Guild Wars 2

Seishiro.7468:

teh persun.6517:

I’m sorry, but did we tell you to not fight Zhaitan because your dead bodies could be fuel for its armies? How would you feel if we locked you in cages when the Pact pressed on Kralkatorrik merely because you can become branded?
You had no trouble trusting us with suicide missions in Orr, yet now we’re the ones that can be corrupted, you want us to ignore our Wyld Hunts?
If we’ve learned anything from fighting Zhaitan, it’s that each of us has strengths, but also weaknesses, and only united can we win, which your kind has a habit of forgetting, or did your plan of ‘isolation until the vines come from the shiverpeaks’ have a part were you swoop in from the flank and save the day that you forgot to mention?

The problem is not that your race can be corrupted by the dragon, alsmost every race can be corrupted in some one, be it by dying, beeing exposed to Krallkatorik or the strange worshippingtransofrmation for jormag.

The problem is that you are born as a dragonminion and only some of you managed to
stay free of your true nature until now. Now, you have already gone back to your roots and it annihalated the packt, simple said, you became corrupted by becoming normal. Would we still allow branded to fight at our side? Take the orrians back home with us? No of course we wouldn’t therefore why should we let you be an exception from these rules, now that we know you belong to the dragon?

A charr Tribune had no trouble trusting Glint if it meant taking out a dragon, despite the fact her aid could have been a trap, and she did far less to earn his trust. I also am not saying that those sylvari whom have become corrupted should have a picnic with all the pact’s important strategist and logistical officers, but rather those who’ve shown no signs of corruption shouldn’t automatically be treated as any more of a liability than any pact fauna during the assault on Orr. And yes, there are such sylvari.

teh persun.6517:

A charr Tribune had no trouble trusting Glint if it meant taking out a dragon

That was because of Glint’s reputation.

teh persun.6517:

A charr Tribune had no trouble trusting Glint if it meant taking out a dragon, despite the fact her aid could have been a trap, and she did far less to earn his trust. I also am not saying that those sylvari whom have become corrupted should have a picnic with all the pact’s important strategist and logistical officers, but rather those who’ve shown no signs of corruption shouldn’t automatically be treated as any more of a liability than any pact fauna during the assault on Orr. And yes, there are such sylvari.

Glint did a lot of things, that dragon aided the humans for hundreds of years, so it worked kind of hard to get a trustworthy reputation.

The only Sylvari I would trust nowadays is Cannach, because he appears to be kind of immun to any psychic influence(after all, he didn’t even have a dream, and that without beeing a soundless) and yes, I do belive that the dream has some form of connection to the dragon, after all, his champion appears right in the sylvari startingmission. I have no proof of this of course, but to me, Malak and Cannach are the most trustworthy Sylvari right now.

oh and btw, to the point of some sylvari that didn’t et corrupted in the first wave: how shall we know which of them did get corrupted and which didn’t? They could be knowingly serving mordremoth while acting all innocent, and I want to remember you of the damage one orrian that infiltrated the ranks of the pact as a high ranking office could do, and entire platoon of warriors got wiped out because of him.
And no sylvari would admit that he had been under mrodremoths controll, even if he came back to his sences, assuming they ever could.
A single infiltrator can do massive damage to an army, but we are talking about 20% of the former pact forces that go from the lowest soldier right to the leader of the pact, if we activly leave those in command, Mordremoth might even use non sylvari troops against us!(I don’t mean he would command them to kill us, I belive no pact soldier with half a brain would do that, but he could use them to gather magical artifacts, slaughter other enemys for him and many other things, withouth having to waist his own resources).

Everyone is corruptible.

We saw Humans and Charr becoming crystal menaces with the rise of Kralkatorrik.

We saw our fallen ones becoming minions of the fallen Zaithan.

Always have the Sylvari fight beside us. Yes they are young and many times naive, but they have great learning skills and have shown amazing fighting skills and companionship.

We have great examples like Caithe, who fought besides Glintt while Logan Thackeray abandoned his friends, or the Necromancer Killen that died with honor instead of becoming a traitor like Riona, a human.

Even the Charr fought beside us, after years of war between them and us Humans.

As long as we have a common threat, I will fight beside any race and against all foes.

Rikardo Chackan – Human Warrior

Our Mother shields us from the powers of Mordremoth with all the force she can muster. In that she is a lot like Glint, a traitorous general to her former master. Would you blindly annihilate those who’re forming up a defense against one of the greatest threats to Tyria? They say we Sylvari are a naiv folk, yet it is you who’re threatening our people with ignorance and brute force, for the simple reason that you don’t understand the nature of Sylvari and don’t care to learn.

I will tell you this. Come to us in friendship and good intention and we’ll fight by your side to ward off the oppression of Mordremoth. Come to us with blades and fire and you won’t leave the forest alive. That, my friends, is a promise.

Seishiro.7468:

This war is almost lost, even though it is just begining, all because of your kind, with the pact destroyed, the orders in chaos and most of our forces lost, while we can’t trust a fifth of the survivors.
You want to proove your innocence? Turn yourself in so that you can’t harm those around you, willingly or not.
You want to fight Zhaitan? Dig up ore in the mines and join the supplyproduction in our regulated workcamps.
Once all of this is over, you might be able to live a free life again, but for now, only a supervised sylvari in a controlled environment is a good sylvari.

Lighten up, Francis.

With an oriental-sounding account name like “Seishiro”, I wouldn’t think you’d support something like the Japanese internment camps of World War 2.

Sylvari are born immoral creatures. Case in point.

Caithe: finds out she is a dragon minion from Wynne and that the centaurs were killed needlessly. Wynne begs Caithe to kill her before Faolain comes back and tortures her. Now, Caithe could have joined forces with Wynne and either killed or captured Faolain. Does she do that? Noooo. She immediately sticks a knife in Wynne without a second thought.

Evil. All Sylvari are evil veges.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Sylvari are born immoral creatures. Case in point.

Caithe: finds out she is a dragon minion from Wynne and that the centaurs were killed needlessly. Wynne begs Caithe to kill her before Faolain comes back and tortures her. Now, Caithe could have joined forces with Wynne and either killed or captured Faolain. Does she do that? Noooo. She immediately sticks a knife in Wynne without a second thought.

Evil. All Sylvari are evil veges.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/anecdotal

Also, she totally hesitated, and only killed Wynne because she begged Caithe to.

teh persun.6517:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Sylvari are born immoral creatures. Case in point.

Caithe: finds out she is a dragon minion from Wynne and that the centaurs were killed needlessly. Wynne begs Caithe to kill her before Faolain comes back and tortures her. Now, Caithe could have joined forces with Wynne and either killed or captured Faolain. Does she do that? Noooo. She immediately sticks a knife in Wynne without a second thought.

Evil. All Sylvari are evil veges.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/anecdotal

Also, she totally hesitated, and only killed Wynne because she begged Caithe to.

Oh please. If I was forced into a situation where the choices were, kill an innocent person or join up with that person in order to fight against someone who was planning to torture her and who had killed others without provocation, people who were friendly and not carrying weapons, I don’t think I would be stabbing to death the innocent person, hesitation or no hesitation, (unless I was a coward, that fits also).

Wynne was only begging to be killed because her information was to terrible for someone like Faolain to know. Remove Faolain and she no longer has that problem. After that, get Wynn to the Pale Tree and let her decide the next step since she knows more.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

teh persun.6517:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Sylvari are born immoral creatures. Case in point.

Caithe: finds out she is a dragon minion from Wynne and that the centaurs were killed needlessly. Wynne begs Caithe to kill her before Faolain comes back and tortures her. Now, Caithe could have joined forces with Wynne and either killed or captured Faolain. Does she do that? Noooo. She immediately sticks a knife in Wynne without a second thought.

Evil. All Sylvari are evil veges.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/anecdotal

Also, she totally hesitated, and only killed Wynne because she begged Caithe to.

Oh please. If I was forced into a situation where the choices were, kill an innocent person or join up with that person in order to fight against someone who was planning to torture her and who had killed others without provocation, people who were friendly and not carrying weapons, I don’t think I would be stabbing to death the innocent person, hesitation or no hesitation, (unless I was a coward, that fits also).

Wynne was only begging to be killed because her information was to terrible for someone like Faolain to know. Remove Faolain and she no longer has that problem. After that, get Wynn to the Pale Tree and let her decide the next step since she knows more.

And then you would have to explain why Faolain and all the second born she brought went ‘missing’ to the general populace, and the reason it happened is because Wynne knew some terrible secret. That’s just begging for civil war.
And before you say that civil war happened anyway, Caithe, at the time of stabbing, would have no way of knowing how much traction the nightmare court would have in the future.
Also, remember that Caithe and Faolain are/were in love.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

All Sylvari are evil veges.

That word “All” is mighty big. You are pre-judging a whole race. Per Merriam-Webster, prejudice is defined as:

• an unfair feeling of dislike for a person or group because of race, sex, religion, etc.

• a feeling of like or dislike for someone or something especially when it is not reasonable or logical.

The definition fits. So you can understand when unfair, unreasonable, illogical feelings don’t sway fair, reasonable, logical people towards your view.

P.S.: Does nobody remember that the Asura captured/experimented on/killed etc. Sylvari when they first encountered the race? I suppose they just get a “pass” for their actions because they have cute floppy ears? There is good and bad to be found everywhere. Certainly the Sylvari’s 27+ years of doing intentional good outweighs the recent evil a few of them have done against their will, though.

Oh I am all for throwing Vorpp into the abyss, give me the choice to do that and I will do that without hesitation.

The difference between ALL those examples though remains: Sylvari are not a race, they are dragonminions. 3 of the dragons(zhaitan, jormag & krallkatorik) create their minions from creatures, and the 2 remaining dragons(primordus & Mordremoth) create their servants from the elements, in that they are kind of similar.
But the difference to all the other races is the same:
Regular race =/= born dragonminion.
On a different notw, Vorpp really needs to be brought to justice in one way or another, would have no problem leaving him in an unsupurvised room with Cannach.

Poor soul. Your definition of “justice”, which you seem to confuse with vengeance, is mind staggering. I will include you in my meditations. May you eventually find a path to clarity.

It saddens my heart to know that some of our brothers and sisters, as well as many of our cousins from other Sylvari Trees are vulnerable to the dragon’s corruption. From Scarlet we know that those corrupted didn’t succumb willingly, but got possessed by the dragon’s will. It is not like they’re fighting for the dragon of their own accord, but rather because they’re forced to. The corrupted are slaves against their own will and in that the first victims of the dragon.

Still, our Mother and the teachings of Ventari root us to this world and will prevent Mordremoth from taking control of Sylvari of the Dream as well. I will fight for the freedom of all Sylvari.

All things have a right to grow. The blossom is brother to the weed.
But those who deny others this right, lose it for themselves.

I think many are looking at this from the wrong view point. The Sylvari are OF the dragon.

They are not corrupted because they already belong to the dragon. The corruption is when they “appear” to be free of him. You are all looking it at from the wrong side.

The Sylvari were a driving force in the destruction of Zhaitan. Was it really for the good of Tyria or for the good of Mordremoth to usurp Zhaitan? Many of the Sylvari have always been of a single driven mind to kill Zhaitan. NONE have had the Wyld hunt to kill Mordremoth.

The Sylvari are not corrupt. The Sylvari are of the dragon.

So, basically you’re saying that Destiny’s Edge should have slaughtered Glint, no matter what, because she was of the dragon? Maybe we should also slaughter all Zephyrites, because they’re clearly in cahoots with Glint.

Don’t you see where this logic fails?

Sylvari may stem from Mordremoth’s sphere of influence (though we don’t have any information on where the sylvari tree seeds actually come from), but they’re sentient beings with a free will until exposed to and taken over by the power of the plant dragon. However, as pointed out many times by now, this is different for Caledon Sylvari, because they’re freed from the dragon’s influence and shielded by the Pale Tree for as long as they maintain a strong connection to the Dream of Dreams, pretty much like Glint was freed from Kralkatorrik’s will by the Forgotten. How does that fit into your theory?

I am a child of the Pale Tree. Mordremoth may have planned for us to be his minions, but the Pale Tree has protected us for 27+ years, and still fights against him. So far, she has lost only one battle. And that was after her protection had been weakened from a direct assault on her person. We most certainly have not all turned against our fellow Pact members. We are still strong and in control of ourselves.

“Divide and Conquer” is the oldest trick in the book. Mordremoth is using it against us, and you are falling for it. Stop working for our common enemy! The weakest person is the one who fights alone. You don’t have to like us personally, but you do need all the help you can get. Now put down your traitorous, shameful picket signs, pick up your weapon, and get back in the ranks with us, soldier! It’s time to fight, not bicker!

SylvariMasterRace!
Little charrs, brainless northlings, imps and puny humans, you will all get torn apart.

PS: The alliance with Mordremoth will be temporary. Once the other lesser races are out of the way we are coming for you!

Girion.5483:

So, basically you’re saying that Destiny’s Edge should have slaughtered Glint, no matter what, because she was of the dragon? Maybe we should also slaughter all Zephyrites, because they’re clearly in cahoots with Glint.

Don’t you see where this logic fails?

Sylvari may stem from Mordremoth’s sphere of influence (though we don’t have any information on where the sylvari tree seeds actually come from), but they’re sentient beings with a free will until exposed to and taken over by the power of the plant dragon. However, as pointed out many times by now, this is different for Caledon Sylvari, because they’re freed from the dragon’s influence and shielded by the Pale Tree for as long as they maintain a strong connection to the Dream of Dreams, pretty much like Glint was freed from Kralkatorrik’s will by the Forgotten. How does that fit into your theory?

Slaughter of the sylvarikind was never intended, only stricter regulation, only those that willingly submitted themself to Mordremoth like the nightmarecourt shall be killed on sight.

The difference is, as you correctly pointed out: Glint was FREED of Krallkratoriks will. Find a way to ensure the Sylvari won’t just murder all of us while we sleep, and I will gladly fight side by side with them again, but for now, there is no such way, and the closer they come to Mordremoth, the more of them will fall under his controll, therefore they have to be kept as far away from Maguuma as possible, for the greater good of all!

We are already giving the sylvari special pardon for the first betrayal, because of the circumstances, if any other
species would have done what they did, they would all have been behaded by charrlaw, it is the only way to ensure the security of the commandchain, and while there might be another solution in times of peace, we are waging war on more fronts then anyone can count, the slightest weakness might lead to every living souls downfall!

I created a Sylvari Necromancer just to serve Mordremoth.
Kill those human scums and rejoice our real master: Mordremoth!
Asuran had mistreated us, Charr and Norn had looked down on us, so why do we have to ally with those inferior races who’re weak yet prideful?

We do not need discrimination or sympathy, all we need is the dragon’s power.
Our master destroy their entire forces known as Pact with just a tiny fragment of his power, so if we Sylvaris gather together, we’ll surely take down Tyria in no time.

We’ll make Tyrians bow before us! We’ll make them fear!
All hail Mordremoth!

Naus the Gobbo.5172:

Go away, you filthy salad head. We don’t need dragon minions in our parties or guilds.

You probably also won’t be needing:

• Titan worshippers that killed who knows how many people – bye bye Charr
• Child torturers and murderers – bye bye Asura
• People who can be corrupted by the Elder Dragons – bye bye Norn
• People who can be corrupted by powerful alien beings that can phase out of reality and then spending decades appeasing those beings by lying and murdering innocents as ‘sacrifice’ – bye bye Humans.

Whoops, their are no races left -_-. Oh well aka Kodan and Tengu FTW! lol

Kinda surprised no one has done burn down the grove event filling the map with player and Molotov kittentails with video of the grove burning. Anyway you always knew the story line was going to get darker. But I don’t think anyone thought they would go with multiple genocides. Actually it is interesting how many “racest” kinda the term to use for sylvari char and human and such there are in support of genocide. Maybe Guild Wars 2 is trying to have that nagging race discussion. To make a point: Jews where called mice, Ruwanda called kittenroaches and here Sylvari has become salad or cabbageheads. Dehumanization how easy history repeats.

In the end it is just a game though…right

Seishiro.7468:

The difference is, as you correctly pointed out: Glint was FREED of Krallkratoriks will. Find a way to ensure the Sylvari won’t just murder all of us while we sleep, and I will gladly fight side by side with them again, but for now, there is no such way, and the closer they come to Mordremoth, the more of them will fall under his controll, therefore they have to be kept as far away from Maguuma as possible, for the greater good of all!

In game, the failed assault happened maybe an hour ago. We have no idea the mental state of any of the sylvari, whether some turned or didn’t, whether they’re still in high murder mode or not, ect. For all we know, maybe it was only members of the soundless who turned, we don’t really know. All we know is that a number between “enough to take down the fleet from the inside with the element of surprise” and “all of them” turned. If it turns out that the Pale Tree is able to easily shield all the sylvari whom haven’t rejected the dream when she hasn’t been recently attacked by a dragon, then we have little to fear.

We’ve seen how warped Quaggan can become. Wonder what happens when Bubbles comes to town.

looks at wonderfully herbaceous body fuelled with the power of our new Elder Dragon overlord

Yep, I’m well and truly corrupted. When do I get to burn Divinity’s Reach to the ground?

While my Sylvari looks evil, she isnt owned by Mordremoth!!!

So Omadd’s device unlocked Mordremoth’s influence buried within Scarlet when she saw the vision of the Pale Tree and the Antikythera.

The same vision that our PCs saw.

Non-Sylvari don’t have a seed of Mordremoth within them, but Sylvari PCs do, even though it is being influenced by the Tree, the Dream, and Ventari’s teaching.

Is it possible, sometime in the near future, Sylvari PCs will have to deal with being exposed to the vision in Omadd’s machine?