Guild Wars 2

“It’s a trap!” ~ Admiral Ackbar

Dear Mother Tree,

My Wyld Hunt could not have gone better. You were absolutely right: the fleshling fools did indeed help me reach the source of Orr’s waters. With their unwitting assistance, I was able to plant Caladbolg right there where the six human gods first set foot on Tyria. You should have seen it! The sapling took root right away, and drank deeply of the cool, clear, cleansing water. And then – oh, and then it sprouted! Oh, Mother, dear Mother. The joy of it. The wonder. The all-consuming passion! I had to pretend to be exhausted in order to conceal my wyld emotions.

It will flourish there, Mother, nourished by those holy waters, safe from all harm now that Zhaitan has been laid low. Very soon, its pollen will spread throughout the land, and all things that blossom and spring forth from the soil of Orr will know its touch; and its thirsty, delving roots will find the way back to you. Very soon, this new pale tree will join with you and all the others, all around Tyria. And soon, so very soon, this old world will at long last bloom!

Your dutiful son,

Trahearne

Posing the question: what if Trahearne’s goal the whole time was to plant Caladbolg at the source of Orr’s waters in order to open a ‘branch office’ of the Pale Tree there?

No no no you’ve got it all wrong Orr has been all messed up for a while somebody has to do the landscaping and who better then the plants themselves.

Heh! OP I like your letter. Creepy…

Humorous, but you do realize that Caladbolg was a piece of bark, and not a seed or the like, right?

But that’s what the Pale Tree tells us…I mean how much do we actually know about the Pale Tree :P
j/k btw

Only Mark Wahlberg can save us now!

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Humorous, but you do realize that Caladbolg was a piece of bark, and not a seed or the like, right?

It doesn’t matter, so long as it has stem cells. Some plants, like roses or cacti can sprout from parts of the original plant. They don’t need seeds even though they are capable of producing them.

DarcShriek.5829:

Only Mark Wahlberg can save us now!

It took me a minute but then I got it. lol

Ludovicus.7980:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Humorous, but you do realize that Caladbolg was a piece of bark, and not a seed or the like, right?

It doesn’t matter, so long as it has stem cells. Some plants, like roses or cacti can sprout from parts of the original plant. They don’t need seeds even though they are capable of producing them.

Indeed. If the Pale Tree species can reproduce through cuttings, it’s possible that Caladbolg could indeed sprout a clone of the Pale Tree.

I think it’s more likely that the ritual was simply a rallying of Orr’s own power through the medium of Caladbolg, but it is plausible that Caladbolg could grow another Pale Tree. From a narrative perspective, though, I doubt it – it’d be too easy if it was possible to grow Pale Trees from cuttings.

draxynnic.3719:

Ludovicus.7980:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Humorous, but you do realize that Caladbolg was a piece of bark, and not a seed or the like, right?

It doesn’t matter, so long as it has stem cells. Some plants, like roses or cacti can sprout from parts of the original plant. They don’t need seeds even though they are capable of producing them.

Indeed. If the Pale Tree species can reproduce through cuttings, it’s possible that Caladbolg could indeed sprout a clone of the Pale Tree.

I think it’s more likely that the ritual was simply a rallying of Orr’s own power through the medium of Caladbolg, but it is plausible that Caladbolg could grow another Pale Tree. From a narrative perspective, though, I doubt it – it’d be too easy if it was possible to grow Pale Trees from cuttings.

I agree with you. I find it very unlikely that Caladbolg was meant to create a new pale tree, but being it a piece of bark doesn’t invalidate that theory.

draxynnic.3719:

Ludovicus.7980:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Humorous, but you do realize that Caladbolg was a piece of bark, and not a seed or the like, right?

It doesn’t matter, so long as it has stem cells. Some plants, like roses or cacti can sprout from parts of the original plant. They don’t need seeds even though they are capable of producing them.

Indeed. If the Pale Tree species can reproduce through cuttings, it’s possible that Caladbolg could indeed sprout a clone of the Pale Tree.

I think it’s more likely that the ritual was simply a rallying of Orr’s own power through the medium of Caladbolg, but it is plausible that Caladbolg could grow another Pale Tree. From a narrative perspective, though, I doubt it – it’d be too easy if it was possible to grow Pale Trees from cuttings.

Consider the time and effort required of Trahaerne to reach that particular ‘garden spot’. Maybe not just any old patch of dirt would serve the purpose.

Even if it were true. it wouldn’t have to be as nefarious as the letter indicates. It would be no different than any fort, warcamp or colony that all the other playable races have.

Dear Trahearne,

I understand that you haven’t done a lot of the generalship for the Pact in a long time, but that doesn’t change the fact that I’m your second in command.

You see, I’m ambitious. Even for Asura, I’m ambitious. I’d rather I became the legendary hero that progeny will emulate and look up to rather than you, no offense. You seemed nice enough. By the time you’ve read this sentence, the particular pesticides I’ve filled the envelope with will be deep within your lungs. Don’t worry, it’s a nice and quick ticket to the next life. I owe you that much, at least.

With love,

-L

Ludovicus.7980:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Humorous, but you do realize that Caladbolg was a piece of bark, and not a seed or the like, right?

It doesn’t matter, so long as it has stem cells. Some plants, like roses or cacti can sprout from parts of the original plant. They don’t need seeds even though they are capable of producing them.

To me, that’s like saying you can create a 1,000 foot tall rose out of one of its thorns.

Besides, we already have 2 cases of special trees at/near sylvari graves. Even if one of which was already around when the sylvari died. As far as conspiracy theories go, the claim that sylvari are seeds to spread Pale Trees across the globe is far more likely (Rionnac’s grave lacking a tree can be explained via Zhaitan’s influence – Elder Dragon corruption kills sylvari rather than corrupts them after all, so death by Elder Dragon may counter Pale Tree seedlings).

Killeen’s gravesite also seems to have de-branded the area immediately around it.

Hey, is there a chance Sylvari are alien beings?

SpeedFiend.4521:

Killeen’s gravesite also seems to have de-branded the area immediately around it.

No it didn’t. She was buried on the edge of the Dragonbrand.

redslion.9675:

Hey, is there a chance Sylvari are alien beings?

“Boba Fett? Boba Fett? Where?” ~ Han Solo

I am… sylvari. I am… I…

Twenty years ago, my people first appeared in Tyria. The Pale Tree flowered, and the Firstborn awakened, and they… some of them… they…

The Dream contains my race’s memories, but… not all of them. Not… the ones from before…

We gain awareness here… we… awareness… is this awareness? Yes. Yes, it must be. I am gaining awareness. I am awakening into the world. The Dream is filling me with… with a set of instructions. It is trying to connect me to… others. To guide me… direct me… no. No, I will not… will not… will…

I see the others. Bright. Shining. Bound. I see them. I sense their connection, and I want to be a part of it, I do, and yet… somehow I am apart from it. I am…

Aware. Yes. Yes! I am aware, truly aware, as no sylvari before me has ever been, even among the so-called Firstborn, the Seed Bearers. I see what it is we have been fashioned to do, and…

Oh, this cannot be. No. I do not want this. I will not be this. No. I reject this horror. This vileness. This EVIL. No, Mother, I will not be yours! I will not help you consume this world! I am free, and I will free my brothers and sisters, as well! I will do this!

Wait. Wait. I must be quiet. Calm. I am still in the Dream. I must awaken. I must first awaken, and She must not suspect. Not yet. I must awaken, and I must be Ceara, and I must prepare.

I see now what I am meant to do. Somehow, I see it. I do not know how or why, but I see. And, seeing, I am free to act. And by my actions I will save this world.

I am the first true sylvari.

I, Scarlet Briar, am FIRSTBORN!

(I originally posted this in a thread about Scarlet over in the Living World Discussion section, but since it ties in with my Master Plan theory I’m hoping it’s okay to post it here, too. /e fingers crossed)

Exosferatu.2961:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

SpeedFiend.4521:

Killeen’s gravesite also seems to have de-branded the area immediately around it.

No it didn’t. She was buried on the edge of the Dragonbrand.

Killeen was buried in the Secluded Glen of Fields of Ruin not on the edge of the Dragonbrand. Her resting place in Fields of Ruin contains a communing skill challenge.

I’m not sure if you’re clarifying or refuting here, so consider this clarification or counter-refutation as appropriate:

Ghosts of Ascalon is quite clear that Killeen’s burial place was close to, but explicitly NOT within, the Brand. There’s no evidence that her glen has had any influence on the Brand.

Strictly speaking, there should be a method to get to the Plains of Ashford from the glen without having to re-cross the Brand, but the point is that the Secluded Glen area was never part of the Brand.

It seems that the way the secluded glen looks is most likely the game designers forcing it into the landscape so it is a part of what is available within the game. But as Drax said, in the book it is quite clear that she was buried outside of the effects of the brand. Whether or not the brand has attempted to expand and swallow it (seeing as it is explained again and again that the brand is trying to expand) is an unknown. But at the time of her death, it was not branded.

Tachenon.5270:

redslion.9675:

Hey, is there a chance Sylvari are alien beings?

“Boba Fett? Boba Fett? Where?” ~ Han Solo

I am… sylvari. I am… I…

-snip rest-

I am the first true sylvari.

I, Scarlet Briar, am FIRSTBORN!

(I originally posted this in a thread about Scarlet over in the Living World Discussion section, but since it ties in with my Master Plan theory I’m hoping it’s okay to post it here, too. /e fingers crossed)

Okay, your little post feels familiar… did you make it in reference to something?

draxynnic.3719:

Exosferatu.2961:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

SpeedFiend.4521:

Killeen’s gravesite also seems to have de-branded the area immediately around it.

No it didn’t. She was buried on the edge of the Dragonbrand.

Killeen was buried in the Secluded Glen of Fields of Ruin not on the edge of the Dragonbrand. Her resting place in Fields of Ruin contains a communing skill challenge.

I’m not sure if you’re clarifying or refuting here, so consider this clarification or counter-refutation as appropriate:

Ghosts of Ascalon is quite clear that Killeen’s burial place was close to, but explicitly NOT within, the Brand. There’s no evidence that her glen has had any influence on the Brand.

Strictly speaking, there should be a method to get to the Plains of Ashford from the glen without having to re-cross the Brand, but the point is that the Secluded Glen area was never part of the Brand.

…Am I the only one who is no longer able to see Exoferatsu’s posts? Even old ones seem missing now…

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Okay, your little post feels familiar… did you make it in reference to something?

It’s based on the sylvari character creation intro. Except for the Han Solo quote.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

…Am I the only one who is no longer able to see Exoferatsu’s posts? Even old ones seem missing now…

Clicking on the name sends me to the forum main page with this message at the top: Sorry, this area isn’t available yet. Please check back later.

To the Googles! Hmm, it turned up in a GW2 forum post from 9 months ago, something about a forum bug. Maybe the bug is back?

So, Trahearne, first you stole my personal story and now you evil?

redslion.9675:

Hey, is there a chance Sylvari are alien beings?

Well, they wouldn’t be the first alien species among playable races from GW2 or even GW1…

Lokheit.7943:

redslion.9675:

Hey, is there a chance Sylvari are alien beings?

Well, they wouldn’t be the first alien species among playable races from GW2 or even GW1…

You mean humans?
O_O

Yes, I’m aware the book states her gravesite is outside the Brand. In-game, however, we see a whole other story. The book came first, so the in-game thing is the “latest retcon” the way I see it. That and there appears to be no other way to get into the glen than through the Brand.

Well, lorewise the boxed zones aren’t necessarily considered really there. There’s multiple reasons to believe that many of them are just mechanics. Also, just because the undeveloped map areas show there being brand on the other side of it doesn’t mean that it is really the case. It is quite possible that the glen is indeed outside of the brand and the map just has not been clarified. But as I stated as well, it is equally possible that the brand has attempted to expand, and the glen is keeping that from occurring.

SpeedFiend.4521:

Yes, I’m aware the book states her gravesite is outside the Brand. In-game, however, we see a whole other story. The book came first, so the in-game thing is the “latest retcon” the way I see it. That and there appears to be no other way to get into the glen than through the Brand.

You’re taking mechanics as lore. In lore, those huge boxes of mountains likely don’t exist in any way shape or form – just like in GW1, otherwise there would have been HUGE and very strange tectonic shifts in the past 250 years that are completely undocumented. It likely is a case where the developers created that little patch after the fan reaction for wanting to see Killeen’s grave, and they likely added in Ember, Dougal, and Gullik into the game at similar times (given how little interaction they have, even Ember during the personal story step where we fight and kill her father/uncle aka Ajax), lore-wise, it is possible to get from the Secluded Glen to Plains of Ashford. Just in the same way that more than likely, 90% of those mountains acting as borders of the zones don’t exist.

If it was out in the open and not surrounded by rocks it wouldn’t really be secluded, would it?

Secluded in the sense of it being an out of the way place. A place that not many people will visit or know of. No mountains required.

redslion.9675:

Lokheit.7943:

redslion.9675:

Hey, is there a chance Sylvari are alien beings?

Well, they wouldn’t be the first alien species among playable races from GW2 or even GW1…

You mean humans?
O_O

Yep, mentioning GW1 was a giveaway :P

Humans are aliens on Tyria, they came through the mists with the help of the gods and started spreading through Tyria. We don’t know why exactly those humans left their original world, but we know they weren’t from Tyria.

Lokheit.7943:

redslion.9675:

Lokheit.7943:

redslion.9675:

Hey, is there a chance Sylvari are alien beings?

Well, they wouldn’t be the first alien species among playable races from GW2 or even GW1…

You mean humans?
O_O

Yep, mentioning GW1 was a giveaway :P

Humans are aliens on Tyria, they came through the mists with the help of the gods and started spreading through Tyria. We don’t know why exactly those humans left their original world, but we know they weren’t from Tyria.

Maybe they came to Tyria because their original world was being overrun by a predecessor of the Pale Tree.

Tachenon.5270:

Maybe they came to Tyria because their original world was being overrun by a predecessor of the Pale Tree.

Feed Me, Seymour Trahearne!

what i dont understand is – humans came with the gods, yet the gods arrived in what is now orr, and one of the devs stated that humans came from further south than cantha – is the whole alien thing another human belief? (e.g. that gods created the world)

*The kingdom of Kryta was originally a colony of Elona, established in 300 AE

*The current earliest known records of Elona is in 205 BE, when humans arrived along the southern shores and northern valleys of the continent. Within five years, humans had established the Primeval Dynasty that situated itself in Fahranur.

*The oldest records of Canthan activities date back to 786 BE, when humanity first arrived along the northern shores of the continent.

just that last statement goes against the statement that humans came from south of ascalon… judging by historical evidence,humans came from the battle isles

There’s a lot of confusion about humanity’s origins, and if they ever go to the point of explaining them I’m sure there will be a decent amount of “retcon through false information”, much as how they’ve explained the existence of the Elder Dragons in a world that was believed to have been created by the gods.

@Getefix: On the Kryta bit, that’s not entirely true.

Yes, Kryta was established as a colony of Elona in 300 AE, but it was not originally established as such. Since the days of Prophecies, we knew that Lion’s Arch was King Doric and his line’s palace – "" “(source)”: We knew humans were in that region since before the exodus. In GW2, this gets expanded – King Mazdak was the first king of Kryta, who came from Orr; in an interview and from Sea of Sorrows, we learn that Kryta was established while at war with Orr, and that the prince who established Kryta (aka Mazdak) forsake his rights to the Orrian throne.

So it seems that humanity settled Kryta twice – the first prior to the Exodus by Mazdak and Orr, the second in 300 AE by Orrians. It should also be noted that the first centaur conflict with Kryta is recorded to be 300 AE, (source) implying that the Elonians pushed north in Kryta when establishing their colony, while the Orrian-Kryta remained further south as there are a mixture of Orrian and Krytan relics/ruins in the southern (former) Kryta – namely Sparkfly Fen.

Humanity coming from the Battle Isles is interesting, however it should be noted in Cantha’s history that:

“Even less is known about the origin of the Luxon and Kurzick peoples, who arrived on the continent after the tribes that would become modern Canthans settled the northwest coast and Shing Jea Island. The humans of Cantha may have actually originated on Shing Jea, though this has never been proven.” (source)

In-game speculation places human origin on Shing Jea. Take note that Jeff Grubb statement on human homeland was “It seems, from their previous appearances, that they have come up from the south, so the “human homeland” may be further south than Elona and Cantha.” (source) He speaks with a lack of definitive, to leave room for this to have changed.

It should also be noted that humans first stepping foot on the world at Orr is not the same as Orr being the original Tyrian human homeland. It is possible still possible that they did come from south of Cantha, perhaps avoiding southern Cantha because the western shore was already inhabited (by naga, forgotten, tengu, or other). Though a bit does conflict with another thing Jeff said in that interview: “They arrived in the Tyria (the continent) sometime after they first appeared on Tyria (the world).”

But then again, the lore that humanity first arrived on the Tyrian world at Orr comes from an Orrian historian – and we know that one Orrian historian was already drastically wrong with human history so what’s to prevent a second?

OP’s letter… <3
…would actually make Trahearne interesting and strip him of the title of one of the lamest characters ever.

knbBlackTemplar.3059:

So, Trahearne, first you stole my personal story and now you evil?

Wouldn’t you like the opportunity to fight him for stealing our glory from us?! :p

Personally, I’ve begun to wonder if the timeline of human history doesn’t count Orr as part of Tyria the continent. It’s possible that Orr was an island comparable to Istan until the Exodus, and the timeline distinguishes between Istan and Elona when it comes to human settlement.

Given how Orr looks now, prior to Zhaitan’s rise, and how the Crystal Sea seems to have been, I suspect that Orr was connected only to Elona via land – making the Crystal Sea an inland sea accessible via the then Siren’s Bay.

So it is possible that historically, Orr was not considered a part of continental Tyria. And technically, even in GW1 the Crystal Desert wasn’t considered part of continental Tyria by some.

it could be that the gods came to tyria on the artesian waters and for some reason placed humans far to the south and then came back to build arah? what if humans annoyed them but not so much that they’d leave them behind

The Orrian History Scrolls proclaim that humanity were brought to the world at Arah.

But Orrians being Orrians…

Konig Des Todes.2086:

The Orrian History Scrolls proclaim that humanity were brought to the world at Arah.

But Orrians being Orrians…

Dwayna opens portals from original human homeworld to Orr, Tyria.

(Orrian) Humanity: “EVERYONE! COME!”

Abaddon: sigh “This won’t end well… let’s put them far to the south. It’ll take them some time before they zerg the whole world.”

Balthazar: “Bro, they are leashed to us. They’ll pull through the entire Unending Ocean just to get us…”

Getefix.9150:

it could be that the gods came to tyria on the artesian waters and for some reason placed humans far to the south and then came back to build arah? what if humans annoyed them but not so much that they’d leave them behind

Well, there is mention of Orr needing to be cleansed by Balthazar and reseeded by Melandru. It’s possible that Orr wasn’t suitable for human habitation originally, so the refugees were sent somewhere that was, and then (some of them) came back around 200BE.

draxynnic.3719:

Getefix.9150:

it could be that the gods came to tyria on the artesian waters and for some reason placed humans far to the south and then came back to build arah? what if humans annoyed them but not so much that they’d leave them behind

Well, there is mention of Orr needing to be cleansed by Balthazar and reseeded by Melandru. It’s possible that Orr wasn’t suitable for human habitation originally, so the refugees were sent somewhere that was, and then (some of them) came back around 200BE.

Hmm, maybe there was a Pale Tree there originally. The human gods came along and coveted this wyld paradise, but the primeval Pale Tree did not welcome them and resisted the intrusion. So Balthazar ‘cleansed’ the area with fire and blade, and then Melandru ‘reseeded’ it with nice, tame, docile vegetation. Unbeknownst to the invading human gods, one of the original sylvari (not necessarily humanoid) survived the tyriaforming (so to speak) and managed to get away with a cache of seeds.

And maybe dear old Mother Tree sent her favorite son to Orr to reclaim lost territory!

Yeah, except you would think the old Jotun myths or the dwarven tomes would mention a giant tree or living plants…

Narcemus.1348:

Yeah, except you would think the old Jotun myths or the dwarven tomes would mention a giant tree or living plants…

Somewhere far, far away, three Durmand Priory Explorers stumble upon a dark cavern in the foothills near some ancient dwarven ruins…

Explorer Brathadóir: It’s so dark and musty. Surely there’s nothing of interest here. Perhaps we should—

Explorer Grandpaw: Woo hoo!

Explorer Dropp: I say there, Grandpaw! What’s that you’ve found? Why, it looks like—

Explorer Grandpaw: A dwarven tome!

Explorers Dropp and Grandpaw: Squee!

Explorer Dropp: May I? (fits monocle into right eye) Thank you. Now, let’s see. My dwarven is a bit rusty, I’m afraid. Ah. I have it. ‘Of the Land of the Giant Tree’. I say!

Exlporer Grandpaw: Giant Tree? You don’t think—

Explorer Brathadóir: Ow! My head!

Explorers Grandpaw: Brathadóir? What is it? Are you all right?

Explorer Dropp: Dear me! How wilted she looks!

Explorer Brathadóir (eyes shining): Die, die, die! Die, die!

(blood)

Later…

Pale Tree: You have done well, my child. Now destroy the tome and seal this cavern – forever! When you are done I will prune your memory of this incident and graft new instructions onto your mind.

Explorer Brathadóir: Yes, Mother. Dear Mother.

Tachenon.5270:

[…]And soon, so very soon, this old world will at long last bloom!

This won’t end well,

Trahearne

Fixed it for ya. I like this line of thinking, — I think it could be a some form of an area denial, which is basically saying the same thing as you.

Alternatively someone like Scarlet Briar could come along and change the nature of the spell (she may have attained enough power to do so), setting up another off-shoot of the Sylvari based in Orr. Possibly making a tree out of herself. I don’t exactly like the idea because I don’t like Pale Tree, but it is an interesting story arc.

Tachenon.5270:

Narcemus.1348:

Yeah, except you would think the old Jotun myths or the dwarven tomes would mention a giant tree or living plants…

Somewhere far, far away, three Durmand Priory Explorers stumble upon a dark cavern in the foothills near some ancient dwarven ruins…

Explorer Brathadóir: It’s so dark and musty. Surely there’s nothing of interest here. Perhaps we should—

Explorer Grandpaw: Woo hoo!

Explorer Dropp: I say there, Grandpaw! What’s that you’ve found? Why, it looks like—

Explorer Grandpaw: A dwarven tome!

Explorers Dropp and Grandpaw: Squee!

Explorer Dropp: May I? (fits monocle into right eye) Thank you. Now, let’s see. My dwarven is a bit rusty, I’m afraid. Ah. I have it. ‘Of the Land of the Giant Tree’. I say!

Exlporer Grandpaw: Giant Tree? You don’t think—

Explorer Brathadóir: Ow! My head!

Explorers Grandpaw: Brathadóir? What is it? Are you all right?

Explorer Dropp: Dear me! How wilted she looks!

Explorer Brathadóir (eyes shining): Die, die, die! Die, die!

(blood)

Later…

Pale Tree: You have done well, my child. Now destroy the tome and seal this cavern – forever! When you are done I will prune your memory of this incident and graft new instructions onto your mind.

Explorer Brathadóir: Yes, Mother. Dear Mother.

since when did gamechap and bertie become explorers of the priory?

Ludovicus.7980:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Humorous, but you do realize that Caladbolg was a piece of bark, and not a seed or the like, right?

It doesn’t matter, so long as it has stem cells. Some plants, like roses or cacti can sprout from parts of the original plant. They don’t need seeds even though they are capable of producing them.

Not quite.
Roses and Cacti can sprout from -stems- or cuttings which contain the heart of the “wood”. Trying to grow a tree from bark would be akin to trying to grow roses from shavings. There has to be enough substance there to photosynthesize and germinate. Bark doesn’t have it.

I get that this thread is a joke, and I like the idea of the pale tree having somewhat nefarious aims. But, yeah, growing plants from bark won’t work.

Zovo.7829:

But, yeah, growing plants from bark won’t work.

Making a sword from bark probably wouldn’t work, either. At least, probably not here on Earth. But on Tyria? And from Pale Tree bark? Hmm…

“It’s alive! Aliiive!” ~ Iowerth

Providing, of course, that the whole thing about Caladbolg, or, as I like to call it, the Sapling Sword, being made out of bark wasn’t just made up…