Guild Wars 2

So, looking at the dialog from Arah:

Randall Greyston: Fantastic! The human gods not only sundered the seer’s bloodstone here—they increased its power.
Randall Greyston: They pulled the energies of Zhaitan himself, even though they did not know of the sleeping Elder Dragon.
Randall Greyston: They only knew that this was a place of great magical power, and built their godly city here.
<Character name>: Greyston! What is happening to you?
Randall Greyston: I can hear the stones calling me! I can hear the voices of the Six Gods!

I was wondering if part of the reason the Pact had an easier time with Zhaitan was because he had lost more magical power during his slumber due to the actions of the Human Gods.

Magic is supposed to slowly dissipate from the dragons while they sleep, so drawing some of Zhaitan’s power into the bloodstone may not have left him any weaker than he’d normally be. Perhaps it instead caused him to awaken sooner than he would otherwise as the magic dropped below a certain level.

Also, by the time the Pact fought him, he’d had over 100 years to recuperate since waking, and a few more centuries since the Gods were in Arah. Surely that’s plenty of time to recover?

The Elder Dragons awaken when magic in the world has risen to a certain point, so drawing from Zhaitan wouldn’t affect that unless what magic was drawn would be put directly into the world – in this case, it wasn’t, but was placed in the Bloodstones.

However, the Bloodstones were seeping magic over time as well, so that drawing did affect it but only at a different rate. Whether that rate was the same or less than it would be if magic wasn’t pulled from Zhaitan is unknown.

But an important thing to consider is that the Elder Dragons also pull in magic to rise – some are known to do this via champions, which are often called heralds or harbingers (Primordus – The Great Destroyer, Jormag – Drakkar, Mordremoth – Scarlet) while others seem capable of doing it by themselves or at least has no known champion to assist them (Kralkatorrik – given dialogue it seems that Glint was to be this champion, though the details are iffy as some lore indicates she was given free will and betrayed Kralkatorrik before Kralk fell asleep, while others indicate that the betrayal was after – alternatively, knowing that Glint prepared for Kralkatorrik’s return in the manner of trying to stall it, she might have killed whatever champion Kralkatorrik left to act as a herald).

Zhaitan has no known herald, but there is a dragon minion known to have been from the previous dragonrise – the risen giganticus lupicus fought in Arah explorable. It’s possible this risen was Zhaitan’s herald, which if so would mean that Zhaitan was given magic before rising. Alternatively, it’s possible that Zhaitan had no herald, thus leaving him to be like Kralkatorrik – waking without being given magic to assist the awakening (from another at least).

If Zhaitan had a herald, then the gods pulling magic from him wouldn’t matter in theory. If he didn’t, then it could have severely weakened him before he rose.

But also keep in mind this important fact: The Pact was starving Zhaitan before confronting him.

Edit: I’ll also make note: the two dragons where it is known they either lacked a herald or said herald died (Primordus and Kralkatorrik) awoke close to another dragons’ rise. Primordus was likely to wake originally near GW1’s time but awoke 50 years later; 50 years after Jormag woke, but the DSD awoke between Primordus and Jormag (guess which one it likely awoke near). Kralkatorrik awoke after a 100 year gap, and within a decade before Mordremoth.

Given this, it’s likely that Zhaitan – like Jormag and Mordremoth – had a herald to wake it ‘on time’ for that 50 year spacing.

It’s not just Zhaitan. There’s a reaper of Grenth in one of the last pact quests who’s also been drastically weakened. Mabye there was a third battle going on that we couldn’t see at the time. And on the starving Zhaitan thing, he definately had more then one mouth. (you kill at least two of them in the story)

The Pact did more than just kill the Mouth to starve Zhaitan.

They also stripped him of his food (artifacts and corpses) and more importantly they purifying a massive source of magic in Orr (The Artesian Waters).

They also used Gorr’s weaponry that effectively mimics dragon consumption/corruption to metaphorically pump Zhaitan’s stomach both before and while fighting the dragon itself.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Zhaitan has no known herald, but there is a dragon minion known to have been from the previous dragonrise – the risen giganticus lupicus fought in Arah explorable. It’s possible this risen was Zhaitan’s herald, which if so would mean that Zhaitan was given magic before rising. Alternatively, it’s possible that Zhaitan had no herald, thus leaving him to be like Kralkatorrik – waking without being given magic to assist the awakening (from another at least).

Could this undead sea creature from Sea of Sorrows have been Zhaitan’s herald? The Maw or whatever it was called. If I remember correctly (and it has been a few years since I read the book) the Maw was identified as a risen in the later stages of the book, but it could have already been one during the first battle too, which coincidentally also happened while Zhaitan awoke.

I personally understood it as the Maw was alive in heir first encounter, and became risen due, in part, to Zhatian’s Tidal Wave. But I do no know that for certain. I don’t recall whether the original description detailed anything risen like.

It wasn’t visibly undead in the first encounter- and since it was in the second, just thirty-seven years later, I think that rules out the possibility that it’d been a risen for thousands of years.

Was there a specific line in the book mentioning that the Maw wasn’t undead during the first encounter? I mean if my memory serves me right the first fight was a quick and hectic affair. Coupled with the fact that at point no one had ever seen a risen creature it is possible that they simply did not identify it as such yet.
I’m just saying that, because I think it was a bit too convenient that a creature was wreaking havoc in the area and shortly after Zhaitan awoke. Of course that doesn’t mean there has to be a correlation. Especially if there was a line pointing out that the Maw looked very different during the second encounter. Can’t check currently, but it might have been there and I just forgot about it.

There wasn’t really anything that indicated such one way or the other in the first encounter, unfortunately.

But all risen look highly decayed, so I would imagine such would be notable.

However, it should also be noted that the Maw survived cannonballs through the mouth – it’s hard to say if a leviathan would be capable of such survival without being an undead capable of moving all body parts despite how they get separated (per EoD/SoS).

“…Cobiah could see it more clearly- and it was not entirely as he remembered. The monster was as dead as the ships of Orr, its black flesh rotted and fouled by disease. Barnacles clung to the creatures fins…” Sea of Sorrows, page 425. It goes on like that for a bit.

And looking back, Konig, the damage wasn’t all that bad. One cannonball hit it in the cheek, but the way it’s described later on as a “long, pale scar”, it sounds like even that was just a graze.

Aaron Ansari.1604:

“…Cobiah could see it more clearly- and it was not entirely as he remembered. The monster was as dead as the ships of Orr, its black flesh rotted and fouled by disease. Barnacles clung to the creatures fins…” Sea of Sorrows, page 425. It goes on like that for a bit.

Okay nevermind then. Thanks for the quote by the way.

Why I never thought to check when the Maw it seen again is beyond me. I’ve always just scoured the first fight for hints. Thanks for the quote.

Also, the fact that the skin scarred implied that it was still some time before the Maw was turned into a risen – long enough for tissue to heal.