Guild Wars 2

It makes no since to me who the hell is she?
stop talking about her and things she did like i am suppose to know what it is
i was not hear for season 1 story so stop making the story revolve around this person
every single new player is lost and confused about these parts of the story
Not sure if i will get the expansion since i wont know any thing about SCARLET AGAIN

So add season 1 back or make a short movie about it be for the expansion or something
to bridge this gab of story telling from new and old players

ATM if you are new it’s like only being able to watch part 1 and 3 of a trilogy

In a nutshell, she was the first Sylvari, that we know of, to be influenced by Mordremoth. She went a bit batkitten crazy, destroyed Lion’s Arch, and then woke up the dragon. That’s really all that you need to know.

Check out the wiki: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Scarlet

And, welcome to GW2!

But she’s kind of important to the story… :/ You wouldn’t remove Saruman from LotR would you?

While poorly worded, the original concern is a valid one. A new player would have played through PS (introduces you to Pact, and Trahearne), then you suddenly dropped into S2 which talks about the fallout of Scarlet’s invasion. The game also assumes you know your team at least to some extend (and talks about the consequences of their actions during S1).

Having played through S1 myself, I can easily see how a newer player would get horribly lost. Just sitting in Silverwastes listening to people ask ‘what is the Marionette people keep talking about’ can really drive the point home.

I hope they will add some sort of ‘into’ cinematic for the players starting S2 who never played S1. It need not be a large one, but a few slides that recap the story of how you met your team and defeated Scarlet would be very useful.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Living_World_season_1

and the TLDR summary Videos:
http://youtu.be/BYtbtcV78SI
http://youtu.be/ckEsGyYHRFY?t=44s

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/releases/

If only we could retcon her out of existence. If only.

Nilkemia.8507:

If only we could retcon her out of existence. If only.

It’d be better if she was just FIXED. She could have actually, really worked . . . if it weren’t for the uneven nature of LS1

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Nilkemia.8507:

If only we could retcon her out of existence. If only.

It’d be better if she was just FIXED. She could have actually, really worked . . . if it weren’t for the uneven nature of LS1

No. She was broken lore staining filth from the beginning. And I consider the Sylvari my second favorite race (a close second to asura).

- Studying for all three asuran colleges at the same time? Check.

- Joining the Inquest when they consider sylvari little more than kindling? (Zojja’s words, not mine) Check.

- Creating lore-ignoring alliances whose factions had no reason to work together? Check.

- Being behind the Thaumanova disaster? Check.

- Being able to know things that only certain characters know, with no explanation as to how she knows them? Check.

And much more that I can’t/don’t feel like thinking of right now.

The only part of her legacy that people won’t frown upon is the various Black Lion ticket skins and gemstore items that came about as a result of her or her alliance forces. That’s it.

They could’ve found a way to use Faolain, or the Sinister Triad, or any of the remaining existing villains they had to cause all the chaos she did. They probably would’ve been less annoying to listen to as well.

Edit: They could’ve even brought Kudu back from the dead and he’d have been a better villain!

The Scarlet storyline was not my favorite and I’m not especially fond of the character, but trying to retcon her out of the story after the fact wouldn’t make sense. It would create more plotholes than it would fix.

As time passes and we get further away from that storyline, I think mentions of it will just naturally diminish and the problem of new player confusion will solve itself. It’ll become just one backstory element that not everything new hinges on.

Sadly, the damage has been done. And it seems like they’re not stopping anytime soon.

Nilkemia.8507:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Nilkemia.8507:

If only we could retcon her out of existence. If only.

It’d be better if she was just FIXED. She could have actually, really worked . . . if it weren’t for the uneven nature of LS1

No. She was broken lore staining filth from the beginning. And I consider the Sylvari my second favorite race (a close second to asura).

- Studying for all three asuran colleges at the same time? Check.

Dropped, since it was later said she studied them in sequence, not enrolling in each and doing them simultaneously.

- Joining the Inquest when they consider sylvari little more than kindling? (Zojja’s words, not mine) Check.

And plotted to be a guinea pig for the machine we find later? Uncheck.

- Creating lore-ignoring alliances whose factions had no reason to work together? Check.

Do you mean the Aetherblades, who pretty much have reasons to work together? Or the Molten Alliance, which was preying on their weakness and adding a dash of deceit? Or the Clockwork/Steam alliance which . . .

Oh, no, you probably mean Toxic Alliance. Which depends, since the only slice of potential motivation? Is of questionable value canonicity if you want to be persnickety.

- Being behind the Thaumanova disaster? Check.

Was she behind it, or merely present at the time and going “I told you so”? I still haven’t been able to get into the Fractal for that.

- Being able to know things that only certain characters know, with no explanation as to how she knows them? Check.

You should start a list, because I’m fairly certain with what we can glean she has ways of knowing things now.

Edit: They could’ve even brought Kudu back from the dead and he’d have been a better villain!

. . . no. No, he was just terrible. A smug little snake in over his head and not realizing it at all.

I don’t know, topics like this make me all the more eager to see Anet get more zanny with the characters in question just to watch people suffer.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Dropped, since it was later said she studied them in sequence, not enrolling in each and doing them simultaneously.

They backpedaled a bit because even they realized how absurd that notion was.

And plotted to be a guinea pig for the machine we find later? Uncheck.

That was Omadd, not the Inquest. And as we’ve learned, she pretty much went along with it anyway, despite being warned by him on how dangerous it was.

Do you mean the Aetherblades, who pretty much have reasons to work together? Or the Molten Alliance, which was preying on their weakness and adding a dash of deceit? Or the Clockwork/Steam alliance which . . .

Oh, no, you probably mean Toxic Alliance. Which depends, since the only slice of potential motivation? Is of questionable value canonicity if you want to be persnickety.

The Flame Legion are a group of magic using charr who enslaved the others in the past, and also hate females (they’re apparently the reason we saw no female charr in the first Guild Wars). There was no reason for them to listen to a female sylvari. They’d try to burn her alive on sight.

Same with the dredge. Most of them are xenophobic, and after being manipulated by the Inquest, you’d think they’d be very very hesitant to even consider siding up with anyone else again—-let alone charr shamans who enslaved their own kind in the past.

It’s not even clear if these were the dredge we helped in Sorrow’s Embrace, or remnants of the ones we forced out of power, or just different ones entirely.

The Aetherblades are just pirates given Inquest tech to play with—which they really didn’t need to, since they were already dealing with the bandits and Nightmare Court as part of the Sinister Triad (which they could’ve just as easily used). And from what little we see of the Aetherblades, their motivation is basically summed up as “We’re scared of her”. Pitiful.

There was a Youtube video by someone theorizing that the Aetherblades were dead people resurrected by Scarlet via watchwork tech, which would explain plenty, but we never find out anything more about the Aetherblades, and eventually they go to the Edge of the Mists to never have any importance again.

And the Toxic Alliance…krait consider themselves superior to everyone else, and part of Cadeyrn’s disgruntlement leading to the Nightmare Court’s founding was that Niamh decided not to kill krait hatchlings they found, stating they had the right to grow, in the hope they might change their ways (highly unlikely, given what we know of the krait). Although, that probably doesn’t matter since Faolain’s in charge and Cadeyrn’s dead now…and they did dodge a bullet by saying in-game that it was a splinter faction of the Court.

Was she behind it, or merely present at the time and going “I told you so”? I still haven’t been able to get into the Fractal for that.

A little bit of both. She was apparently a “special consultant”, as two Inquest near the start refer to her. It’s not clear what she did for them there beyond that, but near the end she shows up and monologues about how they screwed it up and that her job here is done, implying she did have a hand in what happened.

You should start a list, because I’m fairly certain with what we can glean she has ways of knowing things now.

Well, even a “Mordremoth gave her mind reading powers/plot knowledge” might’ve sufficed.

. . . no. No, he was just terrible. A smug little snake in over his head and not realizing it at all.

He figured out how to control dragon minions, something the Inquest put to use later in Arah. He beat Scarlet to manipulating the dredge first, and unlike with her, we actually see how he managed to do it. And he at least wasn’t annoying to listen to.

If Kudu’s terrible, then Scarlet is trash. Oh wait…she already is.

Zania.8461:

While poorly worded, the original concern is a valid one. A new player would have played through PS (introduces you to Pact, and Trahearne), then you suddenly dropped into S2 which talks about the fallout of Scarlet’s invasion. The game also assumes you know your team at least to some extend (and talks about the consequences of their actions during S1).

Having played through S1 myself, I can easily see how a newer player would get horribly lost. Just sitting in Silverwastes listening to people ask ‘what is the Marionette people keep talking about’ can really drive the point home.

I hope they will add some sort of ‘into’ cinematic for the players starting S2 who never played S1. It need not be a large one, but a few slides that recap the story of how you met your team and defeated Scarlet would be very useful.

I have to agree, 100%

Anet wants new players (and players who have not played in a while). LS2 and even HoT came about because of Scarlet.
Like it or not, she is a major part of the Lore now.
It just does not make sense to play through the battle of Arah, kill Zhiatan, and then jump to LS2 with little/no back-story into the events (and NPC’s) that were introduced in LS1.
I’m glad I’ve been here from the beginning, because I just don’t think I could process that Huge Gap in the story.
I feel bad for new players.

Nilkemia.8507:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Dropped, since it was later said she studied them in sequence, not enrolling in each and doing them simultaneously.

They backpedaled a bit because even they realized how absurd that notion was.

So why bring it up at all if they backpedaled and “fixed” it?

The Flame Legion are a group of magic using charr who enslaved the others in the past, and also hate females (they’re apparently the reason we saw no female charr in the first Guild Wars). There was no reason for them to listen to a female sylvari. They’d try to burn her alive on sight.

Same with the dredge. Most of them are xenophobic, and after being manipulated by the Inquest, you’d think they’d be very very hesitant to even consider siding up with anyone else again—-let alone charr shamans who enslaved their own kind in the past.

And in both cases, demonstrably, you’d be wrong. It’s also worth noting it wasn’t the entire dredge or Flame Legion which dropped everything and joined up – just enough to become a threat.

The Aetherblades are just pirates given Inquest tech to play with—which they really didn’t need to, since they were already dealing with the bandits and Nightmare Court as part of the Sinister Triad (which they could’ve just as easily used). And from what little we see of the Aetherblades, their motivation is basically summed up as “We’re scared of her”. Pitiful.

Not quite true, but hey, why bother looking too hard at it? Mai Trin was leading them, and she was working for Scarlet directly until she got captured. After that, the next time we see them Scarlet is basically leading directly through threats of force. Given this happened shortly after we watch her pull off the bit with Twisted Watchwork? Believable.

And the Toxic Alliance…krait consider themselves superior to everyone else, and part of Cadeyrn’s disgruntlement leading to the Nightmare Court’s founding was that Niamh decided not to kill krait hatchlings they found, stating they had the right to grow, in the hope they might change their ways (highly unlikely, given what we know of the krait). Although, that probably doesn’t matter since Faolain’s in charge and Cadeyrn’s dead now…and they did dodge a bullet by saying in-game that it was a splinter faction of the Court.

They’re all basically splinter factions. That’s kind of the point.

A little bit of both. She was apparently a “special consultant”, as two Inquest near the start refer to her. It’s not clear what she did for them there beyond that, but near the end she shows up and monologues about how they screwed it up and that her job here is done, implying she did have a hand in what happened.

Or just being her quirky sarcastic self.

Well, even a “Mordremoth gave her mind reading powers/plot knowledge” might’ve sufficed.

Which couldn’t have been used since “Mordremoth” hadn’t been officially revealed as an entity yet. But even better, doesn’t need to be that – she went into the machine and had a vision; we don’t know if our vision was the same.

He figured out how to control dragon minions, something the Inquest put to use later in Arah. He beat Scarlet to manipulating the dredge first, and unlike with her, we actually see how he managed to do it. And he at least wasn’t annoying to listen to.

He also figured out how to mix corruptions but was stupid enough to experiment on himself. And he was annoying to deal with, especially with that personal teleporter he had so he could keep escaping points where he should have been nailed to the nearest wall with a spear through the head.

. . . something Scarlet did repeatedly. Which is why I say he is terrible.

Zania.8461:

While poorly worded, the original concern is a valid one. A new player would have played through PS (introduces you to Pact, and Trahearne), then you suddenly dropped into S2 which talks about the fallout of Scarlet’s invasion. The game also assumes you know your team at least to some extend (and talks about the consequences of their actions during S1).

Having played through S1 myself, I can easily see how a newer player would get horribly lost. Just sitting in Silverwastes listening to people ask ‘what is the Marionette people keep talking about’ can really drive the point home.

I hope they will add some sort of ‘into’ cinematic for the players starting S2 who never played S1. It need not be a large one, but a few slides that recap the story of how you met your team and defeated Scarlet would be very useful.

Yes! The idea of an intro cinematic is excellent, especially if it also introduced you to your team! I’d love to see the Tower of Nightmares fall and the defeat of the clockwork marionette in the Shiverpeaks. But please don’t remove Scarlet.

I’m a new player also, been bumbling around Tyria for about 6 months and I understand the OPs confusion. But I like that confusion personally! It’s like moving to a new city and getting to learn all about the new neighbors, the new politics, discover new locations. It’s a challenge at first but eventually bits and pieces are filled in until you feel comfortable. When characters mentioned something that I hadn’t heard of I just consulted the great god Wiki (she’s actually an aspect of Kormir) and found out all about it.

I do have to agree that it is weird coming into the S2 storyline the first time with Braham, Kas, Jory, Rox and Taimi talking to you about things you have no way of knowing. Since that first time though I’ve learned a lot more and the second play through was more enjoyable.

One of the things I love about this game is the depth of the storyline/lore.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Nilkemia.8507:

If only we could retcon her out of existence. If only.

It’d be better if she was just FIXED. She could have actually, really worked . . . if it weren’t for the uneven nature of LS1

If by “fixed” you mean “completely change her backstory and change how she created the alliances” then sure, it could work. But that would be changing almost everything about her except “sylvari genius corrupted by Mordremoth” really.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

So why bring it up at all if they backpedaled and “fixed” it?

Because fixing something doesn’t change that they screwed up, nor does it mean I should ignore it afterwards.

And in both cases, demonstrably, you’d be wrong. It’s also worth noting it wasn’t the entire dredge or Flame Legion which dropped everything and joined up – just enough to become a threat.

Feel free to show evidence where the dredge were willing to work with others outside of the dredge that we help in Sorrows Embrace or the rebellion up in Frostgorge Sound, or the ones that were manipulated

Same with the Flame Legion regarding females, please.

Not quite true, but hey, why bother looking too hard at it? Mai Trin was leading them, and she was working for Scarlet directly until she got captured. After that, the next time we see them Scarlet is basically leading directly through threats of force. Given this happened shortly after we watch her pull off the bit with Twisted Watchwork? Believable.

“Do you like my Aetherblades? They work for me, you know. Because…they like living.”

And as for Mai Trin and/or the other higher ups, we never get any real glimpse to their motivations for working for her either. For the grunts though, it is basically “we’re scared of her.”

Which couldn’t have been used since “Mordremoth” hadn’t been officially revealed as an entity yet. But even better, doesn’t need to be that – she went into the machine and had a vision; we don’t know if our vision was the same.

So this vision also showed Caithe’s (utterly stupid) secret, and what our player characters did in their second story arcs? How convenient.

He also figured out how to mix corruptions but was stupid enough to experiment on himself. And he was annoying to deal with, especially with that personal teleporter he had so he could keep escaping points where he should have been nailed to the nearest wall with a spear through the head.

. . . something Scarlet did repeatedly. Which is why I say he is terrible.

It’s not stupid if he succeeded—something they don’t elaborate on later. He could’ve still had free will, or could’ve been being manipulated by the dragons at that, which could’ve explained why he didn’t just teleport out of there for that last fight too.

Scarlet also experimented on herself with Omadd’s mind-opening device too. And look how that turned out.

Oh, and Kudu only uses that personal teleporter a grand total of 3 times in the entire story, whereas Scarlet abused it like it was going out of style.

So she should be even more annoying to you by that logic.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Nilkemia.8507:

If only we could retcon her out of existence. If only.

It’d be better if she was just FIXED. She could have actually, really worked . . . if it weren’t for the uneven nature of LS1

If by “fixed” you mean “completely change her backstory and change how she created the alliances” then sure, it could work. But that would be changing almost everything about her except “sylvari genius corrupted by Mordremoth” really.

Fixed as in her introduction handled better, the quirkiness at the start toned down (like they did later on) so she didn’t come off as she did in the first release she appeared in.

I certainly noticed most people never forgave that introduction and didn’t seem to get past it. Introduce her better and lay better groundwork and it would work fine.

Nilkemia.8507:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

So why bring it up at all if they backpedaled and “fixed” it?

Because fixing something doesn’t change that they screwed up, nor does it mean I should ignore it afterwards.

Yes, you should. If her lore was changed to fix that, it was always like that. That’s how retcons work. The original material doesn’t matter anymore.

Feel free to show evidence where the dredge were willing to work with others outside of the dredge that we help in Sorrows Embrace or the rebellion up in Frostgorge Sound, or the ones that were manipulated

For the entire history of dredge and outsiders, or just within your target area so you can keep your point?

Same with the Flame Legion regarding females, please.

You mean, willing to talk with them and use them instead of your implication of “they don’t exist to us”? The Flame Legion isn’t the Sons of Svanir who basically tell every female norn to go drown themselves – they have uses for females, even if they fit a narrow band.

Taking advice from one and claiming it was their own idea all along? Fits with their modus operandi anyway.

“Do you like my Aetherblades? They work for me, you know. Because…they like living.”

Note this is after Mai Trin was in jail and out of command. So . . . yeah. Timing.

And as for Mai Trin and/or the other higher ups, we never get any real glimpse to their motivations for working for her either. For the grunts though, it is basically “we’re scared of her.”

Should they not be?

So this vision also showed Caithe’s (utterly stupid) secret, and what our player characters did in their second story arcs? How convenient.

Convenient is written all over the plotline everywhere in the game. All the time it’s wonderfully convenient our characters are in the place where they’re needed most so they can step in and act. All the time it’s wonderfully convenient how someone knows some little detail which can help us in a problem, or they know where to go find it. This isn’t just a Scarlet thing, this is a writing thing.

And it’s not just a GuildWars 2 thing either. Convenient coincidence is grease writers need to use so their plot doesn’t grind to a halt. It shows up in every piece of writing if you look hard enough.

It’s not stupid if he succeeded—something they don’t elaborate on later. He could’ve still had free will, or could’ve been being manipulated by the dragons at that, which could’ve explained why he didn’t just teleport out of there for that last fight too.

Scarlet also experimented on herself with Omadd’s mind-opening device too. And look how that turned out.

Oh, and Kudu only uses that personal teleporter a grand total of 3 times in the entire story, whereas Scarlet abused it like it was going out of style.

So she should be even more annoying to you by that logic.

Oh, she’s annoying to me, I never denied that. But Kudu has top billing for being an asura and should flipping know better than to experiment on himself. You don’t do that, you get disposable minions for that.

And do we count every invasion as an individual use of Scarlet using the device? Because if so we need to count every instance of everyone ever running Sorrow’s Embrace story mode of Kudu using his device. That’s only fair.

If not, and the invasion events count as only one instance (her defeat at the end), then there are less times Scarlet uses her personal teleporter device than Kudu. Once then, once to escape the Pavilion. She is careful not to put herself in that position again until it’s inside the Breachmaker – when she doesn’t use it to escape, but instead uses an access lift from what I recall.

But then, all of this I went over months ago. Scarlet isn’t as terrible “lore-wrecking” piece of crap as people insist. Two issues were central to what I see having been put out there:

- There was no buildup to her existence, no hints of it aside from vagaries, and suddenly she’s there. And they had space in which to introduce her – hints and details could have been threaded through the first few pieces of the Living Story at that time. Dialogue could have been cheaply tacked in there to lead to the idea of some_one_ in control. But they didn’t.

- The wackiness in the first time we met her was over the top and toned down the more we fought against her plans into a more focused madness. It could have worked if the start hadn’t been so high a bar set at the first reveal – which could be excused as Scarlet deciding to be theatrical due to thinking nobody was going to be able to stop her. Unfortunately, that excuse only is accepted if you liked her in any capacity – and it should have been different. Should have been hints she was playing to the gallery instead of just two moas short of a flock.

Please remove Destiny´s Edge, I did not play when they where introduced. And references to Zhaitan, I mean, when I joined the game, it was already about Mordri. And while you are at it: I did not watch the early seasons of Supernatural. Please remove the character of Crowley, I was not there when he was introduced. Hm, now thinking of it, you can scrap Dean and Sam for the same reason actually. Please make everything in general depend on when I joined something. This of cause only applies to me. Every fictional format should revolve about my point of view.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

If not, and the invasion events count as only one instance (her defeat at the end), then there are less times Scarlet uses her personal teleporter device than Kudu.

I don’t have to, or plan to count the invasions or any of the open world events she shows up in. The instances we encounter her in are more than enough.

Opening Ceremony (Queen’s Jubilee) : At least 5 times on screen. In her very first appearance, no less.

Video proof: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sz1aheyh2Gs

Closing Ceremony : Twice on screen. Possibly a third for when you defeat the boss and she retreats into the Pavilion, but this video didn’t show if that was the case.

Video proof: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hr6ojFQg0LI

Scarlet’s Playhouse : 4 times during the entire instance for each round against her and when she escapes.

Note: I’m not counting the extra teleports for when she tries to cook Faren since she’ll use it there indefinitely until you finish, but I will count the one where she leaves as you finish that.

Video proof: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0J3QrmAFiQ

Fractured: Once in the Thaumanova Reactor, after her monologue just before the boss fight.

Video proof pending.

The Nightmare Within: Twice. Once to get in just before the boss fight and monologue at you again, then again via a portal to leave.

Video proof pending.

Surprisingly she ditched it entirely for the Battle for Lion’s Arch while onboard the Breachmaker.

Well, that tally up aside, I’ve accepted that we’ll never find common ground regarding Scarlet’s worth (or lack of) to the story. She did have potential, but it was utterly wasted, and they still had plenty of other potential masterminds they could’ve used in her place for the alliances she ended up creating. Her only lasting impact at this point was waking Mordremoth up early, along with all those broken probes left all over Tyria.

Unfortunately, there’s no way to ever fully remove her taint on the story now. One hopes they’ll eventually find a way to bring back Season 1 for those who started playing after that, but I’m not holding high hopes on that either.

Nilkemia.8507:

I don’t have to, or plan to count the invasions or any of the open world events she shows up in. The instances we encounter her in are more than enough.

Opening Ceremony (Queen’s Jubilee) : At least 5 times on screen. In her very first appearance, no less.

She never appeared during the Opening Ceremony

No. Never did.

Closing Ceremony : Twice on screen. Possibly a third for when you defeat the boss and she retreats into the Pavilion, but this video didn’t show if that was the case.

Video proof: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hr6ojFQg0LI

Scarlet’s Playhouse : 4 times during the entire instance for each round against her and when she escapes.

Fractured: Once in the Thaumanova Reactor, after her monologue just before the boss fight.

The Nightmare Within: Twice. Once to get in just before the boss fight and monologue at you again, then again via a portal to leave.

Strange thing is, despite her being present to taunt all through the tower, she never showed physically, but tons of hallucinations (including auditory ones) showed up. I don’t know if it’s easy to count these.

Surprisingly she ditched it entirely for the Battle for Lion’s Arch while onboard the Breachmaker.

Yeah, very strange.

Also, Kudu still outdoes her. Five times alone during the fight in Sorrow’s Embrace (teleporting before loosing a golem boss on you, four times, then teleporting out).

Counting the times he shows up during the asura personal story . . . there’s three times he intersects the story. As my character doesn’t have that branch as their personal story (Infinity Ball instead – it looked more interesting) I only can go by wiki involvement. Assume one teleport each time . . . minimum, so that’s eight.

The tally of Scarlet has seven.

I’ve accepted that we’ll never find common ground regarding Scarlet’s worth (or lack of) to the story. She did have potential, but it was utterly wasted, and they still had plenty of other potential masterminds they could’ve used in her place for the alliances she ended up creating. Her only lasting impact at this point was waking Mordremoth up early, along with all those broken probes left all over Tyria.

Unfortunately, there’s no way to ever fully remove her taint on the story now. One hopes they’ll eventually find a way to bring back Season 1 for those who started playing after that, but I’m not holding high hopes on that either.

We’re not disagreeing too much – they didn’t handle her as well as they could have. They could have done much better.

I don’t think she’s a terrible character. Not on the level of others they keep shoving in our face (like Lord Faren or Zojja).

….Did you even watch the video I linked for the Opening Ceremony? She’s there. She’s named “Mysterious Stranger” at that point, but she’s in—-no, no, you’re clearly trolling now. Done. No more.

Nilkemia.8507:

….Did you even watch the video I liked for the Opening Ceremony? She’s there. She’s named “Mysterious Stranger” at that point, but she’s in—-no, no, you’re clearly trolling now. Done. No more.

No, not trolling. I think you are (especially with regards to anything post-Scarlet storywise), but I’m still treating you with utmost seriousness. You’ll note I wound up agreeing with you at the end, just not to the same severity you have.

She is an important part of the story wether you like it or not. That you weren’t here at the time is your own fault.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

She is an important part of the story wether you like it or not. That you weren’t here at the time is your own fault.

Yes, let’s just blame everyone else who joined the game after Season 1, or are just joining now. Sigh. Totally their fault. /sarcasm.

Nah we know whose fault it is.

. . . why we haven’t destroyed Rata Sum before they do something like that again is beyond me.

Algreg.3629:

Please remove Destiny´s Edge, I did not play when they where introduced. And references to Zhaitan, I mean, when I joined the game, it was already about Mordri. And while you are at it: I did not watch the early seasons of Supernatural. Please remove the character of Crowley, I was not there when he was introduced. Hm, now thinking of it, you can scrap Dean and Sam for the same reason actually. Please make everything in general depend on when I joined something. This of cause only applies to me. Every fictional format should revolve about my point of view.

To be fair, though, you can go and pick up Supernatural DVDs or (cheekily) watch it from other sources to plug any gaps. They also give you a bit of information ahead of the episode (Then and Now), which typically gives you enough information so the episode itself will still make sense. Despite having typical series arcs and some concentrated arc episodes, they also still do that monster-of-the-week thing so you don’t have to know all the ins and outs.

I get the point, however.

Previous forum-goers have asked for things like a Tyrian newspaper. I don’t know if anything has come of that, or if we’re actually waiting until the expansion for something concrete.

I personally would just shove an item or two in the Priory archives and direct players there through an in-game mail from some magister or other, though I should think Ela Makkay was a strong candidate (she’s being documenting things, IIRC, and did catch us up a little at one point a long while back during the Tower of Nightmares. Not sure if she still performs that catch up function in any capacity). The mail would mention an artifact that shows pertinent scenes from all that has gone before, or perhaps a book written by a notable Priory member, which details in diary form events that have gone before - whichever makes most sense to get people caught up in an unobtrusive manner. I favour the book, which would maybe have an advantage by showing a clear timeline due to its format, and is perhaps the easiest solution to slot in. It could clarify Scarlet’s role in everything - even if she is rather annoying - which would assist any player, new or old, in placing their own role in the timeline. Also, there should be a book for each season and/or event. No event, however big or small, should be undocumented by the Priory!

There was also a map that showed us where things happened in season 1. I’m rather out of the loop, mind, but the link doesn’t show any more, and I don’t know what happened to it. That doesn’t do much for something in the game itself but for that, there is some small precedent with Scholar (now Magister) Makkay.

Please remove Rytlock from the game, I don’t like him.

Nilkemia.8507:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

She is an important part of the story wether you like it or not. That you weren’t here at the time is your own fault.

Yes, let’s just blame everyone else who joined the game after Season 1, or are just joining now. Sigh. Totally their fault. /sarcasm.

So everytime a new player comes along we should delete all the past story/lore. Which is basically what the OP initially asked for.

If you join an MMO years after it’s release, you will have missed certain things. It’s normal.

Scarlet was awesome and I was sad to put a spike in her. I was hoping she would come back as a ghost or something later on.

Whether you liked her or hated her there are still questions to be answered in regards to Scarlet.

Maybe I’m missing something but one of which being.. How did Scarlet know caithe’s (wynne’s) secret? And the whole gossip of what her true intentions are/were concerning Mordremoth etc.

Maybe ANet will get back to it and hopefully clear things up. It really is a mess though when no one can play/re-play LSS1. We can only hope though.

Please remove hitler from history

This is a really harsh comparison, but it’s the same thing. think about it for a second.

See I don’t even think it’s Scarlet herself, it’s jsut the fact that the story seemed to find more and more contrived ways for her to do things. It could have been anyone in that place.

For her part, I love the idea of a engineer, pro-technology, anti-pale tree Sylvari, and the character herself was ok. Just the fact that she pulled all these alliances and gigantic machines out of nowhere for little to no explained reason,

and don’t forget to delete all that connects to gw1. I’ve never played that.

Valky.2574:

It makes no since to me who the hell is she?

In the time it took you to write this, you could have Googled and found out. This is like asking to not use any lore or characters more than a month old. Seriously, I didn’t play GW1 but, you don’t see me asking Anet to delete all of Tyria’s past for me.

GG….

Scarlet wasn’t a bad villian. Would have been better if you she was written a bit better.

I wouldn’t be too surprised if ArenaNet released a brief ’LS1’ pack with re-used LS1 content before HoT releases to solve exactly this lore consistency issue.

They could probably package all the major elements of LS1 into 4 or 5 LS2-sized chapters. I mean, honestly, I actually think they should, they owe it to every new player hoping into GW2, who now are left fairly confused as to what it actually happening in LS2.

The only thing left out of such a repackaged LS1 chapter would be the open world content from the original LS1, but that still leaves a decent chunk of instanced content, in which most of the plot of LS1 occurred anyhow.

They could set it up sort of like this:
- Chapter one: Molten Alliance missions (cragstead, hatchery, factory), and introduction of characters.
- Chapter two: Aetherblade missions (murder investigation, hidden base), and introduction of additional characters.
- Chapter three: Clockwork stuff and fractals stuff.
- Chapter four: Toxic Alliance stuff (admittedly the tower of nightmares is problematic since its physical location is blown up, GW2 needs phasing technology)
- Chapter five: Defense of lions arch (will need some reworking as this was mostly open world content).

Edit: Writing about the alliances above reminded me of how terrible the story for LS1 was... Maybe axe the worst offenders, like the toxic alliance (which still plague PvE maps today).

Agree they need to do something to explain season 1, I came back to playing right at the end of season 1, and Didn’t really find out much about Scarlett, and meeting Marjory and her friends was very strange, and not seeing the original Destiny’s edge. But to re-write the story is over the top.

I think I saw mention of a recap though in time for the expansion release.

This was always the problem with the living story approach.

ANet knows that now, which is why they are switching to traditional expansions.

The question is, will they ever go back and fix it by adding in LS1 and making the story linear again.

My guess, probably not. Too much time and effort for the sake of new players.

I see what OP is getting at. Deleting would a bad idea, just clarify. However, ANET, I think you guys are beating a dead horse at this point. I’m not a new player but I didn’t log in for 7 months and missed all of LS1 and that kittened me off to no end. So, I sympathize.

As far as the people above trolling each other… either fix yourselves to do that on plebbit.

The way to fix Season 1’s poor storytelling is through addition, not subtraction.

In order to improve the overall narrative, there are three main problems that need to be fixed. First, the alliances seem completely unrealistic, with only flimsy justifications for why all these powerful groups would grovel before Scarlet. Secondly, the aforementioned shrub’s resources and abilities seemed nearly infinite, but the story played it completely straight, which broke any sense of verisimilitude. Finally, Scarlet’s corruption was extremely weak, basically a throwaway audio log rather than an actual descent into madness. All of these can be solved by adding story elements which should have been there from the start.

Season 1 needs interesting NPCs from each of the five factions in the alliance. We need a Flame Legion shaman who is far more erudite and educated than his fellows, who recognizes that clinging to the ashes of their former glory isn’t working. We need a Dredge commissar looking for solutions to their technological deadends, blind to the ways of the surface world but eager to gain its riches. We need Mai Trin to have an actual personality, deciding to wager her army on the chance of plundering the banks and vaults of the Big Mango, even if it means sacrificing some grunts. We need to a krait priestess to reject the xenophobia of her fellows in favor of bringing the prophet to life, and we need a Nightmare courtier on direct orders from Faolain to cause mayhem while keeping an eye on this interesting blip on the sylvari radar.

If these characters are interesting and dynamic, it will justify Scarlet’s obscene resources. The dredge commissar will bring manufacturing, the Flame shaman has brilliant tactical sensibilities, the Aetherblades have an elaborate scouting network, etc. Rather than explaining every single detail with Scarlet Ex Machina, the NPCs of the alliance can demonstrate their skill and acumen to make the story seem more grounded.

And finally, these NPCs will allow us to see Scarlet’s corruption play out. In the beginning, she’s three steps ahead of anyone in negotiations, an expert at ferreting out dissent, and adept at playing each side against each other to keep them in line. But as her madness takes hold, the advantage shifts, and soon the alliance begins using the mad inventor, rather than the other way around. By the final battle with Lion’s Arch, each faction should be treating it like a heist aboard a runaway train, trying to accomplish their own goals before everyone blows up.

Adding and expanding side characters will help the early stages, which lack focus, and allow Anet to tie up a lot of loose ends and round out the finale as the alliance tears itself apart from within, or gets butchered by their own people who believe they have betrayed their ideals.

Nice as always, Shriketalon, but I’d like something to explain how Mai Trin had an army that wasn’t a known factor. No one had heard of the Aetherblades before they first attacked, but they were far too sizable a force to just camp in the woods undetected for the months/years it would take to recruit and train them. No deserters? No loose lips in taverns? No rangers out hunting and going zomg it’s a fracking army out here? No sightings of non-Pact airships? No odd caravans of supplies going out into the wilds?

Maybe I’ve read too much SM Stirling but I really do crave realistic logistics in things like this.

Donari.5237:

Nice as always, Shriketalon, but I’d like something to explain how Mai Trin had an army that wasn’t a known factor. No one had heard of the Aetherblades before they first attacked, but they were far too sizable a force to just camp in the woods undetected for the months/years it would take to recruit and train them. No deserters? No loose lips in taverns? No rangers out hunting and going zomg it’s a fracking army out here? No sightings of non-Pact airships? No odd caravans of supplies going out into the wilds?

Maybe I’ve read too much SM Stirling but I really do crave realistic logistics in things like this.

The problem is, thanks to scaling and repeatable events, it’s hard to say exactly how large the force of the Aetherblades are. Or the Vigil alone for that matter, or the Priory, et cetera.

We can count NPCs all we want but when there’s generic enemies which just spawn in to fill an event-scaled quota? It’s literally impossible to get a precise fix on just how big these organizations are. Big enough to have two hangar bases, and to dispatch enough people to be dangerous.

Realistic logistics get in the way of the game part of the MMO. You have to toss some of it out or you wind up with impossibilities. For instance . . . if the Pact was supposed to field enough people to take Orr, a place Zhaitan had fortified with whatever corpses were lost in the catacombs there or lost at sea around there . . . how many people would be needed? Realistically, I’d say roughly three times the number of soldiers accounted for D-Day.

. . . Tyria doesn’t have that.

Donari.5237:

Nice as always, Shriketalon, but I’d like something to explain how Mai Trin had an army that wasn’t a known factor. No one had heard of the Aetherblades before they first attacked, but they were far too sizable a force to just camp in the woods undetected for the months/years it would take to recruit and train them. No deserters? No loose lips in taverns? No rangers out hunting and going zomg it’s a fracking army out here? No sightings of non-Pact airships? No odd caravans of supplies going out into the wilds?

That would actually be pretty easy to explain, as long as we’re going by “totally not retcons” additive storytelling. The idea of the Aetherblades was supposed to be essentially the Sinister Triad from the Brisban Wildlands stealing a bunch of Pact equipment and recruiting the more nefarious pirates into their armada. The set pieces are already there, it just requires a little more work to put it into the actual game.

1) Add an episode to the beginning of the season where the player character takes a sabbatical from the Pact. We then head to Southsun, where all that wonderful karka stuff happens, then the Molten Alliance attacks.

2) After the Molten Alliance, the player is called back to the Pact for a meeting. Trahearne decides to appoint several commanders, each geared towards researching and planning a battle against a different dragon. This explains why we are no longer Supreme Commander Dude, but in a way that doesn’t treat us like a forgotten afterthought. While this episode is occurring, some very odd things happen at the Pact camp, and several conversations indicate that equipment is being “lost”. Several NPCs should show up here that are later revealed as Aetherblade infiltrators.

3) The assassination, investigation, and dungeon delve already serve as a good backbone for a complete episode with a nice story arc. The Aetherblade force shouldn’t appear that big during this time.

4) During Clockwork Chaos, the Aetherblade army should be swelling. Pirates hostile towards LA are recruited in massive numbers after the attack, and the booty and plunder from their raiding makes the group even stronger. The lost Pact equipment, including several airships, starts showing up all over the place and the story calls attention to the fact that they’re jacking our ride. Mai Trin’s character arc will help reveal all this information quite easily without sounding too much like exposition.

This shouldn’t take much time at all to set up, but it will mean that by the time the story reaches the Aetherpath, it’s perfectly obvious why the Aetherblades have suddenly gotten strong. They’ve got tech, they’ve got booty, and they’ve got a number of victories against the people all the bandits and brigands hate. Rather than try to present them as a massive army that’s been around for ages without anyone noticing, the story can do much better depicting them as a small fringe group that has suddenly swelled to dangerous proportions.

Isnt there a existing or soon to be added feature where u can buy S1 content and play it ?

While people may grumble about Scarlet’s story line her inventions and attack on LA gave us some of the most fun events……Marionette was awesome (setting aside the difficulty people seem to have working together) and I sold one of her gun skins for 500g.

So no she cannot be forgotten O:<

Ankushp.7245:

Isnt there a existing or soon to be added feature where u can buy S1 content and play it ?

While people may grumble about Scarlet’s story line her inventions and attack on LA gave us some of the most fun events……Marionette was awesome (setting aside the difficulty people seem to have working together) and I sold one of her gun skins for 500g.

So no she cannot be forgotten O:<

Not yet. The problem is that most content was designed as open world raiding content. So if they reimplement it, it would cause open world issues. But anet did state they were working on a solution because they wanted to have it returned. Among the options are summarized story in fractals or instanced locations.
Albeit now that they announced HoT I don’t think will be any updates on the subject until after the release. or maybe the HoT comes with a fractal bundle for LS1.. dunno.. wait and see I guess

All I know is that they are willing to bring it back but dont have a solution for how