Guild Wars 2

I LIKE LIADRI!!!! keep it up pls)
Beat her many Times even the 8 Orb Achievement 2 Times

But i support the opinion of the colour blind ppl who cant seee that circles good enough(

Anyway the Fight is fine, there NEEDS to be challenge in a game!!!! -.- you can also watch TV or read a book or go for a walk, or whatever if you dont like challenges.

Here is a Tipp for Liadri, just be completely aware!!!!
Dont fantasies, dont talk with your immaginary you, just watch, play and learn!!!!

It took me 1-2h in a row for the 8 Orb achievement until i had a decent “feeling” of the fight and could controle her better

Did it with a glass cannon engi btw, also with a glass cannon berserk necro, but not the 8 orbs

Shpongle.6025:

You said Gauntlet will come back. When it does, you SERIOUSLY need to nerf Liadri bad.

Make her like Scarlet, now Scarlet was really cool, not too easy and not too hard.

Liadri was a disaster, been playing since August 28th 2012.
Only two achievements I don’t have, and also refuse to try and do until you make Liadri a normal difficulty like the rest of Living Story.

Boycott Liadri !

I’m afraid I must disagree, OP. I decided to give up trying to beat Liadri last night, even though I think I’ve tried less than 20 times; far less than many others have, I know. But I’m well aware of the limitations of my reflexes and response time. Really, I’m thrilled just to have gotten that far. That said, I think her difficulty is fine. I wouldn’t object to them making the floor a solid color, or taking the roof off the dome, but I don’t see any reason her mechanics should be changed. The Gauntlet was an entirely optional achievement track clearly designed for a subset of the playerbase who enjoy that sort of thing; it was even set up as a side thing, apart from the main LS achievement track. That was the right way to go, IMO.

Now, I also greatly enjoyed Scarlet’s Playhouse, but I certainly would not want every boss in the game to be as easy as Scarlet, any more than I would want every boss to be as difficult as Liadri. There are things I can do in the game , and things I can’t, and I see no problem with that.

GoldenTruth.2853:

Which parts are RNG besides the camera angle and rift spawn locations?

The patterns change depending on which pod you use, but if you stick with one yes the spawn and angle is the same. It basically penalizes you if you change pods due from lack of time. The rift spawns also change with that so if you’re bouncing from pod to pod trying to find an empty one, it can seem random. Given crowding and randomnesss of overflows etc I think this should have been factored into the design

Another thing I found earlier while trying to do it as a mesmer is that the sword-5 push back skill can be randomly bugged whether it works or not. Again.. if the fight was a little more forgiving, all the bugs and unintended issues would be annoyances but not game breaking.

The furthest I’ve gotten her down is 40% but that was due to good luck more than skill. The problem with this encounter is that it depends a lot more on luck both in phase 1 (spawn patterns of rifts favouring you killing them easily, stuff actually working i.e. hitting the kitten things, shades connecting with portals) and in phase 2 whether or not the hour glass spawns right on top of you or not. Staying closer to the middle gives you the least area to avoid but then its also luck whether or not the clones are around the middle also.

The encounter was designed for best cases, someone’s not a charr/norn, camera works and isn’t slightly delayed when picking up the orbs, skills actually not being bugged , no lag and so on. It just needs to be dialed down a bit to account for imperfect conditions, so it’s still challenging but not impossible if luck isn’t with you.

Shpongle.6025:

Make her like Scarlet, now Scarlet was really cool, not too easy and not too hard.

You lost all credibility there.

She was not “not too easy”. She was a total joke, and if you had any difficulty with her, you are bad. End of story.

This is entirely pathetic. God forbid we have entirely optional difficult content.

fathamburger.8453:

GoldenTruth.2853:

Which parts are RNG besides the camera angle and rift spawn locations?

The patterns change depending on which pod you use, but if you stick with one yes the spawn and angle is the same. It basically penalizes you if you change pods due from lack of time. The rift spawns also change with that so if you’re bouncing from pod to pod trying to find an empty one, it can seem random. Given crowding and randomnesss of overflows etc I think this should have been factored into the design

Another thing I found earlier while trying to do it as a mesmer is that the sword-5 push back skill can be randomly bugged whether it works or not. Again.. if the fight was a little more forgiving, all the bugs and unintended issues would be annoyances but not game breaking.

The furthest I’ve gotten her down is 40% but that was due to good luck more than skill. The problem with this encounter is that it depends a lot more on luck both in phase 1 (spawn patterns of rifts favouring you killing them easily, stuff actually working i.e. hitting the kitten things, shades connecting with portals) and in phase 2 whether or not the hour glass spawns right on top of you or not. Staying closer to the middle gives you the least area to avoid but then its also luck whether or not the clones are around the middle also.

The encounter was designed for best cases, someone’s not a charr/norn, camera works and isn’t slightly delayed when picking up the orbs, skills actually not being bugged , no lag and so on. It just needs to be dialed down a bit to account for imperfect conditions, so it’s still challenging but not impossible if luck isn’t with you.

The rifts are RNG yes, the AoE pattern isn’t really random even when you switch arenas. It looks random from the outside, however, the moment you enter the arena you can look where the light field is and know exactly where the AoEs will spawn for the rest of the fight.

12
34

These numbers are where the AoEs can fall

If the light field is between 3 and 4 (it is always between 2 potential AoE fields) the order will be 2,3,4,1 and repeat that same order until phase 2.

Phase 2 is 1+4, 2+3 and will repeat in that pattern. This means that in phase 2 the area where the AoE just fell is always the safe zone and where it missed it always the danger zone.

The only real luck involved is technical issues such as camera angle and possible lag. Saving an invuln or correctly dodging the AoE when you are in trouble during the transition is part of the fight. Because bombs have a shorter walk period the closer you are to the middle you need to pay attention to how large the circles you make should be.

I think it is a good fight that is very reliant on understanding how the boss works rather than luck, which, unfortunately has several technical issues (such as a few of ones you addressed). I’m not saying I think the fact that bad camera angle can screw you over is good design. I do, however, think that Liadri is well designed mechanically and relies very little on luck.

fix crappy camera issues, don’t place it in a zone that may or may not have 100 other players.

I haven’t done gauntlet but i heard fights are really annoying because you have to do them over and over to win. I refuse to waste my gaming time with something like that.

I have left that achievement after watching few people fighting her and trying myself for few times. I want to play the game for fun and challenge, not frustration over unfinished content. I won’t even enter the arena utill that horrbile camera collison, random lag and hit detection be fixed.

Denovean.2785:

Lane.3410:

I’ve beaten Liadri and I can honestly say it had absolutely nothing to do with player skill. I basically kept feeding tickets to the Ringmaster until I got lucky with 1. orb RNG and 2. being able to find safe spots in P2 because the red circles are nearly impossible to see.

Any encounter that relies on RNG and visual limitations as heavily as this one does as a means of “difficulty” is not indicative of skill whatsoever as far as I’m concerned. I wanted a real challenge and instead I got this. It was a very poorly designed fight and by far the least amount of enjoyment I’ve had in GW2.

Have you read any guides in how to deal with her fight phases? You can also turn off Post Processing to remove the ‘blind’ effect she randomly chucks at you. The aoe circles that 1 shot you follow a fixed pattern everytime you fight her. Knowing what you’re getting into is half the battle. Understanding how the red circles pattern work will give you less trouble than you would’ve had. Oh and the cosmic rifts spawn at the same places too during phase 1 :p

Turn off Post Processing? That is cheating! ..and not how the content was supposed to be played it also wasn’t meant to be watched on youtube or any other site. you were meant to figure out how to do everything all by yourself otherwise they would have told you in game.
Now I agree with those who are saying she needs to be fixed! As others have said she isn’t based on skill but luck and if you want challenge that is what the Gambit NPC is for! This is a very poorly designed fight that is designed to be unfair instead of challenging. If everyone keeps trying to disagree with those who say this needs to be fixed then you will only get more crap like this in the future. Liadri needs to be fixed as many are saying. camera sucks doesn’t even work right on the balcony before you enter. Notifying effects on the ground need to be made more obvious. Come on it is a metal grated floor..90% of the animation isn’t even there. One shot mechanics are completely lazy cop out instead of designing challenge into the event. etc.. etc.. Please fix Liadri and when you bring her back don’t take away the mini like you did with the Moa races!

Cinnamon Goddess.3869:

Denovean.2785:

Lane.3410:

I’ve beaten Liadri and I can honestly say it had absolutely nothing to do with player skill. I basically kept feeding tickets to the Ringmaster until I got lucky with 1. orb RNG and 2. being able to find safe spots in P2 because the red circles are nearly impossible to see.

Any encounter that relies on RNG and visual limitations as heavily as this one does as a means of “difficulty” is not indicative of skill whatsoever as far as I’m concerned. I wanted a real challenge and instead I got this. It was a very poorly designed fight and by far the least amount of enjoyment I’ve had in GW2.

Have you read any guides in how to deal with her fight phases? You can also turn off Post Processing to remove the ‘blind’ effect she randomly chucks at you. The aoe circles that 1 shot you follow a fixed pattern everytime you fight her. Knowing what you’re getting into is half the battle. Understanding how the red circles pattern work will give you less trouble than you would’ve had. Oh and the cosmic rifts spawn at the same places too during phase 1 :p

Turn off Post Processing? That is cheating! ..and not how the content was supposed to be played it also wasn’t meant to be watched on youtube or any other site. you were meant to figure out how to do everything all by yourself otherwise they would have told you in game.
Now I agree with those who are saying she needs to be fixed! As others have said she isn’t based on skill but luck and if you want challenge that is what the Gambit NPC is for! This is a very poorly designed fight that is designed to be unfair instead of challenging. If everyone keeps trying to disagree with those who say this needs to be fixed then you will only get more crap like this in the future. Liadri needs to be fixed as many are saying. camera sucks doesn’t even work right on the balcony before you enter. Notifying effects on the ground need to be made more obvious. Come on it is a metal grated floor..90% of the animation isn’t even there. One shot mechanics are completely lazy cop out instead of designing challenge into the event. etc.. etc.. Please fix Liadri and when you bring her back don’t take away the mini like you did with the Moa races!

There has to be some form of RNG in it or, as I’ve already stated, people could simply learn the rotations of her attacks and take her down with zero issue. This is the entire reason we had people farming Deadeye, because his attacks were predictable with very little margin of change. It was a boss you could do with muscle memory alone, requiring no skill past the initial learning how to do it phase. Without some kind of significant RNG factor (the Cosmic Rifts) Liadri would be in the exact same boat. It can be very frustrating, but killing Liadri is possible. It wasn’t intended as something just anyone can do. It’s something only those that are skilled are able to succeed in, and if you’re unable to complete it then you have to either get better or just deal with it.

Basically, when it comes to getting your precious mini.. it’s time to put up or shut up, and if you’ve got nothing to put up, shut up. Don’t whine and moan.

The Liadri fight itself was good as it was. The only bother in it was the rifts, which bring a frustrating element of randomness along.

Ditch the rifts and she’s a good scripted boss that you will defeat after enough practice.

EDIT:
Though I get your point Zanryu, I still think the rifts are not fair, especially when you have classes which do not have easy access to stability or evade.

Evans.6347:

The Liadri fight itself was good as it was. The only bother in it was the rifts, which bring a frustrating element of randomness along.

Ditch the rifts and she’s a good scripted boss that you will defeat after enough practice.

EDIT:
Though I get your point Zanryu, I still think the rifts are not fair, especially when you have classes which do not have easy access to stability or evade.

Every class has access to stunbreaks. If you pay attention and see the rift spawn be ready with it to get out and continue your fight. If not the rifts, then something else will need to be at least somewhat unpredictable.

Yes, I understand the battle is doable in it’s current state but it remains my opinion that her second phase is slightly over the top and I find the rifts the easiest barrier to remove.

Stunbreakers or not, if it pulls you just as the chaos fields drop you’re dead. The only reliable way to deal with them is stability or evade. Oh and for the heck of it I spent last night observing and supporting the players trying to get it at the nick of time and I’ve seen it happen a lot.

What is wrong with you guys ;/ It took me a lot of stress and time to beat Liadri, in no way did i find it easy. Not once did i go ‘oh i wish they would make her easier’ i only wished that i could be better.

You guys in mmo’s expect everything to be catered to you and your skill level. In a regular game someone comes across a boss that takes many many goes, so they keep doing it until they beat it. In an mmo, someone finds a tough boss, cant do it, so comes on the forum crying that it needs to be nerfed. There is nothing wrong with the Liadri fight other than she is painfully hard. Yeah it hurt like hell to lose over and over and over, the waypointing, repairing etc. Then comes the feeling when you beat her. Never have i experienced such a feeling in a game, it was an outstanding feeling of personal achievement. I was almost frozen and shaking for ages. Im an average player so to finally beat that fight was epic, and i don’t regret it.

Haven’t you ever thought that the camera angle and the hard to see aoe was an intentional thing implemented to intensify the difficulty level…this fight was unique in that it pulled toughness from all aspects possible…hard to see aoe..visions that had to be avoided 100%, strange angles that make it harder to see everything around you, random elements injected by the use of pull orbs. I think its great. Hard, awful, stressful…but great.

Anet done a fantastic job building a tough fight. Games are meant to have objects and achievements not obtainable by all. Easy things for casual players, uber hard things for the more hardcore players.

Stop whining about it, and accept that this fight needed you to step up your game or walk away.

You say that as if you believe that all the people who critique the fight haven’t been able to beat her.

Shpongle.6025:

’’prestige’’ lol you just want to feel special, is all, and better than everyone else, i get that, but i’m not like that

i work in real life

i play gw2 to relax and chill and feel a fake sense of accomplishment

Yep. Before GW2 I was playing The Secret World and I quit for two reasons: that game is seriously heavy on oneshot mechanics and everyone was absolutely obsessed with DPS. Do a dungeon, and someone will run a dps check on every boss to see how everyone is doing. Every time. No, I don’t want to practice my godforsaken rotation and improve my dps, I want to play a game.

I got to the 11th boss and just got fed up with the whole thing. Not a good feeling. I know I could have gotten through the whole thing, but the time it would take and the cost (and stress) is just not worth it. I don’t care about the mini that much, I’m missing so many of them that I’ll never notice it’s not there, but I’m noticing an intense focus on DPS in the last few events and it’s starting to get uncomfortable.

Evans.6347:

You say that as if you believe that all the people who critique the fight haven’t been able to beat her.

If this is for me.

Not at all. My message was directed more at people who have completed her and are still complaining about the camera angle and the aoe etc…that is what provoked me to say something. I don’t think any part of her or the arena needed to be changed. Only that maybe of death, repairs, waypoints…all of which have nothing to do with the fight intensity. I completely fail to see how my message implied anything of what you say.

Just as clarification, because in the discussion it really doesnt matter, I highlighted the parts where it comes across as such:

effybuttonmoon.4607:

What is wrong with you guys ;/ It took me a lot of stress and time to beat Liadri, in no way did i find it easy. Not once did i go ‘oh i wish they would make her easier’ i only wished that i could be better.

You guys in mmo’s expect everything to be catered to you and your skill level. In a regular game someone comes across a boss that takes many many goes, so they keep doing it until they beat it. In an mmo, someone finds a tough boss, cant do it, so comes on the forum crying that it needs to be nerfed. There is nothing wrong with the Liadri fight other than she is painfully hard. Yeah it hurt like hell to lose over and over and over, the waypointing, repairing etc. Then comes the feeling when you beat her. Never have i experienced such a feeling in a game, it was an outstanding feeling of personal achievement. I was almost frozen and shaking for ages. Im an average player so to finally beat that fight was epic, and i don’t regret it.

Haven’t you ever thought that the camera angle and the hard to see aoe was an intentional thing implemented to intensify the difficulty level…this fight was unique in that it pulled toughness from all aspects possible…hard to see aoe..visions that had to be avoided 100%, strange angles that make it harder to see everything around you, random elements injected by the use of pull orbs. I think its great. Hard, awful, stressful…but great.

Anet done a fantastic job building a tough fight. Games are meant to have objects and achievements not obtainable by all. Easy things for casual players, uber hard things for the more hardcore players.

Stop whining about it, and accept that this fight needed you to step up your game or walk away.

I still don’t see how that implies that i think that the only people that complain are people who failed to beat her. At the top i was pointing out a common occurrence when it comes to tough fights in mmo’s. At the end i said that this fight needed you to step up, therefore im talking to people who either stepped up and beat her or those who didn’t. Either one is fine.

I beat her after a few tries and with sub-optimal gear. It was great to have a challenge and get that rush when I finally beat her. ( Like beating Rag the first time in pre-expansion WoW)

I enjoy her mechanics the only thing I would agree on would be the camera suffering from the dome. I just started to kite in a smaller circle in the middle so there was less distance to avoid her aoe and a bit more room for the camera. I think the gauntlet was done incredibly well. She is a pain and some of the other bosses but there is enough easier bosses for everyone to get something out of it. My brother is a mouse clicker on skills and a bit slow on the reflexes but he was able to get tier 3 and feel accomplished that he got as far as he did.

Personally I have not beat Liadri, as I struggle on certain parts of the fight, but I don’t think it should be changed at all, she is challenging, the first actual challenging bit of content for a lot of players in the game.

So she has ruined your 100% all achievement streak or whatever, you will have to get over that. Other players have done it, which means it isn’t impossible. Just because you are unable to do it, doesn’t mean it should be made easier so you can.

No change to Liadri – she remains so the challenge remains. It should be a real achievement to beat her. I agree that Anet might make the AoE circles more apparent to those with vision “impairment”, but that’d be it in terms of changes to this fight.

Keep it up Anet – more challenges like this!

Denovean.2785:

Have you read any guides in how to deal with her fight phases? You can also turn off Post Processing to remove the ‘blind’ effect she randomly chucks at you. The aoe circles that 1 shot you follow a fixed pattern everytime you fight her. Knowing what you’re getting into is half the battle. Understanding how the red circles pattern work will give you less trouble than you would’ve had. Oh and the cosmic rifts spawn at the same places too during phase 1 :p

That’s interesting. I always play with Post Process effects disabled and I didn’t even know she had an additional effect I wasn’t seeing. Not that I usually lasted long enough against her to see much anyway.