Snaff's Mind-Control
I’d have to go find my copy of the book to say with 100% certainty but I don’t recall Snaff ever using any explicitly mesmer magic (unlike Queen Jennah).
Snaff’s telepathic control was, like most Asuran magic based around magitech devices. If I remember right it was primarily through use of a special crown/helm that let the user take direct control of whatever it was linked to (Snaff controlled a number of golems/devices with it ranging from battle-suits fashioned in his & Zojja’s likeness to grinder-boats designed to destroy hordes of undead as they boarded the ships.)
It wasn’t really mind control- like Riot said, he just used asuran crystals, a link between a device he wore and similar crystals on or in something else to gain access to what passed for a mind in other creatures (he desribed it as essentially functioning like a mental portal). More mindless creatures, like golems and non-sapient branded, could be controlled by this method, but with Kralkatorrik he was only able to interfere, temporarily disrupting the dragon’s control of its body to force it from the sky. It’s not like he could have just flown Kralk off to do something or used the link to take control of the Branded armies.
R.I.P., Old Man of Auld Red Wharf. Gone but never forgotten.
Snaff doesn’t use any direct magic in any form, let alone mesmer.
He used laurel-like devices encrusted with powerstones to connect his mind with another set of powerstones that were on the body or what he was controlling. In the case of his golems – “Big Snaff” and “Big Zojja” (former controlled by Snaff, latter by Zojja) – they had a kittenpit area for the pilot and a device; the golem’s heads were carved stone made to look like the pilot (Snaff and Zojja respectively) and dusted with crushed powerstone in order to show facial expression; the rest of the body was akin to other golems, joints being powerstones that held the limbs and other pieces together.
In his second shown golem, Sandy, it was carved-then-crushed sandstone that was also embued with crushed powerstone; naturally no kittenpit for a pilot but still same kind of head device on him.
When Destiny’s Edge fought Kralkatorrik and the branded, he utilized Kralkatorrik’s crystallized blood as replacement for standard powerstones, covering the branded with them to move their bodies against their will, and placing some on a yoke which Glint placed on Kralkatorrik’s head. This he used to gain access to Kralkatorrik’s mind – but not without a lot of mind games and the like.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
I literally just finished re-reading the book, so I can help you out here.
Like everyone else said, he used powerstones/kralky’s blood to control golems/minions. But fighting the mind of the dragon was something else entirely. They portrayed Kralky’s mind as a tornado of rage, endless hunger, etc. etc. Snaff put his mind in the center of that raging vortex, and basically showed Kralky everything he could never experience or understand. Memories, the feelings attached to them, etc. Meaningful to puny mortals, but unimportant and worthless to a being that only lives to consume magic and corrupt everything around it. By doing this, Snaff was able to seep into the subconscious of the dragon, and control his bodily functions against his will.
As Kralky fought Snaff’s mind, he tried, in vain, to trap him while simultaneously sending his minions after Snaff’s body. By the time he crashed, Snaff probably could’ve made the dragon die without needing the spear Glint gave Rytlock, and if Logan hadn’t run away like a love-crazed pansy, he would’ve had enough time to do so presumably. But Thackeray ran away, and the rest, as they say, is history.
But if Logan hadn’t run away, the charr in Ebonhawke that helped stem the tide of branded wouldn’t have been freed, thus Ebonhawke would have been wiped out because Jennah was still reeling from her attempt to see into Kralkatorrik’s mind unprepared. And most certainly would have suffered far larger casualties, and there would be no beginning of the charr-human peace treaty as that event was the very first steps towards it (with freeing the charr prisoners and Jennah’s little speech).
And if the branded had managed to kill Jennah, then Caudecus would no doubt have taken Kryta – say hello to Neo-White Mantle Kryta. And if not that, then Kryta would be torn into civil war while still fighting centaurs and, in 5 years time, an increased incursion of risen that bypassed Claw Island. The last human nation would undoubtably fallen or be rendered unable to assist the Pact.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
But if Logan hadn’t run away, the charr in Ebonhawke that helped stem the tide of branded wouldn’t have been freed, thus Ebonhawke would have been wiped out because Jennah was still reeling from her attempt to see into Kralkatorrik’s mind unprepared. And most certainly would have suffered far larger casualties, and there would be no beginning of the charr-human peace treaty as that event was the very first steps towards it (with freeing the charr prisoners and Jennah’s little speech).
And if the branded had managed to kill Jennah, then Caudecus would no doubt have taken Kryta – say hello to Neo-White Mantle Kryta. And if not that, then Kryta would be torn into civil war while still fighting centaurs and, in 5 years time, an increased incursion of risen that bypassed Claw Island. The last human nation would undoubtably fallen or be rendered unable to assist the Pact.
Valid points, but, I’m pretty sure both Jennah and Smodur wanted peace in Ebonhawke. Even if the Charr hadn’t been freed, she would have still, presumably, used the illusion on the surviving guardsmen. Logan’s presence at Ebonhawke didn’t really sway anything. Jennah saved the city. Plus, DE would have been able to kill Kralky, Snaff would have lived, the branded wouldn’t be an issue (presumably), and we’d all be mind-controlling gigantic golems made to kill dragon minions.
I don’t think it would’ve derailed the peace treaty either. Ghosts of Ascalon would, presumably still be happening. The Claw would have still been in Ascalon, and hell, maybe DE would’ve been the ones to retrieve it instead. Or maybe not, since a guild made up of each of the sentient races taking down a dragon would’ve been the ideal poster for unity. Nobody could’ve denied that, had they actually taken Kralky down.
Smodur seems to care more about freeing up his forces than peace itself. Annihilation of Ebonhawke would have served him equally well.
Jennah saved the city, sure, but keep in mind that when Logan showed up the branded were butchering the Ebon Vanguard/Seraph forces, and were at the front doors of the building Jennah was hiding in – the only other occupant of which was Anise. Logan’s arrival and freeing the charr gave the Ebon Vanguard and Seraph some recooperation time and took the branded off of said front doors. If Jennah was able to save the city just like that – like so many seem to presume – then why didn’t she? Why wait until her forces were clearly losing, on the brink of death with so many casualties on both sides? Why wait until the man she loved was nearly killed? Keep in mind that this wasn’t all happening in mere moments, but was an elongated battle – long enough to tire out the forces. We don’t have an exact time estimate, but given Jennah’s lack of interaction for the entire duration of the battle, it’s pretty clear that she had to recooperate. If Logan hadn’t shown up, then the branded would have gotten to her – and possibly killed her depending on Anise’s abilities – well before she could have saved the city.
The branded would be an issue with Kralkatorrik’s death – just as the risen are; just as Tequatl continued to be. They would spread the corruption under the leadership of champions. They wouldn’t be as big of an issue, but the Dragonbrand would remain, and would spread just as it does now.
And I highly doubt Snaff’s survival would have resulted in mind-controlled golems for all. Simply because asura don’t tend to like spreading their – or others of their races’ – inventions without a price. And they’d be no more effective at killing dragons than standard golems, really, beyond the fact that they’d be reacting like a person would. Besides, if such was viable… why doesn’t Zojja introduce such? As Snaff’s apprentice, she should have some degree of knowledge about them, given that she piloted one such golem a lot!
And Ghosts of Ascalon wouldn’t have happened because without Jennah, there’d be no mission to go into Ascalon City to retrieve the Claw of the Khan-Ur.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Smodur seems to care more about freeing up his forces than peace itself. Annihilation of Ebonhawke would have served him equally well.
Jennah saved the city, sure, but keep in mind that when Logan showed up the branded were butchering the Ebon Vanguard/Seraph forces, and were at the front doors of the building Jennah was hiding in – the only other occupant of which was Anise. Logan’s arrival and freeing the charr gave the Ebon Vanguard and Seraph some recooperation time and took the branded off of said front doors. If Jennah was able to save the city just like that – like so many seem to presume – then why didn’t she? Why wait until her forces were clearly losing, on the brink of death with so many casualties on both sides? Why wait until the man she loved was nearly killed? Keep in mind that this wasn’t all happening in mere moments, but was an elongated battle – long enough to tire out the forces. We don’t have an exact time estimate, but given Jennah’s lack of interaction for the entire duration of the battle, it’s pretty clear that she had to recooperate. If Logan hadn’t shown up, then the branded would have gotten to her – and possibly killed her depending on Anise’s abilities – well before she could have saved the city.
The branded would be an issue with Kralkatorrik’s death – just as the risen are; just as Tequatl continued to be. They would spread the corruption under the leadership of champions. They wouldn’t be as big of an issue, but the Dragonbrand would remain, and would spread just as it does now.
And I highly doubt Snaff’s survival would have resulted in mind-controlled golems for all. Simply because asura don’t tend to like spreading their – or others of their races’ – inventions without a price. And they’d be no more effective at killing dragons than standard golems, really, beyond the fact that they’d be reacting like a person would. Besides, if such was viable… why doesn’t Zojja introduce such? As Snaff’s apprentice, she should have some degree of knowledge about them, given that she piloted one such golem a lot!
And Ghosts of Ascalon wouldn’t have happened because without Jennah, there’d be no mission to go into Ascalon City to retrieve the Claw of the Khan-Ur.
When Logan showed up she was in the tower surrounded by Shining Blade. Outside, she was surrounded by Seraph, although they were too late to save their captain. Yes she had to recuperate, from looking into Kralky’s mind, but she would have still been able to cast her illusion, with or without the charr. The branded were nowhere near her, nor were they focusing on her. Plus, the odds of giant ogres/hyenas successfully climbing a narrow human turret are low. And, there’s the Shining Blade to deal with, not to mention the queen herself. Her overdeveloped sense of caution basically doomed the fight with the dragon, although, had she known about it, I think she would’ve made Logan stay.
Where Snaff is concerned, I disagree. He was the hero we needed, and his golems were undisguisedly efficient at killing dragon minions. It was stated many times that nobody would ever be able to build golems like he did, not even his apprentice. As brilliant as she is, she trusts magic over machinery. If they had beaten Kralky, which they could’ve done if Logan manned his kitten post, Snaff would’ve definitely lent his inventions to a combined force. There’d be no reason not to, provided he had enough money/materials to build them.
There are too many variables on whether or not Ebonhawke would’ve survived without Logan. Personally, I could see a lot more carnage, but no real change. Jennah has a habit of summoning him for no reason. Plus, I’m also pretty sure her final spell was drawn out for dramatic flair, like many other things are in the book.
(edited by Charrlizard.8041)
When Logan showed up she was in the tower surrounded by Shining Blade. Outside, she was surrounded by Seraph, although they were too late to save their captain.
- She had three Shining Blade guards with her, including Anise. That’s not a big defense.
- The Seraph and Ebon Vanguard were literally being torn apart, barely stalling the Branded.
- Dylan, said captain, died at the door of the keep Jennah was in, surrounded by branded hyenas. The same keep which the charr prisoners – nearly a hundred of them – were held in and pushed the branded away from.
They were, quite literally, on Jennah’s doorsteps with only a handful of soldiers between her and the door the branded were battering on when Logan showed up.
Yes she had to recuperate, from looking into Kralky’s mind, but she would have still been able to cast her illusion, with or without the charr.
That is quite unlikely. The entire battle against Kralkatorrik took place inbetween the time that Logan showed up – when the humans were being torn to piece (quite literally and quite fast) to when Jennah cast her spell. The charr and Logan didn’t buy a few seconds, nor was it just a few minutes, but a lot of minutes – possibly up to an hour, given how much detail went into the battles.
Plus, the odds of giant ogres/hyenas successfully climbing a narrow human turret are low.
Because there is ever a mention of a narrow human turret…
And, there’s the Shining Blade to deal with, not to mention the queen herself. Her overdeveloped sense of caution basically doomed the fight with the dragon, although, had she known about it, I think she would’ve made Logan stay.
Probably, and probably at the cost of her own life.
Where Snaff is concerned, I disagree. He was the hero we needed, and his golems were undisguisedly efficient at killing dragon minions. It was stated many times that nobody would ever be able to build golems like he did, not even his apprentice. As brilliant as she is, she trusts magic over machinery. If they had beaten Kralky, which they could’ve done if Logan manned his kitten post, Snaff would’ve definitely lent his inventions to a combined force. There’d be no reason not to, provided he had enough money/materials to build them.
All number of things are efficient at killing dragon minions. That’s not much of an issue, really, given that they use dragon minions as a test for Lion’s Arch’s arena. It’s the dragon champions which were always a problem – and the golems did no better against them than Rytlock or Logan or Eir did.
Jennah has a habit of summoning him for no reason.
Because summoning him once is a habit…
Plus, I’m also pretty sure her final spell was drawn out for dramatic flair, like many other things are in the book.
No doubt about that, but if it weren’t meant to be a case of “Logan’s arrival saved their kitten” then I think that Logan would have arrived later at Ebonhawke than he did, that they would have put less effort into describing all the minions Logan and charr prisoners managed to kill.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.