(Spoiler) Living Story S3E5 Discussion
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- At 0:51 there’s a brand new green-destroyer model, as well. There may be more, finally some diversity in destroyers.
As to Lazarus “definitely being not Lazarus” – I wouldn’t be so sure. The PC’s lines are, after all, created from an incomplete perspective that we players know more about (that being that Lazarus can physically exist without all his aspects). All the lines prove is that the artifact did indeed have an aspect of Lazarus, if we take them at face value.
And whoever Lazarus truly is, it would seem that Kasmeer’s surprised by it (if the lines-to-imagery is giving an accurate depiction). Which if so implies Kasmeer knows something about his true identity (that is: knows who the person pretending to be Lazarus is, not that they were pretending to be Lazarus).
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
- At 0:51 there’s a brand new green-destroyer model, as well. There may be more, finally some diversity in destroyers.
As to Lazarus “definitely being not Lazarus” – I wouldn’t be so sure. The PC’s lines are, after all, created from an incomplete perspective that we players know more about (that being that Lazarus can physically exist without all his aspects). All the lines prove is that the artifact did indeed have an aspect of Lazarus, if we take them at face value.
And whoever Lazarus truly is, it would seem that Kasmeer’s surprised by it (if the lines-to-imagery is giving an accurate depiction). Which if so implies Kasmeer knows something about his true identity (that is: knows who the person pretending to be Lazarus is, not that they were pretending to be Lazarus).
Something this reminded me of (which may or may not be completely irrelevant here) is some of the dialogue from Hidden Arcana, where Marjory and Kasmeer are surprised by, but seem to recognise, who gave the Master of Peace the egg – something that’s not really been revisited since, nor has it been revealed who they though it was.
- At 0:51 there’s a brand new green-destroyer model, as well. There may be more, finally some diversity in destroyers.
As to Lazarus “definitely being not Lazarus” – I wouldn’t be so sure. The PC’s lines are, after all, created from an incomplete perspective that we players know more about (that being that Lazarus can physically exist without all his aspects). All the lines prove is that the artifact did indeed have an aspect of Lazarus, if we take them at face value.
And whoever Lazarus truly is, it would seem that Kasmeer’s surprised by it (if the lines-to-imagery is giving an accurate depiction). Which if so implies Kasmeer knows something about his true identity (that is: knows who the person pretending to be Lazarus is, not that they were pretending to be Lazarus).
Something this reminded me of (which may or may not be completely irrelevant here) is some of the dialogue from Hidden Arcana, where Marjory and Kasmeer are surprised by, but seem to recognise, who gave the Master of Peace the egg – something that’s not really been revisited since, nor has it been revealed who they though it was.
It reminded me in the same way too, not that i can find much plausability in any potential link mind you.
Something this reminded me of (which may or may not be completely irrelevant here) is some of the dialogue from Hidden Arcana, where Marjory and Kasmeer are surprised by, but seem to recognise, who gave the Master of Peace the egg – something that’s not really been revisited since, nor has it been revealed who they though it was.
It reminded me in the same way too, not that i can find much plausability in any potential link mind you.
The only relevance I could think of that isn’t a massive stretch, is that we know Lazarus has an interest in Aurene’s survival. Someone powerful enough to convincingly impersonate a Mursaat, could they also have been impresonating whoever that was in Glint’s lair? I.E. fake-Lazarus has been lurking in the background a lot longer than just season 3.
To what point?
As brought up in the other Lazarus identity thread, why hide his identity to the PC during Dragon Vigil if he were a good guy (like the guy who gave the Master of Peace the egg)?
And if he were impersonating the guy who gave the egg, then how and when and why?
Plus, Marjory and Kasmeer’s reaction had always been more about the egg, rather than the mysterious voice. Remember that Hidden Arcana was the first time we heard about the egg beyond the mysterious vision from the Pale Tree.
After all, after the vision of the MoP getting the egg, Marjory asks “What… was… that?” Note: What was that, not who was that. So the exclamation is more towards the vision and/or the egg, not the voice.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
I’d like to consider the few lines we get with the trailer along with what we see:
Can’t tell if either Marjory or the PC: “One of Lazarus’s aspects… without it they could have never resurrected Lazarus–the real Lazarus.”
It appears we will interact with the supposed aspect of Lazarus that was switched following Caudecus’s orders. However, other sources of information make it look like that switch was never made in the first place. Where’s the truth here? I guess we’ll find out soon.
Taimi: “Mortal danger, a mursaat/not a mursaat on the way.”
Kasmeer: “He’s on the way? What should we do?”
It’s reasonable to think that Lazarus is on the way to Taimi’s laboratory in an attempt to learn more about the Elder Dragons, specifically Primordus perhaps, and it’s probable he was directed there by none other than Marjory herself. However, it’s Taimi to inform Kasmeer that he’s on the way there and, assuming Marjory is already with them, the necromancer did not willingly bring Lazarus there.
Marjory: “He’s trapped us here.”
Does Marjory refer to them being trapped in the lab or is there something more? Did he disable the asura gate and Kasmeer’s mesmering portals as well?
Kasmeer: “No. It can’t be!”
First of all, given that Kasmeer is a powerful mesmer, it seems to me that she is the one attempting to unmask Lazarus, which would explain the mesmering magic surrounding the mursaat while in the lab. Assuming it was her, she looks very surprised to see the result of her work–was someone she knew “dressing up” as Lazarus? Somehow, I doubt this is the case.
Given that these characters–PC included–might be biased by the knowledge of one of Lazarus’s aspect not being used in the rituals (and, as I pointed out at the top of my post, this might be a false knowledge) or, in other words, that it is unlikely Lazarus is infact the real Lazarus, I could conclude that realizing that he is in fact Lazarus would result in a surprise for Kasmeer.
However, could that hint of flames behind/surrounding Kasmeer when she speaks this line be of any clue about something?
Possibly Almorra Soulkeeper: “The lies, the willingness to kill to get what he wants.”
Assuming the talker is referring to Lazarus, the lies outspoken by the mursaat have been acknowledged as such by now, hence it seems reasonable to think that this statement will be made after the true identity of Lazarus gets revealed; according to that statement, it would follow that, whoever Lazarus really is, we’re dealing with a male character nonetheless.
“My research has found a thread between magic and the mind. The two are linked.”
— Snaff
— Snaff
(edited by Sock.2785)
I wasn’t suggested he was a good guy, instead that he’s someone with designs on Aurene. The why – Aurene is potentially very powerful, so could be a plan to end up in control of her, or perhaps the plan is to fatten her up with more magic to kill later for a magical feast, given this is someone who managed to absord the bloodstone’s magic. The how & when – well, you could ask those questions on any theory behind Lazarus, that neither proves nor disproves anything.
However, both Randulf and I have already expressed doubts there’s more to this than the two scenes felt similar.
To what point?
As brought up in the other Lazarus identity thread, why hide his identity to the PC during Dragon Vigil if he were a good guy (like the guy who gave the Master of Peace the egg)?
There could be plenty of reasons to hide his identity. If someone is actually impersonating Lazarus (which I don’t believe yet, but I may soon be proved wrong), they clearly have a much bigger goal to accomplish than getting close to us and Aurene. There are plenty of other ways such a person could have gotten to Aurene and the commander if that was the only goal of impersonating lazarus. So if it is an impersonation, they have other goals, which means that depending on what they could be, it could have undermined the goals to have revealed their identity to the commander at that point.
Well, as I’m on a rampage with this theory at the moment, if Anise = Livia = Lazarus, it’s entirely possible that Queen Jennah may not want the commander to have known the true identity just yet due to the white mantle still being a threat, and of course Lazarus the Mursaat potentially fragmenting the white mantle and weakening the ranks was already part of the plan.
Know that the White Mantle are essentially dealt with or at least the current leader, it may be time for Lazarus to reveal the true identity.
Even if WE know that we can keep a secret and are high ranking officials, that doesn’t mean that us knowing wouldn’t have put the grand plan at risk. Anise is also said to be very cunning and, if Livia, has been playing the long game this whole time. I don’t think she’s going to put any part of her plan in jeopardy.
I do like the idea mentioned above about Kasmeer using her abilities and being shocked to find out that Lazarus is truly Lazarus though.
I still can’t help but wonder if the line above the trailer in the post is a hint though. Something mentioning the “truth being reflected.”
Taimi: “Mortal danger, a mursaat/not a mursaat on the way.”
Kasmeer: “He’s on the way? What should we do?”
It’s reasonable to think that Lazarus is on the way to Taimi’s laboratory in an attempt to learn more about the Elder Dragons, specifically Primordus perhaps, and it’s probable he was directed there by none other than Marjory herself. However, it’s Taimi to inform Kasmeer that he’s on the way there and, assuming Marjory is already with them, the necromancer did not willingly bring Lazarus there.
Personally, I find this much more interesting than the question of who Lazarus is. (However that ends up being resolved, it’s looking more and more like there’s going to be a disappointed backlash.) The dragon research is a possibility, as is the map that seems to show where Primordus is… but it’s more interesting to me to think that he’s after Omadd’s machine, just recently delivered to Taimi. It would explain the timing, and he might be able to do much, much more interesting things with it than with research on Primordus.
Another thought- two episodes left, and we still don’t have a clear region or plot thread for the next expansion. It’s possible there’ll be an abrupt turn yet, or that this resumed interest in the destroyers means that it’ll be Primordus and the Ring of Fire after all, but I’m a little excited by the possibility of one that’s scattered across the map. It seems like that sort of plot would have a harder time forgetting that the rest of the world exists the way HoT did. It’s also an interesting contrast to S2, which telegraphed where we were going and why from the first episode onward, long before we knew there’d even be an expansion.
R.I.P., Old Man of Auld Red Wharf. Gone but never forgotten.
I wasn’t suggested he was a good guy, instead that he’s someone with designs on Aurene. The why – Aurene is potentially very powerful, so could be a plan to end up in control of her, or perhaps the plan is to fatten her up with more magic to kill later for a magical feast, given this is someone who managed to absord the bloodstone’s magic. The how & when – well, you could ask those questions on any theory behind Lazarus, that neither proves nor disproves anything.
However, both Randulf and I have already expressed doubts there’s more to this than the two scenes felt similar.
The why, how, and when was more about Lazarus pretending to be someone that Marjory and Kasmeer knew who also happened to be the one to give the Master of Peace the egg.
That seems an awfully contrived connection.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Lazarus: Another paper thin villain with designs on destroying the world. Pretty much what we can expect from Arenanet at this point.
My theory is Lazarus is an agent of the elders dragons, a champion. I suspect it’s Gleam who has been recently corrupted (maybe by kralkatorrik). Assuming he gave the egg to Master of Peace, that would explain how he knew where the egg is + knows Tyria’s history, he also worked with Ogden). We still need to consider the fact, whoever it is it absorbed most of the maguuma bloodstone’s magic and a dragon fits perfectly for that role.
Aaron Ansari.1604Personally, I find this much more interesting than the question of who Lazarus is. The dragon research is a possibility, as is the map that seems to show where Primordus is… but it’s more interesting to me to think that he’s after Omadd’s machine, just recently delivered to Taimi. It would explain the timing, and he might be able to do much, much more interesting things with it than with research on Primordus.
Good point about Omadd’s machine, that would definitely be a better and more direct source of information than Taimi’s studies.
When we last spoke with Taimi she was having the heart of Omadd’s machine delivered to Rata Novus–it looks like she is determined to build her own machine around a fundamental core. Following this, the device we see at 0:33 could definitely be part of “Taimi’s machine”.
However, that machine isn’t placed inside Taimi’s lab, but in the room hosting that–to use Taimi’s words in “Buried Insight”–"huge telescope", which could definitely be part of the machine itself.
Interestingly enough, the device we see in the trailer kind of resembles the figure of Scruffy. Could have Taimi fused the project of Scruffy 2.0 with that of reproducing Omadd’s machine? And if so, would it still work as an armor of sort, meaning that Taimi is already inside the machine when Lazarus is approaching?
Aaron Ansari.1604Another thought- two episodes left, and we still don’t have a clear region or plot thread for the next expansion. It’s possible there’ll be an abrupt turn yet, or that this resumed interest in the destroyers means that it’ll be Primordus and the Ring of Fire after all, but I’m a little excited by the possibility of one that’s scattered across the map.
By how they pose it, it totally looks like we’ll start to get an answer by this penultimate episode, and the finale will definitely be expositive in this regard, presenting something major and explosive in my opinion.
I’m of the idea that there will definitely be an abrupt turn, as you say.
The idea of a geographically scattered expansion is indeed exciting, given the amount of interesting areas waiting to be explored in Tyria, but it looks like the job of inspecting “random” maps is attributed to the Living World–however, this isn’t at all definitive.
“My research has found a thread between magic and the mind. The two are linked.”
— Snaff
— Snaff
(edited by Sock.2785)
By the reaction of Kasmeer in the trailer it seems to me that it is somebody.
1-someone she hoped was missing or dead.
2-Someone who is bad.
Anyway it is very reduvious, if the person behind lazarus, is someone bad that supposed to be dead, why not himself? I find the development of this mystery very weak.
By the reaction of Kasmeer in the trailer it seems to me that it is somebody.
1-someone she hoped was missing or dead.
2-Someone who is bad.Anyway it is very reduvious, if the person behind lazarus, is someone bad that supposed to be dead, why not himself? I find the development of this mystery very weak.
It doesn’t necessarily imply L is someone we know beforehand is bad. By this moment he can already played his move and the reaction might be a shock it was actually someone who Kas trusted. We’ll see in a little less than a week.
My theory is Lazarus is an agent of the elders dragons, a champion. I suspect it’s Gleam who has been recently corrupted (maybe by kralkatorrik). Assuming he gave the egg to Master of Peace, that would explain how he knew where the egg is + knows Tyria’s history, he also worked with Ogden). We still need to consider the fact, whoever it is it absorbed most of the maguuma bloodstone’s magic and a dragon fits perfectly for that role.
Aurene would be Kralkatorrik’s enemy, so if Lazarus was a dragon minion (makes no sense as there’s very very few dragon minions that autonomous and even those who are, none look like a normal living being), so why would he give away a purified egg of a dragon that could potentially become an Elder Dragon and therefore a great threat and rival to food source?
By the reaction of Kasmeer in the trailer it seems to me that it is somebody.
1-someone she hoped was missing or dead.
2-Someone who is bad.Anyway it is very reduvious, if the person behind lazarus, is someone bad that supposed to be dead, why not himself? I find the development of this mystery very weak.
This doesn’t make sense on two accounts.
Firstly, everyone’s assuming Kasmeer’s reaction is to Lazarus’ identity. There’s going to be much more discussed than just that in this episode, just as there always is in every episode. While the trailer definitely made it seem like its a reaction to Lazarus’ identity, we don’t really have reason to believe such.
Secondly, and far more importantly, everyone is assuming Lazarus is evil. So why would his identity being a known bad guy surprise Kasmeer at all? It’d be the most predictable thing to the characters. At this point, the characters would be more surprised that it really is Lazarus because of the huge heavy handed assumption that the PC makes due to Caudecus’ journal (and because now it’s the PC’s turn to handle the idiot ball).
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Aurene would be Kralkatorrik’s enemy, so if Lazarus was a dragon minion (makes no sense as there’s very very few dragon minions that autonomous and even those who are, none look like a normal living being), so why would he give away a purified egg of a dragon that could potentially become an Elder Dragon and therefore a great threat and rival to food source?
You’re overlooking Labwan the Deceiver, who was both autonomous, and a powerful enough mesmer to pass as a member of the pact despite being risen. As you say, very rare, but we have previously seen at least one dragon minion who was capable of passing as a normal living being.
For viable candidates we have:
1. Balthazar(due to the Flashpoint name of the story and would explain Kasmeer’s shock due to Balthazar proving himself worthy of the title God of Murder)
2. Menzies(also tied to the Flashpoint name due to being Balthazar’s brother)
3. Lazarus(would explain Kasmeer’s shock since it’s not supposed to be Lazarus)
4. Anise(would also explain it and she is also a Mesmer) and…
5. Jenna(same as Anise).
I suspect we’ll see multiple villains revealed at once during Flashpoint.
(edited by Mickey Frogeater.1470)
I was actually very much thinking of Labwan when I said very few dragon minions. Labwan is literally a sole situation that is a very odd outlier. But even then, every single action that Labwan took was a direct benefit for Zhaitan.
Lazarus giving Aurene as an egg to the master of peace, or defending Aurene from destroyers, is not only non-beneficial to Kralkatorrik, but harmful to Kralkatorrik.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
I was actually very much thinking of Labwan when I said very few dragon minions. Labwan is literally a sole situation that is a very odd outlier. But even then, every single action that Labwan took was a direct benefit for Zhaitan.
You actually said none could look like a living being, not very few, which is why I thought you’d overlooked Labwan.
Lazarus giving Aurene as an egg to the master of peace, or defending Aurene from destroyers, is not only non-beneficial to Kralkatorrik, but harmful to Kralkatorrik.
Agreed, with one possible exception – Aurene could make a powerful lieutenant if allowed to mature before being corrupted (if she is even capable of being corrupted).
Lazarus giving Aurene as an egg to the master of peace, or defending Aurene from destroyers, is not only non-beneficial to Kralkatorrik, but harmful to Kralkatorrik.
Agreed, with one possible exception – Aurene could make a powerful lieutenant if allowed to mature before being corrupted (if she is even capable of being corrupted).
Even if you don’t want to corrupt it yet, why let it out of your control?
I could buy Lazarus being a dragon champion who looked at the Commander and Luminate and decided ‘not yet’, but I can’t see the voice being a servant of an Elder Dragon.
To those who think Scarlet hate means she’s succeeded as a villain:
People don’t hate Scarlet like Game of Thrones fans hate Joffrey.
They hate her the way Star Wars fans hate Jar Jar Binks.
People don’t hate Scarlet like Game of Thrones fans hate Joffrey.
They hate her the way Star Wars fans hate Jar Jar Binks.
According to the last chapter, one of the artefacts was swapped, That means whatever spawned has connection to said artefact surely. I can’t really see it being an actual person impersonating Lazarus, rather something or someone who has become bound to the 4 aspects by way of whatever Caudecus substituted into the resurrection when he meddled
According to the last chapter, one of the artefacts was swapped, That means whatever spawned has connection to said artefact surely. I can’t really see it being an actual person impersonating Lazarus, rather something or someone who has become bound to the 4 aspects by way of whatever Caudecus substituted into the resurrection when he meddled
I had a bizarre thought along those lines – large concentrations of unbound magic cause anomalies to form. Could an anomaly formed from the bloodstone explosion, and became somehow fused with the 4 aspects of Lazarus that were present, resulting in a sentient anomaly that looks like Lazarus, and even thinks it is Lazarus? Since then, it’s been drawn towards the nearest concentrations of ley energy – first to Tarir, and then to Rata Novus.
According to the last chapter, one of the artefacts was swapped, That means whatever spawned has connection to said artefact surely. I can’t really see it being an actual person impersonating Lazarus, rather something or someone who has become bound to the 4 aspects by way of whatever Caudecus substituted into the resurrection when he meddled
I had a bizarre thought along those lines – large concentrations of unbound magic cause anomalies to form. Could an anomaly formed from the bloodstone explosion, and became somehow fused with the 4 aspects of Lazarus that were present, resulting in a sentient anomaly that looks like Lazarus, and even thinks it is Lazarus? Since then, it’s been drawn towards the nearest concentrations of ley energy – first to Tarir, and then to Rata Novus.
It’s a nice idea, but they’ve gone to a lot of trouble to make this a big reveal, so it has to be something more “wow” than that.
I originally thought maybe somehow Caudecus trapped a part of himself in an artefact and the result is part Lazarus, Part Caudecus, but then that doesn’t hold up versus Lazarus’ intentions and Caudecus’ shock at seeing him, so I ruled that out.
So far, I haven’t seen a theory that holds up, so I’m betting no one has guessed right yet.
Lazarus giving Aurene as an egg to the master of peace, or defending Aurene from destroyers, is not only non-beneficial to Kralkatorrik, but harmful to Kralkatorrik.
You misread me. I wrote that Lazarus may be a corrupted Gleam, the egg could’ve been given to Master of Peace before the corruption.
As for Aurene,
a) we were literally between him and Aurene and threatening to kill him (with help of the Luminate among others in close proximity) if he tries to do anything to Aurene.
b) he wanted us to believe him so it’s obvious he has a bigger agenda than mindlessly killing Aurene on spot. Did Labwan kill us when she was disguised as Syska? No, because she had another agenda.
Did we ever find out what happened to the locket that shows the true heir to the Krytan throne? Did it just get eaten by Mordy as a late night snack? That’s an oddly specific magic item function to assign for a throwaway McGuffin.
It might have some role to play in the Lazarus situation, though I’ve no real idea how. But as the WM rebellion gets wrapped up, the time for the locket’s importance seems to be fading.
I was actually very much thinking of Labwan when I said very few dragon minions. Labwan is literally a sole situation that is a very odd outlier. But even then, every single action that Labwan took was a direct benefit for Zhaitan.
Lazarus giving Aurene as an egg to the master of peace, or defending Aurene from destroyers, is not only non-beneficial to Kralkatorrik, but harmful to Kralkatorrik.
Actually, since it was destroyers attacking Aurene it might have been in Kralkatorrik’s best interest of only to make sure that Primordus doesn’t get get her magic, or her as a minion. Not that I back this theory, just playing devil’s advocate.
You actually said none could look like a living being, not very few, which is why I thought you’d overlooked Labwan.
Labwan doesn’t look like a living being, she is very much rotten – though there are mesmers (and not just Labwan – we see five in total; Labwan, the High Priestess of Lyssa in Arah, and three generic risen wraiths during Battle for Fort Trinity) who take the illusionary guise of another person. But they were all mesmers, unlike Lazarus, and those disguises were very short lived and, more importantly, not that deceptive (everyone in Syska’s party knew something was odd about her immediately, so she got rid of them).
None of them were capable of deception longer than a few minutes.
Agreed, with one possible exception – Aurene could make a powerful lieutenant if allowed to mature before being corrupted (if she is even capable of being corrupted).
Was going to say the latter. We’ve not yet seen reason to believe that purified dragon minions can be re-corrupted. Even the sylvari-turned-Mordrem Guard were converted, not corrupted.
But then there’s what drax said: why let it out of your control and give it the chance to become a major threat?
I had a bizarre thought along those lines – large concentrations of unbound magic cause anomalies to form. Could an anomaly formed from the bloodstone explosion, and became somehow fused with the 4 aspects of Lazarus that were present, resulting in a sentient anomaly that looks like Lazarus, and even thinks it is Lazarus? Since then, it’s been drawn towards the nearest concentrations of ley energy – first to Tarir, and then to Rata Novus.
You’re combining two separate events. The ritual to revive Lazarus with the four artifacts was performed in the Twisted Castle – the final room in the third raid wing. The Bloodstone explosion happened days later, after Bauer had written about his “supreme leader” arriving in secret.
As for Aurene,
a) we were literally between him and Aurene and threatening to kill him (with help of the Luminate among others in close proximity) if he tries to do anything to Aurene.
b) he wanted us to believe him so it’s obvious he has a bigger agenda than mindlessly killing Aurene on spot. Did Labwan kill us when she was disguised as Syska? No, because she had another agenda.
a) We were also facing off dozens of destroyers who were directly after our goal, and we could not defeat the destroyers without Lazarus’ help. So if Lazarus wanted to kill Aurene, that was the best time. Furthermore, why hold back then, but then go after us in Rata Novus later? Unless he secretly got another power boost, the situation’s worse off for him now.
b) Labwan didn’t want us dead in the first place. She wanted the Pact destroyed. Killing the leaders wouldn’t outright destroy the Pact. If she wanted us dead, she would have had us sent into a ambush, like she did her team mates who she did want dead, rather than set up us to kill a bunch of Vigil soldiers.
Actually, since it was destroyers attacking Aurene it might have been in Kralkatorrik’s best interest of only to make sure that Primordus doesn’t get get her magic, or her as a minion. Not that I back this theory, just playing devil’s advocate.
Probable. But what would stop “branded champion Lazarus” from absorbing that magic if he were there when Aurene was killed?
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
I had a bizarre thought along those lines – large concentrations of unbound magic cause anomalies to form. Could an anomaly formed from the bloodstone explosion, and became somehow fused with the 4 aspects of Lazarus that were present, resulting in a sentient anomaly that looks like Lazarus, and even thinks it is Lazarus? Since then, it’s been drawn towards the nearest concentrations of ley energy – first to Tarir, and then to Rata Novus.
You’re combining two separate events. The ritual to revive Lazarus with the four artifacts was performed in the Twisted Castle – the final room in the third raid wing. The Bloodstone explosion happened days later, after Bauer had written about his “supreme leader” arriving in secret.
Do we know for sure which supreme leader Bauer is referring to, as it could be Caudecus or Lazarus. If the former, then first known sighting of Lazarus is after the bloodstone exploded, and the artifacts from a failed ritual could still have been in close enough proximity at the time.
You actually said none could look like a living being, not very few, which is why I thought you’d overlooked Labwan.
Labwan doesn’t look like a living being, she is very much rotten – though there are mesmers (and not just Labwan – we see five in total; Labwan, the High Priestess of Lyssa in Arah, and three generic risen wraiths during Battle for Fort Trinity) who take the illusionary guise of another person. But they were all mesmers, unlike Lazarus, and those disguises were very short lived and, more importantly, not that deceptive (everyone in Syska’s party knew something was odd about her immediately, so she got rid of them).
None of them were capable of deception longer than a few minutes.
That could be more down to the fact the Labwan was impersonating a specific person while surrounded by people who knew that person very well – the deception fails people being able to spot when she starts acting out of character. The illusion itself is only dropped when we confront her and she knows the jig is up.
(On a side note, you’ve missed one risen mesmer that appears living: Lord Kitah)
Its PC, if pc will know that its pc then in one timeline two pc’s can’t be, so one will go death. Player, not mu one. Then desert adventure as undead.
b) Labwan didn’t want us dead in the first place. She wanted the Pact destroyed. Killing the leaders wouldn’t outright destroy the Pact. If she wanted us dead, she would have had us sent into a ambush, like she did her team mates who she did want dead, rather than set up us to kill a bunch of Vigil soldiers.
That’s exactly my point, she had a different goal in mind. We can’t just assume the obvious when thinking about Lazarus’s motivation – there might be something we don’t know about that makes him not focused on Aurene for the time being.
Do we know for sure which supreme leader Bauer is referring to, as it could be Caudecus or Lazarus. If the former, then first known sighting of Lazarus is after the bloodstone exploded, and the artifacts from a failed ritual could still have been in close enough proximity at the time.
It’s not Caudecus, because he didn’t show up in Bloodstone Fen until after the explosion (per Canach in Confessor’s End), and in that journal Bauer never calls Caudecus “supreme leader” despite referring to him in name and title (Confessor).
Bauer also talks about virtuous pursuits, just as Lazarus does, when talking about the supreme leader and “his plans”.
(On a side note, you’ve missed one risen mesmer that appears living: Lord Kitah)
Ah right, Kitah also uses illusions to make himself and all the risen thralls in his manse look alive.
For a very, very short time. And not one is done convincingly in terms of persona (they just repeat the same lines over and over – perhaps a mock on traditional NPC dialogue).
Still no different from the other risen, though, where their persona prevents a long-term disguise. Not just Labwan, but the other risen mesmers disguising as vigil members too.
Besides, making Lazarus “just another dragon champion” would be boring as hell since it make every single majory storyline villain tied to the Elder Dragons.
That’s exactly my point, she had a different goal in mind. We can’t just assume the obvious when thinking about Lazarus’s motivation – there might be something we don’t know about that makes him not focused on Aurene for the time being.
The suggested goal which I disagreed with was “kill or corrupt Aurene” so you’re not exactly disagreeing with me.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
I hope Lazarus is either Palawa Joko, or the offspring of one of Kralkatorrik’s Dragon Champions.
So. Is anyone satisfied with the actual revelation?
Could anyone PM me spoiler?
Nothing to see here guys, Lazarus is just a paper thin villain with the face of a “friend”.
same, anyone can spoiler me too? i wont able to login anytime soon.
So. Is anyone satisfied with the actual revelation?
I’m satisfied with who he is. But I hope this didn’t conclude that storyline, because the ending was not at all satisfying
same, anyone can spoiler me too? i wont able to login anytime soon.
Same, I have not had internet for over a month, so I most likely will not be able to play the episodes until maybe next year.
I am really curious to see where the story is going from here!
Someone pls just spoil it for us xD we beg of you!
Mystogen 80 Mes
Knights Of The Knightmare
S3 Legend
Knights Of The Knightmare
S3 Legend
As a long time Gw 1 player this feels like a slap in the face. I especially liked the story with the gods as it was. It was epic and reminded me of the Vala in the Silmarillon from Tolkien. When they go with something like “Oh, they were false gods all along” a lot of previous lore gets devalued and they definitely lost my interest with that..
For Lazarus’ identity:
Lazarus is Balthazar
Overall, I think it was a decent episode, but the ending kind of fizzled out, which is disappointing in the penultimate episode. There are some lingering questions, sure, but it seemed to resolve most things, and wasn’t the huge cliffhanger that the last episode was.
What bugged me though, is how everyone seemed instantly up to speed on what was going on and were talking like they knew it would come to a head soon, but no one seemed to care to ask any questions once it did. I’m starting to feel that the biggest issue with the storytelling is that it is written with the end goal in mind, so the characters don’t react naturally to the events happening in front of them, because they already know where they need to be in the future.
Considering the reveal for Lazarus, it really stood out to me that no one seemed to have any questions. It was just treated as the next black and white, let’s go confront the big bad, even though the reveal should be a big deal. Time was of the essence, but the urgency itself was the result of actions that we really should have been more surprised and curious about.
(edited by Jokubas.4265)
Overall, I think it was a decent episode, but the ending kind of fizzled out, which is disappointing in the penultimate episode. There are some lingering questions, sure, but it seemed to resolve most things, and wasn’t the huge cliffhanger that the last episode was.
What bugged me though, is how everyone seemed instantly up to speed on what was going on and were talking like they knew it would come to a head soon, but no one seemed to care to ask any questions once it did. I’m starting to feel that the biggest issue with the storytelling is that it is written with the end goal in mind, so the characters don’t react naturally to the events happening in front of them, because they already know where they need to be in the future.
Considering the reveal for Lazarus, it really stood out to me that no one seemed to have any questions. It was just treated as the next black and white, let’s go confront the big bad, even though the reveal should be a big deal. Time was of the essence, but the urgency itself was the result of actions that we really should have been more surprised and curious about.
^This. All this.
Wow, that escalated quickly… This was way too fast to solve !
I’m not even sure the guy we saw was actually Balthazar
After all, at least in French, he spouts nonsense about his fading light, his loss of honor…
Is it really Balthazar? Or some other guy, who look (supposedly) just like him, and is almost as warmongering as he is?
If i remember well, Balthazar is supposed to be at war with his evil-brother Menzies, who uses more mesmers than his brother…
Anyway, with the 2 sub-boss Temar and Tegon, I’m afraid i won’t like the direction of this story… please, bring an epic plot twist, i don’t want The GW series ending like this
So… spoilers obviously, but my review:
Lazarus is Balthazar. Yes, he’s actually Balthazar. Guguwars brings up him talking about his light fading. Actual line is: “They abated me, they dimmed my light… but now they will see me.” and the line about honor is: “I have learned there is no honor in war.”
Basically, something happened to Balthazar, something we do not know, and he lost his godhood. Who “they” refer to we do not know, but Balthazar seems to have fallen from grace the way Abaddon has. Or he was supplanted the way Grenth supplanted Dhuum (leaving the god alive but fallen).
But let’s take a step back.
The reveal of Balthazar felt half-done. While aesthetically awesome, everyone instantly treating him as a villain except Kasmeer felt a little too on the nose. Especially if we’re human PC. I feel like the human PC should react akin to Marjory at worst, but every race just reacts the way I’d expect a charr to react (so playing main charr wasn’t so bad!).
Marjory’s reaction to Kasmeer’s reaction (to paraphrase: “She chose him… over me.”_ was bad, just bad. No Marjory, Kasmeer froze in shock, and you almost immediately put the blame on her (“You…!” said in disgust as she gasped for life), she didn’t choose anyone over anyone, she’s just in kitten shock ya fool).
The mercenary thing is also weird as hell. He began with using the White Mantle, then imprisoned them and hired mercenaries. To built a fort? Why? I don’t get that, maybe there’s something I missed. But why is Balthazar, of all beings, _hiring charr and Inquest) is the real oddity. If he just showed up in DR and said “WORSHIP ME!” the human masses would… and he’d be using a force of good for his ends, without being questioned by the Pact Commander. The mercenary bit is made even weirder given that he has always been pro-humanity.
The mirror from Lyssa… how did Kasmeer know it’s from Lyssa anyways? She just knew it out of nowhere… Kind of odd.
Beyond that, I rather liked the episode. The finale was pretty kitten epic. I’m a bit disappointed that Primordus has a 100% new nothing like in GW1 look. He looks like a proper primordial dragon, yes, and is kittening huge! which is proper for an Elder Dragon, but in the end… I kind of felt like his old look was better for him. This one looks a bit… generic.
And how does Primordus move without anyone knowing it, when he’s that big – when his head alone is nearly the size of Zhaitan’s whole half-body? (Gonna wait on that_shaman to make a model size comparison like he did with Mordremoth and Zhaitan, can’t wait to see that). One would think that the passages he’d make would collapse on themselves and create massive amounts of sinkholes across Tyria.
And I rather enjoyed the chaotic but not too chaotic fight with Tegan and Tamur.
Looking forward to seeing where Balthazar’s history change goes, surprisingly. I do think having Balthazar disguise as Lazarus was pointless, all done for the sake of ‘omg’ ness. Kind of wish they just had Balthazar return as Balthazar. But what’s done is done.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Makes you wonder if any orher Gods are disguised as well. Someone suggested the Queen or Anise as Lyssa, which whilst prob full of loopholes, at least the idea has interesting spevulation around it if there is any presumption the other Gods may have diminished.
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