Guild Wars 2

You like Bell Choir. I get that. You like JPs. I get that to. But shutting people who don’t or can’t do ether completely out of the title track is unreasonable. I do not have the reflexes to do Choir. I lack a keyboard responsive enough to do the jumping puzzle. I have however put hours into every other title track, including repeating the snowball mayhem and toypocalypse titles only to find out the copies don’t count. I can’t complete the dailies because it still wants 5 tiers completed but insists on every rotation inserting the 2 things I can’t do and don’t enjoy in the bloody thing! Stop that! I don’t want to play guitar hero! Give us more options for filling out the meta without forcing us into a small set of activities please. (sigh)

Now that we are past that I would like to add that your new daily system is causing problems. Specifically in the zone specific events category. It is causing the same kind of zergs and mad rush to complete content that you got away from when you demoted the Queensdale champions to vets. I know you want people to explore your content. I know you want to give exposure to under represented zones. But jamming your entire player base into them just to finish a daily is not the way to accomplish this. Nor is making them wait around for hours to complete a specific world boss. There was nothing wrong with the previous daily categories. They didn’t need to be changed. Just reduced. Assuming your stated goal of reducing grind was indeed sincere.

Generalize the daily. Don’t specify a certain zone for events, just ask for events. 4 or 5 of them is fine, but don’t tell them where they must be done. Let the players adventure where they will. You want them to play like THEY want after all. Get rid of daily (insert meta boss here). World zergs do them anyway. Bring back salvage, or dodger to replace it. Something that can be done quickly and importantly without needing a zerg, and without needing to wait an hour or more for a world boss. That is the definition of grind. Don’t micromanage us. As long as we put in the play time we should get the credit. Both for dailies AND festival meta.

I second this and I’d like to add my own thoughts which may echo points OP already brought up.

When it comes to doing events with the current Daily system, it introduced (in my opinion) some unneeded headaches. There are zergs trying to do events for the Daily and everyone is spamming “1” like a madman, only to have a handful of said zerg get credit while everyone else doesn’t. It’s happened to me on several occasions and it’s not fun. While, yes, there’s less to do to get Daily rewards, there lacks the variety that the previous Daily system had.

With regard to Wintersday, the lack of variety and options for those Daily’s is also disappointing and pretty much drove me away from all of those events. I too don’t have the reflexes and/or the keyboard responsiveness needed to do the Wintersday Daily JP’s and Bell Choir. Compare that to the Halloween Daily meta where (in my opinion) there was so much more to choose from.

Like OP, I feel like the Daily needs to be generalized a bit more. That or bring back the variety the previous Daily system had.

TheOrlyFactor.8341:

I second this and I’d like to add my own thoughts which may echo points OP already brought up.

When it comes to doing events with the current Daily system, it introduced (in my opinion) some unneeded headaches. There are zergs trying to do events for the Daily and everyone is spamming “1” like a madman, only to have a handful of said zerg get credit while everyone else doesn’t. It’s happened to me on several occasions and it’s not fun. While, yes, there’s less to do to get Daily rewards, there lacks the variety that the previous Daily system had.

With regard to Wintersday, the lack of variety and options for those Daily’s is also disappointing and pretty much drove me away from all of those events. I too don’t have the reflexes and/or the keyboard responsiveness needed to do the Wintersday Daily JP’s and Bell Choir. Compare that to the Halloween Daily meta where (in my opinion) there was so much more to choose from.

Like OP, I feel like the Daily needs to be generalized a bit more. That or bring back the variety the previous Daily system had.

This to, the lack of daily categories for PvE is disheartening. You had so much more freedom in the old system to go your own way. Why did that need to change just because you reduced the number needed to complete the daily?

I am really impressed at how lazy players had become… Those achievement with daily don’t take more than 15minutes to complete.
No one is forcing you to play what you don’t like… And just don’t. Let the players who do like it, play.
I presume you do it for achievements points. The name says… You need to do something harder in order to achieve something.
Or you would just like to do things like build a snowman, kill a rat? What is the fun in that. Or should anet just make some tetris or kid style game so we can all farm 10000 achievement points in 3 days.
Why do you hunt AP if you don’t have skill to do basic things? Enjoy the content you like, play game for fun it offers. You don’t like music puzzle or jp . Then just don’t do it. Go and do what you are good at doing. That’s all.
And let the others enjoy a bit harder and different content

Just stop doing wintersday daily. Trust me 4gifts and 10snowfalls is not shutting you out of game. Total value is 25 silver.
And it’s a game you play, you play to have fun. Those Ap doesn’t mean anything in real life, they don’t mean anything in game also. You won’t feel better with 10ap more. So stop farming it.
Try to understand why are you rly playing the game. Just relax and do what you like and make you happy in game… ANET is not forcing you into any content.

Somnium Luna.6294:

I am really impressed at how lazy players had become… Those achievement with daily don’t take more than 15minutes to complete.
No one is forcing you to play what you don’t like… And just don’t. Let the players who do like it, play.
I presume you do it for achievements points. The name says… You need to do something harder in order to achieve something.
Or you would just like to do things like build a snowman, kill a rat? What is the fun in that. Or should anet just make some tetris or kid style game so we can all farm 10000 achievement points in 3 days.
Why do you hunt AP if you don’t have skill to do basic things? Enjoy the content you like, play game for fun it offers. You don’t like music puzzle or jp . Then just don’t do it. Go and do what you are good at doing. That’s all.
And let the others enjoy a bit harder and different content

I don’t think you read the OP. At all. The issue isn’t with the daily wintersday achievements, it’s the festival meta. Having 10/11 achieves then seeing you need to do bell choir to get the last one is a tad disheartening. Don’t get me wrong, I do believe that in order to get the meta achieve one should be required to do difficult things, but I don’t think it’s the best policy to add in things people might not be able to do for reasons they can’t control. And being condescending when you don’t care to read through someone’s post is a rather poor way to get your point across.

Anyway, I get where you’re coming from OP, but there aren’t a whole lot of options. When it comes down to it, I feel the meta should be open to various methods of completion such as cycling the infinite achieves or requiring less so you can pick and choose. But it’s all a matter of opinion on if the meta should be easily accessible or if it’s a trophy. As for the Winteraday dailies, I’m a bit bothered that Toypocalypse isn’t in the dailies. It’s as much of an activity as the others, and is much more manageable. But I feel like they made the right move with the jp and bell choir put into its rotation. It’s a pain for sure, but it makes sense and was a solid choice.

Whoo boy.

Somnium Luna.6294:

I am really impressed at how lazy players had become… Those achievement with daily don’t take more than 15minutes to complete.

For you. Stop speaking for everyone because I can assure you not everyone has had the same blazing fast experience as you seem to have.

No one is forcing you to play what you don’t like… And just don’t. Let the players who do like it, play.

Nowhere did I say I did or did not like something. Please don’t put words in my mouth.

Somnium Luna.6294:

I presume you do it for achievements points. The name says… You need to do something harder in order to achieve something.

You presume incorrectly. There’s plenty of other things I can go to if I want achievement points. Additionally, there’s a difference between something being hard and something that wasn’t tested enough before being pushed out the door. The new Daily system feels like it needs more polish. It feels like it needed more time to “cook”.

Somnium Luna.6294:

Or you would just like to do things like build a snowman, kill a rat?

There’s at least achievements for those.

Somnium Luna.6294:

Or should anet just make some tetris or kid style game so we can all farm 10000 achievement points in 3 days.

I have no idea what you’re going on about here. :v

Somnium Luna.6294:

Why do you hunt AP if you don’t have skill to do basic things? Enjoy the content you like, play game for fun it offers. You don’t like music puzzle or jp . Then just don’t do it. Go and do what you are good at doing. That’s all.
And let the others enjoy a bit harder and different content.

You’re assuming (incorrectly I might add) that I’m hunting for achievement points, and we all know what happens when you assume.

Not doing something doesn’t change the fact that it still needs work and needs tweaking/fixing. Using that same logic, I should stop walking if I break my leg because it’s too hard/painful/challenging to walk on it. Sure, I can do that, but it doesn’t change the fact that I have a broken leg that needs to be looked at by a doctor if I want to function normally.

Also, I know Anet isn’t forcing me or anyone else to play this game and its content. However, in order to improve on certain features and aspects of the game, some critiquing and feedback from the players is certainly needed. If feedback/critique isn’t given, the game can’t improve. Issues current players are dealing with never get addressed, which gets passed onto newer players. Those issues could very well lead to other, bigger issues if not addressed and not mentioned.

In short, the feedback I left is because I love the game, as I’m sure OP does, and I want to see it become better than it is. Providing feedback/critique is one way of doing this. By saying nothing, by “not doing the things I don’t like” or “not doing the ‘hard’ things” when a fix may very well improve things is doing this game and any other game a disservice.

In conclusion, cool post but I think you completely missed the point OP and I were making or trying to make. :U

I had a weird experience today. Usually, to get the bell choir daily you need just one correct note. I did a bunch, but didn’t get the daily. It was really weird.

Black Frog.9274:

I had a weird experience today. Usually, to get the bell choir daily you need just one correct note. I did a bunch, but didn’t get the daily. It was really weird.

I think you need to complete a song (not get kicked out). You get no credit for notes in a song that ejects you.

I cannot disagree with the OP more.
Wintersday- for the daily you just need to hit 1 note and not get kicked off the platform. Since you are talking about the daily and not the meta, it is that simple.
PVE- I presume you want more generalized quest completion daily. That is the only daily that is specific to a map while every other daily is for a region. If you truely are spending hours doing your dailies, for Gods sake, hop into PVP and cap a node or something. You can basically sneeze in PVP or WVW and get another daily complete.

To make your life easy, open up daily achievement pane, look for the vista viewer, map boss and harvester. Do those and rejoice. Or if you are still not complete because you just missed the boss, do the easy pvp ones, in one hot join you can typically get 2/3 of the daily unless you happen to have the class specific win for that day and you can go 3/3 in 10 min.

I’m disagreeing with the OP completely.

Wintersdaymeta: I too sat 10/11 and QQ that I would never make the Bell Choir thingie in order to complete it. Then I decided to look into it, ask people while doing BC and put some effort in and in no time I had my meta done. Sometimes things in life just take a little effort and the willingness to take your time to learn. Sadly many games spoonfeed you these days and once a game gets a kittenallenging (no clue why I’m being kittened here? ), everyone complains.

Same goes for the new Daily system: sure, I missed out on events because I couldn’t get my damage in through the zergs. Still I just keep going and I still completely my dailies way faster than before. Also it pays off to have toons that have completed the map. You are shown where the closest event is! Also it pays off to know about the map, know where event chains start or which are contains a lot of chains in general.

The only thing I maybe like to see is that you can change that compass thingie, that points you to nearby interesting stuff, to show just events and not personal story or poi’s and stuff. That would accommodate playing toons that haven’t completed the map yet.

The Bell Choir for the meta achievement isn’t really that hard. It was more time consuming than difficult. You can be horrible at it but it’ll still count towards the achievement provided you hit some notes. I was often in the bottom 50% for score. Despite that I had the meta achievement finished within 2days.

The Wintersday daily is optional if you want more achievement points/gifts and isn’t needed for the festival meta achievement anyways.

Somnium Luna.6294:

I am really impressed at how lazy players had become… Those achievement with daily don’t take more than 15minutes to complete.
No one is forcing you to play what you don’t like… And just don’t. Let the players who do like it, play.
I presume you do it for achievements points. The name says… You need to do something harder in order to achieve something.
Or you would just like to do things like build a snowman, kill a rat? What is the fun in that. Or should anet just make some tetris or kid style game so we can all farm 10000 achievement points in 3 days.
Why do you hunt AP if you don’t have skill to do basic things? Enjoy the content you like, play game for fun it offers. You don’t like music puzzle or jp . Then just don’t do it. Go and do what you are good at doing. That’s all.
And let the others enjoy a bit harder and different content

It didn’t take more than 15 minutes the old way. And that didn’t require you to chase a zerg. Stop apologizing for a broken system. The stated reason the change happened in the first place was to “reduce grind”. This is a casual game. For casual players. If you want hardcore grind then I might suggest WoW.

Akikaze.1307:

The Bell Choir for the meta achievement isn’t really that hard. It was more time consuming than difficult. You can be horrible at it but it’ll still count towards the achievement provided you hit some notes. I was often in the bottom 50% for score. Despite that I had the meta achievement finished within 2days.

The Wintersday daily is optional if you want more achievement points/gifts and isn’t needed for the festival meta achievement anyways.

That’s the thing. I did hit a few notes. I didn’t get credit for anything. I was there for hours.

Fogeltje.3091:

I’m disagreeing with the OP completely.

Wintersdaymeta: I too sat 10/11 and QQ that I would never make the Bell Choir thingie in order to complete it. Then I decided to look into it, ask people while doing BC and put some effort in and in no time I had my meta done. Sometimes things in life just take a little effort and the willingness to take your time to learn. Sadly many games spoonfeed you these days and once a game gets a kittenallenging (no clue why I’m being kittened here? ), everyone complains.

Same goes for the new Daily system: sure, I missed out on events because I couldn’t get my damage in through the zergs. Still I just keep going and I still completely my dailies way faster than before. Also it pays off to have toons that have completed the map. You are shown where the closest event is! Also it pays off to know about the map, know where event chains start or which are contains a lot of chains in general.

The only thing I maybe like to see is that you can change that compass thingie, that points you to nearby interesting stuff, to show just events and not personal story or poi’s and stuff. That would accommodate playing toons that haven’t completed the map yet.

It’s insane now how many people clamor for events, scream about not getting credit, complain about broken events. Why would changing the category simply do “daily events” without specifying a zone hurt things? I’m not suggesting they revert to the old system wholesale. Just generalize more so we aren’t forced into a specific zone. So we can do things on our own without having to rush after a zerg that clears events in seconds. Not all of us have computers that let us load to a new WP in milliseconds.

Ken DeBoer.9268:

I cannot disagree with the OP more.
Wintersday- for the daily you just need to hit 1 note and not get kicked off the platform. Since you are talking about the daily and not the meta, it is that simple.
PVE- I presume you want more generalized quest completion daily. That is the only daily that is specific to a map while every other daily is for a region. If you truely are spending hours doing your dailies, for Gods sake, hop into PVP and cap a node or something. You can basically sneeze in PVP or WVW and get another daily complete.

To make your life easy, open up daily achievement pane, look for the vista viewer, map boss and harvester. Do those and rejoice. Or if you are still not complete because you just missed the boss, do the easy pvp ones, in one hot join you can typically get 2/3 of the daily unless you happen to have the class specific win for that day and you can go 3/3 in 10 min.

You miss the point of the game. I should HAVE to “just do something else” when it wasn’t broken in the first place. Generalizing daily events, as it was before, does not require an overhaul of the system and allows the player to play when and how they want. This is not an issue. There is nothing to “disagree” with, because there is well over a year of evidence to back it up.

Phage I would advise you to stop being rude to everyone who disagrees with you. They are entitled to their opinion as you are entitled to yours. This issue, as far as I can see was that certain zones were empty most, if not all of the time. The new daily ensures that at least part of the time these zones will be filled with players.

I also disagree with your opinion. There is nothing at all in the game that requires you to to complete the wintersday or regular daily other than a few AP.

If you are not willing to put in enough effort to just WP to a different map or try one of the other 9 other daily options then I dont think you should get AP. I think its a good thing that players can no longer get AP for essentially doing nothing every day and Im enjoying the new system more than the old.

I agree it needs work, in particular scaling in low level maps, but I definitely don’t want to see a full reversion to a generic ‘do events’ daily again.

Phage The Blighted.6350:

It didn’t take more than 15 minutes the old way. And that didn’t require you to chase a zerg. Stop apologizing for a broken system.

The system is not broken, in general I’m done quicker than in the old system.

Phage The Blighted.6350:

It’s insane now how many people clamor for events, scream about not getting credit, complain about broken events. Why would changing the category simply do “daily events” without specifying a zone hurt things? I’m not suggesting they revert to the old system wholesale. Just generalize more so we aren’t forced into a specific zone. So we can do things on our own without having to rush after a zerg that clears events in seconds. Not all of us have computers that let us load to a new WP in milliseconds.

Neither does my computer, especially zoning into DR and LA takes quite a lot of time, yet it’s not really an issue for me and we are talking about a machine that’s over 5 years old and wasn’t top notch when I bought her.

The point of the new system is to introduce people to new stuff and it works! I already did a lot of stuff, but some stuff is hard to play because it requires more people. I’m fond of a particular even chain in the Harathi Hinterlands for example that start with a huge Champion giant that really requires a group to take down. I could hardly ever do that. The Megaserver already improved on enjoying more content again because maps are populated again and with this new daily thing I even discover new events when people call them out! Yeah, sure I miss out on the credit, maybe a bit more than before. But is it a problem? No, because there’s so much going on, even with missing credits and having to zone I’m still done quicker as I generally don’t even need to look for events. They are called out or Commanders put out their tags and it relieves me actually of the question “where should I go event today for my daily” instead of just going touring Queensdale for the area’s known to have a few events going on all the time.

And the best part is, if you don’t want to do events, you don’t have to. In the old system, if events was up, I nearly always had to do it to get enough dailies (at least when I only had little time to play). Now I can just skip it if I wish and quickly go cap something in WvW and still get my AP.

The system is not broken. Things are just changed. Not for better, not for worse, in my eyes, just changed. And I think that’s the problem. People are generally opposed to any kind of change (and I’ll readily admit, I’m no exception to that) and it will take some time to get used to it. Be glad ANet is still making changes to the game, if they are not, then I would be worried if the game was slowly going to be left alone.

The bell choir is unplayable if you have any kind of bad ping or lag.

Ditto for the jumping puzzle. If you have any kind of bad ping or lag you will trigger fall damage 2/3 of the way through and be unable to finish.

I suspect OP just doesn’t like jump puzzles and got discouraged when he failed his first 5-10 bell choirs. But most of us don’t like jump puzzles and failed the bells a lot before we learned them.

But neither bells nor the jump puzzle should be part of the meta.

The real screwup is doing 150 games of snowball mayhem for the 15 AP. Waaaaay too much grind.

Personally, I love the Bell Choir minigame (I wait with bated breath all year for Wintersday to roll around again just for that alone), but I agree that it doesn’t really make sense to not count Toypocalypse and (especially) Snowball Mayhem for the meta. IIRC, last year there was an achievement for Snowball Mayhem that counted towards the meta; I’m not sure why that wasn’t brought back this year.

As far as the new dailies system goes, I don’t really care for the PvE dailies beyond the Exotic Crafter and Mystic Toilet user ones. However, I’m not sure why they’ve removed the option of doing dungeons as part of the PvE dailies. Under the old system, one of the possible dailies was to run one dungeon path (sometimes story, sometimes exp), which was super-easy to do. Now, if we want a similar PvE daily to the old one, we’re stuck with bloody Fractals. I hate Fractals with a passion. If nothing else, they should bring a dungeon-related PvE daily back, to give the PvE category a bit more variety.

As far as the events-related PvE daily goes, I think they should change it from being map-specific to zone-specific like the gathering daily. Maybe that would help with the whole ‘events are done before I can get to them’ problem? But hey, who am I to say about PvE issues when I’m mostly a dedicated WvW and EotM runner?

I understand what you mean and agree, Phage.

I love bell choir and the JP. I’m good at them, even. I owe a big part of my success to both activities is a new computer and a solid internet connection. Thanks to both of those I had a few perfect runs during halloween this year. Last year I couldn’t complete the JP a single time because my connection wouldn’t let me time that final jump no matter how many times I got to the top. For anyone having connections even worse than mine, I can’t imagine how absolutely miserable that must be.

The dailies system worked well before they revamped it. While I do like some changes, the “broader” options of activities you can do seems more shallow. The other day there was a daily for doing events in Malchor’s leap. What about people whose characters aren’t high level enough? What if they don’t like pvp or WvW?

On the topic of limited dailies, what happens when you get people who don’t like an activity forced into it for the sake of dailies? You get people who don’t know what they’re doing, don’t want to know what they’re doing, and generally care less about what they’re doing than the people who genuinely love that activity. People who hop into WvW for the sake of achievements or dailies may take up valuable space in a popular server where every active member counts. They may grumble and complain, and that can bring down everyone’s morale. I’d really hate to be excitedly learning how to try a new activity, only for people to angrily grumble about it in chat, or to have veterans lash out against newcomers because of it.
It’s simple to say “They shouldn’t go there in the first place then” but it doesn’t actually solve any problems.

The massive overpopulation for world events or zone-specific events (and region-specific harvesting? WHY) is ridiculous. Expanding both dailies to be “complete a world event” or “complete 5 events” would be so much easier, and would allow people to do what they like where they like. If you have to force people to go to a zone, maybe you need to sit back and evaluate why people don’t go there in the first place.