Guild Wars 2

This is a simple suggestion but would be complicated to implement.

Since the Living Story features (generally) likeable characters, why not add player-NPC romances to the game?

It doesn’t have to be as extensive or adult as Dragon Age Origins, but having the option to flirt with certain characters would add greater character depth; something that is fairly lacking in both the Personal Story and the Living World.

Flirting? Maybe.

Romances? Probably not.

It couldn’t fit into the story with all the players, as there would be no way to explain that storyline/canon-wise. Braham couldn’t get Ottilia’s attention, but now he’s in a happy relationship with several thousand players? It just wouldn’t work in an MMO setting with important story characters.

Erukk.1408:

Flirting? Maybe.

Romances? Probably not.

It couldn’t fit into the story with all the players, as there would be no way to explain that storyline/canon-wise. Braham couldn’t get Ottilia’s attention, but now he’s in a happy relationship with several thousand players? It just wouldn’t work in an MMO setting with important story characters.

Zhaitain was killed by thousands of players. Big Nose Ted blew the orphanage up thousands of times. The White Stag has been captured by the Nightmare Court thousands of times. There have been thousands of seconds-in-command for the Pact. And there have been thousands of Infinity Balls invented by asuran players. But romances is where you have a problem?

That’s a pretty weak excuse to avoid them (or anything else). That excuse has also been given to justify Trahearne, not the players, being made the hero of the story. Other MMOs have managed to make the players both central characters and heroes of their stories, so I see no reason why ArenaNet couldn’t have done the same.

For this to work, they will need to have a random NPC generator. These random NPCs will random appear in the world with random events. And the players’ character may or may not fall in love with these characters. Some may become friends.

Other than random names and random skins, they may also need random stats and skills. Perhaps some will use monster only skills. It should be so random that the players won’t know how powerful that NPC is until it is fully levelled to 80.

Some NPCs will be all look, weak fighting ability.

Can’t have 100,000 players all falling in love with Tony Smith, for example.

one problem there, bioware is known to make games that gives you control over a conversation, GW2 has absolutely nothing like that.
so unless Anet makes the conversations like you see in SWToR, it’s not gonna happen in a proper way.

You could just RP the flirting. Our guild has someone that routinely chats up Citizen (blonde human NPC) at Lion’s Shadow.

Or even RP it with other players. I have many alts that are enjoying time with many guildie alts, and my main guy is an incorrigible ladies’ man.

(No, I don’t ERP. I leave that part for fade to black. Doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist in my characters’ lives, though, just because I choose to draw the curtain on it).

There are people who enjoy well-told, nuanced, and sophisticated storylines in their games. Romance is a valid theme for this kind of story.

I mean…GW2’s storylines feature plenty of violence. Does that mean this game is only suited to the needs of angry, violent people who just want to kill stuff?

darkace.8925:

Zhaitain was killed by thousands of players. Big Nose Ted blew the orphanage up thousands of times. The White Stag has been captured by the Nightmare Court thousands of times. There have been thousands of seconds-in-command for the Pact. And there have been thousands of Infinity Balls invented by asuran players. But romances is where you have a problem?

All those events happened in the Personal Story. Personal being the keyword, as canon wise, those actions only happened once, and it was towards or by the player. One player’s PS does not effect or ever conflict with another person’s PS because they are separate entities.

If they ever decide to add light flirtation, suitable to the T game rating, to the future PS, I would be fine with that. As it would be in the Personal Story. The Living Story is more open world though, as it solely focuses on the changing events of Tyria and not the player’s actions. Sure, the player may take part in it, but he or she isn’t needed to progress it. That’s why the LS wouldn’t be a suitable place for any relationship content.

Erukk.1408:

darkace.8925:

Zhaitain was killed by thousands of players. Big Nose Ted blew the orphanage up thousands of times. The White Stag has been captured by the Nightmare Court thousands of times. There have been thousands of seconds-in-command for the Pact. And there have been thousands of Infinity Balls invented by asuran players. But romances is where you have a problem?

All those events happened in the Personal Story. Personal being the keyword, as canon wise, those actions only happened once, and it was towards or by the player. One player’s PS does not effect or ever conflict with another person’s PS because they are separate entities.

If they ever decide to add light flirtation, suitable to the T game rating, to the future PS, I would be fine with that. As it would be in the Personal Story. The Living Story is more open world though, as it solely focuses on the changing events of Tyria and not the player’s actions. Sure, the player may take part in it, but he or she isn’t needed to progress it. That’s why the LS wouldn’t be a suitable place for any relationship content.

I’m not sure where you get that idea. The living story is effectively an extension of the personal story, the only difference is the method of delivery. Just because ArenaNet continues the story every two weeks doesn’t mean the intention from a story perspective is that each individual player is inconsequential. The story progresses under the assumption that the player participated and was instrumental in it. Marjory did just send us a letter telling us they couldn’t have put Scarlet’s motives together without us, after all. Besides, there’ve been plenty of living world releases with personal story-style instances. Just look at the instance in Lion’s Arch from Origins of Madness.

If ArenaNet were to implement the ability for our characters to become more intimate with other characters in the story, how would it have any negative impact on the way other players experience the living story? One player might pursue Lord Faren, another might pursue Countess Anise. The living story itself would be the same, but perhaps there would be differences in dialogue and certain story instances for these two players. I don’t see how it’s unsuitable, and ArenaNet has even expressed a desire in the past to allow for more choices on a personal level that give different players different experiences throughout the living story.

“Bioware-style romances” are usually love story sub-plots, not just pointless bang-a-thons. I don’t see the problem with the concept in general. It’s part of the natural progression of a romantic relationship, right?

I find it odd that nobody minds endless violence in their video games, but suggest a story about people loving each other and OMG, meltdown.

I’ve no problem with anyone saying they don’t want romantic story content. In fact, I’m not sure it could be properly implemented in a game structured like GW2. Also, I think it would take up a lot of resources that might better be spent somewhere else.

But see, I can just say that instead of insulting the OP just for bringing up the subject.

ETA: I of course did not mean you were being insulting, lordkrall. I was referring to the person I was originally responding to.

Cliff.8679:

I’m not sure where you get that idea. The living story is effectively an extension of the personal story, the only difference is the method of delivery. Just because ArenaNet continues the story every two weeks doesn’t mean the intention from a story perspective is that each individual player is inconsequential. The story progresses under the assumption that the player participated and was instrumental in it. Marjory did just send us a letter telling us they couldn’t have put Scarlet’s motives together without us, after all. Besides, there’ve been plenty of living world releases with personal story-style instances. Just look at the instance in Lion’s Arch from Origins of Madness.

I would argue that while it has certain personal aspects to it, the living story isn’t personal though. It’s about Tyria, not the player in the end. The LS doesn’t stop for the player, or wait for him or her to catch up before advancing. It goes on with or without him.

The devs have been doing a better job with integrating the player into the LS, and making it feel more personal to them, but that only for the people doing it. What about the people that have taken a break from the game? How it is “personal” to them? They have no idea what is going on, since the storyline has moved on without them, and they can feel totally lost at times.

That’s because the story isn’t about them, it’s about Tyria and the events that are happening in it. The player may play a role in said events, and they may even play a large role in them, but they aren’t necessary for the LS to progress. And if the game automatically assumes the player did events and actions they might have missed? Well… that’s about the biggest definition of an UNpersonal Story there is, since we wouldn’t even be needed for it anymore.

Cliff.8679:

Erukk.1408:

darkace.8925:

Zhaitain was killed by thousands of players. Big Nose Ted blew the orphanage up thousands of times. The White Stag has been captured by the Nightmare Court thousands of times. There have been thousands of seconds-in-command for the Pact. And there have been thousands of Infinity Balls invented by asuran players. But romances is where you have a problem?

All those events happened in the Personal Story. Personal being the keyword, as canon wise, those actions only happened once, and it was towards or by the player. One player’s PS does not effect or ever conflict with another person’s PS because they are separate entities.

If they ever decide to add light flirtation, suitable to the T game rating, to the future PS, I would be fine with that. As it would be in the Personal Story. The Living Story is more open world though, as it solely focuses on the changing events of Tyria and not the player’s actions. Sure, the player may take part in it, but he or she isn’t needed to progress it. That’s why the LS wouldn’t be a suitable place for any relationship content.

I’m not sure where you get that idea. The living story is effectively an extension of the personal story, the only difference is the method of delivery. Just because ArenaNet continues the story every two weeks doesn’t mean the intention from a story perspective is that each individual player is inconsequential. The story progresses under the assumption that the player participated and was instrumental in it. Marjory did just send us a letter telling us they couldn’t have put Scarlet’s motives together without us, after all. Besides, there’ve been plenty of living world releases with personal story-style instances. Just look at the instance in Lion’s Arch from Origins of Madness.

If ArenaNet were to implement the ability for our characters to become more intimate with other characters in the story, how would it have any negative impact on the way other players experience the living story? One player might pursue Lord Faren, another might pursue Countess Anise. The living story itself would be the same, but perhaps there would be differences in dialogue and certain story instances for these two players. I don’t see how it’s unsuitable, and ArenaNet has even expressed a desire in the past to allow for more choices on a personal level that give different players different experiences throughout the living story.

The players cannot fall in love or befriend those important NPCs. That is too story altering to be allowed.

Let’s say I married Queen Jennah.
You married Caithie.
My friend Bill married Scarlet.
My friend John also married Queen Jennah.

Imagine the chaos in the story.

If these love or friends relationship are to exist, they must be done though randomly generated, randomly named NPCs. It would be similar to those mercenaries in Diablo 2.

http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Mercenaries

It is not like GW1, where everyone befriended Mhenlo. Why? Because technically, me, you, Bill and John are all in the same team doing the same quest. So of course we all knows Mhenlo.

But which of us is Mhenlo’s lover? None. Mhenlo’s lover is Cynn, another NPC.

Hence, if you want a lover for your character, that NPC will be randomly generated.

First of all, I never said I was a proponent of romances in Guild Wars 2. I’m not. I don’t think the writers are skilled enough to handle it well. And even if they were, I don’t think it fits with the rest of the game. What I said is the “we can’t have thousands of romances with NPC X” reason for not having romances is a weak one, considering thousands of players have killed Zhaitan or watched Tybalt die.

RPGs are stories. Romances are one of the oldest and most prevalent story genres in the history of mankind. If you don’t appreciate romances as a viable form of character development, fine.

Erukk.1408:

I would argue that while it has certain personal aspects to it, the living story isn’t personal though. It’s about Tyria, not the player in the end. The LS doesn’t stop for the player, or wait for him or her to catch up before advancing. It goes on with or without him.

The devs have been doing a better job with integrating the player into the LS, and making it feel more personal to them, but that only for the people doing it. What about the people that have taken a break from the game? How it is “personal” to them? They have no idea what is going on, since the storyline has moved on without them, and they can feel totally lost at times.

That’s because the story isn’t about them, it’s about Tyria and the events that are happening in it. The player may play a role in said events, and they may even play a large role in them, but they aren’t necessary for the LS to progress. And if the game automatically assumes the player did events and actions they might have missed? Well… that’s about the biggest definition of an UNpersonal Story there is, since we wouldn’t even be needed for it anymore.

As I said before, the personal story and the living story’s main difference is method of delivery. In a way, you can look at the personal story as Season 0 of the living story. However, it shipped with the game rather than being implemented through updates, and was focused on instances rather than open world events. It still became the story of Tyria and the fight against the Elder Dragons, and like the living story, it doesn’t actually require player participation for its events to occur. As an example, even if a player never does the personal story, the Pact still gets formed and sets up a beachhead in Orr, because if you go there that’s exactly what’s going on. Someone can buy the game today, having never done the personal story, and the story dictates that Zhaitan was killed over a year ago. It may be called the “Personal Story” but it was never all that personal, especially after Claw Island.

CHIPS.6018:

The players cannot fall in love or befriend those important NPCs. That is too story altering to be allowed.

Let’s say I married Queen Jennah.
You married Caithie.
My friend Bill married Scarlet.
My friend John also married Queen Jennah.

Imagine the chaos in the story.

If these love or friends relationship are to exist, they must be done though randomly generated, randomly named NPCs. It would be similar to those mercenaries in Diablo 2.

http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Mercenaries

It is not like GW1, where everyone befriended Mhenlo. Why? Because technically, me, you, Bill and John are all in the same team doing the same quest. So of course we all knows Mhenlo.

But which of us is Mhenlo’s lover? None. Mhenlo’s lover is Cynn, another NPC.

Hence, if you want a lover for your character, that NPC will be randomly generated.

Obviously your examples are off limits from a story perspective, as those NPCs are either already involved in romance stories with other important characters of Tyria or are villains. However, there are NPCs in the story that already exist, or can exist in the future, that could easily be given potential romance paths with the player character where it wouldn’t have any adverse affect on the overarching story. The examples I gave were Countess Anise and Lord Faren. Your examples would mess with the story, certainly, but what about them? What about some of the Order representatives from the personal story, like Agent Ihan or Crusader Hiroki? There are plenty of NPCs that already exist and plenty more that could/will be added in future living story installments. I think you’re going way overboard with the idea that every single player needs randomized NPCs strictly for the purposes of romance.

there is another reason why bioware romance works while it doesn’t in GW2, you don’t have even a single companion to romance with and regular NPC’s don’t work unless it’s in your personal home instance and that’s a big stretch if any.

Would be great, but I don’t see it happen.

I love the romances in Bioware games, but I agree that it’s not really needed in GW2. You can always just head-canon your romance with your love interest NPC.

Cliff.8679:

Erukk.1408:

I would argue that while it has certain personal aspects to it, the living story isn’t personal though. It’s about Tyria, not the player in the end. The LS doesn’t stop for the player, or wait for him or her to catch up before advancing. It goes on with or without him.

The devs have been doing a better job with integrating the player into the LS, and making it feel more personal to them, but that only for the people doing it. What about the people that have taken a break from the game? How it is “personal” to them? They have no idea what is going on, since the storyline has moved on without them, and they can feel totally lost at times.

That’s because the story isn’t about them, it’s about Tyria and the events that are happening in it. The player may play a role in said events, and they may even play a large role in them, but they aren’t necessary for the LS to progress. And if the game automatically assumes the player did events and actions they might have missed? Well… that’s about the biggest definition of an UNpersonal Story there is, since we wouldn’t even be needed for it anymore.

As I said before, the personal story and the living story’s main difference is method of delivery. In a way, you can look at the personal story as Season 0 of the living story. However, it shipped with the game rather than being implemented through updates, and was focused on instances rather than open world events. It still became the story of Tyria and the fight against the Elder Dragons, and like the living story, it doesn’t actually require player participation for its events to occur. As an example, even if a player never does the personal story, the Pact still gets formed and sets up a beachhead in Orr, because if you go there that’s exactly what’s going on. Someone can buy the game today, having never done the personal story, and the story dictates that Zhaitan was killed over a year ago. It may be called the “Personal Story” but it was never all that personal, especially after Claw Island.

CHIPS.6018:

The players cannot fall in love or befriend those important NPCs. That is too story altering to be allowed.

Let’s say I married Queen Jennah.
You married Caithie.
My friend Bill married Scarlet.
My friend John also married Queen Jennah.

Imagine the chaos in the story.

If these love or friends relationship are to exist, they must be done though randomly generated, randomly named NPCs. It would be similar to those mercenaries in Diablo 2.

http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Mercenaries

It is not like GW1, where everyone befriended Mhenlo. Why? Because technically, me, you, Bill and John are all in the same team doing the same quest. So of course we all knows Mhenlo.

But which of us is Mhenlo’s lover? None. Mhenlo’s lover is Cynn, another NPC.

Hence, if you want a lover for your character, that NPC will be randomly generated.

Obviously your examples are off limits from a story perspective, as those NPCs are either already involved in romance stories with other important characters of Tyria or are villains. However, there are NPCs in the story that already exist, or can exist in the future, that could easily be given potential romance paths with the player character where it wouldn’t have any adverse affect on the overarching story. The examples I gave were Countess Anise and Lord Faren. Your examples would mess with the story, certainly, but what about them? What about some of the Order representatives from the personal story, like Agent Ihan or Crusader Hiroki? There are plenty of NPCs that already exist and plenty more that could/will be added in future living story installments. I think you’re going way overboard with the idea that every single player needs randomized NPCs strictly for the purposes of romance.

The problem is me, you, Bill and John all exist in the same universe at the same time. Remember the time the 4 of us did Twilight Arbor together? This won’t be possible unless we all exist.

So if all 4 of us fall in love with Countess Anise at the same time, this universe won’t make any sense. How can 4 adventurers, who can team up with each other in the same timeline and location, be dating the same woman at the same time?

The same thing goes for Lord Faren, Agent Ihan and Crusader Hiroki.

If there is a “one partner at a time” rule, the situation is even worst. That means an older player have an “advantage” in dating Countess Anise. A new player have no chance at Countess Anise because she is already taken.

Random NPC is the only way to go, if we want NPC romance in MMORPG.

CHIPS.6018:

The problem is me, you, Bill and John all exist in the same universe at the same time. Remember the time the 4 of us did Twilight Arbor together? This won’t be possible unless we all exist.

So if all 4 of us fall in love with Countess Anise at the same time, this universe won’t make any sense. How can 4 adventurers, who can team up with each other in the same timeline and location, be dating the same woman at the same time?

The same thing goes for Lord Faren, Agent Ihan and Crusader Hiroki.

If there is a “one partner at a time” rule, the situation is even worst. That means an older player have an “advantage” in dating Countess Anise. A new player have no chance at Countess Anise because she is already taken.

Random NPC is the only way to go, if we want NPC romance in MMORPG.

But you’re making a problem where one doesn’t exist. The story doesn’t account for other player characters. That’s why all of us are Trahearne’s right-hand man, the Commander of the Pact. For you, it’s only your character who’s the Commander. For me, it’s only mine. Hell, even having multiple characters on the same account completing the personal story doesn’t make sense by your logic. If one player were to pursue a romance with an NPC, it wouldn’t mean that character is “taken.” It would have no relevance to any other player, because from a story perspective, no other player characters exist.

For anything instanced, it could depend on the instance owner (like everything else.) For open world things, different people could have different dialogue options with the same npc (like what happens now.)

Cliff.8679:

CHIPS.6018:

The problem is me, you, Bill and John all exist in the same universe at the same time. Remember the time the 4 of us did Twilight Arbor together? This won’t be possible unless we all exist.

So if all 4 of us fall in love with Countess Anise at the same time, this universe won’t make any sense. How can 4 adventurers, who can team up with each other in the same timeline and location, be dating the same woman at the same time?

The same thing goes for Lord Faren, Agent Ihan and Crusader Hiroki.

If there is a “one partner at a time” rule, the situation is even worst. That means an older player have an “advantage” in dating Countess Anise. A new player have no chance at Countess Anise because she is already taken.

Random NPC is the only way to go, if we want NPC romance in MMORPG.

But you’re making a problem where one doesn’t exist. The story doesn’t account for other player characters. That’s why all of us are Trahearne’s right-hand man, the Commander of the Pact. For you, it’s only your character who’s the Commander. For me, it’s only mine. Hell, even having multiple characters on the same account completing the personal story doesn’t make sense by your logic. If one player were to pursue a romance with an NPC, it wouldn’t mean that character is “taken.” It would have no relevance to any other player, because from a story perspective, no other player characters exist.

I see what you mean now. Yes if romance is in personal story only it will be ok. If you treat the story as a single player game it is fine.

However I came from the GW1 background, which look at the story globally. And even in GW2, I follow the GW1 model. This is hard to explain. But let me try to explain to you.

GW1:
Vizier Khilbron: Yes, you are all Chosen.

GW2:
Trahearne: You, player 1, is my commander.

Do you see the difference now?

In GW1, a group of adventurers accomplished something. There was, in effect, no main character. My character was not more important than Mhenlo. Nor was Mhenlo more important than my character. We were part of a team that fight side by side together for years.

You might say: “But there were only 8 characters per mission. It was impossible for everyone to be there.” Actually, that was a game play balance thing. By lore, all the players, heroes, henchmens were in effect part of the same team. It was never stated who exactly was there in certain events. So this actually works great for the lore.

For example Ruins of Surima. Me, you, Bill and John might have never actually done that mission together. But by lore, we DID do it together. Why? Because that event only happened once in history, and we were all part of it.

Does this make sense?

Now in GW2, player 1 was specifically named the main character. The one and only main character. This is VERY BAD for lore. Why? Because by lore, it is physically impossible for all the players in this game to be main characters. How can we all be the one and only commander under Trahearne at exactly the same time?

The only way that I could dealt with such a huge breach in lore, unfortunately, was to refuse to believe that I am the main character. Since we cannot ALL be the main character, the only way out of this error is for NONE of us to be the main character.

Here is my version of the lore:

That final battle against Zhaitan was lead by a commander who is a NPC. That NPC does not yet have a model in the game yet. We players were indeed on that air ship for the final battle. But we were part of the crew. We were important in that victory. But we are not the main character.

Hope this makes sense. ^^

Erukk.1408:

Flirting? Maybe.

Romances? Probably not.

It couldn’t fit into the story with all the players, as there would be no way to explain that storyline/canon-wise. Braham couldn’t get Ottilia’s attention, but now he’s in a happy relationship with several thousand players? It just wouldn’t work in an MMO setting with important story characters.

The Personal Story does exactly what you say it can’t do. How many infentors of the infinity ball do you think there are? How many best friends do you think Lord Faren has? How many Snaff Savants are there? How many commanders of the Pact are there? The Personal Story is riddled with these kinds of plot threads.

As far as romances go, I’d be fine with less romance in Tyria.

Shiren.9532:

The Personal Story does exactly what you say it can’t do. How many infentors of the infinity ball do you think there are? How many best friends do you think Lord Faren has? How many Snaff Savants are there? How many commanders of the Pact are there? The Personal Story is riddled with these kinds of plot threads.

No it doesn’t. As I posted later…

All those events happened in the Personal Story. Personal being the keyword, as canon wise, those actions only happened once, and it was towards or by the player. One player’s PS does not effect or ever conflict with another person’s PS because they are separate entities.

The same applies to Bioware’s games as well. Each player is playing in their own little alternate universe, and no one player’s actions ever effect the others. That’s very easy to pull off since theirs is a single player game, but it would be much more difficult to do with MMOs. The multiplayer aspect allows for greater chances of breaking each player’s canon.

As CHIPS said, if a group of people are all romancing the same person, and they all talk to him/her at once in the open world, what does s/he do? If s/he only acknowledges one person, that will be breaking everyone else’s canon. If s/he acknowledges everyone, that wouldn’t break the player’s canon, but it would make it so that the love interest is in relationship with multiple people at once. And if s/her doesn’t acknowledge no one at all, that is a huge snub towards the player, and it wouldn’t make sense if you are in a relationship with someone.

The only way they could make it somehow work, is if they put everything in personal instances, tie it to only the PS, and have no open world interaction at all.

Erukk.1408:

The same applies to Bioware’s games as well. Each player is playing in their own little alternate universe, and no one player’s actions ever effect the others. That’s very easy to pull off since theirs is a single player game, but it would be much more difficult to do with MMOs. The multiplayer aspect allows for greater chances of breaking each player’s canon.

As CHIPS said, if a group of people are all romancing the same person, and they all talk to him/her at once in the open world, what does s/he do? If s/he only acknowledges one person, that will be breaking everyone else’s canon. If s/he acknowledges everyone, that wouldn’t break the player’s canon, but it would make it so that the love interest is in relationship with multiple people at once. And if s/her doesn’t acknowledge no one at all, that is a huge snub towards the player, and it wouldn’t make sense if you are in a relationship with someone.

The only way they could make it somehow work, is if they put everything in personal instances, tie it to only the PS, and have no open world interaction at all.

Except when one person goes up to talk to said NPC, no other players can see the conversation. The conversation is only witnessed by the player talking to the NPC. No canon is being broken, because as far as the other players are concerned from a story perspective, no one is talking to the NPC. There’s no canon to break outside of your own. The other players do not exist from a story perspective. The story is still told as if it were a singleplayer game, but the game is made to allow for hundreds of players to be playing it together.

I agree, there’d be a problem if a player goes up to an NPC, the NPC proclaims their love for the player in /say chat, and then another player comes along and the NPC says the same thing to them. But that’s not how it works.

You brought up Bioware games, so let me ask a question. Hypothetically, if there was a multiplayer mode in Mass Effect where you could do missions with other players, and it also let you bring your NPC squadmates, would that all of a sudden be breaking canon because in the other players’ games, they have their own relationships with those squadmates? Keep in mind that you would be portrayed as your Shepard to yourself, while the other players would just have helmets on as they aren’t relevant to your story. Your squadmates would never refer to them as "Shepard’ nor would they even acknowledge their existence during the mission. Meanwhile for those other players, you would be the helmeted one, they would see themselves as Shepard, and the squadmates would only acknowledge them. I would argue that this has no effect on breaking canon, and that it’s the same concept.

Like I said if you treat the whole story as a single person story, where you are the solo main character, and you refuse to acknowledge the existence of other players in your own universe, it would be fine.

This means the players you see online are all in their own separate universes. None of the players actually ever played together.

So let’s say me, you, Bill and John did a mission together in the game. You have to remember that by lore that never happened. It couldn’t happen. Else the lore won’t make sense. The players playing together is PURELY a game play mechanic.

It is perfectly fine if you read the story like this.

I read the story differently. I believe that all the players actually exist in the same universe at the same time. Because no one player can be THE main charater, NONE of us can be the main character. Because we cannot all date Anise at the SAME time, NONE of us can ever be dating Anise. In fact we cannot date any NPC unless they are randomly generated.

CHIPS.6018:

So let’s say me, you, Bill and John did a mission together in the game. You have to remember that by lore that never happened. It couldn’t happen. Else the lore won’t make sense. The players playing together is PURELY a game play mechanic.

Well that’s not entirely true. The mission did happen, the story just doesn’t take you, Bill, and John into account when I did it. Likewise, when you did it, Bill, John, and I weren’t taken into account. But yes, the players playing together is a gameplay mechanic rather than a part of the story.

CHIPS.6018:

I read the story differently. I believe that all the players actually exist in the same universe at the same time. Because no one player can be THE main charater, NONE of us can be the main character. Because we cannot all date Anise at the SAME time, NONE of us can ever be dating Anise. In fact we cannot date any NPC unless they are randomly generated.

If you read the story that way though, both the entire personal story and the living story completely fall apart. Let’s switch up your wording to another story-related development: Because we cannot all be the Commander of the Pact at the same time, none of us can be the Commander of the Pact? We already know this is untrue, because the game explicitly tells us that we’re the Commander of the Pact. We also know that there’s only one Commander of the Pact. The only way that’s possible is if the story doesn’t take other players into account. The way you’re reading it, that means everything we witness isn’t actually happening and that you don’t matter as a player. That’s definitely not what ArenaNet wants to convey.

On a sidenote, I like your Charr’s character name.

Cliff.8679:

Except when one person goes up to talk to said NPC, no other players can see the conversation. The conversation is only witnessed by the player talking to the NPC. No canon is being broken, because as far as the other players are concerned from a story perspective, no one is talking to the NPC. There’s no canon to break outside of your own. The other players do not exist from a story perspective. The story is still told as if it were a singleplayer game, but the game is made to allow for hundreds of players to be playing it together.

I agree, there’d be a problem if a player goes up to an NPC, the NPC proclaims their love for the player in /say chat, and then another player comes along and the NPC says the same thing to them. But that’s not how it works.

All npc dialogue IS canon, whether it is seen by other people or not. That is why I said anything related to the romance have to be put into instances, since that sets clear ownership of who’s story is being told at the moment. In the open world, with no player having ownership over the story, that story is open to everyone.

So if the love interest acknowledges multiple people in the open world, s/he isn’t breaking the player’s canon. It is putting in place the canon that the LI is dating multiple people. The players might not be able to see it, but they can still turn to one another and ask, “Are you getting the romance dialogue too?”

My norn ranger has her lizard pets. That’s all the companionship she needs.

Seriously, “romances” would just be pets for everyone.

Erukk.1408:

All npc dialogue IS canon, whether it is seen by other people or not. That is why I said anything related to the romance have to be put into instances, since that sets clear ownership of who’s story is being told at the moment. In the open world, with no player having ownership over the story, that story is open to everyone.

So if the love interest acknowledges multiple people in the open world, s/he isn’t breaking the player’s canon. It is putting in place the canon that the LI is dating multiple people. The players might not be able to see it, but they can still turn to one another and ask, “Are you getting the romance dialogue too?”

Alright, let me give you a specific example of why that way of thinking doesn’t work with how the story is told in GW2. Remember the task we had of hunting down heirlooms that were left behind by the refugees during Flame and Frost? When you speak to the refugees for the first time, they lament the loss of a certain item they had to leave behind when fleeing. Every player gets this dialogue, right? So let’s say I hunt down their heirloom and return it to them, and you don’t. For me, that NPC is grateful to my character for hunting it down, and in my story, they’ve gotten their item back. Now, let’s say you talk to that same NPC right after I hand over the item. You’ll still get the dialogue indicating they still need the heirloom. Why? Because what goes on in my story has no impact whatsoever with the story in yours. Our canons are completely separate. And keep in mind, this isn’t instanced. This is out in the open world. For me, that character is grateful for my help in retrieving the heirloom and the story will continue for me with him having received it and remembering that I helped him. For you, he was sadly unable to get his heirloom back. Same character, two completely different dialogues and outcomes for two different players. Neither is more valid than the other, because the story itself is unique to each player. Every player does have ownership of the story, even in the open world. What you’re not factoring in is that there is an overarching story and a personalized story of the player within that overarching story.

The exact same thing would apply to romances, no instancing required.