Guild Wars 2

mercury ranique.2170:

Personally only a fraction of the people dislike Scarlet. but those are, as always the people who speak out on the forums. I absolutly love the character and think she is truly a job well done.

So definitely not signed.

huehuehue

“Team Scarlet is blasting off AGAAAAAAAAAIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN”

So well written
wow
great story
such wonder
wow

Whenever I see “Scarlet’s minions are invading x!” I always think of Plankton from “Spongebob Squarepants”. The on-going joke with Plankton is the fact that he never successfully steals the Krabby Patty Formula. He does all manner of evil shenanigans to get it, but his plans always fail. To me, this is another major problem with Scarlet that I’ve only thought about recently. Like others of said, she consistently fails but she never cares. Is that supposed to show that she is such a crazy kitten that no failure affects her? Even the Joker in “The Dark Knight” (who Scarlet is so obviously and poorly based off) gets frustrated when he loses control of a situation or things don’t go according to plan.

Either let Scarlet win for once or let us see her get upset when we defeat her for the 9000th time.

mercury ranique.2170:

Personally only a fraction of the people dislike Scarlet. but those are, as always the people who speak out on the forums. I absolutly love the character and think she is truly a job well done.

So definitely not signed.

Mostly the pessimists.

Optimists and people who have no problem with the lore/game are usually busy playing it rather than chatting about it here.

I feel she’s undeveloped and needs explanation for just about everything she does, which Anet has not given us.

Not signed, but it might get there.

I swear, if they come out and say that Scarlet was behind the Toxic Alliance, it will just be proof that Anet is taking the kitten . Is this the only way you know how to wrap things up and advance the plot now, Anet? Scarlet formed another unlikely alliance between two “evil” factions to conquer Tyria? Why? Because she went crazy after seeing the Eternal Alchemy? Give me a break.

Scarlet breaks lore left and right. It was ridiculous enough when it was explained that she graduated from all three Asura Colleges (even though it has already been established that you only graduate from one, nevermind the fact that Scarlet seems to be the only non-asura to pull this off), and it only kept going from there. On top of the Colleges, she was also trained by charr and norn. Then she manipulated the dredge and Flame Legion into their Molten Alliance. She built all the Watchknights Queen Jennah spent tax payer money on buying (to protect herself instead of fighting the centaur and securing Kryta). She apparently pulls her Aetherblade minions from another dimension solely populated by magitech pirates with airships. The list goes on, from her stupid hairdo to her apparently inexhaustible supply of suicidal troops.

Scarlet needs to stop. There’s way too much focus on this stupid Mary Sue villain. She feels like something Matt Ward would come up with when asked to design the perfect villain for Tyria.

And what are the dragons doing while all of this is going on? Are they on a break, eating popcorn while watching us fight some ridiculous kitten with a kitten for technology? Is Scarlet also behind the Elder Dragons?

This new content can go two ways:
It can steer Guild Wars back on track.
Or it can wreck it even further.

Signed.

Dott.5672:

I swear, if they come out and say that Scarlet was behind the Toxic Alliance, it will just be proof that Anet is taking the kitten . Is this the only way you know how to wrap things up and advance the plot now, Anet? Scarlet formed another unlikely alliance between two “evil” factions to conquer Tyria? Why? Because she went crazy after seeing the Eternal Alchemy? Give me a break.

Scarlet breaks lore left and right. It was ridiculous enough when it was explained that she graduated from all three Asura Colleges (even though it has already been established that you only graduate from one, nevermind the fact that Scarlet seems to be the only non-asura to pull this off), and it only kept going from there. On top of the Colleges, she was also trained by charr and norn. Then she manipulated the dredge and Flame Legion into their Molten Alliance. She built all the Watchknights Queen Jennah spent tax payer money on buying (to protect herself instead of fighting the centaur and securing Kryta). She apparently pulls her Aetherblade minions from another dimension solely populated by magitech pirates with airships. The list goes on, from her stupid hairdo to her apparently inexhaustible supply of suicidal troops.

Scarlet needs to stop. There’s way too much focus on this stupid Mary Sue villain. She feels like something Matt Ward would come up with when asked to design the perfect villain for Tyria.

And what are the dragons doing while all of this is going on? Are they on a break, eating popcorn while watching us fight some ridiculous kitten with a kitten for technology? Is Scarlet also behind the Elder Dragons?

This new content can go two ways:
It can steer Guild Wars back on track.
Or it can wreck it even further.

Signed.

i dont think you saw the picture for the next release did you let me show you

Lol, the other day I was thinking of pointing out that even though the Lore forum members are angry and lashing out against Scarlet and the general direction of the Living Story, we are still avid supporters of the world of Tyria, and none of us have started using the general “I’m gonna quit unless you change x” methodology. We just have so much invested in this world that it hurts us at our core to see some of the decisions being made and the damage they are doing to the world in general…

I do want to point out though, that Dott isn’t a usual name I see on these posts/topics.

EDIT: Any player opinions on this current content? I probably won’t be able to play til around the weekend, but interested to see if the content changes player opinion about the validity of the Sushi Alliance (Not my name, but I rather enjoy it, and it fits my current opinion of this LS content).

My opinions, Narcemus?

Mechanically, and aesthetically, I love the update. Though I’m unhappy of the LS category requiring the dailies once again…

I love the addition of an Oratuss (at long last), and how the lore from the krait blog post is finally being put in-game (most if not all the other minor races’ lore blog posts’ lore was in the game upon release, but krait definitely wasn’t).

As for the alliance and “Scarlet did it” – predictable and sad, but not as terrible as it could have been. At least they’re bringing up the whole issue of xenophobia by the NPCs. Maybe we’ll see the full reason why the krait joined in next update – for now we only know “Scarlet gave them Obelisk shards”… why did the krait not gut Scarlet for defiling their most sacred of objects? How did Scarlet get the shards? Why did Scarlet make the Toxic Alliance? These are the things I want to know next update. And the answers can make or break the lore.

So its pretty much confirmed that the Lore Slayer did it. She was the one behind the Snakes and Salads (SS) alliance.

The only saving grace so far is that the NPCs in the game talks about how this alliance doesn’t make sense. So hopefully they can come up with an good explanation later on.

I agree with Konig. The next update will make or break the lore about Kraits.

Tbh did any one even give a kitten about the krait to start off with or any villain untill they started making alliances. Dose anyone even remember the krait from GW1 they were able to transform and morph into different fighting forms at least i am glad to see they seem to be getting that side of them back with this update. Cause in eye of the north the krait had to be one of the most annoying mobs to run into on your way to rata sum

I’ve always been interested in the krait, actually. The Blue Orb of theirs along with some of their skill challenges with the blog post strike interesting thoughts in my mind.

I don’t have a problem with scarlet i just want answers i wanna know how she is able to sweet talk races into doing the most bizarre/amazing things. I want to know what makes her so threatening that aetherblade fear her and a few other things i do wish she had a different disposition though there is a way of making a mary sue with out her having the attitude of a child. I think i have a few mary sue characters i love atm the one i am most liking is Mari Illustrious makanari from the rebuild of evangelion series.Other then that that sums up my opinion on scarlet love her voice actress though lolz.

The Krait dosen’t see other races as something to wipe out they see them as potential slaves who will eventually be converted into members of the Prophets’ armies in other words Scarlet’s race proved themselves worthy of constructing the means for the Prophets’ return and will be among the first of the Prophets’ armies to spill over Tyria.

That’s an interesting view but Shadows in the Water – The Krait make it sound like any race is “worthy” of joining the army… but they are to be joined as slaves, and as souls.

The krait sacrifice slaves to show reverence to the prophets and to ensure that the prophets will have servants in their mystical “other world.”

The Prophets’ army that other races are added to are spiritual. The souls of those the krait enslaved and sacrificed. No living non-krait is part of this army.

Equally comfortable above and below the water, the krait have never felt truly threatened by any of the land-dwelling races of Tyria. Perhaps that is why they have not bothered to communicate with other races. They have no need of anything land-dwellers can give them, other than slaves for their use and sacrifices for their rituals. However, the krait can seize those for themselves—with ruthless efficiency.

I found this line interesting, as it can be both used to explain and counter the krait allying with the Nightmare Court.

The krait see no reason to ally with land-dwelling races, because anything the land-dwelling race can provide, the krait believe they can simply take by force. But at the same time, no land-dwelling race has offered the krait something they can’t take by force.

Taking this bit into account, it may be that Scarlet somehow proved herself to be threatening even to the krait, making them bother to communicate since previously they wouldn’t – this can be supported in that the krait mooks now have voiced over lines. And then after showing to be strong, Scarlet offered the obelisk – by being threatening enough, the krait wouldn’t simply try to take it by force and enter negotiation.

Makes me wonder if the krait had ever clashed with the charr in full force before, if the krait would have opened communications in return. “Gain our respect by proving your strength to us first” kind of deal.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

That’s an interesting view but Shadows in the Water – The Krait make it sound like any race is “worthy” of joining the army… but they are to be joined as slaves, and as souls.

The krait sacrifice slaves to show reverence to the prophets and to ensure that the prophets will have servants in their mystical “other world.”

The Prophets’ army that other races are added to are spiritual. The souls of those the krait enslaved and sacrificed. No living non-krait is part of this army.

Equally comfortable above and below the water, the krait have never felt truly threatened by any of the land-dwelling races of Tyria. Perhaps that is why they have not bothered to communicate with other races. They have no need of anything land-dwellers can give them, other than slaves for their use and sacrifices for their rituals. However, the krait can seize those for themselves—with ruthless efficiency.

I found this line interesting, as it can be both used to explain and counter the krait allying with the Nightmare Court.

The krait see no reason to ally with land-dwelling races, because anything the land-dwelling race can provide, the krait believe they can simply take by force. But at the same time, no land-dwelling race has offered the krait something they can’t take by force.

Taking this bit into account, it may be that Scarlet somehow proved herself to be threatening even to the krait, making them bother to communicate since previously they wouldn’t – this can be supported in that the krait mooks now have voiced over lines. And then after showing to be strong, Scarlet offered the obelisk – by being threatening enough, the krait wouldn’t simply try to take it by force and enter negotiation.

Makes me wonder if the krait had ever clashed with the charr in full force before, if the krait would have opened communications in return. “Gain our respect by proving your strength to us first” kind of deal.

I hope this event changes the krait i want them to evolve as a villain they seem to be taking a turn to how they use to be in GW1 changing and adapting to the toxin this is a good thing i feel the green krait are what the krait use to be able to do from gw1 and morph into more powerful forms.

Regarding scarlet i want to see her attitude evolve more i really would not have a problem with scarlet but i just wanna know what about her is that threatening cues at first glance she dose not seem any different from any other syvari. She is a blatant mary sue i don’t think the writer’s try hiding it if they do there bad at it you cant have some one with her background not be a Mary sue but that not her problem. Her problem is as a villain she leave more questions the answers she seem to be the writers version of a Mary Sue/Heath Leger’s Joker I get that she wants to watch the world burn and make something out of whats left. But all we know about her is that well she is a Crazy Mad Genius what other powers dose she have she must have others thanks to her peek at the eternal alchemy at least give us a tast of what she can really do and how she herself can be so threatening you get me.i guess its to much to ask

Guys it’s not Scarlet….

Next update Scarlet could do something to make you think she was interesting, or if not that at least add depth to the story. I hope she does. BUT I have been hoping this for a looong time now. She just keeps NOT advancing the story in any shape or form. She just combines faction x with faction y, we never learn why or how then the next update she does it again.

If ANET right now got rid of Scarlet and replaced her with another villain the new antagonist would be just as boring. If they could write better stories they would have by now. Now I am not saying that their writers are no good or any assumptions like that. There may be a reason they are just giving us what feels like filler story. But there is certainly a problem.

She’d given them an excuse to be lazy.

The recent update seems to have gone against the trend a bit, since we’re actually seeing some indications that the question of why the factions in question have allied will be answered. Previously, they’ve been cases of “Scarlet did it”, with no extrapolation of just how exactly she persuaded them to ally up and serve her.

The way they have paced this LS is terrible. Absolutely terrible. After each patch they never leave me wanting more, or wanting to find out more. Only in F&F did they manage that.

But here’s my take on Scarlet. She is a herald or servant of Mordremoth. He invaded her visions and Scarlet, like Snaff when he linked with Kralkatorrik’s mind and almost went insane, Scarlet went one step further and actually did lose her mind. Bobby Stein says – “There is a reason to her madness but we haven’t revealed it yet.” – I’m guessing it is that.

But now scarlet has been injected with power from Mordremoth, allowing her to grow red like vines from her body who she choked Omadd with. I can’t explain her genius level intelligence and its probably one of the major things that has bugged me about her, this mary-sue like excellence.

As for the Krait and the Nightmare court, I believe the Krait are actually the ones in control of the situation and the NMC are unwittingly just pawns in this alliance, tricked by Scarlet to help. The Krait will treacherously backstab them when they have the obelisks (yet another thing that bugs me about scarlet – where did she get them from, how has she managed to find them when the Krait having been trying for years)

Too many convenient unrealistic plot fillers for my liking. But I’m hoping they don’t just stay on this path and give us some juicier content.

I’m guessing that Scarlet was able to get to and talk to the Oratuss, even more so now that they are mentioned in-game, to form the alliance.

While the regular every day Krait are known to be steadfast xenophobes, the Oratuss have been known to manipulate the whole race by subtly changing their religious text to suit their own needs and power. If Scarlet was able to make them an offer they can’t refuse, one that would be very much profitable for them; I’m sure they would be up to negotiation. After of course, Scarlet had shown herself to be powerful enough where they couldn’t just take it from her.

Because really, what’s a few changes to the sacred holy text to manipulate the masses, when they, the Oratuss, get the possibility of their prophet(s) return?

The Oratuss. Tyrian’s original retconners!

I’m still wondering what the Nightmare Count is getting out of the deal, other than maybe the lulz of creating a giant hallucinogenic plant. That, and if Faolain could be possibly behind the veil that was hiding it. Unless, of course, that was the work of a very powerful Krait…

Next month: An unholy alliance between the Skritt and the Ettins. Who could possibly be behind this Dumb Alliance? Who could it be? Who could it POSSIBLY be?!

According to the Dev in the collaborative post we’ve got scarlett for 4 – 6 more months maybe longer. Thats going to be a darn slow fleshing out.

mercury ranique.2170:

Personally only a fraction of the people dislike Scarlet. but those are, as always the people who speak out on the forums. I absolutly love the character and think she is truly a job well done.

So definitely not signed.

Needs moar thumb down buttons

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Next month: An unholy alliance between the Skritt and the Ettins. Who could possibly be behind this Dumb Alliance? Who could it be? Who could it POSSIBLY be?!

Guess who? Scarlet! You couldn’t guess that right? RIGHT? Signed… TWICE!

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Next month: An unholy alliance between the Skritt and the Ettins. Who could possibly be behind this Dumb Alliance? Who could it be? Who could it POSSIBLY be?!

Skritts riding Ettins to form a cavalry force? Be afraid. Be very afraid.

And we’ll have to find the 24 shinies spread out across Tyria !

Trahearne should slay Scarlet in single combat.

Grumpdogg.6910:

Trahearne should slay Scarlet in single combat.

This won’t end well

I wonder how Scarlet plot line is going to end? Will it end with she get what she wants, but destroyers herself in the process? Or everyone she has used in the past turns on her to eventually cause her downfall? I am looking for some type of foreshadowing. I guess we have to wait till we get to her second act of the conflict, and past the introduction phase of her alliance forming collaboration. Maybe we could eventually stop one of her alliance from ever forming. Instead of always being the ones who just put an end to them. It would be interesting if our character drew her out with some type of public humiliation. Probably just upstaging her would do it, and show how predictable she can be.

“Past the introduction phase”
Oh God…we aren’t past that yet? How long has it been since F&F started?
whelp

It’s because every single time they introduce another pseudo alliance without solving the “why they are untied,” it set’s the introduction clock one tick backwards. There is still unanswered question about most if not all the alliances that scarlet has been apart of. We have yet to get to the part where her plan is truly revealed to us. So we are no where near the true conflict stage. Also according to Bobby Stein outside short stories can be skipped because they are complementary narratives to what happens in game. So you can technically throw out the short story ”What Scarlet Saw,” right out the window. As well as the short story ”Twlight Prepations,” which alludes to why the Nightmare Court allowed Scarlet to build a base in TA.

I’m starting to wonder if maybe Scarlet isn’t to Lyssa what Kormir was to Abaddon (I dunno, killing Zhaitan caused the remainder of the dead-ish goddess’s essence to get coughed up into the Mists, and Scarlet’s “Eternal Alchemy” experiment caused her to tap into that essence and perceive a mind-breaking divine illusion of total consciousness). The difference being that her apotheosis was purely accidental, so she doesn’t understand her divine nature, and since her divine nature is Illusion, she really can’t. Because of this, the mortal consciousness of Ceara and the divine essence of Lyssa are struggling against one another rather than working together, thus insanity.

It would explain the source of the powerful Mesmer magic that cloaked the ToN, her skill at manipulating others despite being a flake, and her actual physical power in combat (cuz, goddess). [Edit: The portals in her invasion, while more likely magitech in origin, could also be based on mesmers’ portal magic.] More importantly, the Molten Alliance, the Aetherblades, the Toxic Alliance — randomly taking two things and mooshing them together — would actually make sense rather than just being lazy design. Lyssa is a twin goddess, portrayed as two intertwined beings. Basically, all of Scarlet’s actions could be explained as her dualistic divine nature subconsciously acting out through the filter of an already capricious and somewhat unethical mortal’s mind.

Aside from the staggering amount of brainstorm and the highly speculative nature of the above post and the outright debunked assumption that Scarlet did delve into the Mists (she did not, only got lost in her own consciousness and the Dream/Nightmare thanks to having her senses fully deprived) and the totally wrong explanation for the absorption of the eternal, divine energies of a god…

… there is one fatal error in the above post that destroys it completely: Lyssa is not dead.

Thalador.4218:

Aside from the staggering amount of brainstorm and the highly speculative nature of the above post and the outright debunked assumption that Scarlet did delve into the Mists (she did not, only got lost in her own consciousness and the Dream/Nightmare thanks to having her senses fully deprived)

Do we really know what happened? Other than she didn’t see what she thought she saw (ie the Eternal Alchemy)? Which would be the case if somehow hollowed herself out enough inside through sensory deprivation and her own personal rejection of Dream/Nightmare to mentally absorb the purest essence of illusion. Ok, maybe not from the Mists specifically. From somewhere.

and the totally wrong explanation for the absorption of the eternal, divine energies of a god…

Is this something that is solidly explained in lore? The only case I’m aware of that is well known is Kormir, and that was with a freshly dead god.

… there is one fatal error in the above post that destroys it completely: Lyssa is not dead.

Is that confirmed? Sure, prayers work, but “dead” for a god doesn’t mean the same thing as for a mortal, and what it does mean isn’t too well defined. Maybe prayers still work because of a combination of the remaining divine essence and the belief of the one praying. Certainly, the Risen Priestess of Lyssa in the Cathedral of Eternal Radiance claims that all the gods are dead, and that Lyssa specifically was prey for Zhaitan. She may have just been taunting players as his mouthpiece, but maybe not.

- And this so-called “purest essence of illusion” just happened to be in the Dream/her own consciousness just when she went sensually-deprived. Also, if a god was dead his/her energies couldn’t linger anywhere without exploding a large chunk of reality in a very short time.

- Abaddon and Kormir, Dhuum and Grenth. A god can be killed the god fully, or stripped of his/her divinity, but not before the successor is blessed with an enchantment of sorts that can soak up all the knowledge and power – prepare his/her mind and soul for ascension – without killing the person… which would also result in a Realm of Torment and Tyria sized explosion. Which god would give such a blessing to a single, unebelieving creature on a planet that they’d long left.

- https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/lore/Status-of-Lyssa-Spoilers/first#post1734492

So no, the High Priestess is trying to undermine the faith and hope of those she’s fighting. Remember, as a powerful mesmer she probably sees into people’s minds, and if we consider that one Pact soldier who is said to have been blessed by Lyssa in all his life and is there battling the priestess with the rest of us, it’s very easy to see that she lies just like the Emperor does to Luke to break him and make him do something stupid.

Also, it is just that one priestess that utters such lie. Prince Ellasal who Trahearne calls out for the atrocity they were doing in the ossuary says that while it was a sacred place to Lyssa, since she is no longer with them they turned to serve the dragon. The prince is a mesmer too, yet he speaks plainly and squarely. Then, Priestess Farnax in Arah uses the same psychological warfare again, but she mentions nothing about Lyssa getting devoured, only that Zhaitan eats gods. Which is actually true to a certain degree, as Zhaitan consumed almost all of the divine power they left behind, including Abaddon’s. Just look at their colossal, corrupted statues. Those were indeed mere prey for Zhaitan.

Risen who are not mind-screwing, deceptive, and highly mesmeric say nothing about the gods being dead:

“The gods have forsaken you! This land is Zhaitan’s!” – A Risen Giant Champion of Zhaitan

As for the power of a god getting consumed by a dragon: not going to happen, because A ) dragon has no enchantment to make it a potential container for eternal energies, and B ) if Zhaitan managed to consume a god, he would have been unstoppable, regardless of how much we weakened him during the Orrian campaign. He would’ve definitely destroyed the entire Pact all by himself, not fall to some laser beams and a collapsing tower. (Plus he had no mesmeric abilities himself.)

I’m not really sure if there’s any real need for “enchantments” – I mean, the avatars of the gods did say they gave Kormir their “greatest gift” but nothing really says that’s magical. I’m pretty much playing the devil’s advocate for my own view of that mission, but as far as we can tell they only said fancy words – no magic attached.

This said, however, it is extremely unlikely that Zhaitan had consumed a god. Even if the Lyssan priestesses are right in that Lyssa is dead, given our knowledge of divinity Zhaitan would have:
1) Exploded upon death.
2) Shined so bright we would have turned blind.
3) Not fall so easily despite being starved, given the pure amount of magical energies of a god it would have devoured.
3.5) It in turn would not have looked the way it did because the look was partially due to his starvation and the Pact’s other efforts in Orr.

If any Elder Dragon had consumed a god, it would be either Jormag – who via the Sons of Svanir has gained access to the Mists – or Kralkatorrik – who was last seen near Tomb of the Primeval Kings and hasn’t been heard from since (he could have fled into the Mists quite easily). But to do that not only would the dragon need access to the Mists, but to be able to find where the gods went after they left the Mists since per Priestess Rhia (sp?), the gods are known not to be within the Mists themselves anymore. And lastly, if there is a god that’s been killed, it’d be Lyssa since no other being mentions Lyssa’s potential death, and we know for a fact that Grenth is alive per the Avatar of Grenth (unless the reaper lies) – though the chance of it having been Zhaitan who killed her? Slim to none.

Either way, Perilisk, your theory of Scarlet having ascended into godhood by taking Lyssa’s divinity is fully and utterly debunked. Even if Lyssa was dead, her essence wouldn’t have gone to the Mists unless possibly if it caused an explosion the way Abaddon’s would have if not for Kormir, and Scarlet didn’t really go to the Eternal Alchemy (the device was merely a sensory deprivation device). Even if she did witness Eternal Alchemy, that’s not the same as the Mists. The Mists are protomatter that serve as the beginning and end of all life. The Eternal Alchemy is how everything interconnects and functions together. Technically speaking, the Eternal Alchemy is not a place to “go to” so even if Scarlet did see the Eternal Alchemy, she didn’t go there – as that would be an impossible act.

So, this just occurred to me, and since this thread is talking about the holes in Scarlet’s story I’ll put it here…

Scarlet/Ceara was on Teyo’s krewe leading up to the Snaff Prize. We don’t know that this is our Snaff Prize from the asuran personal story, but assuming it is, Teyo’s krewe was also the one in charge of that year’s entry. And what was said entry? A device that is capable of bending non-asura to the user’s will. IF Scarlet used the Floating Grizwhirl- and I’m not saying she did, just that it’s a possibility- but if she did, I’d feel a lot better about her managing to smooth-talk her way with the Flame Legion and dredge leadership. Though it would still be aggravating that the devs didn’t even hint at it until a short story months later.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Either way, Perilisk, your theory of Scarlet having ascended into godhood by taking Lyssa’s divinity is fully and utterly debunked. Even if Lyssa was dead, her essence wouldn’t have gone to the Mists unless possibly if it caused an explosion the way Abaddon’s would have if not for Kormir, and Scarlet didn’t really go to the Eternal Alchemy (the device was merely a sensory deprivation device). Even if she did witness Eternal Alchemy, that’s not the same as the Mists. The Mists are protomatter that serve as the beginning and end of all life. The Eternal Alchemy is how everything interconnects and functions together. Technically speaking, the Eternal Alchemy is not a place to “go to” so even if Scarlet did see the Eternal Alchemy, she didn’t go there – as that would be an impossible act.

The path by which Lyssa’s divinity got to Ceara was pure speculation (but I never meant to suggest that it involved the actual Eternal Alchemy, just that in her hypnotic state her mind generated such a thorough and powerful illusion she somehow opened herself up to the divine essence of illusion magic — and as a Sylvari, she sort of has a permanent quasi-telepathic channel up all the time anyway). The theory was more rooted in her behavior and abilities.

Stripping the theory down to the basics, which are more supported by evidence:

• In the isolation chamber, Ceara/Scarlet had a vision of a red thorny vine intertwined with the Pale Tree. Two powerful magical (and female, FWIW) beings intertwined, which is Lyssa’s thing.
• This couldn’t have been a simple hallucination, because afterward she physically changed in appearance to mimic the red vine and gained the ability to go all Viktoria on people. Unless that sort of mind/body link is normal for Sylvari, I guess.
• Since then, she’s been obsessed with turning pairs of things into one thing (FL+Dredge, Inquest+Priates, NC+Krait). Which, again, is kind of Lyssa’s thing.
• Ceara was a simple mortal engineer, albeit a talented one. Scarlet’s power, and her ability to persuade and deceive her minions, haven’t really been explained. Lyssa’s divinity, specifically, would be an acceptable explanation.
• There is a lot of powerful Mesmer magic (like the veil in Kessex Hills, possibly Scarlet’s portals if they aren’t pure magitech) whose source hasn’t been revealed yet AFAIK. Lyssa’s divinity, specifically, would be an acceptable explanation.
• Divine transference has happened enough to be a plausible occurence, but not often enough to have clear, defined rules about how or why or under what circumstances.
• It is known that Jormag devoured at least one Norn spirit, which seem similar to gods in nature.
• There’s supporting evidence (not proof) for the idea that all or some of the gods, Lyssa in particular, died/were devoured. It is known that their presence is no longer strongly felt in Tyria.
• There no evidence one way or another what would happen if a Dragon did devour a god, and no reason to think it would become divine as Kormir did; it might just as easily simply start “digesting” the divine essence, and who knows how long that would take for such a large source of magical power?

So, what, now we can add godhood to her resume?
God kitten Mary Sue.

EDIT: Since when is “d—a—m—n” a word so dire it has to be censored?

No, fortunately we can’t. This speculation is probably on par with the “6 gods = 6 dragons” or the “Pale Tree = ED champion” aneurysms.

One more thing, since you can read all the discrediting points of your “counter” points above. Spirits of the Wild are nowhere near similar to gods in nature. Both spirits and gods represent certain values, but the semblance ends there.

(And I love how everyone ignores my thorough analysis of the corrupted priests’ twisted mentality, and goes on to take the words of a highly deceptive, mesmeric being at face value.)

@ perilisk.1874

The Lore Slayer is not Lyssa. Using technology to create illusions is not the same as magic. That illusion barrier around the Tower of Nightmare is all technology imo.

If the Lore Slayer is Lyssa, we would already be dead.

Er… i’m clearly out of the loop here. Any website/map area in-game where i could bring myself up-to-speed?

Dott.5672:

So, what, now we can add godhood to her resume?
God kitten Mary Sue.

EDIT: Since when is "kitten " a word so dire it has to be censored?

The real low blow is that I can’t even say kitten nal.

A—r—s—e—n—a—l

Sounds like utter twaddle to me that Scarlet imbibed Lyssa’s essence.

Dott.5672:

So, what, now we can add godhood to her resume?
God kitten Mary Sue.

EDIT: Since when is "kitten " a word so dire it has to be censored?

So’s kittenroach. xD

My problem with Scarlet is that she’s the Jon Favreau of Tyria: she’s in everything. During the QJ, I thought she was kind of funny, in small amounts. That quickly changed.

So… signed.

Dott.5672:

So, what, now we can add godhood to her resume?
God kitten Mary Sue.

Wouldn’t that make her less Mary Sue? No complains about the dragons being Mary Sue, they’re supposed to be super powerful and the audience can buy that. The audience ought to be able to buy that a reborn god is also pretty powerful, and that a reborn illusion god is pretty good at manipulating and deceiving. It’s when she’s just some random nutso Sylvari engineer that it feels pretty implausible.

In all fairness to you Perilisk, you have engaged in a debate about Lyssa, with arguably her 2 biggest fans. It is an interesting thought, but just highly unlikely. Between the upcoming fractal concerning the reactor, as well as the emphasis on chaos magic throughout the game, I’m curious as to what it could be building towards. I will certainly be paying attention.
Now that I make mention of it, are there any theories out there concerning all the chaos magic wreaking havoc in the world?

As a point of information here, the interview where it was revealed that the experiment that made Caera into Scarlet was effectively a sensory deprivation tank didn’t say that what Caera saw was definitely entirely in her head. It may be that the experiment was a success and that clearing out the physical distractions did grant her a special spiritual insight. Or it may be that, as sensory deprivation tanks often do, it just drove her insane. At this point, we don’t know.

(I’d have to admit, the cynical part of me thinks that that was thrown out as a fig leaf over the Villain Sue discussions – the direction the LS has gone implies that she does in fact have some special source of knowledge.)

Aaron Ansari.1604:

So, this just occurred to me, and since this thread is talking about the holes in Scarlet’s story I’ll put it here…

Scarlet/Ceara was on Teyo’s krewe leading up to the Snaff Prize. We don’t know that this is our Snaff Prize from the asuran personal story, but assuming it is, Teyo’s krewe was also the one in charge of that year’s entry. And what was said entry? A device that is capable of bending non-asura to the user’s will. IF Scarlet used the Floating Grizwhirl- and I’m not saying she did, just that it’s a possibility- but if she did, I’d feel a lot better about her managing to smooth-talk her way with the Flame Legion and dredge leadership. Though it would still be aggravating that the devs didn’t even hint at it until a short story months later.

That… is a very interesting hypothesis.

There’s two types of people who play Guild Wars 2:
1. Those who enjoy the lore
2. Those who just play the game

Anyone who enjoys the lore, does not enjoy Scarlet.

Signed.

Something to note here: In the Collaborative Development thread on the Living Story, Chris Whiteside gave a pretty clear acknowledgement that there were major problems with how Scarlet has been presented so far. Specifically, I’d point to this post

They’re intending to bring her story to conclusion regardless – which is probably fair enough. Given they have a four month lag between planning and implementation, there’s a good chance that by the time they get the chance to take the story in a new direction anyway, Scarlet’s story will either have already finished or be close enough that they might as well just finish it.

The key points, however, are:

1) The developers have directly recognised the problems with how Scarlet was done

2) The Scarlet storyline is intended to come to a conclusion, not be something that is going to continue to dominate LS for ever and ever.

3) With the above in mind, we can probably stop pruning a dead plant here.

OP – signed!

mercury ranique.2170:

Personally only a fraction of the people dislike Scarlet. but those are, as always the people who speak out on the forums. I absolutly love the character and think she is truly a job well done.

So definitely not signed.

So, are you just a troll or an Anet employee? :p

There was a lot of general QQ about Scarlet in LA map chat as well.

While this new update is one of the better material we got recently and aesthetically well done, all going back to Scarlet as the preview suggests is really disappointing. But I truly hope we can end the bonkers salad once and for all.

hedix.1986:

So, are you just a troll or an Anet employee? :p

There was a lot of general QQ about Scarlet in LA map chat as well.

While this new update is one of the better material we got recently and aesthetically well done, all going back to Scarlet as the preview suggests is really disappointing. But I truly hope we can end the bonkers salad once and for all.

That’s because QQing is contagious, especially on the internet. People might have a small problem(s) with a something (whether it would be a character, item, event, or place), but if they listen to a group of people say how horrible it is; it slowly starts to reshape their opinion on the matter.

That’s how Scarlet, an interesting but very lacking and flawed character in design, became, in people’s mind, the most hated lore breaking abomination that ever walked on Tyria.

Isn’t peer pressure swell?

Erukk.1408:

That’s because QQing is contagious, especially on the internet. People might have a small problem(s) with a something (whether it would be a character, item, event, or place), but if they listen to a group of people say how horrible it is; it slowly starts to reshape their opinion on the matter.

Just because someone says something, doesn’t mean you have to agree? You could have an entirely different opinion or even just slightly agree. I wouldn’t call that peer pressure at all. Nobody’s threatening anyone to get on the forums and rage about Scarlet.

I think that’s a lame excuse of the cause behind all the Scarlet hate. She just sucks, end of story.