Guild Wars 2

Anatoli Ingram of the Flameseeker Chronicles actually brought up the idea of the Zephyrites helping LA already yesterday in his blog post. I agree with his speculation and I was also considering this idea for quite some time as an interesting potential development:

This speculation might be born out of wishful thinking, but what would you think about the Zephyrites anchoring above Lions Arch early on in Season 2 and helping to rebuild the city. After all, they had a profitable trade agreement with the now defunct LA authorities, and they might have an interest in reinstating this agreement. They could build a temporary “upper level” with the Zephyr Sanctum hovering atop, while in the ruins below slowly the rebuilding takes place. And with their airships, they could easily be the ones to provide the necessary resources for rebuilding LA.

While I understand that the Zephyrites might not anchor anywhere exposed for a too long period without attracting the attention of Kralkatorrik’s agents (or whoever it is that they are hiding from) it might be an interesting opportunity for the devs to rebuild LA in a more “vertical” way, maybe even realizing some of the earlier concepts they had before launch.

~MRA

I’d say there’s a pretty good chance they’ll show up. ANet has to do something with the zone, seeing as right now it’s just a big hole in the map, and with the Captain’s Council not letting citizens in, holidays are out. I see why they wouldn’t want to rebuild it, at least not so soon, but that means that some kind of temporary content has to start cycling through LA before it goes the way of Southsun and we forget the place exists. The Zephyr Sanctum would certainly be an easy solution, though I don’t believe the Zephyrites would be much help in rebuilding. A nomadic existence in the skies doesn’t exactly lend itself to a surplus of resources, especially bulky building materials.

Lion’s Arch has a treaty with the Zephyrites. Aiding in rebuilding LA would be a good show of that treaty.

Wasn’t it just a trade agreement?

It would make sense for the Zephyites to assist in rebuilding LA as per their treaty, but also as a way to form a more permenent trade agreement, as well as an outpost to conduct business from. Plus it would serve as competition for the BLTC. There are many factions who would stand to gain much by assisting in the rebuilding of LA.

As far as their usefulness in the project. I think they could be VERY valuable. They have access to many resources, and the speed of transportation. I wouldn’t be surprised to see them as a major part in the next LS and the rebuilding of LA.

Aaron Ansari.1604:

A nomadic existence in the skies doesn’t exactly lend itself to a surplus of resources, especially bulky building materials.

True, they most certainly would not have stockpiled those materials. But as airship traders they would have the means of acquiring and delivering them when necessary.

~MRA

pdavis.8031:

It would make sense for the Zephyites to assist in rebuilding LA as per their treaty, but also as a way to form a more permenent trade agreement, as well as an outpost to conduct business from. Plus it would serve as competition for the BLTC. There are many factions who would stand to gain much by assisting in the rebuilding of LA.

As far as their usefulness in the project. I think they could be VERY valuable. They have access to many resources, and the speed of transportation. I wouldn’t be surprised to see them as a major part in the next LS and the rebuilding of LA.

Again, where would they have resources from? Wood and rock both require land, and the Zephyrites stick to the sky. Creating a permanent would also be against their interests- the entire reason they have a flying sanctum is so that they can stay away from conflicts on the ground, so creating a permanent tie to a place that draws trouble like a corpse draws flies would be ridiculous.

@MRA True, they could pick them up easily, but I don’t think that’d really be necessary. The Captain’s Council would have to pay for it all anyway, and Lion’s Arch’s mine and lumber camp in Lornar’s are still functional. The only room I see for the Zephyrites is to play middleman if those places don’t turn out resources fast enough… and even then, I’d expect the Council to turn first to Kryta, and maybe even the charr legions, as they’d be able to move the material quicker and cheaper thanks to the asura gates.

The authorities of LA are not defunct… they are simply keeping the city as clear of people as they can to make reconstruction, repairs, and clean-up as easy as possible without dealing with hordes of citizens throwing things around trying to find loved ones or their valuables in the rubble.

Kalavier.1097:

The authorities of LA are not defunct… they are simply keeping the city as clear of people as they can to make reconstruction, repairs, and clean-up as easy as possible without dealing with hordes of citizens throwing things around trying to find loved ones or their valuables in the rubble.

That sound like a little bit of an euphemism to me.

As far as I know they are not even assembled anymore, at least half of them are scattered around in refugee camps, Ellen Kiel is wherever (in her airship?), and Captain Peter is, well, most likely lost. Even if not defunct, I hardly see this government working at peak efficiency.

~MRA

Aaron Ansari.1604:

pdavis.8031:

It would make sense for the Zephyites to assist in rebuilding LA as per their treaty, but also as a way to form a more permenent trade agreement, as well as an outpost to conduct business from. Plus it would serve as competition for the BLTC. There are many factions who would stand to gain much by assisting in the rebuilding of LA.

As far as their usefulness in the project. I think they could be VERY valuable. They have access to many resources, and the speed of transportation. I wouldn’t be surprised to see them as a major part in the next LS and the rebuilding of LA.

Again, where would they have resources from? Wood and rock both require land, and the Zephyrites stick to the sky. Creating a permanent would also be against their interests- the entire reason they have a flying sanctum is so that they can stay away from conflicts on the ground, so creating a permanent tie to a place that draws trouble like a corpse draws flies would be ridiculous.

True, while they do stick to the sky, and not likely stockpiled such things, they CAN buy and trade for them from the various peoples they do business with. It’s not far fetched to consider that if they are undertaking a MAJOR project in rebuilding LA that they would actively seek out such materials. Or at the very least, hire themselves out as transport for those very goods that others have aquired for the rebuilding. And having invested, in one way or another, in the rebuilding of LA they could easily justify leaving an agent on the ground. And while the OLD LA was built largly by pirates, I would think that the NEW LA would be completly different, both in culture and construction, and would be more accepting of a Zephyrite presence on a permenent basis.

Accepting or not, LA has a bad track record of attracting negative attention. Just in the GW2 timeline, so the last 2 years, it’s been attacked three times, and the last one razed it to the ground, while all the other major cities have only experienced one attack (well, two, in DR’s case) in the same time frame, none of which did any lasting damage. Short of an area under the control of an active Elder Dragon, LA seems the worst place for the Zephyrites to put down roots.

True, but it IS a central hub for trade. But whether or not they decide to put down roots, I still believe they can be an integral part in the reconstruction. And leaving an agent on the ground, doesn’t mean that the whole of them stop being sky nomads, just having a permenent “store” to be able to conduct trade better.

Aaron Ansari.1604:

Wasn’t it just a trade agreement?

Technically, yes. A trade agreement, but the Zephyrites are said to often be used for peace summits and the like, so it would not be strange for them to offer what they could to aid in rebuilding those they have agreements with (perhaps for a price, but equally likely more as an investment – without LA, what can they trade for?).

If one looks at Lion’s Arch, while on the surface it is a place for outlaws, but underneath at its core, it is more a place for peaceful co-existence. And this is what the Zephyrites strive for.

Aaron Ansari.1604:

Accepting or not, LA has a bad track record of attracting negative attention. Just in the GW2 timeline, so the last 2 years, it’s been attacked three times, and the last one razed it to the ground, while all the other major cities have only experienced one attack (well, two, in DR’s case) in the same time frame, none of which did any lasting damage. Short of an area under the control of an active Elder Dragon, LA seems the worst place for the Zephyrites to put down roots.

Four attempts on LA (Priory storyline being the fourth, which didn’t get close to a threat on the actual city due to the once-in-the-game preemptive strike by the good guys). But it is attacked because of my prior point – that it is a place for multiple cultures co-existing (lots more targets than the other cities) and is a social and trade hub.

The reasons it is attacked are the same reasons why the Zephyrites would probably want a foothold there.

MRA.4758:

Kalavier.1097:

The authorities of LA are not defunct… they are simply keeping the city as clear of people as they can to make reconstruction, repairs, and clean-up as easy as possible without dealing with hordes of citizens throwing things around trying to find loved ones or their valuables in the rubble.

That sound like a little bit of an euphemism to me.

As far as I know they are not even assembled anymore, at least half of them are scattered around in refugee camps, Ellen Kiel is wherever (in her airship?), and Captain Peter is, well, most likely lost. Even if not defunct, I hardly see this government working at peak efficiency.

~MRA

They obviously are meeting as noted when Kiel put forth the idea of making Gnashblade support the Lionguard in the retaking efforts.

One is getting trade lines with the havens rebuilt, Kiel and Magnus securing the city. The council likely is spread around simply so there is leadership in each camp and to direct the refugees in posistive manners.

They might not be at 100%, but they are around. Also Peter is/was in LA. He stayed behind to help guide civilians out and in the process got trapped in. (He appeared in areas in LA during the battle). “Lost” refers to his ship, not him actually getting lost.

Why would LA need the Zephyrites help? It’s not like the surviving citizens have a whole lot to do these days, what else are they going to do? Lion’s Arch was also one of (if not the) largest trading capitals in Tyria so its former residents are either very resource rich or have the connection to many resources flowing throughout Tyria, it wouldn’t make sense for the rebuilding of Lion’s Arch to require resources from people like the Zephyrites when the city is supposed to have trade systems set up with many other groups across Tyria. Lion’s Arch was the only place in Tyria with an asura gate leading to all five racial cities, what could the Zephyrites offer Lion’s Arch that the city couldn’t get via rebuilding the asura gates and trading with the five major races? It’s gotta be more efficient to load up a dolyak and walk it through a gate rather than fly Zephyrite ships all around the place. What’s in it for the Zephyrites that they aren’t already getting that is worth the risk?

Outside of a lore standpoint, Zephyrite stuff turned up in the dat over the last few months so it’s very likely they are returning sooner rather than later, so it’s only natural that their return overlaps with Lion’s Arch but I’d be personally disappointed if they were heavily involved with the reconstruction (anything much beyond a supply drop). The Zephyrite lore and identity is the highlight of the Living World for me but it exists primarily outside of Lion’s Arch and deals with issues and themes outside of the city (GW1 lore with Glint, represents human diversity from GW1 and most importantly it has a link to Kralkatorrik and Glint’s children). I’d hate to see those interesting plot points be dragged down by Lion’s Arch.

Then look at the other things that made the Bazaar such a popular release – one of the only new maps Tyria received. People loved the map specifically. I’d hate to lose that map so the Zephyrites could anchor in Lion’s Arch. Sure it gives the devs the opportunity to make a fresh take on the Zephyrite landing location, but it would have to be temporary (unless the Zephyrites are staying) and it would throw away the beautiful old map as well as abandon one of the benefits of last year’s releases (several of which were already abandoned) – a framework of festivals to re-release every year allowing for a lighter work load because of reusing content. We already lost all of the Lion’s Arch festival decorations (unless Lion’s Arch is rebuilt to look the same) it would be silly to throw away Bazaar creating more work for themselves and abandoning what is arguably the best received content since the first FotM update.

I can see the Zephyrites having token involvement in the form of a supply drop, but any robust or long term involvement has too many drawbacks imo and it’s not the best use of the Zephyrites imo. We were told more than once last year that they built several festivals in an attempt to build up a library of recurring releases, they cleverly destroyed most of that with Lion’s Arch (Halloween, Wintersday, Dragonbash) why remove another piece from their library?

People are forgetting something important. The Zephyrites don’t need to bring resources to help rebuilt LA, because they can possible bring something better…. The Bazaar of the Four Winds.

They might not be able to bring the materials themselves to LA, but they can possibly bring the merchants that can bring them to there, if they are allowed to anchor above LA anyway. All they would need is the Captain’s Council’s permission, along with probably some lessening of restrictions and regulations for the time of the Bazaar. For those less savory merchants.

I don’t know how much sway the Sanctum had on the Bazaar. Remember that the two are not inextricably linked- the Bazaar has no set location or schedule, and the Sanctum is only a sometime visitor to it.

EDIT: That said, I have had the thought that the disruptive black marketeers Belinda is chasing are not bandits, who have thus far shown no interest in selling goods on the sly or trying to economically destabilize DR, but instead the Bazaar of the Four Winds. If I’m right, we could see if and how they’ll tie into Season 2 sooner rather than later.

The zephyrites traded their kites and fortune scraps for our material resources that we gathered from the ground. They need what they have, because they are not getting more of that in the sky, and what is needed to rebuild a city is materials. What exactly can they give to Lions Arch that they dont need but we do? Karma boosters? Wind catchers?

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Lion’s Arch has a treaty with the Zephyrites. Aiding in rebuilding LA would be a good show of that treaty.

i agree. and in the background it would seem that the zephyrites rebuilding LA would be a good springboard connection to cantha if it ever became a possibility that we could go back there.

@Lakdav: how about the crystals to aid workers in getting hard-to-reach places, or hastening the travel of supplies?

Shiren.9532:

Why would LA need the Zephyrites help? It’s not like the surviving citizens have a whole lot to do these days, what else are they going to do? Lion’s Arch was also one of (if not the) largest trading capitals in Tyria so its former residents are either very resource rich or have the connection to many resources flowing throughout Tyria, it wouldn’t make sense for the rebuilding of Lion’s Arch to require resources from people like the Zephyrites when the city is supposed to have trade systems set up with many other groups across Tyria. Lion’s Arch was the only place in Tyria with an asura gate leading to all five racial cities, what could the Zephyrites offer Lion’s Arch that the city couldn’t get via rebuilding the asura gates and trading with the five major races? It’s gotta be more efficient to load up a dolyak and walk it through a gate rather than fly Zephyrite ships all around the place. What’s in it for the Zephyrites that they aren’t already getting that is worth the risk?

About the gates. Although it’s a game mechanic for players to use the gates for free. In the lore, there is a charge for using the gates, and an additional charge for the amount of cargo passing through. The gates require a large amount of energy to operate, and a large expense and effort to change the destination of the gates. I can’t see trains of dolyaks wandering through Rata Sum, or Ebonhawk. Ebonhawk is only recently freed from the siege of Charr, but still plagued by sepratists and renegade Charr. Any large amounts of movement into Ebonhawk is sure to hindered by these parties. Hoelbrak and The Grove shouldn’t be too much of an issue, but Divinities Reach would also pose the same logistical issues as Ebonhawk and Rata Sum. So that leaves Hoelbrak and The Grove as the only viable means of supplying materials to rebuild. The Zephyrites on the other hand, in accordance with their desire for peace, would be a much better alternative for supply. They could, and probably would, deliver supplies gratis to LA in the interests of peace. The other cities, not only have the logistical issues, but dangers outside as well. Centaurs and Bandits, Sons of Svanir, creatures and what not. Although it would be a good idea as an in game mechanic to defend the supply trains as they travel to LA, much like the supply dolyak events in WvW, it doesn’t make much sense. Where as the Zephyrites can travel more quickly, and safely, to and from any location.

Same with waypoints. We can assume there is a price for transporting cargo (if that’s even possible), and it’s steep enough to simply warrant most people just hiking their goods and cargo instead of using the waypoints.

LA could use one of their airships to go pick up supplies though.

Kalavier.1097:

LA could use one of their airships to go pick up supplies though.

Shouldn’t it rather be “their one airship”, or how many airships are currently at the Captains Council’s disposal?

~MRA

MRA.4758:

Kalavier.1097:

LA could use one of their airships to go pick up supplies though.

Shouldn’t it rather be “their one airship”, or how many airships are currently at the Captains Council’s disposal?

~MRA

They have Kiel’s airship, the Havoc’s Heir, and at least one which appeared in the Aetherblade path dropped off lionguard (I forget if one or two showed up in that scene, but they were both ‘normal’ airships if two)

There was one plain airships parked near the friendly pirate camp (near the swamp in Kessex hills), but it moved/got taken out.

So, they have at LEAST 2 or 3(depend on the cutscene at end of aetherblade path, I’ll check it later), with maybe 4 total airships.

Only 1 showed up I think, but it uses the same model as Havoc’s Heir so the two could be the same. I think the Lionguard only have 2 airships.

All non-Aetherblade airships use the same model technically.

So they have 2-3 airships that we know about.

That isn’t true. There are presently 5 airship models in the game. You have the original Pact model, the Aetherblade model, and the three PvP/WvW models (the difference between the red PvP/WvW model and the Aetherblade model is that the Aetherblades’ airships have their emblem (a skull/cog mix) on the sides of the balloons while the PvP/WvW ones are blank).

I think Kiel’s airship actually uses the red PvP/WvW model, as I don’t recall the Aetherblade emblem on its side (Which would make perfect sense too).

I don’t go into edge of the mists much(hence not thinking about them. But the only difference being green/red/blue stuff instead of aetherblade red isn’t a huge model difference to me), but even then it doesn’t really change that most of the airships we see use the same model parked at Fort trinity/over Vigil Keep. It’s safer to go “It could be that one, or another since we don’t have hull markings on them.”

Which would be a neat thing they could do. Make different named airships have some sort of emblem that clearly marks which one they are.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

I think Kiel’s airship actually uses the red PvP/WvW model, as I don’t recall the Aetherblade emblem on its side (Which would make perfect sense too).

It’s there. You need to climb to get an angle to see it, but from the top of Stormbluff it’s clearly visible.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

@Lakdav: how about the crystals to aid workers in getting hard-to-reach places, or hastening the travel of supplies?

Thats reasonable, though i have my doubts about civilians using the stuff. Our characters can handle it fine thanks to gameplay convenience, but i figure the usage of those crystals is something to be specificly trained at, possibly through life. Getting to hard to reach places is one thing, the other thing is getting back from there safely with the gathered supplies.

Regardless, if thats the most they can do for us, thats hardly the Zephyrites “rebuilding” LA, more like just aiding it a bit. Thats more probable.

So it appears that the Zephyrites are indeed aiding in the rebuilding of LA, not only to honor their trade agreement, but also to supply whatever resources as well as funding. So it looks like the we were right and the Zephyrites are aiding in the rebuilding of LA.