture a thousand years later. You also see a big distinction between the western Middle East and Western Europe, which at the height of the Roman Empire were both part of the empire.

Now, Ascalon and Orr didn’t have the migrations that Europe did in the Dark Ages to change customs and architecture, but on the other hand, Orr is at least a subtropical if not wholly tropical climate, while Ascalon is temperate. That’s probably going to result in a substantial variation in clothing and architectural styles (you don’t wear the same thing and live in the same design of house in Syria as you would in the English winter if you know what’s good for you). Add to that Orr’s greater piety and much greater access to magic, and I think the differences are easily explained.

Furthermore, when you get past the architectural differences… what we know of Orrian and Ascalonian culture is actually quite similar. They’re both feudal cultures with a king, nobles, and commoners, both have major religious sites presided over by priests and priestesses (although Orr has so much more in any given area, but as noted above, Orr was much more pious), and so on – once you get past appearances, they actually have more in common culturally than the three provinces of Elona did with one another. Particularly Istan, which seemed to have done away with having a noble caste altogether (probably, I’d guess, because the original nobles died in the Scarab Plague, and those who resettled didn’t see fit to bring the concept of nobility with them).

Isn’t Orr an extension of the continent of Elona? In GW 1 Orr is a land mass of the Crystal Desert. However when the six human gods and orrian kings lived on Orr the Crystal Desert was the Crystal Sea, but it was still possible even then Orr could still be a land extension of Elona. For instance currently in GW 2 Orr is a land extension of Elona and in addition there is the Crystal Sea as well. If that is the case then as it is currently in GW 2 the explanation would be Orr is the original origin of human on planet Tyria; and as Orr is a land extension of the continent of Elona, this would make the continent of Elona the original origin of human as well.

Orr is considered a part of the Tyrian continent. Though originally there’s heavy implication that prior to the Exodus (aka with the Crystal Sea), it was directly connected to Elona while closer to Tyrian civilizations (Ascalon and Kryta, mainly).

Avariz.8241:

Isn’t Orr an extension of the continent of Elona? In GW 1 Orr is a land mass of the Crystal Desert. However when the six human gods and orrian kings lived on Orr the Crystal Desert was the Crystal Sea, but it was still possible even then Orr could still be a land extension of Elona. For instance currently in GW 2 Orr is a land extension of Elona and in addition there is the Crystal Sea as well. If that is the case then as it is currently in GW 2 the explanation would be Orr is the original origin of human on planet Tyria; and as Orr is a land extension of the continent of Elona, this would make the continent of Elona the original origin of human as well.

Yes and no. Depending on how large the Crystal Sea actually was, Orr might have been an island; if not, it would have been only the tip of a very long, mountainous, seemingly uninhabited peninsula that has since become the mountains making up the western border of the Desolation. Either way, I’d hesitate to call it part of Elona- they might be part of one landmass, but then, Kryta and Ascalon are also part of that landmass. Somewhat similarly to Europe and Asia in our world, the border between Elona and Tyria seems to be at least as much a cultural one as a geographical one, and culturally Orr is definitely not Elonian.