Guild Wars 2

Like the title says. What if the human gods are really six different aspects of the same god, who in turn is what the asura refer to as the Eternal Alchemy?

Better suited for the Lore section.

This argument has also been used in IRL to explain all the diff religions as simply different “views” of the same “God” which could turn ugly quickly if people don’t stay on topic.

On topic there is no evidence to support it from any of the lore I’ve read, it’s not impossible, just improbable. For instance the Asura acknowledge the human gods as entities ie. referring to Balthazar as “the human god of fire and butt kicking”.

Actually, the asura will freely acknowledge that the Six Gods are a part of the Eternal Alchemy. Just as everything else in the universe is. They’ll even acknowledge that the Six are extremely powerful entities who shaped the face of Tyria. But the Eternal Alchemy doesn’t try to define a single being — it’s a theory of how all beings interrelate to each other. A bit ironic that the race who appears the most aloof and stand-offish actually has the most refined concept of “we’re all in this together”.

Except the Eternal Alchemy isn’t a deity. It’s a mix between Philosophic and Scientific Theory. The idea is that everything in Tyria is somehow not only linked but explainable. That even the Gods are not some intangible unknowable entity, but rather another cog that makes the Universe work. This theory encompases everything and everyone, and is slightly fatalistic in its approach.

So to answer you question I suppose, it’s not that the Eternal Alchemy and the Six are one in the same, but that the Asura wor to understand the Six’s place in the Eternal Alchemy as part of something greater.

“So to answer you question I suppose, it’s not that the Eternal Alchemy and the Six are one in the same, but that the Asura wor to understand the Six’s place in the Eternal Alchemy as part of something greater.”

I looked it up and yeah, the Eternal Alchemy does have fatalistic implications, which is flawed in and of itself as the future simply isn’t written in stone and “destiny” itself is dubious at best. The great hero isn’t “destined” since birth for his role, he just happens to have abilities and talents that far exceed the typical person’s and has a certain bravery that makes him the man for the job.

But what about the humans’ theology? I don’t know too much about the lore, but I’m pretty confident that no human has ever made direct contact with the gods and give them representations of different aspects of human life (love, war, luck, etc.) Eventually, Mystery Schools in real life theorized that all gods are different aspects of one, and Hinduism takes this position, as does Akhenaten’s version of ancient Egyptian religion, which was ahead of its time given that his stance was taken up by the Hellenistic Mystery Schools centuries later. Maybe the humans are going through the same evolution in Tyria behind the scenes?

Maximus has it
Pretty much the Eternal Alchemy isn’t a deity, but an idea, almost philosophical, like Taoism, it’s not a theology but a philosophy

Agemnon.4608:

But what about the humans’ theology? I don’t know too much about the lore, but I’m pretty confident that no human has ever made direct contact with the gods and give them representations of different aspects of human life (love, war, luck, etc.) Eventually, Mystery Schools in real life theorized that all gods are different aspects of one, and Hinduism takes this position, as does Akhenaten’s version of ancient Egyptian religion, which was ahead of its time given that his stance was taken up by the Hellenistic Mystery Schools centuries later. Maybe the humans are going through the same evolution in Tyria behind the scenes?

It feels like you’re trying too hard to look at the religions of Tyria moving towards Monotheism.

You however are not wholly correct on the humans not actually meeting the Gods. The Gods had once dwelled in Orr, and it as 0AE (AE = After Exodus) that actually marked their physical departure from Tyria. The Statues you see depicting the Gods were created by Malchor, who is said to be the only human who who was able to look upon the Gods long enough to complete his project before allegedly he lost his sight.

The next time we ‘Witnessed’ a God would not be until we both fought and killed Abbadon before he broke his chains in the Domain of Anguish during the Nightfall Campaign of GW1, but also when we watch Kormir absorb his power and become a God in his place to prevent the unleashed power of a God from rending the Mists and probably Tyria asunder.

So there are 6 entities that live in the Mist that go by the names Balthazar, Dwayna, Melandru, Lyssa, Grenth, and Kormir. However what we do not understand is the nature of the power these entities, nor why they seem to favour different races at different times.

Is it possible for Monotheistic religions to grow in Tyria or for there to be any already in place? I would fully imagine so. Are there any at the moment? Not technically speaking, though the Quaggan worship of Melaggan could very well be seen as such. I would Argue that Koda is more a Buddha figure, who himself would not consider himself a God, but in fact a Teacher.

The Asura acknowledge the gods’ place, and also the Norn animal spirits’ presence.
To quote from (most likely) the Asura Kerrsh, who spent a large amount of time studying the gods in GW1, “A greater understanding of the Eternal Alchemy is within my reach. Human gods, charr gods, norn animal totems-they are part of the all-encompassing Eternal Alchemy. I am humbled as never before by the grandeur of it, and by my own ability to conceive such vasness.”

As other said, the Six are viewed, by the asura, to be part of the Eternal Alchemy. However, the Eternal Alchemy isn’t a being, so the six cannot be one individual who is the Eternal Alchemy – even Koda can, at best, only be two of the six by reasonable deduction (specifically, Dwayna and Melandru seem likely).

The Eternal Alchemy is more of a philosophy or inter-relations of all things rather than a religion, let alone a deity. So no, the Six are not Eternal Alchemy, merely a piece of it – just as everything else is.

I don’t know too much about the lore, but I’m pretty confident that no human has ever made direct contact with the gods

If you are talking about humans from Tyria, then not only they have made contact, We got to kill one and a human took its place.

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Abaddon

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Kormir

Also Malchor had to gaze upon them to make their statues:

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/14475-malchor-and-dwayna/page__st__30#entry696206

It is quite likely that every religion is a by-product of something else. That is what the Eternal Alchemy is interpreted as. Just like how the Quaggan worship a deity known as Melaggan, when it is quite clearly Melandru, even the statue that can be found near them.

Actually, it’s not “quite clearly Melandru” – that’s just how human scholars believe the case is. The statue you see is not of Mellaggan but an abandoned human statue of Melandru that the quaggan simply use.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Actually, it’s not “quite clearly Melandru” – that’s just how human scholars believe the case is. The statue you see is not of Mellaggan but an abandoned human statue of Melandru that the quaggan simply use.

Well, as a human scholar, I do believe it to be the case. Anyway, I am pretty sure that is what I said regarding the statue.

Right, as I said, that statue is of Melandru. But it’s not of Mellaggan. The quaggan simply… renovated it, so to speak.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Right, as I said, that statue is of Melandru. But it’s not of Mellaggan. The quaggan simply… renovated it, so to speak.

What is it you don’t understand? I am saying the same thing as you, you are just repeating my point while adding nothing further to the conversation.

Cassius.8945:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Right, as I said, that statue is of Melandru. But it’s not of Mellaggan. The quaggan simply… renovated it, so to speak.

What is it you don’t understand? I am saying the same thing as you, you are just repeating my point while adding nothing further to the conversation.

You clearly stated that Mellaggan = Melandru and there is a statue to prove it, which is not true. So he is not repeating what you are saying, he is in fact correcting you.

Parisalchuk.9230:

Cassius.8945:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Right, as I said, that statue is of Melandru. But it’s not of Mellaggan. The quaggan simply… renovated it, so to speak.

What is it you don’t understand? I am saying the same thing as you, you are just repeating my point while adding nothing further to the conversation.

You clearly stated that Mellaggan = Melandru and there is a statue to prove it, which is not true. So he is not repeating what you are saying, he is in fact correcting you.

If you read my original post, I said “it is quite clearly Melandru, even the statue that can be found near them”

What Konig is saying is that the statue of Melandru is still a statue of Melandru. That the quaggan have not claimed it to be a statue of Melaggan. At least this is what I am getting from this post. I do not know exactly where this statue is, I’ve been out and about a good many quaggan settlements.

Gendarran Fields, it’s by the farm outside of LA

What if the human gods and the pale tree and the great dwarf and the norn spirits are all champions of the eldar dragon of order that oppose all the other great dragons and is known by the Asura as the Eternal Alchemy? We are all dragon minions then, oh noes!!! P

Ah, so they are the quaggans that I saved in the Durmand Priory “study the quaggan” storyline.

Those quaggans are in Dredgehaunt
Unless it’s different for every order, which doesn’t make sense (I helped the Quaggans on my Vigil character)

Yes, but after I got them out of Dredgehaunt they moved to a village just north of Lion’s Arch according to the end of the story.