Guild Wars 2

I was wondering, shouldn’t the portal for places like Lake Doric be accessible for everyone who cleared the story at least once with a character instead of having to go through the story every time?
I mean, the story is great, but still…. It might be quite handy.
I know there are scrolls to transport you there but am I the only one that finds that kinda weird?

The Lake Doric entrance is tied to the guard as you need permission which comes from progressing the story. The portal scrolls only cost 1K UM so I don’t really see it as much if an issue and this coming from someone who has map completed every map with nine characters while only doing the story once or twice.

I don’t really understand Anet creating these gated zones. It’s strange to keep a lot of your game population away from new content unless they approach it using the exact steps you dictate (completing the story).

Probably to encourage players to purchase the episodes if they for whatever reason did not log into the game with the 2-3 month windows.

That’s not the matter here. This is a question of why they gate some LW3 zones (not BFF) on a character basis.

Djinn.9245:

I don’t really understand Anet creating these gated zones. It’s strange to keep a lot of your game population away from new content unless they approach it using the exact steps you dictate (completing the story).

Yea really. Imagine if Dry Top or Silverwastes were gated like this.

But honestly, I don’t think making story playing mandatory is a good idea either. Furthermore, there are also HoT trinkets stats that they’d be cut off from, besides raids.

Tanner Blackfeather.6509:

That’s not the matter here. This is a question of why they gate some LW3 zones (not BFF) on a character basis.

Since it’s the only one of the four that isn’t, perhaps the question should be why is it not gated like the others.

Tanner Blackfeather.6509:

That’s not the matter here. This is a question of why they gate some LW3 zones (not BFF) on a character basis.

Well, clearly if the gate to zone access is completing the story, then each character must complete the story. Just because you complete the story on one character doesn’t mean that each character on your account has the story completed.

That’s why I asked why they are story gated at all.

Djinn.9245:

Tanner Blackfeather.6509:

That’s not the matter here. This is a question of why they gate some LW3 zones (not BFF) on a character basis.

Well, clearly if the gate to zone access is completing the story, then each character must complete the story. Just because you complete the story on one character doesn’t mean that each character on your account has the story completed.

That’s why I asked why they are story gated at all.

Actually, I was asking if anyone else found it weird for the map to be gated once you cleared the story with 1 character, to all the others. Not sure how anyone shifted the idea to simply opening the zones for people who didn’t get season 3.

There are several questions worth asking:

• Should LS zones be gated at all? Neither Dry Top nor Silverwastes were.
• If gated, should they be gated by unlocking the story? Or by completing parts of the story?
• If gated by the story, should they be gated per account or per character? (Bitterfrost is per account; the rest are per character.)

I have no problem with ANet wanting to increase incentives for people to unlock the Living Story per episode. I’m concerned that by restricting it per character they have made it more onerous than it needs to be.

Then there’s the question as to whether offering yet another portal scroll is fair alternative to per-character gating. To me, it seems unworthy of the polish that ANet applies to other parts of the game; it’s clunky.

However, I guess we’re stuck with it. Sure makes me less enthusiastic about LS3. (It’s not a deal breaker; it is, however, just one more awkward element to the latest episode.)

tl;dr yeah, I find it weird that three of newest four maps are gated per character instead of all being, at worst, gated by account.

Raven.1524:

Djinn.9245:

Tanner Blackfeather.6509:

That’s not the matter here. This is a question of why they gate some LW3 zones (not BFF) on a character basis.

Well, clearly if the gate to zone access is completing the story, then each character must complete the story. Just because you complete the story on one character doesn’t mean that each character on your account has the story completed.

That’s why I asked why they are story gated at all.

Actually, I was asking if anyone else found it weird for the map to be gated once you cleared the story with 1 character, to all the others. Not sure how anyone shifted the idea to simply opening the zones for people who didn’t get season 3.

I understood your OP. As I said above, the gating makes perfect sense in its current form. Since completing a story on one character doesn’t complete it for all characters on your account, of course your other characters wouldn’t have access to the zone.

However, your OP sparked a question for me of why Anet gates these zones at all which is why I asked that question.

The teleport scrolls allow access without playing the story.

Cheap solution:
- buy a teleport scroll
- teleport to new map with character who doesn’t have access
- drop scroll back in the bank since you now have waypoints
- repeat for as many characters are required

Expensive solution:
- buy shared inventory slot
- buy teleport scroll and place in shared inventory slot
- …
- profit

The gating is very likely to incentivise the purchase of said Living Story episodes and/or the purchase of shared inventory slots.

Cyninja.2954:

The teleport scrolls allow access without playing the story.

Cheap solution:
- buy a teleport scroll
- teleport to new map with character who doesn’t have access
- drop scroll back in the bank since you now have waypoints
- repeat for as many characters are required

Expensive solution:
- buy shared inventory slot
- buy teleport scroll and place in shared inventory slot
- …
- profit

The gating is very likely to incentivise the purchase of said Living Story episodes and/or the purchase of shared inventory slots.

It’s cheap by comparison to other gating; it’s just super clunky. Worse, it requires people to ‘pay’ more than once: unlock the story, play the story at least once buy the scroll, find space to hold yet another teleport scroll/key.

I still think this isn’t worthy of ANet’s idea of a polished game

So, basically every player that buys the game after this is going to have pay a thousand gems just to have access to the maps and be cut off from a dozen mastery points. And unlike in Central Tyria, these masteries do significantly affect gameplay.

And I won’t have to excuse to say “Well, it’s just the story! Just watch it on Youtube, and the rewards aren’t that great anyways”.

And this is going to keep increasing…..

So pray tell, do people that don’t unlock the story have access to the “Ancient Magics” masteries? Because if they can’t fill those out, and it is quite hard to do so using only HoT map masteries, then they’d be stuck with useless XP.

This isn’t a new game. I don’t think finding more ways of separating the population is going to help things, considering it’s already separated by expansion.

ArchonWing.9480:

So, basically every player that buys the game after this is going to have pay a thousand gems just to have access to the maps and be cut off from a dozen mastery points. And unlike in Central Tyria, these masteries do significantly affect gameplay.

And I won’t have to excuse to say “Well, it’s just the story! Just watch it on Youtube, and the rewards aren’t that great anyways”.

And this is going to keep increasing…..

So pray tell, do people that don’t unlock the story have access to the “Ancient Magics” masteries? Because if they can’t fill those out, and it is quite hard to do so using only HoT map masteries, then they’d be stuck with useless XP.

This isn’t a new game. I don’t think finding more ways of separating the population is going to help things, considering it’s already separated by expansion.

As far as we know, the Ancient Magics mastery line will only impact LS3 maps. That mastery line unlocks upon entering any LS3 map. That said, only the first one is really required.

There are also enough mastery points in the game where they do not need to have every LS3 map unlocked to max out their masteries.

Ayrilana.1396:

ArchonWing.9480:

So, basically every player that buys the game after this is going to have pay a thousand gems just to have access to the maps and be cut off from a dozen mastery points. And unlike in Central Tyria, these masteries do significantly affect gameplay.

And I won’t have to excuse to say “Well, it’s just the story! Just watch it on Youtube, and the rewards aren’t that great anyways”.

And this is going to keep increasing…..

So pray tell, do people that don’t unlock the story have access to the “Ancient Magics” masteries? Because if they can’t fill those out, and it is quite hard to do so using only HoT map masteries, then they’d be stuck with useless XP.

This isn’t a new game. I don’t think finding more ways of separating the population is going to help things, considering it’s already separated by expansion.

As far as we know, the Ancient Magics mastery line will only impact LS3 maps. That mastery line unlocks upon entering any LS3 map. That said, only the first one is really required.

There are also enough mastery points in the game where they do not need to have every LS3 map unlocked to max out their masteries.

I think that’s cutting it a bit close though.

It takes 132 points to max out all the masteries, and I think… /stares 132 mastery points that aren’t locked behind raids or the LS.

Though I guess most of them aren’t really needed.

ArchonWing.9480:

Ayrilana.1396:

ArchonWing.9480:

So, basically every player that buys the game after this is going to have pay a thousand gems just to have access to the maps and be cut off from a dozen mastery points. And unlike in Central Tyria, these masteries do significantly affect gameplay.

And I won’t have to excuse to say “Well, it’s just the story! Just watch it on Youtube, and the rewards aren’t that great anyways”.

And this is going to keep increasing…..

So pray tell, do people that don’t unlock the story have access to the “Ancient Magics” masteries? Because if they can’t fill those out, and it is quite hard to do so using only HoT map masteries, then they’d be stuck with useless XP.

This isn’t a new game. I don’t think finding more ways of separating the population is going to help things, considering it’s already separated by expansion.

As far as we know, the Ancient Magics mastery line will only impact LS3 maps. That mastery line unlocks upon entering any LS3 map. That said, only the first one is really required.

There are also enough mastery points in the game where they do not need to have every LS3 map unlocked to max out their masteries.

I think that’s cutting it a bit close though.

It takes 132 points to max out all the masteries, and I think… /stares 132 mastery points that aren’t locked behind raids or the LS.

Though I guess most of them aren’t really needed.

Roughly that many without the LS or raids. The wiki is still off the last I checked since it’s missing the one from Mayatl and one other (I think was from the HoT story). Assuming someone unlocks an episode to unlock the mastery line, they’ll obtain all of those masteries.

Episode 3 is the worst one to go with and people have claimed that they were able to enter the zone without the episode unlocked. I haven’t personally verified that claim though and chances are it could have gotten patched under one of their “Fixed a server crash” patches.

Ayrilana.1396:

ArchonWing.9480:

Ayrilana.1396:

ArchonWing.9480:

So, basically every player that buys the game after this is going to have pay a thousand gems just to have access to the maps and be cut off from a dozen mastery points. And unlike in Central Tyria, these masteries do significantly affect gameplay.

And I won’t have to excuse to say “Well, it’s just the story! Just watch it on Youtube, and the rewards aren’t that great anyways”.

And this is going to keep increasing…..

So pray tell, do people that don’t unlock the story have access to the “Ancient Magics” masteries? Because if they can’t fill those out, and it is quite hard to do so using only HoT map masteries, then they’d be stuck with useless XP.

This isn’t a new game. I don’t think finding more ways of separating the population is going to help things, considering it’s already separated by expansion.

As far as we know, the Ancient Magics mastery line will only impact LS3 maps. That mastery line unlocks upon entering any LS3 map. That said, only the first one is really required.

There are also enough mastery points in the game where they do not need to have every LS3 map unlocked to max out their masteries.

I think that’s cutting it a bit close though.

It takes 132 points to max out all the masteries, and I think… /stares 132 mastery points that aren’t locked behind raids or the LS.

Though I guess most of them aren’t really needed.

Roughly that many without the LS or raids. The wiki is still off the last I checked since it’s missing the one from Mayatl and one other (I think was from the HoT story). Assuming someone unlocks an episode to unlock the mastery line, they’ll obtain all of those masteries.

Episode 3 is the worst one to go with and people have claimed that they were able to enter the zone without the episode unlocked. I haven’t personally verified that claim though and chances are it could have gotten patched under one of their “Fixed a server crash” patches.

Ah, well, I do see that point. Personally, I was hitting it very close on the masteries. I only have 4 extra points even after doing most of the masteries in LS and have 2 from raids. All the “easy” or even “not so easy” ones I’ve already exhausted and if I had missed one chapter, I’d be in pretty bad shape. Well, if I actually needed spirit shards.

But beyond that it’s a bit hard to tell my friends that there’s a new LS story coming out and they say they’ll be back in a few weeks only to be stifled by a paywall. And then any other friends that were checking out the game as F2P. Now, perhaps it’s the people I associate with, but nobody’s ever complained to me that “they couldn’t do the story! OMG!” beyond any possible rewards but it’s obvious they were caring more about the rewards. So I thought having to pay for the story (as in LS2 was a fair deal). On a broader scale, people not playing the story only impacts the single player part, but shutting down the multiplayer part indirectly affects me, since I’m someone that would rather see more crowded maps than empty ones.

And I also think the availability of full HoT stats trinket was a great thing to have, due to not having to do raids for them, but if new players have to pay a gem fee, that it kind of sours the whole thing as a viable option. Then again, I guess if they gave new ways to get those, then the issue would be greatly dampened for me.

It’d be nice if Expansion 2 had a version that say, had a slightly more expensive version that included the LS3, but alas.

ArchonWing.9480:

Ayrilana.1396:

ArchonWing.9480:

Ayrilana.1396:

ArchonWing.9480:

So, basically every player that buys the game after this is going to have pay a thousand gems just to have access to the maps and be cut off from a dozen mastery points. And unlike in Central Tyria, these masteries do significantly affect gameplay.

And I won’t have to excuse to say “Well, it’s just the story! Just watch it on Youtube, and the rewards aren’t that great anyways”.

And this is going to keep increasing…..

So pray tell, do people that don’t unlock the story have access to the “Ancient Magics” masteries? Because if they can’t fill those out, and it is quite hard to do so using only HoT map masteries, then they’d be stuck with useless XP.

This isn’t a new game. I don’t think finding more ways of separating the population is going to help things, considering it’s already separated by expansion.

As far as we know, the Ancient Magics mastery line will only impact LS3 maps. That mastery line unlocks upon entering any LS3 map. That said, only the first one is really required.

There are also enough mastery points in the game where they do not need to have every LS3 map unlocked to max out their masteries.

I think that’s cutting it a bit close though.

It takes 132 points to max out all the masteries, and I think… /stares 132 mastery points that aren’t locked behind raids or the LS.

Though I guess most of them aren’t really needed.

Roughly that many without the LS or raids. The wiki is still off the last I checked since it’s missing the one from Mayatl and one other (I think was from the HoT story). Assuming someone unlocks an episode to unlock the mastery line, they’ll obtain all of those masteries.

Episode 3 is the worst one to go with and people have claimed that they were able to enter the zone without the episode unlocked. I haven’t personally verified that claim though and chances are it could have gotten patched under one of their “Fixed a server crash” patches.

Ah, well, I do see that point. Personally, I was hitting it very close on the masteries. I only have 4 extra points even after doing most of the masteries in LS and have 2 from raids. All the “easy” or even “not so easy” ones I’ve already exhausted and if I had missed one chapter, I’d be in pretty bad shape. Well, if I actually needed spirit shards.

But beyond that it’s a bit hard to tell my friends that there’s a new LS story coming out and they say they’ll be back in a few weeks only to be stifled by a paywall. And then any other friends that were checking out the game as F2P. Now, perhaps it’s the people I associate with, but nobody’s ever complained to me that “they couldn’t do the story! OMG!” beyond any possible rewards but it’s obvious they were caring more about the rewards. So I thought having to pay for the story (as in LS2 was a fair deal). On a broader scale, people not playing the story only impacts the single player part, but shutting down the multiplayer part indirectly affects me, since I’m someone that would rather see more crowded maps than empty ones.

And I also think the availability of full HoT stats trinket was a great thing to have, due to not having to do raids for them, but if new players have to pay a gem fee, that it kind of sours the whole thing as a viable option. Then again, I guess if they gave new ways to get those, then the issue would be greatly dampened for me.

It’d be nice if Expansion 2 had a version that say, had a slightly more expensive version that included the LS3, but alas.

Yeah. Not doing all of the LS episodes and raids tends to reduce the choices you have on which mastery points you can skip. Many people dislike adventures and/or have difficulties with some so this makes it more of a pain to max their masteries.

I guess I’m not understanding what you mean about your friends. Are you telling them outside the game or from within? If it’s from within then they should have the previous or current episode unlocked depending on how you look at it. Unlocking an episode takes about a minute assuming that they still have the game installed plus the time to update. Being back in a few weeks would put them within the window to get the upcoming LS.

Missed episodes can be bought for 40G, which given how they allow us to get easy ascended trinkets, feels fairly worth it. A lot of farms yield at least 15G/hr so you can spend about 2-3 hours to get enough gold to purchase an episode. While players are required to purchase an episode if they missed it in order to experience anything from that episode, unlike LS2, I don’t feel the cost is so high that they cannot afford it through farming or help from friends.

There is more than enough mastery points to cap out mastery levels way before starting living story 3. (https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mastery_point_unlocks)

131 HoT mastery points are available without stepping in any raid or LW3 of which only 112 are needed (if not maxing raid mastery and Ancient Magics).

Does LW3 make it easier to get the HoT masteries and allow for skipping of some of the harder or longer mastery achievements? Sure, that’s called convenience and arenanet charges for that.

Quote tree broken so…

Well, I have a number of friends that have gone inactive due to lack of content so I was figyring s3 would give us something to do. And one doesn’t have Hot yet. I do nit know if it is good timing to tell them to buy hot if another expansion looms around the corner. And then all this spending.

Now, I guess the gold I guess isn’t too bad. But given recent discussion, I am not sure about others. But the actual story has also been an issue but fortunately teleport to fruend is a thing for those that unlocked it.

As for the mastery points one would need all 131 which I think is a bit difficult. And here is the thing. Right now when my xp fills, I get a spirit shard but should there be more masteries then I may lose that ability unless I get to work again.

Now is that going to kill me? No, but that doesn’t really please me either.

I will just say that this chsnge from ls2 to ls3 has been offputting. I have unlocked them all, but something feels wrong. And yes, I don’t mind them charging for the story.

ArchonWing.9480:

Quote tree broken so…

Well, I have a number of friends that have gone inactive due to lack of content so I was figyring s3 would give us something to do. And one doesn’t have Hot yet. I do nit know if it is good timing to tell them to buy hot if another expansion looms around the corner. And then all this spending.

Now, I guess the gold I guess isn’t too bad. But given recent discussion, I am not sure about others. But the actual story has also been an issue but fortunately teleport to fruend is a thing for those that unlocked it.

As for the mastery points one would need all 131 which I think is a bit difficult. And here is the thing. Right now when my xp fills, I get a spirit shard but should there be more masteries then I may lose that ability unless I get to work again.

Now is that going to kill me? No, but that doesn’t really please me either.

I will just say that this chsnge from ls2 to ls3 has been offputting. I have unlocked them all, but something feels wrong. And yes, I don’t mind them charging for the story.

Oh. That’s what you meant by paywall.

ArchonWing.9480:

Quote tree broken so…

Well, I have a number of friends that have gone inactive due to lack of content so I was figyring s3 would give us something to do. And one doesn’t have Hot yet. I do nit know if it is good timing to tell them to buy hot if another expansion looms around the corner. And then all this spending.

The old dilema of “is it worth to spend 25 dollars on a product you might be spending 1, 5, 100 or more hours on”. Always amazes me how such people manage to do anything else like watch a movie or go for a date.

To repeat what people love to say in this case:
The true cost for any MMO comes from the time you spend on/in it. Those 25 bucks are like not even a drop in the bucket.

ArchonWing.9480:

Now, I guess the gold I guess isn’t too bad. But given recent discussion, I am not sure about others. But the actual story has also been an issue but fortunately teleport to fruend is a thing for those that unlocked it.

Story is subjective. You like it or not (or gravitate towards one of those sides). An actual legitimate complaint. Me personally, I loved LW3 so far.

ArchonWing.9480:

Quote tree broken so…

As for the mastery points one would need all 131 which I think is a bit difficult. And here is the thing. Right now when my xp fills, I get a spirit shard but should there be more masteries then I may lose that ability unless I get to work again.

Again, you don’t need 131 for the base materies (only 112). Once you start going for the raid mastery, you unlock a ton more from raids. Same for Ancient Magics which come with way more mastery points from Living World 3 than required to unlock the track.

If they add more masteries, they will add more mastery points. That’s how they handled the last 5 situations where this happened (raids, each living story part). Not sure why they would change going about this now, so moot point.

Cyninja.2954:

ArchonWing.9480:

Quote tree broken so…

Well, I have a number of friends that have gone inactive due to lack of content so I was figyring s3 would give us something to do. And one doesn’t have Hot yet. I do nit know if it is good timing to tell them to buy hot if another expansion looms around the corner. And then all this spending.

The old dilema of “is it worth to spend 25 dollars on a product you might be spending 1, 5, 100 or more hours on”. Always amazes me how such people manage to do anything else like watch a movie or go for a date.

To repeat what people love to say in this case:
The true cost for any MMO comes from the time you spend on/in it. Those 25 bucks are like not even a drop in the bucket.

Red herring. Cost is subjective and it’s not about the absolute costs, especially when ones are added to the game. So if they’re putting down $50 for HoT, they’d have to put down 50% more for other things. You might think it’s worth half an expansion. Some may not.

It’s very nice and all that you are willing to spend money on the game. But to people on the fence, it’s not a clear cut question.

I mean, some games these days, including this one can be free. But that doesn’t mean you should play them just because they have an infinite cost:time ratio, should you?

See, this argument gets tossed around too much, but the problem is that it is way too broad and can be used to justify anything. It also focuses too much on people’s personal spending habits, which more or less is a pointless discussion when it comes to games.

ArchonWing.9480:

Now, I guess the gold I guess isn’t too bad. But given recent discussion, I am not sure about others. But the actual story has also been an issue but fortunately teleport to fruend is a thing for those that unlocked it.

Story is subjective. You like it or not (or gravitate towards one of those sides). An actual legitimate complaint. Me personally, I loved LW3 so far.

I meant the story being required to enter the zone,

Again, you don’t need 131 for the base materies (only 112). Once you start going for the raid mastery, you unlock a ton more from raids. Same for Ancient Magics which come with way more mastery points from Living World 3 than required to unlock the track.

If they add more masteries, they will add more mastery points. That’s how they handled the last 5 situations where this happened (raids, each living story part). Not sure why they would change going about this now, so moot point.\

Which is why I specified, specifically, points not locked behind the raids and LS. We’re talking about getting spirit shards and that isn’t possible unless everything is maxed.

And yes I am aware that they would add more point. Point is I would have to go acquire more points when this happens I don’t have to at this moment to gain back an ability I already have now. This is compounded if I were to say, miss, the next chapter.

So this isn’t a moot point.

ArchonWing.9480:

Cyninja.2954:

Story is subjective. You like it or not (or gravitate towards one of those sides). An actual legitimate complaint. Me personally, I loved LW3 so far.

I meant the story being required to enter the zone,

1,000 unbound magic per teleport scroll, literally 2/3 of a Winterberry Farm which takes 10 minutes total.

I did mention that futher up though. No reason to waste teleport to a friend, though those work too.

Cyninja.2954:

ArchonWing.9480:

Cyninja.2954:

Story is subjective. You like it or not (or gravitate towards one of those sides). An actual legitimate complaint. Me personally, I loved LW3 so far.

I meant the story being required to enter the zone,

1,000 unbound magic per teleport scroll, literally 2/3 of a Winterberry Farm which takes 10 minutes total.

I did mention that futher up though. No reason to waste teleport to a friend, though those work too.

Correct me if I am wrong , but you need to enter the zone to buy the scoll.

ArchonWing.9480:

Cyninja.2954:

ArchonWing.9480:

Cyninja.2954:

Story is subjective. You like it or not (or gravitate towards one of those sides). An actual legitimate complaint. Me personally, I loved LW3 so far.

I meant the story being required to enter the zone,

1,000 unbound magic per teleport scroll, literally 2/3 of a Winterberry Farm which takes 10 minutes total.

I did mention that futher up though. No reason to waste teleport to a friend, though those work too.

Correct me if I am wrong , but you need to enter the zone to buy the scoll.

For the zones that have a scroll, you do have to complete the story and get to the zone in that manner once to be able to get the scroll.

And for those who say that the zones are gated to encourage people to purchase the story, Anet should have made a different incentive to purchase the story. The zones should be open to everyone but maybe certain events or currency is only available to characters that have completed the story.

Seems better than artificially closed zones.

I don’t think one has to complete the story. Maybe an instance or two?

Regardless, if it’s not worth the effort (no cost as all Living World available Episodes can be acquired sans cash) to ‘acquire’ the zone, playing in the zone likely isn’t that desired. (Like much content/items/rewards in the game.) /shrug

Good luck.

You don’t have to complete the story. You have to do the story. I never implied the former, I thought.

I also think that the motivation for doing the story and zone are rather unrelated things. I did the story, because it was actually pretty good. But my first priority was playing in the zones. Anyhow, my standard was based off previous ones set by Anet in season 2 which I found acceptable. That changed, and I am questioning it.

In other good news, it turns out apparently at least one friend has been logging on sporadically enough to unlock the needed chapters.

Ayrilana.1396:

Tanner Blackfeather.6509:

That’s not the matter here. This is a question of why they gate some LW3 zones (not BFF) on a character basis.

Since it’s the only one of the four that isn’t, perhaps the question should be why is it not gated like the others.

The answer to that was simple before Lake Doric: it was the only one directly connected to another zone. Granted they could have added a portal to Bloodstone Fen from Verdant Brink but I think they were trying to show that Bloodstone Fen is overall cut off from surrounding areas.

Lake Doric is the real oddity – it has a physical zone portal, like Bitterfrost Frontier, but it requires character determined progression through the story.

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

I don’t think one has to complete the story. Maybe an instance or two?

This is true, I was not accurate when I said “complete”. I meant you had to participate in the story to the point where it takes you into the zone.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Ayrilana.1396:

Tanner Blackfeather.6509:

That’s not the matter here. This is a question of why they gate some LW3 zones (not BFF) on a character basis.

Since it’s the only one of the four that isn’t, perhaps the question should be why is it not gated like the others.

The answer to that was simple before Lake Doric: it was the only one directly connected to another zone. Granted they could have added a portal to Bloodstone Fen from Verdant Brink but I think they were trying to show that Bloodstone Fen is overall cut off from surrounding areas.

Lake Doric is the real oddity – it has a physical zone portal, like Bitterfrost Frontier, but it requires character determined progression through the story.

If you go by one having a connected zone, it’s a 50/50 so you can’t lean one way or the other as to which is an oddity. Your claim that Lake Doric is an oddity is no different than a claim that Bitterfrost is an oddity.

However, we have to take all of the maps into consideration. Anet could very well have added an NPC to interact with on all of the other maps but they didn’t. There’s also the portal scrolls. There’s a higher probability that none of the zones were meant to travel freely to outside of the story, portal scroll, or WP.

The portals never make sense to me in season 3, there is no consistency except the portal scrolls.

ep 1 – no portal
ep 2 – no portal
ep 3 – portal that all of your characters can enter with
ep 4 – portal that only character(s) that have done the story can enter with

I know all about the lore excuse with ep 4 …. ‘but, but …. the guard does not have PERMISSION to let your other characters in’. Ok, explain the ep 3 portal then. I submit ep 3 and ep 4 should be the same as far as whether other characters on your account can use it or not. Obviously all using it is prefereable (the player does not learn anything new doing the same instance multiple times) but uniformity is the key thing.

Menadena.7482:

The portals never make sense to me in season 3, there is no consistency except the portal scrolls.

ep 1 – no portal
ep 2 – no portal
ep 3 – portal that all of your characters can enter with
ep 4 – portal that only character(s) that have done the story can enter with

I know all about the lore excuse with ep 4 …. ‘but, but …. the guard does not have PERMISSION to let your other characters in’. Ok, explain the ep 3 portal then. I submit ep 3 and ep 4 should be the same as far as whether other characters on your account can use it or not. Obviously all using it is prefereable (the player does not learn anything new doing the same instance multiple times) but uniformity is the key thing.

You’re right as uniformity is the key thing. They should prevent zone portal access to Bitterfrost as it’s the only map you can get into without doing the story on that character without having to use the portal scroll or teleport to friend stone.

Consistency is always nice, but closing these maps to characters who have not gained access through the story just means that as people move on to new content, those maps will be less and less populated.

As I said previously, if they wanted to encourage people to purchase the episodes, they should have some other incentive.

There’s a portal scroll for a nominal cost of 1,000 UB which can be earned very quickly. I also doubt that people not getting into the map with alternate characters would noticeably contribute to the player population of the maps.

Ayrilana.1396:

There’s a portal scroll for a nominal cost of 1,000 UB which can be earned very quickly. I also doubt that people not getting into the map with alternate characters would noticeably contribute to the player population of the maps.

Who are you responding to? And I don’t recall that all of the maps being discussed have a portal scroll.

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

There’s a portal scroll for a nominal cost of 1,000 UB which can be earned very quickly. I also doubt that people not getting into the map with alternate characters would noticeably contribute to the player population of the maps.

Who are you responding to? And I don’t recall that all of the maps being discussed have a portal scroll.

It was you, I think. Every map has a portal scroll.

This may be worth bringing up at the next AMA to see if Anet would give us an explanation why the maps were cut off compared to season 2 and why episode 3 was different.

Ayrilana.1396:

Djinn.9245:

Ayrilana.1396:

There’s a portal scroll for a nominal cost of 1,000 UB which can be earned very quickly. I also doubt that people not getting into the map with alternate characters would noticeably contribute to the player population of the maps.

Who are you responding to? And I don’t recall that all of the maps being discussed have a portal scroll.

It was you, I think. Every map has a portal scroll.

This may be worth bringing up at the next AMA to see if Anet would give us an explanation why the maps were cut off compared to season 2 and why episode 3 was different.

Ok, the reason why I was asking who you responded to is because I was talking about having to do the story to get into the map in the first place, not only about alternate characters being able to access the map.

Ayrilana.1396:

If you go by one having a connected zone, it’s a 50/50 so you can’t lean one way or the other as to which is an oddity. Your claim that Lake Doric is an oddity is no different than a claim that Bitterfrost is an oddity.

Except by being the first map directly connected, it set an expectation and the basis. Plus, it isn’t the first zone added – with the exception of Southsun Cove (which was released prior to story journal), all added zones had been physically connected until the Season 3 zones. With exception of Lake Doric, every zone is capable of being reached by the entire account – either immediately or after one character has gained access to the zone (or in Verdant Brink’s case, once HoT is owned access is granted).

Ultimately, it’s a moot point in the end. It’d be nice if ArenaNet formed some sort of consistency, but it’s three different teams so apparently consistency remains one of the things ArenaNet has troubles with.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Ayrilana.1396:

If you go by one having a connected zone, it’s a 50/50 so you can’t lean one way or the other as to which is an oddity. Your claim that Lake Doric is an oddity is no different than a claim that Bitterfrost is an oddity.

Except by being the first map directly connected, it set an expectation and the basis. Plus, it isn’t the first zone added – with the exception of Southsun Cove (which was released prior to story journal), all added zones had been physically connected until the Season 3 zones. With exception of Lake Doric, every zone is capable of being reached by the entire account – either immediately or after one character has gained access to the zone (or in Verdant Brink’s case, once HoT is owned access is granted).

Ultimately, it’s a moot point in the end. It’d be nice if ArenaNet formed some sort of consistency, but it’s three different teams so apparently consistency remains one of the things ArenaNet has troubles with.

Yes, the new areas mark a step away from accessibility for everyone. So did the expansion and so will very likely the next expansion.

The main reason is for arenanet pushing HoT. I doubt they will step back from this stance. The vanilla game is over. Any benefits coming to vanilla non HoT owning players will be at best side effects of overall world changes.

The Living World Season 3 requires HoT no matter if unlocked or not.

This is nothing new. Every MMO on the market works off of the latest expansion and developes the game futher from there.

TCs question (which he even answered himself) was though if there is access to the new story areas without having to go through the story multiple times.

Raven.1524:

I was wondering, shouldn’t the portal for places like Lake Doric be accessible for everyone who cleared the story at least once with a character instead of having to go through the story every time?
I mean, the story is great, but still…. It might be quite handy.
I know there are scrolls to transport you there but am I the only one that finds that kinda weird?

Arenanets solution to the problem of denying access to non-elegible accounts and not forcing multiple story encounters was teleport scrolls.

I think you entirely misunderstood what I was saying, Cyninja.

You make it sound like I’m complaining that you need to own Heart of Thorns to access the Season 3 maps. Trust me, I’m not making that claim.

Rather, what I was saying is that Bloodstone Fen, Ember Bay, and Lake Doric being locked behind character progress is unusual. If we were to follow “the standard” which Ayrilana was talking about, then the standard would be immediate access to the zone for any and every HoT owner (just as Southsun, Dry Top, and Silverwastes are immediately accessible to all owners of the core game – be they F2P or bought it).

Also, ArenaNet can very easily prevent access to Lake Doric without blocking it behind completing Meeting of Ministers on every character. Ignoring the fact they did such with Bitterfrost, they also did such with the HoT zones themselves – players who do not own HoT cannot access Verdant Brink, despite it being physically connected to Silverwastes (and the same goes for the exits out of the guild halls into VB and AB).

Which means they can block access to the maps without locking any of them behind story progress at all.

Now, it’s very clear that they want to get people to learn the preface of the zone (as each one has such, especially for Bloodstone Fen and Lake Doric), but still that’s served by making players do the story once, rather than on each character (without mandating portal scroll purchasing). Ultimately, it’s very likely the reason they have access to the new maps by character-based story progress is to push players into buying those scrolls, giving a heavily-incentivized decrease of Unbound Magic and gold, since both are so easily farmed and are used throughout S3 as currency (particularly the latter for Unbound Magic).

Konig Des Todes.2086:

I think you entirely misunderstood what I was saying, Cyninja.

You make it sound like I’m complaining that you need to own Heart of Thorns to access the Season 3 maps. Trust me, I’m not making that claim.

Rather, what I was saying is that Bloodstone Fen, Ember Bay, and Lake Doric being locked behind character progress is unusual. If we were to follow “the standard” which Ayrilana was talking about, then the standard would be immediate access to the zone for any and every HoT owner (just as Southsun, Dry Top, and Silverwastes are immediately accessible to all owners of the core game – be they F2P or bought it).

Also, ArenaNet can very easily prevent access to Lake Doric without blocking it behind completing Meeting of Ministers on every character. Ignoring the fact they did such with Bitterfrost, they also did such with the HoT zones themselves – players who do not own HoT cannot access Verdant Brink, despite it being physically connected to Silverwastes (and the same goes for the exits out of the guild halls into VB and AB).

Which means they can block access to the maps without locking any of them behind story progress at all.

Now, it’s very clear that they want to get people to learn the preface of the zone (as each one has such, especially for Bloodstone Fen and Lake Doric), but still that’s served by making players do the story once, rather than on each character (without mandating portal scroll purchasing). Ultimately, it’s very likely the reason they have access to the new maps by character-based story progress is to push players into buying those scrolls, giving a heavily-incentivized decrease of Unbound Magic and gold, since both are so easily farmed and are used throughout S3 as currency (particularly the latter for Unbound Magic).

Things change between seasons. Season 1 content was temporarily, for example, and content became permanent with season 2. Should S2 content not be permanent in order to be consistent? There were differences between PvP seasons although they were minor (depending on who you speak with).

Anet started out S3 with map access requiring progression of the story, portal scrolls, or teleport to friend stones. This occurred for two episodes, didn’t for one, and resumed with the one after that. Since 3/4 episodes require you to use one of the methods listed above, you can assume that’s intended. This means that episode 3 is the abnormal one.

In any case, reasons can be made in either directions with some being strong than others. It’s still going to come down to what Anet’s intention is which overrides any reasoning that we have no matter how logical we may find it.

“Things change between seasons.”

Which is exactly what I was talking about in the second half of the post, if you had read it at all.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

“Things change between seasons.”

Which is exactly what I was talking about in the second half of the post, if you had read it at all.

Pulling that out of context from the rest of my post doesn’t mean that I didn’t read your post.

Well you didn’t actually respond to the post you quoted so…

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Well you didn’t actually respond to the post you quoted so…

I did.

There might be reason to think Doric is the outlier in many ways. Compare what you can get from the UM vendor to the prior maps. There are no services to get a chance of karma from a kill. There are no ways to change stats on the ascended trinkets.