Guild Wars 2

We’re playing a game, where most of the things we do is killing all sorts of nasties. I wonder how strong we are in the story? Is the player character one of the strongest mortals on Tyria or merely an owner of a relatively stout sword arm, who happens to succeed thanks to good luck and cooperation with the other characters in the plot?

I suppose we can compare the main character to a member of Destiny’s Edge, who’s prowess has been somewhat established. They’re massively strong. Are we on their level or maybe even beyond?

I don’t suppose it’s an important discussion, but I’d still like to know for myself. Are we a legend in the making? Is the main character one of the biggest threats to Elder Dragons on Tyria just because he’s so kitten powerful? Or are we just a sidekick of Trahearne, that happened to be in the right place in the right time?

considering we’re the slayer of an elder dragon, commander of the pact, and brothers/sisters in arms with destiny’s edge, we’re comparable to them. i wouldn’t say we’re uber powerful like a DBZ character that gets progressively stronger like, well, leveling, but more in that we’re extremely skilled and competent.

I feel like we are a tier above Destiny’s Edge given our clout and the many foes we’ve defeated now. We were already on the rise during the racial part of the personal story. We beat up the baddies and saved the day in each of the dungeons. We’re a commander of the pact against Zhaitan (although, the actual slaying part is iffy since we just stand there shooting a cannon at an immobile target). We killed Scarlet Briar. We have fought many powerful dragon minions and champions including the latest dragon champion whom we have to finally defeat, almost single-handedly. We have free reign to tackle whatever is the most pressing concern for Tyria as we see fit. Everyone else, including Trahearne waits for us to help them make decisions.

I don’t feel we are on the level of the GW1 heroes yet though. They saved Tyria by beating the Lich and his titans. They saved Cantha by beating Shiro and his monsters. They saved the entire world by defeating the Lich and Shiro together…and then slaying an actual God (sure it was chained but still…a God). Then to ice the cake they too defeated an Elder Dragon champion. And right under the nose of Primordus himself. Literally. Plus the billion other side quests and missions that saved lots of people.

It’s a bit hard to tell with the whole “Battle Mechanics =/= Canon”.

Personally though, I would put the player character(s) a level or two below the DE members and people like Jennah and Anise. We are really strong characters, especially shown in the last LS episode where we soloed the Shadow of the Dragon (the only assist being Marjory and Co throwing in the Divine Fire), but we’re still a bit away from the individual strength shown by the DE members. Though, it would see the PC and Marjory and Co are slowly working their way towards DE level strength and group coordination.

personally i mark such levels by the banners around the profile. if the player character was given such a banner (like an encounter opponent) i imagine they’d have either Champion (gold) or Legendary (purple) whereas Rox, Braham and such would be Elite (silver), though Taimi only gets Veteran (copper) due to her lack of actual experience. The player character has been through a lot and has overcome many challenging opponents and trials, and recently has managed to defeat a Dragon Champion on their own (relatively) which is more than can be said for members of DE. Destiny’s Edge members needed more than one person to take down a Dragon Champion, all needing to work together. The only help the player character needed at this point was just the Divine Fire which – were it in their possession and not Rox’s when the champion attacked – they would have been able to finish the fight completely on their own.

In conclusion i’d say that the player character is definitely on par with DE, and is slowly rising to be stronger. it was even said by them after the vision of the Eternal Alchemy – “I saw how Tyria is woven, and…I’m tied up in it. Somehow.”

Carlin Sanders.3587:

The only help the player character needed at this point was just the Divine Fire which – were it in their possession and not Rox’s when the champion attacked – they would have been able to finish the fight completely on their own.

Personally, I took away a couple of points for the use of the Divine Fire. The PC was able to solo the SotD, which is a huge achievement in and of itself, but the Divine Fire was an outside magically element, since it came from neither the PC or the dragon originally, that’s super effective against the Mordrem. Without it, the PC would have easily been killed without some way to contain/trap the dragon to damage it.

Erukk.1408:

Carlin Sanders.3587:

The only help the player character needed at this point was just the Divine Fire which – were it in their possession and not Rox’s when the champion attacked – they would have been able to finish the fight completely on their own.

Personally, I took away a couple of points for the use of the Divine Fire. The PC was able to solo the SotD, which is a huge achievement in and of itself, but the Divine Fire was an outside magically element, since it came from neither the PC or the dragon originally, that’s super effective against the Mordrem. Without it, the PC would have easily been killed without some way to contain/trap the dragon to damage it.

That said, it didn’t seem to damage it. We used the fire to pin it down for brief periods of time, but we did all the damage that slew it, and in between those windows we survived it while it was free to move and attack as it pleased.

It’s over 9000

Zhaitan shouldn’t count. While I don’t want to talk about the very anticlimatic fight the last dungeon was, in the end it’s clear the whole Pact took Zhaitan down. No one gave it a last deathblow.

Unlike the Shadow of the Dragon. That was all us. We are very powerful, almost Legendary. Only Destiny’s Edge is above, having taken down more than one Dragon Champion in their prime.

Rhaegar.1203:

Only Destiny’s Edge is above, having taken down more than one Dragon Champion in their prime.

Considering all we have done. All the dragon champions/luitenants we have killed, the thousands of bandits/inquest/dragon minions/nightmare court/SoS/Toxic Alliance/Molten Alliance/Aetherblades/Pirates/animals/ettins/Ghosts/Centaurs/Flame Legion and other enemies we have slaugthered (both in groups and on our own) I’d say we are far beyond Destiny’s Edge. Hell we even took down a dragon entirely on our own, even Destiny’s Edge never pulled that off. And when I say thousands, I literally mean thousands, as you can see by the Slayer and Weaponmaster achievements.

The only one above us is Asgeir Dragonrender. As he was somehow able to smash a tooth the size of a truck out of Jormag’s mouth, a dragon who is probably the size of a skyscraper considering the size of his teeth.

The book never went into an itemization of what DE killed, but you would need to assume they also killed critters, grubs, oakhearts, etc.

Rhaegar.1203:

The book never went into an itemization of what DE killed, but you would need to assume they also killed critters, grubs, oakhearts, etc.

for some reason after reading your post it makes me want a ‘rabbit slayer’ title.

Isn’t there an Indiscriminate Slayer title? I killed a bunch of small animals in my early days xD

Aaron Ansari.1604:

That said, it didn’t seem to damage it. We used the fire to pin it down for brief periods of time, but we did all the damage that slew it, and in between those windows we survived it while it was free to move and attack as it pleased.

We also used the last of the Divine Fire to deliver the ‘finisher’ on the Shadow. It’s also possible that the ring lorewise was damaging it, we just didn’t see that mechanically because it was part of the assumption of the writers that the ring would be there whenever the dragon was being damaged.

Regarding power level: Zojja does say that the PC is over half of Destiny’s Edge’s firepower on their own. I think that when it comes to single combat, the PC is lorewise a legendary and the strongest fighter on the Pact’s team. However, the NPCs still have a variety of abilities that PCs (even PCs of the same profession) lack, including ‘deus ex machina’-type abilities.

Basically, the PC is hyper-specialised at in-your-face combat, but doesn’t seem to have much knowledge of things with wider utility.

It would make sense if you though of us as purely combatants. We aren’t really “protectors” as much as we are “sanctioned assassin’s” in the roles we usually fill. Most of what we do that ISN’T killing is simply to “find the next thing so we can kill it” Destiny’s Edge has more of a history as a team. And I imagine if it came to a fight between Destiny’s Edge and the PC lore wise form what we have read they should kick our kitten hands down. Simply because they cover eachother so well.

Logan said something in one of the last LS episodes that we alone represent 87% of the pact force… not sure about the exact percentage… but it was high and it felt Legendary.

My main character is not a big fan of Destiny’s Edge because they seem like a bunch of children at each others throats over personal grudges with too much power on they’re hands while Elder Dragons threaten to destroy tyria… yeaaahh no big deal.

I love my new band of brave misfits, they’re young and naive but hell they ARE bold….
What I’m trying to say is that we’re witnessing a shift in power between our band and DE, so if we’re ot yet “legendary” we’ll soon be, the PC is the Elder Dragons nemesis.

Marjory and Kasmeer might be be stronger than us. Certainly Kasmeer is a stronger mesmer than MC (then again probably all NPC mesmers are…Faolain, Queen, Anise, That SE boss and that bounty). Marjory has some tricks that Necromancers can’t do (don’t think they are quite the level of Traeherns pack of flesh golems).

DE with Glint and Without Logain were able to fight with Karalkatorrik; that’s quite an achievement but Glint was probably a big part of it.

The strongest character than we know in Tyria (ignoring Palawa Joko, Livia etc) is probably the Pale Tree by far and after her probably the Queen, Anise, then Traehern (with Caladbolg) then probably Faolain (certainly stronger than Caithe), Rytlock (probably stronger than Faolain when revenant), Zoijja (made glory of tyria), then probably Kasmeer etc. Some Fire Legion Shaman in there too. Most magic users are more powerful than non-magic ones especially magicians who are more indirect (mesmers, easy to make overpower in game).

Now imagine if the Guild Wars 1 character came into this world with all his known powers, now that would be a true “god walking among mere mortals”, considering you could have every power, you helped defeat a god, saved the world 3 times…etc.

KngGilgamesh.3481:

Marjory and Kasmeer might be be stronger than us. Certainly Kasmeer is a stronger mesmer than MC (then again probably all NPC mesmers are…Faolain, Queen, Anise, That SE boss and that bounty). Marjory has some tricks that Necromancers can’t do (don’t think they are quite the level of Traeherns pack of flesh golems).

Marjory and Kasmeer have tricks that PCs of their profession don’t. Heck, that’s true for most major NPCs.

However, whenever a fight starts, it’s invariably the PC that does the heavy lifting. Kasmeer, for instance, might be able to maintain more illusions at a time than a PC mesmer, but even with this advantage she does substantially less damage than a PC mesmer… when she’s an effective combatant at all. Similar observations can be made for all the other major NPCs. They have various utility abilities that the PC doesn’t have, but the PC generates the lion’s share of the firepower.

Shadelang is probably fairly close to the money here. Other major NPCs each have things they’re good at that aren’t killing things – Logan, as an example, is (was?) a better defender than even guardian PCs (see, for instance, CoF story). When it comes to killing something, though, the PC is likely to be the best for the job.

draxynnic.3719:

However, whenever a fight starts, it’s invariably the PC that does the heavy lifting.

Not to mention, DE 2.0 members seem to be constantly marvelling at our abilities.

We’re probably on par with DE members by now (Legendary status) but We’re by no means gods walking amongst mere mortals. Anise and Jennah still out class all of DE combined. (When your queen summons an entire illusory army to fight freshly made dragon minions to save Ascalon, that’s kinda hard to beat). So are we as players kitten? Sure. Are we OP? Definitely not.

I don’t think Jennah is that good at face-to-face fighting, though. What she pulled off at Ebonhawke is something that she did while sequestered away at a safe location, and took long enough for Logan to rally the human defenders and recruit the charr prisoners to push the enemy away from the keep and then be pushed back again. Unless you buy the conspiracy theory that she waited until the last possible moment deliberately in order to come off as a hero, this implies that it was a complicated spell that took at least several minutes to complete, not something you’d be able to do while someone is in your face trying to disembowel you.

When in direct personal danger, Jennah usually relies on that personal shield of hers – which is impressive in itself, but suggests that she might not have the in-your-face combat magic that PC mesmers do. Basically, comparing the mesmer PC to Jennah directly is like comparing apples to oranges… sure, they’re both fruit, but they don’t both do the same things.

Rhaegar.1203:

Zhaitan shouldn’t count. While I don’t want to talk about the very anticlimatic fight the last dungeon was, in the end it’s clear the whole Pact took Zhaitan down. No one gave it a last deathblow.

Unlike the Shadow of the Dragon. That was all us. We are very powerful, almost Legendary. Only Destiny’s Edge is above, having taken down more than one Dragon Champion in their prime.

The fight was anticlimactic because we had spent the greater part of the end of the living story figuring out ways to cut off Zhaitan’s sources of power and sustenance. It was basically starving to death by the time we killed it and it still takes ships full of megalasers to bring it down for good.

So, while the PC doesn’t deliver one single final blow that kills Zhaitan they do spend a long time creating the conditions for its death, which is a very impressive feat. The ability to set huge events in motion that lead to a specific outcome is powerful, more so than being able to swing a sword really hard or make a really strong fireball.

Rhialto.8423:

The ability to set huge events in motion that lead to a specific outcome is powerful, more so than being able to swing a sword really hard or make a really strong fireball.

Indeed. It’s impressive how Traheanne managed to organize all that and still be at the front lines, with the help of a few nobodies.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

It’s over 9000

Beat me to it xD

Rhialto.8423:

The fight was anticlimactic because we had spent the greater part of the end of the living story figuring out ways to cut off Zhaitan’s sources of power and sustenance. It was basically starving to death by the time we killed it and it still takes ships full of megalasers to bring it down for good.

In my opinion, Zhaitan was hardly starving to death. We only took down one of its Mouths, and a few Eyes, but I’m sure Zhaitan had consumed a lot more magic before.

Xienvex.9567:

We’re probably on par with DE members by now (Legendary status) but We’re by no means gods walking amongst mere mortals. Anise and Jennah still out class all of DE combined. (When your queen summons an entire illusory army to fight freshly made dragon minions to save Ascalon, that’s kinda hard to beat). So are we as players kitten? Sure. Are we OP? Definitely not.

But then a couple bandits nearly kill her, and all she can do is make a bubble while you kill them all… granted, it WAS an invulnerability bubble. one shes uses again at the world summit.