Guild Wars 2

Xera gathered 4 aspects of Lazarus, right? But there are 5 aspects.

I think, that perhaps Xera gave 4 aspects of 4 the elements and perhaps this is why he used fire to burn the White Mantle’s members in out of the Shadows and Rising Flames, because he is an elementalist.

But perhaps 5th aspect was used to give him his personality, as the Lazarus the Dire from GW1. Perhaps this 5th aspect was replaced by Bloodstone power and the Bloodstone’s power did not changed him into bad one, but he could get a new personality or the fake artifact, who was given to Xera as 5th aspects did not make Lazarus as a bad guy.

So I don’t think so Marjory is in danger, worst if the Commander will come with this aspect, Lazarus will consume it and get the unknown ability, which Caudecus wanted to avoid.

But anyway I think this is the real Lazarus with Marjory.

I stopped to trust Caudecus long long ago, because even in the Personal Story he used people for his goals to kill Jennah.

You can agree with me or not, but I think Lazarus is the real Lazarus.

That would actually be pretty interesting. By “faking” the last aspect Caudecus inadvertently screwed himself over and gave the heroes an unexpected ally. I like it.

This is an interesting point you make. But we already have a thread on imposter-like state of Lazarus here and in lore section. The point you made was brought up there already.

Oh, really? Ok, sorry I do not know every post of the players here. Appologize.

I actually think Lazarus is not Lazarus, the conversation in the end was quite implicative in my eyes. I think the Imposter is Queen Jenna. And yes, a part of me just dislikes her for being such an awful mary sue.
On the other hand.. think about it: shes a extremely powerful mesmer so pulling off something like that would not be beyond her capabilities. During the attack on lake doric she protected THE WHOLE CITY with a shield bubble, and that not after some sort of long ritual, but quite spontaneously, must be quite a feat eh? Additionally, some of her moves in this episode have been quite totlitarian, like disbanding the council. Additionally I think that kind of intrigue is not beyond her, she always strikes me as extremely intrigant..

Some people might argue that she is a mesmer, and therefore she would not be able to use elemental magic (with the bloodstones being divided and all that) but renember that one of the bloodstones has been released and absorbed by Lazarus, it is very possible that that one was governing elemental magic.

The whole city? it is not clean in the story instance you can see that she protected only the palace not the whole city, but in Lake Doric the whole city is protected so I am confused.

But I think I know what you mean- you probably like the theory that in the Palace are the clones of Anise and Jennah and they are doing different things. Hmm if it would be true, your theory would be correct, but we have not any proofs.

But why would she protect the Egg? I think that if mesmers would do these things like this, that would ruin them. Look- they wanna change into anything they wanna- this is dangerous and not possible.

Anyway Jennah finally showed that she is the real Queen, who can protect her people and the big shield doesn’t mean she absorbed any power. The magic was given by the Gods and she got the gift from Lyssa. I am sure she is not Lyssa or Lazarus.

But I love every theory about Lazarus so you have good theory and we have to wait if it is true

I am so hyped!

The most possible theories about Lazarus are:

1) Lazarus is Lazarus (I believe in this theory)
2) Lazarus is the human god- Lyssa- Balthazar- Kormir. If it is Kormir I will cry, Kormir is my fave goddess!
3) It is Gleam- Glint’s first Scion
4) One of the legendary characters like Palawa Joko
5) Jennah or Kasmeer.

Ahh, so the Qeen of Divinitys reach has some sort of power bestowed upon her by Lyssa? Because what happend there, with the dome seemed powerful beyond the reasonable level of a single human.. (unless that human absorbs some sort of Bloodstone that is)

Regarding Aurene: Maybe she wants to get some leverage on Aurene? But yeah, that was out of queen jennas domain for shure and a big argument against it being Jenna. I hope it is not Kasmeer, that seems unbelievable to me.

On the other hand, in the “regrouping with the queen” story instance one of the Ladys-in-Waiting mentions that Jenna and Logan apparently are not as close as they used to be. A possible explanation for that is, that Logan subconciously realized that Queen Jenna is not the real one. If there is anyone she cannot fool its propably Logan I guess..

Artasqweroldy.7458:

Because what happend there, with the dome seemed powerful beyond the reasonable level of a single human.. (unless that human absorbs some sort of Bloodstone that is)

That is because Jennah is a disguised Steve Bubbles, the deep sea dragon. She protected the city with a bubble, what else evidence do you need? You need more proof? She takes a bath every week! Totally a water dragon.

Ider.1276:

Artasqweroldy.7458:

Because what happend there, with the dome seemed powerful beyond the reasonable level of a single human.. (unless that human absorbs some sort of Bloodstone that is)

That is because Jennah is a disguised Steve Bubbles, the deep sea dragon. She protected the city with a bubble, what else evidence do you need? You need more proof? She takes a bath every week! Totally a water dragon.

sounds reasonable

Artasqweroldy.7458:

Ahh, so the Qeen of Divinitys reach has some sort of power bestowed upon her by Lyssa? Because what happend there, with the dome seemed powerful beyond the reasonable level of a single human.. (unless that human absorbs some sort of Bloodstone that is)

OR, and this is just a theory, she’s a powerful mesmer. You say it’s beyond human capability, but it’s not like she, say, summoned a giant illusion of Kralkatorrik to lead Branded away from Ebonhawke or anything. That’d just be ridiculous.

Artasqweroldy.7458:

On the other hand, in the “regrouping with the queen” story instance one of the Ladys-in-Waiting mentions that Jenna and Logan apparently are not as close as they used to be. A possible explanation for that is, that Logan subconciously realized that Queen Jenna is not the real one. If there is anyone she cannot fool its propably Logan I guess..

My interpretation was that it was a change of emotion on Jennah’s part, not Logan’s. Logan just realises she doesn’t need him as a protective puppy-dog and can move on to better things like Marshal of the Pact.

Of course, this doesn’t mean that Jennah’s not an illusion at the moment, but perhaps the illusion isn’t giving the same emotions off that the real Jennah is. At the same time, this could be a calculated play by whoever created the illusion, which might be Jennah herself.

Lazarus = Lazarus > terrible story writing, complete destruction of a famous NPC
Lazarus = semi-Lazarus > interesting story writing, plus redemption for the so far terrible display of Lazarus’ personality.
Lazarus =//= Lazarus > also interesting, but maybe a bit too much of an open, aka, lazy writing to justify just about any random plot they have yet to come up with

We secretly replaced Lazarus the Dire’s final aspect with Folger’s Crystals. Let’s see if anyone notices the difference.

I do like the idea that this is the actual mursaat with a piece missing, but that doesn’tppear to be the way ANet is taking the story.

Arden.7480:

I stopped to trust Caudecus long long ago, because even in the Personal Story he used people for his goals to kill Jennah.

In the letters scattered across the mission, one of them mentions that Caudecus got the “fifth piece” from Justiciar Bauer and it was Bauer who told Caudecus that the ritual would fail without all five aspects.

But as we see from journal pages in Bloodstone Fen, Bauer is a fanatic of the Unseen Ones – unlike how he presents himself to Caudecus.

Implying that it isn’t Caudecus who lied, but Bauer. Caudecus was fooled just as the PC has been. That is, if there was a lie.

The question is: What is Bauer’s true goal?

Did he lie to Caudecus, giving him a fake? Did he betray Xera, giving Caudecus a real piece? Did he betray both, aiming for personal glorification (thus bringing Lazarus back himself, rather than letting Xera do it)?

If Lazarus is a fake, my money is on “Lazarus” being Bauer – as Bauer is the one who orchestrated the ritual to absorb the bloodstone’s magic (and secretly, at that). But if Lazarus is not a fake, then I’d bet he’s a 4/5th Lazarus, the fifth aspect being what got corrupted by Naveed in GW1.

And either way, his “good guy” act is just that: an act.

Artasqweroldy.7458:

Ahh, so the Qeen of Divinitys reach has some sort of power bestowed upon her by Lyssa? Because what happend there, with the dome seemed powerful beyond the reasonable level of a single human.. (unless that human absorbs some sort of Bloodstone that is)

Nothing says she was blessed or anything, but she had always been presented as an exceptionally powerful mesmer.

My theory is that she has the Scepter of Orr – after all, we know that Livia retrieved it, but did not keep it. It would make sense that it was kept in the hands of the royal family. Of course, she’s not carrying around the Scepter of Orr – and didn’t have it on her when she did an equally magnificent feat in Ebonhawke during Edge of Destiny (mass paralyzing all seraph, ebon vanguard, and charr, while disguising them as branded, and tricking the hivemind branded there not only to believe the humans and charr got corrupted, but that the illusion of Kralkatorrik in the sky was the real Elder Dragon) – so unless it got shifted into a different form it seems unlikely.

Or she could just be a naturally stupidly powerful mesmer. It’s not really mary sueness for there to be a one-in-a-million super-talented individual (I mean, the Pact Commander exists too! And we’re 100% natural human/asura/norn/charr/sylvari!)

Artasqweroldy.7458:

On the other hand, in the “regrouping with the queen” story instance one of the Ladys-in-Waiting mentions that Jenna and Logan apparently are not as close as they used to be. A possible explanation for that is, that Logan subconciously realized that Queen Jenna is not the real one. If there is anyone she cannot fool its propably Logan I guess..

Rather than “as they used to be” the entire Regrouping with the Queen instance indicates that Jennah never had feelings for Logan in the first place – a direct contradiction with Jennah’s own words in the human personal story.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Arden.7480:

I stopped to trust Caudecus long long ago, because even in the Personal Story he used people for his goals to kill Jennah.

In the letters scattered across the mission, one of them mentions that Caudecus got the “fifth piece” from Justiciar Bauer and it was Bauer who told Caudecus that the ritual would fail without all five aspects.

But as we see from journal pages in Bloodstone Fen, Bauer is a fanatic of the Unseen Ones – unlike how he presents himself to Caudecus.

Implying that it isn’t Caudecus who lied, but Bauer. Caudecus was fooled just as the PC has been. That is, if there was a lie.

The question is: What is Bauer’s true goal?

Did he lie to Caudecus, giving him a fake? Did he betray Xera, giving Caudecus a real piece? Did he betray both, aiming for personal glorification (thus bringing Lazarus back himself, rather than letting Xera do it)?

If Lazarus is a fake, my money is on “Lazarus” being Bauer – as Bauer is the one who orchestrated the ritual to absorb the bloodstone’s magic (and secretly, at that). But if Lazarus is not a fake, then I’d bet he’s a 4/5th Lazarus, the fifth aspect being what got corrupted by Naveed in GW1.

And either way, his “good guy” act is just that: an act.

Artasqweroldy.7458:

Ahh, so the Qeen of Divinitys reach has some sort of power bestowed upon her by Lyssa? Because what happend there, with the dome seemed powerful beyond the reasonable level of a single human.. (unless that human absorbs some sort of Bloodstone that is)

Nothing says she was blessed or anything, but she had always been presented as an exceptionally powerful mesmer.

My theory is that she has the Scepter of Orr – after all, we know that Livia retrieved it, but did not keep it. It would make sense that it was kept in the hands of the royal family. Of course, she’s not carrying around the Scepter of Orr – and didn’t have it on her when she did an equally magnificent feat in Ebonhawke during Edge of Destiny (mass paralyzing all seraph, ebon vanguard, and charr, while disguising them as branded, and tricking the hivemind branded there not only to believe the humans and charr got corrupted, but that the illusion of Kralkatorrik in the sky was the real Elder Dragon) – so unless it got shifted into a different form it seems unlikely.

Or she could just be a naturally stupidly powerful mesmer. It’s not really mary sueness for there to be a one-in-a-million super-talented individual (I mean, the Pact Commander exists too! And we’re 100% natural human/asura/norn/charr/sylvari!)

Artasqweroldy.7458:

On the other hand, in the “regrouping with the queen” story instance one of the Ladys-in-Waiting mentions that Jenna and Logan apparently are not as close as they used to be. A possible explanation for that is, that Logan subconciously realized that Queen Jenna is not the real one. If there is anyone she cannot fool its propably Logan I guess..

Rather than “as they used to be” the entire Regrouping with the Queen instance indicates that Jennah never had feelings for Logan in the first place – a direct contradiction with Jennah’s own words in the human personal story.

Yeah, I hope that this is intentional and is leading to something and is not just a retcon to the story. I was a bit off put when the story acted like Jennah never said she had feelings for him.