Why not Omadd?
Omadd never went into the isolation chamber, y’know.
And even then, did Mordremoth chose Scarlet? Was it an active choice of being Scarlet or was it a “anyone will do” case? Or was it pure coincidence?
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Omadd never went into the isolation chamber, y’know.
And even then, did Mordremoth chose Scarlet? Was it an active choice of being Scarlet or was it a “anyone will do” case? Or was it pure coincidence?
If Mordremoth has the power of plants, then it makes sense that Sylvari are in someway inexplicably linked to his power simply by their very nature as a plant. They are plants, he has dominion over plants.
Omadd is not a plant… Mordremoth is not an asura based dragon. God knows what that would look like.
If Mordremoth has the power of plants, then it makes sense that Sylvari are in someway inexplicably linked to his power simply by their very nature as a plant. They are plants, he has dominion over plants.
Omadd is not a plant… Mordremoth is not an asura based dragon. God knows what that would look like.
I’m sorry but that is a silly assumption. Jormag is the dragon of ice but not all ice related creatures fall into its base control or are even linked to it. From what I have seen in game dragons don’t care what they are corrupting as long as they can corrupt it, Sylvari being immune to those known corruptions.
If Mordremoth has the power of plants, then it makes sense that Sylvari are in someway inexplicably linked to his power simply by their very nature as a plant. They are plants, he has dominion over plants.
Omadd is not a plant… Mordremoth is not an asura based dragon. God knows what that would look like.
I’m sorry but that is a silly assumption. Jormag is the dragon of ice but not all ice related creatures fall into its base control or are even linked to it. From what I have seen in game dragons don’t care what they are corrupting as long as they can corrupt it, Sylvari being immune to those known corruptions.
I’m curious if you have examples of ice related creatures that are not under control of Jormag? It is not a silly assumption that a master of something would be able to more easily corrupt things of the same nature as its specialty.
If you understand the inner workings of plants and have done for millenia then you’re gonna have a shorter route to controlling them should you wish to.
Omadd never went into the isolation chamber, y’know.
And even then, did Mordremoth chose Scarlet? Was it an active choice of being Scarlet or was it a “anyone will do” case? Or was it pure coincidence?
Why would Mordremoth need Omadd to go into the chamber? If the chamber is the reason, then Mordy needs to talk to someone about making a whole bunch of these chambers.
My theory is that Mordy was waiting for someone like Scarlet. It’s not unreasonable to assume that if one pale tree can produce Scarlet, then all of them can. If there is a link between Mordy and the sylvari, it’s not unreasonable to assume that Mordy would just wait for the first Scarlet type to show up and use it to wake him up. Scarlet just happened to be first, because her tree was planted first. Mordy simply caught a lucky break when she went into the chamber and be freed from the protection of the dream.
(edited by DarcShriek.5829)
Omadd never went into the isolation chamber, y’know.
And even then, did Mordremoth chose Scarlet? Was it an active choice of being Scarlet or was it a “anyone will do” case? Or was it pure coincidence?
The answer to that may lie in the fact that Scarlet brought something into the isolation chamber. Either she had an inherent link or susceptibility to the dragon (or pro-dragon entity) or whatever she brought into the chamber allowed for her to become influenced. I think that is the key difference between Omadd and Scarlet entering the machine.
Omadd never went into the isolation chamber, y’know.
And even then, did Mordremoth chose Scarlet? Was it an active choice of being Scarlet or was it a “anyone will do” case? Or was it pure coincidence?
Why would Mordremoth need Omadd to go into the chamber? If the chamber is the reason, then Mordy needs to talk to someone about making a whole bunch of these chambers.
Good question actually…
As i just posted in another thread… Either Scarlet accidentally branded herself or she lost it when she discovered a link between Sylvari and Mordremoth that the pale tree was covering up. This could have been an opening for the sleeping mordremoth to assert his will. Mordremoth likely would find no use for the device on it’s own. What he needed was a weak sylvari that knew a hint of the truth.
I’m curious if you have examples of ice related creatures that are not under control of Jormag? It is not a silly assumption that a master of something would be able to more easily corrupt things of the same nature as its specialty.
If you understand the inner workings of plants and have done for millenia then you’re gonna have a shorter route to controlling them should you wish to.
Yes look at all the different Ice Wurm, Ice Elemental, and Ice Imps. They are ice creatures that aren’t under Jormag’s control. Like I said, from my understanding of the elder dragons, they don’t care what they corrupt. They corrupt anything that will make getting magic easier/faster.
Just because the dragon is given a specific element doesn’t mean that everything that is some what related to that is easier to corrupt. IMO the dragons will try to corrupt anything and everything that will help it feed on magic or help defend it, the strongest of the corrupted undead were kept close while the weaker were sent out collecting magical artifacts.
If Mordremoth has the power of plants, then it makes sense that Sylvari are in someway inexplicably linked to his power simply by their very nature as a plant. They are plants, he has dominion over plants.
Omadd is not a plant… Mordremoth is not an asura based dragon. God knows what that would look like.
That is like saying all Necromancer minions are tied to Zhaitan. That Palawa Joko is tied to Zhaitan. That oakhearts and druids are tied to Mordremoth. That Embers and other fire elementals are tied to Primordus. That Ice Elementals are tied to Jormag.
But they aren’t. Especially necromancer minions.
I’m curious if you have examples of ice related creatures that are not under control of Jormag? It is not a silly assumption that a master of something would be able to more easily corrupt things of the same nature as its specialty.
If you understand the inner workings of plants and have done for millenia then you’re gonna have a shorter route to controlling them should you wish to.
What you said is that sylvari are tied to Mordremoth because Mordremoth us plant based. Not that he would have an easier time corrupting plants over non-plants.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
(edited by Konig Des Todes.2086)
Why would Mordremoth need Omadd to go into the chamber? If the chamber is the reason, then Mordy needs to talk to someone about making a whole bunch of these chambers.
My theory is that Mordy was waiting for someone like Scarlet. It’s not unreasonable to assume that if one pale tree can produce Scarlet, then all of them can. If there is a link between Mordy and the sylvari, it’s not unreasonable to assume that Mordy would just wait for the first Scarlet type to show up and use it to wake him up. Scarlet just happened to be first, because her tree was planted first. Mordy simply caught a lucky break when she went into the chamber and be freed from the protection of the dream.
I mentioned Omadd going into the machine because that was when Scarlet began contact with Mordremoth. We technically know nothing still around why – or, in fact, even if – Mordremoth began talking to Scarlet since entering the machine. We know that was when Scarlet began interacting with the entity… But we still don’t know who that entity is. And the aftermath instance hints that her goal was multiple dragon’s.
My main point was that Mordremoth may not have been after Scarlet specifically.
The answer to that may lie in the fact that Scarlet brought something into the isolation chamber. Either she had an inherent link or susceptibility to the dragon (or pro-dragon entity) or whatever she brought into the chamber allowed for her to become influenced. I think that is the key difference between Omadd and Scarlet entering the machine.
But did she bring in Mordremoth? A champion of Mordremoth? Something else that wanted to empower Mordremoth/multiple Elder Dragons?
Or perhaps she didn’t bring it in. Remember that Omadd was the one pushing for Scarlet to be let into the college’s under grounds of them studying her… And Omadd continued working with Scarlet even after she worked with Inquest and became a criminal in Rata Sum… What if he sabotagued the device? Just to see the reaction? Or what if whatever it tied Scarlet to was where the entity lied in wait thus anyone who entered the machine would become influenced by it.
We still know far too little.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
What you said is that sylvari are tied to Mordremoth because Mordremoth us plant based. Not that he would have an easier time corrupting plants over non-plants.
If you have a deep understand and a power relating to something, you are linked to the those things in a way. Especially if you can create or control them.
Maybe so. But that doesn’t mean the sylvari are tied to Mordremoth just because they are plants. To say that is like saying the water in a mug at the DR taverns is tied to the deep sea dragon.
Mordremoth may have a better understanding of plants – but sylvari are unique even for plants, and both Zhaitan and Kralkatorrik are shown capable of corrupting plants – Kralkatorrik with relative ease (as much ease as flesh and soil). So even if Mordremoth has an easier time corrupting plants, that doesn’t mean the sylvari are tied to it.
And if we follow the logic of “new things are harder to corrupt over things they are used to” then why do they all have a seemingly perfectly easy time corrupting humans – there is no way the dragons knew of humanity until they woke.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
I think this is just a plot hole and that we will never find out the true origin of the human race. If no corrupted humans were there people would be asking questions too. And it just happens to be so that the main antagonist, Zhaitan, was under an ancient human civilization. So that explains why we see more corrupted humans.
Look beyond the obvious…
Mordremoth may have a better understanding of plants – but sylvari are unique even for plants, and both Zhaitan and Kralkatorrik are shown capable of corrupting plants – Kralkatorrik with relative ease (as much ease as flesh and soil). So even if Mordremoth has an easier time corrupting plants, that doesn’t mean the sylvari are tied to it.
Ultimately Scarlet stepped into the device and was corrupted by Mordremoth because of something within her mind that she took in with her. Implying a base connection between Mordremoth and the Sylvari.
You’ll forgive me I hope if I cannot be bothered to sit here debating the correct semantics for usage of the word link.
Maybe the voices she heard aren’t Dragons whispers. We dont know this yet. She tried resist it, it was a slow process, and i think she had a bunch of free will even at the stomp when we killed her.
Maybe the voices she heard aren’t Dragons whispers. We dont know this yet. She tried resist it, it was a slow process, and i think she had a bunch of free will even at the stomp when we killed her.
End of the day, her plan to wake Mordremoth couldn’t have worked without knowledge of Mordremoth’s location. Information that could only have been relayed to her by Mordremoth.
I think this is just a plot hole and that we will never find out the true origin of the human race. If no corrupted humans were there people would be asking questions too. And it just happens to be so that the main antagonist, Zhaitan, was under an ancient human civilization. So that explains why we see more corrupted humans.
Missed my point. My point is that “expertise on a specific group” doesn’t seem to be the situation here. Reason: humans.
Ultimately Scarlet stepped into the device and was corrupted by Mordremoth because of something within her mind that she took in with her. Implying a base connection between Mordremoth and the Sylvari.
You’ll forgive me I hope if I cannot be bothered to sit here debating the correct semantics for usage of the word link.
You and Darc keep saying Scarlet was corrupted by Mordremoth… But we still don’t have solid evidence for such.
But even then, one individual being corrupted due to external situations doesn’t make aninnate relation between the individual’s group and the dragon.
And you never once brought up Scarlet before.
Maybe the voices she heard aren’t Dragons whispers. We dont know this yet. She tried resist it, it was a slow process, and i think she had a bunch of free will even at the stomp when we killed her.
End of the day, her plan to wake Mordremoth couldn’t have worked without knowledge of Mordremoth’s location. Information that could only have been relayed to her by Mordremoth.
Inquest know of Mordremoth. They have been studying both the Elder Dragons and Scarlet.
Elder races may have known where Mordremoth was, and hints in aftermath imply we’re gonna deal with bandits aka White Mantle who are based west of Brisband next. Maybe they knew.
There is always more than one possibility.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Maybe the voices she heard aren’t Dragons whispers. We dont know this yet. She tried resist it, it was a slow process, and i think she had a bunch of free will even at the stomp when we killed her.
Kellach had free will up until we stomped him also. Corruption doesn’t necessarily remove your free will.
@konig – What hints at multiple dragons? I thought it said she was trying to wake up a dragon and there is only one that is sleeping still according to all historical records.
Finally, we need to take the information that we have about Scarlet and take it to the Pale Tree with some questions. I think a lot of folks died because the Pale Tree tried to protect Scarlet. I believe the Pale Tree knows more than she is letting on.
(edited by DarcShriek.5829)
Maybe the voices she heard aren’t Dragons whispers. We dont know this yet. She tried resist it, it was a slow process, and i think she had a bunch of free will even at the stomp when we killed her.
End of the day, her plan to wake Mordremoth couldn’t have worked without knowledge of Mordremoth’s location. Information that could only have been relayed to her by Mordremoth.
Actually, it wasn’t Mordy’s location that mattered, it was the intersection’s location that mattered. Mordy could have been anywhere and felt the disruption.
Kellach had free will up until we stomped him also. Corruption doesn’t necessarily remove your free will.
@konig – What hints at multiple dragons? I thought it said she was trying to wake up a dragon and there is only one that is sleeping still according to all historical records.
Finally, we need to take the information that we have about Scarlet and take it to the Pale Tree with some questions. I think a lot of folks died because the Pale Tree tried to protect Scarlet. I believe the Pale Tree knows more than she is letting on.
son first paragraph: maybe the reason Zhaitan doesn’t normall corrupt living beings is due to not being able to fully remove their free will. Or maybe Kellach was made a champion and dragon champions have a form of self-decision to their actions, even capable of putting their master’s corruption at risk such as when the Sovereign Eye allowed Trahearne and the PC to walk past several very powerful minions and access their objective.
Second paragraph: if you talk to Braham after Big Beli shows up, the dialogue will switch midway to Taimi, who says:
Scarlet wanted to touch the dragons, and she succeeded.
Dragons. Plural.
Yes, it is said Scarlet used her drill to wake a dragon. But Taimi, who recognized the dragon threat and is more or less an expert on Scarlet (not to mention of the dues ex machina race) mention plurals.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
(edited by Konig Des Todes.2086)
New Pale Tree dialogue
http://i.imgur.com/TdYBfPd.png
Canach at Vigils Keep has some dialogue too. He implies that Scarlet aimed some greater good:
“Speaking from experience, when someone does something this drastic, they think they’re doing some sort of good. Which raises a troubling question… what good did Scarlet think she was doing?”
I don’t have the pics.
Canach’s line doesn’t hint to Scarlet aiming for good, but Scarlet thinking she was.
But the same can be said for various risen – particularly those in the Sea of Sorrows novel, such as the risen norn (Bronn, iirc) who promises eternal unlife to his brother, and the Sovereign Eye of Zhaitan who calls us the defilers and poisoners for trying to reverse Zhaitan’s corruption.
On the flip side, Canach thought he was doing good by letting loose crazed karka on the Southsun settlers in order to destroy the Consortium contracts.
All it means is that Canach thinks Scarlet thought she was doing good – which falls back to the Spinal Blade blueprint quote of “You’ll see someday, Caithe, Tyria needs me”. Maybe she thought she was unleashing a master for Tyria that would steer them in the right direction – her direction.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
@Konig: Taimi is mistaken. It was dragon – singular. Taimi’s information is all second hand. The link below is first hand. Therefore it’s a better source.
https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/139864/gw342.jpg
And what makes your character’s view infallible? However, I’d like to point you out to the two maps of new probes. One centralizes on the Far Shiverpeaks.
She may have been intending to repeat her actions at Lion’s Arch further north, affecting Jormag. Either way, it’s obvious that Lion’s Arch wasn’t the end of her plans.
But why is Taimi wrong when you don’t know her sources? She is in full agreement to the PC st that, whom never states she was after a single Dragon.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
No. I think Scarlet disturbed the ley lines, knowing they feed the dragons.
I don’t understand.
The dragons consume magic. The ley lines are currents in an ocean of magic.
And Scarlet threw a giant rock in that pool, sending ripples out to the dragon. It makes sense. You’re brilliant.
I’m not sure if it was ever said that Scarlet actively rerouted all the magic from the leyline convergence in a single direction, because if she didn’t, that ripple effect would have extended in all the directions the leylines connected to it went. And as the player said, Scarlet disturbed them knowing that the Elder Dragons fed from them. So they would have been able to feel the disturbance with their food supply.
Taimi: I told you so. I told you all. I knew Scarlet had grand plans, but did you listen? No. And now, there’s at least one dragon, maybe more, who want to destroy all of Tyria.
Emphasis mine.
Braham:You really believe that stuff about Scarlet poking the dragon?
Player:Yeah, I do.
Taimi:Well, you’ve got it right. Scarlet wanted to touch the dragons, and she succeeded. Quite impressive when you think about it.
Player:I have a theory about why, but what do you think?
Taimi:Why do our greatest minds ever do anything? In order to know, to learn, and to understand.
Player:I think she was more practical than she let on.
Braham: Or more crazy. I’m gonna guess she was hoping to make a dragon or two mad so they would attack. Don’t matter. All that matters is she’s dead now.
Emphasis mine again, and as Konig pointed out, references of multiple dragons. The more that I think about it. I’m starting to wonder if “the Entity” wasn’t Mordremoth at all, but something else. As the PC said, he/she is thinking that Scarlet was more practical than she let on, and that is reminding me of a part from her short story…
“But I reject that call. I reject the notion that that I must choose the Dream or be lost to Nightmare. The forces that push us this way or that can be redirected. They can be set against one another to the detriment of both, and now I know how.”
I’m starting to think that she and possibly “the Entity” are simply using the Elder Dragons and everyone else. Wake up and stir the Elder Dragons, possibly sic them against one another and the races of Tyria, wait for them to finish killing each other, and then they can easy claim whatever is left.
And what makes your character’s view infallible? However, I’d like to point you out to the two maps of new probes. One centralizes on the Far Shiverpeaks.
She may have been intending to repeat her actions at Lion’s Arch further north, affecting Jormag. Either way, it’s obvious that Lion’s Arch wasn’t the end of her plans.
But why is Taimi wrong when you don’t know her sources? She is in full agreement to the PC st that, whom never states she was after a single Dragon.
You have no proof that anything further was planned. Dots on a map are not evidence.
All known production facilities were either destroyed or abandoned. The evidence presented in Edge of the Mists only stated that Lion’s Arch was her target. In order to promote this fantasy of multiple attacks, you not only have to make up new evidence you have to ignore existing evidence.
(edited by DarcShriek.5829)
You have no proof that anything further was planned. Dots on a map are not evidence.
All known production facilities were either destroyed or abandoned. The evidence presented in Edge of the Mists only stated that Lion’s Arch was her target. In order to promote this fantasy of multiple attacks, you not only have to make up new evidence you have to ignore existing evidence.
Proof? No. Never called it proof. What it is , evidence to support such.
And why would they add two NEW maps to the Breachmaker instead if using the ones from the lair if it meant nothing. It is obviously intentional. There is even an interactive panel to it called Energy Probe Map Can you really say that it means nothing? No, you cannot. Not reasonably.
As to Edge of the Mists – yes, as Scarlet’s next target. Not necessarily the final target. Even in the Origins of Madness we saw x’s over places other than LA, indicating she had more plans than just Lion’s Arch.
Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.
If Mordremoth has the power of plants, then it makes sense that Sylvari are in someway inexplicably linked to his power simply by their very nature as a plant. They are plants, he has dominion over plants.
Omadd is not a plant… Mordremoth is not an asura based dragon. God knows what that would look like.
I’m sorry but that is a silly assumption. Jormag is the dragon of ice but not all ice related creatures fall into its base control or are even linked to it. From what I have seen in game dragons don’t care what they are corrupting as long as they can corrupt it, Sylvari being immune to those known corruptions.
Well it was explained pale tree put up mental barriers to prevent her children being corrupted. You get corrupted you die. Omadd machine disabled the barriers which then allowed Scarlet to be corrupted.
Fafnir.5124:Well it was explained pale tree put up mental barriers to prevent her children being corrupted. You get corrupted you die. Omadd machine disabled the barriers which then allowed Scarlet to be corrupted.
Where does it say the Pale Tree is the one that put the Sylari anti-corruption defenses in place? I don’t remember ever reading or seeing anything related to that so the link to prove that would be nice, I’m more than happy to admit if I am mistaken but I just don’t remember anything along those lines ever being stated.