Guild Wars 2

do you think the storytelling in GW2 is bad? to me it doesn’t feel neither epic or cosy, not even like an adventure. it just feels like you go along with it sort of…

I’d like to see more ingame cinematics like gw1 or other games.
but I still think there’s more things missing to make the lore and storytelling more intressting…

any suggestions or oppinions about your lore experience in gw2?

for example I think the southsuncove islands could be really intressting if it had some kind of storymode-tour through the islands similar to the GW1 mission outposts.

I didn’t play when southsun cove was in action. So I have no idea what those islands are all about. they are beautiful but just feels random and abandoned. I think the living world events comes and goes to much. they don’t really make the game bigger since they are irrelevant later anyway.

if there in the future would come content which would be about perhaps the Mursaat, I would be really dissappointed if it’s gonna be handled the way living world event’s are being handled right now, I would probably stop playing in an instant and try to erase GW2 from my mind and ignore the rest of gw2 news etc. just to not destroy my beautiful picture of GW1 universe I have in my head. Like they did with the GW1 characters in catacombs. thank god they were not big characters in GW1. (exept Adelbern which they made feel weak and not a mighty king at all.)

If rumors are true about Livia (that she will make a comeback in GW2). She will probably not be potraited as a big deal as she is and when event is gone so will she be and noone will really remember her…

long story short; make Lore more instressting!

Lore is good.
Story is good.
Characters are good.
Story_telling_ is terribad. Especially Living Story. Somewhat for personal story. They’re not telling us nearly close to even half of the lore without making us dig not even into the internet. And this isn’t really a new issue, but it wasn’t nearly as prevalent before.

Guess it may be our own fault, since we never complained about the interviews and pushed to get answers out of devs in them ando n forum/wiki posts… (Though we only did such because the story didn’t tell us enough, we just never mentioned it really).

I respect Konig’s opinion, if only for his vast knowledge, but I disagree.

The new lore is ok, not great. Too radical a departure from its roots imo, but that’s another topic.

The story is good at times, but overall it just seems whimsical and flat. I have to say there were a few moments I actually enjoyed the story content, but they were rare gems indeed. It kind of felt like it was meant for an adolescent Harry Potter type crowd. /shrug

The characters…idk. Unmemorable? Destiny’s Edge is uninteresting: Logan is universally loathed; Rytlock is probably the most well-liked by players, including me. Tonn and Ceera’s little mini-story was nicely done. Trahearne…I don’t need to talk about him. The Personal Story had potential, but it didn’t follow through at all really. It also wasn’t very “personal.” People seemed to like Tybalt.

The Living Story characters I have no idea really. Trying to force me to participate in temporary content in a tiny window of time is bad. You can chalk this up to story telling like Konig said, but the reasons behind it is what destroys my interest in it.
There was an interview awhile back(can’t remember the details) where a dev was asked why GW2 has leaned so intensely toward the Living Story as its modus operandi for story-telling. His answer was basically that ANet had started to notice that “hype” for GW2 always seemed to spike before content releases. So they decided to change their content releases to be doled out in pieces every two weeks so they could ride that wave of hype more often. This also benefited their gem-store tremendously, adding several new, unique items every two weeks to pad their wallets.

It really irks me that marketing decisions can influence the story in such a way. Bad ANet, bad!

The story sucks because nothing big ever happens. Nothing big ever changes. When we killed Zhaitan, did the world change? Nope. I can already guess that when we defeat Scarlet, nothing will change.

Until the story writers grow some “guts” and do crazy things like burn down the whole Hoelbrak forever, or change Logan into a villain, the story will continue to suck.

If you need an example, look at Ascalon and the Searing. I still remember that faithful day. I also remember that day that Kehanni died, which I said “Varesh, your head is mine.”

Obsidian.1328:

I respect Konig’s opinion, if only for his vast knowledge, but I disagree.

The new lore is ok, not great. Too radical a departure from its roots imo, but that’s another topic.

The story is good at times, but overall it just seems whimsical and flat. I have to say there were a few moments I actually enjoyed the story content, but they were rare gems indeed. It kind of felt like it was meant for an adolescent Harry Potter type crowd. /shrug

The characters…idk. Unmemorable? Destiny’s Edge is uninteresting: Logan is universally loathed; Rytlock is probably the most well-liked by players, including me. Tonn and Ceera’s little mini-story was nicely done. Trahearne…I don’t need to talk about him. The Personal Story had potential, but it didn’t follow through at all really. It also wasn’t very “personal.” People seemed to like Tybalt.

The Living Story characters I have no idea really. Trying to force me to participate in temporary content in a tiny window of time is bad. You can chalk this up to story telling like Konig said, but the reasons behind it is what destroys my interest in it.
There was an interview awhile back(can’t remember the details) where a dev was asked why GW2 has leaned so intensely toward the Living Story as its modus operandi for story-telling. His answer was basically that ANet had started to notice that “hype” for GW2 always seemed to spike before content releases. So they decided to change their content releases to be doled out in pieces every two weeks so they could ride that wave of hype more often. This also benefited their gem-store tremendously, adding several new, unique items every two weeks to pad their wallets.

It really irks me that marketing decisions can influence the story in such a way. Bad ANet, bad!

Have you read the novels? I’ve grown fond of DE because of it, shows why they are who they are better than the game. I know Logan is a bit of a lovesick puppy, but aside from that I dont see a reason to hate him like so many do.

But yea story and lore is awesome, but the actual storytelling isnt. Saw a gw1 eotn vie yesterday and it had very nice storytelling so i cant wrap my head around how its pretty awful now…

Direksone.3867:

Obsidian.1328:

I respect Konig’s opinion, if only for his vast knowledge, but I disagree.

The new lore is ok, not great. Too radical a departure from its roots imo, but that’s another topic.

The story is good at times, but overall it just seems whimsical and flat. I have to say there were a few moments I actually enjoyed the story content, but they were rare gems indeed. It kind of felt like it was meant for an adolescent Harry Potter type crowd. /shrug

The characters…idk. Unmemorable? Destiny’s Edge is uninteresting: Logan is universally loathed; Rytlock is probably the most well-liked by players, including me. Tonn and Ceera’s little mini-story was nicely done. Trahearne…I don’t need to talk about him. The Personal Story had potential, but it didn’t follow through at all really. It also wasn’t very “personal.” People seemed to like Tybalt.

The Living Story characters I have no idea really. Trying to force me to participate in temporary content in a tiny window of time is bad. You can chalk this up to story telling like Konig said, but the reasons behind it is what destroys my interest in it.
There was an interview awhile back(can’t remember the details) where a dev was asked why GW2 has leaned so intensely toward the Living Story as its modus operandi for story-telling. His answer was basically that ANet had started to notice that “hype” for GW2 always seemed to spike before content releases. So they decided to change their content releases to be doled out in pieces every two weeks so they could ride that wave of hype more often. This also benefited their gem-store tremendously, adding several new, unique items every two weeks to pad their wallets.

It really irks me that marketing decisions can influence the story in such a way. Bad ANet, bad!

Have you read the novels? I’ve grown fond of DE because of it, shows why they are who they are better than the game. I know Logan is a bit of a lovesick puppy, but aside from that I dont see a reason to hate him like so many do.

But yea story and lore is awesome, but the actual storytelling isnt. Saw a gw1 eotn vie yesterday and it had very nice storytelling so i cant wrap my head around how its pretty awful now…

I broke down and read GoA. Killeen was my favorite. I didn’t become emotionally attached to any of it though, it was just a moderately entertaining read. It failed to convince me to read the other two at all. :/

“(We) troll because (we) care”.
Many of here have been entangled in the world of Tyria for many years. We have “grown up” with this game, it’s world, and it’s lore. This place has captured our hearts and imaginations, and held them, for a long time now. This sub-forum, as a result, is full of highly opinionated people. These people all love this world.
That said, I do feel like the storytelling is taking a backseat. It all feels very “rushed out the door”. I do not wish to argue the abilities of the writing staff at Anet, I am sure they are all very talented individuals. But even the most talented person can fall short under insane time constraints. The Personal Story wasn’t THAT bad, at first. You can tell time was spent writing and fleshing out characters and stories, only to watch it all dissolve after “Cloor Island”. No more time spent working within your order, exploring and righting wrongs throughout Tyria, no more meeting new, interesting characters (Mallyk, Tonn, Seiren, Tybalt etc) only “HURRY!! we have to stand around and watch the dragon die!!” From there everyting has felt “rushed” and “kitten”. It doesn’t feel like the lore has been “widened” only washed over and made shallow. We come here and complain among ourselves, because we KNOW Anet can do better, we’ve all SEEN it. We love this game, and its world.
Sadly, our “vocal minority” here has proven to be a bit too toxic for devs to dare come into, and I can’t blame them, I’d be put off and/or frightened too. The saddest part, is that right here, in THIS forum, are the MOST die-hard fans. These are the ones that don’t care so much about bugs, and loot (though still important). These are the people that care about the STORY, the world as a whole. Yes, the story telling has taken a real hit in the past year or so, but I still have faith, and hope that Anet will deliver to us, something compelling, something epic, something worthy of being Guild Wars 2. Personally, I think slowing down the tempo of releases is what they need to do. Take more time and really flesh out the plots, check the lore of old, and hey…maybe interact with some of the lore-masters of the forums in reference, it could only serve to help the game.
“(We) troll because (we) care”….well said Mr Obsidian, well said.

the lore is good,the story arc of the main character is good at first then gets a bit too childish,the story in itself is good the way it is conveyed is awfull…

GW2 seems to have a philosophy of showing you the current world through the game events and all the old lore is hidden away in conversations and books. I don’t think that’s so bad. All the stuff with Zaitan raising Orr and corrupting the worship of the human gods is shown in game. Any history of Orr is stuck is elsewhere. Fine.

With Scarlet and the living story we may again just be looking at current events but without any access to a back story through conversations and books. Hopefully the series of current events will form a decent history over time but at the moment I agree that it feels empty.

Obsidian.1328:

The new lore is ok, not great. Too radical a departure from its roots imo, but that’s another topic.

I never said it was “great” either. Really, the only bad thing is Scarlet turning Guild Wars into Tech Wars. Aside from a few isolated peculiarities like the Stone Summit being related to ED magics every other sentence in GW2.

Obsidian.1328:

-snip rest-

That’s storytelling not story or characters.

The story is the idea of (I’m butchering it here) five races, each with their own hatreds or likings of the others (sylvari v asura; human v charr; charr v human; norn v human). But these are rarely picked up on, and everyone’s buddy go friendly. The idea of the Elder Dragons is rather good – even if not too entirely original – but poorly shown in the game (Sea of Sorrows does a far superior job of personalizing the Risen IMO, which only makes the game seem worse). The inconsistency of game to novel (e.g., Risen in both EoD and SoS are still mobile even after chopping them down… in game you have a dialogue at Fort Trinity saying “any way you can kill the living, will kill the undead”).

Basically, story = the concept of plot; storytelling = how the plot’s portrayed

On the characters, if you delve into their dossier then they’re rather interesting – even Trahearne. But ArenaNet does a rather bad job at showing them off – the storytelling revolving them.

And Robert King did not help with Destiny’s Edge either.

CHIPS.6018:

The story sucks because nothing big ever happens. Nothing big ever changes. When we killed Zhaitan, did the world change? Nope. I can already guess that when we defeat Scarlet, nothing will change.

Until the story writers grow some “guts” and do crazy things like burn down the whole Hoelbrak forever, or change Logan into a villain, the story will continue to suck.

I would chock this up to the storytelling as well.

The game was introduced as static – even if they claimed dynamic events, not really. There was a clear progression. Then they added the so-called “Living World” which is nothing more than a linear progressional story, untied to the personal story (the main plot at least). They put themselves in an unnecessary spot between a rock and a hard place where they cannot acknowledge changing things that would drastically alter new players’ ability to do the personal story (which I am not opposed to per se, but them refusing to say “this happens post-Personal story” is really kittening annoying).

But this is their means of storytelling – which indeed sucks. Not the story themselves – which thanks to their means of storytelling, people don’t really see the full scope of.

Side note: You do have to take into question new players to the game series. I mean, think of it… Take your suggestion of burning Hoelbrak down, this would have to be shown in the open world to. That would utterly destroy the first thirty levels for all norn players. They effectively cannot make drastic moves without cutting all new players out of content.

Then again… they’ve been doing exactly that with their so-called “Living World.”

Stooperdale.3560:

GW2 seems to have a philosophy of showing you the current world through the game events and all the old lore is hidden away in conversations and books. I don’t think that’s so bad. All the stuff with Zaitan raising Orr and corrupting the worship of the human gods is shown in game. Any history of Orr is stuck is elsewhere. Fine.

With Scarlet and the living story we may again just be looking at current events but without any access to a back story through conversations and books. Hopefully the series of current events will form a decent history over time but at the moment I agree that it feels empty.

Even lots of the current events are hidden in interviews and videos of Scott and Angel doing summaries of Living Story chapters, where we find out things only through those. Like the device Scarlet was in to see the Eternal Alchemy merely being a sensory deprivation device. Well over half of Scarlet’s persona is only viewable via some internet ArenaNet never acknowledged.

The issue is that their lore isn’t hidden away in just dialogues and books. A very small amount overall is such, in fact. Even their current story plots are hidden away in the bowels of the internet, and there’s lore accessible in only certain personal story steps (which is bad in GW2’s case because there are so many variances that to re-access you gotta follow those same steps more or less).

I keep hoping they’ll give us a “historian” or an NPC of some kind, that will recap the story so that new players (and those like me with really bad memories) can review what’s going on. Or, at LEAST make use of the priory’s library. If nothing else, they could start a section on the website showing what has and IS going on. I enjoy the short stories, but they are buried on the official website when they should be collected. And while I have nothing in the world against Mr Potato or Ms Dulfy, I DO resent being somewhat forced to go to their sites to get information that should be available on Guildwars2.com.

The Storytelling sucks for a simple reason: There are no motivations.

If you want somebody to keep reading/watching/playing, you need to give him motivations to do that. A person or an Area that he can associate with. An example is the Kord of the Rings. Why it is such a good book/movie? Because Tolkien and Peter Jackson gave us the beautiful shire that needs to be defended, Frodos and Sams journey to Mordor, Aragorns fight for the throne. It is not “The Fight to save Middle earth” that keep you in the story, we don’t know much about Middle earth anyways, but we want the places we saw and the characters we got to know to survive, to continue, we want to know what happens to them.

We don’t have anything like this in Guild Wars 2. Sure they can’t have the same character developement level as Game of Thrones, but ONE SINGLE motivation would be enough. Characters? We got none. The members of destinys edge? You don’t know much about them without reading the book, and having to buy a book to get excited for the story ingame is stupid.
Braham? Rox? Ellen Kiel? Scarlet? Without having to read the shortstories on the website we don’t get to know much about them, they barely have ingame dialog with you, nor are they likeable. And Scarlet as a villain thrills or scares me as much as a tree in bright daylight. Unless Scarlet burns Divinities Reach and puts the Human race further towards extinction or something remotely evil, I won’t take her serious.

I can’t get excited for the elder dragons because Zhaitan sucked. The whole personal story lead to a crappy final encounter, but in the end why even do that? What precious have we lost because of him? Clarwrwrrwr Island? Our Mentor? A tribe of uncivilized creatures lost their home? All these things COULD have motivate us to go kill him, but they’re poorly done. NPCs die all the time and no one even cares. Logan and you fight Two blade pete in a bar, both of the Seraph Logan brought with him die instantly and can’t be revived, Logan doesn’t even attempt run away because nobody gives a crap.

The synchronization of gameplay and story is poorly done, not to mention the countless Sound and animation bugs in the cutscenes (Not the dialog scenes).

They have to take something away from us at this point to make us excited. Jormag freezes Queensdale and corruptes everything there. Kralkatorrik destroys the black citadel and Rytlock dies in battle. Primordus invades the Maguuma jungle. Things like that. We’ve been in these areas for a year now, we like them, I love caledon forest. If Primordus would come and burn the whole place down, I’d want to stick my sword up his dragonhole. Then they had a good motive to bring in the tengu and the story starts telling itself. It isn’t that hard.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

The idea of the Elder Dragons is rather good – even if not too entirely original – but poorly shown in the game…

Are you kidding??

First off, it’s terribly tropish. Every fantasy MMO seems to have dragons as the apex predator. Guild Wars 1 actually managed to shirk that stereotype and create original villains. Of the 3 “draconic” beings in GW1 that stand out at all, one was a minor boss with no real story connection(Rotscale), the other two were important to the story, but totally allied with you and acted more as npc advisors than anything else(Glint & Kuunavang). Why bring in huge dragons at all??

Secondly, the whole dragons-devour-magic thing was a plot device created to further ANet’s thematic style for the game. They wanted to diminish magic and magnify technology. They could have done that any number of ingenious ways, but the fact that they chose the cheesy fantasy fall-back trope of “dragons” makes one want to spam /rollseyes.

I like the way they’re trying to sell their dragons in a Lovecraftian-esque way in their almost cosmic existence. Even Zhaitan has mouth tentacles (adorned in dragon heads) that rose from a sunken nation. It all falls way too short in presentation, build up, and atmosphere.

Obsidian.1328:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

The idea of the Elder Dragons is rather good – even if not too entirely original – but poorly shown in the game…

Are you kidding??

First off, it’s terribly tropish. Every fantasy MMO seems to have dragons as the apex predator. Guild Wars 1 actually managed to shirk that stereotype and create original villains. Of the 3 “draconic” beings in GW1 that stand out at all, one was a minor boss with no real story connection(Rotscale), the other two were important to the story, but totally allied with you and acted more as npc advisors than anything else(Glint & Kuunavang). Why bring in huge dragons at all??

Secondly, the whole dragons-devour-magic thing was a plot device created to further ANet’s thematic style for the game. They wanted to diminish magic and magnify technology. They could have done that any number of ingenious ways, but the fact that they chose the cheesy fantasy fall-back trope of “dragons” makes one want to spam /rollseyes.

On the first part – I have and probably always will view them less as “Elder Dragons” and more as “Elder Abominations” that just happen to take draconic shape. I mean, look at Zhaitan. Look at the entire feel behind them. They are less “gold-hoarding dragons” (btw, most fantasy settings have dragons not as the apex of power but as the apex of middle-earthen power excluding the main villain(s)) and more of “beyond-ancient beings of incomprehension.” Their plot falls short in that they made it so easy to confront one of them, and so immediate too. They shouldn’t have had Zhaitan rising at Orr – maybe a champion of an Elder Dragon, but not an Elder Dragon itself. And the statue he asura saw should have been a higher ranking champion rather than Primordus. If they were kept in the unknown longer they would have held more impact. Effectively, “what Kyrel said.”

To your second point – I wouldn’t argue the Elder Dragons are a thematic plot device for that. After all, the asura, dredge, charr, and Scarlet go in the direction of technology without the Elder Dragons.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

To your second point – I wouldn’t argue the Elder Dragons are a thematic plot device for that. After all, the asura, dredge, charr, and Scarlet go in the direction of technology without the Elder Dragons.

Well…when you consider that they also render the gods defunct, or at least a non-factor, then that’s exactly what they do. It’s two birds with one stone. The Asura, Dredge, Charr, and Scarlet went the techno route not in spite of the ED’s, but because the ED’s existence allowed them to do so. Otherwise, pure magic would still be the power-of-choice in Tyria.

I thought Kyrel was being sarcastic, but I could be wrong. :-/

Actually, they went the techno route despite, not in spite or due to. The two were unrelated, directly at least.

2 things

1) Elder Dragons – They are boring right now because they are not doing anything. What are they doing? Kill everyone already (or try to). Its been a year since GW2’s release. Get a move on. Come kill us. Or are they scared because we took out Zhaitan?

2) Technology vs Magic – If you look at our 8 professions you will see that magic still rules supreme. Engineer is the only profession that focus on technology. The other 7 professions are mostly physical damage or magic. Just because a warrior uses a rifle it doesn’t mean he is a technology class.

All I see from technology are tanks, golems and airships. So what? I rarely see them on the front lines. Its still your warriors and mages doing the hard work.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Actually, they went the techno route despite, not in spite or due to. The two were unrelated, directly at least.

Oh for christ’s sake, can no one here separate writers’ intention with lore canon? Do you really think the way they presented this games’ story has nothing to do with how they wanted to market it? Wake up, man. They are selling us a product. And to make that product more appetizing to the masses, they threw in all sorts of glitzy, mainstream fluff to guarantee the sales.

Good grief, I understand you know this lore inside and out Konig, and whoever else, but if you can’t bring yourself to look at it from a business perspective, you’ve lost objectivity. Try to see things from a sellers eyes, and not a fan’s eyes. I’m one too, but I’m tellin ya man, this game was not made with the same compassion as the original. Whether that’s on Anet, NCSoft, or whoever, it doesn’t matter. You can pick apart my wording ‘till the cows come home, but that won’t change the fact the game is a sell-out.

Almost every decision of import they’ve made since development began bespeaks that.

And btw, every time someone asks why a dev or writer chose one way over another, for anything, and you answer with only some game or lore nugget, you lose credibility.

I can outright agree this game wasn’t made with the same compassion – or the same business intention, or hell even the same commitment – as the first. And if any of that is the same, ArenaNet doesn’t sell that image. I won’t call GW2 a “sell-out” though – different people, different mentality, different ideals, different plans. A sell-out is when an individual or group caves into the desires of others. Replacement of writers != selling out, just a change of ideas.

I just do not think that the Elder Dragons was created for the sole purpose of turning the game from magic to technology. I’m sure they turned the ED for that. But it sure as hell wasn’t the sole purpose for them, and it sure as hell wasn’t the lore explanation – both of which you claimed – for groups going into technology.

Even without the Elder Dragons, they would still have the tech themes, and it would be fully justified. That was the point you apparently failed to see.

I didn’t say it was the ED’s sole purpose to make tech eclipse magic, only one big one. Other things contribute. The 250 years is one. The mass market appeal is another(prolly the biggest one). The Charr and Asura themselves are another. The gods exit-stage-left is another big one(again…ED’s tied to that).

/shrug… Just look at the big picture. Everything is interconnected and purposed to do one thing: provide us, the players, with a cool world with which to engage in. Every game does that.

The difference is some games make it a point to tell a story simply because the story is that good to hear, while others design the story around a target audience.

Which one do you think this game is?

Obsidian, your old posts diagree with you.

Obsidian.1328:

Secondly, the whole dragons-devour-magic thing was a plot device created to further ANet’s thematic style for the game. They wanted to diminish magic and magnify technology. They could have done that any number of ingenious ways, but the fact that they chose the cheesy fantasy fall-back trope of “dragons” makes one want to spam /rollseyes.

Clearly shows you think the entire point of the ED is to remove magic from the lore’s importance.

Obsidian.1328:

The Asura, Dredge, Charr, and Scarlet went the techno route not in spite of the ED’s, but because the ED’s existence allowed them to do so. Otherwise, pure magic would still be the power-of-choice in Tyria.

This further shows you think the entire point of the ED was to remove magic, but also shows that you think without the ED’s addition there would be magic. You state that the asura and charr go tech because of the ED – rather than as an independent aspect to further take the game away from magic and into tech.

Side note: Nothing says the ED are related to the Six Gods’ departure, given how they departed 3 years before the earliest ED activity.

But that was what I was in disagreement with you about – that the Elder Dragons were introduced just to give a reason for all the tech directions the story was going.

As to your final question? In this case, neither. GW2 seems geared around the story that previously-fans-of-the-game want to turn the story into. Aka, they’re taking grade c (or worse) plot material fan-fiction and trying to make it into canon lore. That’s what I see it, especially given Angel’s shown contributions.

Konig

Meh, their magic-devouring ability was the point. They do server another huge purpose…aka main antagonist. Or at least they were before all this LS stuff now, I’m not sure anymore.

You’re missing one big thing here though. The ED’s allowed the Charr, Asura, and Scarlet to go techno not because they literally couldn’t go another route, but because the writers already wanted to go that way. They could have used dozens of plot devices to further that aim, they chose this ability of the ED’s as one big one. It’s not the only one, but it’s a main one.

They had decided all this a long, long time ago I’m sure. They had to. Could the Asura and Charr have simply gone this route on their own without the ED’s? Sure, why not. But it makes it much more plausible and relevant to have them in. Especially with the gods gone at the same time they start stirring(3 years out of thousands is pretty close in my book). Add the 250 years to the mix, it all makes sense. I’m sure there are other factors I don’t even know about.

But I still think that the magic-devouring aspect of the ED’s was created by the writers to further their overall style and tone for the game, and not just some cool ability our player characters have to deal with. Or whatever. It makes sense if you look at the big picture, and not try to understand it from just a local level.

Lore really isn’t my thing, I usually just get my info from Konig, The Wiki, or WoodenPotatoes, but I did play GW1 since around 2006. Maybe it was just because I was so young then, but I definitely felt that GW1 had better storytelling.

Prince Rurik was a really generic “noble prince looking out for his people” character, but I sympathized with him. His goals were clear, his character was well rounded, his accomplishments were WITNESSED by our characters, not TOLD to our characters. He was very likable even though he was really generic, and I was genuinely sad when he died.

As for Trahearne, I don’t even care about the whole “Trahearne took over the personal story” controversy. I’m fine with that, I didn’t want a personal story in the first place, I wanted the devs to focus their attention on making one good story, instead of a bunch of different bad stories that branch out. I liked being Trahearne’s sidekick. I just really didn’t like Trahearne. His character was about as generic as Prince Rurik, maybe a little bit less generic, but he wasn’t realized at all. He only contributes to a fight once, and he goes on vacation at the end while our characters+Destiny’s Edge go and kill Zhaitan.

I don’t really know what I’m trying to say, but I guess I’m saying that it’s bad for me to like Prince Rurik, who was roughly 1/4 of the story in GW1, while disliking Trahearne, who is at least half of the story.

As for the “Living World” I like the concept of the Aetherblades, as well as the Zephyrites. Neither of them have been fleshed out (I’m seeing a trend here) but I think they have potential. Scarlet is hopeless at this point, she can’t be saved. I never even knew who Canach was or why I was fighting him, and I’ve basically forgotten about the Molten Alliance.

^

One thing that GW1 has over 2 is a simple game mechanic: the mission replayability. I know some people thought it stupid that the content was gated through the storyline. That’s another discussion. But what it did do was reinforce that story to you many times through playing it on alts, with friends, and for daily quests from GToB. I thought is was very ingenious the way they encouraged visiting all areas of the known map through that system.

GW1 story is much better than GW2’s. It flows better, plenty of foreshadowing, and involves characters that you care (or hate) about.

Ascalon was great -> Searing
Prince Rurik decided Ascalon hopeless and leads the people to Kryta (rightfully so)->dies
Help White Mantle pick out Chosens
Betrayed by White Mantle & Chosen (probably the same ones we just picked) killed->escapes
Lich pretend to help us
Forgotten have to test us->ascension
Both Stone Summit and Mursaats wants us dead->Saidra dies.
Tricked by Lich->Titans now loose
Kill Lich.
Kill Titans.
Reinstall the Queen on the throne. (plenty of foreshadow on this one. )
Kill all remaining White Mantles and Mursaats.

Guild Wars 2’s story is every bit as complex as GW1, with plenty of foreshadowing (the flow is admittingly choppy and caring about characters, well…). The problem isn’t the story, it’s how it is presented to us- in episodic chapters, with any given character only seeing a very small part of it. To experience the whole story you need a minimum of 15 characters, much more if you want to see how each part of the story interacts with other parts, with all the characters stepping on each others feet more and more the farther they progress. That viewpoint is not conducive to appreciation of what’s happening in Tyria, in fact, it almost stipulates that you can only care about what is happening immediately around a given character. Bottom line, the story isn’t the problem the kitten “personal” is. Unfortunately, the living world strategy is only exacerbating many of these complaints.

I know at this point I’m just saying what has already been said, but the failing is in the implementation, not the conception.

We. Need. Cinematic. WoW-like quality ( or even queen Jubilee ).

And we need to hate and to love. For the moment we can love some character/ place, but I can’t ate the ED or Scarlett because they didnt hurt me, as a player. Maybe the mentor part but that wasnt enough.

It hurt to lose the mentor, but then we stormed Claw Island and killed everyone that took part in killing our Mentor. I understand that Zhaitan was behind it all, but he wasn’t ever present in any of it.