Guild Wars 2

I never said I thought it was a “bug”. But I just wanted to make my displeasure known. Those of us who have multiple alts typically spend far more time and money on the game than those who only have one main character, and the way GW2 is structured means that a lot of times, we’re artificially hindered in gearing up our alts via account limits. Things like the Carapace Shoulders being easier to obtain by altoholics felt like ANet was at least giving us a boost elsewhere to make up for it.

Relshdan.6854:

no way it’s a bug. and it doesn’t really bother me.

they “threw us a bone” by letting alts get the skins in ep1 (a nice way to get the your collection going)…..but if this practice continued all the way through, the zone would be pretty dead as soon as the last installment ended. these episodes take so little time to complete.

you get one full set by playing the LS (a few hours of gameplay)….you get the rest by playing the map (it’s only a grind if you make it one and “need” to have all skins quickly). you can argue the cost in crests is too high (i’d agree and probably halve the total)…but the fact that it isn’t available only through rng is more important to me.

The other simple solution to keep the area active would have been to make the Pact Fleet weapons available through Silverwastes.

Before I knew how to make the Luminescent shoulders, I made the horrifying mistake of unlocking the skin and then deleting the medium shoulders… ugh.

Egon Vidar.9125:

Before I knew how to make the Luminescent shoulders, I made the horrifying mistake of unlocking the skin and then deleting the medium shoulders… ugh.

That doesn’t matter, you’re still good. All you need is to unlock the skin as it is a collection reward.

Just wait for the next two living story episodes when you have two armor pieces available. That’s like 8,000 – 10,000 crests you’ll need to farm over those four weeks depending on whether one of each type is given as a freebie.

Zaxares.5419:

Hopefully we can get a statement from ANet about whether or not this was intended for the Gloves.

A statement from Anet on something players dislike? Especially a statement that clarifies anything (or more, gives reasons behind the change)?
…yeah, right. As if that would ever happen.

I got around 1k crests per day even before this “grind”. I like the zone.

I want one of those “we want to communicate and hold hands” anet staff to come here and clarify this.

Do u intend to force us to play a map we no longer like because of the nerf and are desperately looking for ways to make us come back to it in order to get the items or is it a bug and we should have obtained the other gloves through the story via our alts that sit there and collect dust?

Can anyone please tell me if this is intentional or a bug ?

We still don’t know, JP. But, if I had to guess . . . intentional. And, quite frankly, I like the achievement and armor, but not THAT much.

I’m not even wearing the armor. So, if I don’t get the achievement . . . I’m okay with it. Not getting tricked into running the hamster wheel for a pair of gloves and other apathetic rewards.

I know the difference between the carrot and the stick, thank you very much.

masterJP.5048:

Can anyone please tell me if this is intentional or a bug ?

While it’s not currently known if there was some deeper consideration behind the change, or not, the way it has been changed makes it clear it is not a bug.

What’s so “deep” about it?

“Oh well guys we made a nice map…but nobody cares about it anymore because we fixed the chest bug (completely removed any incentive to play that map instead of making a smarter change). What should we do now? we don’t have the funds to make a new map for the next 5 months”

“Don’t worry about it…give them a carrot(item) and make them suffer for it. It should populate the map and we get to scratch our balls more”

That’s kinda the “deep” thoughts that go into making an episode. I love how they always “change/fix” the things we like.
- We liked chests, they nerfed them so much most of us think it’s a waste of time and energy now.
- We liked the fact that we could get the new set items by playing the story, they again completely removed it and replaced it with even more grinding on top of the already existing grinding.

Ayrilana.1396:

Just wait for the next two living story episodes when you have two armor pieces available. That’s like 8,000 - 10,000 crests you’ll need to farm over those four weeks depending on whether one of each type is given as a freebie.

urgh....
Took me long enough to only collect 1,000 bandits crests... >.<’
I would like Anet to re-add this so people who are just like me, only want the Carapace armor.

This story is incredibly short compared to the last one so I’m sure they removed that option to get the glove this time to help keep SW area active.

Cyrrin.1230:

This story is incredibly short compared to the last one so I’m sure they removed that option to get the glove this time to help keep SW area active.

Both are about the same length.

But don’t we get a black lion key each time we complete it? I haven’t done it on an alt yet, but if that’s the case I"m happy with the trade off here.

I flew thru the story and got all the achievements much much faster this story.. maybe same for you but it wasn’t for me. Felt really short.

Yes Khani – you get a key per alt you run it on.

Cyrrin.1230:

I flew thru the story and got all the achievements much much faster this story.. maybe same for you but it wasn’t for me. Felt really short.

Yes Khani – you get a key per alt you run it on.

There were less time sinks in this episode than last but the gameplay portion was pretty much the same.

khani.4786:

But don’t we get a black lion key each time we complete it? I haven’t done it on an alt yet, but if that’s the case I"m happy with the trade off here.

Exactly… and once you’ve worked out how to kill the bosses quickly, its cheaper and takes about the same amount of time as a key farm run so it’s very much a win for alt-a-holics imo. Especially now that they’ve upped the drop rate of scraps in the last few months.

Personally I’m relieved that they’ve taken then gloves off the mission reward. Yes I’ve played last weeks story on 3 chars and got all the achievs so I can get the Luminescent skin but it’s still a lot of work to get the full set – a big commitment from me. I don’t want to do that if everyone is going to end up with the skins as well. The harder it is the less people will have it, and that’s a good thing for me. At the end of the day you’ve got to work hard to get nice things

Hmm, I can’t really say much about that issue since it doesn’t bother me at all. I got my first gloves after the story, I bought the second with crests I saved from the previous part and the third one I got from digging up bandit chests.
Not to forget the fact that you can also get them as a reward during the breach and from the pvp reward track.

I do understand that some people can’t/don’t want to spend too much time on getting the gloves, but really, if they kept it so that alts can earn the gloves too, everyone would have all three of them within 2 hours. And 2 hours of doing the story, compared to collecting 2k crests or doing the reward track, does seem a little bit too fast and easy.

Ayrilana.1396:

Cyrrin.1230:

I flew thru the story and got all the achievements much much faster this story.. maybe same for you but it wasn’t for me. Felt really short.

Yes Khani – you get a key per alt you run it on.

There were less time sinks in this episode than last but the gameplay portion was pretty much the same.

Speaking of which, here’s me:

Me: Oh, look, a key. Whoopee. Always get the same old un-fun junk. (uses key) Wait! What’s this? Something different! A ‘deathly dye kit’. Cool! Wait. 1 in 6 chance for an ‘exclusive’ dye. Oh. Chance, huh. Yeah. (double clicks) Oh, look. Tang dye. Wow. Not only is it not ‘exclusive’, I already have it. Whoopee. Good thing this was a free key, huh.

Still, here I am thinking of playing through it again on my mesmer, which is the one I usually do these things with, but due to the extra-mesmery ‘fun’ of the last chapter I decided to do this one with my NPE ele instead, who, even without a full load of traits usually does okay, but then she got pulled and pushed and gassed and chucked hither and yon and clobbered a couple of times for no apparent reason, so…

Meh. Might as well, can’t dance. Freaky, huh.

Freaky. Free key. Get it? Huh, huh?

Jimmy JimBob.2801:

khani.4786:

But don’t we get a black lion key each time we complete it? I haven’t done it on an alt yet, but if that’s the case I"m happy with the trade off here.

Exactly… and once you’ve worked out how to kill the bosses quickly, its cheaper and takes about the same amount of time as a key farm run so it’s very much a win for alt-a-holics imo. Especially now that they’ve upped the drop rate of scraps in the last few months.

Personally I’m relieved that they’ve taken then gloves off the mission reward. Yes I’ve played last weeks story on 3 chars and got all the achievs so I can get the Luminescent skin but it’s still a lot of work to get the full set – a big commitment from me. I don’t want to do that if everyone is going to end up with the skins as well. The harder it is the less people will have it, and that’s a good thing for me. At the end of the day you’ve got to work hard to get nice things

Meh. As far as I’m aware, you can still farm keys much quicker the old way and the cost should still be at break even depending in what you craft. I did key farms over the summer and managed to actually make a profit from the crafting portion of the key farm.

If they want people on their map, maybe they should start by allowing the mobs to loot in the events…
No loot but the reward at the end of event (5 tokens, and sand!) , great! no T6 mat in a lvl 80 zone, so motivating…

Ayrilana.1396:

Jimmy JimBob.2801:

khani.4786:

But don’t we get a black lion key each time we complete it? I haven’t done it on an alt yet, but if that’s the case I"m happy with the trade off here.

Exactly… and once you’ve worked out how to kill the bosses quickly, its cheaper and takes about the same amount of time as a key farm run so it’s very much a win for alt-a-holics imo. Especially now that they’ve upped the drop rate of scraps in the last few months.

Personally I’m relieved that they’ve taken then gloves off the mission reward. Yes I’ve played last weeks story on 3 chars and got all the achievs so I can get the Luminescent skin but it’s still a lot of work to get the full set – a big commitment from me. I don’t want to do that if everyone is going to end up with the skins as well. The harder it is the less people will have it, and that’s a good thing for me. At the end of the day you’ve got to work hard to get nice things

Meh. As far as I’m aware, you can still farm keys much quicker the old way and the cost should still be at break even depending in what you craft. I did key farms over the summer and managed to actually make a profit from the crafting portion of the key farm.

Either way it’s still about knowing what to craft and how to do the run as fast as possible. Essentially the same here but without the crafting component. The only downside is this is only repeatable once per toon but it’s still a big reward for altaholics. Even more so I’d say seeing as this gives people a reason to play the story through more than just 3 times.

Phew, I am so happy that armor is looking so crappy. I got best looking part of it what was that shoulder piece. Otherwise that armor is not worth to hunt those scraps.

I am dissapointed tho, that Anet decide to put this armor piece behind of the first achievement. It is like facepalm to those players who wanted all armor classes. Maybe they wanted to check out who is really so desperate to get those armor pieces by grinding.

DragonflyDusk.6582:

Relshdan.6854:

no way it’s a bug. and it doesn’t really bother me.

they “threw us a bone” by letting alts get the skins in ep1 (a nice way to get the your collection going)…..but if this practice continued all the way through, the zone would be pretty dead as soon as the last installment ended. these episodes take so little time to complete.

you get one full set by playing the LS (a few hours of gameplay)….you get the rest by playing the map (it’s only a grind if you make it one and “need” to have all skins quickly). you can argue the cost in crests is too high (i’d agree and probably halve the total)…but the fact that it isn’t available only through rng is more important to me.

The other simple solution to keep the area active would have been to make the Pact Fleet weapons available through Silverwastes.

Yeah, too bad Anet didn’t do it that way. Would have made more sense. Woulda kept people playing the zone more than the carapace.

I am so sick with grinding. finish all the achievement in less than 3 hrs minus uber grind for the crappy armor glow, not gona bother, not worth my time. now back to play other games. see you in 2 weeks. fix your kitten cheesy story while you’re at it.

Jimmy JimBob.2801:

Personally I’m relieved that they’ve taken then gloves off the mission reward. Yes I’ve played last weeks story on 3 chars and got all the achievs so I can get the Luminescent skin but it’s still a lot of work to get the full set – a big commitment from me. I don’t want to do that if everyone is going to end up with the skins as well. The harder it is the less people will have it, and that’s a good thing for me. At the end of the day you’ve got to work hard to get nice things

Selfish kittens like you are why we can’t have nice things.

Invictus.1503:

Egon Vidar.9125:

Before I knew how to make the Luminescent shoulders, I made the horrifying mistake of unlocking the skin and then deleting the medium shoulders… ugh.

That doesn’t matter, you’re still good. All you need is to unlock the skin as it is a collection reward.

And that really should have been obvious to me but I’m just brilliant. Thank you!

After some reflection last night (and trying out the new content), I now believe the inconsistent acquisition methods for the Carapace armor was intended, for the following reasons:

1. Having the players “re-farm” the Silverwastes and the Breach bosses is a way of prolonging player interest and map longevity, as others have said.

2. There are actually lots of ways of acquiring the Gloves:

- You get 1 from completing the Tangled Paths LS chapter
- You can earn 1 from completing the (non-repeatable) Silverwastes PvP reward track
- You can buy 1 from the Bandit Crest Merchants for 1g + 1000 Crests
- Glove chests are a rare drop from the Greater Nightmare Pod, and also from Lost Bandit Chests (rumors say that they can also drop from the Lesser Nightmare Pods, but at a much lower rate than from the Greater Pod)

Furthermore, the new Labyrinth actually helps speed up acquisition of Bandit Crests. You get more Crests each time the Labyrinth tiers go up, which means an additional ~50 Crests if you’re in a populated map with lots of people grabbing the Lesser Pods. This increases the average number of Crests you can earn within a single round of SW.

You can furthermore speed this up by constantly taxiing to different SW instances that are at their Breach/Labyrinth phase. I managed to earn a stack of Crests in about a little over an hour, which means I could conceivably farm up the 1000 I need within a single day. (I plan on doing the PvP reward track for the 3rd.)

3. I have a suspicion that ANet is once again tying the LS into the different game modes to encourage players to return and populate different parts of the game. I fully expect some of the subsequent armor pieces to require participation in WvW (Badges of Honor. I suspect that this will be the Chest/Leggings piece, and it will require a big sink of Badges), Fractals (Fractal Relics or Pristine Relics) and possibly dungeons/JP’s.

All that said, I still would have preferred if alts could have gotten the Gloves per run. :P I can now understand why it was done, but I’d still have liked more options.

DragonflyDusk.6582:

Relshdan.6854:

no way it’s a bug. and it doesn’t really bother me.

they “threw us a bone” by letting alts get the skins in ep1 (a nice way to get the your collection going)…..but if this practice continued all the way through, the zone would be pretty dead as soon as the last installment ended. these episodes take so little time to complete.

you get one full set by playing the LS (a few hours of gameplay)….you get the rest by playing the map (it’s only a grind if you make it one and “need” to have all skins quickly). you can argue the cost in crests is too high (i’d agree and probably halve the total)…but the fact that it isn’t available only through rng is more important to me.

The other simple solution to keep the area active would have been to make the Pact Fleet weapons available through Silverwastes.

they make RL money from skins (more than anything else)…….be glad both armor and weapon skins weren’t tied to gem store BL keys.

My opinion: This is not about encouraging players to stay in the map and actually do the events. The reward from them is good enough on its own (finally!) and we do not need any more of this so called encouragement. This is more about forcing players to do the events, because Anet apparently didn’t spend much time preparing the story instances and achievements for this chapter, so they decided to tell the players… “repeat the map ten or twenty more times, that should keep you busy for at least the time you expect from living story updates”.
As for me, I’d prefer one more story instance and a few challenging achievements tied to that rather than more mindless zerg grind. Time I spend in the game will be the same, it’s just I will have a lot more fun.

Remember, this game is not about grind. Now go and collect 2000 bandit crests, you may as well prepare 8000 more of them for future needs. I was very upset by that.
Definitely wrong choice on your side Anet, I am really hoping you will return to the old system with the next update(s).

You can get the chests as loot though.

Tarasicodissa.7084:

Remember, this game is not about grind. Now go and collect 2000 bandit crests, you may as well prepare 8000 more of them for future needs. I was very upset by that.

And then we get a new map with new currencies. Only reason why I’m hesitating on farming the rest.

Ameepa.6793:

I got around 1k crests per day even before this “grind”. I like the zone.

Quoting myself! Yesterday I made around 3k crests as side product while playing the zone for labyrint and chests and other loot.

It does not take that long. I would not call anything a huge grind if it can be done in few hours.

Ameepa.6793:

Ameepa.6793:

I got around 1k crests per day even before this “grind”. I like the zone.

Quoting myself! Yesterday I made around 3k crests as side product while playing the zone for labyrint and chests and other loot.

It does not take that long. I would not call anything a huge grind if it can be done in few hours.

Everyone has a different opinion. But to me, that maze of bumping into dogs and mindless chest farming, mob farming in SW is 99.9% grind… And what’s a few hours? Did you really time yourself? The only way you going to get fast chests is do a constant search for “Breach” and hop over there and repeat itself many times. Either way, it shows the creativity of Anet’s devlopers to find a way to buy time in a almost dead zone?

Zomaarwat.3912:

You can get the chests as loot though.

Yes. As well as precursors. Wouldn’t count on either, though.

SleepingDragon.1596:

Ameepa.6793:

Ameepa.6793:

I got around 1k crests per day even before this “grind”. I like the zone.

Quoting myself! Yesterday I made around 3k crests as side product while playing the zone for labyrint and chests and other loot.

It does not take that long. I would not call anything a huge grind if it can be done in few hours.

Everyone has a different opinion. But to me, that maze of bumping into dogs and mindless chest farming, mob farming in SW is 99.9% grind… And what’s a few hours? Did you really time yourself? The only way you going to get fast chests is do a constant search for “Breach” and hop over there and repeat itself many times. Either way, it shows the creativity of Anet’s devlopers to find a way to buy time in a almost dead zone?

No not really timed, but I was there around 6-7 hours. Did not hop around, did the whole rounds mostly in same map like it is supposed to be done, no dedicated chest hunting, looted them if I saw one. Events give more crests than chests btw.

So that is approximately 2-3 hours per 1k crests if you do the zone like it is ment to be done.

Jimmy JimBob.2801:

The harder it is the less people will have it, and that’s a good thing for me. At the end of the day you’ve got to work hard to get nice things

Farming chests/crests for this is not hard, it is just time consuming and boring (at least for me), which for me is the definition of: Grinding.

With the last patch, even Caiths Blossom can now be bought with crests, so you really do not need to achieve anything for this … you just need to grind.

Greetings

Zok.4956:

With the last patch, even Caiths Blossom can now be bought with crests, so you really do not need to achieve anything for this … you just need to grind.

Is it actually unlocked for everyone, or only for those that got it from completing the achievement to get it? This may be only unlocked after you get one of them for achievement, so that people can get second one for their alts.

Dude, I know. This sucks. Completely ruined my experience.

Well, the map is fun and all that, but 2000 crests is stretching it. I might get these in time doing SW once in a while, but if it’s the same or a similar grind for the next pieces I will pretend luminescent doesn’t exist. A bit disappointing it took this turn, was looking forward to the scavenge hunt.

archmag.1259:

Zok.4956:

With the last patch, even Caiths Blossom can now be bought with crests, so you really do not need to achieve anything for this … you just need to grind.

Is it actually unlocked for everyone, or only for those that got it from completing the achievement to get it? This may be only unlocked after you get one of them for achievement, so that people can get second one for their alts.

Well, I have the achievement but I saw it at the npc-merchant not before the last patch, so I assumed it is one of the items that were added with the last patch for everyone. Maybe someone without the achievement should go to the merchant in SW and look it up.

Greetings.

Zok.4956:

archmag.1259:

Zok.4956:

With the last patch, even Caiths Blossom can now be bought with crests, so you really do not need to achieve anything for this … you just need to grind.

Is it actually unlocked for everyone, or only for those that got it from completing the achievement to get it? This may be only unlocked after you get one of them for achievement, so that people can get second one for their alts.

Well, I have the achievement but I saw it at the npc-merchant not before the last patch, so I assumed it is one of the items that were added with the last patch for everyone. Maybe someone without the achievement should go to the merchant in SW and look it up.

Greetings.

If you mean the priory historian [bandit crest collector] guy at Camp Resolve, I just checked and he doesn’t have it. I also don’t have the achievement.

Tachenon.5270:

Zok.4956:

archmag.1259:

Zok.4956:

With the last patch, even Caiths Blossom can now be bought with crests, so you really do not need to achieve anything for this … you just need to grind.

Is it actually unlocked for everyone, or only for those that got it from completing the achievement to get it? This may be only unlocked after you get one of them for achievement, so that people can get second one for their alts.

Well, I have the achievement but I saw it at the npc-merchant not before the last patch, so I assumed it is one of the items that were added with the last patch for everyone. Maybe someone without the achievement should go to the merchant in SW and look it up.

Greetings.

If you mean the priory historian [bandit crest collector] guy at Camp Resolve, I just checked and he doesn’t have it. I also don’t have the achievement.

Yep, I meant him. It seems then it is only available for players that already have the achievement.

Greetings.

Galespark.7835:

Well, the map is fun and all that, but 2000 crests is stretching it. I might get these in time doing SW once in a while, but if it’s the same or a similar grind for the next pieces I will pretend luminescent doesn’t exist. A bit disappointing it took this turn, was looking forward to the scavenge hunt.

Keep in mind that if this is the way they will go forward, all the other armor pieces will need the same grind. So it’s not 2,000 badges for completion, it’s 10,000.

Hyper Cutter.9376:

Selfish kittens like you are why we can’t have nice things.

Do you complain about having to grind to get a legendary weapon? What about Ascended gear? Or the T3 cultural armour back before 120 gold was difficult to make. Likewise commander tags.

To get end game gear/skins you have to work hard, and that usually involves a bit of a grind. That’s the way it’s always been in MMOs and the way it always will be. Otherwise everyone would have them and they lose their appeal.

If you want to have nice things, do the work. At least you’ll have a warm feeling for a while about your achievement.

Zok.4956:

Farming chests/crests for this is not hard, it is just time consuming and boring (at least for me), which for me is the definition of: Grinding.

With the last patch, even Caiths Blossom can now be bought with crests, so you really do not need to achieve anything for this … you just need to grind.

Greetings

True, true. I more meant hard as in “hard work” as in time consuming, rather than difficulty. I too find grinding pretty boring, but at least for me I enjoy the mechanics of the SW and it’s a pretty nice way to kill a few hours with a couple of guildies while chatting about the weather on VoIP.

It’s a shame that they added a separate way to get Caithe’s Blossom other than completing the achievs… it also detracts from the uniqueness of that item Maybe it’s for people who want to have more than one ascended Sinister set rather than the Luminescent skin. I mean surely the achievs is still the fastest way?

Jimmy JimBob.2801:

Do you complain about having to grind to get a legendary weapon?

Are you seriously comparing an aesthetic for-fun armor skin with a legendary?

To get end game gear/skins you have to work hard, and that usually involves a bit of a grind. That’s the way it’s always been in MMOs and the way it always will be.

I distinctly remember playing well-populated MMOs that didn’t have these grinds. It’s definitely not ‘how it always was’, and I very much hope it is not ‘how it always will be’, since grinds are by definition boring and repetitive. Especially when the reward is in no way proportionate to the effort.

And also: I play games to have FUN, not to “work hard”.

Broom.2561:

Jimmy JimBob.2801:

Do you complain about having to grind to get a legendary weapon?

Are you seriously comparing an aesthetic for-fun armor skin with a legendary?

To get end game gear/skins you have to work hard, and that usually involves a bit of a grind. That’s the way it’s always been in MMOs and the way it always will be.

I distinctly remember playing well-populated MMOs that didn’t have these grinds. It’s definitely not ‘how it always was’, and I very much hope it is not ‘how it always will be’, since grinds are by definition boring and repetitive. Especially when the reward is in no way proportionate to the effort.

And also: I play games to have FUN, not to “work hard”.

There are lots of other nice armour skins available if you don’t want to grind out this skin then. Hell the carapace skins are nice in themselves. If you don’t have time or the patience to grind out a skin like that then fine don’t. Noones making you. That doesn’t mean those that want to shouldn’t be able to have a nice and pretty rare armour skin.

And yes what else are Legendaries other than a fun aesthetic weapon? Apart from being able to swap out stat sets, which i’ve never used on my own legendary it has no other benefit. It’s just a nice looking ascended weapon.

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. If you make it too easy to get everyone will have it and then it’s no longer worth having.

Jimmy JimBob.2801:

Broom.2561:

Jimmy JimBob.2801:

Do you complain about having to grind to get a legendary weapon?

Are you seriously comparing an aesthetic for-fun armor skin with a legendary?

To get end game gear/skins you have to work hard, and that usually involves a bit of a grind. That’s the way it’s always been in MMOs and the way it always will be.

I distinctly remember playing well-populated MMOs that didn’t have these grinds. It’s definitely not ‘how it always was’, and I very much hope it is not ‘how it always will be’, since grinds are by definition boring and repetitive. Especially when the reward is in no way proportionate to the effort.

And also: I play games to have FUN, not to “work hard”.

There are lots of other nice armour skins available if you don’t want to grind out this skin then. Hell the carapace skins are nice in themselves. If you don’t have time or the patience to grind out a skin like that then fine don’t. Noones making you. That doesn’t mean those that want to shouldn’t be able to have a nice and pretty rare armour skin.

And yes what else are Legendaries other than a fun aesthetic weapon? Apart from being able to swap out stat sets, which i’ve never used on my own legendary it has no other benefit. It’s just a nice looking ascended weapon.

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. If you make it too easy to get everyone will have it and then it’s no longer worth having.

Who ever said I was going to even try under these circumstances? I’m someone who liked to play the story line on all my alts, partly from curiosity about how other classes perform and partly and unashamedly for the loot. Loot’s not worth it now, and I neither have the time nor the inclination to go running around following a zerg for days on end. Which means a lot less incentive to play this game, which in turn would rather indicate it’s bad game design, since I’m quite sure from the reactions I’ve seen that I’m not the only one who feels this way.

And incidentally, I completely disagree with the notion that things are only interesting if only a select few can have them. That’s an elitist attitude I can really do without, ESPECIALLY in a game that was once intended to be as casual friendly as possible. I’d much rather see all players able to achieve goals like this through diverse means, so all styles of gameplay are rewarded.

As to legendaries: actually, as someone who enjoys killing other players in world PVP, I rather disagree that these legendaries are just aesthetic. The stat difference between legendary/ascended and exotics may not be huge, but it’s definitely there, and differences like that DO count. Given the same player skills, the better stats WILL win.