Guild Wars 2

S3 Episode One – Ending Spoilers

After so much build-up with the mysterious explosion and its reversal, the scattered and richly-detailed notes about executions and dangerous magic, the stylish and very artistic cutscenes that delivered a very bad kitten story presentation and the dangerous and mood-setting music…

The white mantle’s leader is (or acts like) a clown, Lazarus pops up out of nowhere and disappears and we get a “oh, btw, primordus is active thxbye” line. Episode’s over.

What?

I did find most of the episode to be very well written, and some of Anet’s best storytelling, but I couldn’t take that ending seriously. It was the very definition of anti-climatic.

I’m not sure exactly what it didn’t work, but it surely didn’t. Was Caudecus meant to be a comical villain? Or was his voice acting and his cheesy lines that just didn’t deliver? I am THE the white mantle leader. I am serious about that. Please, TRY to take me seriously. Oh, a Mursaat. Go away, don’t bother me. Was it the no-budget Lazarus entrance? Hey guys, sup? Here’s some dialogue, bye, thanks for listening. Sorry for no big entrance. Was it the lack of follow-up after primordus reveal? Primordus is active. Now, let’s stare at the sky in silence while we think deeply about life, the universe and everything.

Maybe I expected much when I was hoping for a stylish cutscene that would set up the white mantle as the dangerous enemies they were being built-up to be, or for a grand entrance of the last Mursaat that would leave us in awe.

Thoughts?

Maybe I just have lower standards than you but I thought it was great. Lazarus’ return and Primordus being active. I almost cried tears… manly tears that is.

I think Caudecus was well written. He stood out more to me as belligerent and demanding while not understanding anything cause all he wants is power.

What I’m most upset about is Lazarus. He literally pops in randomly, “yo caud, you silly all ya want is powah we have better things to claim.” pops out… Really? I wish we could have at least seen the chamber or tomb thing from the raid blown up somewhere. Or a longer section of dialogue between Lazarus and the player character. Just a tiny bit more and it wouldn’t have been so awkward and feeling a little rushed.

It’s a really good cliffhanger after a long time without new content – primarily lore-wise.
It is now confirmed that Caudecus is the White Mantle leader – something that we’ve been hinted at since the game’s release, but it could have gone a different way; we’ve SEEN THE MURSAAT! and everyone who played GW1 should be quite surprised by the interaction between Mr. C and Lazarus; we also had the big bomb dropped at the very end, with EXTREMELY good pacing of the dialogue (even more props to the Taimi voice actress!).

You need to see this episode exactly as that: an introduction to a new storyline, purposely ending with such cliffhangers.

drkn.3429:

You need to see this episode exactly as that: an introduction to a new storyline, purposely ending with such cliffhangers.

The only problem is that cliffhangers are sort of the curse of Living Story. I don’t mind this one, if the next episode doesn’t make it a habit again like it was for S2.

For S2 it wasn’t so bad because the cadence, despite some breaks was faster… however, with the 8-12 weeks cadence, having almost one cliffhanger per episode is not going to work at all.

drkn.3429:

(even more props to the Taimi voice actress!).

Absolutely! She knocked it out of the park! Really enjoyed her stuff, plus all the other VAs were superb too.

I had fun!

There’s plenty of interesting story bits in the last cutscene, and S3 definitely has a lot of potential.

I think my issues are more with story presentation. Both with scene direction (Lazarus entrance needed more screen time before he started talking, I think) and in the dialogues (“Im the white mantle but I suck at it” and “I’m the big bad guy who has been hyped up as this extremely dangerous villain for generations, but hey, don’t listen to this old clown, I have a virtous ambition for you all, bye”).

I think Anet handled the story fine, but failed to stylize it. The whole episode – and the entire raid subplot beforehand – were building up and teasing for something big regarding the white mantle, and what we’ve gotten was very anti-climatic. It almost felt kind of troll-ish.

I have nothing against Caudecus ignorance nor against Lazarus “pretty words”, but there was something there lacking that totally failed to estabilish how important Lazarus entrance should have been. It seems like not even the characters didn’t care about about the big bad guy neither. “Oh, wasn’t he supposed to hate us? Maybe people do change over time”. Yeah.

He needed a more fearsome/ respectful entrance (the current one feels more like “Surprise! I was here all along listening to you talking! But I’m left out of time and gotta go fast, so listen quickly”). His dialogue to Caudecus should also have been more humiliating. I mean, despite Lazarus clearly having more power to do whatever he wants, I still got the feeling that caudecus got to humiliate him back quite effectively. “I’m THE white mantle leader and I’m saying to the last mursaat, of all things, and right on his face, that he is irrelevant.” Shouldn’t the super-powerful being Lazarus have been a bit… nastier at replying to that? “Hey guys, just ignore him and follow me instead” was not a very compelling reply.

I think Anet didn’t manage this scene very well. Lazarus felt unitentionally at the same level as Caudecus, to the point that if Anet were to reveal him as a comical villain next episode, I wouldn’t be surprised. Even when it clearly shouldn’t have been so, considering his demonstrated powers and all the story and air of mystery built-up until that moment. It was very tension-breaking.

I think that they were trying to create a cliffhanger and I agree, it felt a bit abrupt… but maybe it’s meant to be played as part of the full season. I would have liked a little more text to read at the end of the episode. Not everything needs to be voice acted; I think plain old clicky clicky text is a good way to keep those of us satisfied with more optional juicy text to read.

I really liked the ending scene, however with that said I care much more for what is actually happening rather than how well it is told. The Primordus reveal was awesome and I am so excited to be going after another dragon and can’t wait for the final battle (I just hope that primordus is absolutely HUGE and actually looks like a proper dragon, I seriously don’t care about mechanics or anything so long as it is not like the mordremoth fight). Leaving the episode with that reveal created a great cliffhanger and has really made me excited for episode 2 (shame I am going to have to wait so long for it with the new living world system however).
I didn’t play gw1 so the mursaat really don’t matter to me but I thought the conversation between him and caudecus was good and I look forward to seeing what they do with the rivalry between those 2 characters in future.

suffish.4150:

I really liked the ending scene, however with that said I care much more for what is actually happening rather than how well it is told. The Primordus reveal was awesome and I am so excited to be going after another dragon and can’t wait for the final battle (I just hope that primordus is absolutely HUGE and actually looks like a proper dragon, I seriously don’t care about mechanics or anything so long as it is not like the mordremoth fight). Leaving the episode with that reveal created a great cliffhanger and has really made me excited for episode 2 (shame I am going to have to wait so long for it with the new living world system however).
I didn’t play gw1 so the mursaat really don’t matter to me but I thought the conversation between him and caudecus was good and I look forward to seeing what they do with the rivalry between those 2 characters in future.

Primordus is the most fearsome Elder Dragon, he’s not going to die next expansion.

Disagreed. I loved the ending.

The ending and the suspense built from it were literally genious in terms of litrature writing quality. It was perfect to set up episode 2’s build up but I think theres a bigger and more obvious issue with this episode than that.

It was too short.

This episode needed at least another 2 hours on it from what it had, more depth, more time to add even more content, we got plenty in Eir’s house, which was fantastic, we got plenty in Rata Novus.

Then we had this ‘scattered’ but “swiftly” finished storyline in bloodstone fen that felt… rushed.

The ending was Great, I loved it, Cadecus while being a bit less clever and cynical from GW2’s launch was much more blatant evil villian now and im not necessarily complaining, he had been building his power for a while. When his time came to shine it was the best time to reveal his obvious evil intention.

However, Lazarus? Lazarus stole the show, not only because his reveal could not have been more epic than it was, but frankly because it leaves him with just enough mystery that while you are probably sure hes still a villian, your not sure “how” hes going to be villianous yet.

If, he is…

Theres alot of interesting ways they could go with him now, whos to say he will necessarily be evil and suddenly pull a fast one, just yet.

Perhaps his goal is alot more subtle than being evil for the sake of being evil, infact, I already think I know what A-net is planning to do with Lazarus and if its what I think it is, its quite a clever play.

After all, if he is the last living Mursaat, who just absorbed the power of a bloodstone, he has the power of a demi-god at this point, enouigh so to challenge, even kill, an Elder Dragon.

And if that was the case, then…

Why does the world need the commander, or the pact, when it has a new protector, a new god, to watch over it?

Me thinks, Lazarus, is going to play the “better to be loved than feared” card, turning “us” into the villians as we will look incompitent and lackluster compared to this all powerful deity absorbing magic and killing dragons.

Very well played A-net, very well played.

Yeah. For someone with no knowledge of GW1, this “reveal” had no impact on me. Something shows up called Lazarus and then there’s mention of a dragon called Primordius or something (I assumed a dragon). The Lazarus bit was confusing. Here I am preparing for an epic battle and…it’s gone. Some talk about Mursaats went over my head as well.

misterman.1530:

Yeah. For someone with no knowledge of GW1, this “reveal” had no impact on me. Something shows up called Lazarus and then there’s mention of a dragon called Primordius or something (I assumed a dragon). The Lazarus bit was confusing. Here I am preparing for an epic battle and…it’s gone. Some talk about Mursaats went over my head as well.

As a GW1 vet, this ignorance almost makes me want to cry. I wish I could share with you what I know, but the only way to truly understand is by playing it – which we both know won’t happen.

It makes me sad and furious when people state the story sucks or was lack luster because they did not play Guild Wars 1. If you’re that cheap and lazy… Get your WoW butts to the GW1 wiki and read the basic lore…

Guild Wars 2
2
1…2…

Not 2…1..

If you’re going to play 2 you need to understand there’s a 1. So here’s your options:
A. Play gw1
B. Read the gw1 wiki
C. Watch YouTube videos from GW1
D. Suck it up and realize you’re lazy and 10 years late

Be critical of the the story that’s cool… But cut the bs hating the story for being: lazy, late, and ignorant.

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Main_Page
https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Storyline
https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Timeline
https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Mission
https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Lore

I also highly suggest reading the lore.

Mental Paradox.3845:

misterman.1530:

Yeah. For someone with no knowledge of GW1, this “reveal” had no impact on me. Something shows up called Lazarus and then there’s mention of a dragon called Primordius or something (I assumed a dragon). The Lazarus bit was confusing. Here I am preparing for an epic battle and…it’s gone. Some talk about Mursaats went over my head as well.

As a GW1 vet, this ignorance almost makes me want to cry. I wish I could share with you what I know, but the only way to truly understand is by playing it – which we both know won’t happen.

I started to read about Lazarus, just because I wanted to know what the fuss was about. Very interesting. But it’s like walking into Empire Strikes Back at the Darth Vader scene when he reveals who is to Luke – but never having watched any Star Wars beforehand.

Wolfey.3407:

It makes me sad and furious when people state the story sucks or was lack luster because they did not play Guild Wars 1. If you’re that cheap and lazy… Get your WoW butts to the GW1 wiki and read the basic lore…

Guild Wars 2
2
1…2…

Not 2…1..

If you’re going to play 2 you need to understand there’s a 1. So here’s your options:
A. Play gw1
B. Read the gw1 wiki
C. Watch YouTube videos from GW1
D. Suck it up and realize you’re lazy and 10 years late

Be critical of the the story that’s cool… But cut the bs hating the story for being: lazy, late, and ignorant.

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Main_Page
https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Storyline
https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Timeline
https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Mission
https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Lore

Problem is, story needs to stand on its own two feet and present itself to anyone as a whole in its linear path alone. It mustn’t rely on you scouring other media, other books or other games. Those can provide tidbits of additional information for the “initiated”, but this approach is basically shivving anyone new in the eye and alienating new players (which goes pretty much against everything ANet was trying to do so far).

And before you start tossing accusations of being a lazy noob my way, I’ve played Guild Wars 1. I know the lore. And I still think presentation of Lazarus and the White Mantle arch was lackluster. I as a player know what bloodstone and Mursaat and White Mantle are (because I’m a stubborn mule and was willing to put up with GW1’s horrible combat, but not everyone is). But for my character to know that with no buildup makes absolutely no sense.

When you see a kitten explosion, the transition to “Oh, right, it was bloodstone exploding” wasn’t on par with a character who lives in the world where White Mantle are supposed to be operating on such low key they’re basically superstition to even most humans, let alone other races. It’s on par with an avid lore-nerd who kept the past half a year eagerly speculating about raiding storyline and where will it go next.

The final presentation of Lazarus is basically “O hey, you knew I was coming, so just keep it short, I’ll be on my way, toodles”, without counting on people who have literally no idea what the hell’s that supposed to mean.

Also, yes, I know Bennet recaps the raid for you, I know another NPC gives you details on the White Mantle, but this was supposed to be a major cliffhanger in a short storyline, that requires investment. Tossing half a wikipedia on someone doesn’t make them invested, knowing isn’t the same as caring.

I know all the lore I need for the plot, yet I still struggle to care. Because for me as a player character, I struggle to find a reason to be invested. Especially since I’m obviously clairvoyant now.

Only disappointment was that after such an insane long wait, this was all we got. Story was done within an hour, meta was done within 4. Still have that new fractal to try out I guess.

I’m also fairly certain that a lot of people are missing that a ‘virtuous purpose’ to a Mursaat is probably still REALLY bad for Tyria. He could want to continue purging non-believes, or take revenge for the fact that he got his kitten kicked before, for his race. He might be going after the egg. And if he’s the one who absorbed the power of the Bloodstone? Or even if he isn’t, that energy went SOMEWHERE and that’s bad news. The Bloodstone exploding ALONE is bad news. Those things are sorta tied to magic in the world and even if that energy contained in it just went back into the system, the deaths of Zhaitan and Mordy have both showed that huge influxes of energy being allowed to escape back into the wild isn’t really a good thing.
Primordus being active? I’ve said it already, he’s not the dragon I wanted to go after next (but who knows what the others are doing, Kracky and Jornag have been sending their minions to harass Tyria for awhile now, they’ve gotta be getting agitated that they keep getting roflstomped,)
But Primordus has been awake for a long kitten time and he hasn’t made a move. It COULD just be because there’s a lot of energy to gobble up now (which actually… suggests the other dragons should be interested. I wonder if the various dragons don’t like each other?)
So Primordus being active? I think I said this in another thread, we didn’t need to hear that he was active and have a whole ten minute conversation on ‘zomg, Primordus is active, that’s super bad.’

We had a moment where we find out that Caudy is in fact the White Mantle leader (we already knew he was an idiot,) that Lazarus has chosen NOW to come back with some secret motive, and that there’s at least one dragon who’s ready to make a play.

I dunno, I could say something about trying to hike the stakes up too high, but disappointing? EH, wouldn’t say that.

Mental Paradox.3845:

misterman.1530:

Yeah. For someone with no knowledge of GW1, this “reveal” had no impact on me. Something shows up called Lazarus and then there’s mention of a dragon called Primordius or something (I assumed a dragon). The Lazarus bit was confusing. Here I am preparing for an epic battle and…it’s gone. Some talk about Mursaats went over my head as well.

As a GW1 vet, this ignorance almost makes me want to cry. I wish I could share with you what I know, but the only way to truly understand is by playing it – which we both know won’t happen.

I have to agree on that. I’m a big sucker for lore and we’re finally getting some of the old lore being fed back to us in the new world. It only took 200+ years, but we finally have the payoff. :p

If you’re playing the Living World episodes and you know nothing about the old lore, that’s more ArenaNet’s fault for not including it somewhere in the game world. I think there’s somewhere that talks about the 5 Old Races with the mursaat being one of them, but I kind of think that’s tucked into a corner. So for that, I can understand.

However, if you don’t know who Primordus is, that’s your fault for not paying attention to the information about all the elder dragons. I can understand if you don’t want to dig through the old game for information, but you ought to know at least a little bit about the lore for this game, especially if you’re playing through the story bits. I know the destroyers aren’t the most common dragon minion out there, mostly relegated to the mid-Eastern section of Lornar’s Pass, Mount Maelstrom and a few instances like the Skritt recruitment storyline in the original Personal Story, but he was still one of the 6 Elder Dragons – the first to awaken – so you should at least know his name if not care that a new dragon is on the move!

Seems like this threat went waaaay off-topic!

I still find the last scene’s direction/ presentation lacking. The story details there were good, but Caudecus personality was way anti-climatic after 4+ hours of built up and Lazarus entrance felt unimportant (I wouldn’t probably mind Caudecus if Lazarus entrance had been more stylish).

And I’m not talking about Lazarus dialogues. I’m talking about the visuals, the music, the camera angles, the pacing, everything that deals with his presentation. He simply popped up, told us a few words and PUFF! disappeared. Anet should have created a better scene for that. If there’s one thing that the cinematic’s team is really good at, is at presentation. They should have asked that team to do one for this scene. And if theres one thing that Lazarus needed after so much hype and build-up, was a good presentation. Which he hasn’t gotten.

I liked it because LS3E1 started off slow. I mean we spend quite a while just following a crippled asura around.
And then it takes off like a rollercoaster, and how do we stop this thing?! Slow it down a little?! We don’t! ha haa
Honestly I think the pacing worked.

BTW, taimi is the best. Just wish she gets a prof X hover chair or something later on.

DiogoSilva.7089:

And if theres one thing that Lazarus needed after so much hype and build-up, was a good presentation. Which he hasn’t gotten.

Lazarus had hype and build-up?

The cool thing about living story is not only the surprises at the end, but the scavenger hunt of journals which talk about some of the raid content, tying it into the current arc, but not making it central, and also making it clear that Lazurus was the ultimate goal. Tie that with after magic image and Lazurus’s return was pretty easy to guess and didn’t feel random at all. Primodus coming back was just icing on the cake. Great start. I can’t wait to see where it goes next.

I think the next epizode will tell about thr Egg and Exalted (something with Caithe and Pale Tree)

The White Mantle’s Thread will continue after announcement of the 2nd wing.

Next Thread- Glint’s Egg and Kralkatorrik (maybe next expansion)
We will see.

It was all disappointing.

Caudecus has been setting this up for how long? And his followers still don’t take him seriously.
The last living Mursaat just pops up, says one thing, and disappears.
Primordos is active? What has he been doing since he woke up because wasn’t he the first to wake up? Has he been waiting for this patch to move?
Still no word on the egg, Rata Novas, Rytlocks new magic etc.

Glad they scrapped legendary weapons for this lol

My problem with the end was the long drawn out grind and repeat. With them adding the flying combat aspect there should have been that added to the final battle.

“It was all disappointing.

Caudecus has been setting this up for how long? And his followers still don’t take him seriously. The last living Mursaat just pops up, says one thing, and disappears. Primordos is active? What has he been doing since he woke up because wasn’t he the first to wake up? Has he been waiting for this patch to move? Still no word on the egg, Rata Novas, Rytlocks new magic etc."~ Sird

You should know something: everything happened when GW2 started.

But we cannot see this in the game. If Anet would realise story without breaks, the game would die when the player end everything.

But I believe that the progress of story is slow.

Ley Line didn’t make that Baby Dragon born after this happening, Ley Line gives energy. I repeat this again: Ley Line is the pure magic, Ley Line is life, Ley Line is everywhere.

Ley Line makes everything grows.
So, the birth of new dragon is very slow process. And anet wants make it realistic.

We don’t know about Rytlock’s new magic???
We knew it since the revenant has been presented…
Just Rox was stupid and he didn’t watch trailer for HoT…

I am joking

But when Scarlet died and LLE moved through Tyria and awakened Mordremoth, the full awakening wasn’t quick process, he had to prepare himself. for attack Tyria.
Same Primordus and another Dragons will need time to attack.

We will wait years when all dragons will die. We must prepare for 3 different expansions, and we still don’t know where DSD is. We didn’t meet Tengu and their history. We have to discover a lot of things. But this is game for years and we will know everything… For 10 years?

And someone with the brain could think that Taimi will discover something about Primordus.
And it became the fact when we did 1st epizode.

Tekoneiric.6817:

My problem with the end was the long drawn out grind and repeat. With them adding the flying combat aspect there should have been that added to the final battle.

This sparked a thought for me: yes, it would have been cool if gliding was part of that fight, with all the new skills unlocked while in the instance. That way it would offer a tutorial in using the skills and also a preview of what they do so players could prioritize their skill purchase order in the open world.

Not that it takes very long at all to unlock all the skills as it is — but I’d have taken skill 3 last if I’d known what they all did.

On the other hand, with the number of complaints about the gliding part of the Mordremoth fight as well as an oft-stated view by players that they don’t like having their skills bar swapped to five new skills so they can’t play their build, perhaps they opted to leave those elements out this time.

Donari.5237:

On the other hand, with the number of complaints about the gliding part of the Mordremoth fight as well as an oft-stated view by players that they don’t like having their skills bar swapped to five new skills so they can’t play their build, perhaps they opted to leave those elements out this time.

The problem with the Mordremoth fight was that there was a moment of dialog saying “shield up or take to the sky” then you die. Hardly any gap.

Oh indeed — that part hasn’t gotten me, actually, it’s the freaking rocks he hurls, so many times I’ve done that instance and never got the achieve — but I meant more that given the glitches in having flight as part of the fight, they may have decided to avoid such things entirely. An over-correction of the problem, as it were.

Changer the Elder.2948:

Problem is, story needs to stand on its own two feet and present itself to anyone as a whole in its linear path alone. It mustn’t rely on you scouring other media, other books or other games. Those can provide tidbits of additional information for the “initiated”, but this approach is basically shivving anyone new in the eye and alienating new players (which goes pretty much against everything ANet was trying to do so far).

….

Also, yes, I know Bennet recaps the raid for you, I know another NPC gives you details on the White Mantle, but this was supposed to be a major cliffhanger in a short storyline, that requires investment. Tossing half a wikipedia on someone doesn’t make them invested, knowing isn’t the same as caring.

I know all the lore I need for the plot, yet I still struggle to care. Because for me as a player character, I struggle to find a reason to be invested. Especially since I’m obviously clairvoyant now.

Your argument on “a story needs to stand on its own” is ok, i don’t agree with it, but it’s a fair statement to make.

Your idea that Guild Wars 1 should be severed from Guild Wars 2 because people refuse to play the game or read up on it is just heresy….

If someone doesn’t feel like getting invested in the story, they shouldn’t cry and complain about not understanding the story… it’s that simple, You know what you were getting into when you created the account, you know you were going to be missing out on content if you didn’t play the first and just jumped right into the 2nd.

My simple point is this:
If you’re going to complain about GW1 content being included in GW2 then cry about not understanding it, that’s on you 100% not anet.

Side note, when i say you, Changer the Elder.2948; i don’t mean you exactly. I mean you as in the people who are doing what I’m describing.

Excluding GW1 100% from the topic for a moment…
Those who played Vanilla GW2 knew:
- about the white mantle “myth”
- knew that caudecus was up to something against the queen (cm & personal story)
- Plenty of dialogue, papers, diaries in vanilla that talked about the “unseen ones” that the white mantle worshiped. Don’t recall if they were ever called Mursaat in vanilla gw2.

HoT wise, you have the raids, even if you didn’t touch them you knew about the white mantle weapons as people were running around with them. Hell, even if you asked “what weapon was that?” it has White Mantle in the name….

Post HoT and the Lead Up to LW S3 you have events that involve bandits and thieves and executioners. As weeks passed, the executioners and a couple of the bosses have white mantle weapons in their hands.

sooo is the excuse people are too lazy to do pve content provided to them?
People are too lazy to do their personal story?
People are too lazy to play the game for 15 minutes a week?

Trying to understand the mindset of:
“OMG WHAT IS A MURSAAT WHY SHOULD I CARE???” that a couple of people are going on about.

To put it in even more simplistic terms,
Complaining about GW1 content in GW2 is like complaining about Horde vs Alliance in WoW because you didn’t play Warcraft 1,2, or 3.

At what point does ANET cut the umbilical cord and expect the players to walk on their own two feet in GW2?

Wolfey.3407:

To put it in even more simplistic terms,
Complaining about GW1 content in GW2 is like complaining about Horde vs Alliance in WoW because you didn’t play Warcraft 1,2, or 3.

Agreed. I never played GW1 but I did read the lore and watch lore videos on the topic. I think Anet’s mistake for vanilla GW2 was there were too few meaningful connections to GW1’s events… to the point most players could just ignore there was ever a GW1.

Wolfey.3407:

- knew that caudecus was up to something against the queen (cm & personal story

Except that’s only true for humans. I am a charr. I only went to Caudecus Manor and that’s… how to put it politely. Very plain on actual information.

It’s the same as the uproar against Caithe’s story, actually, possibly even more so. Back then, human-only players were upset story relies on information they haven’t seen. Now they’re not, because they’re a majority.

What I’m saying is: for a human, the story’s good. For every other race, there’s simply no buildup.

I enjoyed it a lot. The only thing that felt random was Caudecus being involved.. However, finding out that it will be Primordious as the next dragon was unexpected. that sure to mean fire islands opening up?

I honestly felt the ending was great, but there was a bit of “fridge logic” to it.

Caudecus doesn’t really grasp the true threat of the elder dragons. He’s fixed on his goal, and in his mind the dragons are just a distraction. Facing the truth will shatter him and show him how unimportant he really is, so he never faces it. We see some of that here, with his disturbingly narrow focus that makes him come across to us as an idiot.

The appearance of Lazarus was oddly underplayed, or so I felt when it happened. But it was interesting to see him casually dismiss Caudecus and his goals as unimportant. Interesting, and a surprise as well.

Then, at the very end, we get the message that Primordus is active. Everyone falls silent as it sinks in that the one dragon we should fear the most just became our number one dragon priority. And here’s where the fridge logic comes in. You see, Lazarus must have known what was happening, and that’s what he’s facing. Primordus can and WILL kill him, there’s no doubt about that. Lazarus basically just stuffed himself full of dragon food, he’s the biggest magical snack in the world right now.

Lazarus has a plan, and the White Mantle may be a part of it, but only if they’re useful. So, he showed up to make sure he had some of them he can use when the time comes. No flashy entrance, no huge proclamations of doom or joy. Just “Align White Mantle: check”. That’s all it was, him just checking off another box on his to-do list to get his plans ready. It was given all the theater we give to checking we have enough gas in the car before going for a drive, because that’s pretty much what it was to him.

There’s a good chance he had no idea who we were during that scene, so he paid us no real attention. That’s likely to change in the very near future, but it was very fitting for the moment. Nobody there was important to him, he just needed to appear and let them know he was back. Thus, the downplayed appearance and lack of conversation make complete sense.

onevstheworld.2419:

Wolfey.3407:

To put it in even more simplistic terms,
Complaining about GW1 content in GW2 is like complaining about Horde vs Alliance in WoW because you didn’t play Warcraft 1,2, or 3.

Agreed. I never played GW1 but I did read the lore and watch lore videos on the topic. I think Anet’s mistake for vanilla GW2 was there were too few meaningful connections to GW1’s events… to the point most players could just ignore there was ever a GW1.

I agree. I never played GW1, but read up as much of the lore as I can to get immersion for my character.

One note I noticed is that the young lady Mesmer who helped Caudecus escape was named Lady Wi. Her first name escapes me as I forgot to get a screenshot of it.

I am guessing she is the daughter of the Lady Wi who is a member of the Order of Whispers and Godmother of Demmi Beetlestone (Cadecus’s daughter)?

That would be interesting if she is connected with the Whisper’s as well.

Lahmia.2193:

Maybe I just have lower standards than you but I thought it was great. Lazarus’ return and Primordus being active. I almost cried tears… manly tears that is.

Lazarus showing up was definitely a highlight and his response was near perfect for a Mursaat. I loved the Mursaat in GW1 and was bummed that they were barely referenced at all up until the Arah EXP mode.

As for Primordus, well HoT already disappointed me with that. There I was hoping that Primordus would swoop in before we could kill Mordremoth and steal the show (because us winning all the time against these creatures that are supposed to be unstoppable is dumb) by frying the jungle dragon only to grow in size (upon gathering Mord’s magic) and then swoop off only to be the final dragon sometime in the future. Sadly HoT happened very much differently and while hinted, Primordus seemed just another name on the ED list. Yes the Asura had it out for Primordus but I always chalked that up to the fact that they lost their Central Transfer Chamber which is what the heroes in GW1 used to reach Primo’s Lieutenant: The Great Destroyer.

At the same time though, Primo’s introduction also opens up a lot of new opportunities. Seeing the dwarves again ( “Stonekin” ) and this new dynamic with Lazarus whom I assume wants to go home – to the Isles of Janthir.

I’m just disappointing that it’s Primordus. I wanted to see the triumphant return of Destiny’s Edge to get revenge on Kralkatorik and clear the path for us to Elona and Cantha.

I thought the story was very good. Caudicus is obviously simply trying to manipulate the White MAntle to get himself in power, this is not an uncommon thing in the real world. Simply driving the zealots. The zealots though know kind of whats up and are hesitant. Now introduce Lazarus, whose probably trying more than anything to WIN the white mantle back over than to burn away those who disagree. The white mantle used a mix of fear and awe to control their subjects in GW1 to push their purpose. They did not hand out the smiting, they let their White Mantle do the smiting and reaped the benefits.

With Lazarus being the last of his kind, he is going to try real hard to win his enemies over instead of fighting them and risking himself in the process.

Even though I’ve never played GW1, I thought I was up on the lore. I’ve been through the event that opens Lazaruis’s grave, only to not find him there. I was confused when the party members thought that the 2-bit minister of a human city was the source of the Bloodstone eruption and not Lazarus. I mean is not a name like Lazarus expected to have 2 lives? My main is a Charr, and maybe that is why Cadecaus seems like no threat whatsoever.

Apparently I played a different LS3. My experience was awesome, the best story content to date in GW2 and when Taimi said Primordius got active I screamed just because of the possibilities where this could go.

But it was a los of lore packed in one episode. I’m looking forward the next one.

I liked the ending and this new way ANET is going with Guildwars 2. I think it’s ok to draw off Guildwars 1 because GW2 is in the same world simply 200 years in the future. It’s a world where some entities last centuries (Ogden is still alive) and the effects of past events linger well into the future. It wouldn’t be too far fetched to have any number of GW1 enemies return.

lioka qiao.8734:

I liked the ending and this new way ANET is going with Guildwars 2. I think it’s ok to draw off Guildwars 1 because GW2 is in the same world simply 200 years in the future. It’s a world where some entities last centuries (Ogden is still alive) and the effects of past events linger well into the future. It wouldn’t be too far fetched to have any number of GW1 enemies return.

I agree with this 100%. It seems the new game director is trying to make sure that the world feels cohesive. Its what I missed the last couple of seasons and the Personal Story. Yes it was Tyria but it only made broad and very vague references once in a blue moon to the ENTIRE game series that created all of this before it. I am so far considering the game 2 for 2 on content updates since the new Director took over.

My thoughts are quite long, so spoiler tags so folks can ignore them if they like.

Things the episode was missing:

Things that were done well:

As an asura main, I actually got chills when Taimi announced her discovery.

So as someone who has criticized the writing team since GW2 launched. I have to say I was satisfied by the way it turned out. Even though the call out to the next elder dragon felt a little jarring. However it does not mean I don’t get what the DiogoSilva is getting at (in some context).

The problem for me, is that I went through everything. I have experienced Guild Wars 1 and 2 entire narrative. I even have looked through the subtext plot-lines that most people seem to miss. It’s why I could vaguely put together what Scarlet was doing in season 1. For instance did you know that Scarlet alluded to the “drill” way before the Breachmaker made it’s first appearance? There is a few plot points that make season 3 ending feel better in context. Caudecus’s Manor/dungeon, the human personal story sections, Forsaken Thicket/raid (prelude to season 3), and the 3 completed journals found in Bloodstone Fen. You can sort of piece together some of those events by talking to Squad Leader Bennett in Bloodstone Fen, and Canach at the end of the Research in Rata Novus instance.

Now if you just take away all of that “side plot,” before season 3 started then I can see the issue with the ending. It could feel a bit rushed. Where they re-introduced three major antagonist at once. Hopefully the next episode will give more background to what is going on. The biggest hurdle this poolside had to do was answer some narrative pitfalls that were left at the end of HoT. Which was no easy feet. Since even with the answers we got not everything was fully fleshed out. However this is just the beginning.

I think there is also a problem with Lazarus’s voice. Its not… bossy. I expected something more diabolical.

With Mordremoth, I felt the danger, the suspense, the gravity of the situation. With White Mantle? Not so much.

Also commander’s voice (norn female for me) was also different than before. She used to be more calm and reasoning, now she is all excited (especially with the Caithe bloodstone conversations)

Btw, why did Caithe decided to open her heart up in the middle of an ambush?

My god… So many things are wrong.