Guild Wars 2

I just wanted to shout my complete and utter admiration for your brilliance in matching servers.

Not only did you manage to pair up the lowest ranking servers with any others, but – my best congratulations – numbers like servers haveing zergs of 100+ to servers like Vabbi (mine) with zergs at best of 30+ (if at all, most times we have 10-20).

It is now like our esteemed skilled zergies are splitting up their zergs, because 50 are enough already.

Using superior siege as defence and oil and so on did not even slow those masses.

I really would like to see the actual population numbers of the servers.
As long as there is no cap on entering WvW based on server population, WvW is just pathetic.

Yes, we are fighting back.
Yes we are killing those others guerilla style.
Yes we switch borders to get keeps and towers and so on.
Yes, we try to use any advantage we can muster.

And no, this is not whining.

It is just no fun (most of the time), if you just get steamrollered and there is nothing you can do to change this fact.

And yes, one could switch server – if i wanted to.
But this would not solve the problem(s).

I would ask Arena net for some inforamtion and, i would really appreciate it, some attempts to solve it or even a solution.

Best wishes…

PS: you can keep any typos

So basically you want them to somehow artificially strengthen your server or weaken the others servers simply because they happen to have more people than you?

lordkrall.7241:

So basically you want them to somehow artificially strengthen your server or weaken the others servers simply because they happen to have more people than you?

Your reading comprehension skills need a lot of polishing. I’ve noticed it in many other threads, but it has become obvious here.

Thalador.4218:

Your reading comprehension skills need a lot of polishing. I’ve noticed it in many other threads, but it has become obvious here.

Oh, feel free to explain what he meant then, because as far as I understand it he simply wanted ArenaNet to make changes so that his server got artificially stronger.

Lugaedh.3609:

I just wanted to shout my complete and utter admiration for your brilliance in matching servers.

Not only did you manage to pair up the lowest ranking servers with any others, but – my best congratulations – numbers like servers haveing zergs of 100+ to servers like Vabbi (mine) with zergs at best of 30+ (if at all, most times we have 10-20).

It is now like our esteemed skilled zergies are splitting up their zergs, because 50 are enough already.

Using superior siege as defence and oil and so on did not even slow those masses.

I really would like to see the actual population numbers of the servers.
As long as there is no cap on entering WvW based on server population, WvW is just pathetic.

Yes, we are fighting back.
Yes we are killing those others guerilla style.
Yes we switch borders to get keeps and towers and so on.
Yes, we try to use any advantage we can muster.

And no, this is not whining.

It is just no fun (most of the time), if you just get steamrollered and there is nothing you can do to change this fact.

And yes, one could switch server – if i wanted to.
But this would not solve the problem(s).

I would ask Arena net for some inforamtion and, i would really appreciate it, some attempts to solve it or even a solution.

Best wishes…

PS: you can keep any typos

Read the bolded.

OP wants a more fair matching of servers for the WvW league based on similar world populations. He also proposed to limit the number of player entries to WvW in order to even the odds when a low population server is playing with a high one – which is very unlikely to happen.

Notice the complete lack of words regarding mechanical strengthening or weakening? I hope so.

Isn’t however limiting the number of players to “even the odds” quite a bit like mechanically weaken a server?

Vabbi is in a league of the nine bottom-ranked European worlds, which means it’s already fighting the closest competition available while still staying in the nine-world rotation. Even if one or more of the other Bronze-ranked worlds have enough of a WvW-playing population to crush it, there simply are no “more appropriate” worlds to match it with left. Since the match-ups rotate over the season, Vabbi is going to have to play against everyone in the Bronze league sooner or later.

The only alternatives are to either create an even smaller league (probably impractical) or to somehow buff the lowest worlds. Capping WvW population based on world population is effectively a buff for low-population servers, since it keeps larger worlds (who are still in the Bronze league) from using their full population, up to the normal WvW limits.

I think the struggle is just going to have to continue until a more favorable match-up rotates in. That’s very frustrating and discouraging, I’m sure, but that’s just going to happen in a multiple-round tournament.

lordkrall.7241:

Isn’t however limiting the number of players to “even the odds” quite a bit like mechanically weaken a server?

As mentioned above, it was an unlikely proposition – although I’d argue that the high population servers would still have the upper hand thanks to having more WvW-expert guilds. It would be unfair in the sense of preventing players from playing WvW (just like it’s happening now because the achievement-hunters flooding the borderlands and EB).

Still, in no way did the OP want such. His stance is understandable; ANet should have done a better job at world pairings. That is what his post is about.

Thank you Thalador.

I would even go so far and say, that overpowered servers have no fun too – it is far too easy….

Thalador.4218:

Still, in no way did the OP want such. His stance is understandable; ANet should have done a better job at world pairings. That is what his post is about.

Here’s the schedule for Vabbi:

Vabbi | Whiteside | Fissure
Vabbi | Surmia | Dzagonur
Vabbi | Drakkar | Blacktide
Vabbi | Arborstone | Ring of Fire
-Repeats Start-
Vabbi | Vabbi | Whiteside | Arborstone
Vabbi | Fissure | Blacktide
Vabbi | Whiteside | Fissure

They play everyone in the bottom nine at least once, the bottom five twice and they play Whiteside and Fissue three times each. Vabbi, Whiteside, and Fissure are the three-lowest-ranked European servers, and they see each other the most in the rankings.

What alternative is there? Always make sure Vabbi is paired up with at least one of Whiteside or Fissue? The leaves the third world to crush them both, without a strong world to keep it in check. Have Vabbi fight the bottom five only once, and spend more than two weeks on Whiteside/Fissue? Have more than three leagues, so that Vabbi never has to play the top four of the current nine? After a point, you quit having a tournament and just become normal WvW again.

I’m sympathetic to anyone who comes in last in a tournament, but, ultimately, Vabbi is the bottom-ranked EU server and they’re going to have some rough match-ups until they’ve played through everyone once and are allowed to start repeating.

If someone would like to try cooking up a better league schedule than the current one, at least as far as the bottom nine are concerned, I would like to see it.

Lugaedh.3609:

I just wanted to shout my complete and utter admiration for your brilliance in matching servers.

Not only did you manage to pair up the lowest ranking servers with any others, but – my best congratulations – numbers like servers haveing zergs of 100+ to servers like Vabbi (mine) with zergs at best of 30+ (if at all, most times we have 10-20).

It is now like our esteemed skilled zergies are splitting up their zergs, because 50 are enough already.

Using superior siege as defence and oil and so on did not even slow those masses.

I really would like to see the actual population numbers of the servers.
As long as there is no cap on entering WvW based on server population, WvW is just pathetic.

Yes, we are fighting back.
Yes we are killing those others guerilla style.
Yes we switch borders to get keeps and towers and so on.
Yes, we try to use any advantage we can muster.

And no, this is not whining.

It is just no fun (most of the time), if you just get steamrollered and there is nothing you can do to change this fact.

And yes, one could switch server – if i wanted to.
But this would not solve the problem(s).

I would ask Arena net for some inforamtion and, i would really appreciate it, some attempts to solve it or even a solution.

Best wishes…

PS: you can keep any typos

I totally understand you. My server is now fighting with Vabbi and Drakkar Lake, this match is just pathethic. I feel really sorry for Vabbi because it’s the lowest population server, it’s laughable that we can’t take a single tower without Drakkar 100 people zerg attacking us. They have ALL in Eternal, ALL their border, most Vabbi and most Blacktide. How servers like ours can be matched with them? We lost our last match and we’re now paired with even BETTER server? Even though Blacktide is “Very high” populated, people doesn’t play WvW and in weeks like this it’s just even more pathetic than usual… I just wanted my living world to be done, but it’s impossible to even gain a single rank there, because they have huge zerg in every possible place. And even better is that they make fun of us, letting us damage gate to 10% and then killing all of us /laughing. Very encouraging, indeed.
I will now stop complaining, but game is supposed to be fun, not torment.

Paciunek.2496:

How servers like ours can be matched with them? We lost our last match and we’re now paired with even BETTER server?

By “our last match,” you mean last week, against Ring of Fire and Whiteside Ridge?

Wins/losses in the league don’t change who you face each round, since the schedule was set last month before the league started, based on the WvW leaderboard at the time. The nine lowest-ranked worlds were grouped together into the Bronze league, so even if Drakkar is much more powerful than you, you’re all still within the bottom nine. (At the time, anyway. Drakkar has managed to overtake Underworld since the tournament started, but it’s still in the Bronze league.)

(Bold = higher rank, italics = lower rank)
Blacktide | Surmia | Arborstone
Blacktide | Ring of Fire | Whiteside
Blacktide | Drakkar | Vabbi
Blacktide | Fissure | Dzagonur
-Repeats Start-
Blacktide | Ring of Fire | Dzagonur
Blacktide | Fissure | Vabbi
Blacktide | Arborstone | Surmia

If it’s any consolation, at least you won’t be fighting Drakkar again. Since Blacktide is the mid-tier Bronze world, it gets more variation in its competition than Vabbi, and it has a pretty even spread of worlds that are higher/lower than it, never having to play a world more than twice at most. Except for weeks five and six, Blacktide always has one world higher than it, and one lower, in each match-up.

There’s no arguing that Drakkar is a big fish in a little lake, so hopefully your other matches will go better!

I think this idea of a cap on WvW is a great idea. It would encourage people to spread out among the servers and not all try to jump on T1 servers for the sake of winning.

What I think would work would be if each server could have X + 1 people in a WvW map at a given time where X is the number of people from the server who has the least amount of people on… which has a minimum of some sort… determined by the lowest seen population in WvW for a server. This would encourage people to spread out among the servers so that they could get the most amount of people on at a given time as well as encourage large servers to play against large servers so that they could get their full force in there instead of losing to drop down to face lower population servers (which is currently a serious problem).

The other alternative is to scrap the leagues, which many people said they didn’t want in the first place, and go back to stable match-making like we had at launch.

Vick.6805:

The other alternative is to scrap the leagues, which many people said they didn’t want in the first place, and go back to stable match-making like we had at launch.

This won’t discourage people from all trying to be on a T1 server though… I know that isn’t exactly the true intent behind all this, but personally I’d love to see the population more evenly spread out.

callidus.7085:

Vick.6805:

The other alternative is to scrap the leagues, which many people said they didn’t want in the first place, and go back to stable match-making like we had at launch.

This won’t discourage people from all trying to be on a T1 server though… I know that isn’t exactly the true intent behind all this, but personally I’d love to see the population more evenly spread out.

Honestly, if people want to be on T1 servers, deal with queues, and zerg day in and day out, they’re welcome to it. I’ve been there, and I honestly didn’t think it was that great. My concern is that smaller servers should actually be able to play WvW effectively at whatever level they’re at, instead of having matches that are decided in the first few hours.

What is this thread in the LS discussion? Move to WvW please.

WvW Season 1 is listed under Living Story for achievements, so it could reasonably go here or there. None of the posters can move it, and if the mods were going to move it, I think they already would have.

As for scrapping leagues, I can see an argument either way, for having the league (fresh competition, a new event to follow along with,) and not having it (everyone stays paired up against their rivals.) There’s no strictly right answer, but it makes sense that they’d try something new. If it proves widely unpopular, they might have second thoughts before hosting season 2, but as long as the event is temporary, I think it’s a worthwhile experiment.

The only REAL Soulution would be to just merge the 3 Servers into 1, which would even give the other Servers more Ressources.. I mean srsly low populated Servers are just unneeded just merge them and made a mid server out of it.. Problem solved.

If there were a population cap your opponents could control by not participating in the game mode, WvW might as well not exist at all. One side would night cap all four maps the very first day then log in with the bare minimum players so that nobody could take them back. And that’s just one of dozens of exploits I can think up on the spot. If you just lowered the cap period then you might as well just shrink it slightly, remove siege and the point system and make it an oversized SPvP map.

What it needs is both personal and group bonuses for organized combat, movement, and placement; as well as penalties for unorganized combat, movement, and placement. So long as the most efficient method of play is to stack as large a group of players as possible in to as small an area as possible, effectively making those players nearly immune to AoE and the downed state, nothing can be done vs zerging. The games most basic mechanics do not function in this game mode and need to be fixed.

keichi.5107:

The only REAL Soulution would be to just merge the 3 Servers into 1, which would even give the other Servers more Ressources.. I mean srsly low populated Servers are just unneeded just merge them and made a mid server out of it.. Problem solved.

Low population servers aren’t the only servers with imbalanced match-ups, though.

I’m currently on EBay, which is a mid-tier server, and we consistently have matches where we’re either blown away by a higher-tier server with 3-4x our numbers, or we steamroll lower-tier servers with 1/4 our numbers. Neither situation is enjoyable over a week-long match.

Merging servers isn’t the answer; just allow servers to play opponents that are on a closer tier deviation than the matches we have now. Skill doesn’t even play into it anymore.

lordkrall.7241:

Isn’t however limiting the number of players to “even the odds” quite a bit like mechanically weaken a server?

How about just simply, and not stupidly, matching a low pop server against 2 higher ones. It’s fine if you have 2 lower pops against one high one. They can, and do ally. Doesn’t always help, but it can. When you have two server with much higher pops against one that doesn’t even have the number of one of them, much less both? May as well hand out the KY and just hold your self open to ease the way.
And spare me any crap about they don’t know. They log the activity. They know what numbers what servers have. And how many WvW. This isn’t genetic engineering.