Guild Wars 2

I don’t hate him, but I think the character is a hard to like.

He’s too nice. Straight laced, uptight. Not much personality. Kind of a C3PO type character, but not funny. Not a people person either, more a facts and figures kind of guy.

He’s cast initially (if you do the sylvari story) as a wise scholarly type, but he’s only 25. It doesn’t quite work. But it’s not as bad as his transformation into a great leader. That part of the story really doesn’t work at all. I can’t see him in a leadership role, he just doesn’t have the gravitas, the mana, the charisma of a great leader.

Most importantly, I don’t think he’s paid his dues. He comes out of nowhere, with no leadership or military experience, like some MBA grad who happens to be the nephew of the CEO. Actually a lot like that – he’s all theory, no experience, and just happens to be one of the firstborn. I can see why a lot of people would have a problem with that.

He would have been better cast as some sort of head-researcher or senior advisor.

I’m sorry BuddaKeks, it’s hard to even take what you write seriously because 98% of is is just pure hatred of anything sylvari. I can honestly see you right now running around burning down the pale tree and every sylvari in sight, which makes me take any opinion you seem to have and toss it. Even if we made a 100% sound argument for Trahearne’s ranking as Marshal, you would just ignore us and continue to mutter “burn all salad-heads” over and over again.

Narcemus.1348:

I’m sorry BuddaKeks, it’s hard to even take what you write seriously because 98% of is is just pure hatred of anything sylvari. I can honestly see you right now running around burning down the pale tree and every sylvari in sight, which makes me take any opinion you seem to have and toss it. Even if we made a 100% sound argument for Trahearne’s ranking as Marshal, you would just ignore us and continue to mutter “burn all salad-heads” over and over again.

Contrary to your believe, I don’t actually hate the Sylvari, I just think they are boring, somewhat annoying, uncanny and I would have rather seen the Tengu as the last playable race. Comments on how the Pale Tree should be nuked are comical exaggerations. I thought the sheer stupidity of such remarks would be enough to show their true nature as jokes.
Also I don’t dislike NPCs because of the fact that they are Sylvari, it’s the other way round, I dislike the Sylvari because of the high amount of annoying or bland NPCs they produce (Trahearne, Tegwen, Sieran and so on). There are however Sylvari NPCs that I think are atleast decent, like Carys, or Faolain.
Last but not least, nothing in this thread has convinced me that Trahearne is in anyway even a good Marshal, not because he is a Sylvari, but because there was nothing said that makes me think he is a good Marshal. Heck in my opinion Caithe would be a better Marshal.
Anyway, please don’t run around and accuse people of fictional racism, because in my case, it couldn’t be further from the truth, as I approach it like a Norn, everyone is a blank slate, no matter where he comes from or how he looks, it’s his/her deeds that make the person.

I don’t hate him.

All I am saying is, with the exception of Carys and Faolain are cool (which is kinda a double edged compliment since Faolain is kinda evil) you have not said one thing decent about the race while you have made dozens of insults against them. I think it’s time to just admit you don’t like them dude.

I personally loved my first 1/3 of the game, and that 1/3 was going through the Sylvari starter area/storyline. There was something so mystical/naive/fantasy about it that I really wish I could go back and see it again. It’s distinctly different from any other storyline and it honestly permanently endeared myself to the race.

As to Trahearne and his appointment to Marshal (though I doubt anything I say will make any difference to yourself or your opinion on the matter.) I fully agree that in a military matter it would make sense to have a military mind (The Vigil) in charge. The problem with that is that the other two orders absolutely refuse to have the Vigil ruling over their actions. In all honesty, the 3 orders have created divides between each other as they try to get the 5 races to unite, which is really ironic when you think about it.

Order Representative- “Hey we need to get everyone together to defeat the dragons!”

Bypasser- “Even the other two orders”

Order Representative- “What? No! Not them! They’re Dumb!”

Because of that they needed a neutral party to come in and take them all by the reins. They had to be an individual that was outside of the control of any one of the orders. Well this makes it so you can’t lead, but this is obvious, you can’t have millions of Marshalls of the Pact anyways.

Certain other individuals also cannot be the leaders because they hold positions too high within their own race, thus ensuring they may pull power of the pact for their race’s own good. This takes Jennah, Anise, Logan, Caudecus, (or any Minister), Smoldur (and any charr tribune most likely), Any Arcane Council Member, Knut Whitebear or his son, or Magus the Bloody Handed (because he would most likely lose interest once the threat was no longer directed at Lion’s Arch).

You may say that Trahearne falls into this category because of his status as a firstborn Sylvari, and you may honestly be right. When it comes down to it though, Trahearne had met and grew bonds of trust with high level members of each order which allowed him to overcome any anxiety they may have had with another “high profile” character.

Prowess in battle and inside knowledge are two major factors that MUST have been there. I know what you’re thinking, Trahearne and prowess in battle? But you have to honestly think about it. The man spent, what, twenty years in Orr. TWENTY YEARS!!! He’s studied the environment which gave critical knowledge to all of the orders, and he survived it all. I don’t know about you guys, but even if I’m fast I can’t spend more than 2 minutes outside of combat, if I’m lucky. This guy survived multiple years on the continent, full of dragon minions, and has come out without a scratch.

In the end, what makes a good leader? Someone with the ability to make decisions based on the knowledge given to him. Trahearne does this many times. He is given information and tactics from representatives of every order/race and he is able to pull it all together to choose the next step in their invasion plan. And someone who has the trust of his men. Whether or not he has your personal trust is beyond the point. Trahearne is able to motivate the soldiers of the Pact to move forwards with their invasion, and he is able to get all 3 orders to agree on an action, even if it wasn’t their own order’s plan.

Now will I say he’s perfect? No. Will I say his development was brilliant? No. I would have much preferred to have an extra segment in the story that showed the development of Trahearne into a leader than say a greatest fear storyline, but sadly we do not always get what we wish for. And I do have to say that no, the claw island storyline was not his development, at the very least it wasn’t enough. If afterwards he showed more confidence in his actions, or his voice acting changed it MAY have been enough, but sadly we won’t know.

Narcemus.1348:

Order Representative- “Hey we need to get everyone together to defeat the dragons!”

Bypasser- “Even the other two orders”

Order Representative- “What? No! Not them! They’re Dumb!”

More like:

Priory is too interested in knowing things rather than doing things, the Vigil is too interested in acting first and finding things out later, and the Order of Whispers are sneaky sneaks who we don’t know if we can trust to have peoples’ best interests at heart.

(All of which is true, to an extent. Especially about the Order – they play for the greater and long-term good.)

Narcemus.1348:

You may say that Trahearne falls into this category because of his status as a firstborn Sylvari, and you may honestly be right. When it comes down to it though, Trahearne had met and grew bonds of trust with high level members of each order which allowed him to overcome any anxiety they may have had with another “high profile” character.

We have a problem though. Lots of this is established in exposition, and told rather than shown. So it comes off to some as “ArenaNet setting their Mary Sue up” rather than someone who earned that trust and should be allowed to lead.

It’s one of the problems which plagues a lot of fiction – “show, don’t tell” – which is inevitably one of the first things which winds up failing to take shape as a story is put together. Especially if it’s for a video game, it seems, because there are very little “show” moments in video games anymore.

We’re informed of things threatening people, rather than shown why we should care. There’s no familiarity to the place before it’s threatened, so it’s like using the destruction of a well-known monument in a disaster flick to shortcut “why should we care?” to “oh my god they blew up the White House!”.

We’re informed of high-profile characters having credentials and experience. We’re not always shown they can handle it, and sometimes we’re given to understand they’re not as useful as our Player Character / Player Avatar.

All of this could have been ironed out if the Personal Story had more space to it and more dialogue to develop things. Here’s hoping the Living World project does better, though its pacing currently has me wondering if it was dialed back a bit too slow.

Narcemus.1348:

All I am saying is, with the exception of Carys and Faolain are cool (which is kinda a double edged compliment since Faolain is kinda evil) you have not said one thing decent about the race while you have made dozens of insults against them. I think it’s time to just admit you don’t like them dude.

I ment that in the sense of, Faolain being an interesting character. She is not so much “I must torture for the evulz” like most other NCs are. Besides that, I made pretty clear that I’m not to fond of the Sylvari as they are now, in other words I don’t like them. That doesn’t mean I hate them. If they step away form being 2 dimensional they can be quiet interesting. Canach would be another interesting Sylvari NPC imo.

I personally loved my first 1/3 of the game, and that 1/3 was going through the Sylvari starter area/storyline. There was something so mystical/naive/fantasy about it that I really wish I could go back and see it again. It’s distinctly different from any other storyline and it honestly permanently endeared myself to the race.

Believe it or not, but I have played a Sylvari too. They have some interesting storylines and the jungle setting looks pretty neat. I like for example how it casually introduces the Sylvari’s pansexuality right at the beginning. But they are still pretty bland personality wise and therefore unintersting for me. Also I prefer “ugly on the outside- noble/good hearted on the inside” races, the Sylvari are too much “what you see is what you get” for me.

As to Trahearne and his appointment to Marshal (though I doubt anything I say will make any difference to yourself or your opinion on the matter.)

I said from the get go, it’ a matter of opinion. If you don’t mind the Mary-Sue-ish vibe from Trahearne or my alternate theory, that he didn’t just learn being a competent leader of a military organization in a few weeks, but is instead dependent on his good advisers and the player, then that’s fine for you, and I don’t argue that, because honestly there is no point in arguing over opinions. There is no right or wrong, it’s just different stand points. I for one am bothered by Trahearne being the Marshal, but I talked enough about this. That’s my opinion. You have a different one and that’ fine.

Sylvari is not boring at all. The elder tree can be thought of as a computer AI programmed to avoid harming other races if possible. In a twisted logic it can very well turn against everyone, because the elder dragons posts the greatest threat. The only way to “protect” other races is by “uniting” all races under one single banner (elder tree’s) and producing an unstoppable Nightmare army.

Treb is boring.

My complaints about Trahearne:

• Given his prominence in the story, he lacks sufficient development. It would have been better if all race stories included a quest with Trahearne, together showing more of his personality/history/abilities/etc.

• The character development that is there makes him seem too straightforward, predictable, one-dimensional, boring. I can’t remember a single time when I felt surprised by the character. He feels like a very generic reluctant commander.

• In the gameplay itself, he feels more like a liability than an asset. He never does anything really strong or cool against mobs, and several times I’ve had to backtrack because I went too far ahead and Trahearne didn’t bother following me.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

More like:

Priory is too interested in knowing things rather than doing things, the Vigil is too interested in acting first and finding things out later, and the Order of Whispers are sneaky sneaks who we don’t know if we can trust to have peoples’ best interests at heart.

(All of which is true, to an extent. Especially about the Order – they play for the greater and long-term good.)

No, there are quite a few instances of the personal story where the representatives display outright disgust at the other orders because “We have the right mindset. They have the wrong one!”

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

All of this could have been ironed out if the Personal Story had more space to it and more dialogue to develop things.

I fully agree, but to show him gaining the trust of all 3 orders would honestly take at least 2 full storylines added to the game. What may have been a smart thought would have been showing him in one of the order storylines. This way characters can get used to him before they lose their mentor, and you can see how he gained the respect of at least one of the orders, and from there the other two can be applied.

Narcemus.1348:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

More like:

Priory is too interested in knowing things rather than doing things, the Vigil is too interested in acting first and finding things out later, and the Order of Whispers are sneaky sneaks who we don’t know if we can trust to have peoples’ best interests at heart.

(All of which is true, to an extent. Especially about the Order – they play for the greater and long-term good.)

No, there are quite a few instances of the personal story where the representatives display outright disgust at the other orders because “We have the right mindset. They have the wrong one!”

Depends on the race and who’s talking. The Order of Whispers will back Priory over Vigil sometimes, for instance “Dredge Technology” I opted to follow the Priory path. The Whispers rep went “The Slayer’s right, this isn’t a time to just rush out swinging.”

It’s been a LONG time since I did the other two story segments but I recall the charr representatives weren’t quite as bad towards each other . . . then again, they’ve got their own three-order setup (Ash, Blood, and Iron) so I could have just been used to it

I fully agree, but to show him gaining the trust of all 3 orders would honestly take at least 2 full storylines added to the game. What may have been a smart thought would have been showing him in one of the order storylines. This way characters can get used to him before they lose their mentor, and you can see how he gained the respect of at least one of the orders, and from there the other two can be applied.

That’s about what I was thinking. We did need another chapter just kicking around in the order of our choice before/after the “racial sympathy” just to cool down and get a feel for things. However, as tightly spaced as these quests are it’s probably not possible without some recalibration of later quests.

It would definitely have made the transition into the Claw Island/Pact storyline much easier though. I’d personally say after the Racial Sympathy. This gives you a whole 10 lvl storyline with your mentor and Trahearne. It somehow shifts the focus towards Orr a little bit more, and it ends heading off to Claw Island and dealing with the loss of your mentor. Throughout the story you can see how Trahearne is/gets the trust of your specific order. This plus a bit of re-writing during and after the Claw Island storyline could give Trahearne the extra confidence needed to show his development as a leader. As much as I enjoyed Tonn, I would definitely say that the “worst fear” storyline could easily be scrapped in order to give Trahearne some MUCH needed character development.

I can say that I don’t hate Trahearne. I’ll also admit the the Sylvari are my favorite playable race, with humans being my least favorite. Trahearne’s voice, appearance, and actions…nope, I can’t see anything wrong. He is a figure-head. This is what it seems most people don’t like.

I’ve played through 2 of the different order story lines and it seems that the higher ups do not dislike the other orders. Now their underlings are trained in a specific manner and geared to think that anything OTHER than what they’re doing is rubbish. It’s a semi-brainwashing thing to form a sense of brotherhood. So while the leaders of each order might think the Pact is a good idea, they have to feign displeasure so as to keep their respective “troops” in line. And the Pact needs leader that is completely neutral, once again so as not to make waves, so they pick Trahearne.

And why Trahearne? Why the entire set-up? Well the most surface-level reason is that Trahearne is a neutral party. While some say he’s respected among the Sylvari, I think its more his rank that’s respected (First Born), as Caithe seemed a bit put-off by him. So he’s a nobody that the player & the three orders trust…but he’s not a leader. Not in the slightest. And the player & the three orders know this.

• So he’s advised almost at all times and “his” plans never fail. This is important because if he falters, people lose hope. It might even cause a mutiny.
• He openly states that he’s a scholar. This is also important because his desire to avoid battle never puts him in harms way and, once again, reduces the chances for him to falter.
• He’s Sylvari. While the other 4 races have seen corruption take their friends and family on every front, the Sylvari are immune.

There’s a war going on against a monstrous foe. A foe that has corrupted or destroyed homes, civilizations, and even “gods”. The entire situation is dire. Trahearne steps in as an infallible figure head, political puppet, and artificial god. The leaders of each order show trust and respect, and this trickles down the ranks. As cliche as it is, no, he isn’t the hero everyone wants. He isn’t even a hero. He’s simply the person that was needed. And in that, I like Trahearne. He gets a grasp on his pathetic role and plays his part.

Caithe is put off by him? I don’t remember this at all. In fact, as a Sylvari I remember some warm conversations between the two of them. They see each other as almost siblings because of their shared burden of Orr (the corruption or the dragon).

Also the dr agons have corrupted and destroyed homes and civilizations (I’ll give you that), but they haven’t destroyed “gods”. I assume you are talking about the spirits of the wild, specifically Owl, but no one ever claims that the spirits of the wild are gods or god-like beings. The norn see them as spirits to be valued, the humans believe them to be a step below their gods, and the norn look at the human gods and kind of step the gods down to the level of the spirits.

Why do i hate Trahearne? He is boring. I have just done the “A light in the darkness” quest, and his speech was… boring. Definetely.

His voice is plain, what he says is predictable… and he’ll start each fight saying “This will not end well”

I’m quickly getting real tired of your crap, Trahearne.XD

Trahearne’s character unfortunately has to explain everything that happens in the story. This is a sign of poor writing since the plot should unfold through events.

For example, when you meet him at claw island he just happens to be there and he has to tell you who he is when you’re really not interested. If instead there had been a story chapter before claw island where you go to him because you need a scholar of Orr, and you persuade him to come to claw island, and he does proper scholarly things at claw island instead of tagging along as muscle, then Trahearne is properly introduced. His transformation into a general then becomes more interesting.

Stooperdale.3560:

Trahearne’s character unfortunately has to explain everything that happens in the story. This is a sign of poor writing since the plot should unfold through events.

For example, when you meet him at claw island he just happens to be there and he has to tell you who he is when you’re really not interested. If instead there had been a story chapter before claw island where you go to him because you need a scholar of Orr, and you persuade him to come to claw island, and he does proper scholarly things at claw island instead of tagging along as muscle, then Trahearne is properly introduced. His transformation into a general then becomes more interesting.

He shows up in the Sylvari storyline before the player joins an Order.

This is kind of a standard issue – NPCs from other racial storylines seeming to flow in and out and leave you going “who was THAT and why should I care?” . . .

It’s not that it’s badly written per se, it’s that it’s badly handled. It’s portioned out and sectioned off to inspire people to play alts, but there are plenty who people just will never get to know until they show up in the last half of the storyline.

I think most of Trahearne’s problems lie in the execution not necessarily the goals the devs probably had in mind for the character. There were just a lot of little things which probably could have been done better to, if not endear him to the player, then at least to antagonize them less.

For example, in the haste and urgency of Claw Island where most people will meet him first, why does he give me a lengthy history monologue? It doesn’t fit the mood and thus irritates the player. All the same information could have been relayed through dialog more respectful of the urgency we’re feeling, being implied by the characters rather than monologued out. Imagine if you were allowed to have your only first impression of Trahearne be as "that guy who also thought I was right about the attack, but no one would listen to us."

Then, what if he actually tended to his own business after Claw Island when your mentor is killed and you were allowed to deal with the emotional fallout of that on your own for a mission or two instead of having this silly monologue-guy being suddenly clingy.

Then, a mission or two later when you return to Claw Island, he could have shown up and revealed the other side of himself: that of the tactically minded strategist. You would remember him as "that guy who stood up for me" and now he’s putting together a plan to fix it? That right there would have been getting off on the right foot with the character.

Would it make up for the dry dialog and wooden voice acting? Maybe not, but I think it could have gone a long way towards making more people dislike him less.

I’m honestly baffled by some of the storytelling decisions that were made by the devs. They clearly understand some aspects of storytelling, because their world and lore and history is absolutely stunning... but some aspects of the personal story really do fall flat.

(for the record, I’m less vehement toward him than average on account of my first 2 characters through story being sylvari)

“THIS WON’T END WELL” This is annoying xD I don’t hate him,but this is annoying. Everytime! And everytime we win, but no for Trahearne this won’t end well.

Story mode quests in a nutshell:

>Falls on his butt, calling for help.
Riltmos: “I need help over here, Trahearne!”
Trahearne: “One moment! I just need to kill this mob.”
>3 damage, 3 damage, 2 damage, 3 damage…
Riltmos: “ kitten it Trahearne!”
>Riltmos passes out.
_

>Trahearn gets a legendary sword.
Riltmos: “Finally! You can be useful in batt-”
>1 damage, 1 damage, 0 damage…
Riltmos: “…”
_

Trahearn: “I did a great job during that mission.”
Riltmos: “You? You were dead weight at best, I did all the work while you were using a melee weapon as a ranged weapon, barely hurting the fly flying around the undead!”
Everyone else: “Yay! Trahearne did it! He is the greatest person ever! Who is that charr next to you?”
Riltmos: “…”
______

Trahearne: “Riltmos! I have no idea what to do! Should we destroy the one of the boats carrying the undead, or should we destroy them at the source?”
Riltmos: “What kind of stupid, idiotic question is that? We should obviously kill them at the source, this shouldn’t even be a question.”
>Trahearne turns to the pact group and shouts out; “Alright, I have decided that we are going to stop the undead at the source, it was all my idea!”
>Everyone cheers.
Riltmos: “Why are you leader again and not me?”

So he is basically Kormir reincarnated as a salad.

Esorono.1039:

Trahearn: “I did a great job during that mission.”
Riltmos: “You? You were dead weight at best, I did all the work while you were using a melee weapon as a ranged weapon, barely hurting the fly flying around the undead!”
Everyone else: “Yay! Trahearne did it! He is the greatest person ever! Who is that charr next to you?”
Riltmos: “…”
______

Trahearne: “Riltmos! I have no idea what to do! Should we destroy the one of the boats carrying the undead, or should we destroy them at the source?”
Riltmos: “What kind of stupid, idiotic question is that? We should obviously kill them at the source, this shouldn’t even be a question.”
>Trahearne turns to the pact group and shouts out; “Alright, I have decided that we are going to stop the undead at the source, it was all my idea!”
>Everyone cheers.
Riltmos: “Why are you leader again and not me?”

So he is basically Kormir reincarnated as a salad.

Now if these actually happened, that’d be a valid complaint

So basically he is worse then Kormir.. great I have something to look forward to…

I don’t particularly like him but I don’t really hate him. He has yet to tell me how unwise it would be to face an army of charr directly only too immediately yell “For Ascalon!!” and runs straight into the middle of said charr army getting himself killed and failing the mission so he miles ahead of Prince Rurik at least. People complain about Trahearne dying a lot but he didn’t with me. He was actually fairly useful as a distraction. Although “this won’t end well” got annoying. Thanks for the vote of confidence mate!

He pops out of nowhere if you aren’t a Syl and his opening on claw island which I think was suppose to establish that he could be a leader and knows what he is doing kind of just made everyone else seem stupid instead but maybe that’s just me. Despite his knowledge or Orr it seems like someone with military and leading experience would be better to lead and army than him. Then again I guess he really just needs to be neutral to stop the orders from kittening and know how to listen and weigh up options that specialists give him. He seems kinda “sueish” I guess, you just have to accept that he has connections with everyone.
Some don’t like him because he steals their thunder and story revolves around him during the second half (though the end is around DE). I personally don’t care about that. I think its better story wise to have it that way rather than to try and revolve it around a player character and you are still the big hero. I didn’t hate Kormir either who got the same complaint.

I think they need to give him a love intrest for the next expansion and than kill it off after they finally get together by a dragon.

Like most Sylvari, he’s too perfect and excels at everything. I prefer Seiren over Trahearne any day…especially since she had to make room to fit him in.

SPOILERS AHEAD —-

GW2 made a good work with each order’s companion: I personally liked Order of Whispers’ Tybalt the most. And when they are killed, and suddently replaced by a plant, while you still are mourninng them, is natural that we hate the replacement.

I’ve been thinking over my dislike of him a lot recently, and then I played through the Forging of the Pact/Claw Island storyline just recently (last time being before Halloween). I understand that a lot of things are sudden, but in all honesty they develop him a lot more than I remembered in the past.

well i really like him, he seems so nice and devoted, i also like how he seems to get closer and closer with our character;
I don’t see how can anyone hate him

Because he isn’t a memorable character that has very little character development, mediocre backstory,and contrary to what everyone says there is no reason lore wise for him to take a dominating role. The reason for the later can be summed up in two words Darth Revan. You can play however you like but ultimately there is a canon ending. For this they could just say with the help of Trahearne and Destiny’s edge the <Insert race> Hero <Insert name> defeated Zaihtan. And just let the lore people decide who it was. Maybe a Largos name Gil ga Mesh.

The reason I dislike him is because he just kind of hijacks the story line quests. While up until the Orders part you are the main character who is pushing the story and guiding it a long. But then Trehaerne shows up out of no where and just takes over. I think that had he been introduced better and earlier it would not have been as bad.

One way I could imagine the story going would be like that during your racial story line you get introduced to some sort of character that would be like Trehaerne later on. You would complete the racial part of the story and then the character would become more important but gradually. He/she be trying to get the racial factions together while you get the Orders together.

exelion.2369:

The reason I dislike him is because he just kind of hijacks the story line quests. While up until the Orders part you are the main character who is pushing the story and guiding it a long. But then Trehaerne shows up out of no where and just takes over. I think that had he been introduced better and earlier it would not have been as bad.

One way I could imagine the story going would be like that during your racial story line you get introduced to some sort of character that would be like Trehaerne later on. You would complete the racial part of the story and then the character would become more important but gradually. He/she be trying to get the racial factions together while you get the Orders together.

Err… Destiny’s Edge??

Ludovicus.7980:

exelion.2369:

The reason I dislike him is because he just kind of hijacks the story line quests. While up until the Orders part you are the main character who is pushing the story and guiding it a long. But then Trehaerne shows up out of no where and just takes over. I think that had he been introduced better and earlier it would not have been as bad.

One way I could imagine the story going would be like that during your racial story line you get introduced to some sort of character that would be like Trehaerne later on. You would complete the racial part of the story and then the character would become more important but gradually. He/she be trying to get the racial factions together while you get the Orders together.

Err… Destiny’s Edge??

Basically, although there could be a bit less drama amongst them. ANet tried to build them up but didn’t quite get it.

Simple answer to ur question. T’ man or Trahearne just stood there while the risen comes and beaten me to death!
I personally want to steal that giant sword of his and stab him to death. I hate him beyond anything else. He let me down so many times.

Hate is a strong word. I used to dislike that Trehearne character but after finishing my personal story on my mesmer, I finally realized why people disliked him and I felt sort of “meh” about the word “personal” in Personal Story.

He did take credit for some of the player character’s work and talks in a weird monotone voice, but what frustrated me the most was that this “personal story” Guild Wars 2 came with was not about my character, but of Trehearne and his Wyld Hunt. He completed his Wyld Hunt and everyone was nice and happy, Destiny’s Edge made up and had a little slumber party while the player character got to fire a cannon at Zhaitan, you know, spamming #2 and killing weak risen monsters and champion dragons and all that crazy nonsense. In fact the story makes more sense if you played on a Sylvari character. That way Trehearne doesn’t look like some random kitten character forced into your story at Claw Island.

He felt rushed, random, and the story was about him. The player character didn’t overcome any personal obstacles on his/her way to Orr, just “HEY MEET ME HERE SO WE CAN TALK AT FORT TRINITY LOL.” Back in Guild Wars Prophecies we had to do so much kitten just to SEE Mursaat, venture to inhabitable lands and finding out we were being played by the Vizier who blew up Orr, help out the Deldrimor dwarves during their civil war, fight the White Mantle, aid the Shining Blade, travel with Ascalonian refugees to Krytan with an exiled prince, etc.. what about Guild Wars 2? Do a couple of chores with an order NPC who will die in 20 minutes.. AND HERE COMES THE MAIN CHARACTER TREHEARNE!

Ontop of this Trehearne was friends with our order mentor, aided a female Largos, and earned a respectable reputation among all three orders and who knows what else. Are you kidding me? We should have just played as Trehearne, kitten. I wouldn’t be surprised if ArenaNet made Emperor Usoku and Trehearne BEST FRIENDS for the Canthan expansion, or best friends with Palawa Joko, lol.

Nevermind, I hate that treeman so much.

“Because he’s the hero Guild Wars 2 deserves, but not the one it needs right now.”

Trahearne was absolutely necessary, the writers hit the spot in that regard.

The actual execution was flawed. No arc, no fall or rise, no memorable moment and wooden voice acting. Previous mentors occasionally had the grace to perform an ultimate sacrifice, earning them a little noble cred.

Though, even if these things had been fixed and if the devs had the time/resources to polish him up (there’s only so much of it), some people insist on being the grandmaster gloryhound general to the end anyway, there’s no way around that. I like the freedom Trehearne allows us to keep personally.

Also (spoilers i guess lol): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxmkAoLC6_4

I think the way to go with him is still have him lead the Pact, be there as a presence, but don’t have him be the one on the stage all the time.

However, I also see the need for a character to be on the stage beyond the player character, and for this reason I am going to predict that against each Dragon and their corruption we’ll have a different figure to focus on. Maybe of one of the main races, but perhaps not.

For example, Ogden for Primordus.

The main reason is that nothing really happens with him. He is very mary sue-ish in that he becomes leader and then everything goes perfectly (well, mostly perfectly). It seemed like the game ended once we completed his wyld hunt, killing Zhaitan just seemed like the epilogue to me. Basically once we finished our Order storyline it felt like we transitioned from our personal story, to being in Trahearne’s personal story.

General Caesar is just too unbelievable as a general. He’d be a lot more fitting as a Priory scholar that advises you.

That and his uppity English accent just makes me want to mulch him up and use him for my tomato plants…

I’d have to agree with majority on the subject that Trahearne was made an iconic character too fast and was hard to connect with. Depending on how you chose your personal story, you have to work your way into being a respected ally to the races whereas Trahearne was put in that position initially. If it had to be a sylvari, I would had preferred someone with more historical relevance, such as Caithe or even Dougal Keene from the first GW2 book.

I beat the game mostly ignoring his presence because I never connected with the NPC. If he would had saved the player in a crucial point on the storyline maybe it would had been different.

If you played GW1 you can remember how the storyline would have drastic turns and twists. It was exciting (if you are into lore) not to know what was going to happen.

I will be honest, the way they played Trahearnes story and the end story in general, I knew what was going to happen when it was going to happen. Just kinda generic.

Complaints about the focus on Trahearne amuse me. He’s not the hero, you are. He’s just a public face. It’s you that’s making the decisions, you that’s achieving victory after victory. What does Trahearne do? He talks and performs a few rituals. He’s nothing more than a scholar. I like to think my character used him to try to divert assassination attempts from me, get the other orders to do what i say and if things go sour to take the blame while i walk away laughing to myself.

While others point out his arrogance his deadpan personality and his voice acting. there are things to consider. He takes credit for the acts of his subordinates, not because he wants it (as is noted by his absence from the party) but because people give it to him as the leader of the army. As a leader you have to maintain a level head and a certain distance from those under you else you find yourself making a whole new array of mistakes. Those traits of his I can forgive but there are 2 that I cannot

I dislike Trahearne based solely on the two points below .(SPOILERS BELOW)

1. During the battle of Claw Island he Stood in the back barking orders to an already over burdened attack force. It was his leadership decisions that lead to the death of my close friend from my personal order. A death which I took quite hard and yet he remained unflinchingly unphased. Without any remorse or even I’m sorry your friend died he ran off to leave me to deal with stuff and try to play catch up later. No leader no matter how detached or professional should ever walk away from such loses without taking a moment to reflect and consider how to insure their forces never again face such loses. Trahearne took the victory as simply that and payed no attention to the losses suffered and never showed any signs of learning from the outcome of the battle instead continued to use the same logic of if we press hard enough and toss enough body’s at it we can win.

2. (This I am told has since been patched.) In my personal story I came across Carys and helped her to rescue Tegwen and then assisted with retrieving a mirror from some scritt. A mirror which promptly sucked Tegwen in and trapped her in Orr. At this point I was faced with a decision seek Trahearne’s help since he knows of Orr, Or seek the aid of an Asuran since they know of portals. I weighed my options and came to the conclusion that even if I knew absolutly everything about what was on the other side of that mirror it would do me no good if I could not get it to open in the first place. So I chose the Asuran, and Carys and I saved Tegwen. Now jump ahead towards the end of the story and that kitten mirror shows back up and Trahearne has the balls to introduce me to Carys and Tegwen AND take the credit for saving Tegwen. This is not like a commander taking credit for the job his soldiers did or a manager taking credit for the work his employees did. This is straight up bold face lieing. To make a harry potter reference, He pulled a Gilderoy Lockhart on two people who I had befriended and became close friends with. He erased every trace of that friendship from them so I am left even more alone in this world.

^
Trahearne was not the leader of anything during Battle of Claw Island, and had nothing to do with the order mentors’ deaths. He was at Claw Island to warn everyone about the incoming attack. It ends badly because Commander Talon doesn’t believe him or you, and underestimates the threat. Your order mentor chooses to stay behind to help everyone else escape. In the followup quest, Trahearne acknowledges their courage and accompanies you because they were also his friends, and he wants to help avenge them. The only time Trahearne stands back and barks out orders is a couple quests later, during Retribution (taking Claw Island back from the risen), and even then he’s just warning you about Blightgast’s attacks.

Also, Carys is the one who says she helped Trahearne rescue Tegwen. Trahearne doesn’t take credit for anything that happened with the mirror.

Yeah, Darkorical… Trahearne made no strategic decisions in the Battle of Claw Island. Much of what we did was going around doing Talon’s orders until he died. He was only there to warn them of the risen attack, but this was long before he even thought of being a leader of anything. He just knew an attack was coming and rushed to warn them. The whole thing was botched because they had an arrogant leader, but the leader was Talon not Trahearne. I also specifically remember him saying quite a few nice things about the lost mentor. As for the Mirror, I do not know anything, I did the White Stag storyline.

Personally, there are a few things I dislike about Trahearne. Him being the figurehead, the head honcho, the general to which you are but a sidekick… is not one of them. I actually like that setup, story-wise I keep getting sick of MMOs that set you up as “now you’re the best guy in the entire universe. Just like that guy. And that guy. And that girl. But not that fellow, because he’s not gotten there yet. But he will. Oh, isn’t it swell?” Sure, it can be argued that the same still occurs since everyone ends up being Trahearne’s second-in-command, but I still see it as a refreshing change.

What does rustle my jimmies, however, are points that have already been made in the thread, and number three. Presentation, development, voice.

Let’s start with the voice, since that’s the easiest to summarize. Trahearne is an incredibly monotone character to listen to, and you have to listen to him a lot. I don’t know whether to blame the script writer or the voice actor for it, but his voice is just so horribly bland that when he talks about, say, the deaths of people you have been working with closely, he might as well have been talking about his latest essay on Orrian tree rot, or the peculiar taste of swamp water. There is little to no emotion in what he says, and that ticks me off the most.

Presentation, then. Assume the player character is not a sylvari, which statistically should have about an 80% chance of being correct. The first time you encounter him, he’s barely introduced as anything but a scholar who knows stuff about Orr. The second time, he becomes your boss. This is on top of the PC just having been severed from another character who was a partner, not a boss. Depending on the player and the faction chosen, you might’ve even had some form of emotional attachment to the character in question (RIP, Mister Tibbles – next apple’s on me). Now, enter Blandvoice Scholarboss and let hilarity ensue… no? No.

Finally, development. Or more accurately the lack of one. Over the course of the faction storyline, you get to see and learn new things regarding your “mentor”, whether that be the childish curiosity of Seiran, the humor and dedication of Tybalt, or the reluctant admiration and friendship of Forgal, the three characters develop from what they seemed when you first met them. Trahearne, on the other hand, does not develop. You do not learn anything new about him, despite interacting more with him than with the previous three combined. He doesn’t reveal any flaws, his abhorrently bland voice doesn’t confer any new emotions, and he seems perpetually stuck in a character limbo where nothing happens. From the moment you meet him his character is as good as it’s going to get, and whether you’re satisfied with that character or not, it doesn’t change the fact that it doesn’t develop from there.

Those are my three reasons to dislike the character. If I were to rewrite the character, this is what I’d do:

• Revoice him from the ground up, make sure he can convey fear, friendship, trust, authority, all the necessary range of emotions for a character that’s meant to be your friend, superior, and advisor all in one.
• Introduce him earlier in the storyline, maybe have him visit or briefly partake in a mission for one of the orders. Make him get to know the PC as well as the PC’s partner. Make him mourn partner’s death.
• Give the character flaws, and let the PC be aware of them and help alleviate them temporarily. “I may not be good enough” is NOT SUFFICIENT. One suggestion is to make Trahearne afraid of personally engaging in open combat.

I’m sure that with time, I, and certainly the rest of the community as well, could establish a full list of what we’d like Trahearne to be and how we’d like to see him become that – but alas, hindsight is a beautiful and often pointless thing. At best we might be able to make our voice heard and prevent ANet from making the same mistake, but I fear Trahearne will always remain… mister Blandvoice Scholarboss.

Darkorical.9213:

While others point out his arrogance his deadpan personality and his voice acting. there are things to consider. He takes credit for the acts of his subordinates, not because he wants it (as is noted by his absence from the party)

. . . sorry, what? When did he take (sole, “I did this”) credit at all?

Jenosavel.1756:

I think Trahearne was just executed poorly. In theory there’s nothing wrong with the role he has to play. If, for example, it was Tybalt that was stealing the show from you in the final arc of the story, I doubt many people would be complaining.

But bland lines combined with wooden voice acting and an abrupt/forced introduction? That does not make for an emotional connection with the player.

So even if the lore and explanations behind Trahearne’s character, motivations, and eventual undertakings all make logical sense, that still is not enough for a good story.

I agree with everything you said. His script was very poorly written. His lines were either flat or over-the-top. A lot of his script was also speech making. Bad speech making. The one that had me actually telling a computer generated character to shut-up was the one after retaking Claw (or Klor) Island. It went on and on and was so syrupy and d-level sci-fi writing that I laughed after my first toon and got annoyed after the second.

Trahearne: We did it. We recaptured Claw Island-and in so doing, saved Lion’s Arch as well.
Trahearne: I don’t know what lies ahead of us, my friend, but for the first time-I have hope.
Trahearne: Hope that this alliance can save Tyria from the dragons. Hope for the future.
Trahearne: Hope…for Orr.

I don’t hate Trahearne, I just think he was executed poorly.

I agree with the “haters” in this thread. I think a character like Trahearne is necessary for the story. Obviously, the player can’t become the leader of the Pact and make all the decisions. You need a background head-guy to hand out missions and sign paperwork.

However, as has been said before, I think the execution was really badly done. He shows up practically out of nowhere, and at level 50 the personal story goes from you being a cool hero that everyone looks up to, to you being the sidekick of the cool hero that everyone looks up to. It’s kinda backwards.

It doesn’t help that Trahearne gets credit for everything you do. He spends, like, every mission on his back, dying, and once you’ve done everything he gets lauded for being awesome. sigh

In the end, I just think the last part of the “personal” story was badly written.

I dont hate him, however, he does come off as a goody first born leaf Jesus, fresh off the Ashram but everyone knows who he is and are, “so glad to see him”. He has an uber sick sword that I could really use, seeing as he isnt really doing any fighting and when he does fight his damage is horrible. For the record, every time he says, “Commander, to me!”, I want to smack the poop out of him, err…sap out of him? One thing I am curious about though, could a Sylvari be used as a crafting material and if so, I wonder what the Mystic Forge would produce with that? ;p

I love him and I really love he takes protagonism, for various reasons:

1.- I’m kittening tired of saving the world, seriously, it’s like video game writers lost all godkitten creativity! Written fantasy suffers the same thing. It’s infantile wish fullfillment, probably something enjoyed by those who use abyss and red dyes x). It’s bad enough we are forcefully dragged into save the world crusade number 99999, at least we don’t get to become gods or ascend or grow wings and whatnot.

The first half of the first Witcher game is good example of a good and mature story.

2.- It doesn’t make sense in canon that you get to be leader of anything.