Guild Wars 2

My personal expectations of the Living Story were something along the lines of what was delivered in Flame and Frost (but with more permanent additions). The content was designed in a way so that the player felt like he was actively contributing to the story and that the Molten Alliance was defeated with the players playing a pivotal role.

But now, all I can see as far as the Living Story is concerned is two weeks of throwaway minigames bound up by content that I personally consider a joke. Cutthroat Politics is really the last straw for me, as ALL the man hours for this content were spent in minigames.

I do not play the Living Story for minigames, and I never will. I did not buy Guild Wars because I was expecting updates containing throwaway content released every two weeks. If you want to release lots of temporary content, that’s fine, but please stop with the throwaway minigames. I’m sick of them, and it goes against the idea of a living STORY.

I want the living story to be a STORY, not just a new carnival every two weeks.

For the reasons above, I consider Bazaar of the Four Winds/Cutthroat Politics to be the weakest chapter in the Living Story by far and beyond. I would like this trend to stop, and it is for this reason I am posting today.

I agree with that opinion. I don’t mind a mini game from time to time or tied in with holiday events. But really the current trend has to stop, it’s getting worse and worse.

Like the OP said the F&F arc is looking better and better every two weeks. My main complaint about it was that is was too slow, and that the MF was temporary despite being the best dungeon to date. Both of these concerns are actually adressed now, BUT you have also moved away from any other concepts presented during F&F. A story that takes place in the world in the and affects the world. Yea there are results like this election but it seems the majority of the work goes into the mini-games. They have to much focus and feel very misplaced.

For example, southsun survival would’ve been a great introduction of the island back in november, with a background in players being crash survivors and discovering the island before the consortium moves in. Instead, the concept for the minigame is just the rich corporation running entertainment for the masses.

I dont like it that way, I think you can do better.

The next living story update will introduce a cycling schedule of mini-games (it’s in both candidates promises, so we know it’s coming). That means these minigames aren’t going to be thrown away, but rather introduced into a permanent, repeating cycle.

The Wintersday and Dragon Bash minigames will reoccur annually, while Crab Toss, Sanctum Sprint, Southsun Survival, and Aspect Arena will be the start of the new cycling minigames.

Players wanted the living story content to be more permanent, so Anet is creating a way to make any living story minigames that get added permanent content, without getting too stale. They need a variety of minigames to start that off, so we’ve gotten a lot of minigames for the last few living story chapters. I agree that it’s been an overload of minigames recently, but I expect it to balance out soon.

It’s nice to know that, all I want is a break from the minigames in the next living story cycle. This one has been REALLY bad because of that, and I actually think ArenaNet should rethink having the Living World team developing minigames. If they are going to put a focus on them (as the candidates have promised), make a minigame team and let the Living World teams focus on the Living World.

Did you forget about the jumping puzzles? there has been a flood of jumping puzzles in the past contents….

I’m leveling my Guardian. Bazaar with its grind right after the Bash grind and then more mini games did me in, too.

Zylonite.5913:

Did you forget about the jumping puzzles? there has been a flood of jumping puzzles in the past contents….

I don’t think many of us purchased an active combat MMO to play jumping puzzles either.

Thomas Kaira.7863:

I want the living story to be a STORY, not just a new carnival every two weeks.

I want it to be a good story… not what we are getting so far.

but I still like those mini games, best I’ve ever come across in an MMO. I just would rather the living story not suffer because all the time was put into mini games.

I love guild wars 2 but I do have to agree if all I really have to look forward to is the next mini game every 2 weeks in an MMO and what is gonna be added to the gem store then this game really doesn’t offer me much long term gameplay that has a purpose.

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Can’t really spoil anything but August has no jumping puzzle and we definitely wanted to steer away from instanced mini-games.

Thank you very much

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Can’t really spoil anything but August has no jumping puzzle and we definitely wanted to steer away from instanced mini-games.

So…non-instanced minigame? :P

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Can’t really spoil anything but August has no jumping puzzle and we definitely wanted to steer away from instanced mini-games.

You just made my day. I think we have seen enough mini games and jumping puzzles for a while. Thanks a lot for the heads up. Just an idea: why don’t you guys introduce new world events and some new dragon bosses. I am sure everyone loves fighting big dragons in groups.

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Can’t really spoil anything but August has no jumping puzzle and we definitely wanted to steer away from instanced mini-games.

Thank goodness (though I don’t mind jumping puzzles at all ) In the future, I personally wish you’d leave the mini games more to festivals and also back off on the specific achievements in them (which tend to promote unintended gameplay.)

I agree emphatically with the OP. I hate both minigames and jumping puzzles, but love WvW and loved the Molten Facility. I did not buy this game and over $100 worth of gems to get more tedious non-combat content.

We need new WvW maps in a rotation far more than we need another annoying minigame or JP. Either that, or this game isn’t what I thought I was getting when I purchased it….

I personally enjoy the mini games and jumping puzzles and think it’s somewhat strange to see people who say they DON’T play them, asking them not to be added. If they are added and you don’t play them, how does that affect you exactly?

That said, I can sort of understand why ANet may not leave the mini-games in permanently because, I can imagine that once people got their achievement points from them, most wouldn’t bother touching them again, so adding them every now and again keeps them fresh.

That said, I would like to see permanent, light and friendly mini-games in the cities. ANet said prior to release that there would be mini games in the cities…yet they were never added. I remember a video with a shot in Divinity’s Reach and people doing some sort of archery thing at that little place near the Busted Flaggon, yet it sits as decoration.

As I say, I enjoy the mini-games etc….and like them when they are added, however more meaty story….and MORE content that involves what is the best feature of this game (imo) which is dynamic events.

I feel as if dynamic events are not being utilised to their fullest atm in terms of the living story. Although that may well be, because when ANet tried it, people complained endlessly.

I love most of the mini games, and think their plan moving forward (rotating mini games) is a good one that allows these games to coexist beside the more visceral content (dungeons, DEs, etc).

I say keep throwing mini games at us – as long as they come alongside dungeons, DEs, story quests, JPs, fractals and all of the other goodies we love.

Something for everyone (with optional achievements tagged onto each game element) – hard to argue with that.

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Variety is good for the game, especially a balanced variety. If we make too much of any one type of content, eventually that type of content will become tiresome. The purpose of my reply wasn’t to naysay jumping puzzles or activities, but just to let you know that something different is coming. Personally, I’m a huge fan of epic open-world dynamic events and since I’ve had a hand or two in the upcoming releases, you should get ready.

As the late Captain Mai once said, watch the skies.

I agree, the Karka Evasion and taking it back was absolutely fantastic. Granted, a large amount of folks missed it causing grief, but it was one of the best events so far.

There was a permanent change to LA (Lighthouse)
It actually effected all of us, and we rallied to push the foes back. We then went to their home and defeated the queen in a fun battle.

After that, the only things I enjoyed were Molten Facility and the Aetherblade Retreat. But AR was a hard dungeon to find people to join.

Can we also get some new permanent dungeons. Most of the ones we have now are pretty easy and theres so many guides that even arah doesnt take much skill to get through. This doesnt mean that the dungeons we have need to be changed. What we need are new dungeons and new areas to explore.

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Variety is good for the game, especially a balanced variety. If we make too much of any one type of content, eventually that type of content will become tiresome. The purpose of my reply wasn’t to naysay jumping puzzles or activities, but just to let you know that something different is coming. Personally, I’m a huge fan of epic open-world dynamic events and since I’ve had a hand or two in the upcoming releases, you should get ready.

As the late Captain Mai once said, watch the skies.

Late? I never heard anything about her dying, only that she was incarcerated. Is there something in it?

Phate.4871:

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Variety is good for the game, especially a balanced variety. If we make too much of any one type of content, eventually that type of content will become tiresome. The purpose of my reply wasn’t to naysay jumping puzzles or activities, but just to let you know that something different is coming. Personally, I’m a huge fan of epic open-world dynamic events and since I’ve had a hand or two in the upcoming releases, you should get ready.

As the late Captain Mai once said, watch the skies.

Late? I never heard anything about her dying, only that she was incarcerated. Is there something in it?

I Figured he didn’t mean it in that way, but wondered it as well.

I liked the idea of having 2 weeks of playground type content — but the 2 weeks ended and nothing really took its place. I mean, c’mon — finish dynamic events in the candidate’s home world? Do a dungeon? Complete a fractal? All great activities, but calling it new content because we have to remember to double click a button first doesn’t really fly.

This is by far the weakest living story content we’ve seen. No, wait, there was the heroically epic sign repair at the beginning of Flame and Frost… That’s a whole lot like clicking an I Like Evon button before doing a dungeon.

Phate.4871:

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Variety is good for the game, especially a balanced variety. If we make too much of any one type of content, eventually that type of content will become tiresome. The purpose of my reply wasn’t to naysay jumping puzzles or activities, but just to let you know that something different is coming. Personally, I’m a huge fan of epic open-world dynamic events and since I’ve had a hand or two in the upcoming releases, you should get ready.

As the late Captain Mai once said, watch the skies.

Late? I never heard anything about her dying, only that she was incarcerated. Is there something in it?

She’s lying on the cell floor and looks dead to me.

You had to run past the cell that she was lying in to talk to Magnus and Ellen at the top of the tower to start the Bazaar (Bizarre?) of the Four Winds.

PolarisNova.3867:

I personally enjoy the mini games and jumping puzzles and think it’s somewhat strange to see people who say they DON’T play them, asking them not to be added. If they are added and you don’t play them, how does that affect you exactly?

Don’t forget there are a lot of people who are “completionists”. Using myself as an example, I don’t really like mini-games or jump puzzles, but have no problem with them being in the game when I can tackle them as quickly or as slowly as I wish. The problem with the constant temporary mini-games are we’re forced to focus on them immediately, and when they’re coming at you temp content after temp content… it’s no different from a completionist who may not run a lot of dungeons being tired of all the temporary dungeons (coupled with skins and achievements). Bottom line: I think people are tired in general of all the temporary anything with skins/titles/achievements. It’s good that there’s new content, but it honestly wouldn’t hurt to have downtime between each content release so people can catch up on whatever it is that appeals to them, especially when the playerbase tends to be more casual in nature.

Shiren.9532:

I don’t think many of us purchased an active combat MMO to play jumping puzzles either.

Actually I bought this game partially because of jumping puzzles. I haven’t really seen a mmo use them that much in the past. Even if they did there wasn’t basically no reward. I’m a reward driven player myself.

I specifically like following features in GW2 (which all contributed to my decision to get it):

• Dynamic events (though in all honesty I’m a bit dissapointed here – still better than wall of text quests in other games though)
• Open world cooperation (no exp loss, equal rewards)
• Active combat (even if I would like to dodge more)
• Jumping puzzles/mini dungeons (especially soloable/cooperative ones)
• Ability to revisit old areas (“sidekicking”)
• Armor appearance customization (though I am still waiting for alternate armor tab and costume creator for event items)
• Level of polish and detail (sadly does not apply to living world stuff)

I’m not dissapointed to dynamic events in general even if they get a tad repetitive. I’m dissapointed to world boss events i.e. shatterer fight where you have to make an effort to even get downed because the enemy is pretty much incapable of harming you if you stand on the side. They are just boring. I’d like to see a team that fixes these.

Also I’m dissapointed that many zones just feel like beautiful scenery. They lack actual interesting game mechanics. For example I always wonder why insides of the Volcano in Mount Maelstrom does not apply constant burning or similar effect. This would make the great destroyer fight more interesting. Doubly so if you have some Asuran invented ways to counter it. Similarly if we later get a desert I bet none of the survival stuff applies there which is kind of sad considering food and drink items would finally have more demand.

Similarly why water doesn’t have deceptive currents that pull you around or why high areas don’t have winds (other than in jumping puzzles) that would make them more interesting.

They may have treated zones artistically as characters but they certainly lack any mechanics that would give them depth.

As for minigames. I’m still waiting for a less competitive minigames like fishing (which I would like to see done in breath of fire 3 style). I do enjoy games like sanctum sprint and crab toss but I don’t foresee myself doing them constantly. Pretty much same as with my PvP and WvW in general.

Also honorary mention goes to achievement system. I’m achievement junkie. Originally I was very sad to learn there wouldn’t be GW style achievement system where you would earn new skills and stuff through it. Luckily they changed that.

Edit: Also forgot to mention I bought it partially because of promise of underwater content. There isn’t really that much meaningful underwater content which has been a dissapointed… hopefully this gets better with the water dragons.

Jumping Puzzle achivements? Ok.
PvP related achivements? Not ok. I’m against it with my both hands… and my left leg.

Yeah I don’t like all the mini games or the JP’s but they keep coming, why bother to complain. It’s nice that a Dev responded, twice even, but I have really lowered my expectations and I highly recommend that to all the folks that play. There are many promises made for improvements to LS and to the game and IMO they are not delivered on.

Just want to add my voice that if I wanted to play mini-games, jumping games, and gamble, I would go either to Club Penguin, Facebook or a real Casisno.

So far we have not seen any substantial real new PVE content. I don’t consider Southsun or the whole jumping puzzle zone as substantial, that’s flufftent pure and simple. Southsun is a tiny island. You can explore it in minutes.

When the Living Story first started, it looked like old areas would get some love and new content, but instead we just got temporary instances. Meanwhile the other two areas of the game Spvp and WvW are languishing, with nothing but very small technical tweaks and addtions, but nothing I would consider substantial.

Here we are coming up on a year, and the game clearly has become a kind of 8th grade playground with silly mini-games, jumping puzzles and which just happens to include gambling, while the MMO part is more of a backdrop and themed GUI than the actual content. So many places are completely deserted now like Orr, and most of the mid level zones with the exception of the clockwork world chest events repeating like tired animated shop displays.

I am glad WvW has not been infected with all this kiddy fluff. I just wish some actual new areas were added or at least the existing ones make a little less samey.

Lastly ‘look to the skys’ I hope does not refer to another 2 minute cut scene or marginal fireworks show.

folks, don’t expect too much. things may sound awesome until you see what it is like.

there were good things. liked the haloween instance for example. liked the karka event, and the molten alliance dungeon. Also the aetherblades instance. also the crystal jumping stuff during the bazaar was nice (to me). did not like the jumping puzzle-doing, and the “kill 500 xy” achievements. did not like the meta achievement rewards, and yeah, did not like most minigames so far.

but free content is free, i don’t expect them to come up with “real” new zones to explore. i rather expect more RNG, more “daily” grind (ressource nodes), and other stuff that may try to “keep us log in every day”. in the end, they want our money. So we have to log in so that we can see the “important new items in the store”, and maybe buy.

in the end, they can not expand the game so fast that we have a reason to log in every day to explore new content. most people dont need this anyway. decent ways to farm, reachable goals and fun with guilds and friends (and enemies in WvW) is probably what most people want.

It would be great if some of these minigames went to the custom arena. I don’t have a huge problem with them, it’s just a little boring not being able to do some of these with friends. Since they used the PVP setup anyway it seems like a no brainier and get more activity for the custom arena kits.

Voldemort?!

Poor Mai. An Avada Kedavra is coming her way.

PolarisNova.3867:

I personally enjoy the mini games and jumping puzzles and think it’s somewhat strange to see people who say they DON’T play them, asking them not to be added. If they are added and you don’t play them, how does that affect you exactly?

The reason, as I see it, is that there’s an assumption being made where if ANet would just stop making content for “you” then they would start spending their resources making content for “me.” Of course, this assumption is totally baseless. GW2 has many people who are fans for different reasons and many people to please, some with money on the line who may not even play the game. Just because they aren’t spending time or money on X doesn’t mean they are going to spend it on Y when there’s 24 other letters of the alphabet they have to cover.

While new minigames are good, I’d love if they added some variety instead of always different PvP type games. I’m a primary PvE players, so when I have to compete with others in minigames, I’m not as big of a fan. If they added some of the games that they were hinting before launch and are partially in game, like target shooting in LA and Divinities Reach that would be sweet!

Or you know, polymock

We have mini-games now…. That is good.. When the game launched we really didnt have squat like the videos talked about.. We have jumping puzzles… A million of them. I dont like them personally, but occasionally I will do them. It is different for me….. Anthony – lets get back to the dynamic events. Thats where the living story personnel should be focusing. We want perma content. Temp content is good too when balanced. But if we are talking about a true ‘living story’ here, then strong, rewarding dynamic events are the way to go. IMHO…

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Variety is good for the game, especially a balanced variety. If we make too much of any one type of content, eventually that type of content will become tiresome. The purpose of my reply wasn’t to naysay jumping puzzles or activities, but just to let you know that something different is coming. Personally, I’m a huge fan of epic open-world dynamic events and since I’ve had a hand or two in the upcoming releases, you should get ready.

As the late Captain Mai once said, watch the skies.

I hope it’s a dragon. A dragon attack for the one year anniversary would be really awesome. I sometimes look at the GW2 logo, see the 2 and remember this game used to be about dragons. It’s been too long.

I don’t hate the new contents but story-wise, I think they are weak because there aren’t many story development elements in BotFW (the new jumping skills was enjoyable though), from what I see, we go to another festival, enjoy what it gives us (mostly the mini-game imo). Now we are supporting for our candidate by playing more mini-games, give them our support tokens, and wait for the result. I can see where this is going but honestly I want to see more interaction with the Living Story.
Personally, I’m looking forward to see how the Living Story will turn out, some story or lore about the rest of the elder dragons (it weems there will be more in the future, see the link http://www.usgamer.net/articles/colin-johanson-talks-dungeons-dragons-and-chairs), new dungeons like Aether Retreat, new weapons for my Elementalist (an Ele using pistol would be awesome but it’s just a dream atm). It’s a lot to ask but I can’t help but wondering.
Sorry for my broken English :P

I agree 110% we all remember GW2 trailer where it was against Dragons and the problem i see or we are missing is that after you kill or “fight” Zhaitan basically nothing changes with the dragons and everything happens in the Personal Story and does not affect the real world or maybe not affect but what like the risen trying to summon Zhaitan or something like the svanir tried with jormag. I think we lived a true living story on Frame And Frost and the molten Alliance where you had EVENTS added everywhere on the map. People remember we love how “quest” are handled in this game like events. Living Story SHOULD be made around events. Who remember mapping and area when suddenly and event pops up Defeat the molten alliance and then some people were in the chat asking for help and very few times i completed those events by myself most of the time there was somebody else. …… That is a Living Story! Its funny how the events are more dynamic that a boss fight were you just stand at the side or do nothing like SB you just stand there and shot at him… Jormag is the only boss you actually need to do something. ArenaNet should improve this they are just to easy.

Mini games and JP … well is good to have them rather than not but i believe very few play this game because of that or enjoy them! I tried to avoid them every time i can. They are not my thing. but the point is Living Story became boring because everything is on instances and not in the real game or Can i play the Living History at
wayfarer foothills? or at Diessa Plateau like we could with the molten alliance. No we cant.

Phate.4871:

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Variety is good for the game, especially a balanced variety. If we make too much of any one type of content, eventually that type of content will become tiresome. The purpose of my reply wasn’t to naysay jumping puzzles or activities, but just to let you know that something different is coming. Personally, I’m a huge fan of epic open-world dynamic events and since I’ve had a hand or two in the upcoming releases, you should get ready.

As the late Captain Mai once said, watch the skies.

Late? I never heard anything about her dying, only that she was incarcerated. Is there something in it?

I think he is referring to the fact that mai is no longer a captain as she is incarcerated when he says “late”.

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

You’re all correct, Mai isn’t dead. She might as well be though, after she answers to you-know-who.

Good.

I want her rapier.

NAO!

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Variety is good for the game, especially a balanced variety. If we make too much of any one type of content, eventually that type of content will become tiresome. The purpose of my reply wasn’t to naysay jumping puzzles or activities, but just to let you know that something different is coming. Personally, I’m a huge fan of epic open-world dynamic events and since I’ve had a hand or two in the upcoming releases, you should get ready.

As the late Captain Mai once said, watch the skies.

I’m going to be blunt here. I’m sick of the current renditions of the living story. I hope it changes to something that seems less beta disposable content. I actually love minigames. The game has managed to make me start hating them.

you know anthony i like your responses it sounds like the ls may go somewhere hopefully with some meat. dont get wrong i like extra activities(jp, minigames) but weve gotten enough for a bit and they will be permanent rotation which is good. but thwe op is correct

PolarisNova.3867:

I personally enjoy the mini games and jumping puzzles and think it’s somewhat strange to see people who say they DON’T play them, asking them not to be added. If they are added and you don’t play them, how does that affect you exactly?

It affects everyone actually. If the Living Story teams are working on jumping puzzles and mini-games, then the rest of the content suffers. There needs to be a balance.

Kain Francois.4328:

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

You’re all correct, Mai isn’t dead. She might as well be though, after she answers to you-know-who.

Good.

I want her rapier.

NAO!

That´s what she said!

Wait .. what? 0_o

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

I’m a huge fan of epic open-world dynamic events and since I’ve had a hand or two in the upcoming releases, you should get ready.

I’ll be interested to find out your definition of ‘epic’

Serenity.6149:

PolarisNova.3867:

I personally enjoy the mini games and jumping puzzles and think it’s somewhat strange to see people who say they DON’T play them, asking them not to be added. If they are added and you don’t play them, how does that affect you exactly?

Don’t forget there are a lot of people who are “completionists”. Using myself as an example, I don’t really like mini-games or jump puzzles, but have no problem with them being in the game when I can tackle them as quickly or as slowly as I wish. The problem with the constant temporary mini-games are we’re forced to focus on them immediately, and when they’re coming at you temp content after temp content… it’s no different from a completionist who may not run a lot of dungeons being tired of all the temporary dungeons (coupled with skins and achievements). Bottom line: I think people are tired in general of all the temporary anything with skins/titles/achievements. It’s good that there’s new content, but it honestly wouldn’t hurt to have downtime between each content release so people can catch up on whatever it is that appeals to them, especially when the playerbase tends to be more casual in nature.

I tend to be one of those who lean towards the completionist side as well…but I hold my hands up and say I can’t really do everything and that’s okay. I do what I can/and what interests me and leave the rest alone.

That said Mr.Dev I look forward to more awesome dynamic events. I also remember waiting at the lighthouse in Lion’s Arch waiting for what was coming, and I had a blast.

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Personally, I’m a huge fan of epic open-world dynamic events and since I’ve had a hand or two in the upcoming releases, you should get ready.

Last one i see was highly unplayable as billions of players and karkas simply ruined the servers…

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Can’t really spoil anything but August has no jumping puzzle and we definitely wanted to steer away from instanced mini-games.

THANK YOU SO MUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!

Personally I’m not to keen on either minigames or JPs. Tried them for the achievement and never returned. Some people are happy with it and that’s fine, but I wholeheartedly agree with the OP – minigame festival content isn’t what I’m expecting from the Living Story.
Expanded lore and perhaps new worldwide events that would help populate barren mid-level maps and encourage ppl to explore would be much more welcome.

Glad to hear there will be shift from so many instanced minigames.